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#openttd IRC Logs for 2011-03-11

---Logopened Fri Mar 11 00:00:07 2011
---Daychanged Fri Mar 11 2011
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02:19<@Terkhen>good morning
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03:00<Wolf01>hello
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03:04<@Terkhen>hi Wolf01
03:09<__ln__>http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12709598
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03:42<awam>Is there any way to use NewGRFs in a scenario in the current nightlies or cargodist? The selection window is always empty if I open it from within a scenario.
03:42<awam>I've tried r22230 and the oldest cargodist I could find
03:43<@SmatZ>select newgrfs before generating the scenario
03:43<@SmatZ>eg. from the main menu
03:44<@SmatZ>modifying newgrf config ingame (including scenedit) is very likely to causes errors later
03:45<awam>doesn't work, the game ignores my selection
03:45<@planetmaker>it's like in civilization choosing a tribe to play. You cannot change that later either.
03:46<@planetmaker>awam, it works for all except you then
03:46<@planetmaker>the main menu has no effect on existing games or scenarios
03:46<@planetmaker>nor can it
03:48<awam>so I can't add NewGRFs to a scenario? I remember it used to work if I edited the scenario before starting the game
03:49<@planetmaker>yes. that was broken design
03:49<@planetmaker>and it didn't really work
03:51<awam>never noticed any problems though
03:53<@planetmaker>as long as you don't consider crashes problems...
03:54<awam>can't remember any crashes
03:55<@planetmaker>*sigh*
03:55<awam>I only used newgrfs that added stations or vehicles though, none that modified game mechanics or so
03:55<@planetmaker>"works in a few cases" != "works correctly"
03:55<@planetmaker>see. Already vehicles are very problematic
03:55<awam>why?
03:56<@planetmaker>there's a couple of completely broken-configured scenarios on bananas. Due to this exact thing
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03:58<@planetmaker>vehicle newgrfs modify core game data which other vehicle newgrfs rely on. So changing, adding, removing vehicle newgrfs will have them rely on data which don't exist anymore in the way they expect them to exist
04:02<awam>I must have been lucky then
04:05<@planetmaker>my point. yes
04:05<@planetmaker>it often works once. But if you change your mind a 2nd time, chances are much higher things go hay-wire
04:06<@planetmaker>and so on.
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04:38<Wolf01>svn guru, I need you!
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04:52<Eddi|zuHause>metaquestion guru, i need you!
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05:19<@Terkhen>coffee, I need you!
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06:27<lugo->planetmaker, so i've just revoked those waypoint translation changes :)
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06:35<@planetmaker>ok. Thanks
06:35<@planetmaker>I'll write him an e-mail, I got the address meanwhile
06:36<@planetmaker>And I'll invite him to join discussions on how to improve translations :-)
06:37<@planetmaker>you referencing mb, I assume he commented on that in some private rant?
06:37<@planetmaker>In any case he did not communicate it (as so often, unfortunately) in a place where it is appropriate :S
06:39<@planetmaker>in any case, you (and norbert) were the first who really communicated it; thanks for that
06:41<lugo>well mb did reply in that very thread
06:43<@planetmaker>oh. blind me.
06:43<@planetmaker>thanks again :-)
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06:43<@planetmaker>I guess those updates to the thread entirely slipped my attention for an unknown reason
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09:23<@Belugas>hello
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10:08<DanMacK>Hey all
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11:24<Ruudjah>I downloaded the .deb for ubuntu 10.10 x32, I opened it an ubuntu software center opened, with openttd install page wth an "upgrade" button
11:25<Ruudjah>I hit it, I got an error: There seems to be a programming error in aptdaemon, the software that allows you to install/remove software and to perform other package management related tasks. Please report this error at http://launchpad.net/aptdaemon/+filebug and retry.
11:25<@planetmaker>did you do so?
11:26<Ruudjah>i wonder if its indeed from aptdaemon, since all prev installs using ubuntu sofwtare center did not fail
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11:33<Ruudjah>I does not actually give any error, so I doubt it's usefull for the guys as launchpad. However, I tried to work around it by removing and installing openttd (failed, got back 1.0.4, apparently the Ubuntu repo isn't uptodate) and then by removing and installing openttd by the downloaded deb
11:33<Ruudjah>the latter being successfull
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11:34<Eddi|zuHause>i have heard this story before...
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11:36<Eddi|zuHause>afair the last person who reported such an issue, had dependency failures in the log
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12:09<supermop>hello
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13:45<CIA-7>OpenTTD: translators * r22232 /trunk/src/lang/ (german.txt portuguese.txt slovak.txt):
13:45<CIA-7>OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<CIA-7>OpenTTD: german - 20 changes by lugo
13:45<CIA-7>OpenTTD: portuguese - 1 changes by JayCity
13:45<CIA-7>OpenTTD: slovak - 1 changes by micropro_cz
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14:29<chylex>Hi, is possible in multiplayer to recover password, or assing company to a player?
14:29<chylex>*assign
14:30<@Yexo>type "help move" in the console
14:30<@Yexo>there is no function to recover a password
14:30<chylex>Ok, thanks!
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14:48<CIA-7>OpenTTD: yexo * r22233 /trunk/src/table/settings.ini: -Fix (r22210): value strings for command-pause-level were not shown correctly
15:04<ccfreak2k>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Road_Train2.jpg
15:04<ccfreak2k>I guess it's time to make a new patch!
15:04<ccfreak2k>Or GRF or whatever.
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15:20<@Alberth>rv-wagons :p
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16:17<Zonta>Greetings guys and girls
16:18<@Alberth>hi
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16:18<@Alberth>(although I am just a single instance of the former :) )
16:20<@Rubidium>you're a single greeting?
16:20<Zonta>I got a problem when Hosting a Dedicated server of OpenTTD : sendto([master.openttd.org]:3978 (IPv6)) failed with: 101
16:21<@Rubidium>that's usually harmless; it means that your server has IPv6 enabled but not properly configured, i.e. you can't connect to the internet with IPv6
16:22<Zonta>Ok well and my IPv4 Works but i cannot see my server into the server list
16:22<@Rubidium>the in-game server list or the list at http://servers.openttd.org ?
16:22<@Alberth>Rubidium: that too :)
16:22<Zonta>Nope i don'T see my server there
16:23<@Rubidium>OpenTTD is not whining, after a minute or so that it couldn't advertise?
16:24-!-Markavian [~Markavian@225.205.dsl.syd.iprimus.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:28<Zonta>Does it absolutely need IPv6 to works?
16:28<@Rubidium>no, IPv6 is not needed at all
16:29<@Rubidium>but if it doesn't whine about not being able to advertise, then it should be in the list at servers.openttd.org
16:29<Zonta>he's retrying and telling me that he don'T receive the acknoledge
16:30<@Rubidium>then it's also telling you that port forwarding is probably not set up correctly
16:30<Zonta>Yes
16:31<Zonta>But my router is correctly set and the firewall is also set
16:31<@Rubidium>well, the packet doesn't get to OpenTTD so something is blocking it
16:31<@Yexo>Zonta: did you forward both tcp and udp?
16:31<Zonta>Yes
16:31<@Rubidium>in 99% of the time this is due to local configuration issues
16:32<@Yexo>@ports
16:32<@DorpsGek>Yexo: OpenTTD uses TCP and UDP port 3979 for server <-> client communication, UDP port 3978 for masterserver (advertise) communication (outbound), and TCP port 3978 for content service, a.k.a. BaNaNaS (outbound)
16:32<@Rubidium>the other 1% is "broken" internet
16:32<+glx>or stupid ISP
16:33<+glx>we also saw "smart" routers
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16:34<Zonta>Its cannot be ISP or router i got a Teamspeak server fully running on another machine and a game server also
16:34<Zonta>Plus i can ssh my machine that i try to run a openttd server
16:34<@Rubidium>then, by deduction... what's left to be broken?
16:34<Zonta>Firewall inside the machine
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16:52<Zonta>Ok
16:52<Zonta>Firewall was not set correctly
16:53<Zonta>Everything works gracefully now
16:54<Zonta>Thanks guys
16:56<Wolf01>'night
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17:00<@peter1138>Oh dear.
17:00<@peter1138>The reactor's not going well :S
17:01<@Belugas>mmh?
17:01<@peter1138>The Kyodo news agency is now citing a safety panel as saying that the radiation level inside one of the reactors at the Fukushima-Daiichi nuclear plant is 1,000 times higher than normal.
17:01<@Belugas>ho in Japan?
17:01<supermop>ouch, thought the emergency coolant was under controll
17:01<@Belugas>ho ho.. take your stuff and run
17:01<supermop>good thing they alreay evacuated
17:04<@Rubidium>peter1138: that might be due to their plan to release some steam from the reactor into other parts of the facility in an effort to not make is explode
17:04<supermop>hmm
17:05<supermop>seems like they are still working on the coolant situation, but no damage to the reactor yet
17:06<+glx>they need to release air
17:07<@Rubidium>air?
17:07<+glx>that's what they say on NHK world
17:08<supermop>probably mean steam
17:08<@Rubidium>that would mean the thing is air cooled, which isn't that good at cooling
17:08<supermop>its not
17:09<supermop>last air cooled reactor designs were things like windscale
17:09<supermop>learned that problem a while ago
17:09<+glx>it's air from reactor's containment vessels
17:09<supermop>but the water in the reactor should be boiling off until they can get the pumps running again
17:10<supermop>causing increased pressure in the containment building
17:13<supermop>but they should be able to filter and release some of that vapor
17:13<Sacro>Oh, discussion in here about it too
17:16*frosch123 is impressed that evacuations actually work
17:16<Sacro>it's Japan
17:16<Sacro>they are damn good at this
17:16<supermop>yeah
17:16<supermop>unlike here
17:16<+glx>2 cm of snow are enough to paralyse everything here
17:16<supermop>where people were swept away in california despite going onto a beach with 12+ hours or warning about a tsunami
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18:00<Sacro>so errm, is that another reactor off on one?
18:02<supermop>?
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18:14<marcus>i need some help with a grf codec
18:16<marcus>hello anyone
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18:17<marcus>hello
18:18<DoubleYou>hello, it is not always busy here
18:18<DoubleYou>i don't know much about grf codecs
18:18<DoubleYou>please stay around until someone else might wake up and help you
18:20<marcus>k
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18:27<@Yexo>marcus: grfcodec is a commandline tool
18:27<@Yexo>you need to open a command prompt and run it from there
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19:04<Mazur>How boring, 8 quits in a row.
19:05-!-supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop]
19:09<Eddi|zuHause>and you broke the streak
19:12<Mazur>Yep.
19:12<Mazur>Deliberately and with malice aforethought.
19:13<Mazur>:-)
19:13<Mazur>Ain't I a stinker?
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19:16<Mazur>LOL!!
19:16<Mazur>New Giant in the playground.
19:16<Mazur>:-)))
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19:52<supermop>hey
19:52<supermop>any news on the reactor?
19:57<Sacro>well
19:57<@planetmaker>Depends. none I know. Maybe it has a leak
19:57<Sacro>it's not gone boom yet
19:57<Sacro>there's a controlled leak going on
20:00<supermop>so they went ahead with the vent?
20:00<supermop>no word on if they got the back up generators online for the cooling system?
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20:16<@planetmaker>they didn't so far afaik
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20:16<@planetmaker>which is quite bad news
20:18<supermop>still pumping in water from outside?
20:18<supermop>at least the reactor was able to shut down before hand
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20:20<Zmapper>is it possible to set up an ottd server on a computer connected to the internet via a router?
20:20<supermop>the good thing is that the government is being forthright about the possibility of leakage, and evacuating the areas
20:20<@planetmaker>well. You cannot really shut down a nuclear plant
20:20<supermop>you can insert the control rods,
20:20<@planetmaker>Zmapper: sure. But you need to open the ports on both, computer and router
20:20<@planetmaker>@ports
20:20<@DorpsGek>planetmaker: OpenTTD uses TCP and UDP port 3979 for server <-> client communication, UDP port 3978 for masterserver (advertise) communication (outbound), and TCP port 3978 for content service, a.k.a. BaNaNaS (outbound)
20:20<supermop>which will help keep temperature lower
20:21<supermop>and buy you hours, rather than minutes to prevent the water from boiling off
20:21<Zmapper>And how do I open ports on both computer and router?
20:22<@planetmaker>ask your OS manufacurer and router manufacturer
20:22<@planetmaker>that is really very much configuration / hardware dependent
20:22<Zmapper>ok
20:23<@planetmaker>you need to explain your firewall somehow that these ports are ok and your computer allowed to act as server there
20:23<@planetmaker>Don't ask me about how-to on windows
20:25<Zmapper>thank you planetmaker
20:34<@planetmaker>np.
20:34<Zmapper>can anyone check if i did this right
20:34<Zmapper>http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5098/5518256955_d5423ef71c_b.jpg
20:35<@planetmaker>Zmapper: servers.openttd.org
20:35<Zmapper>I mean for router settings
20:35<supermop>well i am glad my friends are ok for now,
20:36<@planetmaker>probably. yes
20:36<supermop>assuming they don't decide to go hang out on top of any containment builds
20:36<supermop>buildings
20:36<@planetmaker>if you want to use the admin port from external, you additionally need port 3977, too
20:36<Zmapper>I guess it is time to test it out
20:37<@planetmaker>supermop: yeah, I'm glad I heart back from my Japanese friends as well and that they and their family are all well
20:38<@planetmaker>Zmapper: what I meant is: if the port configs are right: then you can check that your server announces itself properly by checking http://www.openttd.org/en/servers
20:38<@planetmaker>it should show up there withing 5 minutes at most, rather much faster.
20:38<Zmapper>is there a time delay before a server appears on the list
20:38<Zmapper>you must be telepathic cause you answered my question as i was typing
20:39<@planetmaker>hehe :-)
20:41<@planetmaker>IIRC the masterserver updates all 20 seconds or so. But I'm not 100% affirmative on that
20:41<@planetmaker>and then there's always the inet in between ;-)
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20:42<Zmapper>not showing up
20:43<Zmapper>do i have to set anything up on my computer
20:43<Zmapper>cause i just set up the ports only
20:45<@planetmaker>well. your pc's firewall has to allow those, too
20:45<@planetmaker>if the pc has one
20:45<@planetmaker>however, it's short of 3am here, so I'll better head off to bed ;-)
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---Logclosed Sat Mar 12 00:00:18 2011