| --- | Log | opened Tue Dec 06 00:00:43 2011 |
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| 02:28 | <@planetmaker> | moin |
| 02:33 | <appe> | morning |
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| 02:57 | <@Terkhen> | good morning |
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| 03:17 | <Zuu> | morning and off to work :-) |
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| 03:28 | <dihedral> | greetings |
| 03:29 | <@Terkhen> | hi dihedral |
| 03:30 | <@peter1138> | urgh, definitely done something to my shoulders/upper back :S |
| 03:30 | <@planetmaker> | hi DDR |
| 03:30 | <@planetmaker> | ehm... hi dihedral |
| 03:31 | <DDR> | Hi, planetmaker. |
| 03:31 | <@planetmaker> | :-) |
| 03:31 | <DDR> | What's up? |
| 03:31 | <dihedral> | :-P |
| 03:31 | <@peter1138> | carrying 8 * 23kg boxes upstairs apparently did it for me :S |
| 03:31 | <@planetmaker> | tab completion is up :-P |
| 03:31 | <dihedral> | the line from Terkhen is |
| 03:31 | <DDR> | Yay! I lurvs tab completion! |
| 03:32 | <dihedral> | i love crtl+r in bash |
| 03:32 | <@planetmaker> | peter1138: do it more often and you'll be fine even afterwards ;-) |
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| 03:33 | <dihedral> | or simply have it amputated if it annoys you :-P |
| 03:33 | <@peter1138> | true that |
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| 05:59 | <@planetmaker> | hm, qc is getting really philosophical ;-) |
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| 06:43 | <Lachie> | evening |
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| 06:56 | <@Terkhen> | hi Lachie |
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| 07:01 | <Lachie> | what's happening? |
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| 07:12 | <@peter1138> | i'm testing EZ sprites |
| 07:12 | <@peter1138> | or will do, once the 32bit-gfx-nightly-megapack-2011-06-15.tar downloads |
| 07:12 | <@peter1138> | 38.9MB ~ 100KB/s :( |
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| 07:17 | <@peter1138> | of course, they're quite ugly, but i can't fix that ;) |
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| 08:02 | <@planetmaker> | peter1138, I'm pondering to start a 'real' 32bpp base set or to add that maybe even directly to OpenGFX. Not yet sure what makes sense |
| 08:02 | <@planetmaker> | definitely not all existing 32bpp EZ sprites do |
| 08:03 | <@Terkhen> | that would be nice :) |
| 08:04 | <@peter1138> | 32bpp-optimized/anim are crashing :( |
| 08:06 | <@planetmaker> | but I'd definitely like bananas support for that... |
| 08:08 | <@planetmaker> | until then I guess I'll have to supply the "standard package" via bananas and the "extended package" via DevZone |
| 08:12 | <@planetmaker> | Mostly it'll need a graphics artist to really work on that, too |
| 08:12 | <@planetmaker> | To make it all a bit consistent |
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| 08:28 | <@peter1138> | if dst > dst_ln... i've done something wrong. hmm. |
| 08:28 | <@peter1138> | i somehow doubt there are 2.5 million pixels in this row... |
| 08:29 | <@peter1138> | oh, /4 |
| 08:29 | <@peter1138> | still :) |
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| 08:38 | -!- | Amis [~Amis@94-21-110-154.pool.digikabel.hu] has joined #openttd |
| 08:38 | <Amis> | Hello o/ |
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| 08:39 | <Amis> | Is it possible to turn on "Funding only" for industries when the game is already running? (like through console or something) |
| 08:40 | <@planetmaker> | yes |
| 08:40 | <@planetmaker> | through console |
| 08:40 | <Amis> | Which command is it? |
| 08:40 | <@planetmaker> | look up your openttd.cfg |
| 08:40 | <@planetmaker> | set settingname value |
| 08:41 | <@planetmaker> | or on servers via rcon set settingname value |
| 08:41 | <@planetmaker> | I probably miss some quotes |
| 08:42 | <@planetmaker> | in SP you can of course change it directly via GUI |
| 08:42 | <Amis> | I guess it's "number_industries" and zero is the value of funding only |
| 08:42 | <@planetmaker> | sounds wrong |
| 08:42 | <Amis> | Then "industry_density"? |
| 08:43 | <@planetmaker> | raw_industry_construction |
| 08:43 | <@planetmaker> | you can always fund secondary ones |
| 08:43 | <Amis> | Oh, you may misunderstood me |
| 08:44 | <Amis> | I'm looking for the one at map generation |
| 08:44 | <Amis> | Not how you can fund industries |
| 08:44 | <@planetmaker> | eh? |
| 08:44 | <@planetmaker> | on a server or in single player? |
| 08:44 | <Amis> | The number of industries (very low, low, etc...) when generating a new map |
| 08:44 | <+glx> | so you don't want any industries at start |
| 08:45 | <Amis> | No, I have this map running but the rate at the industries spawn is kinda high and I want to disabled the spawning of new industries |
| 08:45 | <Amis> | Only player should create industries now |
| 08:45 | <@planetmaker> | then the settings you said are the correct ones. Not sure though that changing them has an effect |
| 08:45 | <@planetmaker> | try :-) |
| 08:47 | <Amis> | Great, "number_industries" is unknown and density one is for network only :/ |
| 08:47 | <Eddi|zuHause> | "HEQ's" ... oh my eyes bleed! :/ |
| 08:48 | <@planetmaker> | I nearly thought so. |
| 08:48 | <@planetmaker> | So what you want to do basically, Amis , is create a new map with no industries and no industry density, manually place in the SE a few industries, if you want and load that map |
| 08:50 | <+glx> | difficulty.industry_density |
| 08:50 | <Amis> | planetmaker, no. I have a map already created and playing it for a while. I want to "set" the spawn rate of new industries to "Funding only" so only ME can create industries and the game won't flood my shores with stupid oil rigs and etc... |
| 08:50 | <+glx> | set it to 0 |
| 08:51 | <Amis> | glx, for multi only :/ |
| 08:52 | <+glx> | no newgame only indeed |
| 08:52 | <Amis> | *sadface* |
| 08:53 | <Amis> | I guess I have to turn on the magic bulldozer and get rid of em manually |
| 08:53 | <+glx> | probably because newgrfs |
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| 08:55 | <Amis> | I do have some newgrfs but it does the same in a default setting. If you have minimal amount of water area around the edges and you are playing for a while (let's say 20 years) it will keep spawning new oil rigs on there so you'll end up with rigs on rigs |
| 09:00 | <Eddi|zuHause> | we should maybe invest some time to make the difficulty settings changable ingame. e.g. max load or industry density |
| 09:01 | * | Amis nods in agreement |
| 09:01 | <@planetmaker> | The difficulty settings IMHO rather should be converted to normal settings |
| 09:01 | <@planetmaker> | Difficulty is hardly affected by them (or at least as much by other settings) |
| 09:01 | <@planetmaker> | And then maybe setting presets which could be like both, "newbie", "advanced" "all" and "easy", "moderate" "hard" as the other category |
| 09:02 | <Amis> | Nowdays difficulty settings = kinkeh newgrfs |
| 09:02 | <@planetmaker> | and one should move over some game options there, too |
| 09:02 | <@planetmaker> | maybe I should re-activate my meanwhile ancient patch queue... |
| 09:03 | <Eddi|zuHause> | but that is something entirely unrelated |
| 09:05 | <+glx> | won't change the fact that some newgrf read these settings on init and can cause desync if the setting is change between 2 player joins |
| 09:06 | <+glx> | that's the only reason to disable changing some settings ingame |
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| 09:09 | <Eddi|zuHause> | but that applies only to multiplayer |
| 09:09 | <Eddi|zuHause> | the difficulty settings are also not changable in _single_ playeer |
| 09:13 | <@Belugas> | hello |
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| 09:20 | <@peter1138> | size mismatch: full-size 130 256 (33 64), scaled 32 64 |
| 09:20 | <@peter1138> | hmm |
| 09:20 | <@peter1138> | that might be it |
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| 09:21 | <@peter1138> | trying to draw a row that doesn't exist. hmm. |
| 09:22 | -!- | andythenorth [~Andy@venncaps.watershed.co.uk] has joined #openttd |
| 09:22 | <andythenorth> | was this prototyped in ottd? |
| 09:22 | <andythenorth> | http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16047098 |
| 09:22 | <andythenorth> | :P |
| 09:26 | <@peter1138> | yes, that's it :D |
| 09:27 | <@peter1138> | i wonder how 32bpp-EZ coped... |
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| 09:44 | <@peter1138> | hmmmmm |
| 09:49 | <andythenorth> | yup |
| 09:49 | <andythenorth> | my thoughts exactly |
| 09:51 | <@peter1138> | http://fuzzle.org/~petern/ottd/yaez3.png |
| 09:51 | <@peter1138> | yeah :S |
| 09:51 | <@peter1138> | hmm |
| 09:51 | <andythenorth> | madness |
| 09:51 | <@planetmaker> | not bad, peter1138 |
| 09:51 | <andythenorth> | some of those buildings aren't pixelated |
| 09:51 | <andythenorth> | what's that about :P |
| 09:51 | <@planetmaker> | cheap rip-off :-P |
| 09:52 | <@peter1138> | oh |
| 09:52 | <@peter1138> | fixed the tall 32bpp sprites being pixelates |
| 09:52 | <andythenorth> | peter1138: are you planning to add a filter that down-samples those nasty hi-res sprites? |
| 09:52 | <@planetmaker> | I'd say 'no' |
| 09:53 | <@planetmaker> | normal tile size should stay authorative |
| 09:53 | <@peter1138> | nope |
| 09:53 | <@planetmaker> | rest is 'extra' |
| 09:53 | <andythenorth> | pah |
| 09:53 | <andythenorth> | :) |
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| 09:56 | <@peter1138> | oh, you want them blocky? heh |
| 09:56 | <@peter1138> | well, don't install the EZ sprites ;) |
| 09:56 | <@planetmaker> | :-D |
| 09:56 | <@peter1138> | (i assume it's possible to have tars full of normal zoom sprites and separate tars for extra zoom) |
| 09:57 | <@peter1138> | some of these ez sprites have massive shadows that aren't drawn properly |
| 09:57 | <@peter1138> | stick out too far from the tile edge |
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| 09:57 | <@peter1138> | much likes FIR's smoke :) |
| 09:57 | <@planetmaker> | hm... shouldn't EZ sprites always have normal zoom accompany them? |
| 09:57 | <andythenorth> | stupid FIRS |
| 09:57 | <@peter1138> | planetmaker, it's not necessary |
| 09:58 | <@planetmaker> | well. Not necessary. But it will be strange |
| 09:58 | <@planetmaker> | How do I then select which EZ sprite to use? |
| 09:58 | <andythenorth> | some of these EZ sprites are confused about where the sun is :P |
| 09:58 | <@planetmaker> | if they're not a set? |
| 09:58 | <@planetmaker> | with the concurrently used normal zoom |
| 09:58 | <@Yexo> | <peter1138> (i assume it's possible to have tars full of normal zoom sprites and separate tars for extra zoom) <- I don't think that is currently possible, but perhaps it is |
| 09:58 | <@Yexo> | don't the sprites for a newgrf have to be in the same tar file as the grf itself? |
| 09:59 | <@planetmaker> | ^^ I'd like that actually to be necessary |
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| 09:59 | <@peter1138> | huh? |
| 09:59 | <@planetmaker> | or you might very easily get WAY too many cross-talk of unwanted category |
| 10:00 | <@peter1138> | Yexo, no |
| 10:00 | <@peter1138> | it's not currently necessary, and these 32bpp-ez sprites rely on it |
| 10:00 | <@peter1138> | anyway we scale sprites as needed |
| 10:00 | <@Yexo> | how does it work? directory name has to match the grf name? |
| 10:00 | <@peter1138> | Yexo, yup, just that |
| 10:00 | <@planetmaker> | peter1138, but how do they / should theybehave if I have two versions of them? In separate tars? |
| 10:00 | <@peter1138> | that's TrueBrain's design ;) |
| 10:00 | <@planetmaker> | I see much mayhem going there |
| 10:00 | <@peter1138> | planetmaker, buggered if i know |
| 10:01 | <@Yexo> | make the version part of the grf name |
| 10:01 | <@planetmaker> | I'd say "same tar" |
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| 10:02 | <@planetmaker> | because now I forsee that I'll have newgrf or baseset v0.1 with both 8bpp and 32bpp. And then v0.2 also. And... yeah :-) |
| 10:03 | <andythenorth> | broken FIRS smoke in high res |
| 10:03 | <@planetmaker> | Feature: High-resolution bugs |
| 10:03 | <@planetmaker> | or bugs in HD :-P |
| 10:03 | <@peter1138> | andythenorth, it's broken whatever res |
| 10:04 | <andythenorth> | I know but it will be broken better in hi res |
| 10:04 | <andythenorth> | more players will be attracted |
| 10:04 | <@peter1138> | this pack has a miserable 3 vehicles done |
| 10:05 | <@peter1138> | and they're crap |
| 10:05 | <@planetmaker> | peter1138, at the same time I'd not want the 32bpp be active when I use a NewGRF to actionA replace the sprites |
| 10:05 | <@peter1138> | planetmaker, why? |
| 10:05 | <@peter1138> | i assume you know how that works |
| 10:05 | <@planetmaker> | might totally not match the actionA replaced sprite |
| 10:05 | <@Yexo> | planetmaker: if it works well the 32bpp sprites from the newgrf that uses the actionA would be loaded |
| 10:05 | <@peter1138> | it will look for 32bpp versions of the replacement sprites... |
| 10:06 | <@planetmaker> | good :-) |
| 10:06 | <@peter1138> | none of this is new |
| 10:06 | <@peter1138> | 32bpp sprites have always been loaded based on grf file name and sprite id within |
| 10:07 | <@planetmaker> | sorry, wasn't sure about actionA :-) |
| 10:07 | <@peter1138> | action a will of course update those, so it won't magically know how to load the original unreplaced sprite |
| 10:07 | <@planetmaker> | yes. That's goood |
| 10:07 | <@peter1138> | and that's been there since 32bpp was introduced |
| 10:07 | <@peter1138> | i'm sure you've tested it with all the 32bpp sets available :D |
| 10:08 | <@planetmaker> | :D |
| 10:08 | <@planetmaker> | but too long ago to test it all in detail :-) |
| 10:09 | <CIA-6> | OpenTTD: yexo * r23439 /trunk/src/script/squirrel.cpp: -Fix: Use the DEBUG macro to output the reason for a compile failure in info.nut instead of printing it directly to stderr |
| 10:11 | <@peter1138> | so... still wonder how 32bpp-ez gets around this blitter issue |
| 10:12 | <@peter1138> | blitter params are set up based on the zoomed in sprite dimensions |
| 10:12 | <@peter1138> | if the zoom level sprite is a smaller, it'll read out of bounds and break |
| 10:13 | <@Yexo> | are you sure it deals properly with that? Perhaps it just added a bounds check to prevent crashes |
| 10:13 | <@peter1138> | 32bpp-ez doesn't appear to change that, but i could be missing it :) |
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| 10:13 | <@peter1138> | could be hidden in their changes to GfxMainBlitter |
| 10:15 | <@peter1138> | oh, i see |
| 10:15 | <@peter1138> | GetSprite returns a different sprite based on the global _cur_dpi->zoom |
| 10:16 | <@peter1138> | nasty |
| 10:16 | <@peter1138> | otoh, it means gfxmainblitter has the real sprite size |
| 10:17 | <@peter1138> | i haven't changed the spritecache that way though |
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| 10:19 | <@peter1138> | maybe i should o_O |
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| 10:36 | <@peter1138> | http://fuzzle.org/~petern/ottd/yaez4.png |
| 10:36 | <@peter1138> | yeah, delightful |
| 10:36 | <@peter1138> | tall sprites loading |
| 10:36 | <@peter1138> | and dodgy shadows showing :p |
| 10:36 | <@peter1138> | oh, and dodgy recolour sprites |
| 10:38 | <Elukka> | hm. somehow most 32bpp sprites look less detailed than 8 bit ones |
| 10:38 | <Elukka> | they have that untextured 3D model look |
| 10:39 | <@peter1138> | yup |
| 10:39 | <SpComb> | reflections, eh |
| 10:39 | <@Terkhen> | yes, they look plain |
| 10:40 | <Elukka> | i suppose another problem with them is that you'd need some kind of general art direction to make them look good and consistent |
| 10:41 | <@Terkhen> | since all of them would be "new" sprites, they could establish conventions such as "direction of light" and "direction of wind" that are not consistent with 8bpp |
| 10:41 | <@Terkhen> | not that I notice those details :P |
| 10:44 | <@peter1138> | apparently the sun is at about 3:10pm |
| 10:45 | <@peter1138> | how reasonable is it to require sprites to be the correct scaled size? |
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| 10:49 | <Elukka> | i think the models would need proper texturing to look really good as sprites |
| 10:51 | <Rubidium> | peter1138: I see no reason why that couldn't be a condition for the sprites (read: I'm okay with such a requirement if is makes stuff simpler code wise) |
| 10:51 | <@planetmaker> | direction of light is - according to andy - about 4:30pm |
| 10:51 | <@planetmaker> | maybe also am ;-) |
| 10:51 | <@planetmaker> | and roughly consistent size among one sprite category makes sense imho |
| 10:52 | -!- | andythenorth [~Andy@cpc1-aztw25-2-0-cust298.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd |
| 10:52 | <@planetmaker> | 16:45 peter1138: how reasonable is it to require sprites to be the correct scaled size? |
| 10:52 | <@planetmaker> | ^^ you mean that the zoom-level sprites must be the same proportions properly scaled? |
| 10:52 | <@planetmaker> | would be fine with me, too |
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| 10:54 | <Ammler> | a common direction of light might be ok, but for wind it would rather be bad |
| 10:54 | <Ammler> | or boring :-) |
| 10:56 | <@peter1138> | planetmaker, don't be silly, it's dark at 4:30am ;) |
| 10:56 | <@planetmaker> | :-D |
| 10:57 | <Elukka> | it's dark at 4:30 pm now! |
| 10:57 | <@planetmaker> | Ammler: for a single set it might make sense ;-) |
| 10:57 | <@planetmaker> | I guess a common _light_ direction makes quite sense |
| 10:57 | <@peter1138> | currently if a prescaled down sprite is too small, i ignore it, and make one based on the last valid zoom level |
| 10:57 | <@planetmaker> | pre-scaled down? |
| 10:58 | <@planetmaker> | I thought we always want normal zoom? |
| 10:58 | <@peter1138> | prescaled as opposed to scaled by the game |
| 11:06 | <andythenorth> | afaik the 32bpp stuff has a common light direction if they all use the same render rig |
| 11:06 | <andythenorth> | but they've chosen a dumb direction :P |
| 11:06 | <andythenorth> | so they're all consistently ugly |
| 11:10 | <Rubidium> | I must say the *train* of http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=153009 looks pretty nice, although the shades outside of the image need to go |
| 11:11 | <@planetmaker> | yes |
| 11:11 | <andythenorth> | they are toylike which is nice |
| 11:11 | <Rubidium> | though it gives me a much higher "Thomas & friends" feel |
| 11:12 | <Eddi|zuHause> | it emphasises the need for longer wagons :) |
| 11:12 | <@planetmaker> | yeah ;-) |
| 11:13 | <Rubidium> | or... narrower/lower vehicles |
| 11:13 | <Rubidium> | will help with some other glitches as well ;) |
| 11:13 | <Eddi|zuHause> | speaking of which: i'd _really_ like a newgrf property to make the bounding box longer than the vehicle |
| 11:13 | <andythenorth> | looks like chuggington |
| 11:13 | <andythenorth> | I'd like long ships not to disappear 32% of the time :P |
| 11:18 | -!- | MEEKS1 [6d964b9e@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd |
| 11:19 | <MEEKS1> | hi can some1 help me? |
| 11:19 | <Eddi|zuHause> | www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/town_space2.diff <-- need testers, and someone who updates the found town gui |
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| 11:23 | <@peter1138> | Eddi|zuHause, why longer? |
| 11:24 | <@peter1138> | it will fuck up tunnels/bridges/probably-foundations/probably-crossing-tile-edges, etc.. |
| 11:24 | <Eddi|zuHause> | peter1138: no, it won't. shorter bounding boxes fuck up tunnels/bridges/foundations/... |
| 11:25 | -!- | sla_ro|master [slaco@95.76.26.172] has joined #openttd |
| 11:25 | <Eddi|zuHause> | e.g. if you use refit tricks to shorten a vehicle to 1lu to make a "shorter" consist |
| 11:25 | <Eddi|zuHause> | this worked fine previously, but with the new shortened bounding boxes, it glitches |
| 11:26 | <Eddi|zuHause> | HEQS trams might suffer from this (haven't checked) |
| 11:27 | <andythenorth> | what would the glitch look like? |
| 11:27 | <@peter1138> | should allow 0lu vehicles :) |
| 11:27 | <@peter1138> | then you just bung them on the end |
| 11:27 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: let it drive over a foundation or slope, the foundation will occasionally be drawn over the vehicle |
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| 11:29 | <@peter1138> | if the vehicle is bigger than the bounding box, yeah |
| 11:30 | <@peter1138> | i assume the vehicle following goes crazy with 0lu vehicles ;) |
| 11:30 | <TGYoshi> | you guys know everything so.. is it possible to split log(2x-3) so I get rid of the chain-rule? :3 |
| 11:32 | <Hirundo> | What's so bad about the chain rule? |
| 11:33 | <TGYoshi> | What´s so great about the chain rule? |
| 11:33 | <Hirundo> | It works (tm) |
| 11:33 | <Hirundo> | Now provide your answer :P |
| 11:33 | <TGYoshi> | So much writing ;) |
| 11:34 | <Hirundo> | d/dx(2x-3) = 2, I don't see how that causes much writing |
| 11:34 | <+michi_cc> | Not that it would help you with the chain rule, but log(a-b) = log(a) + log(1-b/a) |
| 11:35 | <TGYoshi> | Mwah, if I use the chain rule I gotta write all this: |
| 11:35 | <TGYoshi> | a = log(b) |
| 11:35 | <@peter1138> | hmm, not possible to have different sprite offsets either |
| 11:35 | <TGYoshi> | a´ = 1/(ln10 * b) |
| 11:35 | <TGYoshi> | b = 2x-3 |
| 11:35 | <TGYoshi> | b´ = 2 |
| 11:35 | <TGYoshi> | f´ = a´ * b´ |
| 11:36 | <TGYoshi> | = 2/(ln10 * 2x-3) |
| 11:36 | <TGYoshi> | +brackets* |
| 11:36 | <TGYoshi> | So much writing ;) |
| 11:36 | <TGYoshi> | michi_cc: ty, so much stuff? :/ |
| 11:36 | <TGYoshi> | lol |
| 11:37 | <Eddi|zuHause> | peter1138: the other application would be my longer wagons, which are currently difficult to compose of several sprites, when they go around curves or slopes |
| 11:39 | <@peter1138> | long bounding boxes aren't going to help there |
| 11:39 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yes, they actually are |
| 11:40 | <Eddi|zuHause> | well, they'd be a workaround |
| 11:40 | <Eddi|zuHause> | the other thing i need is to give a dynamic sprite offset |
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| 11:41 | <Eddi|zuHause> | as in either "draw this relative to <other vehicle>" or "apply this offset to the sprite [and use var62 to calculate the offset] |
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| 12:01 | <@peter1138> | hm |
| 12:09 | <andythenorth> | j< |
| 12:09 | <andythenorth> | gn |
| 12:09 | <andythenorth> | fb |
| 12:09 | <andythenorth> | "it seems to be a simple pattern" |
| 12:09 | <@peter1138> | well said |
| 12:10 | <andythenorth> | "possibly a repetition of a musical theme" |
| 12:11 | <Eddi|zuHause> | your < is at a weird place |
| 12:11 | <@peter1138> | no, it's the correct place |
| 12:11 | <@peter1138> | although andythenorth randomly pressed shift |
| 12:12 | <andythenorth> | I don't like that other character |
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| 12:14 | <@peter1138> | hm j, k. l/ etc |
| 12:15 | <andythenorth> | jb |
| 12:15 | <andythenorth> | g. |
| 12:15 | <andythenorth> | yj |
| 12:15 | <andythenorth> | uk |
| 12:15 | <andythenorth> | what larks |
| 12:15 | <andythenorth> | :P |
| 12:15 | <andythenorth> | we should write code for a living |
| 12:18 | <@peter1138> | i do |
| 12:18 | <@peter1138> | fortunately just computer code, not cryptographic codes :p |
| 12:19 | <murr4y> | this is good material for a new dan brown novel |
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| 12:33 | * | andythenorth makes a living paying other people to write code |
| 12:33 | * | andythenorth is a capitalist exploiter |
| 12:36 | -!- | Jordan [~quassel@CPE00221574c413-CM0026f31f4d65.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #openttd |
| 12:37 | <Jordan> | Hello, how would I go about making the icons bigger? Like 4 times bigger? |
| 12:38 | <@planetmaker> | grab the graphics programme of your choice and use the zoom algorithm of your choice and code the whole thing as NewGRF |
| 12:39 | <@planetmaker> | you might just use the BigGUI NewGRF, though |
| 12:39 | <@planetmaker> | would save you the work ;-) |
| 12:40 | <@planetmaker> | http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/ogfx-biggui/nightlies/LATEST/ <-- maybe you want this updated version |
| 12:40 | <Jordan> | okay I'll try that thanks |
| 12:48 | <lugo> | mmh i'm having issues with desyncs in a game i host (openttd-chillpp-hec8df784-windows-win32) |
| 12:48 | <lugo> | thing is, only one player gets desynced |
| 12:49 | -!- | pjpe [ade6a119@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd |
| 12:49 | <lugo> | since he has the exact same version as all other players and since the wiki reads 'Desyncs are always bugs in OpenTTD' i wonder what's happening there |
| 12:49 | <@peter1138> | 4x might be a bit much :) |
| 12:49 | <@Yexo> | you're playing with a custom patchpack, so complain in the topic for that |
| 12:49 | <andythenorth> | roadtypes2 ? |
| 12:49 | <andythenorth> | oh my fingers slipped :P |
| 12:49 | <andythenorth> | I should learn to buffer brain and fingers |
| 12:50 | <lugo> | Yexo: yeah thought there might be some general troubleshooting steps i could do before that |
| 12:50 | <@peter1138> | nah, everyone wants glossy unmatched high resolution sprites, i'm sure |
| 12:52 | <lugo> | so some tweaking in the [network] part of the config is not likely to do anything right? |
| 12:52 | <@Yexo> | not likely |
| 12:52 | <@planetmaker> | lugo: you can compile the game with desync debugging enabled, start the server in desync debugging mode and then analyse the MB of data it spews out |
| 12:52 | <@planetmaker> | and search where it differs from savegames from the clients taken in similar regular steps |
| 12:53 | <@planetmaker> | i.e. desync debugging is one of the least amusing bugs to fix |
| 12:54 | <@planetmaker> | as you've to compare state of client and server. And have a well-known initial state to start from) |
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| 12:55 | <Jordan> | there we go that's much better. Now I can differentiate between the buttons. :) |
| 12:56 | <@planetmaker> | Jordan: if you also play online, you might want to add that NewGRF in your openttd.cfg to the list of static newgrfs |
| 12:56 | <@planetmaker> | then it's always active |
| 12:57 | <lugo> | thanks planetmaker, i was afraid of that... |
| 12:57 | <Jordan> | I found the newgrf-static section in openttd.cfg but I don't know what to put |
| 12:58 | <@planetmaker> | do you have that newgrf currently in the "normal" newgrf section? |
| 12:58 | <@planetmaker> | Then just copy that line |
| 12:59 | <Jordan> | no I don't |
| 12:59 | <@planetmaker> | mind also that editing the cfg will only be effective if OpenTTD is not running |
| 12:59 | <Jordan> | right |
| 12:59 | <@planetmaker> | or it'll be overwritten once you quit OpenTTD |
| 13:00 | <Jordan> | wait |
| 13:00 | <Jordan> | >ogfx-biggui.grf = |
| 13:00 | <Jordan> | that showed up under the newgrf section |
| 13:01 | <@planetmaker> | yep. Just move that to the static section |
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| 13:01 | <@planetmaker> | save the cfg. and you're done |
| 13:01 | <Jordan> | okay cool |
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| 13:46 | <CIA-6> | OpenTTD: translators * r23440 /trunk/src/lang/ (9 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 13:46 | <CIA-6> | OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: |
| 13:46 | <CIA-6> | OpenTTD: estonian - 35 changes by hellohboy |
| 13:46 | <CIA-6> | OpenTTD: french - 25 changes by glx |
| 13:46 | <CIA-6> | OpenTTD: hungarian - 35 changes by Brumi |
| 13:46 | <CIA-6> | OpenTTD: italian - 2 changes by lorenzodv |
| 13:46 | <CIA-6> | OpenTTD: japanese - 4 changes by ikanotheokara |
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| 13:58 | <Eddi|zuHause> | possible suggestion for YACD: allow setting a percentage of cargo that will go to a random connected location (instead of choosing a completely random destination) |
| 13:59 | <Eddi|zuHause> | so an industry will produce X% for predetermined destinations, Y% for connected destinations, and Z% for random destinations |
| 14:00 | <Eddi|zuHause> | that may improve things in the beginning, when the predetermined destinations are not fitting well into your network |
| 14:08 | <Eddi|zuHause> | that'd be something inbetween current YACD and CargoDist/YACDist |
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| 14:17 | <andythenorth> | that's a nice suggestion |
| 14:17 | -!- | Tenebrae [~Tenebrae@pool-71-105-104-87.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #openttd |
| 14:17 | <andythenorth> | it's even realistic :P |
| 14:17 | <Tenebrae> | There are people here. |
| 14:17 | -!- | JVassie [~James@2.30.129.191] has joined #openttd |
| 14:17 | <Tenebrae> | Whether or not they want to answer your question is another matter entirely. |
| 14:17 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause industries don't contract so much with industries for which there is no transport :P |
| 14:17 | <Tenebrae> | Oh, snap. |
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| 14:18 | <Eddi|zuHause> | ENotAtEndOfBacklog :p |
| 14:20 | <SpComb> | EWrongPersonOnRightChannel |
| 14:21 | <andythenorth> | anyone want to code BANDIT? |
| 14:21 | <andythenorth> | :D :P |
| 14:22 | <andythenorth> | I could use a collaborator |
| 14:22 | <andythenorth> | I am endlessly fun to work with, just ask anyone round here :P |
| 14:23 | <andythenorth> | it's nml... |
| 14:23 | <Eddi|zuHause> | you could adapt my generator script :) |
| 14:23 | <Eddi|zuHause> | then all you need is a table with stats :) |
| 14:23 | <andythenorth> | your generator script handles articulated RVs? |
| 14:24 | <andythenorth> | maybe you adapt it :D |
| 14:24 | -!- | JVassie_ [~James@2.30.129.191] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] |
| 14:24 | <Eddi|zuHause> | it handles articulated trains |
| 14:24 | <andythenorth> | I find your views interesting, may I subscribe to your newsletter? |
| 14:25 | -!- | awesome [50a205e1@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd |
| 14:25 | <andythenorth> | that's pretty awesome |
| 14:25 | <awesome> | hi... how do i make aserver for my friends only? |
| 14:25 | <Rubidium> | - set a password |
| 14:25 | <Rubidium> | - don't advertise it, but let your friends enter the address manually |
| 14:25 | <awesome> | i mean how do i MAKE it? |
| 14:26 | -!- | Tenebrae [~Tenebrae@pool-71-105-104-87.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has left #openttd [Leaving] |
| 14:26 | <Rubidium> | - ask you friends over and run a LAN only game |
| 14:26 | <Eddi|zuHause> | set up your firewall and click on start multiplayer game |
| 14:26 | <Jordan> | I think he means "how do you set up a server" |
| 14:26 | <awesome> | my friend can't find the server and i have port forwarded it? |
| 14:26 | <awesome> | yes! |
| 14:27 | <Eddi|zuHause> | awesome: let them input your IP |
| 14:27 | <awesome> | how? |
| 14:27 | <Eddi|zuHause> | awesome: likely you port-forwarded only TCP, not UDP |
| 14:27 | <Jordan> | damn I have 500 passengers waiting at a bus station |
| 14:28 | <awesome> | i port forwarded in both? |
| 14:28 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Jordan: i think i had 15000 once :) |
| 14:28 | <awesome> | can i use hamachi? |
| 14:28 | <Jordan> | DAMN |
| 14:28 | <Eddi|zuHause> | awesome: i don't know what that is |
| 14:28 | <Jordan> | Hamachi is a VPN program |
| 14:28 | <Jordan> | it would work |
| 14:29 | <awesome> | ok.. 2 sec will try it out |
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| 14:29 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: you do know that code generators are always evil? |
| 14:29 | <andythenorth> | or did you not get that email? |
| 14:29 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: yep :p |
| 14:30 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: we did cover that in compiler construction lectures :p |
| 14:30 | <andythenorth> | they may seem innocent, but they are really just biding their time |
| 14:30 | <andythenorth> | waiting to bite you |
| 14:30 | <andythenorth> | with an edge case, or complexity hell |
| 14:30 | <Sacro> | I miss yacc and bison |
| 14:30 | * | andythenorth has written code generators :P |
| 14:31 | <awesome> | how do my friend join? |
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| 14:31 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: i cover edge cases with including a "custom callbacks" file |
| 14:31 | <andythenorth> | ah |
| 14:31 | <andythenorth> | cheating :P |
| 14:32 | <andythenorth> | I am trying to avoid edge cases in BANDIT - by design |
| 14:32 | <Jordan> | oh god now there's 760 passengers |
| 14:32 | <andythenorth> | conveniently, the edge cases can be put in HEQS, which is plain old NFO + CPP |
| 14:32 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: usually i use this for some weird articulation exceptions... usual articulation is done by (AB*C) |
| 14:32 | -!- | Joker [50a205e1@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd |
| 14:33 | <Eddi|zuHause> | but i have a train that has ABC*D |
| 14:33 | <Joker> | how did my friend join my hamachi server? |
| 14:33 | <Jordan> | you give him your hamachi network's name and password |
| 14:33 | <Joker> | yes but ingame |
| 14:33 | <@Belugas> | he prefered to be with your hamachi server than with you! |
| 14:33 | <Jordan> | he enter's your computer's IP address |
| 14:34 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Joker: search for LAN games? |
| 14:34 | <Joker> | okay..... we are in a hamachi group! but how does he connect in game? |
| 14:35 | <Eddi|zuHause> | "making something idiot proof just creates better idiots" |
| 14:36 | <@Alberth> | Joker: he picks an existing company, or creates a new one |
| 14:37 | <@Alberth> | Joker: http://wiki.openttd.org/Multiplayer#Entering_the_game |
| 14:38 | <Joker> | he can't find the server! |
| 14:38 | <Joker> | F.I.N.D! |
| 14:38 | <@planetmaker> | Joker: setup your network properly and allow the proper ports to pass |
| 14:39 | <@planetmaker> | @ports |
| 14:39 | <@DorpsGek> | planetmaker: OpenTTD uses TCP and UDP port 3979 for server <-> client communication, UDP port 3978 for masterserver (advertise) communication (outbound), and TCP port 3978 for content service, a.k.a. BaNaNaS (outbound) |
| 14:39 | <@Alberth> | you don't need to find it if you have its IP address |
| 14:39 | <@planetmaker> | and search the forum for it. In 99.995% the people mis-configured one or more of firewall or router |
| 14:39 | <@planetmaker> | which is something you'll have to figure out from those handbooks you got for them |
| 14:40 | <@Alberth> | Joker: http://wiki.openttd.org/Multiplayer#Connecting_to_a_server <-- in that window, he clicks 'add server', and types your IP address |
| 14:42 | <Jordan> | oh god everyone wants to leave Nunington |
| 14:42 | <Jordan> | >Waiting: 1635 passengers |
| 14:42 | <@Alberth> | if he cannot connect, most likely your ports are configured wrong at the router firewall, or your firewall of the machine. In theory his firewall can also mess things up, but that does not happen a lot, as normally, firewalls allow outgoing connections |
| 14:42 | <Jordan> | >population: 1956 |
| 14:43 | <@Alberth> | oh, that is quite normal :) |
| 14:43 | <Jordan> | what kind of hellhole is that place |
| 14:43 | <@Alberth> | your average OpenTTD town :) |
| 14:43 | <Jordan> | O_O |
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| 14:46 | <@Alberth> | Jordan: any similarity between concepts in the game and the real world are purely co-incidental and not intended :p |
| 14:46 | <Jordan> | I see |
| 14:47 | <@planetmaker> | :-) |
| 14:47 | <@Alberth> | in other words, don't try to interpret game events as anything real-world :) |
| 14:56 | <Jordan> | >city offers subsidy |
| 14:56 | <Jordan> | >won't let me build close enough |
| 14:56 | <Jordan> | trollololol |
| 14:58 | -!- | valhallasw [~valhallas@193.52.24.37] has joined #openttd |
| 14:58 | <Jordan> | how can I make a train station wider? Just build another one beside it? |
| 15:03 | -!- | valhalla1w [~valhallas@193.52.24.37] has joined #openttd |
| 15:03 | <@Alberth> | That's the easiest way yeah. You can leave a gap between them if you press CTRL while placing, a window pops up with stations nearby select the one you want to extend then :) |
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| 15:06 | <Jordan> | dammit I just cloned a truck I want to sell. :-/ |
| 15:17 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: I would like to buy your generator script |
| 15:17 | <andythenorth> | I have in my hand 1 dollar in silver coins |
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| 15:34 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 15:35 | <andythenorth> | trucks are much smaller than trains aren't they? |
| 15:35 | <andythenorth> | http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=383063&nseq=4 |
| 15:35 | <andythenorth> | I forgot to notice |
| 15:37 | <@Alberth> | that is an error in reality |
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| 15:38 | <andythenorth> | reality is not conformant with the game :o |
| 15:38 | <andythenorth> | is reality GPL, or other OS license? |
| 15:42 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: it worries me that I mostly understand your generator :o |
| 15:42 | <andythenorth> | makes it far too tempting... |
| 15:42 | <Eddi|zuHause> | hey i DID put in comments :p |
| 15:43 | <Eddi|zuHause> | and asides of the articulation stuff, there's not a lot of magic in there |
| 15:43 | <@Alberth> | andythenorth: I have no source, nor do I know where to find it :p GPL seems unlikely if you ask me :) |
| 15:43 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: I really want to use it...but I won't learn nml that way :( |
| 15:44 | <Eddi|zuHause> | well, there's the parser for the refit lists, and the parser for the graphics |
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| 15:44 | <Eddi|zuHause> | and stuff about putting the railtype in the description, but you're likely not going to need that |
| 15:45 | <andythenorth> | need that for roadtypes :P |
| 15:52 | <Eddi|zuHause> | and you still need to know nml, if you want to modify/extend the "prototype" vehicle that the generator is based on |
| 15:52 | <Eddi|zuHause> | the point of the generator is to not have to copy-paste the modification to all vehicles |
| 15:53 | -!- | Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd |
| 15:54 | <andythenorth> | I've been heading that way with templates and defines :P |
| 15:54 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yes. and this is one more step removed from that :) |
| 15:56 | <andythenorth> | tempting... |
| 15:57 | <@planetmaker> | might be worth it, andythenorth :-) |
| 15:58 | <Eddi|zuHause> | "(German pay-tv) FOX channel will air A Christmas Carol (last year's Doctor Who christmas special) in february" |
| 15:58 | <Eddi|zuHause> | "christmas is gonna be late" :p |
| 15:58 | <andythenorth> | so first I'd have to convert Eddi's script... |
| 15:58 | <andythenorth> | unless Eddi|zuHause wants a BANDIT credit... |
| 15:59 | <Eddi|zuHause> | s/FEAT_TRAINS/FEAT_ROAD/? |
| 15:59 | <Eddi|zuHause> | (or whatever that is in nml) |
| 15:59 | <andythenorth> | ho |
| 15:59 | <andythenorth> | all the prop numbers are abstracted :D |
| 15:59 | <andythenorth> | I forgot that |
| 16:01 | <Eddi|zuHause> | you can probably leave out some columns from the table |
| 16:01 | <Eddi|zuHause> | e.g. all that has to do with company/epoch/set |
| 16:01 | <Eddi|zuHause> | there's likely not much real modification needed, only leaving out stuff that you don't need |
| 16:02 | <andythenorth> | I'm convinced... |
| 16:02 | <andythenorth> | I have CETS checked out |
| 16:02 | <CIA-6> | OpenTTD: rubidium * r23441 /trunk/src/ (script/api/script_airport.cpp station_cmd.cpp): -Fix [FS#4764]: some airport functions didn't take the layout into account resulting in wrong noise levels or nearests towns (patch by Zuu) |
| 16:03 | <Eddi|zuHause> | there were some makefile changes to call the generator script, you'll have to ask planetmaker about that |
| 16:07 | <Zuu> | Oh, I've forgoten that I written that patch. :-) |
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| 16:07 | <Zuu> | wrote* |
| 16:08 | <@planetmaker> | or +have ;-) |
| 16:08 | <Zuu> | I though "I've" but then saw I hadn't typed that. :-) |
| 16:08 | <@Belugas> | hee?? Zuu wrote something that fixed my stuff? cool! |
| 16:08 | * | Belugas is moved |
| 16:09 | <@planetmaker> | good night from here |
| 16:09 | <Rubidium> | too bad that all that moving didn't get you in Europe so participating in the meets would be easier |
| 16:09 | <Celestar> | (= |
| 16:09 | <Rubidium> | night planetmaker |
| 16:11 | <@Terkhen> | good night |
| 16:11 | <@peter1138> | http://fuzzle.org/~petern/ottd/yaez6.png < like that |
| 16:11 | <@peter1138> | oh well |
| 16:11 | <@peter1138> | overlapping ground sprites... bad :) |
| 16:11 | <andythenorth> | hmmph |
| 16:11 | <andythenorth> | that building looks ok though |
| 16:11 | <Eddi|zuHause> | oh great... "Eric Bolling of 'Follow the Money' (FOX Business Network) thinks that the muppets movie conveys a communistic message" |
| 16:11 | <@peter1138> | what, the depot in the middle? :D |
| 16:11 | <andythenorth> | the factory :) |
| 16:12 | <@Belugas> | night planetmaker, sweet dreams among the stars :) |
| 16:12 | <andythenorth> | sometimes I like the CGI stuff, sometimes I don't |
| 16:13 | <Zuu> | gqod night planetmaker |
| 16:13 | <Zuu> | good* |
| 16:14 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: the fun thing is that my text editor can syntax highlight python :) |
| 16:14 | <Rubidium> | why does that hous have a swedish flag? |
| 16:14 | <andythenorth> | whereas I am too dumb to teach it nml syntax colouring |
| 16:14 | <andythenorth> | it's swedish houses |
| 16:15 | <Eddi|zuHause> | i just use the nearest script language for nml highlighting |
| 16:17 | <Eddi|zuHause> | what's wrong with the colouring in that picture? |
| 16:17 | <Eddi|zuHause> | the factory roof, i mean |
| 16:18 | <Zuu> | Belugas: I think that patch was part of my work this summer on NoAI support for Airport views and towards NewGRF airports. |
| 16:18 | <Zuu> | I haven't dared to check how much of it that has become broken by all recent changes by TrueBrain :-) |
| 16:19 | <TrueBrain> | pff, I never break anything :D |
| 16:20 | <Zuu> | Actually, I don't think there is that many conflicts, more that files have been renamed + moved around etc. |
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| 16:21 | <@Alberth> | that is easily solved by editing the patch file :p |
| 16:21 | <Zuu> | At least that is what I hope for without looking into it. :-D |
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| 16:25 | <@Belugas> | [16:19] <TrueBrain> pff, I never break anything :D <-- liar, you broke your nail 2 days ago |
| 16:26 | <TrueBrain> | proof it! |
| 16:26 | -!- | amix [~Michal@77.88.121.165] has joined #openttd |
| 16:26 | <amix> | hello |
| 16:26 | <amix> | snowing here |
| 16:26 | <amix> | :) |
| 16:26 | <@Belugas> | hem... cannot... |
| 16:26 | <TrueBrain> | set your snowline higher |
| 16:27 | <Zuu> | I'm happy as long as there is no snow, ice or other slippy surface. |
| 16:27 | <@Belugas> | amix, i'm NOT glad for you, and i'm glad it does not here! |
| 16:27 | <@Belugas> | samo samo, Zuu |
| 16:27 | <@Belugas> | and i have to say, SO FAR, i have a delightfull december |
| 16:27 | <amix> | huhu |
| 16:27 | <Zuu> | Makes my bike ride to work much quicker and safer. :-) |
| 16:28 | <amix> | i love the snow |
| 16:28 | <amix> | :) |
| 16:29 | <Zuu> | With snow I have to go up 10 minutes earlier in the morning if I bike or maby 30-40 minutes earlier if I want to take the bus. |
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| 16:30 | <amix> | Zuu: :) |
| 16:30 | <amix> | i goto training studio |
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| 16:33 | * | andythenorth has a new bike |
| 16:33 | <Zuu> | nice |
| 16:38 | <@Belugas> | i'd rather hide in my <still-in-construction> studio when snow falls |
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| 16:41 | <appe> | snow is an abomination. |
| 16:41 | <Eddi|zuHause> | <Zuu> I'm happy as long as there is no snow, ice or other slippy surface. <-- that reads like "i like snow, just as long as there's no snow" |
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| 16:43 | <frosch123> | or, if there is really a lot of it |
| 16:51 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Bug of the day: Facebook allows viewing private photos in the "report for pornography" form |
| 16:53 | <Jordan> | oh facebook |
| 16:53 | * | Rubidium wonders what is "face" about those photos |
| 16:55 | -!- | DDR [~chatzilla@142.179.78.88] has joined #openttd |
| 16:57 | <TrueBrain> | Eddi|zuHause: I already reported all the photos of my friends |
| 16:57 | <TrueBrain> | just for shit and giggles |
| 16:58 | <appe> | http://d24w6bsrhbeh9d.cloudfront.net/photo/908310_460s_v1.jpg |
| 16:58 | <andythenorth> | bye |
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| 17:01 | <Eddi|zuHause> | that makes absolutely no sense |
| 17:09 | <+michi_cc> | Eddi|zuHause: Regular viewers of FOX News are less informed than people who don't consume any news at all: http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/11/poll-fox-news-viewers-less-informed-than-those-who-read-no-news.php |
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| 17:11 | <Eddi|zuHause> | michi_cc: i always get my news from comedy shows :p |
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| 17:16 | <Eddi|zuHause> | oh, and conspiracy websites |
| 17:25 | <frosch123> | night |
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| 18:01 | <@peter1138> | 21:14 < Rubidium> why does that hous have a swedish flag? |
| 18:01 | <@peter1138> | i dunno, swedish people seem to have a thing for spamming swedish flags... |
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| 18:32 | <__ln__> | the most spoken language on the streets of berlin: spanish |
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| 18:47 | <Zuu> | peter1138: I guess they are compensating for that it has became a situation in Sweden where the flag has been taken over by the far right extrimists. Though, I think it was worse 5-10 years ago. |
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| 20:12 | <lightningchicken> | hi |
| 20:17 | <lightningchicken> | hi |
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| 22:18 | <Lachie> | afternoon. |
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| 22:30 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yeah, that may as well describe the state i am in :p |
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| --- | Log | closed Wed Dec 07 00:00:54 2011 |
