| --- | Log | opened Fri Apr 27 00:00:45 2012 |
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| 01:55 | <NGC3982> | morning |
| 01:57 | <telanus1> | morning |
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| 04:10 | * | NGC3982 so wants to play openttd right now. |
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| 04:25 | <MNIM> | NGC3982: then why don't you do so? |
| 04:26 | <NGC3982> | i have about thirty people who needs to be taken care of. |
| 04:27 | * | NGC3982 administrates a customer service. |
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| 05:40 | <drac_boy> | hi |
| 05:41 | <dihedral> | greetings |
| 05:42 | <drac_boy> | hi dihedral how're you? |
| 05:42 | <dihedral> | ... i know you? |
| 05:42 | <dihedral> | :-P |
| 05:51 | * | drac_boy wonders if you're sick? :P |
| 05:51 | <drac_boy> | heh |
| 05:54 | <MNIM> | ouch yea, NGC3982, that |
| 05:54 | <MNIM> | 's bad |
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| 06:00 | -!- | vichu [75c1926e@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd |
| 06:00 | <vichu> | can anyone help me? |
| 06:01 | <Eddi|zuHause> | sorry, you're beyond hope... |
| 06:01 | <vichu> | y dont may cities allow mw to build? |
| 06:01 | <vichu> | it always says city local authority refuses to allo |
| 06:02 | <Eddi|zuHause> | because you destroyed too many trees |
| 06:02 | <drac_boy> | vichu stop axing/blowing up so much trees perhaps ;) |
| 06:02 | <drac_boy> | heh eddi lucky guess :) |
| 06:02 | <vichu> | how to rectify it now? |
| 06:02 | <vichu> | ?? |
| 06:03 | <Arafangion> | Plant a million trees. |
| 06:03 | <@Alberth> | if you have stations in the town, provide good service |
| 06:03 | <@Alberth> | Arafangion: we should fix that bug :p |
| 06:03 | <vichu> | anywhere in the map? i do provide good service |
| 06:03 | <@Alberth> | in the town |
| 06:03 | <@Alberth> | or near the town |
| 06:03 | <vichu> | if i plant a lot they ll allow me right? |
| 06:04 | <@Alberth> | and wait |
| 06:04 | <drac_boy> | vichu better, next time plan ahead :p |
| 06:04 | <Arafangion> | Alberth: Heh, seriously, though, it's expensive to pull it off! |
| 06:05 | <@Alberth> | Arafangion: I usually just go to some other part of the map, and come back later |
| 06:05 | <@Alberth> | except 'later' can be a lot later :) |
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| 06:10 | -!- | mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ |
| 06:11 | <Arafangion> | Alberth: Time heals all wounds. :) |
| 06:20 | * | Alberth nods |
| 06:21 | <@Alberth> | besides, if they don't want my services, I make my money elswhere :p |
| 06:21 | <Arafangion> | It's a different matter on very small maps. |
| 06:21 | <Arafangion> | Which is about all I can handle on this computer, but soon... Soon I'll have a beast of a computer. |
| 06:22 | <@Alberth> | I imaginve it can be highly annoying then, indeed |
| 06:22 | <@Alberth> | multiple CPUs is not going to make any difference :p |
| 06:22 | <@Alberth> | (well, hardly any difference, technically) |
| 06:22 | <Arafangion> | Alberth: Indeed not, I'm already dual-cpu. |
| 06:23 | <CornishPasty> | Oh my goodness, how do you manage to have 2 CPUs Arafangion? |
| 06:23 | <Arafangion> | Alberth: But going up from 1GHz Atom D525 to something like a 3.6 GHz quad-core 3820... Now, THAT will make a difference. :) |
| 06:23 | * | CornishPasty dreams of Xeons |
| 06:23 | <@Alberth> | what is small? I usually play 256x1024 or 512x512 or so |
| 06:24 | <Arafangion> | CornishPasty: That. :) But I can watch movies, and run x86 applications, and run a 24" screen all on ~50 watts. |
| 06:24 | <CornishPasty> | Arafangion: My 8150 runs at 28W TDP :P |
| 06:24 | <Arafangion> | CornishPasty: I measured that at the *wall*. |
| 06:24 | <CornishPasty> | Ah, my MBP runs 8 logical, 4 physical cores at 95W |
| 06:25 | <@Alberth> | it's good to keep a safe distance :p |
| 06:25 | <Arafangion> | Alberth: Small is... 64x64. :) |
| 06:25 | <Arafangion> | Alberth: Actually gets quite difficult! Because when you have such a tiny map, you very quickly connect all and every cargo. |
| 06:25 | <CornishPasty> | :O |
| 06:25 | <CornishPasty> | That's TEENY! |
| 06:25 | <Arafangion> | Alberth: So those industries eventually produce more and more cargo, which you still have to somehow deliver. |
| 06:26 | <@Alberth> | I once did FIRS at 64x64 with RVs, it was quite fun |
| 06:26 | <Arafangion> | FIRS? |
| 06:26 | <Eddi|zuHause> | every time i tried such small maps, i gave up rather quickly, because there is "nothing to do" |
| 06:26 | <Arafangion> | Eddi|zuHause: Just wait a bit, it gets Hard. |
| 06:26 | <@Alberth> | Arafangion: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=67&t=44177 |
| 06:27 | <CornishPasty> | Ugh, that title is so tautologous it hurts, Alberth |
| 06:27 | <@Alberth> | which is very much not designed for a small map, so it gets swamped with industries, all different :) |
| 06:27 | <Eddi|zuHause> | it's recursive |
| 06:27 | <CornishPasty> | Yes, like LAME and PHP |
| 06:27 | <@Alberth> | and GNU |
| 06:28 | <CornishPasty> | Yup yup |
| 06:28 | <Arafangion> | But not like Hurd. |
| 06:29 | <Arafangion> | (Hird of Unix Replacing Daemons)...(Hurd of Interfaces Representing Depth) |
| 06:29 | <Eddi|zuHause> | this is the smallest map i played for a longer time: www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Loisachkirchen%20Transport,%2013.%20Apr%202027.png |
| 06:29 | <Eddi|zuHause> | i believe that is 128x256 or so |
| 06:29 | <Arafangion> | Huge. :) |
| 06:30 | <Arafangion> | But when I get my massive machine, I intend to try the biggest map I can get my hands on. |
| 06:30 | <Arafangion> | And try to somehow link every industry on it, for good measure. |
| 06:30 | <Arafangion> | I'd have to finally figure out the traffic signals, too. |
| 06:30 | <Arafangion> | (I barely use them on small maps) |
| 06:30 | <CornishPasty> | traffic signals? |
| 06:31 | <@Alberth> | yes, at the rail tracks :p |
| 06:32 | <@Alberth> | Arafangion: I don't understand why people play anything bigger than 1024x1024, you just get more unused space, I think |
| 06:32 | <@Alberth> | Eddi|zuHause: looks nice, I cannot take the patience to get that far in the game :) |
| 06:32 | <Eddi|zuHause> | Alberth: that's also the furthest i ever got in openttd :p |
| 06:35 | * | drac_boy usually sticks to 256x256 to 512x512 and inbetween most of the times :) |
| 06:35 | <drac_boy> | and never have anything to not do even 80 years later :) |
| 06:36 | <Eddi|zuHause> | i tend to neglect cargo transports, because passengers are trumping everything |
| 06:37 | <Arafangion> | Alberth: Greater profits due to greater distances? |
| 06:38 | <Arafangion> | What annoys me, is how utterly uncompetitive trucks and buses can be. |
| 06:38 | <Arafangion> | As in, I frequently struggle to even make them break even. |
| 06:38 | <@Alberth> | drac_boy: try 128x1024 one time :) |
| 06:39 | <drac_boy> | Alberth I kept meaning to play a customized map with flherne and perhaps others....I had been thinking of a skinny long map funny enough |
| 06:39 | <drac_boy> | maybe one day I'll finally host the game but we'll just have to see |
| 06:39 | <@Alberth> | hmm, 64x2048, did anyone try that? |
| 06:40 | <@Alberth> | sounds insane :) |
| 06:40 | <Arafangion> | I'd love to host some games, but my internet is shit here. :( |
| 06:40 | <Arafangion> | I should've used capital letters there, but you get the point. :) |
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| 06:52 | <planetmaker> | moin |
| 06:53 | <planetmaker> | Alberth: 64x2048 is great fun :-) |
| 06:54 | <planetmaker> | though I might have used 128 instead of 64... (checking PS archive) |
| 06:55 | <planetmaker> | http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/PublicServer:Archive_-_Games_181_-_190#gameid_185 <-- there you go, Alberth |
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| 06:57 | <planetmaker> | http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/PublicServer:Archive_-_Games_71_-_80#gameid_77 <-- and another, Alberth |
| 06:59 | <@Alberth> | thanks! |
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| 07:21 | <Eddi|zuHause> | the landscape feature functions don't work well with such extreme aspect ratios |
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| 07:22 | <Hazzard> | Hi |
| 07:23 | <@Alberth> | hi |
| 07:25 | <NGC3982> | afternoon |
| 07:26 | * | NGC3982 is on an old x14. |
| 07:27 | <@Alberth> | that's still 20 |
| 07:27 | <NGC3982> | 20? :) |
| 07:28 | <@Alberth> | x14 looks like a hexadecimal number to me |
| 07:28 | <drac_boy> | heh |
| 07:30 | <NGC3982> | ah:-) hehe |
| 07:32 | <vichu> | am playin 2048x2048 |
| 07:32 | <vichu> | awesome map :D |
| 07:33 | <planetmaker> | too big :-( |
| 07:33 | <vichu> | yea but way awesome |
| 07:33 | <vichu> | u never get bored |
| 07:34 | <planetmaker> | especially your CPU won't get bored... |
| 07:34 | <vichu> | lol |
| 07:34 | <planetmaker> | For me those maps become unplayable / too cpu intensive way before I get bored. thus I avoid them |
| 07:34 | <@Alberth> | and you run into limits sooner |
| 07:35 | <vichu> | i just started |
| 07:35 | <vichu> | so its a long way |
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| 07:38 | <planetmaker> | Hazzard: RUNNING_COST_NONE indeed exists. Seems to be a base cost of 1. Thus no modification |
| 07:38 | <V453000> | for me these maps get unplayable shortly after i start - just cant orientate in such stupidly large map I know I will never fill anyway |
| 07:39 | <planetmaker> | yeah... small(er) maps make for a game one can actually finish :-) |
| 07:39 | <vichu> | wat will happen if my cpu usage increases? |
| 07:39 | <planetmaker> | And there's always a lot of tweaking one can do anyways |
| 07:39 | <planetmaker> | it will eventually lag, vichu |
| 07:39 | <drac_boy> | planetmaker I sometimes get to 2030+ without ever finishing at all some days :p |
| 07:39 | <planetmaker> | and thus be a very bad game experience |
| 07:39 | <vichu> | it doesnt lag for me |
| 07:39 | <vichu> | its proper |
| 07:39 | <planetmaker> | as your cpu simply can't do all the calculations in time which it would need to do |
| 07:39 | <V453000> | yet |
| 07:40 | <planetmaker> | yes, when you start, it is. |
| 07:40 | <vichu> | then wat happens? |
| 07:40 | <planetmaker> | But it will become more and more cpu heavy the more you advance in building the map, the more vehicles you have, the more industries, the more houses, ... |
| 07:40 | <Hazzard> | Doesn't the game just get reaallly sloww? |
| 07:40 | <Hazzard> | and time slows dowwwnnn? |
| 07:40 | <planetmaker> | Hazzard: yes. But ... the responsiveness to your keyboard and mouse as well |
| 07:40 | <Hazzard> | Like a black hole :P |
| 07:41 | <planetmaker> | and vehicles will seem to jump instead of move etc. |
| 07:41 | <Hazzard> | ofc |
| 07:41 | <Hazzard> | I have too much experience with that |
| 07:42 | <vichu> | omg |
| 07:42 | <vichu> | can u guys get a patch for no limits? |
| 07:42 | <planetmaker> | vichu: try http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/PublicServer:Archive_-_Games_211_-_220#gameid_219 or http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/PublicServer:Archive_-_Games_201_-_210#gameid_201 and see how that works for you ;-) |
| 07:42 | <V453000> | like more than 5000 vehicles? :D |
| 07:42 | <planetmaker> | they're NOT 2048x2048. But they're built-up games |
| 07:42 | <vichu> | yea :D |
| 07:43 | <V453000> | yeah try that ^ |
| 07:43 | <planetmaker> | and then ask again about limits |
| 07:43 | <planetmaker> | (I can't reasonably play those) |
| 07:44 | <V453000> | most people cant |
| 07:44 | <planetmaker> | indeed |
| 07:44 | <V453000> | 201 was really only for the last few |
| 07:44 | <V453000> | my laptop was unable too, and it doesnt struggle in most games |
| 07:44 | <planetmaker> | and those maps are only 512**2, thus they're 1/16 of 2048**2 |
| 07:44 | <vichu> | so thats y i asked for no limit patch |
| 07:45 | <Hazzard> | Advanced settings? |
| 07:45 | <vichu> | u can run trains anywhere in the map in 2048*2048 |
| 07:45 | <vichu> | everywhere industries :D |
| 07:45 | <V453000> | but why would you build more than 5000 trains |
| 07:45 | <Hazzard> | Yeah |
| 07:45 | <V453000> | you have some NASA PC or what? |
| 07:45 | <vichu> | lol |
| 07:45 | <planetmaker> | vichu: and ... please... give us the curtosy of writing proper English |
| 07:46 | <vichu> | 5000 is the limit? and planetmaker |
| 07:46 | <vichu> | i cant get u |
| 07:47 | <@Alberth> | 'u' and 'y' are not proper english words |
| 07:48 | <vichu> | lol |
| 07:48 | <Hazzard> | :) |
| 07:48 | -!- | CaveJohnson is now known as rails |
| 07:48 | <planetmaker> | I'll pretend to not understand sentences otherwise :-) |
| 07:49 | * | Alberth tends to read 'y' was 'yes', which makes no sense |
| 07:49 | <@Alberth> | *as |
| 07:49 | <vichu> | lol |
| 07:49 | <vichu> | so which is the best map? |
| 07:49 | <planetmaker> | the one which you have fun with |
| 07:49 | -!- | rails is now known as CaveJohnson |
| 07:49 | <planetmaker> | for a long time |
| 07:50 | <planetmaker> | greatly depends on playing style |
| 07:50 | <vichu> | no the best which will suit the cpu |
| 07:50 | <@Alberth> | I must have missed the best maps then :p |
| 07:50 | -!- | CaveJohnson is now known as rails |
| 07:50 | <planetmaker> | my playing style is best suited with maps smaller equal 0.25 Mega-tiles |
| 07:50 | <planetmaker> | thus 512**2 and equivalents |
| 07:51 | <vichu> | 512*512? |
| 07:51 | <@Alberth> | vichu: anything bigger than 512x512 is useless for a single player |
| 07:51 | <planetmaker> | yes |
| 07:51 | <planetmaker> | Alberth: also for multiplayer... the limits really aren't different |
| 07:51 | <V453000> | 256*256-512*512 is all great in all shapes |
| 07:52 | <planetmaker> | as the hardware requirements are the limiting factor. Actually more so in multiplayer than in single player |
| 07:52 | <@Alberth> | planetmaker: unless you play at a LAN perhaps |
| 07:52 | <planetmaker> | maybe... dunno :-) |
| 07:52 | <vichu> | hmmm ok |
| 07:53 | <vichu> | 512*512 is also good |
| 07:53 | <planetmaker> | or 128 x 2048 ;-) |
| 07:53 | <vichu> | let me see tat now |
| 07:55 | <planetmaker> | vichu: but it really depends much on your playing style and also on your hardware |
| 07:55 | <planetmaker> | so... that's why I suggested to test out those heavy-cpu games I linked |
| 07:55 | <drac_boy> | hmm just had to wonder, what ways are there to cut down hardware load on an ottd map? |
| 07:56 | <drac_boy> | all I know of is more for the patch..using the lowmemory=on option and only having a 2x multiplier for maxvehicles (I rarely get anywhere close to that, I do go over the original limit at times tho hence 2x in that case) |
| 07:59 | <vichu> | yea 512*512 is good |
| 07:59 | <vichu> | and 5000 limit will be good too |
| 07:59 | <vichu> | so time to play the game :D |
| 08:00 | <vichu> | thank you alberth and planetmaker ;) |
| 08:02 | <@Alberth> | drac_boy: drop MP would help, as you can do mulit-core then :p |
| 08:02 | <drac_boy> | alberth aside to that |
| 08:02 | <drac_boy> | ;) |
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| 08:08 | <drac_boy> | guess there isn't much to do then? |
| 08:09 | <@Alberth> | nobody has useful ideas how to make progress there :( |
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| 08:10 | <drac_boy> | heh ok, at least if I recall right someone in a game once mentioned that less or no trees cuts down ram useage noticeably |
| 08:10 | <drac_boy> | is that actually true? |
| 08:11 | <@Alberth> | don't know |
| 08:11 | <@Alberth> | ram usage is not the main problem imho |
| 08:12 | <drac_boy> | alberth...what is? :P |
| 08:12 | <@Alberth> | cpu use |
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| 08:12 | <@Alberth> | which is mostly due to train path finding |
| 08:13 | <@Alberth> | and a bit of newgrf callbacks iirc |
| 08:13 | <Arafangion> | Which is why I'm really looking forward to my new monster. :) |
| 08:13 | <Arafangion> | 3.6 GHz of awesomeness. |
| 08:13 | <drac_boy> | alberth surely aren't train pathfinder quite 'low resource'? or do the patch and ottd differ? |
| 08:13 | <drac_boy> | because I don't see much hit on the cpu even with many pbs-enabled trains here re patch with busy map |
| 08:13 | <drac_boy> | Arafangion :-p |
| 08:14 | <@Alberth> | don't know what the patch does |
| 08:14 | <Arafangion> | drac_boy: You'll note that I brought this up the last time we were talking, too. :) Rather obsessing about it, but then again, I _am_ currently on a D525. |
| 08:15 | <@Alberth> | if it is like the original program, the OpenTTD PF is much better |
| 08:16 | <drac_boy> | Alberth if ottd is better then that means 500 trains on shared routes would barely need more than a 200mhz slice. just guessing roughly tho |
| 08:17 | <@Alberth> | much better pathfinding results I mean, not much better CPU use :) |
| 08:17 | <Arafangion> | :) |
| 08:17 | <Arafangion> | Is OTTD in git? |
| 08:18 | <@Alberth> | there is a git mirror |
| 08:18 | <Arafangion> | Mirrors are sucky. |
| 08:18 | <@Alberth> | and also a hg mirror |
| 08:18 | <Arafangion> | Ah, it's in svn. |
| 08:19 | <planetmaker> | ping curtana |
| 08:19 | * | Arafangion picks the mirror, as a result. :) |
| 08:19 | <drac_boy> | alberth...I've not noticed anything better except that ottd ships don't always like far-apart buoy by comparasion on other hand |
| 08:20 | <drac_boy> | but then what do I really know tho |
| 08:20 | <planetmaker> | Arafangion, in my experience working with the git or hg repo for dev is easier than the svn one |
| 08:20 | <Arafangion> | planetmaker: Yep, does'nt mean it's not sucky. |
| 08:20 | <planetmaker> | why? |
| 08:20 | <NGC3982> | :-) = .ndkd. |
| 08:20 | <Arafangion> | planetmaker: But then again, it's not like I have push access, so it's probably irrelevant. |
| 08:21 | <@Alberth> | drac_boy: ships are much more costly in CPU time than trains; too many paths to chose from |
| 08:21 | <planetmaker> | really, that doesn't quite matter... it might save a step. But it's an extra step to check for sanity. Thus it's not time lost IMHO |
| 08:21 | <curtana> | Hi planetmaker |
| 08:21 | <planetmaker> | you contacted me regarding OpenGFX |
| 08:22 | <drac_boy> | heh |
| 08:22 | <Arafangion> | Alberth: But the ship pathing can be much more naive, surely? |
| 08:23 | <curtana> | Yeah, rather than getting in over my head to start with just working on some sprites at the moment with a mate who does some dev work for OTTD |
| 08:24 | <@Alberth> | Arafangion: it already is; there is no collision concept at all |
| 08:24 | <planetmaker> | so what's your ideas / suggestions / contributions? :-) They sure are welcome |
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| 08:25 | <Arafangion> | Alberth: Not to mention, wouldn't the fitness function be very simplistic, as well? |
| 08:25 | <Arafangion> | Alberth: Quite possibly a simple distance function? |
| 08:26 | <@Alberth> | I think it is, but the problem is the number of paths that exist, at every tile you have about 3 directions to continue, and they are all equal |
| 08:26 | <@Alberth> | so you get an explosion in number of paths to pick the optimal one from |
| 08:27 | <@Alberth> | which is really just a big waste, as they are all equal ;p |
| 08:27 | <@Alberth> | but how to detect that is the problem |
| 08:27 | <Arafangion> | Alberth: You don't have to pick a /path/, really, just the next square. |
| 08:27 | <curtana> | I've got experience doing sprites and was going to look at jumping into learning NML and trying some bugfixes. Thinkin I'll start with fixing some trams prites for my friend first though. |
| 08:27 | <planetmaker> | Arafangion, you sure do... |
| 08:27 | <Arafangion> | planetmaker: For ships? |
| 08:27 | <planetmaker> | Arafangion, sure. Or you go the wrong direction |
| 08:27 | <planetmaker> | you can't cross land tiles |
| 08:27 | <planetmaker> | and want to do better than random walk |
| 08:28 | <Arafangion> | planetmaker: Well, you have to disregard the neighbouring land tiles. |
| 08:28 | <planetmaker> | there you go. That's path finding already |
| 08:28 | <Arafangion> | And then just pick the remaining neighbouring tile that has the cheapest result as determined by the fitness function. |
| 08:28 | <Arafangion> | Semantics! |
| 08:29 | <Hazzard> | Isn't that just like following the right wall of a maze till you reach the end? |
| 08:29 | <planetmaker> | curtana, OpenGFX itself has no trams. Base sets cannot have them. OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles has trams |
| 08:29 | <planetmaker> | but what do you understand under "fix"? |
| 08:29 | <Arafangion> | Hazzard: Possibly. |
| 08:30 | <@Alberth> | Arafangion: I'd suggest you do some experiments in a very simple setup to see what that approach does |
| 08:30 | <planetmaker> | Hazzard, Arafangion that's about the worst choice after random walk to reach a destination |
| 08:30 | <Arafangion> | Well, I've barely used ships... But don't they require a fairly liberal use of bouys? |
| 08:31 | <planetmaker> | curtana, but that said: surely OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles *can* use more trams than it already has. The three trams as present barely cover the needs |
| 08:31 | <@Alberth> | Arafangion: bouys are just a measure to reduce computation costs |
| 08:32 | <planetmaker> | also... YAPF does a not too bad job in OpenTTD 1.2.0 with its caching... |
| 08:32 | <Arafangion> | Sounds like I'd have to find time to do some pathfinding experiments. |
| 08:32 | <curtana> | planetmaker, not sure whether they are OpenTTD or TTDPatch he's just sent them through for me to work on. Still happy to help out with OpenGFX, just have no idea where to start :) |
| 08:33 | <planetmaker> | curtana, that's a good question. What do you like to improve? :-) |
| 08:33 | <planetmaker> | My personal wishlist includes houses which are not that noisy |
| 08:33 | <Hazzard> | This colormap grf stuff is awesome |
| 08:34 | <planetmaker> | The wishlist also includes toyland-specific sprites for the infrastructure (stations, RV stops, airports) |
| 08:35 | <curtana> | I can have a look at the houses. |
| 08:36 | <planetmaker> | how do you create sprites, curtana ? |
| 08:36 | <planetmaker> | Do you draw 8bpp? Or render 32bpp? |
| 08:37 | <curtana> | draw 8bpp is what I've done to date |
| 08:38 | <drac_boy> | 8bpp for both small and large screens to me |
| 08:38 | <drac_boy> | :) |
| 08:38 | <curtana> | Have some experience with 3DSMAX a long time ago :) but not specifically rendering down to 32bpp |
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| 08:44 | <planetmaker> | ok, I'm just curious. It's your choice and 8bpp and 32bpp can be of different origin anyway :-) |
| 08:45 | <Arafangion> | Hmm, the source code looks pretty good, at first impression. |
| 08:48 | <curtana> | old fashioned pixelart. I did some work on the Japan Train set which is somewhere on TT-forums. |
| 08:49 | * | drac_boy just prefers 8bpp for a few reasons but thats to our own tho |
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| 08:49 | <planetmaker> | ah, yes, I know it. I love it :-) |
| 08:49 | <planetmaker> | And... it actually is also on the DevZone :-) |
| 08:50 | <curtana> | What's on teh DevZone? |
| 08:50 | <planetmaker> | curtana, do you know the OpenGFX repository and its friends? http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/opengfx |
| 08:50 | <planetmaker> | It's the home of nearly all open-source 3rd party stuff for OpenTTD |
| 08:51 | <planetmaker> | where you find their source codes, their bug trackers |
| 08:51 | <curtana> | I was having a look around on there today and tried playing around with mercurial but go t abit lost :P |
| 08:51 | <planetmaker> | or rather maybe issue trackers to put it more neutrally |
| 08:51 | <planetmaker> | :-) All you need for a start is |
| 08:51 | <planetmaker> | hg clone URL |
| 08:51 | <planetmaker> | and hg up REV |
| 08:51 | <Arafangion> | Man, the ship controller's heavily nested. |
| 08:52 | <planetmaker> | many projects rely on the a unix-like environment to build properly |
| 08:53 | <Hazzard> | Why are there so many more reds then CC greens/blues? |
| 08:54 | <drac_boy> | ? |
| 08:54 | <Hazzard> | in the Palettes |
| 08:55 | <@Alberth> | hsitoric reasons probably |
| 08:55 | <@Alberth> | *historic |
| 08:57 | <Hazzard> | I originally drew my sprites in red |
| 08:57 | <Hazzard> | luckily I only used 8 shades |
| 08:58 | <Hazzard> | :/ actually 7 |
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| 09:00 | <Hazzard> | They looks so weird green :P |
| 09:01 | <drac_boy> | be back later anyhow :p |
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| 09:02 | <Hazzard> | planetmaker: How can I make vehicle animations? |
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| 09:36 | <Hazzard> | V453000: Can you help me with something? |
| 09:36 | <V453000> | ... |
| 09:36 | <Hazzard> | What should go in sprite_id: ? |
| 09:36 | <V453000> | where? |
| 09:37 | <V453000> | sprite_id SPRITE_ID_NEW_TRAIN yes Set this property to enable new graphics |
| 09:37 | <V453000> | sprite_id: SPRITE_ID_NEW_TRAIN; |
| 09:37 | <Hazzard> | Ok |
| 09:37 | <V453000> | this means that you use new sprites I guess |
| 09:37 | <V453000> | not some from base set |
| 09:37 | <planetmaker> | that's right |
| 09:39 | <V453000> | ^^ |
| 09:39 | <planetmaker> | you can animate vehicles by making use of the variable motion_counter |
| 09:40 | <Hazzard> | I think i'll figure that out later |
| 09:40 | <planetmaker> | you definitely should get a working vehicle first |
| 09:41 | <Hazzard> | I am about 5 minutes from that I think :D |
| 09:42 | <Hazzard> | Do either of you use gimp? |
| 09:43 | <planetmaker> | try again asking your real question ;-) |
| 09:44 | <Hazzard> | ._. |
| 09:44 | <planetmaker> | or will it help you in any way, if you know that *someone* uses gimp? |
| 09:45 | <planetmaker> | http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html <-- Hazzard |
| 09:45 | <planetmaker> | it's really worth the read. And I don't mean it offensive :-) |
| 09:45 | <planetmaker> | It makes communication quite efficient to heed it, though |
| 09:45 | <Hazzard> | That is a lot of text |
| 09:46 | <Hazzard> | What are offsets? |
| 09:46 | <planetmaker> | yes, it's a bit. But I actually enjoyed reading it |
| 09:46 | <V453000> | offsets are something you will hate and love |
| 09:46 | <V453000> | ^smart answer ^^ |
| 09:47 | <V453000> | the offsets say how is the sprite positioned |
| 09:47 | <planetmaker> | offsets are alignment info |
| 09:47 | <planetmaker> | with respect to sprite's (0,0) |
| 09:47 | <Hazzard> | I am getting a "read beyond the image bounds of the image file" Could that have anything to do with the offsets? |
| 09:48 | <planetmaker> | http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Realsprites |
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| 09:49 | <@Alberth> | no, more with giving incorrect postions where the sprite is in the image |
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| 09:55 | <Hazzard> | It compiled |
| 09:56 | <curtana> | Night all |
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| 10:00 | <Hazzard> | Does there happen to be some magical colors that are already animated? |
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| 10:01 | <planetmaker> | Hazzard, please DO READ the wiki |
| 10:01 | <planetmaker> | it's all explained there |
| 10:01 | <planetmaker> | it even has a search bar |
| 10:02 | <CornishPasty> | planetmaker: lies! |
| 10:03 | <planetmaker> | do I? |
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| 10:03 | <Hazzard> | The wiki explains it all very well |
| 10:03 | <Hazzard> | But it takes me about 10 minutes longer |
| 10:03 | <CornishPasty> | Hazzard: SO TAKE 10 MINUTES LONGER |
| 10:03 | <Hazzard> | And it is easy being lazy |
| 10:03 | <Hazzard> | ^^ |
| 10:05 | <planetmaker> | Thanks for being that honest. Though I'll henceforth be lazy then, too. In answering questions as you obviously think that your time is more valuable than mine and it is blatantly obvious that you really don't care to do your homework |
| 10:06 | <Hazzard> | Fine |
| 10:06 | <planetmaker> | your realize that that attitude you showed is quite dis-respectful, yes? |
| 10:07 | <Hazzard> | Yes |
| 10:07 | <Hazzard> | Ok I see now |
| 10:08 | <Hazzard> | I was wondering why the guy was naming those colors strangly :/ |
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| 10:16 | <@Alberth> | o/ andy |
| 10:18 | <planetmaker> | hi andythenorth |
| 10:18 | <@Alberth> | http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/1361/ ? |
| 10:18 | <andythenorth> | patch? |
| 10:19 | <andythenorth> | the town limit text is imho not improved, but the bales definitely is |
| 10:19 | <andythenorth> | I'll change it now |
| 10:21 | * | Alberth changes the dutch translation of the town limit too |
| 10:22 | <andythenorth> | I'm about to push |
| 10:22 | <@Alberth> | s/1/one/ ? |
| 10:22 | <andythenorth> | 1 / one |
| 10:22 | <andythenorth> | changed |
| 10:23 | <andythenorth> | pushed |
| 10:23 | <@Alberth> | ok, thank you :) |
| 10:26 | <@Alberth> | dutch updated |
| 10:26 | <andythenorth> | thanks |
| 10:27 | <@Alberth> | and I don't even play with FIRS at the moment :p |
| 10:27 | <andythenorth> | do you play the game at all? :) |
| 10:28 | <Mazur> | No, the game plays with him. |
| 10:29 | <planetmaker> | who doesn't play 'the game'? ;-) |
| 10:29 | <Mazur> | Plugged him in with Bluetooth and uses him for a pathfinder. |
| 10:29 | <CornishPasty> | planetmaker: you just lost the game |
| 10:29 | <CornishPasty> | </childish> |
| 10:30 | <planetmaker> | :-( drat |
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| 10:30 | * | Mazur is not 'on the game'. |
| 10:30 | <@Alberth> | Mazur: I am a very bad path finder, cannot keep left from right :) |
| 10:36 | * | andythenorth ponders |
| 10:37 | <andythenorth> | Alberth: any ideas about industry terraform hints? |
| 10:37 | <planetmaker> | Alberth, I just learnt a navi system which doesn't either ;-) |
| 10:37 | <planetmaker> | *learnt to know |
| 10:38 | <planetmaker> | can be quite confusing ;-) Luckily the display style was very good |
| 10:38 | <planetmaker> | and timing of announcements and their quality also |
| 10:39 | <@Alberth> | andythenorth: frosch had some ideas with relative requirements on slopes, but I don't know the details |
| 10:39 | <andythenorth> | quak? |
| 10:39 | <andythenorth> | no frosch :P |
| 10:39 | * | andythenorth wonders what other patches are needed for FIRS / newgrf industry |
| 10:40 | <@Alberth> | andy was also missing here for some time ;) |
| 10:40 | <andythenorth> | now is a good time to think about 1.3 |
| 10:40 | <@Alberth> | planetmaker: so you wait until it makes a sound, ignore what it says, and look at the display? :) |
| 10:41 | <planetmaker> | the only thing to verify is left or right. The rest was accurate |
| 10:42 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 10:42 | <andythenorth> | only obvious patch is the cb15f one I wrote |
| 10:42 | <andythenorth> | other things: |
| 10:42 | <planetmaker> | and I learnt that the navi system in Ford vehicles is not worth a single penny |
| 10:42 | <andythenorth> | - stations at water industries are silly, but that needs New Stations / New Ports / New *** |
| 10:43 | <CornishPasty> | Na'vi? |
| 10:43 | <planetmaker> | navigation system |
| 10:43 | <planetmaker> | but probably I just don't get your joke ;-) |
| 10:43 | <andythenorth> | - industry closure has not really been considered properly, from ground up |
| 10:44 | <andythenorth> | maybe industry closure needs rethinking, accounting sanely for both NoGo and Newgrf |
| 10:44 | <planetmaker> | preferrably the answer is 'yes' |
| 10:52 | <andythenorth> | currently closure is very difficult to handle well |
| 10:53 | <andythenorth> | at least part of the difficulty is due to the mechanism: newgrf returns 'close next month' to game |
| 10:55 | <andythenorth> | ottd doesn't appear to maintain any list of industries which are then due to close |
| 10:55 | <andythenorth> | does ottd have any kind of data structures available besides the map? |
| 10:57 | <planetmaker> | all the vehicle, cargo packet, orders pools |
| 10:57 | <planetmaker> | stations |
| 10:57 | <planetmaker> | etc :-) |
| 10:57 | <planetmaker> | settings |
| 10:57 | <planetmaker> | :-P |
| 10:58 | * | andythenorth wonders about a newgrf var that could return list of industries already marked for closure (and type) |
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| 11:01 | <andythenorth> | if NoGo wants to close an industry, who should win? NoGo or Newgrf? |
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| 11:04 | <@Alberth> | not sure, for idle industries, it makes sense for the game to decide |
| 11:05 | <@Alberth> | what are good reasons to let the newgrf decide? |
| 11:05 | <andythenorth> | so the current setup is, newgrf wins |
| 11:05 | <andythenorth> | the current setup doesn't work brilliantly imho |
| 11:05 | <andythenorth> | but we have to preserve that spec |
| 11:06 | <@Alberth> | adding a 'please close' option, or is it a special case of 'please go down in production'? |
| 11:06 | <@Alberth> | the latter seems a bit awkward |
| 11:06 | <andythenorth> | maybe either |
| 11:07 | <@Alberth> | with a used industry, the player must get time to adapt to the industry shutting down |
| 11:07 | <@Alberth> | one month is not enough, especially as it is not findable in its window |
| 11:08 | <@Alberth> | (maybe with newgrfs it is different, don't know exactly) |
| 11:08 | <planetmaker> | Alberth, "please close" is by the definition of the production callback a special case of "change production" |
| 11:09 | <planetmaker> | but of course the callback is newgrf-decided |
| 11:09 | <@Alberth> | let's open a window "dear player, please apply magic bulldozer on this industry" :p |
| 11:10 | <planetmaker> | the newgrf basically can set any production level as it wishes: http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Callbacks#Random_production_change_.2829.29 |
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| 11:11 | <andythenorth> | every time I think about this I end up with precise same amount of puzzle |
| 11:11 | <andythenorth> | for good NoGo gameplay, NoGo should be able to force industries to close |
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| 11:11 | <andythenorth> | but for good industry-related gameplay, newgrf should control industry closure |
| 11:12 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 11:12 | <@Alberth> | please elaborate on the latter |
| 11:12 | <@Alberth> | what is good industry-related gameplay? |
| 11:12 | <andythenorth> | so newgrfs make promises about industries to player, e.g. deliver cargo, pickup cargo in certain ways, and production will increase / decrease, industry will stay open / close |
| 11:13 | <andythenorth> | but for scripted-scenario style play, NoGo needs to be able to impose on player 'boom, all industries near this town just closed. Bad luck!' |
| 11:13 | * | andythenorth ponders two classes of 'please close' event |
| 11:13 | <andythenorth> | sent by game or NoGo |
| 11:14 | <andythenorth> | class 1 is 'I am just managing the general economy, how do you feel about closing?' |
| 11:14 | <andythenorth> | class 2 is 'for narrative reasons, you need to close. Will you?' |
| 11:14 | <@Alberth> | the latter is a sudden change, /me would not like that type of game, but others may |
| 11:14 | <andythenorth> | so OpenGFX+ Industries might answer yes to both |
| 11:14 | <@Alberth> | I would like game that switch from one type to another type in say 10 game years or so |
| 11:14 | <@Alberth> | eg coal -> oil or so |
| 11:15 | <andythenorth> | Manual industries would answer no to both (depending on parameter) |
| 11:15 | <andythenorth> | FIRS would ignore class 1, but accept class 2 |
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| 11:16 | <andythenorth> | Alberth: your example is narrative |
| 11:16 | <andythenorth> | 'in this game, all coal mines start to close after date xyx, even if doing well' |
| 11:16 | <andythenorth> | so class 2 |
| 11:17 | <@Alberth> | nope, I think. Production would slowly decrease (less demand of coal), and production of oil increases |
| 11:17 | <andythenorth> | that is harder to enforce without a major spec change |
| 11:18 | <andythenorth> | although 'close' is anyway a specific value for 'change production' |
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| 11:18 | <andythenorth> | so there could be two classes of 'change production' |
| 11:18 | <andythenorth> | one more highly weighted than the other |
| 11:18 | <andythenorth> | but then NoGo needs to know that, e.g. this is a coal mine |
| 11:18 | <@Alberth> | close == change production, in case production is about 0 |
| 11:18 | <andythenorth> | NoGo is supposed to be blind to specific newgrfs |
| 11:19 | <@Alberth> | I don't know what NoGo can do w.r.t. cargoes, but that would be the control mechanism I guess (ie increase global production of cargo X) |
| 11:21 | <@Alberth> | there is another form of close, but perhaps closely related with industry mix. New industries become available, but old ones refuse to go |
| 11:22 | <andythenorth> | FIRS industries refuse to go |
| 11:22 | <andythenorth> | maybe they should go |
| 11:22 | <@Alberth> | yes, which means it is hard to get newer industries in the game |
| 11:23 | <andythenorth> | the original plan for FIRS was successive generations of industries |
| 11:24 | <andythenorth> | over-ruled by players who don't want disrupted networks |
| 11:24 | <@Alberth> | I don't know whether two classes is useful; a scenario like mine would be programmed by slow production changes, and then closure; a scenario like your nogo one would simply skip the 'slow production change' part |
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| 11:25 | <andythenorth> | so NoGo would specify amount of coal to be produced this month on map? |
| 11:25 | <@Alberth> | they do have somewhat of a point, at 30+ industries, and you move the industries every 20 years, that's a lot of work |
| 11:26 | <@Alberth> | that would make NoGo newgrf independent, I think |
| 11:26 | <andythenorth> | so it would be interesting if primary industry production changed radically |
| 11:26 | <andythenorth> | so that the amount of raw cargo produced was centralised |
| 11:27 | <andythenorth> | supplies etc would still be possible |
| 11:27 | <andythenorth> | let amount of coal be 10k tons |
| 11:27 | <@Alberth> | It sounds like fun to me, but that's just me, perhaps |
| 11:27 | <andythenorth> | let there be 10 nodes (coal mines) |
| 11:28 | <andythenorth> | let each mine produce 1k tons |
| 11:28 | <andythenorth> | now deliver supplies to mine 7 |
| 11:28 | <andythenorth> | mine 7 now produces 2k tons |
| 11:29 | <andythenorth> | other mines produce 1k tons ea. total 11k tons for map |
| 11:29 | <andythenorth> | now coal is out of favour |
| 11:29 | <andythenorth> | let total amount be 5.5k tons |
| 11:29 | <andythenorth> | distributed to mines in same ratio |
| 11:30 | <@Alberth> | more random would be more fun imho |
| 11:30 | <andythenorth> | well you write the rules for that in NoGo |
| 11:30 | <@Alberth> | ie send out 'change production (up/down)' to random mines until you reach the desired level |
| 11:31 | <andythenorth> | I would set the levels directly |
| 11:31 | <@Alberth> | but NoGo does not do individual industries afaik |
| 11:32 | <@Alberth> | we could make a notion 'ease of getting the raw material' :) |
| 11:36 | <andythenorth> | Alberth: I am envisaging a whole new layer of spec |
| 11:36 | <@Alberth> | omg, what have I done???!?? :) |
| 11:37 | <andythenorth> | industry behaviour is a known problem anyway |
| 11:38 | <@Alberth> | Perhaps the issue is not opening/closing but production control in general. Open/close is just the first and last change, in that respect. |
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| 11:39 | <andythenorth> | yes |
| 11:40 | <andythenorth> | basically delegate aspects of production control to the script |
| 11:41 | <andythenorth> | via setting existing production level vars |
| 11:41 | <andythenorth> | ship a reusable industry library for nogo |
| 11:42 | <@Alberth> | it needs C++ code as well, as there may not be a NoGo script running (or a different one) |
| 11:42 | <andythenorth> | produce a default nogo script to go with the newgrf |
| 11:42 | <andythenorth> | if no other nogo in use, use that |
| 11:42 | <@Alberth> | andythenorth: via setting existing production level vars <-- are that global production levels or per industry? |
| 11:43 | <andythenorth> | per industry, but decide the values based on total production, or by any other rules |
| 11:44 | <andythenorth> | this idea only applies to primary-style production |
| 11:44 | <@Alberth> | hmm, 1 level per industry type would drastically reduce the number of news items :p |
| 11:44 | <andythenorth> | depends on how nogo triggers news messages :P |
| 11:50 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 11:50 | * | andythenorth needs to read industry_cmd |
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| 11:50 | * | Alberth needs some food |
| 11:52 | <andythenorth> | @seen zuu |
| 11:52 | <@DorpsGek> | andythenorth: zuu was last seen in #openttd 6 days, 3 hours, 57 minutes, and 37 seconds ago: <Zuu> (to gain better control over the transparency) |
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| 12:17 | <andythenorth> | so my idea is something like: |
| 12:17 | <andythenorth> | - allow NoGo to handle IndustryMonthlyLoop as an event |
| 12:17 | <andythenorth> | - give it two passes over the industries, the first is to read properties / variables |
| 12:17 | <andythenorth> | - the second is to set production level for each |
| 12:18 | <andythenorth> | the second pass appears to newgrf exactly as current production cb, unchanged |
| 12:19 | <andythenorth> | and newgrf can choose to defer to game (NoGo), or handle its own production change (no spec change) |
| 12:19 | <andythenorth> | the first pass could then be exposed to newgrf, allowing newgrf to handle reporting values to NoGo |
| 12:20 | <andythenorth> | the industry random production change could be handled identically. (I would bin it, but that's unlikely I guess) |
| 12:20 | <andythenorth> | that is all :P |
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| 12:35 | <supermop> | hello! |
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| 12:51 | <Eddi|zuHause> | how do i make shapes in GIMP? (circles, etc.) |
| 12:52 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: you will NEVER EVER be able to tie FIRS to a script (or the other way around) |
| 12:52 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: (1) why not? (2) that's not my proposal ;) |
| 12:53 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: if GIMP is like photoshop, it has vector shapes, or shaped brushes with variable sizes |
| 12:53 | <andythenorth> | or you make a shaped selection (marquee) and fill it |
| 12:54 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: if it does, i can't find it |
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| 13:07 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: looks like you use selection tools http://docs.gimp.org/en/gimp-using-rectangular.html |
| 13:07 | <andythenorth> | you should have an eliptical select tool |
| 13:08 | <Eddi|zuHause> | I've found a "paths" tool, but that seems to do bezier curves only |
| 13:08 | <Eddi|zuHause> | or similar stuff |
| 13:08 | <Eddi|zuHause> | nothing remotely circle-ly |
| 13:08 | <andythenorth> | don't do circles with bezier |
| 13:08 | <andythenorth> | world of painful pain |
| 13:09 | <andythenorth> | you have a square selection tool (marquee) ? |
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| 13:09 | <andythenorth> | http://docs.gimp.org/en/gimp-tool-ellipse-select.html |
| 13:09 | <Eddi|zuHause> | does libre office come with a vector program? |
| 13:10 | <andythenorth> | just use PIL directly :P http://www.pythonware.com/library/pil/handbook/imagedraw.htm |
| 13:10 | <andythenorth> | why draw when you can code :) |
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| 13:45 | <CIA-1> | OpenTTD: translators * r24184 /trunk/src/lang/ (catalan.txt hungarian.txt polish.txt romanian.txt): |
| 13:45 | <CIA-1> | OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: |
| 13:45 | <CIA-1> | OpenTTD: catalan - 12 changes by arnau |
| 13:45 | <CIA-1> | OpenTTD: hungarian - 13 changes by Brumi |
| 13:45 | <CIA-1> | OpenTTD: polish - 30 changes by Kilian |
| 13:45 | <CIA-1> | OpenTTD: romanian - 13 changes by tonny |
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| 14:02 | <flaa> | Iltaa! |
| 14:04 | <@Alberth> | where is .ie ? |
| 14:04 | <Rubidium> | ireland? |
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| 14:07 | <__ln__> | that's right. it's the smaller island behind the bigger one on the coast of belgium. |
| 14:07 | <Eddi|zuHause> | you mean the isle of man? |
| 14:08 | <Rubidium> | that'd be .im |
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| 14:09 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 14:09 | <andythenorth> | where's my NoGo idea |
| 14:09 | <__ln__> | actually, to avoid causing an international conflict, i have to emphasize that ireland is the southern part of the said island. |
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| 14:10 | <Eddi|zuHause> | ireland is in the south of ireland. |
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| 14:10 | <andythenorth> | anyone want to educate me on NoGo's basic implementation? |
| 14:10 | <andythenorth> | i.e. how it handles events, and what things it can do practically, without bogging the game |
| 14:11 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: in the beginning there was dust and sand |
| 14:11 | <andythenorth> | and then town growth? |
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| 14:11 | <Eddi|zuHause> | (or how "basic" did you mean? :)) |
| 14:12 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: each tick, the script is continued at the last position it stopped. |
| 14:13 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: the script is stopped if it a) executes a command, or b) the operations-per-tick limit is reached |
| 14:13 | <andythenorth> | k |
| 14:13 | <andythenorth> | one command only per tick? Or is the command 'done' ? |
| 14:14 | <Eddi|zuHause> | command is game interactions (build something, etc.) |
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| 14:14 | <andythenorth> | k |
| 14:14 | <andythenorth> | NoGo can handle events from ottd? |
| 14:14 | <andythenorth> | and return values to events? |
| 14:15 | <Eddi|zuHause> | the script can check whether certain events occured. but there is no "interrupt handling" for events |
| 14:15 | <andythenorth> | k |
| 14:15 | <Eddi|zuHause> | and the script cannot return any values |
| 14:15 | <Eddi|zuHause> | commands are the only way to influence the game state |
| 14:15 | <andythenorth> | so my idea of handling IndustryMonthlyLoop is pretty dead |
| 14:16 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 14:17 | <andythenorth> | well it was a nice idea, while it lasted |
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| 14:18 | <Eddi|zuHause> | why do i have the CIV intro tune in my head now? |
| 14:18 | <andythenorth> | better than the fast food jingle I have in my head :( |
| 14:19 | <Eddi|zuHause> | and why is that tune not in CIV V? |
| 14:19 | <Eddi|zuHause> | or is it, and i just never saw the intro? :) |
| 14:22 | <NataS> | morning |
| 14:25 | <NataS> | how does multiplayer work? Can I turn an existing game into a multiplayer one so I can consult other players? |
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| 14:27 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yes, you can load any savegame as multiplayer game |
| 14:27 | <NataS> | if I run cargodist, will there be problems for people joining my game? |
| 14:27 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yes. people need the exact same version of cargodist then |
| 14:28 | <NataS> | is there anybody who would mind a consulting job in my company who runs cargodist g1de4d2a5-cd |
| 14:29 | <NataS> | (that's the version number right? If not where can I find it?) |
| 14:29 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yes, that is the version number |
| 14:30 | * | NataS is used to version numbers just being simple decimals. |
| 14:30 | <@Alberth> | welcome to the git version control system |
| 14:31 | <Eddi|zuHause> | the version number for non-releases is: one letter indicating the source control system (r: svn, h: mercurial, g: git), the revision as a decimal or hexadecimal value, and the name of the branch |
| 14:32 | <Eddi|zuHause> | so here you have "g" for "git", "1de4d2a5" as a hash value indicating the revision, and "cd" as the branch name |
| 14:37 | <NataS> | anyways it's 2080 and I'm a quarter of the way down cuba with almost unlimited funds at this point, but I'm stumped as to how to extend my high speed rail network north of Havana |
| 14:37 | <NataS> | i could use some consultants. |
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| 14:53 | <supermop> | what's up with the 'latest user screenshot of 1.2.0'? |
| 14:53 | <supermop> | pretty sure that is unchanged since the first time I downloaded Openttd in 2008 or so |
| 14:54 | <NataS> | hey, how come food is getting evenly distributed to every town on the line, but goods all get offloaded at the first station? |
| 14:54 | <NataS> | what's up with that? |
| 14:55 | <Eddi|zuHause> | supermop: yes. it's silly :p |
| 14:55 | <NataS> | no wait now it's working |
| 14:56 | <Eddi|zuHause> | NataS: the first few packets may get generated with "no destination" |
| 14:56 | <Eddi|zuHause> | NataS: then they will get off at the first place that accepts them |
| 14:59 | <NataS> | oh |
| 14:59 | <NataS> | I see |
| 14:59 | <NataS> | cool |
| 14:59 | <planetmaker> | supermop: yes, it's indeed silly... |
| 14:59 | <supermop> | No desire to fix it? |
| 14:59 | <planetmaker> | though there are "updated" ones behind it. But... not from 1.2 actually... |
| 14:59 | <planetmaker> | yet |
| 15:00 | <supermop> | should that just be removed from the front page? |
| 15:00 | <NataS> | well I have a factory and food plant on opisate ends of my network |
| 15:00 | <NataS> | and I have freight trains running between them refitting on both ends |
| 15:00 | <NataS> | :3 |
| 15:00 | <supermop> | or the caption could just say 'screenshots' |
| 15:01 | <supermop> | planetmaker: I'll try to draw you what I meant for rivers later this afternoon, have to run to a site visit |
| 15:01 | <planetmaker> | supermop: did you read my (recent) reply? |
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| 15:02 | <planetmaker> | and the screenshots should not be removed but updated rather |
| 15:03 | <Eddi|zuHause> | planetmaker: didn't you want to put the competition intro games as screenshots? |
| 15:03 | <planetmaker> | yes I did and I do |
| 15:12 | <andythenorth> | anybody want to draw Sugar Beet tiles for CHIPS? |
| 15:13 | <andythenorth> | I'm rejecting the ticket otherwise |
| 15:13 | <andythenorth> | Rhamphoryncus: you tried this? ^ |
| 15:13 | <@Alberth> | make it a low priority feature request :) |
| 15:13 | <andythenorth> | wish I knew what this meant :P http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/3343 |
| 15:13 | <Rhamphoryncus> | Yeah, but it'd take me forever |
| 15:14 | <andythenorth> | I want to close all CHIPS tickets soon |
| 15:14 | <andythenorth> | it's nearly 'done' as far as I'm concerned |
| 15:14 | <andythenorth> | ;) |
| 15:14 | <Rubidium> | smells like an (ancient) nforenum warning |
| 15:14 | <Rhamphoryncus> | is that an error from nmlc? |
| 15:14 | <andythenorth> | nfo |
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| 15:16 | * | andythenorth suppresses it |
| 15:20 | <Chris_Booth> | @seen Ammler # |
| 15:20 | <@DorpsGek> | Chris_Booth: seen [<channel>] <nick> |
| 15:20 | <Chris_Booth> | @seen Ammler |
| 15:20 | <@DorpsGek> | Chris_Booth: Ammler was last seen in #openttd 2 days, 9 hours, 27 minutes, and 44 seconds ago: <Ammler> else you can use the forums or flyspray |
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| 15:23 | <andythenorth> | 4 open tickets for CHIPS |
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| 15:25 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 15:26 | <andythenorth> | is auto-refit still dangerous with cb36 etc? |
| 15:26 | <Chris_Booth> | hi andythenorth |
| 15:28 | <andythenorth> | can vehicle / model life be fixed? |
| 15:28 | <andythenorth> | currently it's pretty useless |
| 15:28 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: there was some good suggestion for that recently....buy menu availability cb? |
| 15:29 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yeah, something like that |
| 15:31 | <andythenorth> | post-stable release is good patching time :) |
| 15:32 | <@Alberth> | good night all |
| 15:32 | <andythenorth> | seems like a simple cb: return 00 for hide, or any other value to show? |
| 15:32 | <andythenorth> | bye Alberth |
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| 15:33 | <andythenorth> | or return the climate availability to match the current prop, but that might be odd |
| 15:35 | <Chris_Booth> | I need to have /ignore cb in this channel |
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| 15:36 | <andythenorth> | needs a var: check availability of vehicle id |
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| 15:41 | <andythenorth> | only 122 newgrf issues assigned to andythenorth :) :P :o |
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| 15:42 | <Chris_Booth> | andythenorth: you need a new helper, and a donate button so we can help you for making the game great for us! |
| 15:42 | <andythenorth> | Chris_Booth: just wait until bananas charges $1.99 for newgrfs |
| 15:42 | <andythenorth> | all will be fine then |
| 15:42 | <Chris_Booth> | I would pay that any day |
| 15:42 | <Chris_Booth> | and not even think of it |
| 15:43 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: and return "callback failed" for default (random) behaviour? |
| 15:44 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: or a value for 'use default', e.g. 04 or such |
| 15:44 | <andythenorth> | but yes |
| 15:45 | <Ammler> | Chris_Booth: Hello :-) |
| 15:45 | <andythenorth> | this is probably a 7 line patch; seems like it's just a switch statement and add the constants for the cb number |
| 15:45 | <Ammler> | do I need to read back? |
| 15:45 | <Chris_Booth> | Ammler: no I have done it now |
| 15:45 | <Chris_Booth> | check PZ |
| 15:45 | <andythenorth> | adding a var to check availability of other vehicles might be harder :| |
| 15:46 | <Chris_Booth> | I paid for some beer for you Ammler :P |
| 15:46 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: should think about it in conjunction with nogo :P |
| 15:46 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: just pass the vehicle id to a 40+/60+ var? |
| 15:47 | <andythenorth> | sounds plausible |
| 15:47 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: but how to handle the "phases" wrt reliability? |
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| 15:47 | <andythenorth> | not sure, I don't really understand them properly |
| 15:47 | <__ln__> | hi Wolf01 |
| 15:47 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 15:47 | <Wolf01> | evenink |
| 15:47 | <Ammler> | Chris_Booth: ok, the less money I need for the server I will spend for beer, no big issue ;-) |
| 15:47 | * | andythenorth had a silly idea: var calls availability cb for vehicle with id xyz |
| 15:48 | <andythenorth> | *might* be circular :P |
| 15:48 | <Eddi|zuHause> | and how do i attach wires to this thing? |
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| 16:00 | <krinn> | hi guys, where can i reserve the 4 chars AI/lib to use in bananas ? I can't put my hands on the thread in the forum, is it delete? |
| 16:08 | <planetmaker> | probably it's a sticky in the NoAI / scripts forum |
| 16:09 | <krinn> | that's what i was looking, but it's no more there |
| 16:09 | <NataS> | nobody wants to try co-op with me? |
| 16:11 | <Eddi|zuHause> | it says "use a max. 3mm screwdriver"... but apparently their 3mm seem to be smaller than my 3mm... |
| 16:11 | <planetmaker> | NataS: there are the coop servers... |
| 16:11 | <andythenorth> | try '2 and a bit' |
| 16:12 | <NataS> | yes, but I want to bring other players into my existing single player game |
| 16:12 | <NataS> | to help me expand my high speed rail network |
| 16:12 | <planetmaker> | krinn: http://wiki.openttd.org/AI:ShortNames_in_use |
| 16:12 | <Eddi|zuHause> | or they meant "use brute force" |
| 16:12 | <NataS> | it's the year 2093 and my network covers a quarter of cuba |
| 16:12 | <NataS> | and I am stumped as how to elegently extend it north of Havana |
| 16:12 | <krinn> | planetmaker, oh gone to the wiki, can anyone add a new one for me ? |
| 16:13 | <planetmaker> | you do that yourself ;-) |
| 16:13 | <planetmaker> | (that's why it was moved to the wiki) |
| 16:13 | <krinn> | never touch a wiki in my life, and don't wish to put hell on it |
| 16:13 | <planetmaker> | too bad then ;-) |
| 16:13 | <andythenorth> | Eddi|zuHause: use a hammer |
| 16:14 | * | andythenorth ponders |
| 16:15 | <andythenorth> | convert HEQS to nml? |
| 16:15 | <Eddi|zuHause> | what for? |
| 16:16 | <NataS> | also, no servers match my version |
| 16:16 | <NataS> | :P |
| 16:16 | <andythenorth> | so I can use the BANDIT code for articulated vehicles, refitting to different lengths etc |
| 16:16 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: port HEQS to the BANDIT codebase... |
| 16:16 | <andythenorth> | exactly |
| 16:16 | <andythenorth> | HEQS has a lot of vehicle-specific code though |
| 16:16 | <andythenorth> | BANDIT is 100% generic |
| 16:16 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: only port over the vehicle data and sprite offsets, throw everything else away |
| 16:17 | <andythenorth> | yes |
| 16:17 | <andythenorth> | I'd start from scratch pretty much |
| 16:17 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: do FIRS economies first :( |
| 16:17 | <Eddi|zuHause> | :) |
| 16:17 | <andythenorth> | planetmaker: ^^ |
| 16:17 | <andythenorth> | I can't do FIRS economies in CPP |
| 16:17 | <planetmaker> | :-) |
| 16:18 | <andythenorth> | that's planetmaker or yexo level stuff |
| 16:18 | <andythenorth> | I could do it in python, but the conversion would be a lot of work :P |
| 16:18 | <planetmaker> | you sure could do that in NML, too ;_) |
| 16:19 | <andythenorth> | we'd want to conditionally change a lot of defines etc |
| 16:20 | <andythenorth> | that means nesting varadic macros or such |
| 16:20 | <andythenorth> | or.... |
| 16:20 | <andythenorth> | we just duplicate all the code for each economy |
| 16:20 | <andythenorth> | and set the defines appropriately |
| 16:21 | <andythenorth> | big, but simple |
| 16:21 | <planetmaker> | I'd do it like in OpenGFX+Industries, first just changing availability of industries |
| 16:21 | <planetmaker> | and maybe then 2nd step parameter-dependent properties |
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| 16:22 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yeah, this smaller screwdriver works way better |
| 16:23 | <andythenorth> | we should probably only change action 0 props anyway |
| 16:23 | <andythenorth> | anything else is a nightmare for testing / bug reports |
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| 16:23 | <Eddi|zuHause> | i think cargo availability is the most troublesome |
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| 16:23 | <planetmaker> | anything else is anyway a 3rd step only. And we need to see how steps 1 and 2 work out, IMHO |
| 16:23 | <Eddi|zuHause> | if you want to have different cargo subsets |
| 16:24 | <planetmaker> | yes |
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| 16:30 | <andythenorth> | fortunately the game handles cargo availability quite well already |
| 16:30 | <andythenorth> | if cargo not available, but define in action 0 for industry, nothing blows up |
| 16:37 | <Eddi|zuHause> | yes, but if SCMT is not defined, you'd want to change the steel mill output to 4 per ore and 4 per coal. or 6/2 |
| 16:39 | <planetmaker> | also yes ;-) |
| 16:40 | <andythenorth> | true, but more complicated |
| 16:40 | <andythenorth> | lots of {string} :P |
| 16:41 | <Eddi|zuHause> | your idea of just duplicating the industry might come in handy there |
| 16:43 | <andythenorth> | "simple is simpler" :P |
| 16:43 | <andythenorth> | if I did my maths correctly, it produces a ~10MB grf : |
| 16:43 | <planetmaker> | Eddi|zuHause: the output level could work via cargo availability checks to be normalized to the desired max output level |
| 16:43 | <planetmaker> | that probably can be generalized somewhat to work w/o ifs |
| 16:44 | <andythenorth> | if we have to use ifs, it definitely gets worse :P |
| 16:45 | <Eddi|zuHause> | andythenorth: i don't think you have to duplicate the sprites |
| 16:45 | <andythenorth> | no |
| 16:46 | <andythenorth> | hmm |
| 16:47 | <andythenorth> | if it was python-based, I'd make each industry type an object subclassing Industry |
| 16:47 | <andythenorth> | each economy would just be a list of industry objects |
| 16:48 | <andythenorth> | I'd template those in with action 7 wrapped around them, all sharing the graphics chain |
| 16:50 | <Eddi|zuHause> | problem is that you cannot skip action2 with an action7 |
| 16:50 | <Chris_Booth> | Eddi|zuHause: can you skip both with an action9? |
| 16:50 | <Eddi|zuHause> | no |
| 16:51 | <Eddi|zuHause> | can't skip action2 with an action9 either |
| 16:51 | <Eddi|zuHause> | and you can't change it with action6 |
| 16:51 | <andythenorth> | I wouldn't need to skip the action 2s afaict |
| 16:53 | <NataS> | are there ANY co-op servers that use any version of cargodist? |
| 16:53 | <andythenorth> | they do no harm |
| 16:54 | <NataS> | I want to try co-op, but i Just can't go back to trunk. |
| 16:54 | <Eddi|zuHause> | NataS: i know that problem... |
| 16:54 | <Eddi|zuHause> | i've had that for many years now :) |
| 16:55 | <Eddi|zuHause> | NataS: you need a pretty close community to use a non-release build in multiplayer, though |
| 16:55 | <NataS> | sure cargodist is less than perfect, but not having any sort of cargo destinations is the opposite of perfect. |
| 16:56 | <zxbiohazardzx> | NaTaS there where some realms that play on custom builds (eg Chrillcore Patchpack |
| 16:57 | <zxbiohazardzx> | if that contains CargoDist then you can try that as tehre are some that do |
| 16:58 | <NataS> | how do I find them? |
| 16:59 | <zxbiohazardzx> | like you would do on others |
| 16:59 | <zxbiohazardzx> | just hit multiplayer and check if you get any greens (matching revision) |
| 16:59 | <NataS> | it's all red |
| 16:59 | <zxbiohazardzx> | thats how me/roma/ext used to play huge maps with the patchpack etc |
| 16:59 | <NataS> | everything red forever |
| 17:00 | <zxbiohazardzx> | then your revision =/ other revisions |
| 17:00 | <zxbiohazardzx> | alot of them are on stable |
| 17:00 | <zxbiohazardzx> | but sometimes you get a few on patchpack |
| 17:00 | <zxbiohazardzx> | if not then just ask on forums if anyone is interested |
| 17:00 | <zxbiohazardzx> | :P |
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| 17:01 | <NataS> | i have come to the conclusion that all the good maps are too big for one player |
| 17:02 | <Rubidium> | then they're probably too big for multiplayer as well |
| 17:02 | <NataS> | lol |
| 17:02 | <NataS> | why do people keep making huge maps |
| 17:03 | <NataS> | :P |
| 17:03 | <planetmaker> | that's a good question. I wonder, too |
| 17:03 | <zxbiohazardzx> | lies |
| 17:03 | <planetmaker> | They just see the big map and the many possibilities. But are not aware of the game's limits |
| 17:03 | <zxbiohazardzx> | i played a 2048x2048 with everything |
| 17:03 | <zxbiohazardzx> | Cindini map in multiplayer |
| 17:03 | <Rubidium> | come on, the only good maps are 16kx16k |
| 17:03 | <zxbiohazardzx> | i haz savegame to share |
| 17:04 | <zxbiohazardzx> | 2048x2048 with paxdest & huge cities, it lags balls even in SP if you try to view the wrong regions |
| 17:04 | <zxbiohazardzx> | :P |
| 17:05 | <zxbiohazardzx> | to bad its on patchpack, else i would upload it for your stresstest :P |
| 17:06 | <NataS> | well what kind of PC do you use? |
| 17:06 | <zxbiohazardzx> | gaming pc |
| 17:06 | <NataS> | I have an i7 and 6gb of ram |
| 17:06 | <zxbiohazardzx> | intel i7, 16 gb ram, geforce gtx 560 win 7 x64 |
| 17:06 | <NataS> | damn |
| 17:06 | <NataS> | so it lags even with that setup? |
| 17:07 | <zxbiohazardzx> | yes |
| 17:07 | <zxbiohazardzx> | ever seen the cindini map? |
| 17:07 | <NataS> | also, what happens if you press fast forward on a tiny map? |
| 17:07 | <zxbiohazardzx> | the 3.0 is downloadable via BaNaNa's |
| 17:07 | <zxbiohazardzx> | im not a fast-fowarder |
| 17:07 | <zxbiohazardzx> | i use pause more often then i use ffw |
| 17:08 | <NataS> | i can fast forward when using my netbook, but it's dangerous to use that on my gaming laptop |
| 17:08 | <NataS> | esp on a small map |
| 17:08 | <NataS> | time can slip away |
| 17:08 | <zxbiohazardzx> | just grab the Cindini map 3.001 from Banana's |
| 17:08 | <NataS> | there should be a setting to throttle maximum possible speed |
| 17:08 | <zxbiohazardzx> | and go to capitola |
| 17:08 | <NataS> | link? |
| 17:08 | <zxbiohazardzx> | banana's has it |
| 17:08 | * | andythenorth -> sleep |
| 17:08 | <andythenorth> | bye |
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| 17:09 | <zxbiohazardzx> | wait your on patchpack right? |
| 17:09 | <NataS> | I'm just on cargodist |
| 17:09 | <zxbiohazardzx> | nvm we used some custom grf's :P so hard to share :P |
| 17:09 | <zxbiohazardzx> | just grab the map |
| 17:09 | <NataS> | and don't know what Bananas is |
| 17:09 | <NataS> | is that the check online content thing? |
| 17:09 | <NataS> | i didn't know it had a name |
| 17:09 | <zxbiohazardzx> | yes |
| 17:10 | <zxbiohazardzx> | the check online content thingy |
| 17:10 | <NataS> | can't find it |
| 17:10 | <zxbiohazardzx> | Cindini? |
| 17:10 | <zxbiohazardzx> | its in the list for sure |
| 17:10 | <NataS> | oh that one |
| 17:10 | <NataS> | yeah |
| 17:10 | <zxbiohazardzx> | ;) |
| 17:10 | <zxbiohazardzx> | anyway |
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| 17:10 | <NataS> | if it's the one I think it is |
| 17:10 | <zxbiohazardzx> | statistics on the played map |
| 17:10 | <NataS> | it looks amazing |
| 17:10 | <NataS> | but it's unplayable for me |
| 17:10 | <NataS> | no room to lay tracks |
| 17:11 | <NataS> | not without demolishing huge portions of the city |
| 17:11 | <NataS> | or removing the highway system |
| 17:11 | <zxbiohazardzx> | lies |
| 17:11 | <NataS> | maybe a bus network? |
| 17:11 | <zxbiohazardzx> | nope |
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| 17:11 | <zxbiohazardzx> | we actually have stations in the cities |
| 17:11 | <zxbiohazardzx> | dont be affraid to nuke hard in the towns |
| 17:11 | <zxbiohazardzx> | we got it done :P |
| 17:11 | <zxbiohazardzx> | anyway |
| 17:11 | <zxbiohazardzx> | ill screenshot some stats for it 1 sec |
| 17:11 | <NataS> | can I see screensho... lol sniped |
| 17:12 | <zxbiohazardzx> | hehe |
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| 17:14 | <zxbiohazardzx> | so hard to capture shit in a screeny though |
| 17:14 | <zxbiohazardzx> | as its really nicely fitted in |
| 17:14 | <NataS> | take a full sized one |
| 17:14 | <zxbiohazardzx> | so you hardly notice it zoomed out to much :P |
| 17:14 | <NataS> | :P |
| 17:14 | <Mazur> | Use a fan, that's always good for capturing shit. |
| 17:15 | <zxbiohazardzx> | to lazy |
| 17:15 | <NataS> | how did they make the beaches in this map? |
| 17:15 | <zxbiohazardzx> | http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=60&t=58204&p=1011775#p1011775 |
| 17:15 | <zxbiohazardzx> | rivertiles or canaltiles |
| 17:16 | <NataS> | did they have to flood the area first? |
| 17:16 | <zxbiohazardzx> | higher up in the thread are screenshots of ownage |
| 17:16 | <zxbiohazardzx> | map overvieuws are higher up, the statistics are lower down |
| 17:16 | <NataS> | how is building in the cities possible without cheating though? |
| 17:16 | <zxbiohazardzx> | and ingame screenshots used to be in romazoon's thread, untill something went wrong with the attachements (they wont show for me, to old or so i recon) |
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| 17:17 | <zxbiohazardzx> | NataS we did cheat slighly to start off some cash |
| 17:17 | <zxbiohazardzx> | but by carefully selecting some initial routes |
| 17:17 | <NataS> | but I imagine bribes eat that up quickly |
| 17:17 | <zxbiohazardzx> | you can actually later on use your insanity profits to keep it up |
| 17:17 | <zxbiohazardzx> | haha |
| 17:17 | <zxbiohazardzx> | nope |
| 17:17 | <zxbiohazardzx> | auto-demolish is on indeed :P |
| 17:17 | <NataS> | auto-demolish? |
| 17:17 | <zxbiohazardzx> | to lazy to modify the game to make cities accept even more |
| 17:17 | <NataS> | you mean the magic bulldozer |
| 17:17 | <zxbiohazardzx> | yes |
| 17:18 | <zxbiohazardzx> | magic bulldozer is on |
| 17:18 | <zxbiohazardzx> | cause city size is not accounted for in the attitude towards changes :P |
| 17:18 | <zxbiohazardzx> | anyway stats are shown :P |
| 17:18 | <NataS> | maps like this make me think some kind of hybrid between sim city and TTD would be intresting |
| 17:19 | <zxbiohazardzx> | haha |
| 17:19 | <NataS> | play as the local authority and "Zone" areas |
| 17:19 | <zxbiohazardzx> | well whopper spend ALOT of time on that map |
| 17:19 | <NataS> | then coperate with the people playing as transport companies |
| 17:19 | <zxbiohazardzx> | and me/roma/ext played alot of games after/before this one |
| 17:19 | <zxbiohazardzx> | so we all liked realistic networking |
| 17:19 | <zxbiohazardzx> | and maps |
| 17:20 | <zxbiohazardzx> | and playing with a graphically neat style (mainly cityscaping as we called it) |
| 17:20 | <NataS> | I think the worst thing about huge maps like this is the inibility to zoom out all the way |
| 17:21 | <zxbiohazardzx> | yeah instead of extra zoom (more zoomed in) i would have prefered extra zoom (more zooming out possible) |
| 17:21 | <NataS> | yeah, I don't get the point of zooming further in |
| 17:21 | <zxbiohazardzx> | but im not sure how that works out for the devs |
| 17:21 | <NataS> | it will just make things more ugly and less usefull |
| 17:21 | <zxbiohazardzx> | 32bpp use it |
| 17:21 | <planetmaker> | 8bpp also uses it |
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| 17:22 | <zxbiohazardzx> | still |
| 17:22 | <zxbiohazardzx> | would more zooming out give issues with map-array or shit like that? |
| 17:22 | <NataS> | to zoom out, just censor all the vehicle sprites and compress the map |
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| 17:23 | <supermop> | planetmaker: yes |
| 17:23 | <NataS> | Hmm, I supose deleting some of the redundent factories would make nice room for freight stations |
| 17:24 | <NataS> | still have to demolish other things to make room for the tracks though, why are these all in the water |
| 17:24 | <NataS> | maybe this map is designed for boats |
| 17:24 | <zxbiohazardzx> | hehe |
| 17:24 | <zxbiohazardzx> | nah |
| 17:24 | <zxbiohazardzx> | we railed it all |
| 17:25 | <zxbiohazardzx> | see image 5, accerbol :P |
| 17:25 | <NataS> | boats would take forever in this map thought |
| 17:25 | <zxbiohazardzx> | and were on v2 |
| 17:25 | <zxbiohazardzx> | so less industries |
| 17:25 | <zxbiohazardzx> | we rail it |
| 17:25 | <NataS> | there needs to be a ship speed factor setting |
| 17:25 | <NataS> | to make them move faster |
| 17:25 | <zxbiohazardzx> | the water and parks are there for a reason |
| 17:25 | <zxbiohazardzx> | we actually did use some boats |
| 17:25 | <NataS> | like the aircraft speed setting |
| 17:25 | <zxbiohazardzx> | but we limited it on multiplayer |
| 17:25 | <zxbiohazardzx> | alot of boats on huge map ==> pathfinder lagged us i believe |
| 17:30 | <NataS> | i just flodded the El Circatriz river |
| 17:30 | <NataS> | :3 |
| 17:33 | <NataS> | anyways, if anybody can run cargodist g1de4d2a5-cd I'd love to hire them as a consultant for my cuban rail network. |
| 17:33 | <zxbiohazardzx> | hehe jump to capitola haha |
| 17:33 | <zxbiohazardzx> | send me a rar with everything i need, then ill check |
| 17:33 | <zxbiohazardzx> | rar with executable && grfs i might need :P |
| 17:33 | <zxbiohazardzx> | 3 more screens for you btw |
| 17:33 | <zxbiohazardzx> | same topic |
| 17:35 | <NataS> | uhh, I don't remember what grfs, but they are all from the loader |
| 17:35 | <NataS> | and common ones |
| 17:36 | <NataS> | so you will likely either already have them, and if not you can just download them automaticly |
| 17:36 | <zxbiohazardzx> | just rar me a file that i can execute here |
| 17:36 | <zxbiohazardzx> | thats ok |
| 17:36 | <zxbiohazardzx> | just get me the exe then |
| 17:36 | <NataS> | windows 7 64? |
| 17:36 | <zxbiohazardzx> | si |
| 17:36 | <NataS> | of course, you said you had an i7 derp |
| 17:37 | -!- | Stimrol_ [~Stimrol@dsl-149-87-36.hive.is] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] |
| 17:38 | <NataS> | just let me wait for my dropbox to sync |
| 17:39 | <NataS> | http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24299180/openttd-cargodist-g1de4d2a5-cd-windows-win64.zip |
| 17:39 | <NataS> | here we go |
| 17:39 | <zxbiohazardzx> | thx |
| 17:39 | <zxbiohazardzx> | unzippin |
| 17:40 | -!- | th_gergo [~thiering@1F2E8CA3.catv.pool.telekom.hu] has joined #openttd |
| 17:40 | <NataS> | okay it should be online now |
| 17:40 | <NataS> | Habana Rail |
| 17:40 | <NataS> | password is Pete |
| 17:40 | <zxbiohazardzx> | checking |
| 17:41 | <zxbiohazardzx> | nothing found, got IP for me? |
| 17:41 | <zxbiohazardzx> | ip&port :P |
| 17:42 | <NataS> | how do I find that? |
| 17:42 | -!- | Xaroth [~Xaroth@059-057-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] |
| 17:42 | <zxbiohazardzx> | whatsmyip.com |
| 17:43 | <NataS> | 131.191.34.64 |
| 17:43 | -!- | Progman [~progman@p57A19B11.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd |
| 17:44 | <zxbiohazardzx> | nope still wont pick it up |
| 17:44 | <NataS> | hmm |
| 17:45 | <NataS> | I had problems with other games |
| 17:45 | <NataS> | and I don't remember how I solved them lol |
| 17:45 | <zxbiohazardzx> | usually its ports etc |
| 17:45 | <NataS> | do you have uhh, that thing |
| 17:45 | <NataS> | Can't remember wat it was called |
| 17:45 | <NataS> | but it set up a vurtual lan network |
| 17:46 | <NataS> | oh I don't have it on this install either lol |
| 17:46 | <NataS> | well what ports need to be open? |
| 17:47 | <zxbiohazardzx> | not sure |
| 17:47 | <zxbiohazardzx> | see wiki on multiplayer FAQ |
| 17:47 | <Rubidium> | might it be the ports in the multiplayer documentation? |
| 17:47 | <zxbiohazardzx> | 3979 is default, but you can change it :P |
| 17:48 | <zxbiohazardzx> | 3979 inbound+outbound UDP , 3978 outbound UDP |
| 17:50 | <NataS> | maybe just refresh aggain? |
| 17:51 | <zxbiohazardzx> | 1 sec |
| 17:51 | <zxbiohazardzx> | if not then ill try host |
| 17:51 | <zxbiohazardzx> | nope |
| 17:52 | <zxbiohazardzx> | try it |
| 17:52 | <zxbiohazardzx> | Natas is the name if it worked |
| 17:53 | <NataS> | can't find any with that name |
| 17:54 | <NataS> | or any green ones |
| 17:54 | <zxbiohazardzx> | `hmmz k |
| 17:54 | <zxbiohazardzx> | 93.208.93.109:3979 |
| 17:54 | <zxbiohazardzx> | neither? |
| 17:56 | <zxbiohazardzx> | how bout now (changed port triggering |
| 17:57 | <NataS> | says server offline |
| 17:58 | <zxbiohazardzx> | k |
| 17:58 | <zxbiohazardzx> | can you try once more? |
| 17:58 | <zxbiohazardzx> | as in you host |
| 17:59 | <NataS> | hosting |
| 18:00 | <zxbiohazardzx> | still not detecting |
| 18:00 | <zxbiohazardzx> | so dunno |
| 18:00 | <zxbiohazardzx> | i hate my network anyway |
| 18:00 | <zxbiohazardzx> | router -> router -> computer |
| 18:00 | <zxbiohazardzx> | fucked up if you need to foward ports etc |
| 18:01 | <NataS> | It might be my end that's causing shit |
| 18:02 | <zxbiohazardzx> | nah i think i got correct outbound now |
| 18:02 | <NataS> | maybe we can try hamachi? |
| 18:02 | <zxbiohazardzx> | screw hamachi |
| 18:02 | <zxbiohazardzx> | hosted another, lets see if i fixed ports now |
| 18:03 | -!- | FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has left #openttd [] |
| 18:03 | <NataS> | negative |
| 18:04 | <zxbiohazardzx> | ok lemmy try on the default 1.2.0 games |
| 18:04 | <zxbiohazardzx> | see if anyone else can check it |
| 18:06 | <zxbiohazardzx> | hosting a test on 1.2.0 |
| 18:06 | <zxbiohazardzx> | 64x64 map |
| 18:06 | <zxbiohazardzx> | anyone able to connect ? |
| 18:07 | <zxbiohazardzx> | also on a Dedi mode :P |
| 18:08 | <zxbiohazardzx> | udp/tcp packets from 3979 cannot be delivered :P |
| 18:08 | <NataS> | lol |
| 18:09 | <NataS> | tried to take a whole map screenshot and nither PSelements or SAI can open it |
| 18:09 | <zxbiohazardzx> | looking at the router, those ports are open |
| 18:09 | <zxbiohazardzx> | haha |
| 18:09 | <zxbiohazardzx> | still the same |
| 18:09 | <zxbiohazardzx> | any ideas on how to fix TCP/UDP port triggering not going as expected? |
| 18:09 | <NataS> | nor can paint |
| 18:09 | -!- | supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop] |
| 18:09 | <NataS> | how do I crop a 43 meg png file? |
| 18:10 | <zxbiohazardzx> | haha |
| 18:10 | <zxbiohazardzx> | just google on huge picture how to solve |
| 18:10 | -!- | oskari89 [~oskari89@213-186-253-165.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] |
| 18:13 | <NataS> | looking it up I find there are people who have to minipulate 16 gb immages |
| 18:13 | <NataS> | :C |
| 18:13 | <Eddi|zuHause> | NataS: "normal" image viewers will try to unpack the whole file into memory |
| 18:13 | <NataS> | apparently these are synthetic aperture radar images. |
| 18:14 | <zxbiohazardzx> | http://www.freewebs.com/dutcharmedforces/Untitled-1.png |
| 18:14 | <Eddi|zuHause> | NataS: so you want one which can handle partial images |
| 18:14 | <zxbiohazardzx> | Eddi any suggestions for that? |
| 18:14 | <CornishPasty> | zxbiohazardzx: you want port forwarding, not triggering |
| 18:14 | <zxbiohazardzx> | CornishPasty hmmz |
| 18:15 | <CornishPasty> | I don't know what port the dedicated server talks to the master server on... |
| 18:15 | <zxbiohazardzx> | how do i foward it haha |
| 18:15 | <zxbiohazardzx> | 3979 |
| 18:15 | <CornishPasty> | Virtual Servers, zxbiohazardzx |
| 18:15 | <zxbiohazardzx> | has it as well |
| 18:15 | <NataS> | hamachi should work |
| 18:15 | <NataS> | it usualy works in situations like this |
| 18:16 | <CornishPasty> | NataS: I'd use imagick for cropping large files :P |
| 18:16 | <zxbiohazardzx> | CornishPasty still same |
| 18:17 | <zxbiohazardzx> | http://www.freewebs.com/dutcharmedforces/Untitled-2.png |
| 18:17 | <CornishPasty> | zxbiohazardzx: I don't know then, I run my openttd on a vps |
| 18:17 | -!- | DDR [~chatzilla@d66-183-121-60.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd |
| 18:17 | <zxbiohazardzx> | im just trying to get it to accept/run over internet |
| 18:18 | <zxbiohazardzx> | but i keep hitting port issues |
| 18:21 | <zxbiohazardzx> | brb checking something |
| 18:24 | -!- | Hazzard [~72f6456f@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd |
| 18:26 | <Hazzard> | Hello |
| 18:28 | <NataS> | hi |
| 18:29 | -!- | Progman_ [~progman@p57A199ED.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd |
| 18:30 | <zxbiohazardzx> | btw i think Cornish there is another router blocking it |
| 18:30 | <zxbiohazardzx> | i have a modem/router that is linked to the actual router |
| 18:30 | <zxbiohazardzx> | i thought that first router/modem was simply passing it all through |
| 18:30 | <zxbiohazardzx> | but i now have to check :P |
| 18:30 | <zxbiohazardzx> | 192.168.50.1 is the router i can change |
| 18:30 | <zxbiohazardzx> | now i need to find out the ip for the other one :P |
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| 18:40 | <Wolf01> | 'night |
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| 18:48 | <NataS> | well trying to open it in IMDisplay, it hasn't crashed yet, but it's not responding |
| 18:49 | <NataS> | megabytes dosn't seem THAT large. |
| 18:49 | <NataS> | 42 megs rather |
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| 19:02 | -!- | zxbiohazardzx is now known as there |
| 19:02 | <there> | hmmz |
| 19:03 | -!- | there is now known as ZxBiohazardZx |
| 19:03 | -!- | flaa [~flaa@089-101-093077.ntlworld.ie] has quit [Quit: leaving] |
| 19:03 | <ZxBiohazardZx> | so i have to foward ports or trigger them? |
| 19:05 | <ZxBiohazardZx> | blegh |
| 19:05 | <ZxBiohazardZx> | now i get "not a valid IP" stuff :( |
| 19:05 | -!- | zxbiohazardzx_ [~IceChat77@5ED05D6D.cm-7-1b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] |
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| 19:11 | <ZxBiohazardZx> | wootwoot i think i nailed it |
| 19:11 | <ZxBiohazardZx> | took long enough :P |
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| 19:46 | <Hazzard> | Is there a way to make RVs cost more then the 255x cost_factor? |
| 20:00 | -!- | drac_boy [~drac_boy@modemcable085.125-161-184.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #openttd |
| 20:00 | <drac_boy> | hi |
| 20:01 | -!- | Firartix [~artixds@27.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] |
| 20:04 | <Hazzard> | Hello |
| 20:09 | <drac_boy> | how're you Hazzard? |
| 20:11 | <Hazzard> | Good, you? |
| 20:12 | <drac_boy> | doing ok, just trying sort out a few major things with no luck as usual -_- |
| 20:13 | <Hazzard> | What kind of things are you trying to sort out? |
| 20:15 | <drac_boy> | a laptop, some way to deal with the various videos here, a bit re this grf tracking table sheet I have, bit about cellphones |
| 20:15 | <drac_boy> | thats them basically :) |
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| 20:38 | <drac_boy> | what you doing hazzard? |
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| 21:57 | <Hungarian1986> | hello |
| 21:58 | <Hungarian1986> | is anyone around? |
| 21:58 | <Hungarian1986> | i could use some help |
| 21:59 | <Hungarian1986> | because no matter what i do the 1.2.0 can't run with the base graphics |
| 21:59 | <Hungarian1986> | it write an error that there aremissing sprites |
| 21:59 | <Hungarian1986> | and it has strange font type, what is annoying, and also some missing GUI guttons |
| 22:01 | -!- | HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@i59F6A069.versanet.de] has joined #openttd |
| 22:06 | <Hungarian1986> | can anyone help? |
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| 22:38 | <Hungarian1986> | hello |
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| --- | Log | closed Sat Apr 28 00:00:46 2012 |
