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#openttd IRC Logs for 2012-04-16

---Logopened Mon Apr 16 00:00:18 2012
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03:19<xiong>If there's a Chinese car set then there should be a Chinese industry set with a dog processing plant.
03:19<NGC3982>:D
03:19<NGC3982>output product: food
03:19<NGC3982>or ipads
03:20<xiong>Also, a Chinese Toyland industry: accepts wood, lead-based paint, produces... goods.
03:20<@planetmaker>and Gucci hand bags
03:21<zxbiohazardzx>lol
03:21<NGC3982>about that, im still waiting for that soylent green grf.
03:21<zxbiohazardzx>cheap products dont give you alot of profit?
03:23<xiong>Actually, the fantasy that has a grip on my brain is the Halloween Total Conversion Set. All the trees are dead; road vehicles include hearses, aircraft include brooms and flying carpets; cargoes include pumpkins and eyes of newt. Instead of town buildings, headstones; and ghosts are transported in pax-type vehicles.
03:23<xiong>Mind you, I'd never play this; but I can see it catching on among the goths.
03:23<NGC3982>well, it's a fun thing
03:23<NGC3982>and re-usable.
03:24<xiong>Re-usable?
03:24<NGC3982>yes, well. something to use every year, that is.
03:24<xiong>Ah.
03:24<NGC3982>my soylent green maps wouldnt be that much of a treat all the year round ;_;.
03:25<NGC3982>although, ive been having dreams about it
03:25<xiong>Then there's the flying Santa sleigh, Arctic climate only... and the Total Lawrence of Arabia Desert Climate Conversion.
03:25<NGC3982>a post-apocalyptic (kinda cccp) climate
03:26<NGC3982>the towns are exports
03:26<NGC3982>and the industries produce food from passengers
03:26<xiong>Dunno; one appeal of OTTD for me is it's one of the few games without nuclear weapons.
03:26<NGC3982>hehe, true.
03:26<xiong>Not that I don't like nuclear weapons!
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03:29<@planetmaker>Not sure about the arsenal of the UFOs
03:30<zxbiohazardzx>was about to mention we have UFO'S flying sometimes, and you never know what happens if they are hostile
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03:51<xiong>One of the better parts of SimTower (Yoot's Tower) was the annual Santa visit. Better than the VIP. And one of the better parts of SimCity was the eco-monster. As I recall, in SC2K it shit windmills.
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04:15<Markk>SimTower owns.
04:15<Markk>:D
04:15<Markk>I remeber that we played it at a LAN for a couple of years ago. :S
04:15<Markk>:D*
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05:48<dihedral>Th0mash0f
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05:56<@planetmaker>again?
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05:58<dihedral>think so :-(
05:58<dihedral>why on earch does xchat grab focuse when i move to an rdp session ... :-(
06:01<dihedral>*earth
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06:07<drac_boy>hi
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08:59<Eddi|zuHause>@ports
08:59<@DorpsGek>Eddi|zuHause: OpenTTD uses TCP and UDP port 3979 for server <-> client communication, UDP port 3978 for masterserver (advertise) communication (outbound), and TCP port 3978 for content service, a.k.a. BaNaNaS (outbound)
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10:05<@Belugas>hello
10:06<FLHerne>hello?
10:06<@Belugas>indeed
10:06<@Belugas>or.. allo
10:07<@Belugas>salut
10:07<@Belugas>hi guys
10:07<Eddi|zuHause>aren't you like an hour late?
10:07<@Belugas>depends of your preferences
10:07<@Belugas>well... takes time to get back on duty after a week of vacations ;)
10:07<@Belugas>all those pesky emails and phone messages..
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10:43<andythenorth>xiong: 'What am I missing?' <- afaict, you're missing 'realistic acceleration' for RVs ;)
10:45<andythenorth>@seen pikka
10:45<@DorpsGek>andythenorth: pikka was last seen in #openttd 1 day, 3 hours, 8 minutes, and 39 seconds ago: <Pikka> true :)
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10:47<andythenorth>planetmaker: your post to thphwh might wear a smiley? :)
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10:59<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: is there a quick walkthrough for pixa?
11:00<andythenorth>no
11:00<andythenorth>I need to write one
11:00<andythenorth>I need a test user to write it against :)
11:00<andythenorth>I am a bad teacher
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11:01<andythenorth>reverse engineering from BANDIT might be fastest for someone of your capability ;)
11:02<Eddi|zuHause>i tried that once but didn't get anywhere
11:02<andythenorth>happy to help
11:02<andythenorth>I do need to document it
11:02<Eddi|zuHause>my mind doesn't work on pixels
11:02<andythenorth>my mind doesn't work on computer science ;)
11:03<andythenorth>pixels are just vector operations
11:03<Eddi|zuHause>i realize that whenever i'm trying to draw
11:04<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause: you have pixa installed?
11:04<Eddi|zuHause>yes
11:05<andythenorth>you have something in mind to draw?
11:05<Eddi|zuHause>i'm currenty successful at "import pixa" ;)
11:05<andythenorth>do you have BANDIT checked out?
11:05<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: i want to colour my green boxes.
11:05<Eddi|zuHause>first step: one colour
11:05<Eddi|zuHause>second step: multiple regular colours
11:06<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: i have bandit now
11:07<andythenorth>k
11:07<Eddi|zuHause>and it says i modified dispatcher.py, but diff doesn't show anything...
11:07<andythenorth>it's easiest for me (not sure if easiest for you) to use BANDIT to step you through the pipeline
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11:07<Eddi|zuHause>i've got about an hour at this point :)
11:08<andythenorth>that's fine, I have a child and such to do to :)
11:08<andythenorth>in src/pixel_generator there's a makefile
11:08<andythenorth>does it work? :)
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11:09<Eddi|zuHause>most of it
11:09<Eddi|zuHause>some parts throw an error
11:09<andythenorth>paste?
11:09<andythenorth>could be errors by me on committing things
11:11<Eddi|zuHause>http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/1327/
11:11<Eddi|zuHause>IOError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: './intermediates/body_flat-cc1-5_8-cargo_coils-grey_metal.png'
11:11<andythenorth>ok, they're tiresome, but not critical right now
11:11<andythenorth>I obviously have something uncommitted here
11:12<andythenorth>ignore it
11:12<Eddi|zuHause>right :)
11:12<andythenorth>had a look in the 'intermediates' and 'output' dirs?
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11:13<Eddi|zuHause>should i see differences there?
11:14<andythenorth>you should see files
11:14<Eddi|zuHause>yes, body_box, body_tank and body_tipping stuff
11:14<andythenorth>k
11:14<andythenorth>so I'll step you through different parts of pixa, and the output in those folders will vary
11:14<Eddi|zuHause>in output/ prefixed with trailer
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11:15<andythenorth>had a look in 'input'?
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11:15<Eddi|zuHause>lots of colourful boxes
11:15<andythenorth>got a pixel editor?
11:15<andythenorth>any will do
11:16<Eddi|zuHause>yes
11:16<andythenorth>k
11:17<andythenorth>palette_key.png might be useful to open
11:17<andythenorth>and tank_body_floorplan.png from input
11:17<andythenorth>[palette_key.png is in src/pixel_generator]
11:17<Eddi|zuHause>yes, found it
11:18<andythenorth>the other file to open is gestalts/tank_body
11:18<andythenorth>tank_body.py
11:18<TrueBrain>no, thank you
11:18<TrueBrain>wait .....
11:18<Eddi|zuHause>yup
11:19<andythenorth>k so lines 148-166 are the first to look at
11:19<andythenorth>the dict keys there correspond to pixel colours in the floorplan
11:20<andythenorth>in the tank floorplan you'll find 195 used for example (yellow-orane)
11:20<andythenorth>+g
11:21<Eddi|zuHause>yes
11:22<andythenorth>if it interests you, change the sequence drawn for 195 to one of the others, then run make and look in 'intermediates'
11:22<oskari89>Hmm, Simutrans with Pak128 looks like a Locomotion clone :P
11:22<andythenorth>e.g change the value for 'points =' to another sequence id
11:23<oskari89>But it's very crappy, even though it has openable bridges and traffic lights :P
11:23<Eddi|zuHause>yes, graphics look odd now :)
11:24<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause: you can also see the sequences defined above. e.g. tank_n_s
11:24<Eddi|zuHause>for the - view
11:24<andythenorth>each of those is a list of x, y offs from the starting pixel
11:24<andythenorth>and a colour
11:24<andythenorth>the colours are abstracted to objects e.g. pc_stripe(), but you don't need those
11:24<andythenorth>that's advanced use
11:25<andythenorth>try replacing all instances of 'pc_tank()' with '240'
11:25<andythenorth>and make again
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11:25<andythenorth>actually that doesn't work for some reason :o
11:26<Eddi|zuHause>it's red now
11:26<andythenorth>k
11:26<andythenorth>so that's the basics of drawing sequences
11:26<andythenorth>the scan order when drawing is from top-left
11:27<andythenorth>this generally works well to get things in the right order
11:27<andythenorth>and will work for boxes
11:27<Eddi|zuHause>lines first?
11:27<andythenorth>yes
11:27<andythenorth>multi-pass compositing is possible but not essential for your first case
11:27<andythenorth>you can ignore most of the pixa abstractions available, and just hard code sequences
11:28<andythenorth>k next step
11:28<andythenorth>if you look at l163
11:28<andythenorth>transforms = [PixaShiftColour(0, 255, -1)]
11:28<Eddi|zuHause>so, i make a sequence of pixels (x_offset, y_offset, colour), and a PixaSequenceCollection
11:28<andythenorth>yes
11:28<andythenorth>and draw a floorplan
11:29<andythenorth>the transforms enable sequence reuse
11:29<andythenorth>so PixaShiftColour has a range (0, 255) and a shift amount
11:29<andythenorth>this enables quick reshading for lighting different faces
11:29<andythenorth>those transforms (and the coloursets available) are why it's worth setting up pixa
11:29<Eddi|zuHause>right. i'd file that under advanced stuff
11:30<andythenorth>once setup they significantly save time
11:30<andythenorth>but yes, advanced
11:30<Eddi|zuHause>so how do i call the processing then?
11:30<andythenorth>pixa provides a set of utilities to handle making spritesheets
11:31<andythenorth>but there are also some in BANDIT's common file
11:31<andythenorth>I didn't want to over-framework pixa
11:31<andythenorth>this is actually the fiddliest part tbh
11:31<Eddi|zuHause>assume i'm loading my file and just write out a same size file
11:32<andythenorth>hmm
11:32<andythenorth>I'll actually have to read my own code now :)
11:34<andythenorth>it's probably easiest if you just follow back the code from the generate() function in tank_body.py
11:34<andythenorth> spritesheet.render(spriterows=spriterows) <- is the key call
11:34<andythenorth>everything else is scaffolding
11:35<andythenorth>GestaltBodyVariation is specific to BANDIT, and essentially decodes the filenames
11:35<@planetmaker>andythenorth, : probably should
11:36<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause: assuming you rely on decoded filenames to pass config data, you'll want something similar
11:36<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: i'd likely read that stuff from the tracking table instead
11:36<andythenorth>k, that too
11:36<andythenorth>it was convenient to put it all on a class
11:36<Eddi|zuHause>i.e. template length and stuff
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11:38<andythenorth>in the simplest form, you load a floorplan image via PIL, turn it into a pixa Spritesheet, then call render() on it
11:38<andythenorth>you have a PIL object in scope, and you can copy / save / modify it etc
11:39<andythenorth>this may all be clear as mud :)
11:39<andythenorth>I found the PIL stuff really easy tbh, it was the abstractions for coloursets and transforms that took work
11:42<Eddi|zuHause>i can do abstractions myself
11:42<Eddi|zuHause>it's the basic "get things to run" stuff i'm usually having problems with :)
11:42<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: so where do you open the floorplan?
11:44<andythenorth>let's see
11:44<andythenorth>get_gestalt_floorplan
11:45<andythenorth>it does some extra slicing things that you won't need
11:45<andythenorth>the BANDIT floorplan files (will) contain floorplans for each length
11:46<andythenorth>you probably don't need the crop at all
11:46<andythenorth>Image.open(stuff) will do
11:46<Eddi|zuHause>nope... so floorplan = Image.open("src/gfx/template_12_8bpp_normal.png")
11:46<andythenorth>yes
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11:47<andythenorth>which you can turn into a pixa spritesheet
11:47<andythenorth>Spritesheet(width=floorplan.size[0], height=SPRITEROW_HEIGHT * row_count, palette=DOS_PALETTE)
11:47<andythenorth>hmm
11:47<andythenorth>actually let me check that
11:52<Eddi|zuHause>spritesheet = pixa.Spritesheet(floorplan.size[0], floorplan.size[1], floorplan.palette)
11:52<Eddi|zuHause>(i hope)
11:54<andythenorth>yup
11:54<andythenorth>ah
11:54<andythenorth>there's a horrible PIL gotcha around palettes
11:54<andythenorth>they don't quite work properly :P
11:55<andythenorth>load the palette from my DOS_PALETTE
11:55<andythenorth>otherwise you have unexpected problems
11:55<andythenorth>l118 in common.py
11:55<Eddi|zuHause>what's the problem?
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11:55<Eddi|zuHause>anyway, i'll fix that later... let's see if i can go on from here
11:56<Eddi|zuHause>you now do some weird stuff with spriterows
11:56<Eddi|zuHause>of which i'd probably only need one
11:56<adi1000>hi i have a problem with openttd 1.2... it wont start on win7 32bit, after i double-click it crashes...
11:57<Eddi|zuHause>apparently i switched out c and v when i put it together yesterday... :p
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12:01<Eddi|zuHause>>>> seq = pixa.PixaSequence(points = [(0,0,240)])
12:01<Eddi|zuHause>>>> sc = pixa.PixaSequenceCollection(sequences = { 86 : seq })
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12:01<Eddi|zuHause>if i understand this right, this should replace all pixels with colour 86 with colour 240. right?
12:02<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: what's "colourset"?
12:04<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause: yes that should switch all pixels from 86 to 240
12:05<andythenorth>when facing pixa problems, I find it easiest to think about single pixels :P
12:05<andythenorth>'colourset' enables colours to be substituted during the render pass
12:05<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: apparently i don't get away with not specifying it :)
12:06<andythenorth> {'seq': get_cargo_load(cargo_path, load_state, i), 'colourset': None},
12:06<andythenorth>use None
12:06<andythenorth>maybe it should accept that :P
12:06<andythenorth>i.e. default to None
12:07<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: use "render_pass.get('colourset', None)"?
12:07<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: instead of "render_pass['colourset']"
12:07<andythenorth>yes probably
12:07<andythenorth>pixa is open for patches ;)
12:07*andythenorth afk for 10 mins
12:08*Rhamphoryncus goes and modifies his newgrf settings
12:08<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: that seems to have worked. lots of red
12:09<Rhamphoryncus>240 tonnes of grain/sugar beets -> bio refinery -> fertilizer plant -> transfer back to bio refinery -> farm resulted in only 11 crates of farm supplies
12:09<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: i think that suffices for now. i g2g
12:12<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: condensed version of what i just did http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/1328/
12:16<@planetmaker>Rhamphoryncus, that's called "conservation of matter" :-)
12:16<@planetmaker>Loss is everywhere ;-)
12:16<Rhamphoryncus>heh
12:17*telanus1 that should be enough translating for one evening
12:17<Rhamphoryncus>It's because I'm trying a different style to utilize farmsup/engsup better, so the ratings are garbage
12:17<Rhamphoryncus>Thus changing newgrf settings, to set it to "always 100%"
12:18*telanus1 afrikaans went from 95.5% to 97.2% translated (+30 fixed)
12:18-!-telanus1 is now known as telanus
12:18<Rhamphoryncus>telanus: nice :)
12:20<telanus>but there is about 20% that needs re-translation, as these % didn't keep up with changes
12:20-!-frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590d5493.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd
12:22<@planetmaker>that's the work which does not immediately show :-)
12:22<@planetmaker>but which is equally valuable
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12:30<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause: looks good
12:30*andythenorth ponders a 'hello world' example that procedurally generates 'hello world'
12:30<andythenorth>seems the most obvious tutorial
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13:01<Rhamphoryncus>andythenorth: how flexible is the "within a month of eachother" code? For a sawmill (2/8 for one, 6/8 for the other) would I get the same result regardless of who arrived first?
13:01<andythenorth>Rhamphoryncus: it's brutally simple
13:02<Rhamphoryncus>Well, I noticed before that it checks dates, rather than just "delivered in current month", so it's not TOO simple :)
13:02<andythenorth>produce_secondary.pnml
13:02-!-|Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5153E8CC.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO]
13:03<andythenorth>l82-84
13:04<Rhamphoryncus>The leftover/waiting parts I don't understand
13:05<Rhamphoryncus>It doesn't really matter. I was just curious
13:05<andythenorth>I don't understand the leftover/waiting parts either
13:05<andythenorth>I'm trusting that they work
13:05<Rhamphoryncus>lol
13:05<andythenorth>but yes, you get the same result for all cargos
13:06-!-Arafangion [~Arafangio@220-244-108-23.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:06<andythenorth>and it's tied to THIS_PRODUCTION_SPAN, which appeared be a variable per-industry last time I checked
13:06*Rhamphoryncus nods
13:06<andythenorth>30 days
13:06<andythenorth>could / should be a global
13:06<Rhamphoryncus>Different note: is there an RV with a real lumber sprite?
13:07<andythenorth>?
13:07<Rhamphoryncus>ATP flatbed truck is displaying big cylinders
13:07<andythenorth>batteries from toyland?
13:07<Rhamphoryncus>yeah, could be..
13:08*Rhamphoryncus hopes he didn't break something
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13:21<Rhamphoryncus>... google streetview just drove past
13:22<@Terkhen>hello
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13:24<Aciid>signals how the ef they work
13:24<Aciid>oh I think I got this
13:24<Aciid>*crashed*
13:24<Aciid>fffffuuuu
13:24<Rhamphoryncus>one man play?
13:24<Aciid>sure
13:25<Rhamphoryncus>We've all been there
13:26<Rhamphoryncus>But if you've got a more specific question then go ahead
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13:32<Aciid>Rhamphoryncus: more like I was describing my failure :D
13:32<Aciid>I'm allrite
13:32<Rhamphoryncus>k :)
13:32<Rhamphoryncus>I've tons of experience. I still get the occasional crash
13:33<andythenorth>7 open FIRS bugs
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: translators * r24122 /trunk/src/lang/ (afrikaans.txt danish.txt french.txt):
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: afrikaans - 139 changes by telanus
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: danish - 3 changes by beruic
13:45<CIA-1>OpenTTD: french - 1 changes by OliTTD
13:46<@Terkhen>andythenorth: I'm checking mine now
13:48-!-Wolf01 [~wolf01@host139-62-dynamic.252-95-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd
13:49<Wolf01>evenink
13:49<@Terkhen>hi Wolf01
13:51-!-telanus1 [~Barney_Er@196.215.173.27] has joined #openttd
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13:51<supermop>yo dudes
13:52<supermop>can a new object be passable
13:52<andythenorth>?
13:52<supermop>like, a boat can drive over it
13:52<andythenorth>nope
13:53<supermop>some special tile, eye candy tthat you place on water
13:53<andythenorth>not without cheating :P
13:53<supermop>cheating how?
13:53<andythenorth>offset the sprites
13:54<supermop>well ive done plenty of that
13:54<supermop>but certainly some objects can occupy water without blocking it?
13:54<supermop>like a bouy or the loading point on a water industry?
13:56<@Terkhen>buoys are more like "stations" than "objects"
13:56<supermop>yeah,
13:57<Rhamphoryncus>"currently running 586 days late". 88 day timetable
13:57<supermop>oh well then
13:57<Rhamphoryncus>I went to demolish a RV depot and found a timetabled vehicle I never started :)
13:58-!-telanus [~Barney_Er@196.215.173.27] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:58<@Terkhen>urgh, the oil wells industry tile animation code is different in both FIRS and OpenGFX+ Industries, now I need to actually understand what the fix does
13:59<andythenorth>:(
13:59<andythenorth>on the positive side
13:59<andythenorth>I missed that this had changed http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Callback:_Industry_availability
14:00<andythenorth>if I've understood this correctly, I should be able to better force industries to appear
14:00<@Terkhen>nice :)
14:00<andythenorth>e.g. OpenTTD never builds FIRS aluminium plants (available 1920 or so) if you start in 1870
14:00<andythenorth>'never' being a subjective measure of 'not often enough' :P
14:02<andythenorth>http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/3588
14:02<andythenorth>^ andythenorth hates parameter stuff
14:03<andythenorth>did Yexo find a house yet? :)
14:05<Rhamphoryncus>andythenorth: that's also a much better way to disable industries after the game start
14:06<andythenorth>I re-read that bug report, I'm not actually sure I understand it
14:06<andythenorth>(3588)
14:06<Rhamphoryncus>The report itself is very confusing
14:07<Rhamphoryncus>The point is: if you turn off "industries can open during gameplay" they ALSO turn off during map generation
14:07<andythenorth>is the bug report about the text string, or the feature?
14:07<Rhamphoryncus>They don't know
14:08<Rhamphoryncus>The feature is broken so the text doesn't match what it really does
14:08<andythenorth>hmm
14:08<Rhamphoryncus>So fix the feature and all will be well
14:09<andythenorth>Rhamphoryncus: you verified it doesn't work yesterday?
14:09<Rhamphoryncus>yep
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14:09<andythenorth>can you extend the report?
14:10<Rhamphoryncus>sure
14:10<andythenorth>thanks
14:10<andythenorth>will help
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14:20<@Terkhen>andythenorth: I was going to test my code, but I managed to reproduce FS 5151 again :P
14:20<andythenorth>he
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14:22<Rhamphoryncus>andythenorth: let me know if that clears it up enough
14:24<andythenorth>thanks
14:25<andythenorth>seems like 'incomplete feature' rather than minor bug
14:25<Rhamphoryncus>if incomplete means non-functional, yes :)
14:26<Rhamphoryncus>I'll put together some proposed replacement text for the parameter
14:27<andythenorth>thanks
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14:28*Rhamphoryncus notes that completely disabling industries is kind of pointless XD
14:29<Rhamphoryncus>also, 2**3 == 8, not 6..
14:29<andythenorth>it's a feature to only support scenarios
14:30<andythenorth>it has no other valid cases :P
14:30<Rhamphoryncus>Scenarios can leave map generation enabled
14:31<Rhamphoryncus>But I suppose it's clearer to have an explicit option
14:37<Rhamphoryncus>andythenorth: done
14:40<@Terkhen>andythenorth: I successfully backported ogfx-industries code, should I commit?
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14:42<andythenorth>Terkhen: \p/
14:42<andythenorth>Rhamphoryncus: so far wrt map gen, we've said 'use the map gen setting for no industry'
14:42<@Terkhen>I'll commit as soon as I manage to get my key working
14:43<Rhamphoryncus>Alright
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14:53<telanus1>what's this suppose to mean? "Vehicle data to base jumping on"
14:55-!-jo2k [~Jonny@dslb-094-222-139-023.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: jo2k]
14:57<NGC3982>two monitors really, really improves this game.
14:57<NGC3982>http://www.flickr.com/photos/appemobile/7084791761/in/photostream
15:00<frosch123>telanus1: i guess it's a tooltip in the order gui when setting up conditional orders
15:01<frosch123>telanus1: http://wiki.openttd.org/Conditional_Orders <- probably the tooltip behind the "vehicle age" button in that second last picture
15:06<telanus1>thank you
15:06<Rhamphoryncus>telanus1: if frosch123 is right then translate all you want, they still won't understand it ;)
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15:07<frosch123>Rhamphoryncus: maybe he translated it with a reference to the manual? :p
15:07<Rhamphoryncus>I stand by my position
15:09<telanus1>Rhamphoryncus: halve the afrikaans speakers won't understand that sentence
15:09<Rhamphoryncus>I barely understand the english version
15:11<telanus1>But then 90% of the afrikaans translation of programs on the net is nothing more than Dutch with Afrikaans spelling. And causes nobody to use it :(
15:12<frosch123>there are certainly some crappy ottd videos on yt
15:14<telanus1>some linux apps' Afrikaans translations is so bad it's useless.
15:17<__ln__>thedailyofftopic: how do i find the Taylor series for (5+x^2)/(x^3-3x+2)?
15:17<__ln__>at x = 0
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15:19<telanus1>Quick Question: {BLACK}Town is {RED}not{BLACK} growing would translate to {BLACK}Dorp groei {RED}nie.
15:20<telanus1>Should I add the {black} command at the end without anything behind it like: {BLACK}Dorp groei {RED}nie{BLACK}?
15:22<Rhamphoryncus>Ergh. I want to transfer and load at the same station :(
15:23<frosch123>telanus1: you can add and remove colour control codes as you like
15:23<frosch123>no need to keep the black
15:23<frosch123>at the end
15:23<telanus1>Webtranslator complains: Missing a {BLACK} command
15:24*andythenorth -> pub
15:24<andythenorth>bye
15:24-!-andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth]
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15:26<drac_boy>hi
15:26<frosch123>telanus1: ok, then blame TrueBrain :)
15:26<telanus1>:-D
15:27<TrueBrain>frosch123: there you are mistaken; translations have to have the same colour markings as the original :)
15:29<frosch123>so translators cannot be creative with colours?
15:29<TrueBrain>exactly
15:30<TrueBrain>no translator can make a {RED}O{YELLOW}P{RED}E{YELLOW}N{BLACK}TTD
15:30<TrueBrain>for the obvious reasons
15:31<telanus1>so it's ok to use this : {BLACK}Dorp groei {RED}nie{BLACK}
15:31<__ln__>what about languages that need to be written with different colors, like italian?!?
15:31<TrueBrain>it should
15:32<TrueBrain>dunno tbh; guess you have a first there *shrug*
15:32<TrueBrain>ask Rubidium :D
15:36<NGC3982>futurama or american dad?
15:37<telanus1>Futurama
15:38<drac_boy>NGC3982 neither for me :P
15:42<drac_boy>got a new 'worlds toughest truckers' on this night tho. wondering if thats the show hosted by IRT again
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15:46*drac_boy is working a bit on the grf worktable and that old computer list now tho
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16:01<frosch123>why are all ottd videos on yt like gold league?
16:01<drac_boy>umm no idea? I only look at screenshots :)
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16:34<__ln__>https://lkml.org/lkml/2012/4/15/5
16:36<SpComb>we need to dumb down the kernel, you can't expect people to actually learn stuff these days
16:36<SpComb>outsource development to Microsoft, some nice Visual Studio wizard thingie
16:38-!-Progman [~progman@p57A19FE8.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:38<drac_boy>heh ms? no thanks :)
16:40<@Terkhen>good night
16:41<drac_boy>bye Terkhen
16:46-!-Penguin66606 [430294e3@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd
16:46<frosch123>night
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16:47<Penguin66606>I need help with multiplayer
16:47<drac_boy>what is it Penguin66606?
16:48<__ln__>it's a type of game where many players play at once on the same map
16:49<Mazur>Hey, that's my job!
16:49<drac_boy>its not mazur :p
16:49<Penguin66606>I'm trying to set up a multiplayer server between me and my Girlfriend, but I follow the directions, and the servers don't show.
16:49-!-Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host81-129-125-202.range81-129.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd
16:50<drac_boy>Penguin66606 you need to set the ports in your router unless your computer is directly connected (either 56k or your ethernet cable runs staight to the dsl/cable modem somehow)
16:50<Mazur>Well, I'm still the king of stating the bleeding obvious.
16:50<Mazur>And reacting to the literal rather than the intended sentence.
16:50<Penguin66606>Alright, I'll try that.
16:51<Mazur>Add server sometimes does the trick as well, at the server list page.
16:52<__ln__>Mazur: you're a fan of the Airplane! movie too?
16:52<Mazur>Does a bear take the paper into the woods?
16:53<Mazur>And don't call me Shirley.
16:53<__ln__>that's right
16:54<Mazur>The best bit for me is the jiving old white lady.
16:54-!-tegro_ [~undefined@78-105-226-68.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd
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16:57<Penguin66606>Alright, now I need to see if she'll find the server.
17:00-!-peteris [~peteris@78.84.100.24] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
17:01<Eddi|zuHause>i clearly haven't seen that movie often enough...
17:02<Eddi|zuHause>Penguin66606: if it's shown on http://servers.openttd.org then she should also be able to see it
17:03<Penguin66606>It's not there.
17:06<Eddi|zuHause>@ports
17:06<@DorpsGek>Eddi|zuHause: OpenTTD uses TCP and UDP port 3979 for server <-> client communication, UDP port 3978 for masterserver (advertise) communication (outbound), and TCP port 3978 for content service, a.k.a. BaNaNaS (outbound)
17:06<Eddi|zuHause>Penguin66606: you need to open both TCP and UDP ports
17:07<Eddi|zuHause>and redirect them to your local IP
17:07<Penguin66606>I have.
17:07<Penguin66606>how do I do that?
17:07<Eddi|zuHause>and then also open them on your local firewall
17:07<Eddi|zuHause>Penguin66606: that depends on your router
17:09<Penguin66606>I have a Linksys, and I set it to
17:09<Penguin66606>Application:openttd
17:10<Penguin66606>start:39789 end:3979
17:11<Penguin66606>protocol to both TCP and UDP
17:11<drac_boy>Penguin66606 sometimes you need to write it as openttd.exe instead
17:11<drac_boy>not sure why some routers are fussy for that
17:11-!-oskari89 [~oskari89@213-186-253-165.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit []
17:11<Penguin66606>alright, I'll try that.
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17:13<Penguin66606>Alright, I don't think it'll work because I'm running Linux, and it doesn't have the support for .exe files.
17:14<drac_boy>oh linux..hm..not sure what stuffix that would had been then
17:14<FLHerne>Use a linux binary then?
17:15*FLHerne misses the point
17:15*FLHerne realises which point he missed :-(]
17:16<Penguin66606>I don't even know how to do that haha. I'm not really a comp. tech, I just got Ubuntu because Windows doesn't like my comp.
17:16<drac_boy>heh FLHerne :-p
17:18*FLHerne isn't sure he did miss the point, actually :|
17:19<FLHerne>[offtopic] Turns out that dwarf hamsters like to eat congealed raspberry jam :P [/offtopic]
17:19<Eddi|zuHause>sounds slimey
17:20<FLHerne>At least it stops them trying to eat my scrollwheel... :D
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17:23<FLHerne>Penguin66606: <I'm running Linux, and it doesn't have the support for .exe files> Did you mean you were using a linux binary, so .exe wouldn't be useful for your router, or that you're trying to use a .exe on linux for some reason?
17:24<Wolf01>'night
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17:25<Penguin66606>I'm running linux binary, so .exe arent useful.
17:26<FLHerne>That seems like the right answer :P
17:27<FLHerne>Was a bit confused -__-
17:27<Penguin66606>okay lol
17:30*FLHerne is easily confused :|
17:30<drac_boy>heh
17:30<drac_boy>you're doing too much patchypatchings then FLHerne :P
17:32<FLHerne>True :P
17:33*drac_boy borks FLHerne with serial i/o datas
17:33<drac_boy>:)
17:34*FLHerne sends back some EEPROM page overflow bugs
17:34<FLHerne>:D
17:35<FLHerne>I keep trying to fit 65 bytes in a page, then get surprised when complete nonsense comes out :P
17:38<drac_boy>you're funny :)
17:38*drac_boy is actually trying to work out some bus design choices tho :/
17:38*FLHerne is trying to design an automatic model railway
17:39<FLHerne>That kind of stupid bug isn't funny at the time :-(
17:39<Penguin66606>alright, when I create a server after forwarding the ports, do I use my computers IP address, or the routers IP?
17:39<drac_boy>btw don't forget to start small on that layout :p
17:39<drac_boy>Penguin66606 computer ip always afaik
17:40<Penguin66606>alright, thanks
17:41<FLHerne>Penguin66606: What are you doing with the IP? Putting it into the server?
17:41<FLHerne>Or giving it to someone else?
17:42<Penguin66606>Putting it in the server
17:42*FLHerne wonders why the server needs to know its own IP
17:44<FLHerne>Sending it to BaNaNaS would need the external address of the router, localhost would do for loopbacks?
17:44*FLHerne is confused again :-(
17:44<Penguin66606>I'm very confuse O.o
17:45<+glx>in openttd.cfg ?
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17:59<Eddi|zuHause>Penguin66606: the IP entry in openttd.cfg is only relevant if you have multiple network cards. in 99% of the cases you just leave it as 0.0.0.0
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18:00<Penguin66606>okay.
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18:38<posidon>hey I was wondering how I get my own server, do I need a server client or will I need to purchase one?
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18:39<posidon>hey I was wondering how I get my own server, do I need a server client or will I need to purchase one?
18:39*drac_boy bonks posidon for both spamming and maybe not reading the very simple www.openttd.org website first
18:40<posidon>I did read, however I didnt find any useful information there
18:40<posidon>and I did not mean to spam I appologise
18:41<drac_boy>posidon you mean you didn't see the obvious big "multiplayer" or "server" links?
18:41<posidon>not any useful information regarding the topic of my question
18:41<posidon>I did see the "server links" however I didnt see any direct corolation towards how to host a server
18:41<posidon>I will take a look again
18:41<drac_boy>posidon...try Documentation and look again
18:44<posidon>I did check again but found no results could you please just point me towards the section I need to look at, I went to the manual link on openttd.org and I checked the server link but only found the current running servers
18:46<drac_boy>manual>gameplay>multiplayer
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18:47<lobster>[00:38] <GoneWacko> http://wiki.openttd.org/Dedicated_server
18:47<lobster>check that
18:50<posidon>I did check them both, thank you guys and I am sorry if I inadvertently upset anyone
18:51<lobster>not me, that for sure
18:51<lobster>always be welcome to ask
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---Logclosed Tue Apr 17 00:00:25 2012