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#openttd IRC Logs for 2011-08-02

---Logopened Tue Aug 02 00:00:46 2011
---Daychanged Tue Aug 02 2011
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04:18<dihedral>good morning
04:20<@peter1138>it's not
04:20<@peter1138>it's the end of the world
04:20<@peter1138>at least, that's what my dog thought, as his ball fell in the canal and we had to leave it
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04:31<dihedral>peter1138, ... cute :-)
04:36<__ln__>not cute, shocking
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05:21<@Terkhen>good morning
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05:54<andythenorth>shame about IE6 being so stubborn:
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06:04<Pikka>ahoyhoy and custard
06:10<andythenorth>Pikka is on uk time?
06:10<andythenorth>or staying up late?
06:11<Pikka>it's 8pm, andy
06:11<Pikka>I'll still be working at this time tomorrow D:
06:12<Eddi|zuHause>what the hell is custard anyway?
06:13<Pikka>it's a mixture of milk and egg that invented SCUBA, Eddi
06:25<Eddi|zuHause>is that comparable to anything edible by continental europeans?
06:31<Pikka>it's hard to tell, Eddi
06:32<Pikka>although of all traditional english foodstuffs I wouldn't have thought it among the least appetising.
06:33<Eddi|zuHause>well, i have no idea how it tastes
06:37<duckblaster>custard powder: cornflour + vanilla flavouring + yellow colouring
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06:38<Eddi|zuHause>so it tastes like vanilla sauce?
06:38<duckblaster>um, not sure?
06:39<duckblaster>since i am allergic to both milk and egg, have to stick with custard powder and soy milk
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06:46<@peter1138>it tastes like... custard
06:51<andythenorth>it's custardy
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07:07<Pikka>gpl custard
07:07<Pikka>the fiends!
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08:20<dihedral>@seen darkequi
08:20<@DorpsGek>dihedral: darkequi was last seen in #openttd 4 days, 3 hours, 58 minutes, and 33 seconds ago: <darkequi> yo ^^
08:20<dihedral>@seen equinox
08:20<@DorpsGek>dihedral: I have not seen equinox.
08:20<dihedral>ah well ^^
08:20<@planetmaker>you've strangely named friends ;-)
08:23<dihedral>yes :-P
08:23<dihedral>but at least i know him :-D
08:23<dihedral>not just one of those ... "virtual" contacts :-D
08:23*dihedral chuckles
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08:25<dihedral>and hello planetmaker :-)
08:55<Eddi|zuHause>it's not our fault that you were not at r20k
08:57<dihedral>yeah - i wish i had been :-(
08:58<dihedral>it's gonna take a while until we hit 30k
08:58<dihedral>but perhaps i'll do a europe tour and visit all the well known ... 'nicks' ^^
08:58<Eddi|zuHause>at the current speed of development... very long ;)
08:59<dihedral>perhaps we should do parties every 5k rather ^^
09:00<Eddi|zuHause>or you people come to my birthday
09:02<dihedral>now that sounds like an interesting idea
09:02<dihedral>i get my car back today ;-)
09:02<dihedral>when's your birthday?
09:03<Eddi|zuHause>end of september
09:04<Eddi|zuHause>might target the 1st october (saturday) though
09:04<dihedral>i am mid november - we can do two parties after each other :-P
09:07<dihedral>interesting andythenorth
09:08<Eddi|zuHause>,1518,777958,00.html <- i spot a real life godwin event...
09:19<@planetmaker>meh, seems like
09:19<@planetmaker>I kinda pity that guy
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10:48<Zuu>dihedral: Make more patches so we get the 30k party quicker ;-) .. or rather if we want a party we can have it without getting to 30k. hehe
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10:56<dihedral>Zuu, i have some admin network stuff to do anyway :-P
10:57<Zuu>Oh, and if I get something going with the NoAI API for airports, it will have to be one patch per new/modified function :-p hehe
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11:03<andythenorth>commit my cb 15e patch :P
11:06<@planetmaker>Zuu, next party up North? ;-)
11:07<@planetmaker>also... one patch per modified or new function is not that bad an idea
11:08<@planetmaker>well, you know how our commits work: atomic ;-)
11:15<Eddi|nichZuHause>so, then atomically commit yacd and distyacd :p
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11:22<Zuu>planetmaker: Not impossible. __ln__ would be even more up North than here. I'm only less than an hour from Copenhagen.
11:24<@planetmaker>that makes it easy to get there ;-)
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11:35<Rubidium>Zuu: by what means of transportation? ;)
11:35<Zuu>Rubidium: Both train and car at least if thee is no jam on the highway and the trains are not too delayed.
11:36<Zuu>Not sure if the helicopter service still exist. But before the bridge was there, there was a helicopter service over the water for those who didn't want to go with the ferry (and could afford the helicopter)
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11:37<Rubidium>so it's Malmö-ish? Although google maps says it's ~1 hour to Helsingborg as well
11:41<Zuu>Rubidium: Lund
11:41<Zuu>Which is only "2 mil" from Malmö. Note that a swedish mile is 10km ;-)
11:42<Zuu>It's between Malmö and Helsingborg sort of.
11:42<@planetmaker>that's an interesting unit. Never heart it before
11:43<Rubidium>the closest airport is probably Copenhagen, right?
11:43<Rubidium>somewhat internationalish one that is
11:46<@planetmaker>well, I'd drive. I could pickup people from there, I guess
11:48<Zuu>Rubidium: Right. There is one called Malmö airport as well which has busses but no train. It is however much smaller and is mostly only used for flights to sunny places etc. "charter" is what its called here.
11:49<Zuu>Copenhagen airport is IIRC the largest one in scandinavia.
11:54<Rubidium>planetmaker: yeah, the Copenhagen airport would be only a tiny detour
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12:11<@planetmaker>yes, and from there it's only like 45min to Lund, according to google
12:11<@planetmaker>but it takes me 5 hours to get there :-)
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12:44<Zuu>There is also a DB train from Hamburg to Copenhagen, but only that takes 5 hours.
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12:54<@planetmaker>well. Hamburg is 2h from here ;-)
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13:00<__ln__>I'm 1,5h from Copenhagen by plane. (there are direct flights)
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13:07<__ln__>driving to copenhagen costs money besides the gasoline; either the ferry or a bridge.
13:09<@planetmaker>it does; I'd go by ferry
13:11<Eddi|zuHause>i have gone warnemünde<->gedser once each way by ferry
13:12<__ln__>yes, ferry is right choice. (puttgarden<->rødby). cuts down 150km of driving or so, and one gets a 45-minute break which can be used for eating a lunch on the ferry.
13:14<Eddi|zuHause>there's a night train berlin-malmö
13:14<@planetmaker>yup. That's what I did so far when going to Sweden
13:14<__ln__>copenhagen<->malmö/lund is shorter and quicker by the bridge, on the other hand.
13:14<@planetmaker>Also... ferries are good
13:14<@planetmaker>also that's what I did so far :-P
13:17<__ln__>though if heading for finland, then the helsingør<->helsingborg ferry is the shorter route
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13:18<__ln__>i've tested both the ferries and both the bridges, most of them more than once :)
13:19<@planetmaker>I've unfortunately not been in Finland so far
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13:23<Eddi|zuHause>so a quick overview shows, there is 3 possibilities: start in the evening (~20:00) and arrive in the morning (~8:00) in Malmö, start in the morning (~4:30) and arrive in the afternoon in copenhagen (~14:00) or start in the afternoon (~14:00) and arrive in the evening in copenhagen (~22:00)
13:24<Eddi|zuHause>(by train, that is)
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13:28<Chris_Booth>sleeper trains rule Eddi|zuHause
13:31<Eddi|zuHause>weird train, it says "RE", but has like 20 stops inbetween... i don't want to see where an RB stops along that same route then...
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13:32<__ln__>Eddi|zuHause: what was the departure point of those trains/times mentioned above?
13:34<Eddi|zuHause>Halle (Saale) Hbf
13:37<Eddi|zuHause>all routes either via berlin or hamburg (or both)
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13:41<__ln__>Hannover-CPH is 1 hour by plane
13:43<Eddi|zuHause>tell if you have Leipzig/Halle -> Copenhagen ;)
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13:45<CIA-2>OpenTTD: translators * r22711 /trunk/src/lang/ (dutch.txt english_US.txt finnish.txt serbian.txt):
13:45<CIA-2>OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<CIA-2>OpenTTD: dutch - 1 changes by habell
13:45<CIA-2>OpenTTD: english_US - 1 changes by Rubidium
13:45<CIA-2>OpenTTD: finnish - 1 changes by jpx_
13:45<CIA-2>OpenTTD: serbian - 1 changes by etran
13:48<Eddi|zuHause>what kind of route is that? Copenhagen - [Puttgarden] - Hamburg - [Hannover - Göttingen] - Bad Hersfeld - [Eisenach - Erfurt] - Naumburg - Halle
13:48<Eddi|zuHause>(names in [] are some inbetween stops, other names are switching trains)
13:51<Eddi|zuHause>there's also the more direct route: Copenhagen - [Puttgarden] - Hamburg - Hannover - [Braunschweig - Magdeburg] - Halle
13:51<__ln__>do they transport trains on ferries from puttgarden nowadays?
13:52<__ln__>passenger trains
13:52<Eddi|zuHause>they always did that, or not?
13:52<__ln__>dunno, i just think Bjarni once said that it's not done on some routes anymore, after the bridges were completed.
13:56<__ln__>looks convincing
13:56<__ln__>that's an ICE-T?
13:57<__ln__>or what was the diesel version's name
13:57<__ln__>TD probably
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14:00<Eddi|zuHause>ICE-T is the tilt version. ICE-TD is both tilt and diesel
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14:07<Eddi|zuHause>many dutch peo... i mean caravans leaving this ferry :p
14:12<Eddi|zuHause>__ln__: as far as i know, the ICE-T was originally developed as "IC-T", as replacement for engine-driven ICs, and only very last-minute declared as ICE. it is mainly used for increased speed through curvy tracks, e.g. on the Saalebahn, the route Nürnberg-Saalfeld-Jena-Naumburg-Leipzig, this is different from the ICE3, which from the beginning was designed as ICE1/2 successor.
14:12<Eddi|zuHause>based on the ICE-T they developed a diesel version ICE-TD for the route Nürnberg-Hof-Plauen-Reichenbach-Zwickau-Chemnitz-Dresden
14:13<Eddi|zuHause>which is not electrified between Nünberg and Reichenbach.
14:13<Eddi|zuHause>but that connection was not very successful
14:14<Eddi|zuHause>so the ICE-TD were withdrawn and basically standing around useless, until the DB decided to run them on the Hambugr-Puttgarden-Copenhagen line
14:16<Eddi|zuHause>by 2017 they want to open the high speed line Nürnberg-Erfurt and Erfurt-Leipzig/Halle, making the Saalebahn obsolete for high speed travel
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14:19<__ln__>normalpreis for kopenhagen-hamburg seems to be 84,60€ ... not much cheaper than flying. 29€ as sparangebot though.
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14:22<__ln__>oh, not even sure if those go through puttgarden
14:25<Eddi|zuHause>i've also seen connections via flensburg
14:32<@DorpsGek>__ln__: Commit by translators :: r22711 /trunk/src/lang (4 files) (2011-08-02 17:45:22 UTC)
14:32<@DorpsGek>__ln__: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
14:32<@DorpsGek>__ln__: dutch - 1 changes by habell
14:32<@DorpsGek>__ln__: english_US - 1 changes by Rubidium
14:32<@DorpsGek>__ln__: finnish - 1 changes by jpx_
14:32<@DorpsGek>__ln__: serbian - 1 changes by etran
14:32<__ln__>ah well, r30k isn't quite here yet, but r25k5 is closing
14:32<__ln__>err -5
14:39<Eddi|zuHause>__ln__: btw, the Berlin-Malmö train goes via Sassnitz-Trelleborg ferry
14:42<Eddi|zuHause>__ln__: and almost nobody pays the "normal price", there's always some sort of reduced price, usually with limiting you to one exact train (instead of "any train within a 24h period")
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15:00<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: we're just discussing ways to get to Zuu's place for the next rWhatever-Party :p
15:04<__ln__>18:41 < Zuu> Which is only "2 mil" from Malmö. Note that a swedish mile is 10km ;-) 18:42 <@planetmaker> that's an interesting unit. Never heart it before <-- speaking of strange units in sweden, they also like to measure weight in 'hg', i.e. hectograms.
15:07<supermop_>so ive decided to convert this 128 tile game to 24 hour schedules
15:08<Eddi|zuHause>__ln__: that's not too stupid, most things get measured in multiples of 100g
15:08<Rubidium>oh, only 18 hours by train
15:08<Rubidium>but a mere 2 changes of train
15:09<supermop_>starting with a tram that now has 120 steps in its orders
15:09<Eddi|zuHause>how many round trips is that?
15:11<supermop_>each round trip is 75 minutes including short lay-up at end of line, it does that for a bit less than 20 hours,
15:11<supermop_>then goes to a depot, then waits until 6:00 am to start again
15:12<supermop_>5 trams run that line, 15 minutes apart,
15:13<supermop_>the first 4 follow that above pattern, the 5th runs all night
15:14<supermop_>there are 6 radial tram lines in the town, so I plan on expanding to those as well
15:15<supermop_>previously, each line was either 60 or 75 minutes round trip,
15:16<supermop_>with very tight coordination in the city center, with trams leaving the central station every 5 minutes
15:18<Eddi|zuHause>how is 5 minutes "tight" in a city centre?
15:19<supermop_>its as tight as i can get these trams in TT,
15:21<supermop_>as the center two stations are on a loop, i need to leave enough space to ensure that a tram does not accidentally enter that section of track ahead of a tram from another line that needs to leave earlier
15:22<supermop_>5 minute spacing make the departure board look pretty
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15:40<supermop_>i wish i could copy and paste orders
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15:41<supermop_>or click on them with the go to cursor
15:41<supermop_>rather than manually click the station and enter the wait times
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15:50<Zuu>Rubidium: The weekend I went to r20k, I also had a trip down from Stockholm to Lund so it ended up as a total of 24hours or so on train (I took the berlin sleeper on the way down and the hamburg->copenhagen train on the way home.)
15:51<Zuu>But I also had my master thesis to read through as entertainment :-D
15:55<__ln__>Eddi|zuHause: agreed, hg is a useful unit, but so rare elsewhere.
15:56<Rubidium>Zuu: but... for less money I can be earlier at Copenhagen airport by using a plane ;)
15:56<Zuu>Not surprised that the airoplane is cheaper and faster.
15:57<Eddi|zuHause>not from here...
15:57<Eddi|zuHause>if they don't have direct flights, it's useless
15:58<__ln__>Lund is so close to Copenhagen it could be possible to get mr. B to participate.
15:58<Zuu>Eddi|zuHause: You could check Malmö airport as well if it has any flights, but perhaps you already did that?
15:59<Eddi|zuHause>i already did that... Leipzig/Halle->Copenhagen with 1 stop and Leipzig/Halle->Malmö with 2 stops. it's totally stupid
15:59<Eddi|zuHause>and if i have to go to places like hannover by train, then i can go the full way anyway...
16:00<__ln__>how much was leipzig/halle-cph?
16:00<Eddi|zuHause>don't remember... more than the train
16:01<__ln__>how about a private jet
16:02<Eddi|zuHause>it's around same time and also similar price range as the train, it seems
16:02<Eddi|zuHause>without the option to go overnight
16:03<Zuu>I should tell that currently my apartment building have renovations and after the vacation they will give me new water pipes and at some point they will also close the drain in the cellar for two weeks replacement. This is schedulled to happen after the summer but there is no really accurate schedule for exactly which week it will happen. I would say for sure that it will be done by the end of quater three, probably earlier than that.
16:04<__ln__>a word of warning; in denmark and sweden the currency is also paper or metal, but looks different and they only accept their kind of money, not the usual money.
16:05<Zuu>On the other hand, paying by VISA/Master card for a packet of milk is almost socially accepted.
16:06<@orudge>a "packet" of milk, you crazy continental types :P
16:06*orudge gives Zuu a lovely bottle of milk instead
16:06<Zuu>Anything above 3-4 euros is usually not a problem. If it is below, you just say that you want to use the shop as an ATM and get money ontop of your buy so that they understand that you are out of cash.
16:06<@orudge>I bet it's UHT milk, too, you drink :(
16:06<Eddi|zuHause>germans rarely use credit cards
16:06<__ln__>yes, and is also possible to buy with a visa/master unlike in many german stores.
16:07*peter1138 's never used a credit card
16:07<@orudge>Major shops here will take credit/debit cards for pretty much anything, smaller shops or takeaways may only take them for amounts over, say, £5
16:07<__ln__>orudge: ewww, and no, swedes aren't that misguided
16:07<@orudge>__ln__: oh, that's OK then
16:07<@orudge>my apologies
16:08<Eddi|zuHause>what's UHT milk?
16:08<Zuu>I've bought things for as low as 1 Euro by card, but at those amounts I try to pay by cash if I have any cash.
16:08<@orudge>I mean, ultra-high-temperature processed milk
16:09<__ln__>comes from ultra-high-temperature cows
16:09<@orudge>in theory lasts 6-9 months
16:09<@orudge>but it doesn't taste as good as proper milk
16:09<@peter1138>yes, because it's so horrible you don't want to use it
16:09<Eddi|zuHause>isn't that the standard for milk nowadays?
16:09<@orudge>the French are big fans
16:09<__ln__>and can be stored in room temperature before opening, but it tastes bad
16:10<Eddi|zuHause>i never liked the taste of pure milk, though, maybe that's the reason :p
16:10<@peter1138>crazy belgiums
16:10<andythenorth>at least the belgiums might ship multi-stop docks
16:10<andythenorth>given enough time ;P
16:10*Zuu usually buys half-processed milk. There is also a more "raw" kind of milk available where they haven't taken away any fat.
16:11*orudge drinks full cream/whole milk
16:11<@orudge>I'll settle for semi-skimmed if I have to, but I won't buy it normally
16:11<@orudge>skimmed milk is pretty much pointless, you might as well have water
16:11<__ln__>pure, cold, non-UHT milk is one of the best things to drink
16:13<Zuu>And then we have the sour milk which has similar consistency to yougurt but is more close to how milk tasts than yougurt is. (but not very close either)
16:13<__ln__>i've also tasted real raw milk a few times (i.e. not pasteurized or processed in any way)... it's a bit different, but not bad either.
16:14<__ln__>Zuu: and to confuse tourists, the norwegians call that kulturmelk or something, nothing about sur in its name.
16:15<Zuu>here it is called "filmjölk"
16:15<Zuu>(mjölk == milk)
16:15<__ln__>not surmjölk? or is that a different thing?
16:15<Eddi|zuHause><__ln__> pure, cold, non-UHT milk is one of the best things to drink <-- wouldn't pure fresh milk be usually still warm from the cow it came from a few minutes ago?
16:15<andythenorth>no no!
16:15<andythenorth>milk comes from fridges
16:16<__ln__>Eddi|zuHause: in the 2000's, cows are refridgerated
16:16<Eddi|zuHause>unless you drink like goat milk or something :p
16:17<Zuu>__ln__: no, surmöjk would be milk that has gone too old and smells and tastes wierd. (I know sour milk is made from milk, but the process is more controlled than an old package of milk that has been forgotten in a fridge)
16:17<frosch123>Eddi|zuHause: the milk is already refridgerared at the farm. so you would have to attach yourself directly to the cow, if you would want to get non-refridgerated one
16:18<@orudge>that'd probably get you arrested
16:18<@peter1138>only if you're Sacro
16:18<andythenorth>probably get you kicked in the head
16:18<andythenorth>did someone mention multi-stop docks?
16:18<andythenorth>who was that?
16:19<__ln__>Zuu: oh, it's called surmjölk over here (in the swedish labels)
16:19<Zuu>__ln__: Interesting, I actually never herd of it before.
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16:19<Eddi|zuHause>i only know "sour cream", not "sour milk"...
16:20<Zuu>For the case of sour milk, you would usually write it as "sur mjölk" but in theory you can make a noun out of it.
16:20<andythenorth>milk economy for FIRS!
16:20<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: it was you, just a few minutes ago!
16:20<andythenorth>I thought someone said they were patching for it
16:20<andythenorth>I must have been smoking crack
16:21<Eddi|zuHause>anyway, is this lack of UHT-milk the reason why you see "milk deliveries" in british movies and series?
16:21<andythenorth>one reason yes
16:21<andythenorth>we have a cultural aversion to UHT
16:21<Eddi|zuHause>that is a completely unknown thing here...
16:21<andythenorth>dunno why
16:22<frosch123>Eddi|zuHause: it's called Dickmilch, and is actually not particularry soured
16:23<Eddi|zuHause>i'm not really that involved with milk products...
16:24<frosch123>orudge: btw. noone drinks uht milk nowadays. microfiltration is the todays technology
16:25<@orudge>frosch123: ah. Is it any less awful? :p
16:25<frosch123>it stays fine for about 20 days and tastes like fresh milk
16:25<@orudge>Eddi|zuHause: milk deliveries tend not to happen so much these days, alas, anyway
16:25<frosch123>it's actually sold as "fresh"
16:25<@orudge>much cheaper for everyone to just go to the supermarket and buy their milk there
16:26*__ln__ bought non-UHT milk in Las Vegas
16:27<Eddi|zuHause>orudge: i guess milk deliveries haven't happened around here since the 1970's
16:27<andythenorth>what happens in Vegas...
16:27<@orudge>My Grandad used to get a milk delivery, they stopped, I don't know, maybe 5-10 years ago, then another guy started them up a few years ago
16:27<@orudge>but I think he's stopped now too
16:29<__ln__>orudge: in the good old days, did the milkman just leave the bottles by the frontdoor in direct sunlight to wait for people to come home some hours later? (or was there someone always at home during the good old days)
16:29<@orudge>well, Granny would usually be home if Grandad wasn't
16:29<@orudge>and the milk would usually come around pretty early, maybe 6am or so
16:29<@orudge>so in reality it wouldn't be out that long
16:32<@peter1138>i think milkmen are a dying breed
16:32<@peter1138>supermarkets have taken over
16:34<@orudge>peter1138 should become a milkman
16:35<__ln__>i agree
16:37<dihedral>good evening
16:38<__ln__>dihedral: UHT or decent milk for you, sir?
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16:46<dihedral>i for sure am at the wrong parties :-P
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19:01<kieran491>Hi ya
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19:04<kieran491>I'm looking into setting up an OpenTTD on a dedicated linux box but im just wondering if there are any Plugins of sort to run an enhanced type or server something that maybe records stats of a game or something along those lines
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19:32<Zuu>kieran491: There exist, autopilot, ap+ as well as the admin port for which there exist two libraries but no ready client.
19:33<Zuu>You might also want to concider that we usually got more servers than the total number of clients.
19:34<Zuu>That said, what we would like the most is if you decide to set up a server, if you keep it up to date when new stable versions come out.
19:35<Zuu> <-- see how many servers that still are on 1.1.0 compared to how many that have upgraded
19:38<Zuu> <--- tells you which is the "last stable" version as well as where it is found on the binaries server (see also comments on
19:39<Zuu>Another option could be to register for the RSS of if you want to do manual upgrades, but get informed when new versions arrive.
19:41<Zuu>Oh, and there is also a php library that can get limited information from a sever by connecting to it the same way as you do in the lobby (without actually joining the game)
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---Logclosed Wed Aug 03 00:00:53 2011