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#openttd IRC Logs for 2011-02-08

---Logopened Tue Feb 08 00:00:50 2011
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00:42<Eddi|zuHause>don't wake a sleeping cat.
00:42<Eddi|zuHause>it immediately demands food.
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01:08<jeremey>i have a question
01:09<jeremey>Why are some new GRF's pink ingame??
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01:15<@planetmaker>oh, jeremey's been a bit inpatient, eh?
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02:39<TruePikachu>Eddi|zuHause: RE the cat, yes, it does...
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02:54<Eddi|zuHause>hm... my monitor just completely failed
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02:55<@planetmaker>you could still use it as frame for hardcopy images
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02:57<Eddi|zuHause>everything is so... narrow... now
02:57<Eddi|zuHause>i've been using 16:10 for too long
02:57<Eddi|zuHause>now where do i get a sensible replacement now
02:58<Eddi|zuHause>i'm afraid i'm already out of warranty
02:59<Eddi|zuHause>it's not only narrow, it's also fuzzy
03:00<@peter1138>everything is 16:9 now
03:01<Eddi|zuHause>not this one ;)
03:03<Eddi|zuHause>it's even worse... since this silly replacement is really old and really cheap, it's only connected via VGA
03:03<Eddi|zuHause>everything is fuzzy...
03:04<@Terkhen>good morning
03:04<Eddi|zuHause>no, this morning is definitely not good
03:08<@planetmaker>Rubidium, you once wrote a small programme to extract the meta-info of screenshots. Can you remind me please, where exactly do I find that
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03:11<@planetmaker>nvm... found it :-)
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06:59<DanMacK>Hey all
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07:01<@planetmaker>moin DanMacK
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07:03<DanMacK>What's new?
07:05<@planetmaker>not much, I guess
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07:06<Rubidium>DanMacK: new in general or new(s) for you?
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07:08<DanMacK>Either/or :P
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07:12<Rubidium>OpenTTD is used for teaching college students about logistics management (or at least somewhere in China)
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07:12<Pikka>I'm 12 and what is scuddles
07:12<DanMacK>The same place they pass Top Gun off as a training video?
07:12<Scuddles>pikka hurry up with the
07:12<Pikka>I'll hurry up with your
07:13<Scuddles>okay thanks
07:13<Rubidium>DanMacK: no idea; see for slightly more information about the associated book
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07:19<DanMacK>that's kinda funny
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08:02<Timmaexx>Good Morning!
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08:05<Timmaexx>I'd like to suggest a namechange under . It appears, that many guys, who upload files to the content service call the wrong version numbers
08:06<Timmaexx>They call their files version like 1.0.5 even if its in reality 2.0.1 or sth. else
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08:06<@planetmaker>you got a point, I guess
08:06<Timmaexx>Maybe you can change the field to "Version of the file" or sth. else
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08:09<@planetmaker>Timmaexx, like that?
08:10<Timmaexx>Thank you!
08:10<@planetmaker>Yes, there are projects on our bug tracker relating to our web page and to translator as well ;-)
08:12<Timmaexx>Someone suggested the translation of some time ago. Is there any progress?
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09:56<+glx>__ln__: I retried japanese IME in fullscreen and it works, I just need to use Ctrl-CapsLock shortcut to swith to hiragana input
09:57<+glx>(shift-caps for alphanumeric and alt-caps for katakana)
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11:07<supermop___>good morning!
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12:46<supermop>quiet day
12:51<@planetmaker>and you broke the silence! ;-)
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12:56<bb10>and you broke my internets!
12:57<@SmatZ>sorry :(
12:58*planetmaker hugs SmatZ and hands a cookie
12:58*bb10 pets SmatZ
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13:22<CIA-11>OpenTTD: smatz * r22022 /trunk/src/vehicle.cpp: -Fix [FS#4468]: verify we can allocate an order before we actually try to do so
13:27<CIA-11>OpenTTD: smatz * r22023 /trunk/src/ (cargopacket.cpp economy.cpp economy_base.h station_cmd.cpp):
13:27<CIA-11>OpenTTD: -Fix: verify we can allocate a CargoPacket and CargoPayment before we actually try to do so
13:27<CIA-11>OpenTTD: -Codechange: increase the limit of number of CargoPayments to match the limit of Vehicles (Rubidium)
13:29<CIA-11>OpenTTD: smatz * r22024 /trunk/src/ (order_cmd.cpp train_cmd.cpp): -Fix [FS#4468]: verify we can allocate an OrderList before we actually try to do so (Rubidium)
13:31<@planetmaker>CIA-11 is somewhat behaving redundant ;-)
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13:33<@planetmaker>but he likes you most probably ;-)
13:34<@planetmaker>Look there! Look there! :-) A bug fix! And another change!
13:34<@SmatZ>well, it could be split to more patches
13:34<CIA-11>OpenTTD: smatz * r22025 /trunk/src/ (6 files in 2 dirs): -Fix: verify there is enough space in the pool when creating new pool items while loading old savegames
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13:34<@planetmaker>well. There :-)
13:34<@SmatZ>I forgot to mention rb in the last commit :(
13:35<Rubidium>yay! :)
13:35<Rubidium>you did a good job there
13:35<@planetmaker>the power of prophecy :-)
13:35<@planetmaker>and now sports - so catch you later :-)
13:36<@SmatZ>have fun :)
13:39<CIA-11>OpenTTD: smatz * r22026 /trunk/src/object_cmd.cpp: -Fix: don't crash when we generate too many objects while generating map
13:45<CIA-11>OpenTTD: translators * r22027 /trunk/src/lang/ (luxembourgish.txt traditional_chinese.txt):
13:45<CIA-11>OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<CIA-11>OpenTTD: traditional_chinese - 38 changes by josesun
13:45<CIA-11>OpenTTD: luxembourgish - 12 changes by Phreeze
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14:15<avdg>hmm, make started the ./configure command twice, breaking my compile...
14:16<avdg>svn up -> make detected changed -> launched ./configure somehow twice
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14:20<avdg>manual ./configure && make clean fixed the problems :)
14:22<@Alberth>weird order :)
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14:27<avdg>alberth: make destroyed my clean :p
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14:36<dihedral>i have not seen SmatZ this active in a long time :-P
14:38<@SmatZ>just splitting one patch to several smaller :)
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14:50<supermop>hello andy
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14:51<andythenorth>aren't critical vulnerabilities in a CMS fun? :P
14:51<andythenorth>especially when you have 50 clients to patch
14:51<supermop>no idea, but i am going to say yes
14:51<andythenorth>I dreamt up a new pony
14:51<@Terkhen>hi andythenorth :)
14:51<andythenorth>hi hi
14:51*Terkhen hides
14:52<andythenorth>nah it's a good one
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14:53<andythenorth>cb29 / 35: a new return value
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14:53<andythenorth>'try and build an industry of the type in register 100h at the north tile location of this industry'
14:53<andythenorth>'if building is possible, close this industry and build the new one'
14:54<@Alberth>aka 'upgrade' :)
14:54<andythenorth>I reckon, if I've read it right, it's not a lot of new code
14:54<andythenorth>the only complexity is checking the tile area is free
14:54<andythenorth>it won't be, because the existing industry is in it :D
14:56<Hirundo>How are you going to test the tile area while the industry is still there?
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14:56<@Alberth>\forall tiles\in area: tile\in old_industry \vee tile=clear
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14:59<Hirundo>At what point in time are you going to call CB 28?
15:04<andythenorth>there would be certain...problems
15:04<andythenorth>what I need to do is
15:04<andythenorth>destroy old industry
15:04<andythenorth>try to build new one
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15:04<andythenorth>if new one fails
15:04-!-enr1x [] has joined #openttd
15:04<andythenorth>rebuild old one with all cargo waiting etc, tile states etc preserved
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15:08<DanMacK>Sounds... problematic
15:09<andythenorth>I'm not sure
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15:09<andythenorth>in principle it's 'copy everything from these map tiles to memory, blow up the industry'
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15:10<andythenorth>this is a silly post, no?
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15:10<andythenorth>is it someone seeding for CIM?
15:13<andythenorth>or is he right?
15:16<avdg>Call it a feature request ;-)
15:17<dihedral>what a silly post :-P
15:18<Rubidium>no, he wants a button: make it do exactly what I want
15:18<@SmatZ>I not suggesting that OTTD goes closed source, it just the main open source causes problem in project such as this.
15:18<andythenorth>right, because it's *so* easy to get a patch into ottd trunk
15:19<avdg>many ideas are not synced with the trunk, and coding is still some requirement to create patches
15:19<andythenorth>he might be right about the GUI stuff
15:20<Rubidium>but... your honour, OpenTTD is closed source!
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15:20<andythenorth>but then.... 4 crappy settings just got removed and I've seen at least two users nearly in tears about it
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15:20<Rubidium>... Q.E.D.
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15:21<avdg>Are we still caring about that guy?
15:22<andythenorth>"Are they dictators or not?"
15:22<andythenorth>wrong link
15:24<@Alberth>Luckily we never claimed to be benevolent :p
15:25<Rubidium>avdg: who says we care about him?
15:25<Rubidium>it's just to prove something that is basically incorrect
15:26<andythenorth>anyway, there are too many settings
15:26<andythenorth>but don't remove any I like :P
15:27<andythenorth>there is a vote already
15:27<__ln__>Luukland must be from the post-Tron era
15:27<andythenorth>and the vote is held usually by rubidium
15:27<andythenorth>except when someone else borrows it :P
15:28*avdg feels threaded
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15:35<Rubidium>though I'd say it's more a meritocracy
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15:36<dihedral>at least he does not shout in the forums
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15:43<supermop>you know what would be fun to draw, 8bpp ez sprites
15:43<supermop>i wonder if i should make ez versions of my sprites
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15:45<supermop>i wonder if 32bpp would allow space to actually use scans of hand sketches for sprites
15:46*frosch123 would prefer if someone would add an alpha channel to some ogfx stuff
15:46<frosch123>like real glass, or antialiasing
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15:48<CIA-11>OpenTTD: rubidium * r22028 /trunk/src/ (main_gui.cpp misc_cmd.cpp): -Cleanup: remove traces of a debugging "feature" that got disabled a long time ago
15:48<MinchinWeb>Is this how you get your company index?
15:48<MinchinWeb>MyIndex = AICompany.ResolveCompanyID(COMPANY_SELF);
15:50<Rubidium>yes, why?
15:51<supermop>i feel like i could draw a town set much more quicky by hand than pixel by pixel
15:51<CIA-11>OpenTTD: rubidium * r22029 /trunk/src/network/network_gamelist.cpp: -Fix [FS#4482]: the server list got not resorted/redrawn after NewGRFs were downloaded
15:52<CIA-11>OpenTTD: rubidium * r22030 /trunk/src/network/network_gui.cpp: -Cleanup: dead code in NetworkGameWindow::OnInvalidateData (adf88)
15:54<DanMacK>supermop -
15:54*andythenorth has run out of internet to read
15:54<andythenorth>now I have to code something :o
15:54<andythenorth>anyone tried new FIRS?
15:54<andythenorth>got any bugs / suggestions for me?
15:54<andythenorth>I haven't played a game with it
15:54<andythenorth>maybe I should :o
15:55<Rubidium>andythenorth: isn't it used on the stable server?
15:55<MinchinWeb>@Revidium It returns an error "the index 'COMPANY_SELF' does not exist"
15:55<andythenorth>did the stable game start?
15:56*andythenorth explores
15:56<Rubidium>then maybe try AICompany.COMPANY_SELF
15:57<MinchinWeb>@Rubidium yup that works thx
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16:02*andythenorth searches tile animation spec
16:02<andythenorth>I need to use a random offset for the initial animation frame on load
16:03<andythenorth>load / construction /s
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16:09<Hirundo>CB 25?
16:09<Hirundo>set bit 0 in tile property 11
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16:17<Nite>are breakdowns reworked somehow in beta 5?
16:19<Hirundo>What behaviour did you observe, that prompted you to ask this question?
16:20<Nite>i was not sure if trains always completely stop when broken down ...
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16:20<Eddi|zuHause>no, that did not change.
16:21<Nite>i still have the idea of a model where trains above 50% never break down ...
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16:22<avdg>Nite: you can change the gamesettings, so trains don't have to break down, if that helps (unless you are on multiplayer ofc)
16:23<@Alberth>afaik there never was a 50% rule
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16:25<andythenorth>Alberth: is the revised industry generation code in 1.1.0 beta 5?
16:25<Nite>- iam only doing multiplayer - no it doesent help, what i think of is that you have to service, but also get rewarded if you plan servicing well with no breakdowns if trains stay above 50% (or a set level)
16:25<Nite>- true there never was a 50% rule.
16:25*andythenorth sees some horrible industry distributions for FIRS
16:25<@Alberth>and in beta4 and in beta3 and in beta2, and beta1, and in nightly... :)
16:26<andythenorth>on the coop stable server game, the balance of industries is odd
16:26<andythenorth>37 fishing grounds, 1 sawmill
16:26<andythenorth>I didn't see the game, so I don't know how it started / changed
16:26<@Alberth>Nite: at 100% perhaps :)
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16:28<@planetmaker>andythenorth: <-- start savegame
16:28<@planetmaker>good evening also :-)
16:31<Nite>Alberth you know there is no 100%
16:31<@Alberth>There isn't? I have seen vehicles with 100% reliability
16:32<Nite>yes for seconds
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16:32<andythenorth>planetmaker: was that map randomly generated wrt industry placement?
16:39<@planetmaker>the only thing edited was that I made each initial dredging site and fishing ground near some kind of shore
16:40<@planetmaker>so that neither planes nor ships are strictly needed
16:40<@planetmaker>as such I added islands and peninsulas
16:40<andythenorth>there are a lot of some industries wrt others
16:40*andythenorth wonders if probabilities are screwy
16:40<@planetmaker>high industry amount
16:41<andythenorth>it's a bit
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16:45<CIA-11>OpenTTD: rubidium * r22031 /trunk/src/network/network_client.cpp: -Fix: bad servers could crash a client
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16:47<CIA-11>OpenTTD: rubidium * r22032 /trunk/src/network/ (network.cpp network_server.cpp): -Codechange: add some asserts to verify we don't allocate too many NetworkClientSockets/Infos
16:47<dihedral>that looks interesting :-)
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16:49<CIA-11>OpenTTD: smatz * r22033 /trunk/src/object_cmd.cpp: -Fix: don't crash when there are too many objects generated already when placing transmitters
16:50*andythenorth_ ponders a FIRS strategy guide
16:50<andythenorth_>where though?
16:50<@SmatZ>dihedral: there are still many ways how server can crash clients, by sending it a broken map
16:50<andythenorth_>in a wiki would be most entertaining
16:50<@planetmaker>andythenorth: OpenTTD wiki
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16:50<andythenorth_>did I?
16:50<@planetmaker>then people would quite naturally extend it.
16:51<dihedral>SmatZ, but then no client connects :-P
16:51*andythenorth_ wonders where that goes in openttd wiki
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16:51<@SmatZ>dihedral: well, r22031 was about the same problem :)
16:52<@Yexo>andythenorth_: ?
16:52<@planetmaker>andythenorth_: others have their guides there, too, like OpenGFX and 2ccTS:
16:52<@planetmaker>so... what yexo suggests is also my suggestion
16:52<@Yexo>we also have for example (doesn't have much content)
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16:59<V453000>andythenorth_: the steel-orientation will need time to dissapear ... people need to discover that it isnt the only way :)
16:59*avdg wants to get ride of some spam, listed on
16:59<andythenorth_>V453000: they seemed to mostly stick to traditional cargos ;)
17:00<andythenorth_>and not much use of RV feeders etc
17:00<andythenorth_>ho hey
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17:07<Rubidium>have a nice dinner Belugas
17:08<@Belugas>and... a goood night sleep :D
17:09<@Belugas>thanks, good night sir
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17:14<dihedral>hehe Alberth, i love the link you posted to the savegame forum :-D
17:14<@Yexo>avdg: deleted all pages listed there, not done the images yet but that'll come some time later
17:15<@Yexo>please give a prod on irc if you find any more, the recently edited list of the wiki is sometimes so long that it's very easy to miss spam
17:15<@Alberth>yeah, no idea why people request features already present :p
17:15<avdg>bleh, there are many things to be done at the wiki
17:15<avdg>same as development I think, things are never done
17:19<DanMacK>or a graphics set
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17:21<Rubidium>avdg: especially when "you" try to put documentation in the wiki that is already out-of-date and will never be up-to-date (most of the network protocol stuff in the devbook)
17:22<andythenorth_>anybody want to help with FIRS strategy guide? :D
17:22<avdg>poor andythenorth_ :p
17:23<@Terkhen>"do the steel chain first, send ENSP everywhere, get $$$"
17:23<avdg>my predictions ;-)
17:24<Rubidium>avdg: he can't be poor... he has many Macs
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17:24<andythenorth_>Rubidium: that means I had to fricking pay for them
17:24<andythenorth_>ergo, poor
17:24<Rubidium>oh yes, the depreciate quite quickly
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17:25<andythenorth_>especially when dropped
17:25<Rubidium>andythenorth_: nah, that's just be "water damage"
17:26<andythenorth_>avdg: what was your prediction?
17:27<avdg>that, unless we have a good docwriter, articles won't grow fast
17:28<andythenorth_>I don't mind that
17:28<andythenorth_>means they don't go out of date fast
17:30<andythenorth_>Terkhen: I'll put your suggestion in the strategy guide...
17:30<andythenorth_>I'll make sure to attribute it to you :D
17:30<@Terkhen>it's probably outdated
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17:30<@Terkhen>I have not played since you tweaked other chains to make the steel chain less centric
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17:35*andythenorth_ bed time
17:35<andythenorth_>good night
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17:35<@Terkhen>good night andy
17:36<CIA-11>OpenTTD: rubidium * r22034 /trunk/src/vehicle_gui.cpp: -Fix [FS#4488]: crash when watching the vehicle view of a vehicle that has multiple sequential nearest depot orders (or consists of a single nearest depot order) when there is no depot with index 0
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17:44<Nite>-shanghai maglev! finally a readable maglev!
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17:54<V453000>bridges suck donkey balls though
17:54<V453000>the rails are nice :)
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17:58<@planetmaker>:-) rails are nice, the bridges... are unneeded monoton
17:58<@planetmaker>(of that maglev type)
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18:04<Nite>teh bridges are discreet i think weather suck nor are good
18:05<Nite>but r e a d a b l e counts for me
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18:08<@Terkhen>good night
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19:10*TruePikachu goes to wipe his ~/.openttd directory
19:10<TruePikachu>It's too cluttered :S
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21:14<TruePikachu>Search for >> transport tycoon <<, first result is :D
21:14<TruePikachu>Even before Wikipedia
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21:28<Nite>here it is 3rd ...
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---Logclosed Wed Feb 09 00:00:52 2011