| --- | Log | opened Wed Oct 26 00:00:14 2011 |
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| 02:30 | <Terkhen> | good morning |
| 02:37 | -!- | sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.27.160] has joined #openttd |
| 03:04 | <planetmaker> | moin |
| 03:06 | -!- | Celestar [~dax@48.121.113.82.net.de.o2.com] has joined #openttd |
| 03:07 | <Celestar> | \o |
| 03:08 | <planetmaker> | hello Celestar |
| 03:22 | <Terkhen> | hi planetmaker and Celestar |
| 03:23 | <Ammler> | Hi Terkhen |
| 03:24 | * | MINM waves |
| 03:28 | <blathijs> | Morning |
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| 03:29 | <planetmaker> | salut Ammler, blathijs, MINM |
| 03:34 | <Terkhen> | hi Ammler and blathijs :P |
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| 04:05 | <Celestar> | ... |
| 04:05 | <Celestar> | I hate indian coders..... |
| 04:06 | <Celestar> | if ($spid==500) write_output("500"); elsif ($spid==501) write_output("501"); elsif ($spid==502) write_output("502") .... |
| 04:06 | <Celestar> | 45 more lines of this follow. |
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| 04:06 | <@peter1138> | uh what |
| 04:06 | <planetmaker> | :-D |
| 04:07 | <@peter1138> | do they get paid per line? :S |
| 04:10 | <Celestar> | peter1138: I hope so, because that would be the only semi-sane explanation... |
| 04:11 | <Celestar> | Make absolutely sure the reader totally understands that the function |
| 04:11 | <Celestar> | does something, but leave him in the dark as to what "something" is: |
| 04:11 | <Celestar> | sub do_perform_action { |
| 04:12 | <@peter1138> | openttd has a funny one |
| 04:12 | <@peter1138> | ReallyDoDrawString() |
| 04:12 | <Celestar> | yeah :) |
| 04:12 | <Celestar> | but I also found this : |
| 04:12 | <Celestar> | switch($pz_arguments->{NoOfDigit}) { |
| 04:12 | <Celestar> | case 2 {$padded_value = sprintf("%02d", |
| 04:12 | <Celestar> | $pz_arguments->{Number});} |
| 04:12 | <Celestar> | case 3 {$padded_value = sprintf("%03d", |
| 04:12 | <Celestar> | $pz_arguments->{Number});} |
| 04:12 | <Celestar> | case 4 {$padded_value = sprintf("%04d", |
| 04:12 | <Celestar> | $pz_arguments->{Number});} |
| 04:12 | <Celestar> | ...goes all the way up to 20. |
| 04:13 | <DDR_> | The Daily WTF |
| 04:13 | <DDR_> | Now brought to you by Celestar. |
| 04:13 | <Celestar> | I have a year's worth of WTFs from reviewing this code. |
| 04:14 | <DDR_> | Also: Well, at least he used a switch, and not a bunch of if...else...s |
| 04:14 | <DDR_> | Who's code are you looking at, anyway? |
| 04:14 | <Celestar> | well... |
| 04:15 | <Celestar> | an Indian development center |
| 04:15 | <Celestar> | I'm supposed to be quality assurance for their code. |
| 04:15 | <Celestar> | which is pretty easy a job tbh. |
| 04:15 | <Celestar> | because it's utterly worthless |
| 04:16 | <Celestar> | so spotting errors isn't .. hard. |
| 04:18 | <Celestar> | so I'm sending the shit back all the time. |
| 04:18 | <Celestar> | I'm just losing track of u |
| 04:19 | <Celestar> | ... |
| 04:19 | <Celestar> | brb |
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| 04:19 | <Terkhen> | I also hope that they are paid per line :P |
| 04:21 | <Celestar> | honestly, I hope they're not payed at all |
| 04:21 | <Terkhen> | :D |
| 04:23 | <Celestar> | http://pastebin.com/rzd3CZ5T |
| 04:25 | <Celestar> | this part was apparently "code reviewed" |
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| 04:32 | <@peter1138> | that appears to be checking if a number will fit in a signed 32 bit integer |
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| 05:26 | <Celestar> | peter1138: that is exactly it. |
| 05:26 | <Celestar> | peter1138: in perl |
| 05:26 | <Celestar> | not that a ($number > 2^31) you know :P |
| 05:28 | <Celestar> | that's the problem with those languages. Any idiot can start hacking away and call himself "developer" |
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| 05:29 | * | LordAro waves :D |
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| 06:25 | <Arafangion> | Hmm. Food, movie, or openttd... |
| 06:25 | * | Arafangion can only pick two. |
| 06:26 | <planetmaker> | get a smartphone or tablet. Then you can have all three :-P |
| 06:27 | <Arafangion> | I have a smartphone, but I can't watch a movie *and* play openttd at teh same time! |
| 06:27 | <planetmaker> | though there are no official versions of OpenTTD for such devices |
| 06:27 | <planetmaker> | not? |
| 06:27 | <planetmaker> | hm |
| 06:27 | <Arafangion> | Certainly not while eating. |
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| 06:29 | <Eddi|zuHause> | get a PC, and you can totally do that |
| 06:29 | <Arafangion> | I have a PC. |
| 06:30 | <planetmaker> | then I indeed so nothing which stops all three activities persued at once :-) |
| 06:30 | <Arafangion> | Several, in fact, but openttd and the movie will each demand 100% focus. |
| 06:30 | <planetmaker> | lie ;-) |
| 06:30 | <Arafangion> | planetmaker: You are clearly a robot, or a girl. |
| 06:30 | <planetmaker> | Start a few AIs. Have them build for you and watch movie :-P |
| 06:30 | <planetmaker> | i.e. OpenTTD plays for you ;-) |
| 06:31 | <planetmaker> | lool :-) |
| 06:31 | <Arafangion> | planetmaker: Actually, I sometimes think about making an AI. |
| 06:31 | <planetmaker> | Arafangion: don't make a new one. Make an existing one better |
| 06:31 | <planetmaker> | (my 2ct. There are many AIs which are started. But very few very good ones) |
| 06:32 | <planetmaker> | much could be gained there by collaboration |
| 06:32 | <planetmaker> | I think |
| 06:32 | <Arafangion> | Point. |
| 06:32 | <Arafangion> | But AI's tend to be very particular. |
| 06:32 | <planetmaker> | in what way? |
| 06:32 | <Arafangion> | The way the logic's implemented, for instance. |
| 06:32 | <Arafangion> | I'd prefer a fuzzy logic system. |
| 06:34 | <planetmaker> | even that in itself does not lend itself automatically to "write an AI from scratch" |
| 06:36 | <Arafangion> | Well, you could reuse pathfinding algorithms, etc. |
| 06:36 | <Arafangion> | But the AI rules are completely dependant on the engine. Change the engine, heck, add or remove rules, and all the other rules have to be changed. (Or at the least, tweaked) |
| 06:37 | <V453000> | it might be easier to teach someone to play as you want :P |
| 06:37 | <Arafangion> | Impossible. |
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| 07:10 | <Eddi|zuHause> | why's my ICQ connection so unstable lately? |
| 07:16 | -!- | George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd |
| 07:17 | <Celestar> | same here |
| 07:17 | <Celestar> | for a few weeks now even |
| 07:17 | * | planetmaker ceased to use ICQ. Some time ago |
| 07:21 | <TrueBrain> | what? ICQ still exists?! |
| 07:23 | <MINM> | irc still exists. |
| 07:25 | * | blathijs stopped using ICQ when his account stopped working all of the sudden... |
| 07:28 | <Celestar> | yeah |
| 07:28 | <Celestar> | same :P |
| 07:28 | <@peter1138> | they like to fiddle the protocol |
| 07:28 | <@peter1138> | but nobody uses the official client these days |
| 07:28 | <@peter1138> | nobody uses it these days :p |
| 07:29 | -!- | Dany0 [5ab27afe@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd |
| 07:30 | <Dany0> | hey guys, quick question, what was the angle of dimetric projection openttd uses again? |
| 07:33 | <__ln__> | he's back! \o/ |
| 07:33 | <Dany0> | seriously, please |
| 07:34 | <Dany0> | how do you remember me? |
| 07:36 | <planetmaker> | hard not to ;-) |
| 07:37 | <Dany0> | ? so can you tell me the angle |
| 07:37 | <planetmaker> | it's one px up and two to the side |
| 07:37 | <Dany0> | or at least the sprite reference |
| 07:38 | <planetmaker> | just look at one of the many ground sprites... it tells you all you need basically |
| 07:38 | <planetmaker> | athttp://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/PalettesAndCoordinates#Coordinates |
| 07:38 | <planetmaker> | *and |
| 07:40 | <planetmaker> | iirc it's 26.5° as that's said to be the angle for one up = two horizontal. But I never bothered to verify. |
| 07:40 | <Celestar> | draw it :P |
| 07:41 | <Celestar> | it's not isometric :P |
| 07:42 | <planetmaker> | that's why it's called dimetric, Celestar ;-) |
| 07:42 | <planetmaker> | No-one said isometric |
| 07:42 | <Celestar> | I read it somewhere in some docu :P |
| 07:43 | <Celestar> | can't remember where (= |
| 07:45 | <@peter1138> | oh hey Dany0 |
| 07:45 | <@peter1138> | so is it still not a sloped sprite? |
| 07:45 | <planetmaker> | http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/opengfx/repository/entry/sprites/png/terrain/field_haybales.png <-- you also have here the 19 possible ground tiles |
| 07:46 | <planetmaker> | the first is the flat ground tile |
| 07:46 | <Dany0> | Tim asks if it's worth the work |
| 07:46 | <planetmaker> | which gives you the dimensions for a tile |
| 07:46 | <planetmaker> | one height level is 8px |
| 07:46 | <Dany0> | (I think what he says is that he's worried no one would buy qubicle for openttd) |
| 07:47 | <@peter1138> | who's Tim? |
| 07:47 | <planetmaker> | and "worth the work" is in the eye of the beholder. You need to have fun. But actually buy stuff? |
| 07:47 | <Dany0> | peter1138: maker of qubicle |
| 07:47 | <Celestar> | michi_cc: you about? |
| 07:48 | <+michi_cc> | Celestar: I am |
| 07:48 | <planetmaker> | Dany0: the question is then: what would I gain by using "cubicles" and *whatever* software? |
| 07:48 | <planetmaker> | Over what I have now |
| 07:48 | <Celestar> | michi_cc: I'm still pondering about the map array. You said that moving m7 into Tile reduced performance by a significant amount? |
| 07:49 | <Dany0> | there is no fucking cubicles! |
| 07:49 | <@peter1138> | Dany0, i was impressed by the way you lined up a sprite, rotated it a bit, and used that as the size of the new qubicle object as if it was somehow relevant |
| 07:49 | <Dany0> | -.-' |
| 07:49 | <+michi_cc> | Celestar: Last comment on http://bugs.openttd.org/task/3789 |
| 07:49 | <Dany0> | 1. it's called a voxel |
| 07:49 | <Celestar> | thanks (= |
| 07:49 | <planetmaker> | ok, calm down |
| 07:49 | <Dany0> | 2. a voxel is not a cube |
| 07:49 | <Dany0> | 3. minecraft is not a voxel game |
| 07:50 | <Terkhen> | heh :P |
| 07:50 | <Dany0> | 4. polygons suck |
| 07:50 | <Dany0> | 5. qubicle is better then Blender for sure |
| 07:50 | <planetmaker> | you can rant on or focus on the real question of "what would I gain"? |
| 07:50 | <Celestar> | michi_cc: 7% in the tile loop alone sounds a lot. |
| 07:51 | <Celestar> | michi_cc: any idea what exactly causes it? |
| 07:51 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: it's better then blender, faster do do, easier and much faster to render |
| 07:51 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: but you can't batch export |
| 07:51 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: and it doesn't save as *.pcx |
| 07:51 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: it works in wine 100% platinum I'd say |
| 07:51 | <@peter1138> | saving as pcx is irrelevant |
| 07:51 | <planetmaker> | ^ |
| 07:51 | <MINM> | oh god, is he back? |
| 07:52 | <Dany0> | how do you remember me? |
| 07:52 | <Dany0> | I don't even remember half of you |
| 07:52 | <@peter1138> | any non-lossy image format is good |
| 07:52 | <Dany0> | peter1138: yes no problem there |
| 07:52 | <planetmaker> | Dany0: people who fall in a rant that easily are easily remembered ;-) |
| 07:52 | <Dany0> | well all I can say is |
| 07:52 | <Dany0> | I never ranted? |
| 07:52 | <Dany0> | never mind |
| 07:52 | <Dany0> | Tim said this: |
| 07:52 | <+michi_cc> | Two simple factors: Worse cache behavior and the fact that the x86 instruction set allows max *8 in a single address calculation. So for anything with a stride > 8 you need at least two instructions for every memory access. |
| 07:52 | <Dany0> | if you guys go, and try out the basic edition |
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| 07:53 | <Dany0> | and if you like it |
| 07:53 | <bondau> | Hello :) |
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| 07:53 | <planetmaker> | Dany0: the system requirements are already a fail for me ;-) |
| 07:53 | <bondau> | long time play, first time IRCer |
| 07:54 | <Dany0> | and you're willing to pay for it(I don't support it though, I think the basic edition is sufficient enough) |
| 07:54 | <planetmaker> | you'd need to give me an OSX one |
| 07:54 | <Dany0> | and you make a topic in feature requests |
| 07:54 | <Dany0> | he will do it |
| 07:54 | <@peter1138> | who are you talking to though? |
| 07:55 | <@peter1138> | graphic artists? |
| 07:55 | <Dany0> | everyone? |
| 07:55 | <@peter1138> | they're the people who use the tools |
| 07:55 | <Dany0> | who's willing to make sprites |
| 07:56 | <planetmaker> | The best way to convince people, I think, might be to actually start using it for this sprite purposes and post in the graphics development section |
| 07:56 | <Dany0> | I am no artist sorry |
| 07:56 | <MINM> | for some reason http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/opengfx/repository/entry/sprites/png/terrain/field_haybales.png forces me to download the png :S |
| 07:56 | <Dany0> | plus it can't render dimetric yet |
| 07:57 | <planetmaker> | http://www.tt-forums.net/viewforum.php?f=68 <-- probably here |
| 07:57 | <@peter1138> | is it perspective then? |
| 07:57 | <planetmaker> | MINM: yes, it might do that |
| 07:58 | <Dany0> | peter1138: no it's isometric |
| 07:58 | <planetmaker> | it only shows for me with the appropriate FF plug-in |
| 07:58 | <Dany0> | peter1138: it's all ortographic |
| 07:58 | <Dany0> | so far |
| 07:58 | <@peter1138> | i thought i saw you move the angle around |
| 07:58 | <planetmaker> | it's also not meant to be an image galery. Just the web-interface of the repo |
| 07:58 | <Dany0> | it's possible he will add perspective to enable minecraft/slab6-like modelling, but it's just in the clouds |
| 07:59 | <planetmaker> | Well. Di-metric is what we need |
| 07:59 | <planetmaker> | MINM: and interestingly it shows in the preview in my irc client ;-) |
| 08:00 | <planetmaker> | MINM: I use the 'Open in Browser' add-on |
| 08:00 | <Dany0> | ok so Tim promised dimetric will be in next or after next version |
| 08:01 | <Eddi|zuHause> | dimetric with very odd stretching factors for each dimension |
| 08:01 | <planetmaker> | It makes sense, Dany0. It's the most common sprite perspective |
| 08:01 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: you mean globally? |
| 08:01 | <planetmaker> | yes |
| 08:02 | <planetmaker> | as it's easy to draw rectangles in it |
| 08:02 | <planetmaker> | without looking too bad |
| 08:02 | <@peter1138> | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_games_with_isometric_graphics |
| 08:03 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: are you sure? |
| 08:03 | <planetmaker> | no |
| 08:03 | <Dany0> | I think the most common is isometric and classic side-view |
| 08:03 | <Dany0> | oh |
| 08:03 | <Dany0> | and he promised |
| 08:03 | <Eddi|zuHause> | the dimetric that openttd uses is very common |
| 08:03 | <Dany0> | qubicle will ship with the OpenTTD palette |
| 08:03 | <@peter1138> | when people say "isometric" in the context of computer games, they mean dimetric |
| 08:04 | <Eddi|zuHause> | it fits neatly in screen coordinates when diagonal lines |
| 08:04 | <Eddi|zuHause> | have 2px left/right and 1px up/down |
| 08:04 | <Dany0> | ok guys if you think so I'll believe you |
| 08:04 | <Eddi|zuHause> | that results in an angle of 26.5° |
| 08:04 | <@peter1138> | maybe you should read that wikipedia link :) |
| 08:04 | <Eddi|zuHause> | which is slightly smaller than the "original" isometric angle of 30° |
| 08:05 | <Dany0> | peter1138: I've been there lots of times, thanks |
| 08:05 | <@peter1138> | are you sure? you wouldn't've just asked that question if you'd read it. |
| 08:05 | <planetmaker> | to be precise, the angle is atan(0.5) |
| 08:05 | <Eddi|zuHause> | peter1138: i'd see that phrase like "yes, i did read the readme" :p |
| 08:05 | <planetmaker> | or so |
| 08:06 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: thanks |
| 08:06 | <Eddi|zuHause> | well, i did explain that already 2 days ago... |
| 08:06 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=atan%280.5%29 ? |
| 08:07 | <planetmaker> | Dany0: if you read the wiki link, you'd not need calculate ;-) |
| 08:08 | <Dany0> | you need more accuracy |
| 08:08 | <bondau> | Hey Guys, so im thinking of setting up an OpenTTD server, what kind of bandwidth do they use? |
| 08:09 | <Dany0> | bondau: last time I checked(~2 years ago) 2megs are good for 4 players |
| 08:09 | <planetmaker> | bondau: 2kbit / client and map downloads. iirc |
| 08:09 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: am I right? |
| 08:10 | <Eddi|zuHause> | but i seriously fail to see the point... you combine the disadvantages of pixel-pushing with the disadvantages of 3D-rendering, without any of the benefits... |
| 08:11 | <bondau> | well |
| 08:11 | <Dany0> | you know unlimited detail technology? |
| 08:11 | <bondau> | 2kbit... aplay |
| 08:11 | <bondau> | is pretty nice |
| 08:12 | <Eddi|zuHause> | bondau: the initial map download may be up to 4MB for large maps |
| 08:12 | <bondau> | pffft |
| 08:12 | <planetmaker> | there speed matters |
| 08:12 | <bondau> | its on a 50mb/50mb connection |
| 08:12 | <planetmaker> | millibit? ;-) |
| 08:12 | <bondau> | haha |
| 08:12 | <Eddi|zuHause> | bondau: usually the limit is the client's download |
| 08:13 | <Eddi|zuHause> | unless you have like 10 people joining simultaneously |
| 08:13 | <planetmaker> | Eddi|zuHause: that'd not happen iirc. they're then queued |
| 08:13 | <planetmaker> | unless that changed |
| 08:15 | <Eddi|zuHause> | well... whatever |
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| 08:15 | -!- | mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ |
| 08:20 | <Dany0> | Eddi|zuHause: hey |
| 08:23 | <Celestar> | michi_cc: hm... I'm also wondering how to find "neighbors" fast. |
| 08:24 | <Dany0> | Eddi|zuHause: are you there? |
| 08:25 | <Celestar> | bondau: the kbits/client are independent of map size, the initial connect, of course not :) |
| 08:26 | <bondau> | kk |
| 08:30 | <bondau> | im starting a sever, and a few mates of mine want to run a comp for the game at a lan party |
| 08:30 | <bondau> | in a teams of 4 style |
| 08:30 | <bondau> | or 8 |
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| 08:30 | <bondau> | they think 8 might get a bit hectic |
| 08:30 | <Dany0> | I've never played OTTD co-op in my life :( |
| 08:30 | <Dany0> | always wanted to |
| 08:31 | <@peter1138> | Dany0, yes, it's bullshit |
| 08:31 | <@peter1138> | (unlimited detail) |
| 08:33 | <Celestar> | what is BS? coop? :P |
| 08:33 | <@peter1138> | i stated afterwards :S |
| 08:33 | <Dany0> | peter1138: not to you, and I know it's bullshit |
| 08:33 | <Celestar> | sorry. hugeass lag :P |
| 08:34 | <bondau> | so co-op isnt good? |
| 08:34 | <planetmaker> | ... |
| 08:34 | <Celestar> | coop rocks |
| 08:34 | <SpComb> | coop is the only way to play |
| 08:34 | <Dany0> | !slap Eddi|zuHause |
| 08:35 | <Celestar> | except for the first 10 minutes when you wait for money to come in :P |
| 08:35 | <planetmaker> | Dany0: it usually helps much better to ask a question than to pester someone to "answer" with a "Yes, I'm here" |
| 08:35 | <bondau> | haha okay good, because another one of them wants to start an online ladder for it |
| 08:35 | <bondau> | haha |
| 08:35 | <Eddi|zuHause> | i should get my special friends list, i think |
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| 08:36 | <planetmaker> | he :-P |
| 08:36 | <Eddi|zuHause> | "people who are on the wrong side of the von moltke scheme" |
| 08:36 | * | planetmaker also usually ignores information-less ping requests |
| 08:37 | <planetmaker> | err, what, Eddi|zuHause? |
| 08:37 | <Eddi|zuHause> | which clearly this is a prime example of |
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| 08:38 | <Celestar> | wtf is the von Moltke Scheme? |
| 08:38 | <MINM> | von moltke scheme? |
| 08:39 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: I asked the question already |
| 08:39 | <Dany0> | Eddi|zuHause: do you know unlimited detail technology? |
| 08:39 | <MINM> | I googled, but got nothing meaningful. |
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| 08:39 | <MINM> | yes, Dany0 |
| 08:39 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: von moltke was a prussian general who divided his soldiers into 4 categories. intelligent/active, intelligent/lazy, stupid/lazy and stupid/active |
| 08:39 | <MINM> | most people call it 'analog' |
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| 08:39 | <planetmaker> | Dany0: that's also hardly a meaningful question |
| 08:40 | <planetmaker> | he... I never heart of that, Eddi|zuHause :-) |
| 08:40 | <Eddi|zuHause> | where intelligent/active would become great generals, intelligent/lazy good officers, stupid/lazy good foot soldiers, and stupid/active you should stay clear of, because they distract everybody else from doing real work |
| 08:41 | <Celestar> | well |
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| 08:41 | <MINM> | lol, eddi |
| 08:41 | <Celestar> | I'm assuming the distribution was about 5%, 10%, 30%, 55% ? |
| 08:41 | <MINM> | I suppose you call stupid/active the wrong side? |
| 08:42 | <planetmaker> | lol indeed :-) |
| 08:43 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: i don't have statistics, but about 1%, 10%, 70%, 19% would be my guess. depends on which group you look at, and where your "average" is |
| 08:43 | <Celestar> | hehehe. |
| 08:44 | <Eddi|zuHause> | or 80%/9%, would still be bad enough |
| 08:44 | <Celestar> | lol |
| 08:44 | <Eddi|zuHause> | that would mean around 1 stupid/active person to distract 1 intelligent/lazy person from doing their work |
| 08:44 | <Eddi|zuHause> | meaning only 2% of people have the chance to bring civilization forward in any way |
| 08:45 | <MINM> | that's why you use the stupid lazy to keep away the stupid active |
| 08:46 | <Eddi|zuHause> | it doesn't quite work that way... |
| 08:46 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: I'd have guessed that'd be about 5% .. but ok (= |
| 08:46 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: 83% of statistics are made up on the spot |
| 08:47 | <MINM> | eddi: that's why you use the encapsulating tactic. |
| 08:47 | <Celestar> | rofl |
| 08:47 | <MINM> | surround stupid-active with enough stupid-lazy, and the stupid-lazy will absorb any idiot actions for ya. |
| 08:47 | <Eddi|zuHause> | MINM: stupid/lazy are the "don't care"s of that calculation (pun intended) |
| 08:48 | <MINM> | I know, that's exactly how you use them |
| 08:49 | <Eddi|zuHause> | MINM: the problem is that stupid/active people get promoted to higher positions before you realize that they really fall into that category |
| 08:49 | <Eddi|zuHause> | MINM: at which point no stupid/lazy people are in the way |
| 08:49 | <Celestar> | yes. |
| 08:50 | <Celestar> | which book did he write that in? |
| 08:50 | <Eddi|zuHause> | dunno |
| 08:50 | <MINM> | that's why one should always promote to a harmless spot first |
| 08:50 | <Celestar> | there are no such spots. |
| 08:50 | <Celestar> | everyone can do damage. |
| 08:51 | <Celestar> | the question is only "how much" |
| 08:51 | <MINM> | The chief commander of the home guard can do less damage than the chief commander of the atlantic navy |
| 08:52 | <Celestar> | less damage. yes. |
| 08:52 | <Celestar> | but not "no damage" |
| 08:52 | <Celestar> | and I think the categorization of people works very well outside of the armed forces. |
| 08:52 | <Celestar> | look at large corporations. |
| 08:52 | <Celestar> | 90% of the middle and upper management positions are filled with stupid/active people. |
| 08:52 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yes, that's why it is such a great scheme, actually |
| 08:53 | <Celestar> | and the other 10% are basically busy cleaning up the mess that the 90% make. |
| 08:53 | <Eddi|zuHause> | if the HR departments are aware of it, it makes hiring processes much better focus on the good candidates |
| 08:53 | <Celestar> | where is in politics, 90% feels on the low side. |
| 08:54 | <MINM> | mehhhhh |
| 08:54 | <MINM> | 100% there |
| 08:54 | <MINM> | anyone smart/active knows there are better positions to get, and the smart/lazy know to steer well clear from politics |
| 08:55 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: assuming that the HR are not made of mostly stupid people, which they are, so you are in kind of a vicious circle there. |
| 08:55 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: that's the problem, yes. |
| 08:55 | <Celestar> | because HR people hate to employ someone who they feel is smarter. |
| 08:56 | <MINM> | yeah, no way |
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| 08:56 | <MINM> | I see it with my brother, who works somewhere on the higher lower echelons of a supermarket chain |
| 08:57 | <MINM> | he's got more knowledge of the law than the legal department of the company. |
| 08:57 | <Celestar> | you know. prime example last week. They wanted to move my workplace from the 4th to the 6th floor. |
| 08:57 | <MINM> | and he doesn't even have his master yet |
| 08:57 | <Celestar> | Needless to say it would be faster to haul the shit up there myself, but they hired a company. |
| 08:57 | <Celestar> | and I had to mark stuff that I want moved. every fucking cable and everything. |
| 08:58 | <MINM> | ... |
| 08:58 | <Celestar> | when I came to my "new" workplace on Monday something was missing. |
| 08:58 | <Celestar> | Guess what? |
| 08:58 | <MINM> | I dunno |
| 08:58 | <MINM> | the desk? |
| 08:58 | <Celestar> | yep |
| 08:58 | <Celestar> | They forgot to move THE DESK. And apparently didn't have half a braincell to friggen notice. |
| 08:58 | <MINM> | couldn't you just tell the movers to jack off and help only if you want something heavy moved? |
| 08:59 | <Celestar> | they put the PC and monitor in front of the chair onto the floor. |
| 08:59 | <Celestar> | nah I wasn't there when it happened :P |
| 08:59 | <MINM> | ...morons |
| 08:59 | <MINM> | well, actually, it's not the movers who are the morons here. |
| 08:59 | <Eddi|zuHause> | but that's more likely a stupid/lazy person at work |
| 09:00 | <Celestar> | so I'm not sure about the "active/lazy" scale, Eddi|zuHause but this is as stupid as it gets. |
| 09:00 | <MINM> | for all they know the desk would come later from another place. |
| 09:00 | <MINM> | the idiot occurrence here is that your management tells people to move your shit while you're not there |
| 09:00 | <Celestar> | well are are not allowed to move it ourselves. |
| 09:01 | <MINM> | seriously, people, who the fuck moves houses when you're on a vacation on the other side of the world? |
| 09:01 | <Celestar> | because, if we trip on the way from A to B, we might break our neck. |
| 09:01 | <MINM> | neither should one move desks while absent |
| 09:01 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: the difference is that stupid/lazy people only just "not do" the work, while stupid/active people actually do "the wrong" kind of work. which is orders of magnitude more difficult to clean up |
| 09:01 | <Celestar> | but that's not the problem. The problem is that the Keyboard i was carrying whilst might be broken and, as such, is not insured. |
| 09:03 | <Celestar> | and while you can always hire another consultant, obtaining a replacement keyboard is a herculan task. |
| 09:03 | <MINM> | celestar: what about you suing your company? |
| 09:03 | <MINM> | I think that's what they're most afraid of |
| 09:03 | <Celestar> | MINM: it's not my company :P |
| 09:03 | <Eddi|zuHause> | that's bureaucracy at work for you |
| 09:03 | <Celestar> | MINM: I'm just "external" |
| 09:03 | <MINM> | lol |
| 09:03 | <MINM> | ugh |
| 09:04 | <Celestar> | basically they paid me for sitting at a desk-less workplace :P |
| 09:04 | <MINM> | remind me to never ever get a 9-5 desk job |
| 09:04 | <Eddi|zuHause> | i'm more into 12-13 desk jobs |
| 09:04 | <MINM> | are you implying what I think you're implying? 0-o |
| 09:04 | <Celestar> | my company actually pretty much rocks. |
| 09:05 | <Celestar> | just some of the customers are .. weird :P |
| 09:05 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: I'm trying to explain eddi why is qubicle not a normal 3d editor and why it's so different from blender and so close to normal pixel-art |
| 09:05 | <MINM> | what kind of job do you have, then? |
| 09:05 | <Eddi|zuHause> | MINM: around here, people tend to rather have 7-15 jobs |
| 09:05 | <Dany0> | Eddi|zuHause: so do you or do you not know Unlimited Detail Technology |
| 09:05 | <Celestar> | I'm a tech consultant. Coding, Testing, etc etc |
| 09:06 | <Celestar> | but the whole company is a group of nerds :D |
| 09:06 | <Celestar> | which is kinda fun |
| 09:06 | <Eddi|zuHause> | MINM: which is rather a bit early for my taste |
| 09:06 | <MINM> | I know, me too |
| 09:06 | <Celestar> | i.e. having done a lot of openttd coding was more important to the BOSS during the interview than my grad student marks :P |
| 09:06 | <MINM> | though |
| 09:07 | <MINM> | while getting up early sucks hairy bananas, I do know that my focus is MUCH better in the morning. |
| 09:07 | <MINM> | after lunchtime Im usually a write-off. |
| 09:07 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: practical experience is always more important to people |
| 09:07 | <MINM> | it's either that or the graveyard shift |
| 09:07 | <b_jonas> | yeah |
| 09:07 | <Dany0> | Eddi|zuHause: hello? |
| 09:08 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: yeah, but we spent 3 hours (!) in the interview discussing openttd implementation details :P |
| 09:08 | <Eddi|zuHause> | ok... :) |
| 09:08 | <Dany0> | Eddi|zuHause: can you finally answer please? |
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| 09:11 | <MINM> | Celestar: the best way to verify of somebody is competent during interview is to make 'em think up something on the spot |
| 09:12 | <MINM> | EG write a quick piece of code, or, like our boss did, discuss implementation issues of OTTD |
| 09:14 | <Celestar> | yeah |
| 09:14 | <Celestar> | we had to write some code too |
| 09:15 | <Celestar> | my interview took 7 hours. |
| 09:15 | <Korenn> | a trusted reference makes things easier :) |
| 09:15 | <Eddi|zuHause> | with a lunch break? |
| 09:15 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: yeah. BBQ break actually (= |
| 09:15 | <Eddi|zuHause> | that's a whole work day |
| 09:15 | <Celestar> | yep |
| 09:18 | <Dany0> | Eddi|zuHause: hey! |
| 09:18 | <Dany0> | Eddi|zuHause: I asked you a question! |
| 09:18 | <Dany0> | Eddi|zuHause: AN HOUR AGO |
| 09:18 | <Dany0> | Eddi|zuHause: could you mind, ANSWERING IT, probably? Thank you. |
| 09:20 | <MINM> | BBQ interview? chiillll |
| 09:20 | <b_jonas> | Celestar: seven hour? nice |
| 09:20 | <MINM> | do you happen to have any need for somebody like me in the company? |
| 09:20 | <b_jonas> | when was that? |
| 09:20 | <+michi_cc> | There's also the Peter principle to promotions. People are usually promoted when they do a good job, but not when they do a bad job. Result: The highest management level people reach is the level where they don't do a good job anymore (otherwise they would've been promoted higher). As people are rarely demoted, most positions are filled with unsuitable people. |
| 09:20 | <Celestar> | well minus the break |
| 09:21 | <Eddi|zuHause> | michi_cc: yes, that's another problem |
| 09:21 | <Eddi|zuHause> | michi_cc: but you can resolve that by promoting "sideways" |
| 09:23 | <Celestar> | you solve that by sending people to retirement :P |
| 09:23 | <+michi_cc> | Yes, but the damage is often already done as it will take some time to notice somebody really is unsuitable. |
| 09:24 | <Eddi|zuHause> | i.e. give them a position where they have less responsibility, but give them a higher wage, so it doesn't look like a demotion |
| 09:24 | <Eddi|zuHause> | best combined with a longer title :) |
| 09:25 | <Dany0> | can somebody please wake up Eddi|zuHause |
| 09:25 | <Dany0> | ? |
| 09:25 | <b_jonas> | longer title doesn't make nerds happy. higher wage might help though. |
| 09:26 | <V453000> | Dany0: I get the feeling that you are not cared about... just saying |
| 09:28 | * | Celestar wakes Eddi|zuHause on Dany0'S behalf :P |
| 09:29 | <Eddi|zuHause> | i told you my office hours :) |
| 09:29 | -!- | mode/#openttd [+o orudge] by ChanServ |
| 09:29 | <MINM> | it's past 15, isnt it? |
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| 09:30 | <V453000> | it is past whatever. :P |
| 09:31 | <Celestar> | orudge!!!! |
| 09:31 | <@orudge> | Celestar!!!! |
| 09:31 | <@orudge> | long time no see |
| 09:32 | <Dany0> | ... |
| 09:34 | <appe> | appe!!!! |
| 09:35 | <appe> | http://s3.amazonaws.com/kym-assets/entries/icons/original/000/003/619/Untitled-1.jpg?1288903617 |
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| 09:44 | <MINM> | awww. |
| 09:44 | * | MINM patpats appe |
| 09:51 | <Dany0> | ok qubicle OpenTTD colour palette is done :) |
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| 09:57 | <Celestar> | orudge: how ya doing` |
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| 10:07 | <@orudge> | Celestar: pretty good |
| 10:08 | <Rubidium> | bonjour! |
| 10:08 | <Celestar> | Pongshure? |
| 10:14 | <planetmaker> | Panmunjeom? |
| 10:19 | <Celestar> | I wonder whether converting Tile to a union would cost performance |
| 10:21 | <b_jonas> | depends on what it's a union of |
| 10:21 | <Celestar> | so is it true the Dutch Railway abolished loos? |
| 10:21 | <Rubidium> | Celestar: in some trains |
| 10:22 | <Rubidium> | but apparantly they've done it in Germany as well |
| 10:22 | <b_jonas> | Celestar: isn't that airplans doing that? making them payware at least |
| 10:22 | <b_jonas> | s/airplans/airplanes/ |
| 10:22 | <Celestar> | Rubidium: well on suburban trains yes. |
| 10:22 | <Celestar> | b_jonas: only Ryanair. |
| 10:22 | <Celestar> | b_jonas: and that's not an airline |
| 10:23 | <Celestar> | and yeah, I consider the S-Bahn situtation unacceptable in Germany tbh. |
| 10:23 | <Rubidium> | Celestar: in the NL it's for non-intercities where most of the people are not more than 30 minutes on the train |
| 10:23 | <Celestar> | unless the train is delayed. |
| 10:23 | <Rubidium> | so that could be considered roughly the same as suburban trains |
| 10:24 | <Celestar> | what's so fucking hard about building toilets into trains ffs |
| 10:24 | <Rubidium> | and even then, only on the newer trains |
| 10:24 | <Rubidium> | Celestar: "it breaks the aesthetics of looking through the train from front to back" |
| 10:24 | <Celestar> | well PUT THEM ON THE SIDE |
| 10:25 | <Rubidium> | it's also the reason why the electronics are cooled with air from track level instead of the top of the train |
| 10:25 | <Rubidium> | i.e. why electronics are cooled with snow instead of cold air |
| 10:25 | <b_jonas> | oh, the first world problems we have |
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| 10:26 | <Eddi|zuHause> | that's what happens when uninformed people make design decisions |
| 10:26 | <Rubidium> | Celestar: but I see no real problems putting one at either end of the train next to the driver cab |
| 10:26 | <Celestar> | yeah |
| 10:27 | <Rubidium> | unless that shits up the safety systems |
| 10:27 | <@Belugas> | hello |
| 10:27 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Rubidium: but the drivers cab must have transparent back so you can see the track |
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| 10:27 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: that's a nice feature. |
| 10:27 | <Rubidium> | Eddi|zuHause: yeah... |
| 10:27 | <Rubidium> | and then they have curtains to close |
| 10:27 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: the BR403 and 406 have that. AND they have dunnies |
| 10:27 | <Rubidium> | but I doubt they can close them fast enough to not see someone all over the windscreen |
| 10:28 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: but you can't look all the way through an ICE3!! |
| 10:28 | <b_jonas> | curtains? I don't think that works |
| 10:29 | <Eddi|zuHause> | b_jonas: it can be made milky-intransparent by some electronic feature |
| 10:29 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: who cares? |
| 10:29 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: I wish they'd bring back compartments. |
| 10:30 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: I hate the fucking "Großraumwagen" |
| 10:30 | <Celestar> | and I don't see a reason why anyone could actually like them |
| 10:30 | <Eddi|zuHause> | never had any issues with that, honestly |
| 10:30 | <Celestar> | I hate them. |
| 10:30 | -!- | pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-076-211.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] |
| 10:30 | <Celestar> | with a passion |
| 10:31 | <Celestar> | too many people. |
| 10:31 | <Celestar> | they make noises. |
| 10:31 | <Eddi|zuHause> | you shouldn't use them with an agoraphobia, probably :) |
| 10:32 | <planetmaker> | the compartments also suck as you constantly hit knees with the person whom you face |
| 10:32 | <Celestar> | I use them rarely, because most of the time one of 3 things happens |
| 10:32 | <planetmaker> | As such the "Großraum"-wagons are much better usable |
| 10:32 | <Celestar> | a) The price in unacceptable |
| 10:32 | <Celestar> | b) the schedule sucks |
| 10:32 | <Celestar> | c) The train is horribly slow (i.e. Munich-Hamburg or Munich-Berlin) |
| 10:33 | <Eddi|zuHause> | blame the person who put these damn mountains inbetween! :p |
| 10:33 | <Celestar> | The Japanese have mountains too |
| 10:33 | <planetmaker> | but they have dedicated high-speed tracks |
| 10:33 | <Eddi|zuHause> | maybe they manage the NBS Nürnberg-Erfurt by 2017 |
| 10:33 | <Celestar> | yeah. |
| 10:33 | <Celestar> | planetmaker: so why don't we have them? because we suck? |
| 10:33 | -!- | pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-035-161.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd |
| 10:34 | <Rubidium> | Celestar: in Japan those trains can go horribly slow as well |
| 10:34 | <Celestar> | Rubidium: of course they can. |
| 10:34 | <planetmaker> | Celestar: basically yes ;-) |
| 10:34 | <Eddi|zuHause> | the japanese didn't have a division for 40 years |
| 10:34 | <Celestar> | Rubidium: but the large cities are connected . |
| 10:34 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: Munich and Hamburg were on the same side of the wall :P |
| 10:34 | <Eddi|zuHause> | which incidently cuts exactly through that problematic route |
| 10:35 | <Dany0> | guys I never understood one thing... can somebody explain me the nightly OpenTTD builds? |
| 10:35 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: and Munich-Hamburg already has about 500km of "high-speed" rail in between and STILL takes about 5:45 |
| 10:35 | <b_jonas> | Dany0: what about them? |
| 10:35 | <Celestar> | 4 hours is easily doable |
| 10:35 | <Rubidium> | Celestar: is 2 million large? If so, then in Japan it isn't either |
| 10:35 | <Dany0> | well last time I checked |
| 10:35 | <Celestar> | WITHOUT dropping any intermediate stops |
| 10:35 | <Dany0> | everyone could submit one |
| 10:36 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: yes, but the shortest historic (pre-1945) route was via Leipzig-Berlin |
| 10:36 | <Dany0> | at the time you were celebrating r10000 |
| 10:36 | <planetmaker> | Dany0: at every time only developers had commit access |
| 10:36 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: the modern high speed tracks couldn't really change that |
| 10:36 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: in 1939, the High-speed train from Munich to Stuttgart took 2:30. today, it's 2:23 |
| 10:36 | <planetmaker> | Dunno how it was at r10k. But they're automatically build by a compile farm |
| 10:36 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: Berlin-Dresden was 1:42. Today it's 2:07. |
| 10:36 | <planetmaker> | *built |
| 10:37 | <Dany0> | well the last time I checked |
| 10:37 | <Rubidium> | Celestar: of the 10 largest cities in Japan 3 are not connected to the Shinkansen |
| 10:37 | <Dany0> | the problem was that every nightly build was supposed to have some new experimental features |
| 10:38 | <Dany0> | and every nightly build was not sequentional |
| 10:38 | <planetmaker> | no. A nightly simply is to be the snapshot of trunk as of that night |
| 10:38 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: Berlin-Dresden has an additional stop in Berlin-Südkreuz nowadays |
| 10:38 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: we're comparing ICE against a steam engine?! |
| 10:38 | <Celestar> | Eddi|zuHause: Berlin-Südkreuz costs AT MOST 5 minutes. |
| 10:38 | <Dany0> | I mean r28789 had experimental signaling, r28790 had support for ultra long trains |
| 10:38 | <Dany0> | for example |
| 10:38 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: the steam train ran 160km/h on a regular basis |
| 10:38 | <planetmaker> | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neutral_build <-- Dany0 |
| 10:38 | <Dany0> | but you wouldn't find out until you've downloaded it |
| 10:38 | <planetmaker> | err |
| 10:38 | <Celestar> | I thought it was even 175km/h. |
| 10:39 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: top speed vs. planned speed |
| 10:39 | <Dany0> | this was few years ago |
| 10:39 | <Celestar> | Rubidium: Hamburg isn'T connected, Munich isn't connected, Cologne is hardly connected, Berlin is mediocrely connected ... |
| 10:39 | <Rubidium> | even between the two largest cities in Japan the fastest train has an average of 90 km/h |
| 10:39 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Celestar: 175 = 160+10% |
| 10:40 | <Celestar> | Rubidium: the largest cities are Tokyo and Osaka :P |
| 10:40 | <Dany0> | http://www.openttd.org/nl/news/49 |
| 10:40 | <Dany0> | :( |
| 10:40 | <Dany0> | I wanna see the cake! |
| 10:40 | <Rubidium> | Celestar: Tokyo and Yokohama |
| 10:40 | <Celestar> | Rubidium: well .. rofl :P |
| 10:40 | <Celestar> | that's 25km |
| 10:40 | <Dany0> | there it is |
| 10:40 | <Dany0> | http://www.openttd.org/nl/screenshot/r10000/r10000 |
| 10:40 | <planetmaker> | http://www.openttd.org/nl/screenshots |
| 10:41 | <Dany0> | wow that's how long I've been around? |
| 10:41 | <Rubidium> | wow, never seen that photo ;) |
| 10:42 | <Celestar> | the train from Toyko to Yokohama takes 18 minutes |
| 10:42 | <Celestar> | for 29 km |
| 10:43 | <Eddi|zuHause> | hey, in 18 minutes i'm not even at the next train station |
| 10:43 | <Celestar> | I am :P |
| 10:43 | <Celestar> | München-Pasing. |
| 10:43 | <Dany0> | hey I remember it was promised in nightly builds that there will be multi-leve bridges |
| 10:43 | <Celestar> | bbl |
| 10:43 | <Celestar> | :D |
| 10:43 | <Rubidium> | in 18 minutes I'm 2 stations further... but bike |
| 10:43 | <Dany0> | one step before we'd have the locomotion-like air tracks |
| 10:43 | <Rubidium> | s/but/by/ |
| 10:44 | <Dany0> | did it ever happen? |
| 10:44 | <planetmaker> | did you play and find out? |
| 10:44 | <Eddi|zuHause> | well, Halle-Nietleben could be doable in 18 minutes |
| 10:44 | * | Rubidium wonders who promised that to Dany0 |
| 10:44 | <Eddi|zuHause> | by car |
| 10:44 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: I saw a screen, but I couldn't find the nightly build the post was talking about |
| 10:44 | <Dany0> | Rubidium: the forums |
| 10:45 | <planetmaker> | lol |
| 10:47 | <Dany0> | http://kecy.roumen.cz/birth_vs._kick_in_the_nuts.jpg < ORLY? Ever felt the pain |
| 10:47 | <Dany0> | http://kecy.roumen.cz/birth_vs._kick_in_the_nuts.jpg < ORLY? Ever felt the pain of dealing with a retard? |
| 10:47 | <planetmaker> | ... |
| 10:47 | <Dany0> | what f*ck just happened? 1. wasn't meant to this tab 2. double post? |
| 10:48 | <planetmaker> | I currently feel like doing so. yes |
| 10:48 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: said the guy who says 'cubicle' |
| 10:49 | <Rubidium> | what's wrong with cubicles? |
| 10:49 | <Dany0> | it's not cubicles |
| 10:49 | <planetmaker> | not again... |
| 10:49 | <Dany0> | there is no such thing as cubicle in this sense |
| 10:49 | <TrueBrain> | yeah; please not this again :( |
| 10:49 | <Dany0> | it's called voxel, and it's not even a cube! |
| 10:50 | <planetmaker> | I guess I'll follow eddi's example for noise control |
| 10:50 | <Rubidium> | http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a5/CubeSpace.jpg <- so these are called voxels... that's something new I learned today |
| 10:50 | <planetmaker> | :-) |
| 10:50 | <Dany0> | Rubidium: what's your problem? |
| 10:51 | <Dany0> | TrueBrain: do you remember multi-leveled bridges? |
| 10:51 | <Dany0> | higher then 1 |
| 10:51 | -!- | Celestar [~dax@82.113.121.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] |
| 10:51 | <TrueBrain> | huh? |
| 10:51 | <Dany0> | and more height levels? |
| 10:51 | <planetmaker> | random highlights for random people. Today for free... :S |
| 10:52 | <planetmaker> | oh. on random topics, of course |
| 10:52 | <TrueBrain> | planetmaker: normally I have to apy for it :P |
| 10:52 | -!- | Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Tschüß] |
| 10:52 | <Dany0> | ? |
| 10:52 | <planetmaker> | apy? |
| 10:52 | <Dany0> | what are you talking about now? |
| 10:52 | <TrueBrain> | planetmaker: pay :P |
| 10:52 | <TrueBrain> | be creative with letters :) |
| 10:52 | <planetmaker> | :-) |
| 10:52 | * | Rubidium is happy to not work in a voxel. Would feel too constrained I guess, and probably not very good for communication |
| 10:53 | <TrueBrain> | Rubidium: I rather talk with vocals :D |
| 10:53 | <planetmaker> | not my creative day today... Much boring work was to be done... |
| 10:53 | <Dany0> | Rubidium: if you'd work in a voxel you'd be smaller then an atom |
| 10:53 | <planetmaker> | TrueBrain: acapella? |
| 10:53 | <Dany0> | this would need compensations, like removing your brain... whole body? |
| 10:53 | <TrueBrain> | planetmaker: for example :) |
| 10:54 | <Rubidium> | but you just said it's not cubicles but voxels |
| 10:54 | <Rubidium> | for some reason I'm getting confused here |
| 10:54 | <planetmaker> | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUc_hTSUnxs |
| 10:56 | <Dany0> | Rubidium: I did not |
| 10:57 | <Rubidium> | 16:49 < Rubidium> what's wrong with cubicles? |
| 10:57 | <Rubidium> | 16:49 < Dany0> it's not cubicles |
| 10:57 | <Rubidium> | 16:49 < Dany0> it's called voxel, and it's not even a cube! |
| 10:57 | <Rubidium> | sorry, but I can only deduce from that, that what I thought to be cubicles are to be called voxels |
| 10:57 | -!- | Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4d08e58c.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd |
| 10:58 | <Dany0> | no some... idiots thought the voxels in qubicle are called cubicles |
| 10:58 | <Dany0> | so no one remembers the multi-level bridges? |
| 10:58 | <TrueBrain> | oeh, I am promoted to everyone :D:D |
| 10:58 | <Dany0> | ? |
| 10:59 | <TrueBrain> | [16:51] <Dany0> TrueBrain: do you remember multi-leveled bridges? |
| 10:59 | <TrueBrain> | [16:58] <Dany0> so no one remembers the multi-level bridges? |
| 10:59 | <TrueBrain> | so I am everyone :D I feel to proud :) |
| 10:59 | <Rubidium> | TrueBrain: everyone agrees ;) |
| 11:00 | <Dany0> | ... |
| 11:00 | <Dany0> | TrueBrain: everyone can read it, also "I feel to proud" |
| 11:02 | * | Rubidium would be very interested in the reasoning the developers had to remove multi-leveled bridges from trunk (assuming they ever were in trunk) |
| 11:02 | <planetmaker> | TrueBrain: we all knew you're our omni-present almighty god(dess) of ... <enter something here> |
| 11:02 | <TrueBrain> | planetmaker: :D |
| 11:02 | <planetmaker> | :D |
| 11:02 | * | planetmaker hides quickly |
| 11:02 | <Dany0> | who are the main developers? |
| 11:02 | <Dany0> | who commit suicide |
| 11:02 | <Dany0> | I mean to the trunk |
| 11:02 | <+glx> | Rubidium: I know why :) |
| 11:03 | <Dany0> | glx: tell me! |
| 11:03 | <planetmaker> | you read the changelog Dany0 |
| 11:03 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: no? |
| 11:03 | <planetmaker> | it's not feeding time for illiterate and lazy |
| 11:03 | <+glx> | it never been in trunk |
| 11:04 | <Dany0> | ... |
| 11:04 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: yeah where is the changelog then? |
| 11:04 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: non-stable |
| 11:04 | <Rubidium> | in any case, I usually see DorpsGek or CIA-6 in the commit messages on IRC |
| 11:04 | <TrueBrain> | so they are to blame? :D |
| 11:05 | <TrueBrain> | always knew CIA had a hidden agenda |
| 11:06 | <@DorpsGek> | leave me alone |
| 11:06 | <Dany0> | DorpsGek: NO! >=( |
| 11:06 | <@DorpsGek> | but I don't want to be alone |
| 11:07 | <Dany0> | is anyone beside DorpsGek? or it's just a bot with pre-recorded messages? |
| 11:07 | <@DorpsGek> | did you just call me a bot? Rude ... |
| 11:08 | <Dany0> | DorpsGek: you're a bot and have no life |
| 11:08 | <Dany0> | DorpsGek: now, complete the turing test |
| 11:08 | <@peter1138> | if your voxels are represented by a 2d representation of a cube on a screen, is it so wrong to call it a cube? |
| 11:08 | <Dany0> | peter1138: yes |
| 11:08 | -!- | Dany0 was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [Warning 1. Don't insult me.] |
| 11:08 | <@peter1138> | ok |
| 11:08 | <@peter1138> | heh |
| 11:08 | -!- | Dany0 [5ab27afe@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd |
| 11:08 | <Dany0> | really? |
| 11:08 | <Dany0> | that's an insult? or even a reason to kick? |
| 11:08 | <Dany0> | DorpsGek: that was uncalled for |
| 11:15 | <@peter1138> | maybe you should try voxelizing a flat sprite?> |
| 11:18 | <Dany0> | peter1138: are you kidding me? |
| 11:18 | <@peter1138> | no |
| 11:18 | <@peter1138> | in your video you took a sloped sprite and turn it into a flat voxel object |
| 11:18 | <Dany0> | peter1138: Blood's 3d objects were made of entirel voxelized flat sprites |
| 11:18 | <@peter1138> | *turned |
| 11:18 | <Dany0> | yeah I know |
| 11:18 | -!- | Br33z4hSlut5 [~static.kp@92.68.154.34] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] |
| 11:19 | <Dany0> | it's iso so you can't voxelize that easily |
| 11:19 | <@peter1138> | what? |
| 11:19 | <Dany0> | peter1138: and I've shown you voxelized sprites |
| 11:19 | <Dany0> | wait |
| 11:19 | <@peter1138> | i thought you said it was easier? |
| 11:19 | <Dany0> | what was easier |
| 11:19 | <@peter1138> | voxels |
| 11:20 | <Dany0> | I didn't say that |
| 11:20 | <@peter1138> | ok |
| 11:20 | <Dany0> | voxels are better then polygons yes |
| 11:20 | <Dany0> | they're not "easier" |
| 11:20 | <Dany0> | and they can't be harder |
| 11:20 | -!- | Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e0a9627.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd |
| 11:20 | <@peter1138> | but a polygon can represent a slope |
| 11:20 | <Dany0> | it's a data/rendering/rasterization technique |
| 11:20 | <Dany0> | so does a voxel |
| 11:20 | <@peter1138> | voxels (on a fixed grid) can't easily do that |
| 11:20 | <Dany0> | here |
| 11:20 | <Dany0> | http://i.imgur.com/OyJiC.gif |
| 11:20 | <Dany0> | voxelized sprite |
| 11:21 | <@peter1138> | no |
| 11:21 | <@peter1138> | what i said "a flat sprite" i mean one of our tiles that is flat |
| 11:21 | <@peter1138> | *when |
| 11:22 | <@peter1138> | animated gifs of a voxel object don't impress me |
| 11:22 | <Eddi|zuHause> | # anotherone bites the dust |
| 11:23 | <TrueBrain> | # dum dum dum |
| 11:27 | <Prof_Frink> | peter1138 drives a voxel vectra. |
| 11:27 | <@peter1138> | hah |
| 11:33 | <Dany0> | you know what I could do |
| 11:33 | <Dany0> | I could voxelize 1942 |
| 11:33 | <Dany0> | http://www.nes-snes-sprites.com/1942.html |
| 11:35 | -!- | welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-86-31-213-47.oxfd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd |
| 11:36 | <planetmaker> | "could voxelize <whatever game not OpenTTD> is like totally off-topic here |
| 11:36 | <TrueBrain> | planetmaker: voxels are offtopic here |
| 11:36 | <TrueBrain> | :) |
| 11:37 | <planetmaker> | yeah.... I've not seen them made on-topic. Just buzz-talk about *could* |
| 11:38 | <TrueBrain> | even if voxel-engines would be mainstream, it would be useless for OpenTTD ... like any other random OpenTTD3D talk we had/willhave :P |
| 11:39 | <Prof_Frink> | TrueBrain: Add "| No Voxels |" to the topic? |
| 11:39 | -!- | snack2 [~nn@dsl-prvbrasgw1-fe05dc00-37.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd |
| 11:39 | <TrueBrain> | Prof_Frink: it would make a very long topic tbh |
| 11:40 | <@Yexo> | | Web service partially offline <- is that still true? |
| 11:41 | <TrueBrain> | haha, no |
| 11:41 | -!- | snack2 [~nn@dsl-prvbrasgw1-fe05dc00-37.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [] |
| 11:41 | <TrueBrain> | who added it, and why did he not remove it? |
| 11:41 | * | TrueBrain looks at planetmaker :) |
| 11:41 | <Prof_Frink> | Or just add it to Dorpy, like the openttdcoop reminder. |
| 11:41 | <planetmaker> | did? |
| 11:41 | <planetmaker> | I really feel innocent :-) |
| 11:41 | <TrueBrain> | you want me to consult backlogs? :P |
| 11:42 | <TrueBrain> | no, I seriously don't know who did :P |
| 11:42 | <planetmaker> | nah, could spoil my feeling of innocence |
| 11:42 | <planetmaker> | @op |
| 11:42 | -!- | mode/#openttd [+o planetmaker] by DorpsGek |
| 11:42 | <Prof_Frink> | Forunately I only just connected. |
| 11:42 | -!- | planetmaker changed the topic of #openttd to: 1.1.3 | Website: *.openttd.org (translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki, patches & bug-reports: bugs, revision log: vcs, release info: finger) | Don't ask to ask, just ask | 'Latest' is not a valid version | English only |
| 11:42 | <Prof_Frink> | -!- Topic set by planetmaker [~planetmak@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] [Fri Sep 30 14:34:12 2011] |
| 11:43 | <TrueBrain> | tnx planetmaker :P |
| 11:43 | <TrueBrain> | I was too lazy, I am sorry :D |
| 11:43 | <@planetmaker> | cmd+t did the trick ;-). k. +@op ;-) |
| 11:43 | -!- | mode/#openttd [-o planetmaker] by DorpsGek |
| 11:44 | <+glx> | I think DorpsGek has a command for that too |
| 11:44 | <planetmaker> | it has |
| 11:44 | <TrueBrain> | last time planetmaker tried to battle it, and he failed horribly :P |
| 11:44 | <planetmaker> | but more effort |
| 11:44 | <TrueBrain> | forcing him to do a +o for it :D |
| 11:44 | <planetmaker> | hm... why did dorpsget -o me? |
| 11:45 | <TrueBrain> | *shrug* |
| 11:45 | <planetmaker> | @op |
| 11:45 | -!- | mode/#openttd [+o planetmaker] by DorpsGek |
| 11:45 | <TrueBrain> | I am sure I had nothing to do with it |
| 11:45 | -!- | mode/#openttd [-o planetmaker] by DorpsGek |
| 11:45 | <planetmaker> | :-D |
| 11:45 | <planetmaker> | grmpf |
| 11:45 | * | TrueBrain hugs planetmaker |
| 11:45 | -!- | mode/#openttd [+o planetmaker] by DorpsGek |
| 11:45 | * | planetmaker pats DorpsGek |
| 11:45 | <@DorpsGek> | purr |
| 11:46 | -!- | snack2 [~nn@dsl-prvbrasgw1-fe05dc00-37.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd |
| 11:46 | <+glx> | grr my script is broken for topic commands |
| 11:47 | <Dany0> | TrueBrain: no voxels aren't off the topic here |
| 11:47 | <TrueBrain> | indeed; they are |
| 11:48 | * | planetmaker wonders whether I should get my 2nd round of popcorn |
| 11:48 | <TrueBrain> | I am getting hungry, hmm |
| 11:48 | <@planetmaker> | yes... but not for popcorn |
| 11:48 | <Dany0> | no they're not |
| 11:48 | <Dany0> | if you think so you have no idea what voxels are |
| 11:49 | <Dany0> | so you guys |
| 11:49 | <Dany0> | have any idea if an ARM build is coming up? |
| 11:49 | <Dany0> | you know, windows 8 |
| 11:49 | <Dany0> | it's about the time to start, seriously |
| 11:49 | <TrueBrain> | I am strongly start to think Dany0 is a bot ... |
| 11:49 | <TrueBrain> | can we start a vote on that? |
| 11:50 | <@planetmaker> | +1 |
| 11:50 | <Dany0> | TrueBrain: what is the **** clue that gives you this non-sense thought? huh? |
| 11:50 | <@Yexo> | Dany0: if I were you I'd back off a bit |
| 11:50 | <@Yexo> | you've been made fun of more than enough for the day, and you don't even seem to know it |
| 11:51 | <@Yexo> | by continuining you're only making a fool of yourself |
| 11:51 | <Dany0> | Yexo: well the mods should punish the people that are making fun of me |
| 11:51 | <Dany0> | then |
| 11:52 | <Prof_Frink> | The people making fun of you *are* the ops. |
| 11:52 | -!- | DorpsGek changed the topic of #openttd to: 1.1.3 | Website: *.openttd.org (translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki, patches & bug-reports: bugs, revision log: vcs, release info: finger) | Don't ask to ask, just ask | 'Latest' is not a valid version | English only | test (glx) |
| 11:52 | <TrueBrain> | and mostly he is just making fun of himself, so that gets a bit tricky too ... ;) |
| 11:52 | -!- | DorpsGek changed the topic of #openttd to: 1.1.3 | Website: *.openttd.org (translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki, patches & bug-reports: bugs, revision log: vcs, release info: finger) | Don't ask to ask, just ask | 'Latest' is not a valid version | English only |
| 11:52 | <TrueBrain> | glx: passed :) |
| 11:52 | <Prof_Frink> | planetmaker: Get me some while you're there |
| 11:52 | <+glx> | command fixed :) |
| 11:53 | <@planetmaker> | gladly, here you go, Prof_Frink |
| 11:53 | * | MINM pokes the town crazy |
| 11:53 | <@DorpsGek> | purr |
| 11:53 | <MINM> | 0-o |
| 11:53 | <@planetmaker> | :-) |
| 11:54 | <Prof_Frink> | Cheers Slarti |
| 11:54 | <Dany0> | how about stop making fun of me and take my words ******* seriously? |
| 11:54 | <@DorpsGek> | purrr |
| 11:54 | <@Yexo> | a better attitude would help |
| 11:54 | <@DorpsGek> | pur pur |
| 11:54 | <@DorpsGek> | zzzZZZZzzz |
| 11:54 | <Dany0> | I'm ***** trying to help you somehow, so far you're the most ***** unwelcome community I've been to for months |
| 11:54 | <@Yexo> | @kick Dany0 bye bye |
| 11:55 | <@Belugas> | yo yo and a bottle of rum |
| 11:55 | <@Yexo> | @whoami |
| 11:55 | <@DorpsGek> | Yexo: I don't recognize you. |
| 11:55 | <Dany0> | -.-'? |
| 11:55 | <Dany0> | why? |
| 11:55 | -!- | DorpsGek changed the topic of #openttd to: 1.1.3 | Website: *.openttd.org (translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki, patches & bug-reports: bugs, revision log: vcs, release info: finger) | Don't ask to ask, just ask | 'Latest' is not a valid version | English only | long test (glx) |
| 11:55 | <TrueBrain> | Yexo: authenticate :P |
| 11:55 | -!- | DorpsGek changed the topic of #openttd to: 1.1.3 | Website: *.openttd.org (translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki, patches & bug-reports: bugs, revision log: vcs, release info: finger) | Don't ask to ask, just ask | 'Latest' is not a valid version | English only |
| 11:55 | <@planetmaker> | @op Yexo |
| 11:55 | <Dany0> | once again, why? |
| 11:55 | <TrueBrain> | planetmaker: he is opped |
| 11:55 | <@planetmaker> | yeah... I need tea. |
| 11:55 | <TrueBrain> | just DorpsGek refuses to copy those rights .. not sure why not, feels a bit mute |
| 11:55 | <@planetmaker> | Yexo: you could authenticate via hostmask to dorpsgek |
| 11:56 | <@Yexo> | yes, I should |
| 11:56 | <@planetmaker> | *somehow* |
| 11:56 | <+glx> | just give it a wildcard mask :) |
| 11:56 | <@planetmaker> | :-D |
| 11:56 | <TrueBrain> | planetmaker: I still haven't discovered how that works :P |
| 11:56 | <@peter1138> | Dany0, so you want to use qubicle to draw sprites. well, here goes. there's nothing stopping you. enjoy. |
| 11:56 | <@planetmaker> | @help authenticate |
| 11:56 | <@DorpsGek> | planetmaker: Error: There is no command "authenticate". |
| 11:56 | <@planetmaker> | @help identify |
| 11:56 | <@DorpsGek> | planetmaker: (identify <name> <password>) -- Identifies the user as <name>. This command (and all other commands that include a password) must be sent to the bot privately, not in a channel. |
| 11:56 | <TrueBrain> | planetmaker: don't spam please :) |
| 11:56 | <@planetmaker> | :-) |
| 11:56 | <MINM> | this all would have been solved a lot quicker with a irc network that actually has a proper op system installed >.< |
| 11:57 | <MINM> | planetmaker: pm? |
| 11:57 | <Dany0> | peter1138: excuse me? |
| 11:57 | <Prof_Frink> | irc.openttd.org ? |
| 11:57 | <@planetmaker> | MINM: how doesn't this have? |
| 11:57 | <TrueBrain> | Prof_Frink: please no :P |
| 11:57 | <MINM> | what? |
| 11:57 | <@peter1138> | Dany0, you brought up qubicle as a way of making sprites. if you don't want to make sprites, why bring it up? |
| 11:57 | <@Yexo> | Dany0: you need to think about what you actually want to achieve. Using qubicles is nice, but whwat does it offer to OpenTTD? |
| 11:57 | <MINM> | have you ever ben as far to go do look more like? |
| 11:57 | <Prof_Frink> | or irc.ttdpatch.net maybe? |
| 11:58 | <Dany0> | Yexo: it's not Qubicles fucking damn this! |
| 11:58 | <@peter1138> | pardon? |
| 11:58 | <Dany0> | are you all just this ignorant or simply dumb? |
| 11:58 | <TrueBrain> | Dany0: once again I warn you: dial it down, don't talk like this |
| 11:58 | <@Belugas> | fucking? he said fucking?? |
| 11:58 | <Dany0> | do you even listen to me? |
| 11:58 | <@Belugas> | no, we read you |
| 11:58 | <__ln__> | would it be too old-fashioned for an op to kick directly, without delegating it to a bot? |
| 11:58 | <@peter1138> | Dany0, have you tried temper management? |
| 11:58 | <@Yexo> | Dany0: I'm not drawing any sprites at all, and I don't really care how they're drawn |
| 11:58 | <TrueBrain> | stop calling people names, stop being arogant .. we have been over this Dany0 |
| 11:59 | <@Belugas> | hey, i want some popcorn too! |
| 11:59 | <__ln__> | Dany0: how old are you? |
| 11:59 | <@Yexo> | voxels, qubicles, whatever, taht was not my point. The point was: whatever you want to introduce, what does it offer to OpenTTD? |
| 11:59 | <MINM> | __ln__: I think the old adage "why simple when it can be done hard" applies here |
| 11:59 | <Prof_Frink> | Belugas: planetmaker's got a bucketful |
| 12:00 | <@planetmaker> | yup. Here's also a bucket for Belugas :-) |
| 12:00 | <Dany0> | Yexo: it's not some kind of new technology |
| 12:00 | <@Yexo> | that is again besides the point |
| 12:00 | <Dany0> | Yexo: I am not trying to sell anything, and it's not some magic stuff like unlimited detail technology proclaims |
| 12:00 | <TrueBrain> | Dany0: what Yexo is trying to ask you, how would voxels help OpenTTD in any way |
| 12:01 | <TrueBrain> | you are aware OpenTTD is not a 3D game, right? |
| 12:01 | <Dany0> | you can not call it qubicles, you can not call it whatever |
| 12:01 | <Dany0> | it's voxels, the end |
| 12:01 | <@planetmaker> | Then why do frigging behave so? And why do you want to sell it to everyone whether s/he draws sprites or not? And to everyone whether s/he wants to listent to or not? |
| 12:01 | <Dany0> | phew... |
| 12:01 | <@Yexo> | ok, so it's voxels |
| 12:01 | <Prof_Frink> | Call it Derek. |
| 12:01 | <@Yexo> | How do voxels help OpenTTD in any way? |
| 12:01 | <Dany0> | thank god |
| 12:01 | <TrueBrain> | you keep coming here talking about voxels like it is _the_ magic word to fix all shit, but ... how does it help OpenTTD? |
| 12:02 | <@planetmaker> | which is... what I asked like 6 hours ago and got no answer to ;-) |
| 12:02 | <Dany0> | the whole point is that for 32bpp sprites you're using blender |
| 12:02 | <TrueBrain> | says who? |
| 12:02 | <@Yexo> | some people are, others are not |
| 12:02 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: yes you got you were just too ignorant to read it |
| 12:02 | <Dany0> | yes |
| 12:02 | <Dany0> | blender sucks, it's hard to learn and long to render |
| 12:02 | <TrueBrain> | how artist do their work, they do their work |
| 12:02 | <Prof_Frink> | TrueBrain: You get to use Mirage Tanks to fool the local authorities into thinking you've planted trees. |
| 12:03 | <@planetmaker> | I only saw "better than blender" which is hardly an argument |
| 12:03 | <TrueBrain> | OpenTTD has nothing to do with any of that |
| 12:03 | <Dany0> | qubicle is easy to learn and instatn to render |
| 12:03 | <+glx> | TrueBrain: let's talk about XML then :) |
| 12:03 | <@Yexo> | but apparently the people using it already know blender |
| 12:03 | <@Yexo> | otherwise they wouldn't be able to make any sprites |
| 12:03 | <Dany0> | it's easier to create sprites because you don't have to do the same work 19 times |
| 12:03 | <Dany0> | Yexo: ok |
| 12:03 | <@Yexo> | and if you want to push voxels for new artists you have the wrong audience here |
| 12:04 | <Dany0> | Yexo: again |
| 12:04 | <@Yexo> | the majority of the people here are either coding or playing openttd, not drawing graphics |
| 12:04 | <Dany0> | Yexo: you didn't get it |
| 12:04 | <Dany0> | Yexo: there is no pushing voxels for new artists |
| 12:04 | <Dany0> | there is no such thing |
| 12:04 | <TrueBrain> | Dany0: if 5 developers don't get you, you might be the one that don't get it? |
| 12:04 | <@Yexo> | than why do you keep bringing it up? |
| 12:04 | <MINM> | ..can't tell if just stupid or troll. |
| 12:04 | <MINM> | in case of doubt, troll! |
| 12:05 | <Prof_Frink> | MINM: Tropid. |
| 12:05 | <Dany0> | you're talking oranges and I don't know, badgers |
| 12:05 | <Prof_Frink> | Mushroom! |
| 12:05 | <MINM> | what, Prof_Frink? |
| 12:05 | <Mazur> | If a Troll is here, the bridge must be open. |
| 12:05 | <Dany0> | Yexo: again |
| 12:05 | <Dany0> | Yexo: there is no bringing it up |
| 12:05 | <TrueBrain> | Dany0: lets make it more clear to you: we, as OpenTTD, do not care how 32bpp sprites are made. Some peopl euse Blender, some use paint, some might use voxel engines (once they are created, if ever) |
| 12:05 | <TrueBrain> | so, why keep bringing up voxels in this channel and proclaiming it is the all-fixing? How does OpenTTD benefit? |
| 12:06 | <Dany0> | TrueBrain: there is no using voxel engines |
| 12:06 | <Dany0> | TrueBrain: making sprites from blueprints is easier |
| 12:06 | <@peter1138> | so what? |
| 12:06 | <TrueBrain> | again, how does OpenTTD benefit? |
| 12:06 | <Eddi|zuHause> | <Belugas> hey, i want some popcorn too! <-- sorry, popcorn ran out two days ago |
| 12:06 | <TrueBrain> | you keep skipping that part |
| 12:07 | <Mazur> | Making sprites with a tool I know and can use is easiest. |
| 12:07 | <Mazur> | Also, I like hte tiool to also exist. |
| 12:07 | <@planetmaker> | TrueBrain: wrong. You're also just ignorant and don't read. I'm quite sure ;-) |
| 12:07 | <Mazur> | -i |
| 12:07 | <Dany0> | peter1138: so making sprites from blueprints is easier |
| 12:07 | <Dany0> | TrueBrain: already said that |
| 12:07 | <@planetmaker> | see :-) |
| 12:07 | <Dany0> | ... |
| 12:07 | <TrueBrain> | (a fun fact btw, most voxel engines atm use blender, which generates a 3D model, which is converted to a voxel engine, because it is too hard to make voxel models from scratch :P) |
| 12:07 | <TrueBrain> | Dany0: so you keep saying, but I never read the answer |
| 12:07 | <@peter1138> | Dany0, great. go ahead and make sprites from blueprints then |
| 12:08 | <Dany0> | TrueBrain: this is not true, and how the hell did you come up with this |
| 12:08 | <Dany0> | TrueBrain: "it's easier make sprites" get it? |
| 12:08 | <Dany0> | it's not for everyone |
| 12:08 | * | Prof_Frink makes a model of a blender using vauxhalls |
| 12:08 | <TrueBrain> | Dany0: clearly you have no clue who you are talking too; that is okay, but I am telling you: OpenTTD does not benefit from voxels. If you want people to use voxels (in what-ever way) go talk to people who are interested |
| 12:08 | <@Yexo> | Dany0: "we, as openttd team, do not make sprites", get it? |
| 12:09 | <Dany0> | so why do you even discuss this if it's not of your interest? |
| 12:09 | <TrueBrain> | because someone keeps bringing it up over and over and over |
| 12:09 | <Prof_Frink> | ... we don't. |
| 12:09 | <TrueBrain> | dunno who :) |
| 12:10 | <@planetmaker> | which is why I suggested to post on this topic better in the graphics section of the forum. Which I already linked you to hours ago |
| 12:10 | <Dany0> | I'm talking to people that want to make sprites easier or they don't like pixel art or they're bad at it or they wish they could make sprites using ms paint like tool but in 3d |
| 12:10 | <@planetmaker> | as there *might* be some interested audience if it really can help producing sprites |
| 12:10 | <@Yexo> | Dany0: those people are not here |
| 12:10 | * | TrueBrain looks in every corner of #openttd |
| 12:10 | <TrueBrain> | nope |
| 12:10 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: you what? |
| 12:10 | <Dany0> | Yexo: and you tell me this NOW? |
| 12:11 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: ? |
| 12:11 | <@Yexo> | <Yexo> the majority of the people here are either coding or playing openttd, not drawing graphics <- I already did so before |
| 12:11 | <@planetmaker> | @logs |
| 12:11 | <@DorpsGek> | planetmaker: http://irclogs.qmsk.net/channels/openttd |
| 12:11 | <Terkhen> | I'm quite certain you have been told to post at the NewGRF development subforum a few times already |
| 12:11 | <TrueBrain> | he has been told here too a few times; but as long as he understands it now :) |
| 12:11 | <Prof_Frink> | Yexo: You missed "or just fishing for trolls". |
| 12:11 | <@planetmaker> | »» 13:57:29 < planetmaker> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewforum.php?f=68 <-- probably here |
| 12:11 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: there's already a topic on the graphics section already |
| 12:12 | <Dany0> | planetmaker: I'm just waiting for a qubicle update so that I can render openttd-valid sprite |
| 12:12 | <Dany0> | Yexo: you said majority |
| 12:12 | <Dany0> | Yexo: I'm obviously talking to minority |
| 12:12 | <TrueBrain> | *facedesk* |
| 12:12 | <+glx> | other are bots and idlers |
| 12:12 | <@Yexo> | look, there are 109 people in this channel currently. I can hardly guarantee that none of them is drawing sprites |
| 12:12 | <Dany0> | and since there are ~5-7 guys answering me most of the time on what 50 people channel I thought I was talking to the minority |
| 12:12 | <Dany0> | see, 109 people |
| 12:13 | <Dany0> | Yexo: see I was counting on that |
| 12:13 | <Dany0> | so anyone not related to this, out! |
| 12:13 | <Dany0> | phew... much better |
| 12:13 | <@Yexo> | in #openttd.artists is everyone you need to talk to |
| 12:14 | <+glx> | oh there's a dedicated chan ? |
| 12:14 | <Dany0> | Yexo: now this... this you tell me now? |
| 12:14 | <Eddi|zuHause> | glx: that better be empty :p |
| 12:14 | <Dany0> | it is... |
| 12:15 | <Prof_Frink> | Yexo: Or maybe #openttd.vauxhalls |
| 12:15 | -!- | welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-86-31-213-47.oxfd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] |
| 12:15 | <TrueBrain> | right; out of popcorn, time to make some real food :) |
| 12:16 | <Dany0> | Prof_Frink: there is no vauxhalls, you clearly don't make the splendor of your name |
| 12:16 | <Prof_Frink> | Hmm, Dany0 seems to have confused me with someone that makes sense. |
| 12:17 | <Dany0> | Prof_Frink: so did you |
| 12:18 | -!- | welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-86-31-213-47.oxfd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd |
| 12:22 | -!- | pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-035-161.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [Quit: I reject your reality and substitute my own] |
| 12:28 | <Xaroth> | TrueBrain: stop hurting your desk! |
| 12:29 | <@planetmaker> | Xaroth: but it really does hurt. I even feel the pain here it radiates |
| 12:29 | <Xaroth> | aye |
| 12:29 | <Xaroth> | my desk is sobbing from all the desk violence it has to witness.. |
| 12:30 | <Prof_Frink> | If you're going to headdesk, do it properly. Run into a wall. |
| 12:30 | <Xaroth> | then it's headwall, not headdesk |
| 12:31 | <MINM> | no, really? |
| 12:31 | <Prof_Frink> | No, more entirebodywall |
| 12:32 | <Eddi|zuHause> | i have another answer to a question nobody ever asked: http://csrc.nist.gov/publications/nistir/ir7275-rev4/NISTIR-7275r4.pdf |
| 12:33 | <Xaroth> | Eddi|zuHause: heh |
| 12:34 | <Eddi|zuHause> | it's a standard how to represent checklists in XML |
| 12:34 | <Eddi|zuHause> | checklists as in: |
| 12:34 | <Eddi|zuHause> | [ ] cleaned dishes |
| 12:35 | <Dany0> | ... |
| 12:35 | <Dany0> | wow |
| 12:35 | <Dany0> | >> glad not to live in the USA |
| 12:35 | <Xaroth> | Eddi|zuHause: at least it's XML-based, so it can't be wrong! |
| 12:35 | <Dany0> | xml sucks |
| 12:36 | <Dany0> | reading it takes way too long |
| 12:36 | * | Xaroth thinks Dany0 doesn't know how to use /me .. |
| 12:36 | -!- | sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.27.160] has joined #openttd |
| 12:36 | <TrueBrain> | Xaroth: stop hurting me! |
| 12:36 | <Dany0> | Xaroth: if I'd use /me I'd say is glad... |
| 12:37 | <Xaroth> | then why use >> .. it adds nothing to your sentence but bloat.. |
| 12:37 | <Xaroth> | and the whole point of XML is that it remains humanly readable.. |
| 12:37 | * | TrueBrain ... |
| 12:37 | -!- | welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-86-31-213-47.oxfd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] |
| 12:38 | <Eddi|zuHause> | XML is about as useful as Voxels :p |
| 12:38 | <TrueBrain> | Eddi|zuHause: he, don't comapre those two! Like oranges with peaches! |
| 12:39 | -!- | welshdragon [~welshdrag@client-86-31-213-47.oxfd.adsl.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd |
| 12:40 | <Eddi|zuHause> | TrueBrain: all these are things i could never get as a child? |
| 12:40 | <Dany0> | Eddi|zuHause: about as fuck you too |
| 12:40 | <Prof_Frink> | Extensible Voxel Markup Language... |
| 12:40 | <Dany0> | Prof_Frink: and you know what? you too |
| 12:40 | <Xaroth> | Dany0: no need to be rude |
| 12:40 | <TrueBrain> | Dany0: final warning. Stop calling names. |
| 12:41 | <@Yexo> | you're in a good mood today TrueBrain |
| 12:41 | <@Yexo> | I didn't expect another warning :P |
| 12:41 | <TrueBrain> | Yexo: yeah, it surprises me too :) |
| 12:41 | <Dany0> | you treat me this way? I treat you this way |
| 12:41 | <TrueBrain> | @kban Dany0 fair enough |
| 12:41 | -!- | mode/#openttd [+b *!5ab27afe@ircip2.mibbit.com] by DorpsGek |
| 12:41 | -!- | Dany0 was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [fair enough] |
| 12:41 | <@planetmaker> | @kban ... |
| 12:41 | <Xaroth> | @ban Dany0!*@* .. |
| 12:41 | <TrueBrain> | I couldn't even be bothered adding a timestamp ... |
| 12:42 | <Terkhen> | :P |
| 12:42 | <@Yexo> | did he ever grasp that TrueBrain was actually an op here? |
| 12:42 | <Xaroth> | nope! |
| 12:42 | <TrueBrain> | Yexo: nope |
| 12:42 | <TrueBrain> | if he can't be arshed to look up who developers of OpenTTD are, I can't be arshed to tell him |
| 12:42 | -!- | Neon [~Neon@dslb-178-004-191-142.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd |
| 12:42 | <@planetmaker> | ^^ |
| 12:42 | <Prof_Frink> | TrueBrain: Are you drunk? |
| 12:42 | <TrueBrain> | Prof_Frink: rarely; why? |
| 12:42 | <@planetmaker> | I doubt it |
| 12:43 | <MINM> | drunk with power, perhaps |
| 12:43 | <TrueBrain> | [18:42] <Dany0> why ban? |
| 12:43 | <MINM> | :P |
| 12:43 | <Prof_Frink> | You're shlurling your schpeech |
| 12:43 | <Xaroth> | that would imply he drinks :o |
| 12:43 | <TrueBrain> | how to reply to that ... |
| 12:43 | <Xaroth> | TrueBrain: quote him. |
| 12:43 | <MINM> | TrueBrain: /ignore *dany0* all |
| 12:43 | <Prof_Frink> | ^ This. |
| 12:43 | -!- | Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] |
| 12:43 | <@Yexo> | TrueBrain: "you treat me this way? I treat you this way" |
| 12:43 | <Xaroth> | or what MINM said. |
| 12:43 | <TrueBrain> | all good suggestions :D |
| 12:44 | -!- | Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has joined #openttd |
| 12:44 | <Prof_Frink> | Unless you've got the stab-in-the-face-over-IP plugin |
| 12:44 | <TrueBrain> | ordered it, but it hasn't come in yet :P |
| 12:44 | <Eddi|zuHause> | does that have an RFC yet? |
| 12:44 | <TrueBrain> | ugh ... only so much I can take of the: USE VOXELS! .. there isn't even software yet to draw in voxel space .. |
| 12:44 | <TrueBrain> | well, we have Minecraft :P |
| 12:46 | <Prof_Frink> | In Europe, Voxels are called Opels. Opal Fruits are now called Starburst. Starburst was what Moya did in Farscape. My brain is a weird place. Plaice is a fish. |
| 12:46 | <Xaroth> | you're confused with Vauxhalls, Prof_Frink :P |
| 12:46 | <TrueBrain> | ah, he was upset Prof_Frink and Eddi|zuHause made fun of voxels |
| 12:46 | <TrueBrain> | seems to make him think it is a card-blanc to start being rude |
| 12:46 | <Prof_Frink> | Xaroth: Same difference. |
| 12:47 | <Eddi|zuHause> | (i was actually being semi-serious) |
| 12:47 | <Prof_Frink> | (I wasn't) |
| 12:51 | <TrueBrain> | I am not allowed to paste an url here, as it would be rude, but pastebins are public these days ... don't know what that is about ... |
| 12:54 | <Xaroth> | can't find it :P |
| 12:54 | <z-MaTRiX> | hey--ho:) |
| 12:54 | <z-MaTRiX> | santa-clause is here |
| 12:54 | <TrueBrain> | you just check your PMs silly mister Xaroth :P |
| 12:54 | <Xaroth> | :) |
| 12:56 | <Prof_Frink> | What, David Cameron's got involved? |
| 12:56 | <TrueBrain> | who is David Cameron? :) |
| 12:56 | <Prof_Frink> | PM. |
| 12:56 | <TrueBrain> | and what part of him got involved? (the 's) |
| 12:57 | <TrueBrain> | or did you mean to type gut? :P |
| 12:57 | <TrueBrain> | :D:D:D :) |
| 12:57 | <Prof_Frink> | You don't want my guts to get involved. |
| 12:57 | <TrueBrain> | no, David Cameron's! :P |
| 12:58 | <Prof_Frink> | Ah, sanity. Never was that keen on it. |
| 13:00 | -!- | TheMask96 [~martijn@sloth.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] |
| 13:00 | -!- | Dany0 [5ab27afe@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd |
| 13:01 | <TrueBrain> | @kban *!5ab27afe@* |
| 13:01 | <@DorpsGek> | TrueBrain: Error: *!5ab27afe@* is not in #openttd. |
| 13:01 | <TrueBrain> | hmm |
| 13:01 | <TrueBrain> | stupid DorpsGek |
| 13:01 | <TrueBrain> | @dop |
| 13:01 | <TrueBrain> | @op |
| 13:01 | -!- | mode/#openttd [+o TrueBrain] by DorpsGek |
| 13:01 | -!- | mode/#openttd [+b *!5ab27afe@*] by TrueBrain |
| 13:01 | <@TrueBrain> | @kick Dany0 a ban is still a ban |
| 13:01 | -!- | Dany0 was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [a ban is still a ban] |
| 13:02 | <@TrueBrain> | @deop |
| 13:02 | -!- | mode/#openttd [-o TrueBrain] by DorpsGek |
| 13:02 | <TrueBrain> | there we go |
| 13:02 | <TrueBrain> | mibbit as multiple access points these days |
| 13:02 | <z-MaTRiX> | ;> |
| 13:02 | <z-MaTRiX> | what did he do? |
| 13:02 | <TrueBrain> | next he connects with mIRC I guess :P |
| 13:02 | <TrueBrain> | being abusive verbally |
| 13:03 | <z-MaTRiX> | because not got answer? |
| 13:03 | <@planetmaker> | didn't get the answer he liked |
| 13:03 | <z-MaTRiX> | haha |
| 13:03 | <TrueBrain> | did he asked anything? |
| 13:03 | -!- | TheMask96 [~martijn@gluttony.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd |
| 13:03 | <@planetmaker> | yes. whether eddi knows some obscure stuff |
| 13:04 | <TrueBrain> | owh, and something about bridges |
| 13:04 | <TrueBrain> | no clue what it was about |
| 13:04 | <z-MaTRiX> | i remember once i read something about the game perspective angle |
| 13:05 | <z-MaTRiX> | but not reading back ;< |
| 13:05 | <TrueBrain> | wise choice ;) |
| 13:07 | <z-MaTRiX> | why dont peoply usually use the chat function in mulktiplayer? |
| 13:07 | <z-MaTRiX> | seems like if they dont even know about it |
| 13:09 | <Xaroth> | TrueBrain: banning on nickname probably works best against low-IQ people :P |
| 13:09 | <TrueBrain> | Xaroth: on IP works better ;) |
| 13:09 | <Xaroth> | granted mibbit doesn't do magics :P |
| 13:11 | <z-MaTRiX> | and realnameban for 1337 lamz0r bots |
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| 13:33 | <Eddi|zuHause> | planetmaker: do we really need the cets.gfx.dep run? |
| 13:33 | <@planetmaker> | we don't need that, if you care to not re-build on png file changes |
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| 13:34 | <@planetmaker> | i.e. it gives the the dep on all image files |
| 13:34 | <Eddi|zuHause> | especially: must that really be a separate run |
| 13:34 | <@planetmaker> | technically it's needed |
| 13:35 | <@planetmaker> | it fails to work properly if you make it not a separate run |
| 13:35 | <@planetmaker> | in some cases |
| 13:35 | <Eddi|zuHause> | it's taking really long, and i think it does many things needlessly twice |
| 13:35 | <appe> | evening. |
| 13:36 | <@planetmaker> | Eddi|zuHause: removing that basically would mean to skip using the makefile at all and use a brainless build-script which builds everything unconditionally |
| 13:36 | <Eddi|zuHause> | planetmaker: and in 99% of all cases it suffices to depend on "find -iname '*.png'" |
| 13:37 | <@planetmaker> | do you write 99% correct code or prefer 100% correct? |
| 13:38 | <Eddi|zuHause> | planetmaker: but what speaks against stripping the dependencies out of the "real" nml compilation, instead of calling nml twice? |
| 13:38 | <@planetmaker> | it's calling nml in dep check mode |
| 13:38 | <@planetmaker> | like gcc -M -MT |
| 13:38 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yes. but that takes needlessly long |
| 13:39 | <@planetmaker> | as said: you can basically kill dep check and use a brainless build script... |
| 13:39 | <Eddi|zuHause> | that's not what i'm saying |
| 13:39 | <@planetmaker> | it's effectively the result of what you advocate |
| 13:40 | <Eddi|zuHause> | no, you miss my point |
| 13:40 | <@planetmaker> | I don't think so |
| 13:40 | <Eddi|zuHause> | i'm saying instead of "(nmlc dep-check) && (nmlc compile)" call "nmlc (dep-check & compile)" |
| 13:40 | <@planetmaker> | and I say: that can fail |
| 13:41 | <Eddi|zuHause> | and i ask: how? |
| 13:42 | <Eddi|zuHause> | planetmaker: a dep check is practically useless if it makes compiling twice as long |
| 13:45 | <TrueBrain> | hmm, you remind me I should add all those extra tools we have in /extra to the compilefarm .... |
| 13:45 | <TrueBrain> | (don't know why, but you two reminded me of that :P) |
| 13:46 | <@planetmaker> | Eddi|zuHause: it fails as soon as the png itself is generated |
| 13:46 | <@planetmaker> | at that stage you need to know which pngs need generation prior to actually building the grf |
| 13:46 | <appe> | what does && mean in code terminology? |
| 13:47 | <@planetmaker> | firs do A && if A then do B |
| 13:47 | <@planetmaker> | (in terms of bash syntax in this context) |
| 13:47 | <Eddi|zuHause> | appe: A && B means "run A, and if A terminates successfully, run B" |
| 13:48 | <TrueBrain> | so it means 'and' ;) |
| 13:48 | <appe> | ah, i see. |
| 13:48 | <appe> | and, with a cool touch. |
| 13:48 | <Eddi|zuHause> | appe: not to confuse with "A & B" which means "run A and B in parallel" |
| 13:48 | <TrueBrain> | any sane language tries to evaluate left first, if true, then right :) |
| 13:48 | <appe> | i see |
| 13:49 | <TrueBrain> | Eddi|zuHause: is that valid (bash-wise?) |
| 13:49 | <Eddi|zuHause> | TrueBrain: yes |
| 13:49 | -!- | blotek [~blotek@etm72.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] |
| 13:49 | <TrueBrain> | A& forks A, but having a 'B' behind it |
| 13:49 | <Eddi|zuHause> | & works like a separator, same as ; |
| 13:49 | <TrueBrain> | A &; B I can understand :) |
| 13:49 | <Eddi|zuHause> | A &; B is a syntax error |
| 13:49 | <TrueBrain> | Eddi|zuHause: kewl :D |
| 13:49 | <Eddi|zuHause> | cannot have empty statements |
| 13:49 | <TrueBrain> | learn something new every day :D |
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| 14:02 | <MINM> | truebrain: any sane /western/ language, yes |
| 14:03 | <TrueBrain> | huh? |
| 14:03 | <TrueBrain> | I was talking about imperitive languages :D |
| 14:04 | <TrueBrain> | Inperative |
| 14:04 | <TrueBrain> | Imperative |
| 14:04 | <TrueBrain> | 3rd time is the charm |
| 14:06 | <MINM> | I got the point. |
| 14:06 | <MINM> | good effort, though :P |
| 14:06 | <TrueBrain> | I hate my own typing sometimes :) |
| 14:07 | <MINM> | my typing is allright, I suppose, i just have some odd corners in my mind which still think 'definitely' is spelled with an a, for example :P |
| 14:08 | <@planetmaker> | yeah... like spelling of alright ;-) |
| 14:09 | <__ln__> | MINM: 'alright' is spelled with one l. |
| 14:10 | <__ln__> | oh, pm noticed that already |
| 14:12 | <MINM> | hmmmh |
| 14:12 | <MINM> | I blame that one on my not being a native speaker :P |
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| 14:13 | <__ln__> | that's a very bad excuse, because native speakers usually spell worse than non-natives. |
| 14:13 | <TrueBrain> | it is a nice way of proving your point I guess ;) |
| 14:15 | <@planetmaker> | gotta love it: "setup found that your system has 2GB of memory. The programme needs 128MB of memory. The game might run slow or instable. Do you want to continue?" |
| 14:15 | <TrueBrain> | huh? LolZ! |
| 14:15 | <Terkhen> | heh, which game? |
| 14:15 | <@planetmaker> | HOOM4 in wine |
| 14:16 | <@planetmaker> | err.. Heroes of Might and Magic |
| 14:16 | <@planetmaker> | HOMM ;-) |
| 14:16 | <__ln__> | it only becomes very lolz if it refuses to install because of that. |
| 14:16 | <@planetmaker> | it allows to continue install. Fortunately |
| 14:16 | <TrueBrain> | and your computer only has 2GB of memory?! |
| 14:16 | <Terkhen> | well, games do strange stuff in wine :P |
| 14:16 | <TrueBrain> | poor planetmaker |
| 14:17 | <@planetmaker> | yeah :-( |
| 14:17 | <TrueBrain> | can you start Firefox at all? |
| 14:17 | <@planetmaker> | it was quite a lot 4 years ago for a laptop |
| 14:17 | <Terkhen> | probably, as long as he does not use more than one tab |
| 14:17 | <@planetmaker> | that's not really an issue, tbh |
| 14:18 | <@planetmaker> | but yes, now I'd love more :-) |
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| 14:23 | <Prof_Frink> | "Warning you have a 1 colour display; Lemmings requires a 256 colour display" |
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| 14:49 | <@planetmaker> | hmpf... I told macports to upgrade wine. And not to upgrade virtually everything, including X and what-not-all |
| 14:50 | <@planetmaker> | bison, flex, perl, libiconv, libpng, openssl... |
| 14:50 | <@planetmaker> | makes one wonder |
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| 14:55 | <TrueBrain> | wine all depends on it :D |
| 14:56 | <@planetmaker> | obviously |
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| 14:58 | <TrueBrain> | @op |
| 14:58 | -!- | mode/#openttd [+o TrueBrain] by DorpsGek |
| 14:58 | -!- | mode/#openttd [-b *!5ab27afe@ircip2.mibbit.com] by TrueBrain |
| 14:58 | -!- | mode/#openttd [-b *!5ab27afe@*] by TrueBrain |
| 14:58 | <@TrueBrain> | @deop |
| 14:58 | -!- | mode/#openttd [-o TrueBrain] by DorpsGek |
| 14:58 | <TrueBrain> | tnx DorpsGek |
| 14:58 | <@DorpsGek> | yw |
| 14:59 | <V453000> | :D |
| 14:59 | <Sacro> | @op |
| 14:59 | <Sacro> | :( |
| 15:00 | <TrueBrain> | be happy I am in a good mood; otherwise I am sure DorpsGek would have kicked you with the mssage: +o :P |
| 15:00 | <TrueBrain> | well, tbh, I am just lazy ;) |
| 15:00 | <TrueBrain> | :D:D :) |
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| 15:31 | <andythenorth> | efanink |
| 15:32 | <__ln__> | http://auto.fishki.net/comment.php?id=100271 |
| 15:35 | <MINM> | ...This is slightly stupid. |
| 15:35 | <MINM> | also, that must have happened at quite a massive speed D: |
| 15:36 | <Terkhen> | hi andythenorth |
| 15:36 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yeah, my thought as welll |
| 15:37 | <Eddi|zuHause> | that does not look healthy at all |
| 15:49 | <+michi_cc> | Eddi|zuHause: Am I seeing right that we're out of articulated IDs now? |
| 15:49 | <Eddi|zuHause> | michi_cc: yup |
| 15:49 | <Eddi|zuHause> | all gone |
| 15:50 | <Eddi|zuHause> | so if we need any more, we need some magic shuffling, or we need the new articulated callback |
| 15:51 | <Eddi|zuHause> | the magic shuffling is a little limited, because we can't adjust capacity by the "front". |
| 15:51 | <Eddi|zuHause> | as _someone_ decided to make var 61 not available during callbacks :p |
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| 15:53 | <andythenorth> | you only need <128 for trailing parts, right? |
| 15:53 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yes. |
| 15:53 | <Eddi|zuHause> | and we are freshly out of those |
| 15:54 | <andythenorth> | so you only need one ID for that? |
| 15:54 | <Eddi|zuHause> | no |
| 15:54 | <andythenorth> | one trailing vehicle, and a ton of horrible conditional magic |
| 15:54 | <andythenorth> | why? |
| 15:54 | <Eddi|zuHause> | as i said, that would require var61 access during at least cb36 |
| 15:54 | <andythenorth> | ach |
| 15:55 | <Eddi|zuHause> | *or* access to the "articulated front" as "related vehicle" |
| 15:55 | <andythenorth> | why do you need that? |
| 15:55 | <Eddi|zuHause> | length, capacity, loading speed, ... |
| 15:56 | <andythenorth> | what's 82 reference for an articulated train? |
| 15:56 | <Eddi|zuHause> | always the front engine of the train |
| 15:57 | <andythenorth> | bah |
| 15:57 | <andythenorth> | that's no help then :( |
| 15:57 | <Eddi|zuHause> | exactly |
| 15:57 | <andythenorth> | patch trunk :P |
| 15:58 | <Eddi|zuHause> | hm... is the tt-forum's favicon broken or is that just me? |
| 15:59 | <andythenorth> | and var 60 is insufficient :| |
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| 16:02 | <Eddi|zuHause> | var 63: access of variables of the first articulated part (self if not articulated). |
| 16:03 | <Eddi|zuHause> | hm, "self" is probably a bad idea |
| 16:03 | <Eddi|zuHause> | nah, should be fine |
| 16:03 | <+michi_cc> | That really should be http://wiki.openttd.org/Frosch/Secondary_Related_Objects though, even 61 feels very hacky already :) |
| 16:04 | -!- | perk11 [~perk11@188.32.29.238] has joined #openttd |
| 16:05 | <+michi_cc> | And of course http://www.icosahedron.de/openttd/patches/cb14_with_register.patch but that also should be frosch's grfv8 mq instead |
| 16:05 | <Eddi|zuHause> | then hurry up!! :) |
| 16:07 | <andythenorth> | no patience :P |
| 16:08 | <+michi_cc> | Pester frosch for GRFv8, maybe he has a patch for the related objects already as well :p |
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| 16:15 | <andythenorth> | smoke for ships is *clearly• a higher priority :P |
| 16:17 | <Eddi|zuHause> | http://www.railpictures.net/images/d1/3/5/7/5357.1204131600.jpg <- "die spinnen die briten" |
| 16:18 | <andythenorth> | ? |
| 16:18 | * | andythenorth has to visit google translate? |
| 16:19 | <Eddi|zuHause> | no, just ignore that part :) |
| 16:19 | <andythenorth> | looks like Newcastle to me, at a guess |
| 16:20 | <supermop_> | nice set of points and Xs |
| 16:23 | <Terkhen> | good night |
| 16:23 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: the phrase (roughly translated): "they are silly, these <people>" is a running gag from asterix |
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| 16:24 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: that sounds familiar ;) |
| 16:24 | <andythenorth> | Obelix says it? |
| 16:24 | <Elukka> | http://www.smallshawrailroad.com/ |
| 16:24 | <Elukka> | oh yay this site is back up |
| 16:24 | <Eddi|zuHause> | probably |
| 16:24 | <Elukka> | one of the more impressive model railroads i've seen |
| 16:25 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 16:25 | <andythenorth> | my model train days are way behind me |
| 16:26 | <andythenorth> | between pixels and lego... |
| 16:26 | <andythenorth> | there's no cmd-z on real trains |
| 16:26 | <andythenorth> | and it's a lot of faff |
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| 16:26 | <andythenorth> | lego has a very similar 'undo' feature to most software |
| 16:27 | <Elukka> | http://www.smallshawrailroad.com/at_high_street.jpg |
| 16:30 | <andythenorth> | those tracks are not on the grid |
| 16:31 | <Prof_Frink> | andythenorth: But doesn't replicate the satisfying nature of putting a Hornby engine on an otherwise Tri-Ang system. |
| 16:31 | * | andythenorth had mostly Lima anyway |
| 16:31 | <andythenorth> | Lego has much more spectacular crashes |
| 16:32 | <V453000> | Elukka: wonderful, your doing? |
| 16:32 | <Elukka> | haha no |
| 16:32 | <andythenorth> | oh god |
| 16:32 | <andythenorth> | everyone is going to stop coding ttd and play with their trains :( |
| 16:32 | <Elukka> | i linked the main page a few minutes back :P |
| 16:32 | <andythenorth> | this is bad |
| 16:33 | <Elukka> | http://www.smallshawrailroad.com/web%20pics/trackwork.jpg |
| 16:33 | <Elukka> | http://www.smallshawrailroad.com/web%20pics/trackwork2.jpg |
| 16:33 | <Elukka> | handmade trackwork... |
| 16:33 | <Elukka> | tolerances are tiny |
| 16:34 | <Elukka> | http://www.smallshawrailroad.com/web%20pics/Y6B.jpg |
| 16:34 | <Elukka> | "Perhaps Harold's crowning achievement was his scratch built Norfolk & Western RR Y6B. Harold labored over this locomotive for years. Everything, except the wheels, was made by Harold. We chided him for not painting it but he still had to add some more parts to it, he would say." |
| 16:34 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Elukka: those welders did a crappy job there... |
| 16:37 | <Eddi|zuHause> | (yes, i know that these are actually isolating sections) |
| 16:39 | <Elukka> | how appropriate that my media player decides to play 'Spike in a Rail' |
| 16:45 | <appe> | what an aewsome train. |
| 16:46 | <V453000> | andythenorth: too expensive hobby :P |
| 16:46 | <andythenorth> | trains? |
| 16:46 | <andythenorth> | pixels are cheaper |
| 16:46 | <V453000> | yes, model trains |
| 16:47 | <andythenorth> | you can buy a very nice mac every year compared to the cost of doing trains properly |
| 16:47 | <V453000> | pixels B good :) |
| 16:47 | <V453000> | hehe yes |
| 16:47 | <andythenorth> | lego trains are rinsingly expensive |
| 16:48 | <andythenorth> | and I never take them apart to build different ones :( |
| 16:48 | <V453000> | :D |
| 16:48 | <andythenorth> | I just buy more :P |
| 16:48 | <andythenorth> | this is where my money goes |
| 16:49 | <supermop_> | one could at a point just start building things in real life - |
| 16:49 | <supermop_> | furniture, houses, gardens, |
| 16:50 | <andythenorth> | from Lego? |
| 16:51 | <Elukka> | surely buying a very nice mac every year is much more expensive |
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| 16:51 | <andythenorth> | I don't buy one every year :) |
| 16:52 | <andythenorth> | fortunately the tech improvements are rather stuck for laptops |
| 16:52 | <andythenorth> | so there's little reason to buy new ones |
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| 16:52 | <MINM> | buy me one! ^.^ |
| 16:53 | <Eddi|zuHause> | a mac one year, a macbook next year, an ipod next year, an iphone next year, an ipad next year, and by the next year, the mac is outdated again, starting the cycle all over again |
| 16:53 | <andythenorth> | did I mention a spent all my money on Lego? |
| 16:53 | <MINM> | awww. |
| 16:53 | <andythenorth> | the iphone sucks |
| 16:53 | <MINM> | you have pics? |
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| 16:54 | <MINM> | I had a friend who had this really cool lego train set, and then I had three nephews who frequently pooled their lego trains |
| 16:54 | <andythenorth> | MINM: http://www.flickr.com/photos/andythenorth/ |
| 16:54 | <MINM> | it was glorious |
| 16:54 | <MINM> | and I was very jealous :( |
| 16:54 | <andythenorth> | I don't have any pictures of 'all of it' |
| 16:54 | <andythenorth> | most of it is in boxes due to the baby |
| 16:54 | <MINM> | ah. |
| 16:55 | <MINM> | what do you think of the new flexible tracks? |
| 16:55 | <andythenorth> | noisy |
| 16:55 | <andythenorth> | but a lot less boring than trying to make fixed shapes fit together |
| 16:56 | <__ln__> | http://arxiv.org/abs/1110.2685 |
| 16:57 | <V453000> | andythenorth: jesus :D |
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| 16:59 | <MINM> | I still want to build a full-suspension tracked vehicle with lego some time. :P |
| 16:59 | <Elukka> | Eddi|zuHause: you forgot the small preplanned incremental improvements or features they removed from the original so they can sell it a few months later at full price again |
| 17:01 | <andythenorth> | like FW |
| 17:01 | <MINM> | possibly with a fully functioning drivetrain :D |
| 17:01 | <andythenorth> | or actually, you know, making phone calls |
| 17:01 | <__ln__> | well.. still.. can someone point me to a piece of pc hardware that is at least as small as a Mac Mini, and has at least the same specs, and is cheaper? |
| 17:02 | <andythenorth> | almost certainly |
| 17:02 | <andythenorth> | the mac mini is now insanely expensive |
| 17:02 | <andythenorth> | when it was about £325 it was a bargain |
| 17:02 | <andythenorth> | but apple are no longer interested in selling computers that are cheaper than an ipad :) |
| 17:03 | <MINM> | well, who can blame them |
| 17:03 | <MINM> | though personally Id price the pad down, not the mini up >.< |
| 17:03 | <andythenorth> | none of this gets smoke fixed for ships :P |
| 17:03 | <andythenorth> | what do I need to do? |
| 17:03 | <andythenorth> | like, learn c++ or something? |
| 17:03 | <MINM> | http://www.flickr.com/photos/andythenorth/4733367228/in/photostream/lightbox/ |
| 17:04 | <MINM> | selfbuild, andy? |
| 17:04 | <andythenorth> | mod of lego set |
| 17:04 | <MINM> | ah |
| 17:04 | <andythenorth> | http://www.brickset.com/detail/?Set=8285-1 |
| 17:04 | <andythenorth> | I tend to be good at copying + extending other people's ideas |
| 17:05 | <MINM> | ah. |
| 17:05 | <andythenorth> | e.g. FIRS :P |
| 17:05 | <Elukka> | personally i'm a fan of the desktop macs you can customize on their website and see how they charge humongous amounts of money for the exact same hardware that goes into a PC |
| 17:05 | <MINM> | yeah, I always have prided myself over selfbuilds |
| 17:06 | <andythenorth> | it's because you don't charge your time |
| 17:06 | <andythenorth> | :) |
| 17:06 | <MINM> | lol |
| 17:06 | <MINM> | well, I was a bit younger then |
| 17:06 | <MINM> | sadly I didn't have a lot of lego |
| 17:06 | <MINM> | so I was forced to be creative. |
| 17:06 | <MINM> | I did have (old school) knex, though, that stuff was glorious. |
| 17:07 | <MINM> | looks less pretty, but you could easily build functioning vehicles with little (and cheap) parts |
| 17:07 | <andythenorth> | it started with this: http://www.flickr.com/photos/andythenorth/4732699069/in/set-72157624355065972 |
| 17:07 | <andythenorth> | and got...bigger |
| 17:08 | <MINM> | I built vehicles a foot wide up till four or five long, (granted, Im counting trailers too) |
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| 17:09 | <MINM> | with fully functioning double steering front axles and all |
| 17:10 | <andythenorth> | http://www.flickr.com/photos/andythenorth/sets/72157624454166047/ |
| 17:10 | <MINM> | the only disadvantage of the stuff was that the joints are bendy, so beyond two feet or so it gets flexy |
| 17:10 | <MINM> | yeah, about that scale. |
| 17:11 | <MINM> | mine didn't have fancy smooth decks, though |
| 17:11 | <MINM> | all wireframe |
| 17:13 | <MINM> | http://www.flickr.com/photos/andythenorth/4733357678/in/photostream/lightbox/ |
| 17:13 | <MINM> | Do want |
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| 17:13 | <andythenorth> | probably expensive now - no longer available new |
| 17:13 | <andythenorth> | it's a good toy |
| 17:14 | <andythenorth> | this is also good: http://www.brickset.com/detail/?Set=8043-1 |
| 17:14 | <MINM> | meh, I wouldn't pay that much for something that Id cannibalize for parts after a couple of months |
| 17:14 | <andythenorth> | the B-model for the excavator is really effective |
| 17:15 | <MINM> | http://www.1000steine.com/brickset/AdditionalImages/8043-1/8043-0000-xx-33-2.jpg |
| 17:15 | <MINM> | this one? |
| 17:15 | <Elukka> | that isn't any cheaper than model trains :P |
| 17:15 | <andythenorth> | yes that one |
| 17:15 | <andythenorth> | it's way *not* cheaper than model trains :P |
| 17:16 | <MINM> | well, model trains mechanization is slightly simpler than making machines like that move :D |
| 17:16 | <Elukka> | maybe |
| 17:16 | <Elukka> | the valve gear on steam locomotive seems like it'd be a bit hard, even if it just moves with the wheels |
| 17:20 | <MINM> | well, I meant more like the electric components and all |
| 17:23 | * | andythenorth -> bed |
| 17:23 | <andythenorth> | good night |
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| 17:23 | <MINM> | my babysitting kids have http://www.brickset.com/detail/?Set=150-1 |
| 17:23 | <MINM> | this set |
| 17:24 | <MINM> | oh, he's gone >.< |
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| --- | Log | closed Thu Oct 27 00:00:20 2011 |
