| --- | Log | opened Sat Aug 13 00:00:26 2011 |
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| 02:28 | <andythenorth> | norming |
| 02:31 | <KittenKoder> | Morning. |
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| 02:35 | <@planetmaker> | moin |
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| 03:57 | <@Terkhen> | good morning |
| 04:02 | <andythenorth> | hola |
| 04:04 | <KittenKoder> | hihi |
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| 04:33 | <CIA-2> | OpenTTD: frosch * r22738 /trunk/src/ (console_cmds.cpp network/network.cpp network/network_func.h): -Fix [FS#4722] (r21854): Setting company passwords via the GUI on servers (including starting a company with the default password) failed, so no client could join. |
| 04:34 | <Wolf01> | 'moaning |
| 04:34 | <@Terkhen> | hi Wolf01 |
| 04:35 | <Wolf01> | because it is morning and I have an annoying pain on my shoulder |
| 04:35 | <Wolf01> | :P |
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| 05:56 | <reikalusikka> | has anybody here compiled openttd for the n900? |
| 05:56 | <@planetmaker> | @base 10 2 37 |
| 05:56 | <@DorpsGek> | planetmaker: 100101 |
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| 06:43 | <CIA-2> | OpenTTD: frosch * r22739 /trunk/src/viewport.cpp: -Fix: The measurement tooltip is supposed to be hidden when not dragging an area. |
| 06:44 | <andythenorth> | frosch123: how might industry be allowed to overbuild houses? |
| 06:44 | <CIA-2> | OpenTTD: frosch * r22740 /trunk/src/viewport.cpp: -Fix [FS#4708]: Display the size of the leveled platform in the measurement tooltip of terraforming operations. |
| 06:49 | <andythenorth> | planetmaker: http://www.flickr.com/photos/pmiaki/2653321260/ |
| 06:49 | <andythenorth> | http://www.trainspot.jp/files/imagecache/col3-slideshow/project/images/Cows_forklift.jpg |
| 06:50 | <@planetmaker> | :-) |
| 06:51 | <V453000> | :D |
| 06:51 | <V453000> | fuck :D |
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| 06:52 | <KittenKoder> | LOL |
| 06:53 | <andythenorth> | wrt http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2959 |
| 06:53 | <KittenKoder> | Nitpicking ... lame. |
| 06:53 | <frosch123> | oh, there is a real highlight between two unimportant highlights :p |
| 06:54 | <frosch123> | [12:44] <andythenorth> frosch123: how might industry be allowed to overbuild houses? <- imo not at all |
| 06:54 | <frosch123> | though it is kind of done for the "build in towns" flag |
| 06:54 | <frosch123> | but imo that behaviour of the flag is stupid :p |
| 06:57 | <andythenorth> | frosch123: you think overbuilding is invalid? |
| 06:57 | <@planetmaker> | frosch123: do you think it's generally stupid that industries can be placed within a town? |
| 06:57 | <andythenorth> | currently it's a half-assed situtation |
| 06:58 | <andythenorth> | overbuilding is possible, but the newgrf control of it is limited |
| 06:58 | <frosch123> | planetmaker: no, it is stupid that you have to build them on top of houses |
| 06:58 | <V453000> | half-assed :DDD brilliant expression |
| 06:58 | <@Alberth> | planetmaker: it happens, also in RL, but they tend to move away |
| 06:58 | <@planetmaker> | but how could the game do that later, if that were not allowed? |
| 06:58 | <@planetmaker> | I agree it should not be a 'has to be' condition |
| 06:59 | <frosch123> | well, it might be kind of ok-ish for randomly placed industries :) |
| 06:59 | <andythenorth> | it should just be another newgrf tile check :P |
| 06:59 | <frosch123> | but whenever someone asks "how can i fund a bank", the current answer is stupid :p |
| 06:59 | <@Alberth> | servicing the industry becomes a problem, so it will die due to lack of being serviced |
| 06:59 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 06:59 | <andythenorth> | there's always a fricking edge case |
| 07:00 | <andythenorth> | in this case the edge case is whether the town allows player to bulldoze those houses |
| 07:00 | <andythenorth> | for game generating a new industry that's no issue |
| 07:00 | <@planetmaker> | frosch123: imho the correct way would be "allow on houses" without impication "must be on houses" |
| 07:00 | <@Alberth> | andythenorth: otherwise it would be crystal clear and we would not have this discussion :) |
| 07:00 | <frosch123> | planetmaker: but it should be very close to houses :) |
| 07:01 | * | andythenorth wonders what town does in current case |
| 07:01 | <@planetmaker> | yes, like additonal town vicinity check. like r <= town_zone_5 or so |
| 07:01 | <KittenKoder> | Frell. I think I got my parameter labels bassackwards. |
| 07:01 | <@Alberth> | :) |
| 07:02 | <andythenorth> | current case pays no attention to town rating |
| 07:03 | <frosch123> | well, that is usually no problem, as industries cannot be removed by players either :) |
| 07:03 | <@planetmaker> | but for funding? |
| 07:04 | <frosch123> | well, maybe we should soften the current flag, to also allow non-house tiles when neighboured tiles are houses |
| 07:04 | <frosch123> | i do not see need for a more detailed check |
| 07:04 | <frosch123> | resp. there is also a "close by town, but no house" flag |
| 07:05 | <@Terkhen> | that would be nice, the current behaviour is annoying :P |
| 07:06 | <andythenorth> | frosch123: I would rather move away from flags |
| 07:06 | <andythenorth> | this should be a cb 28 / 2f check by newgrf author |
| 07:06 | <andythenorth> | it makes for a confusing API to have both flags and cbs covering similar cases |
| 07:07 | <@planetmaker> | yes, but we cannot simply remove it :_9 |
| 07:07 | <frosch123> | oh, my earlier suggestion is void |
| 07:07 | <frosch123> | INDUSTRYBEH_ONLY_NEARTOWN already means "may be house, but doed not need to" |
| 07:08 | <frosch123> | andythenorth: just use that flag to allow houses |
| 07:09 | <frosch123> | it will restrict distance of northern industry tile to town sign to 9 tiles (manhattan)= |
| 07:09 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 07:10 | <@planetmaker> | frosch123: we might have a bug there... |
| 07:10 | <@planetmaker> | with bit 5 set I cannot build on houses |
| 07:11 | <andythenorth> | have you come across languages / frameworks which mark things as deprecated, but leave them in place? |
| 07:12 | <frosch123> | noai |
| 07:12 | <frosch123> | planetmaker: works for toy shop |
| 07:12 | <@planetmaker> | yes. But not for FIRS |
| 07:12 | <@planetmaker> | e.g. builder's yard |
| 07:13 | <@planetmaker> | and it has that one set |
| 07:15 | <frosch123> | works for me |
| 07:16 | <frosch123> | using tip |
| 07:16 | <frosch123> | of both nml and firs |
| 07:16 | <andythenorth> | works for me too |
| 07:16 | <andythenorth> | must have been the special flag issue |
| 07:17 | <@planetmaker> | hm |
| 07:17 | <frosch123> | i can destroy a whole town to population 0 by funding builders yards :p |
| 07:17 | <andythenorth> | still annoying |
| 07:17 | <andythenorth> | we can't allow player to build wherever they like |
| 07:17 | <andythenorth> | whilst also allowing house overbuild |
| 07:18 | <frosch123> | it's kind of expensive, but ruins a online game with enough money :) |
| 07:19 | <frosch123> | so the "one industry per town"-setting has some use :p |
| 07:20 | <@planetmaker> | hm, indeed works for me now |
| 07:20 | <@planetmaker> | Swedish people must have huge families though |
| 07:21 | <@planetmaker> | This one one-family house which remained in that town has a population of 155 |
| 07:21 | <frosch123> | well, if you bulldoze everything, they have to move somewhere? |
| 07:21 | <@planetmaker> | :-) |
| 07:22 | <@planetmaker> | They probably get cheap construction material now, with all that competition of the builder yards |
| 07:22 | <@planetmaker> | they still also have a petrol station, so getting it from there to their home is no issue, too |
| 07:22 | <Rubidium> | probably each of them is owner of a builder yard |
| 07:23 | <frosch123> | sounds like "oilrig increases passenger production by 100%" |
| 07:27 | * | andythenorth re-reads own comment above |
| 07:28 | <andythenorth> | I wasn't clear in what I meant :P |
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| 07:33 | <andythenorth> | I'm not too bothered about griefing risk from allowing industries to overbuild houses |
| 07:33 | <@Alberth> | planetmaker: most live underground, so they are not bothered by industries destroying their home |
| 07:33 | <andythenorth> | the griefing risk exists already |
| 07:33 | <andythenorth> | issue is that mostly FIRS allows players to place industry wherever they like |
| 07:34 | <andythenorth> | but for town industry, I have to use bit 3 or 5 on special flags |
| 07:34 | <andythenorth> | which means I can't allow player to place anywhere |
| 07:34 | <andythenorth> | whilst also guiding map-gen / in-game generator |
| 07:35 | <andythenorth> | if that makes sense? |
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| 07:50 | <KittenKoder> | In spite of a few pixel flaws and possible parameter error, I like my new track. |
| 07:53 | <KittenKoder> | It's a good start to the sci-fi set I will work on soon. |
| 07:54 | <KittenKoder> | andythenorth, are you still alert here? |
| 07:54 | <andythenorth> | yup |
| 07:54 | <KittenKoder> | What do you think of this idea? |
| 07:55 | <@Terkhen> | are you aware of the vactrain set? |
| 07:56 | <KittenKoder> | 3 Maglev tracks based on the three most common concepts in sci-fi work. First is just basically monorail but with a more science fictiony look, second is the standard maglev, third is the more fantasy based "Tesla" track .... |
| 07:56 | <KittenKoder> | Terkhen, I'm talking sci-fi, not insane speeds. |
| 07:57 | <KittenKoder> | Back in the 60's science fiction trains were "up to 100 mph" .... |
| 07:57 | <@planetmaker> | he, having seen the talk about sci-fi immediately the vactrains came to my mind |
| 07:57 | <@Terkhen> | vactrains are also sci-fi :) |
| 07:57 | <@planetmaker> | KittenKoder: no |
| 07:57 | <@Terkhen> | you are talking about vintage sci-fi :P |
| 07:57 | <@planetmaker> | back in 1930 there were 160km/h trains |
| 07:57 | <@planetmaker> | in real life |
| 07:58 | <KittenKoder> | Science fiction was more about the look. ;) The set will not be to make super fast insane speed trains, but to make trains comparable to that era with the look of what they dreamt. |
| 07:59 | <KittenKoder> | Terkhen, exactly. |
| 08:01 | <KittenKoder> | Science fiction in the earlier eras did not have as much science in them, depending on the author. Lovecraft sci-fi, for instance, was a lot of transdimensional fantasy, purely aesthetic. Asimov however was far more science based, he even had some actual train concepts in one of his Opuses. |
| 08:01 | <@planetmaker> | asimov had a strong science background after all |
| 08:01 | <KittenKoder> | Very much so. |
| 08:01 | <@planetmaker> | being later a professor in biology |
| 08:02 | <KittenKoder> | If you read his Opus books he actually explains his theories used in his fictional books. |
| 08:02 | <@planetmaker> | I know. I read them all :-P |
| 08:02 | <KittenKoder> | ^_^ Yay, another Asimov reader. |
| 08:02 | <KittenKoder> | I idolize him a bit too much, being a huge fan of real AI. |
| 08:03 | <KittenKoder> | It was my childhood dream to be one of those to complete the first true AI, alas ... the dream is nearly dead, but meh. |
| 08:03 | <@planetmaker> | yeah, he did an amazing job with his robot stories. |
| 08:03 | <@Terkhen> | you can still make an OpenTTD AI :P |
| 08:03 | <@Terkhen> | if it follows the three rules it won't get much money, though |
| 08:04 | <@planetmaker> | Actually laying the path for many thought trails |
| 08:04 | <KittenKoder> | Well, I am still learning the languages for OTTD, however I was considering it. |
| 08:04 | <@planetmaker> | NoAIs are written in squirrel |
| 08:04 | <KittenKoder> | Could one be written in c or c++? |
| 08:05 | <KittenKoder> | ... better question to append to that, is there an API as well? |
| 08:06 | <KittenKoder> | The 2cc set maglevs really line up nicely on my new maglev track graphics. |
| 08:06 | <@planetmaker> | could. But will not be supported by official versions |
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| 08:06 | <@planetmaker> | but yes, the API is for squirrel |
| 08:06 | <KittenKoder> | Aaah ... best to make it supported by official versions so people would actually be more likely to test it. |
| 08:07 | <@planetmaker> | the old AI which was part of the game was in C. But... it was notoriously bad and cheated |
| 08:07 | <KittenKoder> | LOL |
| 08:07 | <@planetmaker> | And now... the AI work is out-sourced from a dev POV :-P |
| 08:07 | <KittenKoder> | The Open version, you mean? |
| 08:07 | <@planetmaker> | we're in OpenTTD |
| 08:08 | <KittenKoder> | The original TTD AI wasn't that bad, it wasn't smart but it was smarter and planned things. |
| 08:09 | <KittenKoder> | Though there was the "stray track" error if you outcompeted .... |
| 08:09 | <@planetmaker> | it was pretty stupid. But the same logic increasingly failed with new additions and esp. newgrfs |
| 08:10 | <KittenKoder> | Could NML handle AI coding or would I have to buckle down for that? |
| 08:10 | <@planetmaker> | Nope. NewGRFs and AIs are completely different things |
| 08:11 | <KittenKoder> | Aaah. |
| 08:11 | <@planetmaker> | NML is the NewGRF language. Squirrel the NoAI language. C/C++ the OpenTTD source language |
| 08:11 | <KittenKoder> | So I need to learn Squirel. |
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| 08:11 | <@planetmaker> | yep |
| 08:11 | <@planetmaker> | not difficult from what it looks like |
| 08:11 | <KittenKoder> | Or just figure out the c/c++ interface. |
| 08:12 | <@planetmaker> | won't work. It's a squirrel-API which OpenTTD offers |
| 08:12 | <KittenKoder> | But since Squirrel is part of the official version, I'll look into it. |
| 08:12 | <KittenKoder> | Anyhow, what did you think of my idea? |
| 08:12 | <KittenKoder> | The maglev thing. |
| 08:12 | <@planetmaker> | You don't need squirrel really. OpenTTD brings all it needs |
| 08:13 | <@planetmaker> | It offers so-to-speak squirrel VMs for AIs |
| 08:14 | <KittenKoder> | I'll look into it more once I get my train design itch out of the way. |
| 08:14 | <@planetmaker> | look in src/script :-) |
| 08:15 | <@planetmaker> | but what idea do you mean? |
| 08:17 | <Eddi|zuHause> | you realize how annoying it is to read a conversation between two people with the same nick length and nick colour? |
| 08:17 | <andythenorth> | at least one of them has upper case |
| 08:17 | <KittenKoder> | LOL |
| 08:17 | <andythenorth> | so you can visually distinguish |
| 08:17 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: i can't, colour practically dominates all other differences. |
| 08:17 | <andythenorth> | we have two people at work whose names are same length, begin with 'r' and end in 'a' |
| 08:17 | <KittenKoder> | I'm glad one of them is me, I can tell what I'm saying. |
| 08:18 | <@Alberth> | Eddi|zuHause: perhaps you should improve the colour allocation thingie to also take nickname length into account |
| 08:18 | <KittenKoder> | Script. |
| 08:19 | <@Terkhen> | yup, I should do that too |
| 08:20 | <KittenKoder> | Cool, I didn't screw up the parameter labels, I just chose the wrong settings. >.< |
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| 08:22 | <KittenKoder> | Where is glu? |
| 08:23 | <KittenKoder> | I actually made an efficient industrial "complex" that's even cool looking. |
| 08:24 | <@Alberth> | do you have a screen shot? |
| 08:24 | <KittenKoder> | Guess I should take one before the nearby city overtakes it, huh. |
| 08:25 | <@Alberth> | load an old autosave :) |
| 08:26 | <KittenKoder> | I don't bother with autosave. |
| 08:26 | <KittenKoder> | Making a composite .... |
| 08:27 | <KittenKoder> | Yay for Gimp! |
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| 08:36 | <KittenKoder> | Just need to upload. |
| 08:38 | <KittenKoder> | Alright, it's pretty big: http://rpgcn.com/backups/industrycomplex.png |
| 08:39 | <KittenKoder> | The coal mine on the left is going to a steel mill. |
| 08:40 | <frosch123> | did you cut stuff aways, or did you compose that from multiple screenshots? |
| 08:40 | <KittenKoder> | Multiple shots. |
| 08:40 | <frosch123> | in the latter case there is a screenshot funtion to create a zoomed-in screenshot of the area you see when zoomed out |
| 08:40 | <KittenKoder> | I keep forgetting about that. >.< |
| 08:41 | <frosch123> | and i do not see maglev on that screenshot :p |
| 08:41 | <@Alberth> | neat! Much nicer than I make them |
| 08:42 | <KittenKoder> | Nope, I have a maglev in the game, it's a passenger express route, way on the edges though. |
| 08:42 | <andythenorth> | he |
| 08:42 | <andythenorth> | flat maps :) |
| 08:42 | <KittenKoder> | That's all electirc. |
| 08:42 | <andythenorth> | I played a flat map once |
| 08:42 | <KittenKoder> | Actually, it's a subsection of the Congo map. |
| 08:43 | <CIA-2> | OpenTTD: alberth * r22741 /trunk/src/ (newgrf_airport.h table/airport_movement.h): -Add: Add exit direction of hangars to airport specifications. |
| 08:43 | <KittenKoder> | The game has this weird habit of putting most industries and towns in flat areas for me. |
| 08:44 | <KittenKoder> | I have to rerandomize everything a few times just to get one that's at least a little spread out. |
| 08:44 | <andythenorth> | KittenKoder: it's largely because most industries can only build on flat ground |
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| 08:44 | <KittenKoder> | I figured. |
| 08:44 | <andythenorth> | especially the big FIRS industries :( |
| 08:44 | <CIA-2> | OpenTTD: alberth * r22742 /trunk/src/station_base.h: -Add: Add function to query exit direction of hangars at airports. |
| 08:44 | <KittenKoder> | I like FIRS though, so I put up with it. ;) |
| 08:45 | <KittenKoder> | The standard industries are just boring and ECS never works for me. |
| 08:45 | <@planetmaker> | well... we *might* go for changing that between 0.7 and 1.0 ;-) |
| 08:45 | <KittenKoder> | That would be cool if possible. |
| 08:45 | <andythenorth> | planetmaker: it's pretty tricky :P |
| 08:45 | <andythenorth> | the ones that can build on slopes, do |
| 08:45 | <KittenKoder> | Oil wells build anywhere. |
| 08:46 | <@planetmaker> | we just convert the whole set from nfo to NML. Which will be done with 0.7 coming out |
| 08:46 | <@planetmaker> | andythenorth: of course it is |
| 08:46 | <KittenKoder> | I love the oil wells in FIRS. |
| 08:46 | <andythenorth> | it has been often discussed to have the game terraform better for industry |
| 08:46 | <@planetmaker> | not everything would be buildable on slopes. But... |
| 08:46 | <@planetmaker> | andythenorth: no terraform. Just proper sprites ;-) |
| 08:46 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 08:46 | <@planetmaker> | or often proper offsets would suffice |
| 08:46 | <andythenorth> | you have a secret plan? |
| 08:46 | <@planetmaker> | no :-P |
| 08:47 | <KittenKoder> | I think the toyland should be replaced with "mixed" and have industries with specific terrain preferences. |
| 08:47 | <@planetmaker> | But things like junk yard could do w/o foundations |
| 08:47 | <KittenKoder> | But that may be a bit too much to ask at this point. |
| 08:47 | <CIA-2> | OpenTTD: alberth * r22743 /trunk/src/aircraft_cmd.cpp: -Fix [FS#4696]: Make aircraft point to the exit when leaving the hangar. |
| 08:47 | <@planetmaker> | and maybe houses of a larger industry could go for different slopes, too |
| 08:47 | <andythenorth> | planetmaker: the only way proposed so far requires drawing ~22 sprites per tile |
| 08:47 | <@planetmaker> | allow something more in those cases |
| 08:47 | <@Terkhen> | KittenKoder: OpenGFX+ Industries allows you to customize which default industries you want to use, regardless of climate |
| 08:47 | <@planetmaker> | andythenorth: there's 19 slopes exactly :-P |
| 08:47 | <andythenorth> | although junk yard might be a special case as it's similar to forests + fruit plantations |
| 08:48 | <@planetmaker> | you grossly overestimate the work by 15% :-P |
| 08:48 | <andythenorth> | junk yard is mostly fences and vehicles |
| 08:48 | <KittenKoder> | Terkhen, I believe you missed my point. ;) |
| 08:48 | <andythenorth> | if we restricted certain tiles to flat....&& someone drew the ground tile, it could build on slopes... |
| 08:48 | <@planetmaker> | KittenKoder: how so? |
| 08:49 | <andythenorth> | mixed terrain |
| 08:49 | <andythenorth> | all-climates-one-climate |
| 08:49 | <KittenKoder> | ! |
| 08:49 | <KittenKoder> | ^ |
| 08:49 | <@Terkhen> | good luck with that :) |
| 08:49 | <KittenKoder> | Wrong symbol. |
| 08:49 | <KittenKoder> | As I said, it may be too much trouble for them, but it would be a nice touch. |
| 08:50 | <andythenorth> | planetmaker: any industry with large sliced buildings is a straight NO for slopes |
| 08:50 | <andythenorth> | some of the others might still be taught how to build on slopes though |
| 08:50 | <KittenKoder> | Thus forest based industries would be more inclined to appear in temperate terrain, mines in tropic and arctic, oil all over ... secondary clustered near towns, etc. |
| 08:51 | <@planetmaker> | andythenorth: yes, those building tiles don't go on slopes, of course |
| 08:51 | <KittenKoder> | Couldn't the industry sprites be broken like the oil wells but stuck together? |
| 08:51 | <andythenorth> | some can yes |
| 08:51 | <KittenKoder> | I think I saw a few junk yards that were on different levels. |
| 08:52 | <andythenorth> | lumber yard could *nearly* be taught to build on a slope |
| 08:52 | <KittenKoder> | Yeah, and I have a sawmill in two levels on that screen cap. |
| 08:52 | <andythenorth> | planetmaker: if you want to extend the slope-building, some industries will need two tiles instead of one |
| 08:53 | <@planetmaker> | maybe, yes |
| 08:53 | <@planetmaker> | I wouldn't die from that ;-) |
| 08:53 | <andythenorth> | no, we have enough tile IDs |
| 08:53 | <KittenKoder> | LOL |
| 08:53 | <andythenorth> | just mentioning as you guys are busy templating :P |
| 08:53 | <KittenKoder> | There is a lot of variety in FIRS already. |
| 08:53 | <@planetmaker> | do you really care about tileIDs? |
| 08:53 | <andythenorth> | yes and no |
| 08:53 | <@planetmaker> | we're at 1.1...1.3 per industry |
| 08:54 | <andythenorth> | the approach we use will stay within the limit |
| 08:54 | <@planetmaker> | giving each industry an average of 2 won't kill us |
| 08:54 | <andythenorth> | the limit is quite low |
| 08:54 | <@planetmaker> | 256 or so? |
| 08:54 | <andythenorth> | think so |
| 08:54 | <andythenorth> | might not be pooled though |
| 08:55 | <andythenorth> | 256 per grf |
| 08:55 | <andythenorth> | but 512 in total, including original |
| 08:55 | <@planetmaker> | 512 all in all 256 per grf |
| 08:55 | <andythenorth> | so no issue |
| 08:55 | <@planetmaker> | I don't say we should waste them. But we have sufficient space |
| 08:57 | <andythenorth> | metal foundry could also be taught to build on slopes |
| 08:57 | <andythenorth> | although there would be some odd appearance (not broken though) |
| 08:57 | <KittenKoder> | I like how the farms cluster if you allow multiple industries per town. |
| 08:57 | <andythenorth> | planetmaker: changing tile IDs is a savegame break though |
| 08:57 | <andythenorth> | so might be worth trying to do in 0.7 |
| 08:58 | <andythenorth> | I really want to avoid save game breaks from 0.7 onwards if possible |
| 08:58 | <KittenKoder> | Meh. |
| 09:05 | <andythenorth> | paper mill and sugar refinery could also be taught to build on slopes |
| 09:05 | <andythenorth> | although sugar refinery maybe shouldn't |
| 09:06 | <Rubidium> | you ought to use a major version number bump for breaking changes |
| 09:07 | <andythenorth> | like 1.0? :P |
| 09:07 | <Rubidium> | yep |
| 09:07 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 09:07 | <andythenorth> | if we get to 1.0, then we won't break version until 2.0 |
| 09:07 | <andythenorth> | unless it's a critical bug fix |
| 09:07 | <andythenorth> | but we're not at 1.0 yet, by a mile :| |
| 09:10 | <@planetmaker> | Rubidium: so far FIRS has been using the OpenTTD scheme: a.b.c where b is the "major" version and a the "super" version so to speak ;-) |
| 09:12 | <KittenKoder> | TGV are pretty. |
| 09:19 | <@Terkhen> | so 0.7 should be feature and industry complete already? |
| 09:22 | <andythenorth> | Terkhen: no |
| 09:22 | <andythenorth> | check the tickets :) |
| 09:22 | <andythenorth> | there are some remaining tasks |
| 09:23 | <@Terkhen> | none of those breaks savegame compatibility? |
| 09:23 | <andythenorth> | but after 0.7 I'm hoping to avoid changes to action 0 stuff |
| 09:23 | <andythenorth> | hopefully from 0.7 onwards, a lot of polishing can be done for 1.0 |
| 09:24 | <andythenorth> | leaving major game-breaking changes until 2.0 |
| 09:24 | <andythenorth> | I've played quite a bit with FIRS trunk, it's not rubbish anymore |
| 09:24 | <andythenorth> | still not good, but not rubbish |
| 09:27 | <andythenorth> | ~200 changes between 0.6.4 and 0.7, excluding nml conversion |
| 09:29 | <@Terkhen> | after 0.7 I want to add a framework to conditionally select industries, as done on OpenGFX+ Industries |
| 09:29 | <@Terkhen> | after that, economies should be easier |
| 09:29 | <@planetmaker> | That's economies, Terkhen |
| 09:29 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 09:29 | <@planetmaker> | not per industry, but per sector |
| 09:29 | <@Terkhen> | I know :P |
| 09:29 | <andythenorth> | economies == later :) |
| 09:29 | <@planetmaker> | each one individually doesn't make sense with FIRS imho |
| 09:29 | <@Terkhen> | andythenorth: yes, the framework by itself will do nothing |
| 09:30 | <andythenorth> | it needs to handle some other things, like probability and such |
| 09:30 | <andythenorth> | lots of action 6 or whatever :( |
| 09:30 | <KittenKoder> | What do you mean by economies in FIRS? |
| 09:30 | <@planetmaker> | emphasis on certain sectors |
| 09:30 | <andythenorth> | yes |
| 09:30 | <KittenKoder> | Aah. |
| 09:30 | <@Terkhen> | andythenorth: probability_ingame: (economy_param == whatever) ? 4 : 2; |
| 09:30 | <KittenKoder> | That would be cool. |
| 09:30 | <andythenorth> | so 'farming' economy |
| 09:31 | <andythenorth> | or 'city' economy |
| 09:31 | <andythenorth> | things that might vary: included industries, included cargos, cargo payment rates, probabilities |
| 09:31 | <@Terkhen> | andythenorth, planetmaker: what I meant is; include the code for conditionally including / disabling industries |
| 09:31 | <@Terkhen> | then that code gets tested as in theory it should do nothing |
| 09:32 | <KittenKoder> | Differing cargo payment rates for games would be nice ... |
| 09:32 | <@Terkhen> | therefore it makes sense to include it even before economies are done |
| 09:32 | <@planetmaker> | Terkhen: I've no problem with that |
| 09:32 | <@Terkhen> | this should be done after 0.7 (so we can identify bugs caused by conversion more easily) but before economies are introduced (to get some testing) |
| 09:33 | <@Terkhen> | and yes, custom cargo payment rate methods would be nice |
| 09:33 | <@Terkhen> | I want to do some for OpenGFX+ Industries, but I have no clue of what mechanics they should follow :) |
| 09:33 | <@planetmaker> | :-) |
| 09:33 | <KittenKoder> | Right now when I look at the industry layout my eyes just jump straight to the highest pay, lowest cost industry connections. It'd be nice to get tripped up more. |
| 09:34 | * | andythenorth afk |
| 09:36 | <andythenorth> | Terkhen: maybe include disable / enable for 0.7.x |
| 09:36 | <andythenorth> | and then try and get n economies done for 0.8 |
| 09:36 | <@Terkhen> | hmm... ok :) |
| 09:36 | <@Terkhen> | I'll start with that once that the conversion is complete |
| 09:37 | <@planetmaker> | hm... I'm not sure... I think 0.7 should not go for too much |
| 09:41 | <andythenorth> | I wasn't thinking for 0.7.0 ;) |
| 09:41 | <andythenorth> | and 0.7.1 is likely to be a bug fix release |
| 09:41 | <andythenorth> | but maybe after that |
| 09:43 | <@Terkhen> | ok :P |
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| 11:48 | <WMP> | how to use http://wiki.openttd.org/Autoreplace ? I havent replace vehicles |
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| 11:49 | <@Alberth> | did you setup a replacement? |
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| 11:50 | <@Alberth> | ie open the window as shown in the 2nd picture, and press 'start replacing' at the bottom left |
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| 11:51 | <WMP> | i havent replacement |
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| 11:51 | <WMP> | how to setup this? |
| 11:51 | <@Alberth> | after you have done that, vehicles for which you set up a replacement will get replaced when they visit a depot |
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| 11:52 | <@Alberth> | you can send one manually to the depot as test |
| 11:53 | <WMP> | i send all vehicles |
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| 11:53 | <WMP> | but i havent installed replacement |
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| 11:54 | <@Alberth> | then nothing gets replaced, first open the window shown at the 2nd picture (by clicking at 'replace vehicles' as shown in the first picture) |
| 11:54 | <WMP> | and i havent replace vehicles |
| 11:55 | <@Alberth> | then at the left, select the engine you currently have, at the right the engine you want to have |
| 11:55 | <WMP> | version: OpenTTD 1.1.2-RC2 |
| 11:55 | <@Alberth> | WMP: I don't understand where you are stuck |
| 11:55 | <@Alberth> | can you open the window as shown at the 2nd picture? |
| 11:56 | <WMP> | O |
| 11:56 | <WMP> | i'm blink ;) |
| 11:56 | <WMP> | ok, no rpoblem ;) |
| 11:56 | <test> | Sorry for the many connection attempts. Finding a client for an old phone isnt so easy. :p |
| 11:57 | <@Alberth> | WMP: Alberth: then at the left, select the engine you currently have, at the right the engine you want to have |
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| 11:58 | <@Alberth> | then press 'start replacing' at the bottom left |
| 11:58 | <@Alberth> | did you do that? |
| 11:58 | <WMP> | Alberth: is posisble to replace rail to maglev? |
| 11:58 | <@Alberth> | rail, sure |
| 11:58 | <@Alberth> | switch to maglev tracks, and use 'update' |
| 11:59 | <@Alberth> | http://wiki.openttd.org/Convert_rail |
| 11:59 | <WMP> | i think about rail vehicle |
| 11:59 | <@Alberth> | euhm, it's called 'convert' instead of 'update' :) |
| 11:59 | <WMP> | to maglevel vehicle |
| 12:00 | <@Alberth> | no, not possible |
| 12:00 | <WMP> | ughhh... |
| 12:00 | <@Alberth> | as the old engine has to be in a different depot then the new one |
| 12:00 | <@Alberth> | but you can build a maglev depot, build one train, and clone all others |
| 12:01 | <test> | And we dont have multi-tile depots. |
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| 12:02 | <WMP> | ohhh... |
| 12:02 | <@Alberth> | test: and even then, you'd need to define replacement of all vehicles, not just the engine |
| 12:02 | <WMP> | so i must make 50 new train.... |
| 12:03 | <@Alberth> | I don't upgrade, and build a new rail system next to the existing one |
| 12:03 | <@Alberth> | gtg, food is ready now :) |
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| 13:27 | <Ammler> | WMP: there are newgrfs for that task |
| 13:48 | <andythenorth> | bonsoir |
| 13:49 | <__ln__> | seulement anglais |
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| 13:59 | <andythenorth> | pas de anglais |
| 14:00 | <__ln__> | voilà la baguette |
| 14:01 | <andythenorth> | ici un chien |
| 14:03 | <__ln__> | três bien |
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| 15:05 | <Ragnoff> | Wow, a lot more people than i expected! |
| 15:08 | <frosch123> | hello no 100 |
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| 15:28 | <pjpe> | is there any major glaring bugs that would make the nightly 2cc right now not a great idea to play with |
| 15:28 | <pjpe> | over the 2.0 beta |
| 15:29 | <@Terkhen> | I don't know, the 2cc thread might be a better place to ask that |
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| 15:53 | <frosch123> | what? a wagon cots 592 to buy, and 2460 to refit :o |
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| 15:54 | <@Terkhen> | companies prefer that you buy new stuff :) |
| 15:55 | <frosch123> | well, that's bad. that mean i am bankrupt :s |
| 15:55 | <frosch123> | build my first route and just managed to buy the engine and vehicles |
| 15:55 | <frosch123> | and now i have no money to refit :p |
| 15:56 | <@Terkhen> | hmm... with what train set? |
| 15:56 | <frosch123> | serbian standard gauge |
| 15:56 | <@Terkhen> | never heard of it :P |
| 15:56 | <@Terkhen> | sounds like a bug to me |
| 15:56 | <frosch123> | i just picked some set :) |
| 15:56 | <@Terkhen> | or a wrong design decision maybe |
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| 16:06 | <frosch123> | at least wagons with a capacity of 5 bags of gold have very quick loading/unloading :) |
| 16:10 | <frosch123> | hmm, refit costs are added to "running costs" in the finance window |
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| 16:17 | <@Terkhen> | sounds expensive :P |
| 16:18 | <frosch123> | yeah, now using ogfx+trains :) |
| 16:18 | <frosch123> | it would have taken 5 years to get the money for the next train |
| 16:22 | <@Terkhen> | :P |
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| 17:03 | <Wolf01> | 'night |
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| 17:34 | -!- | pjpe [ae5b4e4d@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd |
| 17:34 | <pjpe> | there's some uh |
| 17:34 | <pjpe> | interesting stuff on that 2cc repository |
| 17:34 | <pjpe> | http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/445/n550215534_742602_265.jpg |
| 17:34 | <pjpe> | http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/443/2651_92303585534_550215534_2823429_2216621_n.jpg |
| 17:34 | <pjpe> | O_O |
| 17:35 | <@Terkhen> | good night |
| 17:36 | <@planetmaker> | luckily it's not the 2cc _repo_ |
| 17:36 | <@planetmaker> | learn to know the main coder's wife there |
| 17:40 | <pjpe> | learn to know? |
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| 17:42 | <@planetmaker> | whatever "meet" or... how you like |
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| 18:07 | <frosch123> | night |
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| 20:09 | <Sacro> | Should you be able to use rcon to move clients into passworded companies? |
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| 20:12 | <Sacro> | @seen Bjarni |
| 20:12 | <@DorpsGek> | Sacro: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 19 weeks, 6 days, 0 hours, 50 minutes, and 32 seconds ago: <Bjarni> thanks |
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| 20:37 | -!- | Uncle [~lelkoun@109-183-200-238.tmcz.cz] has joined #openttd |
| 20:37 | <Uncle> | hi guys |
| 20:38 | <Uncle> | what do you think about this station? https://p.twimg.com/AWxHRg6CQAMU2NV.png |
| 20:38 | <Uncle> | trains can use all 4 platforms in both directions :) |
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| 21:50 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Sacro: why shouldn't you? |
| 21:53 | <pjpe> | lmao |
| 21:53 | <pjpe> | griefing the shit out of someone |
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| 22:30 | <pjpe> | are town replacement grfs exclusive? |
| 22:30 | <pjpe> | or can you have a bunch on at once? |
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| --- | Log | closed Sun Aug 14 00:00:27 2011 |
