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#openttd IRC Logs for 2011-01-26

---Logopened Wed Jan 26 00:00:40 2011
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01:52<@Terkhen>good morning
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03:14<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r21909 /trunk/src/ (7 files): -Fix: some missing spaces
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04:11<andythenorth>HEQS has 3 out of 5 transport types
04:11<andythenorth>I should add a ship + a plane
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04:11<andythenorth>I guess monorail and maglev are not featured either :P
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04:23<@planetmaker>moin
04:25<andythenorth>morning
04:26<andythenorth>did I make any mistakes? http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=140077
04:26<andythenorth>(PDF)
04:27<@planetmaker>andythenorth: could you additionally link it also in the posting you announce it?
04:27<andythenorth>yes
04:27<@planetmaker>I always find it annoying when someone writes along the lines of "go there to read what I want to tell you without link"
04:27<@planetmaker>especially the "go to first posting in a loooooong thread"
04:28<@planetmaker>as it's at least two clicks where I could save one :-P
04:28<andythenorth>done
04:28<@planetmaker>:-)
04:29<andythenorth>done, done, onto the next one
04:31*Rubidium wonders why 1.0.0 works, but nightlies from spring to summer 2010 don't
04:33<andythenorth>I took a guess at compatibility :P
04:33<andythenorth>I actually have no idea which versions of ottd HEQS works with
04:33<@Rubidium>if it works with 1.0.0, then it works with nightlies from that time as well
04:34<@Rubidium>as stable releases are basically a subset of the features of nightlies at that time
04:35<andythenorth>true
04:36<@planetmaker>works with stable X --> nightlies from March or later the same year
04:36<andythenorth>I don't even know for sure it works with 1.0.0
04:37<@planetmaker>if it works with 1.0.5 it's a good enough guess
04:37<andythenorth>but it used to work with 0.7.x so I figured it's probably ok in 1.x :P
04:37<@planetmaker>as 1.0.5 is 1.0.0 with bug fixes
04:37<@Rubidium>planetmaker: sometimes properties are added in point releases
04:38<@planetmaker>yes I know :-)
04:39<@Rubidium>1.0.3: some industry/railtype stuff
04:39<@Rubidium>1.0.1: printing qword
04:39<@Rubidium>so I guess it's safe to assume that if 1.0.5 works 1.0.0 works as well (you ought to test it though)
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04:41<@Rubidium>and I think all nightlies of 2010 ought to work as well
04:41<Ammler>andythenorth: very nice guide, openttd 1.1 doesn't have numbers for parameter values anymore, does it?
04:43<Ammler>credits list looks a bit silly using real names for some, for others nick only
04:44<andythenorth>Ammler: you could be right
04:44<andythenorth>I might just use nicks
04:46<Ammler>does "Climate Toyland not supported" mean, you disabled it there or it just looks ugly and therefor not recommend?
04:46<andythenorth>vehicles aren't available in toyland iirc
04:47<@planetmaker>I'd prefer 'not supported' means "use at your own risk"
04:47<andythenorth>ach
04:47<andythenorth>they do seem to be in Toyland
04:47<andythenorth>that's horrible :P
04:47<@planetmaker>It'd mean one could use it with something like Toyland2Mars
04:47<@planetmaker>which would not be that horrible ;-)
04:48<@planetmaker>And that's what all people forget when they disable toyland :-P
04:48<Ammler>climate switch is useless imo
04:48<@planetmaker>well. Not really. But it is nice, if it can be disabled ;-)
04:49<@planetmaker>or all climates would look the same
04:49<@planetmaker>like... arctic tiles, tropic industries, toyland houses :-P
04:50<@planetmaker>oh, and temperate vehicles, of course ;-)
04:50<Ammler>why should you load arctic tiles newgrf for toyland?
04:50<andythenorth>any other suggestions for HEQS manual?
04:50<andythenorth>I've made suggested changes so far
04:51<@planetmaker>andythenorth: could you try a better scaling algorithm for your vehicles?
04:51<@planetmaker>they look quite pixelated...
04:51<andythenorth>meh
04:51<andythenorth>:P
04:51<Ammler>you can still add a ActionB warning like "this set looks ugly in Toyland"
04:51<andythenorth>planetmaker: I can't find a better pdf export
04:51<andythenorth>I thought OS X had more options on print to pdf
04:52<andythenorth>but I imagined them, or they don't exist
04:52<@planetmaker>nah, I don't mean the pdf export.
04:52<@planetmaker>Your vehicle images are like 2x zoomed
04:52<andythenorth>yes
04:52<@planetmaker>with... the simplest zoom algorithm or so
04:52<@planetmaker>(which is the default though)
04:52<@planetmaker>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pixel_art_scaling_algorithms
04:52<Ammler>it does show the pixel art, isn't that nice?
04:53<andythenorth>it's supposed to be blocky :D
04:53<andythenorth>but the effect is diminished by the pdf compression :(
04:53<andythenorth>planetmaker: can you open pages files?
04:54<@planetmaker>uhm? What page? you mean like pages which is the equivalent to writer to word to... text editor?
04:54<@planetmaker>then yes
04:54<andythenorth>iwork page
04:54<andythenorth>s
04:55<@planetmaker>but... it's a matter of how the images were created, not how they're embedded within the layout programme
04:55<@planetmaker>yes, it's installed
04:55<andythenorth>they're just screenshots from 2x zoom
04:55<@planetmaker>exactly
04:55<andythenorth>without compression they look....sharp
04:56<@planetmaker>the 2x zoom algorithm used just sucks
04:56<andythenorth>I think this will be a highly subjective argument :)
04:57<andythenorth>I want a 2x zoom that makes a pixel 2x bigger with sharp edges
04:57<@planetmaker>well. Look at the differences as shown on the link I gave above.
04:57<andythenorth>no interpolation
04:57<andythenorth>I like blocky
04:58<@planetmaker>well... looks not nice when zoomed in and 1px -> 4px without antialias or so
04:59<andythenorth>ho
04:59<andythenorth>well you might convince me
05:00<andythenorth>but all I'll do is remove the zoom and include them at 100% :D
05:00<@planetmaker>:-D
05:00<andythenorth>I am more concerned about the crappy compression at the moment
05:01<@planetmaker>I mean, the real screenshots look ok (though slightly jpg-ified, too).
05:01<andythenorth>maybe a html user manual would be better?
05:01<@planetmaker>dunno
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06:09<supermop>hello
06:10<@planetmaker>hi
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06:11<supermop>how are you?
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09:04<@Belugas>hello
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09:24<Ammler>Bonjour
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09:30<@planetmaker>hi Belugas & Ammler :-)
09:31<@Belugas>Hey ho to you both!
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09:32*andythenorth_ ponders naming the ships in FISH
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09:40<andythenorth_>Should I keep the type of ship in the name?
09:40<andythenorth_>e.g. Coaster, Trader, Ferry etc
09:44<andythenorth_>hmm
09:44<andythenorth_>that's very bizarre
09:44<andythenorth_>the first name I chose for a ship was PATRAIKOS
09:44<andythenorth_>based on name of a greek maritime area
09:45<andythenorth_>and there is a ship named PATRAIKOS
09:45<andythenorth_>bizarre coincidence :P
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09:47<@planetmaker>:-)
09:47<@planetmaker>andythenorth_, maybe you keep the type out of the name, if you can provide the ship type as additional info in the purchase menu
09:47<andythenorth_>I thought so
09:48<andythenorth_>I think it's useful to distinguish some type information though
09:48<@planetmaker>It's also not called Porsche 911 sports car. It's just a Porsche 911 ;-)
09:48<andythenorth_>e.g. it helps choose PAX / general / freight
09:48<andythenorth_>original ships are e.g. FFP Passenger Ferry
09:48<andythenorth_>same for RVs
09:49<@planetmaker>yeah. But original ships have no additional purchase menu info texts either
09:49<@planetmaker>nor refit capability. Nor... so many nice things
09:49<andythenorth_>and train sets don't have 'train'
09:49<andythenorth_>in the name
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09:49<andythenorth_>I'll try reducing it to minimum
09:50<andythenorth_>'Ferry' and 'Freighter' might be justified
09:50<andythenorth_>I guess I just have to test and sea
09:50<andythenorth_>see /s
09:50<andythenorth_>:P
09:51<andythenorth_>this is just like a FISH ship: http://www.wellandcanal.ca/salties/p/passatwind/wind.jpg
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09:52<andythenorth_>planetmaker: you prefer to see less words in the buy menu? Or you just find it weird to specify type when it might be obvious?
09:52<Wolf01>hello
09:54<@planetmaker>hi Wolf01
09:54<@planetmaker>andythenorth_, well, it is more usual to buy a "VW Golf" instead of a "VW Golf medium-sized car".
09:54<andythenorth_>indeed
09:55<@planetmaker>I also just purchase an A380 instead of a A380 long-range high-capacity jet airliner ;-)
09:55<andythenorth_>But you buy a Sikorsky Helicopter?
09:55*andythenorth_ tests
09:56<@planetmaker>Well. There might be Sikorsky Lear Jet, too ;-)
09:56<andythenorth_>not in AV8 you don't
09:56<@planetmaker>Besides Pikka is a good guide but not the rule book ;-)
09:56<Noldo>I remember Lear Jet from Flight Simulator 5 and 98
09:57<andythenorth_>HEQS I mostly included the vehicle type
09:57<andythenorth_>it groups similar vehicles in the players mind
09:57<andythenorth_>and is useful, e.g. when new vehicle type is announced
09:58<andythenorth_>hmm
09:58<andythenorth_>I was just going to use model names
09:58<andythenorth_>but it looks weird
09:58<andythenorth_>seems like it needs manufacturer + model names
09:58<andythenorth_>or numbers or something
09:59<@planetmaker>There's pros and cons for both, yes.
10:00<Ammler>andythenorth_: maybe SirkoZ can make a better HEQS-names grf
10:00<@planetmaker>It might be easier for the player if the type is in the name. Or in an abbreviated form
10:02<andythenorth_>http://tt-foundry.com/misc/name_test.png
10:02<Noldo>http://www.google.fi/imgres?imgurl=http://www.savonsanomat.fi/multimedia/dynamic/00101/Tukit_101141b.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.savonsanomat.fi/uutiset/savo/uppotukkivaara/474564&usg=__BcmmxaaNBvo3lcYMxz2h-u_usik=&h=212&w=468&sz=42&hl=fi&start=0&zoom=1&tbnid=LmSe_o7K9kLJEM:&tbnh=80&tbnw=176&ei=lzdATYqpK8Gi8QPbs_T0Aw&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dtukkilautta%26hl%3Dfi%26sa%3DX%26biw%3D1241%26bih%3D713%26tbs%3Disch:1%26prmd%3Divns&itbs=1&iact=rc&dur=561&oei=lzdATYqpK8Gi8QPbs_T
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10:03<Noldo>oops
10:03<andythenorth_>yes, they're in FISH :)
10:03<Noldo>really?
10:03<andythenorth_>log raft
10:03<andythenorth_>variable capacity
10:04<Noldo>had no idea what it is in english, though that is very logical
10:04<@planetmaker>:-) They're great
10:04<Noldo>popular in the near by lake Saimaa
10:05<@planetmaker>andythenorth_, I think something like "Patraikos frighter" is a good name
10:05<andythenorth_>I think it will do
10:05<andythenorth_>leaves room to add (steam) (diesel) etc if needed
10:06<andythenorth_>not sure it is
10:06<@planetmaker>hm... that's not really important. I'd add it to the purchase description
10:06<andythenorth_>(small) (large) etc is very boring and can go
10:06<@planetmaker>It'll be visible from the graphics possibly ;-)
10:06<@planetmaker>definitely, yes
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10:14<Ammler>you can add icons like 2cctrainset
10:14<DanMacK>Hey all
10:15<Ammler>heya Dan
10:16<@planetmaker>moin DanMacK
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10:26<Ammler>something changed according to lzma from beta3 to beta4, seems like Fedora doesn't build anymore?
10:27<@Rubidium>or did Fedora change between beta3 and beta4?
10:28<@Rubidium>as I don't remember seeing any LZMA related changes in OpenTTD this year
10:29<+glx>no change in rpm spec ?
10:30<@Rubidium>not since beta3
10:30<+glx>so it's the OS :)
10:34<Ammler>I try to build beta3 again, this is silly... :-/
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10:38<Ammler>got following error on local build: "error: %post(glibc-common-2.12.90-17.x86_64) scriptlet failed, signal 11" (first time I try to build for Fedora:14 locally
10:38<@Rubidium>that's like Thai to me
10:39<@Rubidium>although, signal 11 == c0000005
10:39<@Rubidium>or sigsegv
10:39<Ammler>oh, I wanted to paste that on the obs support channel :-)
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10:42<ZirconiumX>hello all
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10:50<unknwn>i install openttd 1.0.5 . Acceleration of time in this version more slower than in 1.0.1
10:50<unknwn>How can i increase aceleration time?
10:50<@Terkhen>hi unknwn
10:51<ZirconiumX>What - Fast Forward? I don't think it is
10:51<unknwn>yes, fast foward
10:51<@Terkhen>if the game is going noticeably slower you are either using lots of AIs or playing with a lot of vehicles
10:52<ZirconiumX>WTHJS
10:52<unknwn>i'm not using AI
10:52<unknwn>in 1.0.1 fast foward more faster
10:52<ZirconiumX>number of vehicles?
10:52<ZirconiumX>Then use 1.0.1
10:52<unknwn>i start new mission and click fast foward
10:52<@Terkhen>unknwn: the same savegame fast forwards faster?
10:53<ZirconiumX>He can't load the savegame
10:53<ZirconiumX>unless I being stupid - which evidently I am
10:53<Ammler>Rubidium: the issue is Fedora works with xz-devel but not with lzma-devel
10:54<@Terkhen>1.0.1 should be savegame compatible with 1.0.5 IIRC
10:54<@Rubidium>Ammler: so why did beta3 work?
10:54<unknwn>lol..1.0.1 started in window, but 1.0.5 in fullscreen)
10:54<@Rubidium>or did it (silently) fail?
10:54<ZirconiumX>then switch off fullscreen?
10:54<unknwn>in window fast foward works more faster
10:54<unknwn>yes
10:58<ZirconiumX>problem solved
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11:04<Mazur>Which version gives Fedora problems? I can try it out here, too, give you my 2¢.
11:05-!-DanMacK [~DanMacK@206.191.69.149] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:05<Mazur>I have 1.0.5 beta3 running no problem.
11:06<Mazur>OpenTTD 1.1.0-beta3
11:06<Mazur>I mean.
11:07-!-DanM is now known as DanMacK
11:15<Ammler>Mazur: none, the issue was in the spec
11:16<Ammler>I assume, fedora uses lzma for lzma1 and xz for lzma2
11:21<Mazur>Ammler: See http://stephane.lesimple.fr/blog/tags/lzma2
11:25<Ammler>Mazur: yeah, as I thought, suse doesn't provide lzma(1) anymore
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12:01<z-MaTRiX1nonidentified>h
12:05<ZirconiumX>could you change your name to something shorter
12:07<z-MaTRiX1nonidentified>sure it used to be shorter
12:07<z-MaTRiX1nonidentified>but its boring to identify again
12:07<ZirconiumX>like... z-MaTRIX1
12:07<z-MaTRiX1nonidentified>because server kicks out link broken or smg
12:08-!-z-MaTRiX1nonidentified is now known as z-MaTRiX
12:08<ZirconiumX>you didn't have to identify for that di you?
12:08<z-MaTRiX>i did
12:09<@SmatZ>irssi doesn't support some kind of auto-perform?
12:09<z-MaTRiX>hm
12:09<z-MaTRiX>it supports scripting
12:09<@SmatZ>where you would enter "/msg NickServ auth abc xyz", so you get identified
12:09<ZirconiumX>mibbit does
12:09<z-MaTRiX>yes its the identify ...
12:10<z-MaTRiX>whats up SmartZ ?
12:11<ZirconiumX>lol
12:12*ZirconiumX jumps at z-MaTRiX and some wierd camera rig suspends me in slow motion with lots of cameras taking photos of me
12:12<ZirconiumX>(matrix style of course!)
12:13<z-MaTRiX><;
12:13<z-MaTRiX>would like that if you were a cute girl
12:13<ZirconiumX>but I'm not
12:13<ZirconiumX>I'm a...
12:13-!-Tennel [~Tennel@farafin-gate.cs.uni-magdeburg.de] has joined #openttd
12:13<ZirconiumX>here it comes
12:13<ZirconiumX>GEEK!
12:14<ZirconiumX>there that's over with
12:14<z-MaTRiX>R wrfu n wrqu jx-wrxu * R pnfu xj luxlu jq srzu * Rxlrdu n wnc nww dna * R'fu nwvnal cuux sprl vna * R'z n ouuk * R'z n ouuk * Jp pj R'z n ouuk * Ojjd Wjed R'z n ouuk.
12:15-!-Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e06ec12.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd
12:15-!-Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has joined #openttd
12:16<@planetmaker>...
12:22-!-ZirconiumX [561b9bc6@ircip2.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client]
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12:23<@SmatZ>z-MaTRiX: google translate recognised that as finnish
12:24<@Terkhen>it probably does not support gibberish
12:24<z-MaTRiX>:)
12:25<z-MaTRiX>(its encrypted)
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12:30<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r21910 /trunk/src/autoreplace_cmd.cpp: -Codechange: rename some autoreplace internal functions so they don't collide with globabl functions
12:30<z-MaTRiX>http://www.poppyfields.net/filks/g.html
12:31<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r21911 /trunk/src/ (4 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: move tcache.last_speed to gcache.last_speed and make SetLastSpeed a function of GroundVehicle
12:31<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r21912 /trunk/src/ (roadveh.h roadveh_cmd.cpp saveload/vehicle_sl.cpp): -Codechange: let road vehicles use gcache.last_speed/SetLastSpeed as well
12:33<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r21913 /trunk/src/roadveh_cmd.cpp: -Codechange: move bridge speed limiting for road vehicles to the same (logically speaking) place as for trains
12:34<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r21914 /trunk/src/ (ground_vehicle.hpp train_cmd.cpp): -Codechange: move the algorithmic part of Train::UpdateSpeed to a function in GroundVehicle
12:34<z-MaTRiX>http://www.openttd.info/news.php
12:34<z-MaTRiX>ahah
12:35<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r21915 /trunk/src/ (roadveh.h roadveh_cmd.cpp): -Codechange: rename RoadVehicleAccelerate to RoadVehicle::UpdateSpeed (to match the naming used by Trains), and make use of the algorithm implemented in GroundVehicle
12:36<@SmatZ>:)
12:36<@SmatZ>I don't speak magyar at all
12:37<@SmatZ>actually.. "Új" is "new"
12:37<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r21916 /trunk/src/ground_vehicle.hpp:
12:37<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Fix [FS#4442]: the minimum speed needed for (realistic) acceleration to work
12:37<CIA-1>OpenTTD: properly can sometimes be more than the (temporary) maximum speed causing Clamp
12:37<CIA-1>OpenTTD: to "fail". Make sure that the minimum speed always overrules the maximum speed
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12:47<z-MaTRiX>btw
12:48<z-MaTRiX>trains coming out of depot trying to bypass one-way pathfinder signals
12:49<z-MaTRiX>so must use simple blocksignals there
12:50-!-ar3k [~ident@87-239-75-101.internetia.net.pl] has joined #openttd
12:54-!-fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4db80557.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd
12:54<@planetmaker>and you're using a recent nightly?
12:55<z-MaTRiX>no it was 1.05
12:56<z-MaTRiX>and before
12:56<z-MaTRiX>dont remember if it was the case in original ttd
12:56<@planetmaker>TTD has only two-way block signals
12:57<z-MaTRiX>ah
12:57<z-MaTRiX>so
12:57<z-MaTRiX>train wants to pass one-way pathfinder signal from bask
12:57<z-MaTRiX>*back
12:57<@planetmaker>original TTD also has another path finder ;-)
12:57<z-MaTRiX>replacing to simple blocksignal solves problem
12:58<@Rubidium>fonsinchen: proof of concept with updating cur_order_index for service depot orders: http://rbijker.net/openttd/fs4440.diff
12:58<@planetmaker>well. Try the beta4 or so with the same savegame...
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13:16<fonsinchen>looks nice
13:16<fonsinchen>I'll try it later
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13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: translators * r21917 /trunk/src/lang/ (5 files in 2 dirs):
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: basque - 28 changes by Thadah
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: indonesian - 15 changes by adjayanto
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: japanese - 11 changes by kokubunzi
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: luxembourgish - 250 changes by Phreeze
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: brazilian_portuguese - 130 changes by Luis_Mizuchiro
13:47-!-Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.A98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd
13:49<z-MaTRiX>2 way pathfinder fail
13:49<z-MaTRiX>in latest beta
13:50<@SmatZ>wow, there is porn at youtube!
13:50<Mazur>Is there?
13:50<frosch123>likely not for long
13:50<z-MaTRiX>2 tracks crossing each other, 4 pathfinders
13:50<@SmatZ>has been there for at lest 8 hours
13:50<Mazur>I looked but never found any.
13:50<z-MaTRiX>train coming from bottom right to top left reserves whole track
13:52<@SmatZ>actually, it has been there since April
13:52<z-MaTRiX>also train coming from top right to bottom down reserves whole track
13:53-!-fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4db80557.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:53<@planetmaker>SmatZ, the only really interesting question is: how did you find that? ;-)
13:54*planetmaker guesses "by pure chance"
13:54<@planetmaker>trallalala
13:54<@SmatZ>:-D
13:55<z-MaTRiX>howcome estimated cost of paying back 20000 euros loan is 0?
13:56<z-MaTRiX>also stopping atrain costs 0 <;
13:56<z-MaTRiX>good to know
13:59-!-Tennel [~Tennel@farafin-gate.cs.uni-magdeburg.de] has joined #openttd
14:01<@SmatZ>z-MaTRiX: indeed it's strange
14:02<@SmatZ>but... "by design"
14:02<@SmatZ>feel free to open a bugreport, unless there is one already
14:02<z-MaTRiX>that does not cause problems
14:03-!-Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF903A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:03<Prof_Frink>z-MaTRiX: But does starting a train cost non-0?
14:03-!-maddy_ [~plaiho@182.21.240.77.static.louhi.net] has quit [Quit: leaving]
14:04<z-MaTRiX>stopping a train only cause profit loss
14:05<z-MaTRiX>well bugs i see now is 2way pathfinder fail and 1-way pathfinder bug
14:06<z-MaTRiX>just make a starburst line and place 2way pathfinders
14:08<z-MaTRiX>and trains can be stuck in certain cases after coming out of depot on a 1-way line if it has 1-way pathfinder signal before
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14:28<z-MaTRiX>nice little diagonal terraforming helper
14:28<z-MaTRiX>best used with terraforming limiter
14:33-!-Tennel [~Tennel@farafin-gate.cs.uni-magdeburg.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend]
14:35<z-MaTRiX>http://gizmodo.com/016525/worlds-largest-truck
14:35<z-MaTRiX>What's huge, slow, and capable of hauling up to 400 tons of bullshit?
14:35<z-MaTRiX><;
14:36<@SmatZ>:)
14:42<Prof_Frink>z-MaTRiX: An Arcturan Megabull.
14:43<andythenorth>Ammler: planetmaker for a river boat (barge) does Rheinfall make any sense as a name?
14:44<@planetmaker>:-D - it does to a certain degree. But it's a rather funny name. You could call it also "Niagara falls" ;-)
14:45<andythenorth>Well I might call another ship Niagra :)
14:45-!-fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4db80557.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd
14:46<@planetmaker>and 2nd Rheinfall is phonetically the same as Reinfall - which means something along the lines of "non-starter" or "failure"
14:46<@Belugas>so... ship Niagra, sloop Viagra, oiler Negra...
14:46<andythenorth>he
14:46<@Belugas>mmh... Viagra Falls
14:46<@Belugas>kinda like antonyms :)
14:47<@Belugas>antonym?
14:47<@Belugas>mmh...
14:48-!-Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has quit [Quit: Quit]
14:49<@planetmaker>andythenorth: rather call it "Rhine class" or alike
14:49<@planetmaker>and then a Niagara class as well
14:49<andythenorth>planetmaker: I don't want to name for real rivers :)
14:49<@planetmaker>with Rheinfall you do ;-)
14:49<andythenorth>I already get pms from ardent boat fans
14:49<@planetmaker>it means "Rhine falls"
14:50<andythenorth>ach
14:50<andythenorth>I know
14:50<andythenorth>maybe it was a bad idea though
14:50<andythenorth>If I name it for something real I get more pms pointing out that x is too long / small / wide / blue / red etc
14:50<@planetmaker>hm... well :-)
14:50<@planetmaker>oh, the look at your local map. Look for the smallest creaks. And pick their names
14:51<andythenorth>he
14:51<andythenorth>frome
14:51<andythenorth>seven estuary :P
14:51<andythenorth>blind yeo
14:51<@planetmaker>:-D
14:51<andythenorth>avon gorge
14:51<@planetmaker>Most doesn't sound too bad ;-)
14:52<@planetmaker>I'd only leave out the seven estuary ;-)
14:52<andythenorth>bit obvious?
14:52-!-Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF903A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
14:53<@planetmaker>:-)
14:53<andythenorth>planetmaker: I want a european sounding name for river boats
14:53<andythenorth>what's *your* nearest weird sounding river?
14:54<@planetmaker>Oker or Wabe
14:54<@planetmaker>but weired? :-) I'm used to them ;-)
14:54<Ammler>[20:43] <andythenorth> Ammler: planetmaker for a river boat (barge) does Rheinfall make any sense as a name? <-- without h
14:55<@Rubidium>andythenorth: IJssel ?
14:56-!-SirSquidness [~sirsquidn@zomg.dongues.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:00<@Rubidium>andythenorth: Our, Main, Ton? ;)
15:01<@Terkhen>andythenorth: I guess that loaded rafts being drawn outside the water in some cases is a known issue
15:03<@Rubidium>fonsinchen: how much of a problem would it be if/when automatic orders are "ignored" (not added or removed) when actually going for service with a "service at order" until it reaches the next manual order?
15:04<andythenorth>Terkhen: same issue applies to other larger ships :(
15:04<andythenorth>there's no fix, except smaller boats
15:04<@Rubidium>as my current diff has some drawbacks in the "oops, reusing already used bits department" and the whole mess could possibly be solved by temporarily ignoring automatic orders by simply setting some flag
15:06<andythenorth>IJssel is good, but a weird capitalisation :D
15:06<fonsinchen>Not much. Just that at the next stop, if there is another automatic order after that, cargodist wouldn't know which station to load cargo for.
15:06<andythenorth>might get reported as a typo :P
15:06<@Belugas>Ruisseau ASec
15:07<fonsinchen>Maybe there's a workaround for that. After all we know that we're ignoring auto orders at that point.
15:07<@Rubidium>andythenorth: but it isn't, although some might consider using the proper character for it... but that's *very* rarely used
15:07-!-dageek [~dageek@11.74.155.90.in-addr.arpa] has joined #openttd
15:10<fonsinchen>Is there enough space to count the visited stations since we started to ignore the auto-orders.
15:10<@Terkhen>andythenorth: it's different from the "usual" issue, happens when they are loading while they are relatively "small"
15:10<andythenorth>Terkhen: can you screenshot?
15:10<andythenorth>I need to fix the log raft loading sequence anyway
15:10<andythenorth>it's a bit of a tricky issue
15:10<fonsinchen>Then I could easily find out which auto order we're actually heading for without the cur_order_index.
15:11<andythenorth>Rubidium: does Schipbeek make sense as a name?
15:12<andythenorth>or Ganzendiep?
15:12<@Rubidium>it's literally ship stream
15:12<andythenorth>he
15:12<andythenorth>might be ok
15:12<andythenorth>or Kattendiep
15:13<@Rubidium>Ganzen = geese, Katten = cats
15:13<@Rubidium>not sure how to translate diep though
15:13<@Terkhen>andythenorth: http://devs.openttd.org/~terkhen/screenshots/log_raft.png
15:14<andythenorth>Terkhen: I guess I have work to do :P
15:14<@Terkhen>:)
15:14<@Rubidium>"diep" is used in names of canals to tell it's navigable by ships, instead of used for draining water from low areas
15:14<@Terkhen>would you prefer a proper bug report at the FISH tracker?
15:14<andythenorth>please
15:14<@Rubidium>fonsinchen: in what way would you use that?
15:15<@Rubidium>do some magic on the order list to make some guesses whether it's still following the automatic orders, just at a different place in the order list?
15:17<fonsinchen>Yes, if it's set I just count the automatic order (which we haven't removed) from the previous mainenance order and then I can guess that this is the station we're heading for.
15:18<fonsinchen>Or if it's just a flag I can shrug and say "nondeterministic" while just loading everything.
15:18<fonsinchen>Also OK.
15:18-!-SirSquidness [~sirsquidn@zomg.dongues.com] has joined #openttd
15:18<Eddi|zuHause>"the dutch have a dozen words for canals" :p
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15:22<TD>hi
15:23<@Terkhen>hi TD
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15:26<TD>how do i save a game on a dedicated server as a client? rcon pw save doesnt seem to work...:-(
15:26<@SmatZ>it should work
15:27<TD>hmmm
15:27<@SmatZ>or is the name not optional?
15:27<@SmatZ>then
15:27<@SmatZ>rcon pw "save xxx.sav"
15:27<@SmatZ>TD: ^
15:28<Eddi|zuHause>how much work would it be to introduce the one-way arrows in a sloped version?
15:28<@SmatZ>*lot*
15:29<andythenorth>is Landwasser a dumb name for a river boat?
15:29<Eddi|zuHause>very :p
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15:30<TD>thanks that worked even though the file is now named XX.sav.sav and it doesnt work without the .sav in the end;-)
15:30<@SmatZ>ok :)
15:30<andythenorth>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landwasser
15:30<andythenorth>ach Lütschine
15:31<andythenorth>that will do
15:31<andythenorth>references HEQS :P
15:31<andythenorth>HEQS vehicle names have a certain 'trivia quiz' element to them
15:31<andythenorth>their are hidden meanings :)
15:31<andythenorth>there /s
15:32<TD>and someone should change the wiki as this says the command is rcon pw save <number | file> ;-)
15:33<@Terkhen>feel free to do so :)
15:34<andythenorth>how do I encode an ü for nfo?
15:35<@Rubidium>add a thorn at the being of the string
15:36*andythenorth learns something
15:36<@planetmaker>i.e. use only UTF-8
15:36<andythenorth>hmm
15:36<andythenorth>"ÞLütschine River Boat" made it worse
15:37<@planetmaker>how?
15:37<@Rubidium>then the source file isn't UTF-8 encoded
15:37<andythenorth>my editor thinks it's "UTF-8, no BOM"
15:38<Eddi|zuHause>that should be the right one
15:38<andythenorth>do I need to add any control codes to the string?
15:38<Eddi|zuHause>the thorn is the control code
15:39<andythenorth>I have read the spec, but I can't follow it 100%
15:39<Eddi|zuHause>but try 'C3 BC' instead of '"ü"'
15:41<TD>there i fixed it... it might not be pretty but the information is there now!
15:41<andythenorth>maybe I just do without the umlaut
15:41-!-DanM [~DanMacK@206.191.69.149] has joined #openttd
15:41<TD>cya
15:42<andythenorth>River Boat / River Barge / River Freighter?
15:42<andythenorth>which is better?
15:42<frosch123>[21:28] <Eddi|zuHause> how much work would it be to introduce the one-way arrows in a sloped version? <- drawing 8 sprites?
15:42<Eddi|zuHause>frosch123: and teaching openttd to use them?
15:43-!-TD [~torbenpaw@188.114.164.254] has quit []
15:43<frosch123>12 actually
15:43<frosch123>Eddi|zuHause: less than drawing 12 sprites
15:43<Eddi|zuHause>yes, the YOU CANNOT PASS versions are also needed ;)
15:44<__ln__>i think what gandalf said whas "you shall not pass"
15:44<__ln__>-h
15:44<@planetmaker>:-)
15:45*DanM is heading out, I will TTYL :D
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15:46<Eddi|zuHause>__ln__: last paragraph of http://usaerklaert.wordpress.com/2010/11/04/zeugs-weg-mit-den-richtern-her-mit-dem-urin-und-was-gandalf-wirklich-sagte/ ;)
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15:51<Mazur>The Black Knight, however, said: "None shall pass!"
15:51<Mazur>Or, possibly: "Nun shall pass."
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16:20<__ln__>of course the whole movie (and the book) was dubbed into english and gandalf was really speaking elvish to the balrog.
16:31<andythenorth>ho
16:31*andythenorth just found the link to the ottd dev documentation
16:31<andythenorth>that makes things a bit easier :P
16:31<@planetmaker>you mean map array?
16:31<@planetmaker>etc
16:32<andythenorth>no
16:32<andythenorth>I mean doxygen stuff: http://docs.openttd.org/
16:32<@Rubidium>the wiki?
16:35<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: strangely, it's not mentioned in the topic.
16:35<andythenorth>it's moderately useful :P
16:35<andythenorth>I mean, it's fun grepping source and following nested back functions
16:35<@planetmaker>it's not something players and average users need
16:36<Eddi|zuHause>planetmaker: the whole channel is not something players and average users need
16:36<@planetmaker>oh right
16:37<@planetmaker>but those all-time-here-people don't care about the topic.
16:37<@planetmaker>But the "hey, I have a question users" can be pointed at it
16:37<@SmatZ>there's a topic here? wow!
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16:46<@Terkhen>andythenorth: feel free to document anything that you can't find there :)
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17:32<@Terkhen>good night
17:32<supermop>good night
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17:43<CIA-1>OpenTTD: rubidium * r21918 /trunk/src/network/network_gui.cpp: -Fix [FS#4443]: Languages improperly sorted in the "start server" window (adf88)
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18:19<DanMacK>Night all
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18:22<DJ_Nekkid>in hotkeys.cfg there is:
18:22<DJ_Nekkid>build_road = SHIFT+F8
18:22<DJ_Nekkid>is it also possible to add build_tram = 'key' there?
18:23<@Rubidium>build_tram would equal build_elrail or build_maglev, or whatever
18:23<@Rubidium>i.e. selecting something from the dropdown
18:24<DJ_Nekkid>speaking of witch, that would be nice :)
18:25<@Rubidium>yes, it'd be magic
18:25<DJ_Nekkid>atleast a build_rail_next
18:25<DJ_Nekkid>and build_road_next
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18:25<DJ_Nekkid>so one could cycle
18:27<DJ_Nekkid>but i guess i have had my share of feature req's lately :)
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18:41<Mazur>You cn make it my feature request.
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19:26<Wolf01>'night
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19:38<CIA-1>OpenTTD: planetmaker * r21919 /trunk/src/rail.h: -Fix: Converting an expensive rail type to a cheap one could give more money than removing and rebuilding cost
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---Logclosed Thu Jan 27 00:00:40 2011