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#openttd IRC Logs for 2012-11-26

---Logopened Mon Nov 26 00:00:42 2012
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00:51<trikol>Hi, got a little problem with a train station, what would be the correct layout of signals on this station?
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05:17*NGC3982 would use EPS all the way.
05:23<NGC3982>The electric path signal (and mostly one-way).
05:24<NGC3982>I'm not the right person to teach about PBS, but it mostly suits me.
05:25<Arafangion>Ah, that.
05:26<NGC3982>I haven't (oddly enough since ive been playing OpenTTD for quite som time now) botherd to learn using PBS correctly, though.
05:26<NGC3982>Maybe, it's time.
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05:30<@peter1138>I would've replied had they not left...
05:30<@peter1138>I don't think I've ever seen path signals referred to as "EPS" before, though.
05:32<NGC3982>I was trying to refer to the design more than the function.
05:32<NGC3982>But yes, could have used something more correct.
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05:58<@peter1138>Hello dihedral.
05:58<dihedral>helli sir :-)
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06:59<Flygon>I can't be stuffed using entry/exit signals, if that's what you mean :P
07:02<@peter1138>They're a bit oldschool
07:05<Flygon>They are?
07:06<Flygon>I always got by perfectly with ordinary one-way and those signals that have a signal on one end but can be passed from behind
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07:13<V453000>not to mention that the possibilities using pre-signals are just ridiculously various :p
07:14<NGC3982>What Flygon said.
07:14<NGC3982>I don't think i have ever used entry/exit for something useful
07:15<V453000>that is rather sad
07:16<Flygon>I don't really think of any particulary uses for it at this moment
07:16<Flygon>None that're entirely practical, anyway
07:17<V453000>telling trains why to go where, under what conditions to go or not, chaining the conditions, making the conditions consist of almost absolutely anything, ...
07:18<V453000>like, let train A go towards the station if there is a) at least an empty platform, b) no other train coming to the station, c) no other train going towards that platform
07:18<V453000>and anything else you could think of
07:22<NGC3982>Well, i guess that is true, and i guess it's sad that i don't use it.
07:22<Flygon>I'm pretty sure you can do that with just one-way and pass-behind signals
07:22<NGC3982>But it works.
07:22<NGC3982>And i have never got around to learn about it.
07:22<Flygon>Barring b... if it's a two-way station
07:23<Flygon>But honestly
07:23<Flygon>I'd rather have multiple trains going in at once, rather than just one at once, for the sake of time
07:23<Flygon>I see no reason not to shove in-shove out as fast as possible
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07:24<Flygon>DDR clearly hasn't seen me on other networks
07:24<V453000>that has nothing to do with throughput, those trains could be like a backup coming from elsewhere
07:24<Flygon>What do you mean?
07:24<Flygon>A train going via?
07:25<V453000>no like a train stored in a depot because it couldnt load previously
07:27<Flygon>Oh, you mean a train going into the depot instead of the station
07:27<Flygon>Then going into the station when there's room?
07:28<Flygon> What I end up using
07:29<NGC3982>Almost the same as me
07:29<Flygon>Why're we arguing then? :D
07:29<Flygon> It clearly works :D
07:31<NGC3982>I guess one could up the anti a bit
07:31<NGC3982>For instance, using entry exit to send trains to a nearby depot when a station is full
07:31<SpComb>hmm... interesting how minecraft compares to openttd in terms of community servers and customizations
07:31<Flygon> Also, why OTTD needs platform selecting :p
07:32<Flygon>I ended up having to turn it into a terminus D:
07:32<SpComb>minecraft has mods/texture packs where openttd has patches/newgrfs, etc
07:32<Flygon>NGC: Your stations are much cleaner than mine
07:32<Flygon>Ragnarok Online just gets plain GRF's :B
07:33<NGC3982>I do not think i use as much traffic.
07:33<Flygon>Pain in the arse to mod, though
07:33<V453000>no, the trains go to depot because station is full, diverted by 2way block signals
07:33<Flygon>Ah, true
07:33<Flygon>You seem focused on cargo, not insane amonts of passenger
07:33<NGC3982>On this map, yes.
07:33<NGC3982>It's on
07:33<NGC3982>If you want to take a looker
07:33<NGC3982>V453000: I see.
07:35<@peter1138>So many signals in Berlin?
07:35<Flygon>peter1138: Me being lazy with signal spacing, if you're referring to the 1-ways
07:36<NGC3982>When taking the theoretical spacing between tiles in consideration, that's not that many? ;)
07:37<Flygon>I'm confused now
07:37<Flygon>...oh wow
07:38<Flygon>Why do I have a 6 track segment on this map @_@"
07:38<Flygon> Here, go laugh at my insanely lazy rail network design :p
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10:47<@planetmaker>SpComb, so... doesn't any game which allows to load add-ons / modpacks and which is opensource have these two kind of game modifications?
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10:55<SpComb>planetmaker: sure, but there are still differences
10:57<andythenorth>I doubt it
10:57<andythenorth>whatever it is :)
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10:58<andythenorth>o sorry, /me is trolling :P
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11:10<sponge>Is there a way to prevent a train from starting moving towards a green exit signal only to have it turn red at the last millisecond by a train using the connection track?
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11:11<sponge>I keep using pbs because it sometimes blocks two tracks while this is happening.
11:12<Pinkbeast>The train is no worse off for doing so, surely
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11:20<@planetmaker>sponge, not sure what setup you refer to... signals work exactly by their defined logic. Exit signals, mind, don't make sense, if not preceeded by an entry signal
11:20<@planetmaker>(or by a combination of combo and entry signals)
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11:22<V453000>pm that happens when 2 comboes lead to 1 signal block
11:22<V453000>both trains at both entry signals leading to the comboes wait at the same time, both start at the same time, but only one can go through ofc
11:23<@planetmaker>of course
11:23<@planetmaker>I mean... *you* know how they work ;-)
11:23<@planetmaker>all I wanted to say is: they work as specified. If you make a bad design... your problem :-)
11:24<@planetmaker>their purpose is to show red, if the block behind them is occupied
11:24<@planetmaker>and there are ways to construct your signal block so that only one train will enter the whole cascade
11:24<@planetmaker>albeit a bit more complex possibly
11:25<@planetmaker>which then, of course, could simply also be broken down to only using one signal block, if you don't want a train to stop an intermediate signal at all
11:25<@planetmaker></monologue> :-P
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12:47-!-mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ
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13:21-!-mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ
13:22<@Alberth>hi hi
13:24-!-mode/#openttd [+v Alberth] by ChanServ
13:24-!-mode/#openttd [+v Belugas] by ChanServ
13:24-!-mode/#openttd [+v planetmaker] by ChanServ
13:24-!-mode/#openttd [+v Terkhen] by ChanServ
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13:36<frosch123>hola terkhen :)
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13:41<andythenorth>quak quak quak
13:41<frosch123>moin :p
13:41<andythenorth>still sounds like a duck to me :P
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14:17<andythenorth>compile on first attempt was too much to hope for :P
14:21<@Alberth>a good target to aim for :p
14:21<andythenorth>I've failed 7 so far :P
14:22<andythenorth>compile takes so long I start reading news or whatever on the web
14:22<andythenorth>then I forget my place :p
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14:55<Wolf01>hello o/
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15:45*andythenorth pub
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17:36<NGC3982>Is there any way to build raw material industries in-game?
17:36<NGC3982>For FIRS, for instance?
17:36<supermop>yes, if the advanced settings are set to allow it
17:37<NGC3982>Oh, i see.
17:37<NGC3982>Snap, i missed that.
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17:40<NGC3982>supermop: Where do i find this setting?
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17:40<NGC3982>I thought that originally was a NewGRF parameter.
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17:44<supermop>in the advanced settings menu i think under the economy tree
17:44<supermop>set to either 'prospecting' or 'as other industries'
17:45<NGC3982>supermop: Thank you, so much. :-)
17:45<supermop>no problem
17:45<supermop>primary industries generally tend to be much more expensive though
17:48<NGC3982>Yes, i noticed.
17:48<NGC3982>When i get to the "end" of a map (2050-ish with no new trains), it feels like a good feature to start building new industries.
17:49<NGC3982>Since with FIRS, good usage always results in a grandé surplus of farm- and engineering supplies.
17:49<supermop>which i guess makes sense gameplay wise, but i find it odd that planting a field of pine trees cost 1-2 orders of magnitude more than building a steel mill
18:04<NGC3982>Can someone remind me to send this to Andy when he returns (sober).
18:15<Eddi|zuHause>looks interesting :)
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18:17<NGC3982>The thing is, the artifacts only appear on that tile type
18:17<NGC3982>As far as i have tried.
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21:46<ccfreak2k>Sober? Well, I could try.
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---Logclosed Tue Nov 27 00:00:28 2012