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#openttd IRC Logs for 2011-02-25

---Logopened Fri Feb 25 00:00:42 2011
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02:35<@Terkhen>good morning
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02:56<JamesG>Good morning
03:00<SmatZ>morning JamesG
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03:15<JamesG>http://jgoode.co.uk/programs/0001-Added-revert-command.patch This is my patch to revert savegames by "guessing" the filename to load from
03:16<JamesG>I'm going to rewrite it to store the filenames in a deque
03:17<JamesG>Double-ended queue in C++
03:19<Eddi|zuHause>why does it have to be a double queue?
03:20<JamesG>I had a reason for that when I first designed it, but have now forgotten
03:21<JamesG>In fact, a normal queue should be ok
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03:21<Eddi|zuHause>+ if (argc != 2) { IConsoleHelp("Usage: revert <no. savegames>"); return true; } <-- maybe you should instead list the possible savegames
03:21<@Yexo>probably you want to remove a savegame from the start of the queue when openttd overwrites it, you need a deque for that
03:22<@Yexo>+ if (_settings_client.gui.keep_all_autosave) { IConsoleHelp("This command is for rotating-autosave games"); return true; } <- why doesn't it work when keeping all autosaves?
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03:22<@Yexo>also, why not have "revert" default to "revert 1"?
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03:25<Eddi|zuHause>instead of some weird list thingie, you can instead use a large buffer for the last N filenames in a round-robin manner
03:25<Eddi|zuHause>assuming n is fixed
03:25<Eddi|zuHause>you can always use the normal load command, if you want to go back more than 10 savegames
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03:31<dihedral>good morning
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03:38<__ln__>ave lupus01
03:38<Wolf01>hello
03:38<Wolf01>sound weird
04:00-!-Wolfsherz [~Wolfsherz@p57A6FC2E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
04:01<Wolfsherz>Hi, openttd.exe seems to contain a virus (TR/Dropper.Gen). Version 1.1.0-RC1. Reported by Avira AntiVir Professional.
04:04<@Terkhen>Wolfsherz: from where did you download your openttd?
04:05<Wolfsherz>i always and only download them from openttd.org
04:07<Wolfsherz>it is reproducable also. i deleted the file, redownloaded it from openttd.org and AntiVir detects the virus on unpacking the archive.
04:08<@Terkhen>unless we (or one of the mirrors) were somehow hacked that detection does not make much sense
04:09<@Terkhen>given the description I found of TR/Dropper.Gen, it might be detecting that OpenTTD downloads compressed files and then unzips and runs them somehow
04:09<@Terkhen>but this is not something I know much about :)
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04:10<Wolfsherz>notice that i did not run the file, it was detected on unpacking the downloaded archive
04:10<@Yexo>Wolfsherz: do you know from which mirror you downloaded openttd? also the 32bit or 64 bit version?
04:11<Wolfsherz>http://binaries.openttd.org/releases/1.1.0-RC1/openttd-1.1.0-RC1-windows-win32.zip
04:11<@Yexo>if you go to http://binaries.openttd.org/releases/1.1.0-RC1/ , on which url do you end up?
04:14<Wolfsherz>http://de.binaries.openttd.org/binaries/releases/1.1.0-RC1/index.html
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04:31<@Terkhen>avast does not complain about that file
04:32<Wolfsherz>well, that is great... but avira does ;)
04:33<Wolf01>even avg doesn't complain
04:35<Wolf01>"it might be detecting that OpenTTD downloads compressed files", yes, OTTD does it for online content, Avira is too zealous
04:36<Wolfsherz>i suppose developers will contact avira and tell them it is a false positive then?
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04:39<Wolf01>http://forum.avira.com/wbb/index.php?page=Thread&threadID=77575 you can do it as well
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05:08<zydeco>greetings
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05:50<Chaot_s>hmm microsift has started bashing opencandy as if it's adware
05:51<Chaot_s>does openttd use that too? that might explain the avira "false" positive then
05:52<@peter1138>What is opencandy?
05:54<dihedral>what is microsift
05:55<Chaot_s>*microsoft :)
05:55<Chaot_s>and opencandy is a litle ad developers might include in their installer
05:56<Chaot_s>that way they can recommend software to their product folowers.
05:56<Chaot_s>windows defender now detects al those installers and marks them as potential risk.
05:57<Chaot_s>http://cranialsoup.blogspot.com/2009/05/opencandy-new-kind-of-adwarespyware.html
05:57<Chaot_s>for some more info
05:57-!-Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has joined #openttd
05:57<Chaot_s>though mirc, winscp, and lots of others do ad it.
05:58<Chaot_s>since today windows defender started complaining about is.
05:58<Chaot_s>it.
05:58<SmatZ>what is windows defender?
05:59<Chaot_s>lol :D SmatZ : you are a *nix only user?
05:59<SmatZ>no, sometimes I use Windows
05:59<SmatZ>but I don't remember using windows defender
05:59<SmatZ>nor installing it
06:00<SmatZ>unless it's some automatically installed program
06:00<Chaot_s>windows defender is microsofts own "anti malware" its inplemented in the security center of win7 iirc
06:00<SmatZ>ok, I even have win7 :)
06:00<Chaot_s>vista had some parts of it too
06:01<Chaot_s>in start menu type defender and it shows up
06:01<Chaot_s>and i didn't instal it manualy.
06:01<SmatZ>ok, thank you for explanation :)
06:01<Chaot_s>maybe its optional in w7 ultimate :D
06:01<SmatZ>I would have to reboot the computer, I can't do it now
06:01<Chaot_s>no problem :D
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06:19<+tokai>Every installer is a potential risk. :)
06:19<+tokai>With ads or without ads. :)
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06:49<Ammler>Chaot_s: as a user of avira, it would be nice, if you care that openttd does install and run without false errors...
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07:03<DanMacK>Hey all
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07:08<Eddi|zuHause>i really shouldn't read the 2ccset topic... 80% of it seems to be about "train X from Y country is the same as train Z from W country"
07:09<DanMacK>lol
07:09<Ammler>they should plan an end :-)
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07:14<__ln__>10:38 < __ln__> ave lupus01 <-- sorry, the romans didn't use zero
07:18<Eddi|zuHause>they didn't use 1 either
07:19*DanMacK thinks the 2CC st will stop once they've used up all of the available ID's :P
07:19<Eddi|zuHause>that's like 64k
07:20<@peter1138>you could have a micromanagement set
07:20<@peter1138>instead of randomised vehicles, every permutation could use a different ID
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07:28<@planetmaker>Chaot_s, I think it's fair to classify those add-installers as potential risk - as simply they are potential risks
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07:33<Eddi|zuHause>you can classify every program downloaded from the internet as potential risk. the result is people will just blindly click on "ok" without even reading the text
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08:35<@planetmaker>hm, the + and - hotkeys for zoom issue is still present, eh?
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08:44<Eddi|zuHause>what's the issue?
08:54<@Yexo>planetmaker: not still present, again present
08:55<@Yexo>@commit 22094
08:55<@DorpsGek>Yexo: Commit by yexo :: r22094 trunk/src/hotkeys.cpp (2011-02-17 23:14:43 UTC)
08:55<@DorpsGek>Yexo: -Fix [FS#4510]: remove invalid keycodes when reading hotkeys.cfg
08:55<@Yexo>it ignores also some valid keycodes :(
08:59-!-Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4d08e6b8.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd
08:59<CIA-11>OpenTTD: yexo * r22142 /trunk/src/hotkeys.cpp: -Fix (r22094): some valid keycodes were ignored along with the invalid ones
09:00*Yexo is happy that bug didn't make any beta or rc
09:01<@Yexo>after updating delete hotkeys.cfg to reset the zoom in/out keys
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09:04<@Terkhen>:)
09:05<@Belugas>hello
09:06<@Yexo>hello Belugas
09:10<@Belugas>mister Yexo!
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09:16<@planetmaker>:-)
09:26<@Belugas>ho.. and mister planetmaker!
09:31<Mazur>Question: Would it be hard for the Land Information view to report the type of railway track, as well as the signals the tile contains?
09:33*Mazur missed loading catenary in his last game and couldn't tell the difference between electric and normal.
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09:36<Ammler>Mazur: imagine a newgrf like nutracks with 16 different types
09:36<@planetmaker>That probably would be feasible
09:39<Mazur>Ammler, that is what I'm thinking about, I'm asking about what would need to be done to achieve it.
09:40<Mazur>If it's only adding appropriate lines to english.txt and a minor change in the gui cpp, I might be able to do it.
09:41<Ammler>Mazur: I would think, it is impossible with 8bpp
09:42<@Terkhen>Mazur: if you mean showing a string, a list of railway track types are already queried and shown when you click on the rail menu so I would start by looking there
09:42<Mazur>I do not understand, the game itself knows, adn hte land view retrieved the tile information.
09:43<Ammler>ah, I misunderstood, thought you were speaking about Minimap :-)
09:43<Mazur>Terkhen: I've build a long track , my first train is ruinning towards its station, and it stops.
09:43<@Terkhen>yes, I meant for the code :)
09:44<Mazur>Quickest way to find out would be query hte tile in front of it.
09:45<@Terkhen>I don't know the code but the railway menu is somehow getting those strings for all types, then it's just a matter of getting the type of the railway track in the tile and using the same function to show the correct string in the land information window
09:45<Mazur>Yet the land information view only states: "Railway tack", which is what I figured myself, my problem is, what kind of railway track?
09:46<Mazur>Terkhen, exactly, not high-powered 2 caf-pow/hour major rewrites of large sections of code.
09:47<Mazur>Just 19*(# of signal combinations) extra lines in english.txt.
09:48<Mazur>And the report function chosing the right one.
09:48-!-|Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd
09:49<Mazur>(Not 19, but nutracks types + 3).
09:50<@Terkhen>Mazur: check GetRailTypeDropDownList in rail_gui.cpp to see how the game gets the rail type name to display it; you would need to get the correct RailType to display from the tile
09:50<@Terkhen>it does not seem much complicated
09:50<@Terkhen>signals are another story :)
09:51<Mazur>Signals are already reported.
09:51<@Terkhen>I see :)
09:51<Mazur>That's why I included them.
09:51<Mazur>:-)
09:53<Mazur>There are 23 lines for reporting ralway track.
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09:59<@Terkhen>http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/121/ <--- these lines are the interesting ones
10:00<@Terkhen>they show how to decide which string to use and which parameters you should pass to it
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10:08<vb>hey
10:08<vb>what's the industry set where you deliver cars?
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10:11<Mazur>Hm, not as interesting as I thought, I just now noticed, that the LAI view already reports Maximum track speed, which amounts to the same kind of thing.
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10:21<Ammler>vb: ECS
10:21<Ammler>hmm, FIRS might also have something like that
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10:22<Phantom>http://www.erepublik.com/en/citizen/profile/1633442
10:22<DanMacK>vb - It's ECS
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10:34<vb>help
10:35<vb>what is the industry set where you deliver cars?
10:35-!-Br33z4hSlut5 [~static.kp@92.68.154.34] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
10:36<@Belugas>i think it's in ECS
10:37<vb>yes, i have ecs
10:37<vb>but as i remember, it was another one
10:37<vb>a little nicer afaik
10:37<@Belugas>can't tell. I only about cars in ECS
10:38<@Belugas>ho.. Ammler may have given you yet another answer: FIRS
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10:38<Ammler>well, It might not matter at all, it depends how the vehicle set does interpret the cargo labels
10:39<Ammler>I know, dbsetxl has car transporter
10:40<Ammler>it does interpret goods as cars
10:41<@Belugas>i think vb only cares about the look, not the inner stuff, Ammler :)
10:41<@Alberth>dotirc: I don't share files
10:42<Ammler>Belugas: then ecs and dbsetxl
10:42<@Belugas>hi Alberth. looks like you have been spammed by dotirc too...
10:42<Ammler>and the cargoset, if that works with openttd
10:43<@Belugas>is it a case of a quick?
10:43<@Alberth>?
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10:43<@Belugas>thanks Ammler
10:43<@Belugas>lol
10:43<Ammler>:-)
10:43<@Belugas>he was afraid!
10:46*Alberth should study the irc commands
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11:28<supermop>good morning
11:28<supermop>although it is almost noon for me
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11:29<ZirconiumX>good almost-evening-but-not-quite-because-it's-4:26pm
11:29<supermop>yeah, I don't start evening any earlier than 5, even when it is dark by 4
11:32<@Belugas>yeah :(
11:32<@Belugas>sadly
11:32<@Belugas>at least, it's clear now, when going to work
11:32<@Belugas>and snow keeps on falling
11:33<@Belugas>28 minutes before allowed to swallow lunch
11:33*Alberth ponders diner
11:34*ZirconiumX wonders how Belugas manages to hold the food in his mouth for 27 minutes without swallowing it
11:34<ZirconiumX>pizza for me
11:34<@Belugas>gnia gnia gnia
11:34<@Belugas>smart ass ;)
11:35*Rubidium ponders bed
11:35*ZirconiumX ponders going to biggleswade
11:35<ZirconiumX>...via london
11:36<ZirconiumX>and via peterborough (ugh!) back
11:42*planetmaker wonders... where are you, Rubidium, that you think of bed, now?
11:45<ZirconiumX>GMT +5 hours?
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11:51<rane>how can i have two trains waiting somewhere and still 70% "transported"
11:53<@Terkhen>rane: http://wiki.openttd.org/Game_Mechanics#Station_rating
11:54<ZirconiumX>because the game is insane
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11:57<Ammler>rane: cargo can become "bad"
11:57<@planetmaker>stale like beer :-P
11:59<ZirconiumX>ed:?
11:59<Ammler>rane: one new train with max speed per produce cicle
12:00<Ammler>hmm, is that 4 days?
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12:01<Ammler>and don't forget the statue :-P
12:09<rane>yea, i've got those
12:09<rane>it's a small map, 64x128 so i have 1 of everything only
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12:10<@planetmaker>you probably still have two towns ;-)
12:11<@planetmaker></smart ass>
12:14<rane>yea
12:14<rane>either won't let me build anything
12:15<supermop>trees
12:15<ZirconiumX>cheat console
12:15<ZirconiumX>only use the latter as a last resort
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12:53<ZirconiumX>meh - the chris sawyer that isn't
12:53<supermop>i think he has checked out for the most part
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13:04<@Belugas>there are a few people here who could tell you that the real Chris Sawyer would not be as friendly...
13:09<ZirconiumX>OpenTTH
13:10<ZirconiumX>Open Transport Tycoon Hacked would be chris' responce
13:10<@Belugas>betrayal Of His Vision, actually
13:11*DanMacK thinks he was banned
13:11<DanMacK>I know Owen has talked to Chris a couple of times
13:12<ZirconiumX>Well if it was *the* chris he *really* won't be happy
13:12-!-v3rb0_ [~v3rb0@78.84.201.137] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:14*Belugas nods
13:14<@Belugas>contrary to all the romantics around
13:15<@Belugas>"he should be, his program is still improving and still popular"
13:17<ZirconiumX>what would the sequel of the sequel of the game that literally no-one has heard of be called
13:18<@Belugas><new_game_vaguely_based_on><The_initial_game>
13:19<ZirconiumX>OpenNGVBSTIG
13:19<@Alberth>OpenTTD::TNG :)
13:19<ZirconiumX>OpenNGVBSTIGWERUOF
13:20<ZirconiumX>(with extra unheard of features)
13:20<@Belugas>OpenWTFAYPWLLT?
13:21<ZirconiumX>Open Why the F*** Are You Paying With ?? ??
13:21<@Belugas>PLaying With Letters Like That
13:22<@Belugas>;)
13:22<ZirconiumX>OpenIHANIWIDTECOMMABIDRC
13:25<@Belugas>i give up on too many silly possibilities !
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13:45<CIA-11>OpenTTD: translators * r22143 /trunk/src/lang/ (irish.txt unfinished/frisian.txt):
13:45<CIA-11>OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<CIA-11>OpenTTD: frisian - 59 changes by Taeke
13:45<CIA-11>OpenTTD: irish - 58 changes by tem
13:45<CIA-11>OpenTTD: slovenian - 30 changes by
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14:04<@Rubidium>planetmaker: because I was awake early enough to say "night" to glx
14:04<rane>is it posssible to generate some extra area and add it to the map i am already playing?
14:04<@Terkhen>rane: no
14:04<ZirconiumX>no
14:05<rane>why not, if i may ask
14:05<@Rubidium>because it's not implemented I'd reckon
14:05<ZirconiumX>because it's part of the game engine
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14:06<ZirconiumX>you can't add NewGRF's, they'll crash the game
14:06<ZirconiumX>If you did add land, it would crash the game
14:06<@Alberth>you can 'lift' water, which becomes land
14:07<rane>i don't believe i'm the first person to ask for it
14:07<@Terkhen>probably not
14:07<@Rubidium>neither would you be the first to suggest corners in bridges/tunnels
14:08*Alberth has never seen the question since he started playing OpenTTD 3 years ago
14:08<@Rubidium>though that's not implemented as well
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14:08<rane>i didn't think about bridges tbh:-)
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14:09<rane>i'd like "delivered" to be renaamed to "quality of service" though
14:09<rane>or something clear like that
14:09<rane>then actual delivered could be displayed alongside it
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14:09<ZirconiumX>hmmm
14:10<ZirconiumX>Quality of service: 70% of 5,400 cargo delivered
14:10<ZirconiumX>Doesn't fit
14:12<rane>but delivered % has nothing to do with service quality
14:12<rane>since quality has a ton of other modifiers
14:13<rane>so: delivered: X out of Y produced, quality: Z%
14:14<@Alberth>what makes you think delivered is quality?
14:15<rane>when i click "ratings" in the station it's exactly equal to "transported" percentage
14:15<ZirconiumX>@rane, such a thing would be tremendously difficult to implement IMHO
14:15<@planetmaker>consume-oriented thinking, of course, Alberth ;-)
14:16<rane>well, it confused me that you can deliver every single piece of product they make and still have "transported" way below 100% until someone sent me to the wiki page and showed me all the other modifiers
14:17<ZirconiumX>@Alberth, a company which delivers more cargo allows the industy to make more money, thus in the industy's point of view the company gives a higher quality of service
14:18<@Alberth>rane they only show your portion
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14:19<@Alberth>ZirconiumX: In my view, they always get enough, just not always through your company
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14:20<@Alberth>ie there are other suppliers/transporters for the industry, although you don't see them
14:26<@planetmaker>except if you play MP or with AIs ;-)
14:26<@planetmaker>then you might
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15:01<rane>ja
15:01<rane>i reached 100%! =)
15:01<rane>it's possible with one station after all
15:04<fonsinchen>Rubidium: I've fixed all the issues pointed out in http://rbijker.net/openttd/cd.diff now. Well, except for those in smallmap-stats and smallmap-zoom-in that don't apply anymore. I've completely replaced those branches with smallmap-refactor, linkgraph-overlay, overlay-legend, smallmap-overlay and viewport-overlay. smallmap-stats and smallmap-zoom-in are still in the repository and being updated so that people have an easier time
15:04<fonsinchen>rebasing onto the new branches.
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15:13<supermop>hello again
15:13<@planetmaker>salute, supermop
15:14<supermop>i've been too busy with work this week to get much nml done
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15:14<@planetmaker>no excuses :-P ;-)
15:14<@planetmaker>real life is never a good excuse ;-)
15:15<supermop>ha
15:15<supermop>occasionally work is actually slow during the middle of the day, if only i could work on nml here
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15:15<@planetmaker>:-)
15:15<@planetmaker>a simple text editor might suffice ;-)
15:16<supermop>yeah, no testing though
15:16<supermop>so you were saying something about dev zone stuff the other day
15:17<@planetmaker>right :-)
15:17<@planetmaker>I mean this: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects
15:19-!-Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.238] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:19<@planetmaker>we offer there to host newgrfs and provide also a nightly build service similar to what openttd nightlies are for openttd
15:21<supermop>oh neat
15:21<supermop>would that make any sense for my grf though?
15:21<@planetmaker>sure
15:21<@planetmaker>IMHO it makes sense for every grf ;-)
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15:22<supermop>so what is the process?
15:22<supermop>i give you guys my files?
15:22<@planetmaker>the other big advantage in my eyes is that the newgrf's source is available there. Thus any gpl requirements about that are fulfilled and you have a bug tracker there, too
15:22<supermop>I sort of have a wierd local workflow system
15:22<supermop>that i use for design stuff as well
15:23<supermop>and more theoretical ideas for grfs down the road
15:23<@planetmaker>nah, you "only" need to create a repository. What you put into that - should be everything which qualifies as "source"
15:23<supermop>like rhino models
15:23<@planetmaker>As source IMHO qualifies everything which is needed in order to create the current grf
15:23<supermop>which i might later render, then paint over
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15:24<@planetmaker>but ... it's a bit up to the author to decide
15:24<supermop>it sounds helpful
15:24<@planetmaker>graphics templates, sources, blender... that's imho source
15:24<supermop>unfortunately i do not work in blender,
15:24<@planetmaker>what should NOT be inside is the compiled grf or programmes needed
15:24<supermop>and rhino is not open
15:24<@planetmaker>oh... blender, render,... whatever :-)
15:25<supermop>also, its really expensive (not as bad as autodesk stuff though)
15:25<supermop>ok
15:25<supermop>so i just make a file of my grf related stuff
15:25<@planetmaker>well, not the point. It's just a tool you use to create graphics. The repo contains the graphics :-)
15:25<@planetmaker>Not the tools
15:25<supermop>how do i keep different versions separate?
15:26<@planetmaker>by using mercurial. It's a version control system
15:26<@planetmaker>That's absolutely required in order to use the devzone.
15:26<@planetmaker>It's also the means you get stuff uploaded.
15:27<@planetmaker>that means probably you'll need to install that
15:27<@planetmaker>http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/home/wiki/Welcome <-- we made a short and rought guide how to setup mercurial on your machine
15:28<@planetmaker>principally a version control system keeps track of every change you make. Thus you can go back to every previous version
15:28<@planetmaker>no need to manually copy and rename stuff
15:29<@Terkhen>and you will not lose anything unless the devzone is broken :)
15:29<@planetmaker>well. Even then you don't loose your stuff ;-)
15:31<@Alberth>in fact it gets ridiculously difficult to get rid of anything ;)
15:32<@planetmaker>which is the whole point ;-)
15:34<@planetmaker>supermop: and it makes it also somewhat easier for others to follow what you do or for you to ask questions about the coding - as everyone can easily get the source code
15:36<supermop>ah ok
15:37<supermop>so should i do this for a grf as soon as i start working on it? or later after it is far enough along for people to look at it without ridiculing me?
15:37<@planetmaker>http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/swedishrails/issues <-- and like that it's also a good way to make me remember stuff I planed, need to fix, ...
15:37<@planetmaker>yes, that's a good time :-)
15:37<@planetmaker>starting with it right from the start
15:37<supermop>i feel like with mlss, people would have said it was a bad idea before i had something to show what i mean
15:39<@planetmaker>supermop: it's not like really many people look at what is newly created at the devzone
15:39<@planetmaker>it's a tool for you. Much much more than means to publish anything
15:40<@planetmaker>And those who actually look there - they are valuable input usually
15:40<supermop>ok
15:40<supermop>because i think some of my ideas for later might actually annoy or upset people
15:41<@planetmaker>so what? Do you care?
15:41<@planetmaker>You have to like it
15:41<supermop>as they involve breaking things like the accepted scale(s)
15:41<@planetmaker>you do with your newgrf what you consider fun
15:41<supermop>ok
15:41<@planetmaker>if people disagree - you can take their advice. But ultimately you're the author.
15:43<@planetmaker>Anyone who disagrees can after all make their own newgrf ;-)
15:43<supermop>heh
15:50<@planetmaker>http://mercurial.selenic.com/wiki/ <-- you want mercurial and maybe you also want tortoiseHG
15:50<@planetmaker>The latter is a GUI interface for it
15:50<@Alberth>the only problem is that once you understand the power of version control systems, you cannot work without them :)
15:50<@planetmaker>hehe :-)
15:50<@planetmaker>There are worse things and addictions in life
15:51<@planetmaker>I totally don't understand that my collegues don't make use of it ;-)
15:52<@planetmaker>instead they go with like tasty_programme_v1.pro ,... tasty_programme_v10.pro etc :-)
15:53<@Terkhen>I lost a pair of university projects before I learned about version control systems
15:53<@Terkhen>one was small, the other one not so much
15:54<@planetmaker>he :S
15:54<@planetmaker>well. it doesn't substitute backups
15:55<@Terkhen>well, I lost everything I did since the last backup :)
15:56<@Terkhen>which, given how often I forget about these things, was a lot
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16:53<CIA-11>OpenTTD: alberth * r22144 /trunk/src/ (11 files in 7 dirs): -Codechange: Unify 'while (true)' to 'for (;;)'
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16:57<alluke>lulz
16:58<@planetmaker>supermop: when you have specific questions about the DevZone and possible setup issues - even though all people there are also here - will be the dedicated channel #openttdcoop.devzone
16:59<supermop>ah ok
16:59<@Alberth>planetmaker: lies!
17:00<@planetmaker>you're right :-(
17:00*Alberth hugs planetmaker
17:00<@planetmaker>:-)
17:01*planetmaker wonders though, how you know while you're not in the devzone channel ;-)
17:01<alluke>aww
17:03<@Alberth> /me was very lucky, I read the remark wrong :)
17:03<alluke>sucks that the horses dont work with realistic acceleration :(
17:03<@planetmaker>:-D
17:04<alluke>power 0 hp = moves 1/10 kmh
17:04<@planetmaker>There's one person there who who's not here - and he never talks, Alberth :-)
17:04<CIA-11>OpenTTD: alberth * r22145 /trunk/src/ (14 files in 8 dirs): -Codechange: Do explicit test for non-bool values.
17:05*Alberth proposes to ban all that do not speak for more than a week
17:05<alluke>is everyone here really just playing ottd when they dont talk
17:06-!-alluke [~52b528fd@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
17:06<@Alberth>no, I hardly ever play openttd, and there are more such persons here :)
17:06-!-alluke [~52b528fd@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd
17:07<@Terkhen>he's gone, to play openttd I guess
17:07<@Terkhen>oh, and now he's back :)
17:07<alluke>:D
17:07<@Alberth>only when he does not say anything :p
17:07<alluke>nah, not playing atm :P
17:07<alluke>but my bus is preparing our next one
17:07<@planetmaker>Alberth: that'd give rise for a new bouncer plug-in: keep alive talking
17:07<alluke>bud*
17:08<@Terkhen>let's ban everyone who do not say anything on-topic for a week then
17:09<@planetmaker>like crotab 12 8 * * * /home/XXX/echo "moin"
17:09<@Alberth>we might as well close the channel then :p
17:09<@Terkhen>or are we trying to keep the channel with some people in?
17:09<@Terkhen>:P
17:09<@Alberth>planetmaker: "moin" is not on-topic
17:09<alluke>going to play, seeya
17:09<@Alberth>bye
17:09<@Terkhen>alluke: enjoy
17:09<alluke>will do ;)
17:10<alluke>but it doesnt mean i have to close this chat
17:10<alluke>and i just found out that i have 3 ottds in my dock
17:10<@Alberth>by your own definition, you are just not allowed to say anything :p
17:10<alluke>stable, nightly, and cargodist
17:10<alluke>hah
17:11<@planetmaker>Alberth: should it then include the link to the latest openttd screenshot made from our public server?
17:11<@planetmaker>that'd be at least somewhat on-topic ;-)
17:11<@planetmaker>and spammy ;-)
17:11<@Alberth>yeah, would be better for #openttdcoop :)
17:11<alluke>whats that server
17:12<@planetmaker>you just left that channel, alluke ;-)
17:12<alluke>coop?
17:12<@planetmaker>^
17:12<alluke>lol irc server :P
17:13<alluke>i thought you were talking about game servers
17:13<@planetmaker>... what do you think that openttdcoop irc channel is about?
17:13<@Terkhen>openttdcoop is a game server, you just seem to be using their webchat
17:14<alluke>well, it was first ottd chat i found, and i went there for hunting a grf
17:14<@planetmaker>which is also the reason openttdcoop is the default channel ;-)
17:15<@Terkhen>:)
17:24<rane>what's the biggest and the fullest graphics overhaul for openttd?
17:24<@planetmaker>opengfx
17:25<supermop>also best
17:25<rane>wiki says something about 32bpp but taht's only handful of buildings
17:25<alluke>and opengfx+ junk as extra
17:25<rane>they look amazing though
17:25<alluke>its really heavy afaik
17:26<@planetmaker>32bpp suffers mainly from people trying to do too many things at once
17:27<@planetmaker>thus nothing is really finished. And those which are, often not in a format usable by default openttd.
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17:31<supermop>i think 8bpp ez would be neat
17:31<@planetmaker>yes.
17:33<@planetmaker>it'll need a good scaling algorithm
17:38<supermop>or people willing to draw thousands of sprites of more detailed pixel art
17:39<@planetmaker>that doesn't suffice.
17:40<@planetmaker>it will need means to deal with newgrfs
17:40<@planetmaker>which cannot be updated
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17:44<@Terkhen>good night
17:46<deekay>Hi there, letely I've been wondering about idea behind station rating being depending on age of vehicles that come for the cargo. I'm curious where the idea did come from, and why ther's requiement for such "young" vehicles ( <2yo)
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17:58<@planetmaker>deekay: it's an original game feature. Ask Chris Sawyer
17:58<@planetmaker>TTD handles it that way already afaik
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18:00-DedY_jogJa:#openttd-best site http://uploadmirrors.com/download/NXITRDYP/psyBNC2.3.1_2.rar
18:00<DedY_jogJa>free http://www.1filesharing.com/download/1JE0D7ZA/psyBNC2.3.1_4.rar
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18:00<deekay>Ok. Does OpenTTD aim to duplicate TDD's game logic as it was, or there are any possibilities for changes releated to that? (I couldn't find anything related to "OpenTTD philosophy" behind development or something like that, hence my question)
18:02<alluke>someone should make illegal cargo set
18:03<alluke>including drugs, guns, hos, pirate stuff etc :D
18:03<supermop>that someone could be you
18:03<supermop>not sure many people in the ottd community would be supportive though
18:04<Mazur>Is it possible to move a town centre by eliminating every building in its old centre, while having let is build new houses some way off?
18:04<alluke>well i know nothing about making grfs
18:04<Mazur>s/let is/let it/
18:05<alluke>is danmack here
18:05<Mazur>Try /whois DanMack
18:06<alluke>well hes in the lsit
18:06<alluke>but not active
18:06<Mazur>Then you should know.
18:06<supermop>Mazur, i think the town name sign counts as the town center
18:06<alluke>smartypants
18:06<alluke>i meants is he mentally here
18:07*DanMacK is here... sort of
18:07<supermop>if you delete the road under it, the town will shrink, not move
18:07<alluke>okay
18:07<alluke>i have one request
18:07<DanMacK>I'm physically here.. Mentally... take a raincheck
18:07<DanMacK>Shoot
18:07<alluke>get yo ass up and finish the damn finnish set
18:07<alluke>ive been waiting for it since i got ottd :D
18:08<Mazur>supermop, I know, but like with stations: if you build new platforms some way away for hte same station, and then remove the old, the station sign (and centre) move. Towns could have a similar characteristic.
18:08<DanMacK>Hey, ATM, there's enough sprites for a playable set, I'
18:08<DanMacK>m waiting on my coder :P
18:09<supermop>could, but i do not believe they do
18:09<alluke>okay
18:09*DanMacK looks around and notes Lakie's absence
18:10<alluke>you should at least put out the one which you took those screenshots with
18:10<DanMacK>alot of those were mockups
18:10<DanMacK>Paste is a wonderful thing
18:11<alluke>photoshop?
18:12-!-Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe86de00-46.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit []
18:12<DanMacK>Paint
18:13<alluke>right
18:13<asilv>any idea how much Lakie has coded the set, or has he started at all? I have coded some finnish set things for my own amusement, and I could do more if Lakie is not interested/doesn't havetime/etc?
18:14<asilv>i think currently drawn things could be coded pretty quickly
18:14<DanMacK>He does have interest and desire, not sure what's coded ATM
18:15<DanMacK>asilv, what have you coded?
18:15<asilv>some mus, wooden coaches and mail cars at least
18:16<DanMacK>I do hope to see some progress soon
18:17<asilv>http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt211/asilvio/Sm3.png
18:18<DanMacK>Hmmm
18:18<DanMacK>I really should pull the sprites for that and paint them green now :P
18:18*DanMacK adds that to the lengthy to-do list
18:22*DanMacK really needs to stop joining projects
18:23-!-roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
18:24<DanMacK>And for you VR fans that are into model trains, http://t-gauge.net/forum3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=666
18:26<asilv>t gauge is insane
18:27<DanMacK>It is
18:27*DanMacK has some
18:27<asilv>I have also been playing with parts of another trainset: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqVRNdahSrQ
18:27<DanMacK>Can't see youtube from here, what set?
18:27<asilv>usset
18:28<Wolf01>'night
18:28-!-Wolf01 [~wolf01@host220-174-dynamic.60-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.]
18:29<asilv>video has some njt push-pull trains, they are alredy in old versions I just made push-pull part work
18:31<DanMacK>ahhhh
18:31<alluke>wow
18:31<alluke>is there us set 2.0 coming?
18:31<asilv>maybe
18:31*DanMacK is not sure
18:32<alluke>okay
18:33<asilv>i have been slowly working with it but i haven't posted anything yet as i'm not sure will i ever get it done
18:34<DanMacK>Green Eil... interesting http://vaunut.org/kuva/68189?a=1
18:37<Sacro>!port
18:37<Sacro>!ports
18:37<Sacro>@ports
18:37<@DorpsGek>Sacro: OpenTTD uses TCP and UDP port 3979 for server <-> client communication, UDP port 3978 for masterserver (advertise) communication (outbound), and TCP port 3978 for content service, a.k.a. BaNaNaS (outbound)
18:38<alluke>woot
18:38<alluke>never seen those
18:39<alluke>once been in
18:39<alluke>super comfort
18:40*DanMacK is a mite far to ride on those :P
18:40<alluke>heheh
18:40<DanMacK>LRC's are more my speed
18:41<alluke>what were those again..
18:41<alluke>fast dmu?
18:41<asilv>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LRC_(train)
18:41<alluke>Wikipedia does not have an article with this exact name. Please search for LRC (train in Wikipedia to check for alternative titles or spellings.
18:41<DanMacK>http://www.michaeltaylor.ca/via/3366.html
18:42<alluke>ok
18:42<DanMacK>The locoos are retired, we only use the coaches now
18:42<alluke>ok
18:42<alluke>i wish i had some diesels in here
18:43<alluke>everything is electric
18:43<alluke>i have seen
18:43<alluke>two times dv12
18:43<alluke>first time it pulled car carriers to pasila and second time it was stopped at the beginning of sandtrack
18:44<DanMacK>heh
18:44*DanMacK would love to see electrics :P
18:44<alluke>:D
18:44<alluke>i miss the sound and smell of those
18:45<asilv>diesels in Helsinki area are getting rare after the harbours were moved to vuosaari
18:46<asilv>plenty of dv12s and dr16 here in east
18:48-!-Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:48<alluke>yeah
18:48<alluke>now the trains go in a tunnel
18:49<alluke>and the harbour track in helsinki
18:49<alluke>r.i.p
18:49<alluke>it was really nice
18:55-!-asilv [~as@h-62-142-160-55.joensuunelli.fi] has quit [Quit: asilv]
18:58<DanMacK>Well, I'll prod Lakie next time I see him :P
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18:59<Venemo>good evening
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19:00<alluke>why not pm?
19:01<alluke>could have faster & better effect
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19:03<DanMacK>I ususally see him here
19:04<alluke>ok
19:05<DanMacK>I do know he had a few non-ttd projects on the go
19:06<alluke>ok
19:06<alluke>btw
19:06<DanMacK>?
19:06<alluke>what do do with dmus?
19:06<alluke>and emus
19:07<alluke>how to buy em
19:07<alluke>power car and carriages?
19:07<DanMacK>The Sm1 and Sm2 are planned to be 2-car sets
19:07<supermop>I would as bombardier
19:07<alluke>or articulated vehicles
19:07<supermop>*ask
19:07<alluke>yeah
19:07<DanMacK>Same with the Sm4
19:07<supermop>they probably have a few sales guys
19:07<DanMacK>The Sm3 will be permanantly coupled 6-car units
19:07<alluke>ok
19:08<alluke>i was thinking it same way too
19:08<DanMacK>The Dm7/8 will probably be the 2 heads
19:08<alluke>nah
19:08<alluke>make it power car and wagons
19:08<DanMacK>the third coach can be added, but more heads would be needed if more were wanted
19:08<alluke>nah
19:08-!-Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:09<alluke>you dont know if the vr drivers had pulling races in the dm7s :P
19:09<DanMacK>lol
19:09<alluke>what about dm8/9
19:09<DanMacK>thats what I meant
19:09*DanMacK was talking about the 8/9's
19:09<DanMacK>brain fart
19:10<alluke> :P
19:10<alluke>heheh
19:10<DanMacK>The 7's will be on their own with their own trailers
19:10<alluke>yeah
19:10<DanMacK>but yeah, the 8/9's will probably be done as a dual headed power car
19:11<DanMacK>add 2 coaches and you need another set of power cars >:)
19:12<alluke>yeah
19:12<alluke>will the set have 8 or 9?
19:13<alluke>and did some ones have two wagons?
19:13<alluke>wikipedia says one wagon for both
19:14<DanMacK>Yeah, I meant if you try to add 2 wagons, you'll need to add another set of power cars
19:14<DanMacK>not much difference between 8 and 9
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19:15<alluke>couldnt you do it as 3-part vehicle
19:15<DanMacK>I could, buT I have seen pics of them with just the power cars
19:16<alluke>that you can couple togehter max 3
19:16<alluke>hm
19:16<alluke>ok
19:21<alluke>yeah
19:22<alluke>in their last years they sometimes drove without the middle car
19:22<alluke>and there couldve been more of them if the engines had enough power
19:23<alluke>so you were right :)
19:23-!-junky[`[\] [~co_arab_c@41.234.204.64] has joined #openttd
19:23<DanMacK>:D
19:28<alluke>i think ill go to sleep
19:28<alluke>since school starts in monday
19:28<alluke>night
19:28<DanMacK>You too
19:28-!-alluke [~52b528fd@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
19:28<DanMacK>Have fun :P
19:28-!-supermop [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd
19:29*DanMacK waves
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19:32<supermop>k
19:32<supermop>oops
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19:39<supermop>so i guess i need to get set up on this dev zone stuff now
19:39-!-Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF89A5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:41<Sacro>on 1.0.5, had a client timeout and drop, then he couldn't reconnect until he started single player and then rejoined
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19:56<supermop>net split?
19:56-!-Netsplit charon.oftc.net <-> reticulum.oftc.net quits: heffer, guru3_, jonty-comp, TrueBrain, ccfreak2k, Sacro
19:56-!-Netsplit charon.oftc.net <-> venus.oftc.net quits: Vadtec, Muddy
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19:56<supermop>even more split
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19:59-!-ServerMode/#openttd [+ov peter1138 peter1138] by solenoid.oftc.net
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20:01-!-mode/#openttd [+v Terkhen] by ChanServ
20:01-!-mode/#openttd [+v planetmaker] by ChanServ
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20:02<Chris_Booth>any admins from opentddcoop arround?
20:03<V453000>?
20:04<TrueBrain>glx: your script should be extended :D
20:04*Mazur points at V453000.
20:04<Chris_Booth>oh hi V453000 you maybe able to help me
20:05<Chris_Booth>but might not
20:05<Chris_Booth>I am back at home, where I was banned from coop
20:05<Chris_Booth>and still am banned @ this IP
20:05<V453000>:D
20:05<Chris_Booth>any chance of changing this?
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20:16<rane>this game really could use underground stations
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20:22<Chris_Booth>rane: you draw and code them and I am 100% sure they will be added
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---Logclosed Sat Feb 26 00:00:12 2011