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#openttd IRC Logs for 2009-07-08

---Logopened Wed Jul 08 00:00:30 2009
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02:27<dihedral>tada
02:29<SirSquid1ess>amazing.
02:31<dihedral>isn't it?
02:34<SirSquid1ess>quite so
02:34<SirSquid1ess>astounding even
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02:49<dihedral>yes i was surprised too
02:49<SirSquid1ess>I can see why.
02:49<SirSquid1ess>I think
02:49<SirSquid1ess>>.>
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03:37<andythenorth_>meh. anyone want to change the cargo payment rates to penalise long distances? No? Thought not. Bad idea.
03:39<planetmaker>why would you want to do that, andythenorth_ ? You're payed for transport after all...
03:40<planetmaker>and the decreasing cargo price with time is already a sort-of distance penalty
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03:54<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16763 /trunk/src/lang/unfinished/vietnamese.txt: -Add: initial translation of Vietnamese.
04:08<Eddi|zuHause>i really don't think the payment rates are either the issue nor the solution
04:09<Eddi|zuHause>half of the solution is cargodest, the other half is an influence on station rating depending on the number of connected destinations
04:10-!-Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has quit [Quit: Sleep]
04:10<Eddi|zuHause>and why are there only 720p versions of torchwood?
04:10<@Rubidium>because the BBC dropped analog?
04:12<@Rubidium>although I have to agree 1080p would've been better
04:15<Eddi|zuHause>that's fun and all, but my computer is not fast enough to play 720p
04:15<Eddi|zuHause>nor is it good on my bandwidth
04:30<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16764 /trunk/src/ (13 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: unify the way viewport signs are marked dirty
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04:46<TrueBrain>Eddi|zuHause: solved your disk issues? :)
04:47<Eddi|zuHause>i'm not sure... it just did not reappear yet ;)
04:50<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16765 /trunk/src/ (5 files): -Codechange: give ViewportSign's width_1 and width_2 more self explaining names
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05:05<Eddi|zuHause>so far my disk problem might be a strange interference between the new harddrive and my external hard drive
05:05<Eddi|zuHause>although i have no idea how that can happen
05:05<TrueBrain>SATA? It can't :p
05:05<TrueBrain>even if the external is eSATA
05:05<TrueBrain>the only 'problem' can be not sufficient power
05:06<Eddi|zuHause>the external drive is USB
05:06<TrueBrain>with its own power-source?
05:06<Eddi|zuHause>yes
05:06<TrueBrain>then it requires almost nthing from the USB hub, so power problems are unlikely (although possible :p)
05:07<Eddi|zuHause>although the external drive seems to have problems staying on for longer times since i moved...
05:08<TrueBrain>if you open up an external drive, it turns out that it is just an usb to SATA convertor :p
05:08<TrueBrain>if a domain is about the expire the 11th this month, what are the chances I can register after it?
05:08<Eddi|zuHause>yes, that i was pretty certain of
05:09<Eddi|zuHause>you mean grab a domain from someone who forgot to renew it?
05:09<TrueBrain>no, it is no longer in use
05:10<Eddi|zuHause>i have no idea... i never had a domain
05:10<TrueBrain>I can make a backorder via godaddy ... might be worth the money ..
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05:20<Muxy>your chance will depend on who owns the domain
05:23<TrueBrain>well, I have a good feeling about this :p
05:24<Eddi|zuHause>http://nothingforungood.com/unanswered-google-queries-part-iii/ <- occasionally the guy is actually funny
05:24<Eddi|zuHause><TrueBrain> well, I have a good feeling about this :p <- you misquoted that :p
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06:08<dragonhorseboy>any of you know about any parameters for the reducedpassengerpayment grf thats on Bananas with no forum thread link?
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06:15<dragonhorseboy>hey mark
06:15<Mark>hello
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06:16<dihedral>dragonhorseboy, try asking at the servers who use it
06:16<dragonhorseboy>how're you?
06:16<dihedral>:-P
06:17<dragonhorseboy>dihedral...well thats the problem.. forum only has one single mention of it in someone's cfg list pasted but thats it .. I wonder who the author even was anyway :P
06:17<dragonhorseboy>and none of the three major IS servers ever used it
06:17<dragonhorseboy>I wonder about the description saying it had parameters especially for mail . but blah
06:18<dihedral>google showed me that there are 2 servers using it - if i am not mistaken
06:18<Eddi|zuHause>you tried grfcrawler?
06:18<dihedral>the grfid is not in the crawler
06:18<TrueBrain>so it is a useless grf :p
06:18<Eddi|zuHause>then the grf is probably not worth using
06:18<TrueBrain>at least link to a thread, I mean ..
06:18<dragonhorseboy>well without parameters the grf actually just halves passenger payment rate alone
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06:19<dragonhorseboy>but I'm curious about making it a bit less serve plus adding mail .. oh well i guess that'll be for another day ;)
06:19<dihedral>perhaps it does not take params :-)
06:20<yorick>heh, google OS
06:20<dragonhorseboy>hm now to decide what roadsets to use hmmm
06:21<yorick>later Google Cars, Google House, United States of Google, Google Planet
06:21<TrueBrain>Google Phone is already there :p
06:21<dihedral>we already have google earth ^^
06:22<yorick>http://www.thinkgos.com/index.html
06:23<dragonhorseboy>any thoughts on a roadset for japan?
06:24<yorick>and then the anti-google communists :)
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06:27<dragonhorseboy>(I've obviously got naroadsetw for canset, czroadset for dbsetxl, but hmm..can't quite find something to go with the third set - japanset)
06:28<Ammler>they have their own roads
06:29<dragonhorseboy>oh..meh I'll check again..ty
06:29<Eddi|zuHause>i was under the impression the japanese have replacements for everything
06:29<dragonhorseboy>eddi..actually..I did quite like the japan landscape.. the green looks dull than bright sunny green if you know what I'm saying
06:29<dragonhorseboy>:)
06:30<Eddi|zuHause>no, i am never sure what you are actually saying
06:31<dihedral>i dislike expect
06:31<dihedral>silly piece of
06:31<dihedral>!
06:31<TrueBrain>I dislike expectations
06:31<dihedral>it's neither interp nor thread safe
06:32<Eddi|zuHause>where was this "lower expectations" institute from?
06:33<Eddi|zuHause>something MadTV-ish i believe
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06:38<TrueBrain>STOP THOSE HIT AND RUNS :'(
06:40<Noldo>who is hit'n'runin'?
06:40<TrueBrain>Gekz in this case
06:40<dragonhorseboy>hmm guess I'll just finetune and start with a grf list based on dbsetxl...brb
06:40<Noldo>Eddi|zuHause: MadTV it was
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07:11<dragonhorseboy>now to fix parameters then finally host.. :P
07:16<planetmaker>wrong
07:16<planetmaker>first define all newgrf and their parameters. Then start a new game with that. then host :)
07:22-!-divo [~asd@0x3e42e6e6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd
07:26<@Rubidium>wrong
07:26<@Rubidium>don't host at all
07:26<TrueBrain>wrong
07:26<TrueBrain>don't
07:26<Ammler>don't play openttd?
07:28<@petern>of course not
07:28<@petern>it's a stupid game
07:28<@petern>not realistic at all
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07:31<dragonhorseboy>btw whatever happened to the snowline option? IS3 doesn't seem to include it in advanced setting anymore
07:38<dihedral>hehe, nice one petern
07:43<dragonhorseboy>hmm ammler...
07:43<Ammler>wow, IS3 already?
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07:44<dragonhorseboy>the basecost.grf .. I'm not sure if its just not liking danmack's grfs or ottd-IS is just glitching up with the combination but the terraform parameter is only set to 2 yet it seem to still cost over $40000 just for one rail tile on a slope
07:45<dragonhorseboy>I'm trying different parameters with danmack's grfs .. so far no change
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07:47<dihedral>load it after the danmacks grf
07:47<dihedral>+ building on a slope = terraforming
07:48<dragonhorseboy>I didn't want it to only cost $140 yet I didn't want it to cost $40000 neither .. heh ... hm let me recheck the grf order
07:49<@petern>Ammler, yes IS2-beta3 is exactly the same thing as IS3, or something
07:49<dragonhorseboy>hm weird .. being either at bottom or on top doesn't matter to all parameters except for the one terraform one..I guess one of the other grf must be affecting it
07:51<dihedral>no kidding!
07:51<TrueBrain>*hihi*
07:52<dragonhorseboy>I wonder why danmack would want to modify the terraform cost...hm...
07:52<Ammler>dragonhorseboy: changing basecosts on a running game isn't that easy, afaik.
07:52<dihedral>+ why dont you ask danmack himself?
07:52<dragonhorseboy>ammler..its a fresh new map
07:53<dragonhorseboy>I was just trying to test the various parameters before starting a server
07:53<Ammler>a fresh new map is already a running game :-)
07:53<dragonhorseboy>hmm just thought..maybe rebooting ottd would help...
07:54<dragonhorseboy>huh .. no it doesn't not even for terraform set to 255
07:54<dragonhorseboy>hmm..basecost must be broken..lets see what happens when its gone
07:54<Ammler>last time a "played" with base costs, it was easiest with saving difficulty settings, not sure, if that still works.
07:56<dragonhorseboy>hmm yeah looks like basecost just didn't like can*.grf perhaps .. the terraform cost is back to default now
07:57<dragonhorseboy>oh well..I changed difficulity to high costs to do for now :P
07:57<@Rubidium>can*.grf are designed to be NOT used with any other NewGRFs
07:57<dragonhorseboy>rubidium check the pdf readmes..they do mention being able to support other grfs
07:57<Ammler>Rubidium: sounds like can*grf is designed to not used with OpenTTD ;-)
07:57<dragonhorseboy>espcially at displaying included hq's if used with another hq grf too
07:58<dragonhorseboy>and there's parameters for to support ecs industries instead
07:58<dragonhorseboy>I could go on but better if you just read the pdfs themself
07:58<@Rubidium>where's the good old time that any other NewGRF was 'crap' etc?
07:58<@Rubidium>was probably back when they disabled themselves when they found OpenTTD ;)
07:59<@Rubidium>because we didn't react in a manner that pleases them on some feature requests
08:00<dihedral>^^
08:01<Ammler>dragonhorseboy: working grf presets: http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/User:Ammler/NewGRF_Presets
08:01<dragonhorseboy>well to put it...what if a building set introduced its own road tiles then later someone drew up a newer better one .. so thats where the parameter to disable there own roadset for third party one (in the building set) comes from :)
08:01<Ammler>(but old :-)
08:01<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16766 /trunk/src/ (station.cpp station_base.h station_cmd.cpp):
08:01<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Codechange: remove station->MarkDirty. It is in all cases meant to only update
08:01<CIA-1>OpenTTD: the sign and not invalidate the widget; the widget would be invalidated by a
08:01<CIA-1>OpenTTD: call before/after the call to MarkDirty or it wouldn't make sense because e.g.
08:01<CIA-1>OpenTTD: the window doesn't exist anymore/yet.
08:01<dragonhorseboy>ammler heh
08:01<dihedral>dragonhorseboy, idealy they should split stuff up into multiple grf's
08:04<Ammler>dragonhorseboy: specially the opengfx were there for testing purposes only, can be removed on those lists.
08:05<dragonhorseboy>well guess I'm just going start server as it is for now and fix the missing aspects later on
08:07<Ammler>dragonhorseboy: are you banned from jointy's server, so you need to make your own server?
08:08<dragonhorseboy>no..just that I thought of it yesterday afternoon while the server computers were still offline :)
08:09<dragonhorseboy>it was too late to start one (only <7 hours of day remaining) so I decided to wait to start it this morning instead ... 14+ hours to play now)
08:09<dragonhorseboy>:)
08:10<dragonhorseboy>well its running now... should be able to find it in server list in a few minutes ;)
08:11<dragonhorseboy>oh and I rechecked this fact before but all grfs are indeed findable in the ottdcoop grf package (beside one or two were only from Bananas tho)
08:12<dragonhorseboy>oh shit..wait...forgot ISR -_-
08:12<Ammler>if it is running now, it should be on the list now, afaik.
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08:13<dragonhorseboy>I had to reload it actually
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08:13<dragonhorseboy>so silly of me to forgot to add ISR to the grf list
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08:13<dragonhorseboy>:)
08:14<Ammler>yeah, I am suprised, ISR isn't on top of the bananas stats.
08:14<dragonhorseboy>I really love it .. use it many times on EVERY single map :)
08:14<dragonhorseboy>espeically the mine loader
08:16<dragonhorseboy>anyway if you're going take a look..don't be mindful of the slight different industries .. canset lets you import arctic industries into temperate (well..what is canada without any print works right?)
08:17<dragonhorseboy>;)
08:27<yorick>dragonhorseboy: ISR is the most used multiplayer grf, next to the generic tram set
08:32<Ammler>yorick: you still make stats with the python bot?
08:32<yorick>Ammler: I made some yesterday
08:32<Ammler>any page?
08:32<yorick>nope ;)
08:32*yorick lunch...brb
08:32<Ammler>pastebin :P
08:47<@Belugas>hello
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09:03<yorick>ammler: http://pastebin.com/d785385bd
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09:10<dihedral>you have a minor flaw in that
09:10<dihedral>97/133 servers queried, 72.93 %
09:10<dihedral>of 133 servers have a password
09:10<dihedral>you cannot say that 133 servers are the 100% because you did not manage to query 36 of them
09:11<dihedral>which makes your stats inaccurate
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09:12<Ammler>what's the reason, you didn't query them?
09:12<Ammler>and still not many servers with newgrfs... :-/
09:12<dihedral>perhaps he got the ip's and ports from the master server, but they were in fact offline?
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09:13<yorick>dihedral: the part before the ###### is a status report ;)
09:14<yorick>"the master server currently knows 133 servers, 133 are up, 133 could be queried"
09:15<dihedral>then why were so many not queried?
09:16<yorick>dihedral: they were, but some were still being queried in the part before ########
09:18<yorick>dihedral: maybe http://pastebin.com/m65eb935 will confuse you less
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09:21<dragonhorseboy>back
09:22<dihedral>yorick, :-P
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09:22-!-mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ
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09:40<@Belugas>those stats are for openttd's master server or another one?
09:40<dragonhorseboy>well I'm off but I'll leave the game still running ;)
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09:41<@Belugas>ho? dragonhorseboy is canadian. ho well... they are everywhere, nowaday
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09:42<Muxy>good afternoon for CET
09:45<@Belugas>good morning from GMT-5
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09:48<SirSquid1ess>G'evening from GMT+10 (or 11... can't remember if we're in or out of DST atm..)
09:48<yorick>Good afternoon from GMT+2
09:49<yorick>oh hello Muxy, at least you don't kiss us anymore :)
09:50<Muxy>hum, Kiss from Goulp
09:50<Muxy>well, good morning for GMT-5
09:51<yorick>:(
09:51*yorick wipes it off
09:51<Muxy>you dont like Goulp Kiss ?
09:51<yorick>not quite
09:52<Muxy>but the Goulp Kiss is not a French Kiss
09:52<Muxy>Even if the goulp is in France
09:53<yorick>ugh, goulps
09:53*yorick goulps
09:54<yorick>that's like the sound dead fish would make when they could make a sound
09:54-!-Progman [~progman@hep-1.E-Technik.Uni-Dortmund.DE] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
09:55<Muxy>but my goulp is not a sound
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09:57<yorick>they all say that
09:58<Muxy>who are they ?
09:58<yorick>you
09:58<Muxy>i'm not they
09:58<yorick>yes you are!
09:58<Muxy>my goulp is hell
09:58<Muxy>like the original one
09:58<yorick>and they al say that
09:59<Muxy>and you always say that ?
09:59<yorick>no
10:00<Muxy>"le Goulp c'est l'Enfer"
10:01<@Belugas>dead fish make sounds? wow... zombies!
10:01<yorick>Belugas: if they could make a sound ;)
10:01<yorick>or it would be too realistic
10:02<@Belugas>yeah... right...
10:02<yorick>yes, dead fish covered in snow would be too realistic
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10:02<@Belugas>like.. if dinosaurs were alive, thet would climb on the trees when thunder sounds were heard...
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10:04<yorick>for example, yes
10:04<yorick>and they would eat their soundmaking dead fish covered in snow until the thunder was over
10:05<@Belugas>WARNING WARNING WARNING!!!! ALL RUN FOR COVER!!!!! Yorick has smoked illegal stuff ONCE MORE!!!!! WARNING WARNING WARNING!!!!!
10:05<Muxy>smoked fish... salmon ?
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10:07<yorick>Belugas: no, I'm always like that
10:07<yorick>or sometimes
10:08<@Belugas>haa.a. you are... sorry, i lost habit...
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10:09<codewolf>heya peoples
10:09<yorick>heya codewolfs
10:09<codewolf>:)
10:10<fonsinchen>Bah, I see now, why that other smallmap zooming patch features a complete rewrite of the smallmap drawing algorithm.
10:10<Muxy>yeha you
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10:10<fonsinchen>The current implementation is just too messy to fix.
10:10<codewolf>had a small question, trying to install a daylenght path but its bitching about a settings.h file. i cant find it and was wondering if it got renamed or removed in a newer version or something
10:11<yorick>Belugas: and it would be lega
10:11<yorick>l
10:13<@Rubidium>if you want to install a patch install it to the version the patch was made for
10:14<codewolf>ah oke so i really need to keep a eye on the version number when using a patch. guess that makes sense :)
10:14<codewolf>was doing quite well untill it tried to find that header file, i was having some hope it would just go trough :)
10:16<Eddi|zuHause>hey... forum is de-403-ed :)
10:16<codewolf>is kind of off tough, the cpp files are present in the tar but not the matching header
10:16<Eddi|zuHause>and that's only a "not found" away from a palindrome...
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10:25<@Belugas>which is not the same as an aerodrome
10:25<@petern>cleesedrome
10:25<Eddi|zuHause>no... palindromes are only for cool people
10:31<@Belugas>ho... and for the others, it's syndrome?
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---Logclosed Wed Jul 08 10:46:00 2009
---Logopened Wed Jul 08 10:46:18 2009
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11:24<dragonhorseboy>hey
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11:36<Chruker>heh, what do we have here a little poet?
11:36<Chruker>-Merge: tomatos and bananas left to be, here is NoAI for all to see.
11:39<dihedral>that is OLD
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11:40<yorick>tomatos to be
11:40<@Belugas>to be do be
11:41<@Belugas>to beer, do beer
11:42<@Rubidium>to code or not to code, that's the question ;)
11:43<@Rubidium>or for Belugas: two beer or be here, that's the question
11:43<@petern>not
11:43<planetmaker>music! :)
11:43<@petern>ding
11:44<@Rubidium>-a-dong
11:44<Prof_Frink>Put your dong away.
11:44<@Belugas>bang a gong
11:45<@Rubidium>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-oUZLV_GdZw <- really... it was on German TV too?
11:46<planetmaker>given the shown broadcast year, I have no way to know :)
11:48<@Rubidium>planetmaker: I'm just assuming ZDF is German
11:49<planetmaker>yes it is
11:49<planetmaker>Must be pretty new back then, I think...
11:49<@Rubidium>oh, but you might've seen it on TV
11:49<@Belugas>[11:43] <@Rubidium> or for Belugas: two beer or be here, that's the question <--- yeah... like... gimme two beers and let get get out of "here"
11:49<planetmaker>oh, well. They started in 1967 with ZDF
11:50<@Rubidium>the ZDF Dokukanal began reruns in 2007 starting with episodes from 1975
11:50<planetmaker>:) I don't own any TV anymore since ~2006
11:51<@Rubidium>and that means you are totally unable to watch TV?
11:52<planetmaker>it doesn't mean that.
11:52<planetmaker>But it implies that I spend quite a tiny amount of time watching TV. Least obscure channels :)
11:53<planetmaker>But granted, it is supposedly not the worst one afaik
11:53<Eddi|zuHause>Rubidium: ZDF Dokukanal is only available via digital tv, and practically nobody has that...
11:54<Eddi|zuHause>and i did not get ZDF before 1989
11:56<planetmaker>ARD = außer Raum Dresden?
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11:57<@Rubidium>poor Eddi|zuHause :)
11:58<@Rubidium>I couldn't watch RTL since uhm... this April ;)
11:58<Eddi|zuHause>planetmaker: i said zdf
11:58<Eddi|zuHause>we did get ARD
11:58<Eddi|zuHause>and no, i was not near dresden
11:59<Eddi|zuHause>that was called "Tal der Ahnungslosen" for a reason ;)
11:59<planetmaker>I know and I know :)
12:00<planetmaker>And I didn't know to the middle statement :)
12:00<Eddi|zuHause>that's a weird statement, considering i gave 4 statements
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12:03<planetmaker>:P
12:03<planetmaker>The first appeared in different (highlight) colour and doesn't count in my enumeration scheme employed :P
12:04<planetmaker>nvm. :) Getting pretty weired :P
12:06<planetmaker>I don't want to upload useless stuff. Does bananas accept an upload in a zip or tar file which contains everything for a new version (grf, readme, license)?
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12:11<Eddi|zuHause>you mean you want a batch-upload feature?
12:11<planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause, no, I don't want a feature. I just want to know what I have to create with the target 'make bananas' :)
12:11<planetmaker>for the NewGRF projects.
12:12<planetmaker>e.g. can I just zip everything which goes there or is it no use at all to zip or tar it?
12:12<planetmaker>may I use a dir in the zip or tar - or may I not?
12:12<Eddi|zuHause>i can't help you with that
12:13<@Rubidium>well, that'd imply you use a custom license; selecting any other assumes there isn't a license file AFAIK
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12:14<DaleStan>Wait, what? Selecting GPL means that the uploader does not upload (distribute) with a copy of the GPL?
12:14<@Rubidium>just putting a readme.txt and the grf is probably enough
12:14<Eddi|zuHause>DaleStan: all places that such a file could go already have a GPL copy
12:14<@Rubidium>DaleStan: does that matter for the author?
12:15<DaleStan>Rubidium: It does if the uploader doesn't have the rights to distribute without a copy of the GPL. (i.e. doesn't have copyright to the entire file.)
12:15<DaleStan>Eddi|zuHause: GPL 2 and 3 both?
12:16<planetmaker>Rubidium, but may I upload them in a joint tar or zip?
12:16<planetmaker>e.g. one upload instead of two or three?
12:16<@Rubidium>huh, two or three uploads?
12:16<planetmaker>well... maybe such target is nonsense. But some people would like it :)
12:16<@Rubidium>you never have used bananas, have you?
12:16<planetmaker>Rubidium, <name>.grf, readme.txt
12:17<planetmaker>Rubidium, only for a single upload of a heightmap.
12:17<@Rubidium>planetmaker: then you would've noticed there's only one upload field
12:18<planetmaker>hm... true.
12:18<planetmaker>may the tar have paths inside?
12:18<Sacro>DaleStan: tt-forums seems to have no concept of attaching the GPL with a download
12:18<Sacro>i've reported so many binaries because of it
12:18<@Rubidium>planetmaker: don't think so
12:19<planetmaker>ok, because that's something needed to know :)
12:19<DaleStan>Sacro: TT-forums allow archives, though. The idea I got is that Bananas does not.
12:19<@Rubidium>planetmaker: but then, I'm not 100% sure about it
12:20<@Rubidium>DaleStan: bananas allows archives, it's only a bit pickier than tt-forums
12:20<planetmaker>hm...
12:20<@Rubidium>e.g. you need to either have a license or copying file in the archive or select one to be added to that archive
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12:21<DaleStan>Then I retract my objections.
12:22<@Rubidium>though I'm not sure how the corner case 'archive with license + selecting the non-custom license' works, whether that ditches the license or rejects it
12:23<@Rubidium>but all files distributed via bananas have a license or copying file
12:23<planetmaker>:)
12:24<planetmaker>I'm amazed. Nearly 8.5k downloads of the stuipd Marsian elevation map I uploaded...
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12:25<@Rubidium>planetmaker: so there've been 8500 people that've selected everything they could get their hands on? :)
12:26<Eddi|zuHause>why did nobody ever put a "download internet" button into a browser?
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12:27<planetmaker>most probable, yes
12:27<@petern>y
12:27<@Rubidium>hmm, lets calculate when we'll hit 2 million downloads via bananas
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12:29<@Rubidium>I'd estimate that to be around next sunday around 18:00
12:30<Brianetta>Bananas is the in-game content system, right?
12:30<planetmaker>:O
12:30<@Rubidium>Brianetta: yes
12:30<Brianetta>Might be illuminating to record the amount downloaded in bytes (:
12:30<@Rubidium>1 million was 15th of May
12:31<@Rubidium>Brianetta: that we don't record, but... it can be calculated
12:32<Brianetta>This laptop battery is only capable of a 28% charge. That sucks, but it was free.
12:33<planetmaker>:P
12:33<Brianetta>I also got one that can do 75%, which beats my original battery's 70%
12:33<Brianetta>Score.
12:34<planetmaker>Queue.BinaryHeap 1 28954 times <-- winner in terms of downloads per single version
12:36<@Rubidium>Brianetta: 811.238.547.698 bytes, or almost 420.000 bytes per file
12:37<planetmaker>wow
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12:38<@Rubidium>would mean it's about half of the used bandwidth
12:38<@Rubidium>which makes sense as the bandwidth usage roughly doubled since 0.7
12:40<@Belugas>2 MILLION downloads????
12:40<@Belugas>fuck
12:40<@Belugas>what a feature!
12:41<@Rubidium>@calc 2000000/300
12:41<@DorpsGek>Rubidium: 6666.66666667
12:41<@Rubidium>would only mean about 7000 people downloading everything they could download
12:41<z-MaTRiX>@calc sqr(sqrt(-1))
12:41<@DorpsGek>z-MaTRiX: Error: 'sqr' is not a defined function.
12:41-!-Fuco [~dota.keys@ip-105.imafexbb.sk] has joined #openttd
12:41<z-MaTRiX>@calc sqrt(-1)*sqrt(-1)
12:41<@DorpsGek>z-MaTRiX: -1
12:41<planetmaker>:)
12:41<z-MaTRiX>ye
12:42<planetmaker>@calc sqrt(-1)
12:42<@DorpsGek>planetmaker: i
12:42<dihedral>@calc i * i
12:42<@DorpsGek>dihedral: -1
12:42<dihedral>hihi
12:42<dihedral>clever little bitch of TB
12:42<@Rubidium>given that there are about 50.000 downloads a month, only a small percentage downloads something
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12:42<z-MaTRiX>sqrt(sqrt(-1))
12:43<z-MaTRiX><;
12:43<planetmaker>hm. True and sad :)
12:43<dihedral>and brain
12:43<z-MaTRiX>@calc sqrt(sqrt(-1))
12:43<@DorpsGek>z-MaTRiX: 0.707106781187+0.707106781187i
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12:43<dihedral>now go play with the bot in a private message will you?
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12:56<@Rubidium>the average number of selected 'things' per download is only 2 and the download massive amounts of NewGRFs don't seem to happen that much lately
12:56<@Rubidium>so everyone's just moved updating the content now
12:59<@Rubidium>http://rbijker.net/openttd/stats.pdf <- visualisation of the download numbers
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13:00<Eddi|zuHause>could use a few descriptions ;)
13:01<@Rubidium>use a 'better' pdf reader ;)
13:01<Eddi|zuHause>that might be an issue...
13:02<@Rubidium>like xpdf
13:04<Eddi|zuHause>kpdf might lack a few advanced features... i noticed that previously when my father sent me an annotated pdf
13:05<@Rubidium>for what it's worth: number of binary downloads a day, average downloads per week day, average downloads per hour, bananas downloads a day
13:05<frosch123>hooray! the g8 want to enact a law, which limits global heating by 2 degree. let's see how they will punish it if the global heating infringes.
13:06<@Rubidium>Fahrenheit or Kelvin/Celsius?
13:06<frosch123>K/°C
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13:07<@Rubidium>or degrees based on a 10 centimeter high thermometer with 1 degree C per millimeter at a distance of 1 kilometer
13:07<frosch123>imo flooding should also be disallowed
13:09<Eddi|zuHause>in the last graph, there are two jumps, one in early april is the release of 0.7.0, but what's the earlier one mid february?
13:09<@Rubidium>they'll just rename floods to flushes; heavy rainfall flushed Bangladesh, a hurricane flushed the lower parts of New Orlean
13:09<jaachanor>is the "plane overtaking" by separating planes in height by their max speed supposed to work?
13:09<@Rubidium>Eddi|zuHause: the first jump is beta, the second jump (mid march) is rc, the third is stable
13:10<Eddi|zuHause>the middle one is less noticeable
13:10<severb>greetings, I'm trying to understand how signals work and I would like to ask for some help, is posting a link to an image allowed?
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13:10<Eddi|zuHause>maybe the line is confusing, it could be a step-function for each block
13:11<@Rubidium>Eddi|zuHause: please tell me how to do that automagically in oocalc
13:11<Eddi|zuHause>;)
13:12<@Rubidium>in the first graph you can see the week of Christmas too as anomaly
13:12<Eddi|zuHause>piecewise functions you can usually do with IF(x<a, f(x), g(x))
13:13<severb>guys, can you please help me? :-)
13:13<yorick>maybe
13:13<@Rubidium>why would linking to images be disallowed if linking to pdfs is allowed?
13:13<Eddi|zuHause>severb: a) please do not ask to ast, b) how many signal tutorials have you read?
13:14<severb>Eddi|zuHause: I've read all I could find on wiki about signals
13:14<Eddi|zuHause>"all i could find" is not an answer
13:14<Yexo>hello
13:14<Eddi|zuHause>for all we know, you found nothing
13:14<Eddi|zuHause>and you still have not shown us your problem
13:14<severb>oh, there are some pages on wiki about signals
13:14<yorick>...
13:14<severb>I like to ask if it's ok to post a link before doing it
13:14<jaachanor>does it work for anyone?
13:14<severb>http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/7459/clujnapocatransport22ma.png
13:15<yorick>serverb: yes, and
13:15<Eddi|zuHause>and we are annoyed by people who ask if they are allowed to do something
13:15<yorick>what is your question
13:15<severb>so, I would like to place the signals in such a way that either the two trains form A to go to B one after the other
13:15<@Rubidium>jaachanor: you probably won't even see the height separation
13:15<severb>or the two from B to go to A
13:16<yorick>serverb, so basically you don t want them to crash into eachother?
13:16<severb>no, I don't want them to intersect in the middle and turn back
13:16<jaachanor>Rubidium: i thought that was the point of it? so they wouldn't "glide" through eachother?
13:16<Eddi|zuHause>severb: you need to place the signals in the middle in a way so they overlap each other
13:16<yorick>serverb, use path signals
13:17<severb>path signals?
13:17<yorick>or listen to Eddi, that's probably wiser :)
13:18<severb>Eddi|zuHause: the idea is in the moment the first train leaves for example train1 all the trains in the other station can't go, until train 1 arrives
13:18<Eddi|zuHause>www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Klein%20Elsmuenster%20Transport,%2023.%20Maer%201942.png <- try it like here on the middle track
13:18<@Rubidium>jaachanor: planes are a mess w.r.t. bounding boxes; their bounding box is about the size of the cock pit, making it very likely that they swap when one is faster than the other
13:18<severb>and eventually train 2 can follow train 1
13:18<jaachanor>Rubidium: i see
13:19<jaachanor>i think i remember them being separated noticably, but it might have been a patch
13:20<Eddi|zuHause>severb: you understand the picture? one in the end, two in the middle facing each other, one in the other end
13:20<@Rubidium>as for the drawing algorithm they are not touching, thus there's no need to determine which one is closer to the camera. Besides that at all distances they are equally big so you can't see which one is closer when they don't overlap
13:20<Eddi|zuHause>must be the ones allowing traffic through the back
13:20<severb>Eddi|zuHause: I'm having a hard time to understand it, I'm a noob :-)
13:21<Eddi|zuHause>right click the signals in the signal gui to get a description
13:21<severb>already tried that, but thanks anyway I'll give it another try maybe I get lucky
13:22<severb>is there a good tutorial about signals?
13:23<yorick>serverb, http://transporttycoon.net/rail1 <-- this, but it's old
13:23<Eddi|zuHause>http://uwe.s2000.ws/ttdx/signal/index.php
13:24<severb>thanks a lot
13:24<Eddi|zuHause>http://uwe.s2000.ws/ttdx/signal/yapp.php <- better this one
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13:43<CIA-1>OpenTTD: yexo * r16767 /trunk/src/ai/api/ (ai_tile.cpp ai_tile.hpp): -Fix [NoAI] (r16524): AITile::GetCargoProduction/Acceptance didn't accept a radius of 0 anymore
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: translators * r16768 /trunk/src/lang/ (6 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed)
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: german - 2 changes by planetmaker
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: persian - 38 changes by Gajet9
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: romanian - 10 changes by kkmic
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: serbian - 93 changes by etran
13:46<CIA-1>OpenTTD: slovak - 2 changes by James
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14:12<Wolf01>hello :D
14:13<yorick>hello :D
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14:17<@Belugas>hi Wolf01. never mind yorick, he smoked some stuff. Again
14:18<Wolf01>how is going on?
14:19<@Belugas>it's going on buzy, as usual... and yuo?
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14:20<Wolf01>the days don't have enough hours to do everything :P
14:21<Wammler>just liked to install openttd on windows vista, that is how the readme looks: http://img.ammler.ch/images/readme.jpg
14:21<Wammler>http://img.ammler.ch/images/readme.jpg
14:21<Wammler>hmm
14:21<Wolf01>that's because notepad is broken
14:22<+tokai>it probably only can handle MS DOS linefeeds
14:23<yorick>Wammler: make bundle should fix it first ;)
14:24<Wammler>yorick: I won't install devtools on that maschine
14:24<@Belugas>Wammler, try Notepad2, or Notepad++
14:24<Prof_Frink>Or wordpad.
14:24<@Belugas>indeed
14:25<yorick>or notepad++
14:25<Prof_Frink>Or kate. Or vim.
14:25<@Belugas>by the way, congrats, Wammler... you're among the few ones wo actually are trying to read the readme file...
14:25<Wammler>well, shouldn't the readme somehow easy be readable?
14:25<@Belugas>yorick, that's what I said :S
14:25<yorick>Belugas: I know
14:25<@Belugas>Wammler, it is readable
14:26<@Belugas>just that notepad is awfully shitty
14:26<Wammler>Belugas: thanks
14:26<Wammler>(I am Ammler on web)
14:26<planetmaker>:O
14:26*yorick thought of ammler on windows
14:27<Wammler>yorick: windows and irc client?
14:27<yorick>Wammler: well I can do it ;)
14:32<@Belugas>identity theft...
14:34<Wammler>I have sample.cat and opengfx in C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Documents\OpenTTD\data
14:34<Wammler>now, I should be able to start, shouldn't I?
14:35<@Belugas>yes no maybe
14:35<dihedral>Ammler: you just had the readme open, it tells you where it looks for those files!
14:36<Wammler>yes, isn't that the correct location?
14:36<dihedral>read it!
14:37<Wammler>204 3. The shared directory
14:37<Wammler>Windows: C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Documents\OpenTTD
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14:38<dihedral>well there you have it then! :-)
14:38<Wammler>doesn't find sample.cat there
14:39<yorick>wwottdgd2 was one year ago - 4 days
14:39<yorick>time for a new one?
14:39<@Belugas>a coffee? yes indeed
14:39<@Belugas>thaks
14:39<@Belugas>+n
14:40<planetmaker>yorick, but *someone* has to do it :)
14:40<dihedral>yorick, who actually cares :-P
14:40<@Belugas>Ammler, if you have a openttd.cfg somewhere, better remove it and restart
14:40<@Belugas>i think
14:40<dihedral>yeah - you cannot just move your config to another location than your data folder
14:40<yorick>planetmaker, you are a someone?
14:40<Wammler>Belugas: this maschine never saw a openttd before
14:41<yorick>machine*
14:41<dihedral>yorick, neither pm nor me this year
14:41<yorick>;)
14:41<Wammler>I just downloaded and executed the openttd
14:41<dihedral>Wammler, does not mean that the config could be created in another place :-P
14:41<Wammler>it works iwth the sample.cat in the binary location.
14:42<dihedral>then you should have a look for the config in you personal Documents folder
14:42<Wammler>well, nvm. I just wanted an alternative to solitaire here :-)
14:45<@Belugas>sudoku
14:45<Wammler>I might be the first, who tried to install it systemwide on windows
14:50<frosch123>sudoku is boring
14:53<@Belugas>well... since i discover it, i still like it a lot :) WebSudoku, Evil level. Print two, am good for traveling home. Daily routine :)
14:54<frosch123>http://www.janko.at/Raetsel/index.htm <- there is so much more interesting stuff
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15:04<@Belugas>miam
15:11<yorick>http://xkcd.com/356/ :)
15:14<KenjiE20>lol
15:14<frosch123>intersting problem there btw., i guess it is some famous problem, isn't it?
15:18<Xaroth>http://xkcd.com/371/
15:18<yorick>frosch123: try looking at the alt-text
15:21<@Rubidium>Wammler: what exact version of OpenTTD did you download?
15:21<Eddi|zuHause>omg... i have been reading xkcd for how many years now? i never noticed that there's an alt-text
15:21<dihedral>hehe IS2-beta3? :-D
15:22<frosch123>well, I guess either the solution is 0 or some irrational number
15:22<Aali>Eddi|zuHause: wow, you just missed half the jokes
15:23<Wammler>Rubidium: r16521
15:24<Wammler>621
15:24<@Rubidium>and then the win9x, win32 or win64 version?
15:24<Wammler>win32
15:24<planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause: fail! ;)
15:25<Wammler>http://binaries.openttd.org/nightlies/trunk/r16621/openttd-trunk-r16621-windows-win32.zip
15:26<Eddi|zuHause>no, i am not just going through 600 comics and checking the alt-texts
15:27<Prof_Frink>Eddi|zuHause: Yes, you are.
15:27<Eddi|zuHause>NO!! I'M NOT !!1!1!einself
15:28<Eddi|zuHause>i'm quite certain i have not seen all the comics anyway
15:28<Wammler>is shift-1 = "!" on german keyboard?
15:29<Eddi|zuHause>yes
15:29<Sacro>shift-1?
15:29<Sacro>surely shift+1
15:29<Prof_Frink>Capital 1.
15:29<Eddi|zuHause>he means shift+1 ;)
15:29<Wammler>sacro, how do you type shift-1?
15:30<Eddi|zuHause>Wammler: it's a standard notation, "a+b" if you press two keys simultaneously, "a,b" if you press them one after another
15:30<Wammler>(what else could you mean?)
15:31<Wammler>maybe, I didn't use it because on my keyboard shift+1 is "+" :-)
15:31<Prof_Frink>c-a c
15:31<Prof_Frink>Wammler: Your keyboard's broken.
15:32<Wammler>oh, you mean, all my spelling errors are because of my broken keyboard?
15:32<frosch123>?-shift=ß
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15:33<frosch123>^^ quite troublesome equation
15:33<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16769 /trunk/Makefile.msvc: -Fix: win32 and win64 binary packages wouldn't get their readme converted to DOS line endings
15:33<Eddi|zuHause>frosch123: that's assuming that the operation is commutative ;)
15:33<Wammler>\o/ windows bug fixed by linux user :P
15:33<Wammler>s
15:34<Wammler>that proves, windows users don't read readmes :-)
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15:36<dihedral>Rubidium, since when? i mean - nobody notices anything like that as nobody ever reads it, but now that it's mentiond, i believe someone in the forums once mentioned something along those lines too
15:39<frosch123>hmm, I should not have taken a look at the changeset :o
15:40*Rubidium ponders whether to quote that
15:40<dihedral>:-D
15:40<dihedral>lol
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15:54<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16770 /extra/masterserver_updater/src/shared/stdafx.h: [MSU] -Fix: compilation, by updating stdafx.h
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16:22<andythenorth_>evening
16:26<Muxy>good evening from/for CET DST
16:27<Eddi|zuHause>that's called CEST
16:27<Muxy>fine
16:29<Muxy>i'm searching in the source code function used to compute requested good to make a town grow
16:29<Eddi|zuHause>GrowTown?
16:30<Eddi|zuHause>it's a simple check saying "if (arctic climate and no food, or tropic climate and not both food and water) return;"
16:31<Muxy>meaning, for tropic, a town will grow only if there is food > 0 and water > 0
16:32<planetmaker>Muxy: the town will tell you
16:32<Muxy>yeap in the town window, i know
16:34<Muxy>but i was searching for a more complex rule, regarding town population, you have to supply a minimum of cargo
16:34<Eddi|zuHause>that does not exist
16:35<@Rubidium>Eddi|zuHause: lies...
16:35<@Rubidium>if population < certain threshold it'll always grow
16:36<@Rubidium>regardless of whether it needs water/food
16:36<Eddi|zuHause>ok, it's _slightly_ more complex, but not in a way that Muxy wanted ;)
16:36<frosch123>also when it is funded :)
16:37<Muxy>Well i found something here : UpdateTownGrowRate
16:37<Eddi|zuHause>yeah, that's it
16:46-!-HackaLittleBit [~HackaLitt@87.196.210.161] has joined #openttd
16:46<HackaLittleBit>evenin
16:47<yorick>evenin
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16:47<Nite_Owl>Hello all
16:48<HackaLittleBit>hello
16:48<Nite_Owl>Hello HackaLittleBit
16:49<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16771 /trunk/src/ai/api/ai_tilelist.hpp.sq: -Fix: API export was forgotten causing API to think variables were uint; doesn't matter much as int was converted to uint and then back.
17:01<Muxy>well, i found the second part of my question...
17:02<Wolf01>'night
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17:08<Chruker>hmm, does anybody have a chart/table over the different vehicles start, max and end reliabilities?
17:09<@Rubidium>wiki?
17:10<Hirundo>reliabilities are randomized IIRC
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17:12<@Rubidium>are the error messages in http://rbijker.net/openttd/fs3019.diff still correct for the English?
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17:14<Chruker>I couldnt find it via google nor the wiki
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17:16<Nite_Owl>They look correct to me Rubidium
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17:33<Chruker>I vaguely recall reading somewhere that the vehicles have a reliability when they are introduced. It then increases to a certain maximum, and finally drops down again before they are obsolete.
17:34<@Rubidium>that sounds about right
17:36<@petern>yes, it is actually random
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17:48<Eddi|zuHause>the grf can roughly define which engines are more reliable and which ones are less. and the length of the high reliability period
17:49<Chruker>Do you happen to have the grf doc at your fingertips?
17:50<Chruker>nvm
17:51<Eddi|zuHause>the DBSet readme says something about this stuff
17:51<Eddi|zuHause>and there's the grf specs
17:51<welshdragon>Prof_Frink: you just lost the game :D
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17:54<Prof_Frink>welshdragon: I am not Sacro.
17:54-!-Yexo [~Yexo@ip51cca4b5.adsl-surfen.hetnet.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:54<welshdragon>:(
17:55<welshdragon>you did play the game
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18:13<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r16772 /trunk/src/ (49 files in 4 dirs): -Fix [FS#3019]: don't use the same error message for turning around road vehicles and flipping parts of trains in the depot
18:14<Eddi|zuHause>:o
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19:23<SirSquidness>So, what did you think of <local sporting event> last night? I really thought <away team> were too good for <home team>, but it was still a good match.
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19:32<z-MaTRiX>hey-ho
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19:34<Sacro>I think i just found a bug...
19:34<Sacro>not sure
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19:34<Gleeb_>Sacro: Oh?
19:35<Sacro>hmm, that or i might have left clone clicked
19:37<Gleeb_>haha
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20:38<niblet>hey.. quick question; How do I develop newgrf? is there a howto anywhere?
20:39<DaleStan>Read the New Graphics Specs on wiki.ttdpatch.net. Including the tutorial. Follow instructions.
20:39<niblet>ty :)
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20:52*DaleStan thinks you will find that my answer was not nearly as helpful as you had hoped. NFO is not known for being readily comprehensible.
20:52<niblet>^^
20:53<Sacro>DaleStan: not helpful, but accurate
20:53<niblet>well it was what I was looking for
20:53<niblet>at least I know what Im up against now :o
20:53<niblet>wether or not to take it on is yet to be decided..
20:54<niblet>all I want to do is add a bit more info in the town window
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21:04<niblet>so who's working on the NFO-editor and when is it expected to be ready? :p
21:06<niblet>or tell me is this possible: I want to for instance add "goods last month" to the city window.. would that even be possible to do?
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21:29<niblet>maybe? :p
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21:41<@Rubidium>noone, when it's done if ever, maybe if you extend the specs and implement that extension, yes
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21:42<niblet>I was only joking about the nfo-editor :p
21:42<niblet>so it could be done.. thats interesting. maybe I'll ask around on the forums later
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23:29<SirSquidness>what is the first year in openttd in which you can build vehicles?
23:29*SirSquidness wants to start from teh very start
23:29<SirSquidness>year 1 wont even let me build depots
23:29<SirSquidness>but they somehow have paved roads :p
23:30<SirSquidness>and early 1900's architecture
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---Logclosed Thu Jul 09 00:00:32 2009