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#openttd IRC Logs for 2012-08-05

---Logopened Sun Aug 05 00:00:55 2012
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02:16<Zuu_>Morning
02:16<Supercheese>Salve, excitate
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02:54*Supercheese is depressed there is no patchpack that has Signals in Tunnels that is close enough to trunk
02:56<Rubidium>that sounds like a massive contradiction to me
02:56<Supercheese>"based on sufficiently recent trunk revision" perhaps
02:56<Supercheese>version* whatever
02:56*Supercheese is sleepy
02:57<Eddi|zuHause>i never understood how people can use this patch, if it doesn't work with path signals...
02:57<Supercheese>ANY signals in tunnels is amazing
02:57<Supercheese>and really necessary to create underground railways
02:58<Supercheese>UKRS+ London Underground stuff + Signals in Tunnels results in a great subway system
02:58*Rubidium wouldn't agree with that
02:59<Supercheese>Alas, I lose out on a lot of cool stuff that happened in trunk after r24122
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03:02<Supercheese>Ah well, decidedly worth it
03:03<Eddi|zuHause>again. i could never find a situation where i could actually _use_ these signals!
03:03<Supercheese>Simple block signals?
03:03<Supercheese>The subways I make are dual-closed-loops
03:04<Supercheese>block signals work fine
03:04<Eddi|zuHause>i _never_ have "simple block signals"
03:04*Supercheese shrugs
03:04<Supercheese>okie dokie then
03:04<Eddi|zuHause>it's simply too much of a restriction
03:04<Eddi|zuHause>and it doesn't even make any sense
03:05<Supercheese>Well as I said, closed loops work fine with them
03:05<Supercheese>all trains going in the same direction, one platform only
03:05<Supercheese>no need to switch anywhere
03:06<Supercheese>one platform per direction per station* that is
03:06<Eddi|zuHause>sure. you can play without signals. just make 100 point-to-point lines.
03:06<Eddi|zuHause>*headbang*
03:06<Supercheese>sigh, not point to point lines
03:07<Supercheese>I'd give you a savegame, but it's a ChillPP savegame
03:07<Supercheese>and has multiple custom grfs I can't distribute T_T
03:07<Eddi|zuHause>there is really no fundamental difference between "use no signals" and "use no switches"
03:08<Supercheese>I think there's a miscommunication somewhere
03:09<Supercheese>not sure where, though
03:09<Supercheese>Probably on my end, I am rather sleepy
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04:01<Wolf01>hello
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04:12<@Alberth>moin all
04:15<Wolf01>hello Alberth, god ludde too
04:17<@Alberth>:)
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05:06<TheDude>hello
05:06<TheDude>what is wrong with bananas server? Unhandled Exception
05:06<TheDude>An unhandled exception was thrown by the application.
05:06<TheDude>what could cause such exception?
05:10<Ammler>are you able to reproduce it?
05:11<TheDude>yes, every time I try to upload my update
05:14<frosch123>open a fs task (project website,category bananas), attach the file you are trying to upload, and assign it to TrueBrain :)
05:15<frosch123>sorry TrueBrain :p
05:19<TheDude>can you tell me link for project website? anyway, how will this contribute to solution?
05:20<frosch123>http://bugs.openttd.org/index.php?project=4&do=index&switch=1
05:20<frosch123>well, since bananas worked fine thursday, i assume there is some problem in the way it handles your file
05:22<TheDude>that is likely
05:23<telanus>helllo
05:24<TheDude>something happened, This GRF is blacklisted :D
05:25<frosch123>you are not allowed to upload grfs which are not yours
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05:28<TheDude>what, I am the author of it!
05:28<TheDude>and I am not uploading it, but updating
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05:31<LordAro>morning
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05:38<@Alberth>mornink
05:39<@Alberth>that would be a new version, to preserve the previous version, so people can play old save games
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05:45<@Terkhen>good morning
05:55-!-drac_boy [~drac_boy@modemcable133.8-80-70.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #openttd
05:55<drac_boy>hi
05:57<TheDude>can you please tell me, who is in charge of banana server?
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05:59<frosch123>darn... why is the micropolis minimap totally broken for me
05:59<frosch123>maybe i should get some nightly snapshot and compile myself
06:03<drac_boy>any of you think its possible to like have one standard gauge, one narrow gauge, and a dual gauge tracktypes? or is there not much in the way of grf coding to make locomotives work on this sort of thing yet?
06:03<frosch123>isn't there already such grf?
06:04<Eddi|zuHause>there's a french narrow gauge set, but i don't know if it contains dual gauge
06:04<Eddi|zuHause>and Oberhümer wanted to make a narrow gauge set at some point
06:05<Eddi|zuHause>and yes, it's definitely possible
06:05<drac_boy>thanks Eddi|zuHause
06:06<drac_boy>would be interesting to have a mixed-gauge junction station where two platforms can serve the narrow gauge from west while the rest of station only has standard gauge for west+east
06:07<drac_boy>of course that'll require some programmed signals (or pbs if it doesn't fail) to sort out the platform useages
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06:08<mohwaqas12>Hey guys, how to comile debug version of openttd
06:09<Ammler>disable-strip
06:09<@Alberth>make
06:10<mohwaqas12>i copiled using make , but when i run gdb ./openttd it says no debugging info found
06:10<TrueBrain>frosch123: tasks made under Project Website are automatically assigned to me ;)
06:11<@Alberth>mohwaqas12: did you run ./configure -enable-debug=3 before 'make' ?
06:11<TrueBrain>or just use 'make run-gdb' ;)
06:12<TrueBrain>well, that doesn't enable debugging .. dammit :P
06:12<mohwaqas12>no i did not , let me check it
06:12<@Alberth>mohwaqas12: ./configure lets you set build options, and generate a Makefile. 'make' performs the build
06:13<@Alberth>'make run' builds, and starts the resulting program, and 'make run-gdb' apparently builds and runs the debugger :)
06:13<mohwaqas12>so what debug level should i keep?
06:14<frosch123>why is the micropolis makefile in lower case?
06:14<frosch123>is it not supposed to be run?
06:15<@Alberth>--enable-debug enables debugging symbols, level 3 apparently suppresses optimization, so your debugger sees the same code as you see in the editor
06:15<@Alberth>frosch123: hmm, that's a long time ago :)
06:16<@Alberth>my guess is it was created at a computer with a case-insensitive file system :p
06:16<mohwaqas12>thanks Alberth , last day i was checking ./configure --help for debugging. i wonder how i missed this debug argument
06:17<@Alberth>mohwaqas12: humans are sloppy when reading, we mostly just scan word patterns. :)
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06:19<mohwaqas12>yes rite :)
06:19<@Alberth>rite?
06:19<drac_boy>btw just a little real train related question, what was the purpose of 3-axle coaches? they seem to have the same chassis length of a 2-axle one sometimes
06:20<LordAro>TheDude: anything web-related is generally managed by TrueBrain although i think all developers have some control over it
06:21<TrueBrain>LordAro: he was already told waht he should do ... I mean .. spoon-feeding is nextdoor ;)
06:22<LordAro>was he? i'm reading through the logs and i can't see anything :L
06:22<TrueBrain>frosch123 told him in detail, even with a link, what he should do .. what more can I say?
06:23<LordAro>in this channel? i didn't get it...
06:23<TrueBrain>then I am afraid you fail to read :D
06:23<TrueBrain>as it is right after he asked
06:23<TrueBrain>like 3 minutes later :P
06:24<TrueBrain>he even replied to it in ack of what was said, so for sure he read it ;)
06:25<LordAro>@logs
06:25<@DorpsGek>LordAro: http://irclogs.qmsk.net/channels/openttd
06:25<LordAro>"[10:57:01] <TheDude> can you please tell me, who is in charge of banana server?" <-- i see no reply to that...
06:25*frosch123 thinks the micropolis *nix port is not actively maintained
06:25<TrueBrain>that is because a reply to that is irrelevant LordAro
06:26<TrueBrain>he got the information what he should do with his problem
06:26<LordAro>whatever, i only joined after the 'main' conversation :P
06:26<@Alberth>frosch123: that would be quite possible, simhacker is only doing the web-frontend afaik
06:27<LordAro>and it seemed to me that no one replied to him...
06:27<TrueBrain>LordAro: hehe :)
06:27*LordAro is spamming this link everywhere today: http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl/participate/
06:28<TrueBrain>ugh :P SPAMMER! ;)
06:28<TrueBrain>(j/k ofc)
06:29<LordAro>(the ";)" was a give away ;) )
06:29<LordAro>also the all caps :P
06:30<TrueBrain>I should kick myself for that :D
06:31<LordAro>you should indeed :P
06:35<TheDude>yes, but after some more tries to update newgrf it told me it is blacklisted, what does it exactly mean?
06:35<TheDude>hi Truebrain, you can give me some advise or info about banana updating?
06:36<TrueBrain>[11:14] <frosch123> open a fs task (project website,category bananas), attach the file you are trying to upload, and assign it to TrueBrain :)
06:36<TrueBrain>[11:15] <frosch123> sorry TrueBrain :p
06:36<TrueBrain>[11:19] <TheDude> can you tell me link for project website? anyway, how will this contribute to solution?
06:36<TrueBrain>[11:20] <frosch123> http://bugs.openttd.org/index.php?project=4&do=index&switch=1
06:37<TheDude>so the message that newgrf is blacklisted is some sort of bug?
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06:38<frosch123>bah... micropolis trunk is for touchscreens
06:39<frosch123>any i have no idea what the pacmans on the map mean
06:39<@Alberth>it's still in?
06:39<@Alberth>:D
06:39<frosch123>what? the pacmans?
06:39<@Alberth>it was little proof of concept for 'helpers' iirc
06:40<@Alberth>the pac man is 'eating traffic'
06:40<frosch123>:p
06:40<frosch123>damn, should i try to update to an older version which is not meant for touchscreens
06:40<frosch123>or should i start up dosbox and use the original?
06:41<frosch123>the usability if almost near zero
06:41<@Alberth>simhacker is pushing towards web-enabled, community-based
06:41<@Alberth>so touch screen makes sense in that context
06:42<@Alberth>let me have a look what revision I have here
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06:43<frosch123>well, let's try to get used to the touchscreen stuff
06:44<drac_boy>frosch123 as long as it still works with a normal mouse cursor too
06:44<drac_boy>:)
06:46<@Alberth>I have revision 389 here, of around april 2009, when some other project wanted to make me dev :p
06:47<@Alberth>after that I think the C/C++ backend + the gtk port stopped being developed
06:47<frosch123>one of the pacmans causes a lot of crime
06:47<frosch123>i am using gtk
06:48<@Alberth>at least I looked a year or so back, and it did not seem to have moved much
06:48<@Alberth>oh, perhaps gtk itself has switched to touch screens?
06:51<frosch123>well, maybe i was wrong with touchscreens
06:51<frosch123>as i have to use the rmb
06:52<@Alberth>enable 'left-handed' so the buttons get swapped :)
06:54<frosch123>somehow i have the impression, police stations have no effect at all compared to original simcity
06:55<frosch123>also, how do i open a gas mask concession?
06:58<Eddi|zuHause>in sim city, these things were done from the budget menu
07:01<frosch123>hmm, i cannot build a stadium...
07:01<Eddi|zuHause>is that game worth a try or should i leave my hands off it?
07:02<frosch123>it's the same as original simcity; except it is not restricted to the dos screen resolution
07:02<frosch123>but it seems to add various bugs
07:05<frosch123>i have not yet decided whether they make it unplayable
07:06<drac_boy>perhaps find where the original open-sourced source was and see?
07:06<drac_boy>dunno tbh :)
07:07<frosch123>i have a svn checkout
07:07<frosch123>first i used the debian package, but the minimap was broken
07:07<frosch123>now i am using svn head with changes to make it compile, but it has other bugs :p
07:08<drac_boy>:p
07:08<frosch123>ah, now i was able to construct a stadium
07:09<frosch123>maybe it thought i did not have enough money
07:09<@Alberth>drac_boy: that's tcl/tk and C, and runs at a unix system only. It's also a bigger mess to get it running
07:09<frosch123>in original simcity it cost 3000
07:09<frosch123>i should have enough money, but i acutally cannot check, as the money display is broken :p
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07:09*Alberth finds it frightening that people know such numbers :p
07:10<frosch123>:p
07:10<frosch123>children have good memory
07:10<frosch123>ofc i know the price of all stuff in the games i played at age of 8 or 10
07:10<@Alberth>:)
07:11<@Alberth>It's no different than knowing that 0x60 was RTS in 6502 machine language, I guess :D
07:11<frosch123>yup :)
07:11<frosch123>stupid pacmans
07:12<frosch123>now i even get newspapers that the polution i very high there
07:12<drac_boy>heh heh
07:12<frosch123>they produce both crime and polution
07:12<frosch123>maybe i can bulldoze them
07:12*drac_boy really has only played with simcity 2000 collection :-s
07:12<@Alberth>plant trees
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07:15<Eddi|zuHause>i vaguely remember about original SimCity that nuclear meltdowns were way too common, and then you could basically throw away the game
07:16<Eddi|zuHause>and people never built anywhere except near forest
07:16<Eddi|zuHause>and then we found the money cheat, which you could do like 5 times and then it caused an earthquake
07:17<Eddi|zuHause>the "solution" to that was to use it before you started the city :)
07:19<Eddi|zuHause>and if you built a police/fire station every time they asked for one, you were guaranteed to never get positive budget
07:19<@Alberth>I found nuclear meltdown lots of fun, time for major damage control and rebuilding
07:23<frosch123>Eddi|zuHause: yup, same about funds for me
07:23<frosch123>but the money issue i only had with sc2000
07:23<frosch123>i was never able to fujnd a new power plant after 30 years
07:23<Eddi|zuHause>i never had money issues in sc2000
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07:23*drac_boy never ever used powerplants at all tbh
07:24<frosch123>so i always played on custom maps with lot of places for water plants
07:24<frosch123>as they had no lifetime
07:24<Eddi|zuHause>jup :)
07:24<drac_boy>yeah it was pretty much always a hydro there and there .. sometimes bunched sometimes not depending on terrain
07:24<drac_boy>sometimes there'll be a few hydro right in middle of downtown but eh
07:24*FLHerne used to build large blocks of oil plants :P
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07:25<drac_boy>never had lot of energy but at same time the energy graph line never went below 10 on the other hand
07:26<Chris_Booth>hi
07:26<drac_boy>I usually put light industry somewhere a bit far away tho... never ever dense zoned either
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07:29<Eddi|zuHause>what was the point of "light" anything? except near airport, i always used dense
07:30<Eddi|zuHause>in sc4, light industry meant agriculture. and most buildings are medium
07:30<drac_boy>much less pollution
07:31<drac_boy>but still just as much jobs apparently
07:31<Eddi|zuHause>i never cared for pollution, really
07:31<drac_boy>well I don't like having a thick fog over the residental areas
07:31<drac_boy>reminds me too much of the london smog problem after all :P
07:31<TrueBrain>TheDude: you got a reply on your FS, and on your thread. Hope you can figure it out :)
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07:33<TheDude>thank you
07:35<TheDude>ok, if I got it right, if I change licence to GPL v2nd include source, all be happy?
07:47<TrueBrain>I _think_ so, but I haven't really looked into it tbh :)
07:51<TheDude>ok, I will just change it, it should make things clear, thanks for help
08:10<frosch123>haha, the save buttons are broken :p
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08:31<andythenorth>bonjour
08:39<andythenorth>my toddler wants diagonal tunnels
08:39<andythenorth>he has gone to lie down in a corner and is being silent and sad because I can't make one
08:40<Eddi|zuHause>i should have done that years ago...
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08:42<frosch123>turn the screen
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08:44<@Alberth>a tunnel from bottom-left to top-right of the screen is pretty much diagonal :p
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09:05<frosch123>hmm, my town collapsed :s
09:05<frosch123>from 100000 to 30000 in two years
09:05<frosch123>i doubt i can recover from this
09:08<telanus>nuke the place and start ove?
09:08<telanus>over?*
09:10<frosch123>hmm, maybe i overrated roads
09:10<frosch123>got back from 5000 to 43000
09:10<frosch123>though almost all roads and rails are gone
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09:16<andythenorth>frosch123: what caused it? :)
09:16<frosch123>i had trouble with cash flow
09:16<frosch123>and change police funding and taxes a bit
09:16<frosch123>taxed from 7 to 8
09:16<frosch123>police from 100 to 80 or so
09:17<andythenorth>oh you're playing Sim City
09:17<Chris_Booth>lol
09:17<Chris_Booth>SC4 I gurss
09:17<Chris_Booth>guess
09:17<frosch123>sc1
09:17<Chris_Booth>since it was impossible to go bankrupt in any SC before SC4
09:17<Chris_Booth>frosch123: you must suck at SC1 then
09:18<frosch123>yup
09:18<Chris_Booth>you played SC2 MP?
09:18<Chris_Booth>that is a right laugh
09:18<frosch123>no
09:18<Chris_Booth>go buy it and play it with a friend
09:18<frosch123>Chris_Booth: i reached 100k pop and everything was running fine
09:19<frosch123>then it collapsed within 2 minutes
09:19<Eddi|zuHause>frosch123: road funding was always weird...
09:19<Eddi|zuHause>frosch123: any value below 100% almost immediately makes your network disappear
09:20<Eddi|zuHause>although SC1 had a "bug" where roads never disappear if they have electric lines above
09:20<frosch123>now people are moving out again
09:20<frosch123>i guess they noticed that there are no roads anymore :p
09:24<Eddi|zuHause>i think at one point we always set traffic funding to 0, built no roads and only rails, with all tiles electric wires above, even crossings
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09:27<frosch123>oh, now you mention it... indeed tiles with wires are not cleared
09:27<frosch123>so, is sc1 only playable with chears? :p
09:29<andythenorth>frosch123: just drop tax before election time
09:29<andythenorth>then max it out straight afterwards
09:29<andythenorth>I always lost to traffic and pollution though :P
09:34<frosch123>well, i just assumed if they complain about taxes the most, then they have nothing to really complain
10:25<TrueBrain>General Notice: while I update all VPSes of OpenTTD, you can expect some slight hickups in regards of kernel updates etc
10:31<LordAro>yay! an active sys-admin!
10:31<TrueBrain>where?
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10:36<drac_boy>hi
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11:00<TrueBrain>3 done, 6 to go .. first some food :)
11:01<drac_boy>heh heh
11:01*drac_boy is more like 0 ordered, 10+ to order :-s
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11:04*drac_boy throws more non-bugs bugs at andythenorth
11:04<drac_boy>heh :P
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12:23<frosch123>Eddi|zuHause: rail only does not exactly seem to work :p
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12:28<TrueBrain>right, back to updating ... let's see ... ah, yes, masterserver
12:34<TrueBrain>lolz, every machine Igive a kernel upgrade: /dev/xvda1 has gone 332 days without being checked, check forced.
12:34<TrueBrain>TAKES FOREVER :'(
12:35<frosch123>you might not want to run multiple checkruns on the same disk in parallel
12:35<Eddi|zuHause>i don't suppose there is a way to autocheck files like at 5AM every 1st of the month?
12:35<Eddi|zuHause>*filesystems
12:35<TrueBrain>frosch123: it doesn't happen on the same disk ;)
12:36<TrueBrain>they are virtual disks, just being named identical; that is all :)
12:36<frosch123>Eddi|zuHause: i think you cannot check them while mounted
12:36<frosch123>TrueBrain: but there is only one hardware behind it
12:36<TrueBrain>there is, yes
12:36<TrueBrain>btw, I am not updating all VMs at the same time, that would be stupid
12:37<TrueBrain>my complaint is merely the fact the downtime is more than 5 seconds :P
12:38<TrueBrain>okay, all frontend machines are updated ... now the hard part ... the backends ...
12:42<Eddi|zuHause>TrueBrain: well, you can just disable the autocheck...
12:44<TrueBrain>Eddi|zuHause: by the time I see it, it is too late :P
12:45<TrueBrain>I don't really mind the check btw, it just takes for ever (at least, it feels that way :P)
12:45<Eddi|zuHause>yes, i know that feeling :)
12:47<TrueBrain>okay ... here goes ldap ....
12:47*TrueBrain crosses fingers
12:49*TrueBrain dances
12:50<TrueBrain>hmm, debian updates overwrite motd
12:50<TrueBrain>annoying :P
12:51<TrueBrain>even more as it trashes the old content
12:51<TrueBrain>bah ... I wrote such good stories there!
12:51<TrueBrain>owh, booting your system does
12:51<TrueBrain>haha
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13:09<TrueBrain>and there goes our MySQL ... that will hurt :P
13:13<TrueBrain>and now finally ... our gateway
13:19<TrueBrain>and poef, then all of OpenTTD services went awol :P
13:19<TrueBrain>lets see if it can reboot before things detect their cannot reach the internet :P
13:19<TrueBrain>s/their/they/
13:21<TrueBrain>@whoami
13:21<@DorpsGek>TrueBrain: TrueBrain
13:21<TrueBrain>ha, lolz :D
13:27<TrueBrain>we use 0.5 TiB per month on our main server atm :P
13:28<TrueBrain>k, all updating done and set; lemme know if there are any issues / problems /etc
13:30<__ln__>@whereami
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13:35<Eddi|zuHause>@whatknowi
13:36<@Alberth><nothing> apparently :D
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13:37<frosch123>ah, figured out the trick in micropolis
13:38<frosch123>make a small citiy which makes some profit
13:38<frosch123>set speed to astonomically fast
13:38<frosch123>wait for some 100k
13:38<frosch123>do whatever you want
13:39<Eddi|zuHause>what's the SimCity creator's obsession with Llamas anyway?
13:40<Eddi|zuHause>now i remember why i quit playing SC4... it crashes at random times
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14:36<__ln__>http://vaunut.org/kuva/76490
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15:09<andythenorth>so everyone is on vacation or what?
15:09<__ln__>not yet
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15:15<drac_boy>hi
15:17<Rubidium>andythenorth: lies... some are just working hard on important not yet visible stuff
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15:44<andythenorth>meh
15:44<andythenorth>coding without an irc monologue on what's being done? :P
15:44<andythenorth>how quaint
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15:47<drac_boy>andythenorth well I don't bother anyway? :) heh heh
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15:59<drac_boy>btw does anyone here recall the name of that particular station on metre gauge in swizterland? it was like a U shape with station on one leg of it ... unusual for real rails
16:00-!-Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has joined #openttd
16:03<Supercheese>So, I went and made an Electricity/Powerlines GRF. The power plants produce electricity, which is carried on power lines and delivered to substations, the "vehicles" are lightning-fast "sparks". Honestly, the gameplay is... really dull :(
16:04<Supercheese>Create "single-track" point-to-point line, stick a vehicle on it, collect money, zzzzz
16:04<andythenorth>for why dull?
16:04<Supercheese>Upgrade to higher voltages as the years go by
16:04<Supercheese>It needs some spice, maybe like Engineering/Farm supply mechanics in FIRS
16:05<andythenorth>you should make the vehicles individual electrons :P
16:05<Supercheese>deliver electricity to other industries to increase production
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16:05<andythenorth>or units of potential or such
16:05<Supercheese>but that would make the code zillions of times more complex
16:05*andythenorth can't remember electrical physics :P
16:05<Supercheese>The current units of "electricity" are kW*h
16:05<Supercheese>it's what my meter outside reads :P
16:06<Supercheese>also, I have no good sprites for the vehicle purchase menu
16:06<Supercheese>Just keep the sparks? Or stick a little generator-looking unit in the purchase menu?
16:07<andythenorth>hmm
16:07<Supercheese>Bigger sparks for higher voltages? :P
16:07<andythenorth>force the power station to produce at 22Kv or whatever
16:07<Supercheese>Currently I've only reused base set sprites
16:07<andythenorth>but make the destination only accept at 1500v or so
16:07<Supercheese>Hey, waypoint transformers
16:07<andythenorth>then have substations that adjust voltage :P
16:08<Supercheese>Well, currently you just dump everything into blackhole substations
16:08<Supercheese>as I said, booooring gameplay
16:09<Supercheese>Figure I'll just disable signal sprites entirely
16:09<Supercheese>The sparks take maybe 1 tick to reach their destination, so they're really not needed
16:10<Supercheese>Problem is, FIRS has no power plants, and also has maxed cargo slots too IIRC
16:10<Supercheese>NARS just needs to get rid of it's silly regearing cargo
16:10<Supercheese>free up an extra slot for everyone
16:14<Supercheese>Also a major problem is NML does not support stations
16:14<Supercheese>and I do not want to mess with NFO
16:15<drac_boy>just do the station in nfo and the rest of grf in nml? dunno what to tell you tbh :)
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16:17<Supercheese>Hah, just found another problem, the level crossing bells ding for "crossings"
16:17<Supercheese>Ding ding, there are overhead power lines... :P
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16:18<Supercheese>Well I'll be danged, there was a Station coding tutorial just posted
16:18<Supercheese>less than an hour ago, it seems
16:19*Supercheese investigates
16:19*drac_boy never ever had any of the game sounds on anyway
16:19<drac_boy>it'll be drowned out by the media player in background anyhow :)
16:20<Supercheese>yeah, I had to turn off my music to hear it too
16:20<Super_Random|2>some people are mean
16:20<Super_Random|2>2?
16:20<Super_Random|2>what?
16:20-!-Super_Random|2 is now known as Super_Random
16:21<Super_Random>some people were ddos-ing a charity stream
16:24<Supercheese>So hmm, code the stations in NFO, export the NML to NFO, combine and NFORenum the lot?
16:26<Eddi|zuHause>or finally implement station support in nml?
16:26<Supercheese>Well, that would be optimal obviously ;)
16:26<Eddi|zuHause>go ahead then :p
16:26<Supercheese>I'm not going to try and develop that myself, ofc
16:29*drac_boy doesn't have much comment on nml for obvious reason yet anyhow
16:29<drac_boy>kinda a bit surprised now that stations aren't in there tho?! :-s
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16:32<Eddi|zuHause>i'm not sure why stations are not implemented. maybe it lacks inspiration how to sensibly specify tile layouts
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16:40<frosch123>it lacks the right idea how to abstract all that station nonsense of tilelayout and spritelayouts into a nml spec
16:40<Eddi|zuHause>deprecate the station spec and make a new one based on industry/object stuff?
16:41<frosch123>who knows :)
16:43<drac_boy>eddi thats assuming ottd would know how to read both formats for sake of grfs that wouldn't be updated for quite some time?
16:43<Eddi|zuHause>drac_boy: yes.
16:45<drac_boy>fair enough, don't have any complains or comments then :)
16:46<Eddi|zuHause>z
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16:46<Eddi|zuHause>the point would be that the old code would be pushed into a somewhat unmaintained state, while the new code would be shared between stations/industries/objects/airports etc.
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16:47<Eddi|zuHause>and the only thing in nml that needs to be changed is the feature number
16:47<frosch123>except that industries and airports are similiar
16:47<frosch123>while objects are different
16:47<frosch123>stations would likely easier fit into the object style
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16:48<Eddi|zuHause>frosch123: what about road/tram stations then?
16:49<Eddi|zuHause>frosch123: they would be closer to airports (with state machine etc.) than rail stations?
16:49<Eddi|zuHause>but then you still need additional magic to construct "platforms" out of multiple adjacent stations
16:50<@Terkhen>good night
16:59<frosch123>Eddi|zuHause: how about ripping out the state machine of airports instead :p
---Logclosed Sun Aug 05 17:08:12 2012
---Logopened Sun Aug 05 17:13:49 2012
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---Logclosed Sun Aug 05 17:20:07 2012
---Logopened Sun Aug 05 17:37:24 2012
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---Logclosed Sun Aug 05 17:42:44 2012
---Logopened Sun Aug 05 17:47:31 2012
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17:47<drac_boy>hm that reminds me I should check about any updates to the grf just to be sure my tracking table is still current
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18:07<Wolf01>'night
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21:02<drac_boy>hi
21:03<Supercheese>Salutations
21:04<drac_boy>how're you cheesy? heh
21:05<Supercheese>Scandalously cheesy
21:05<drac_boy>heh heh
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---Logclosed Mon Aug 06 00:00:57 2012