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#openttd IRC Logs for 2013-01-21

---Logopened Mon Jan 21 00:00:11 2013
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02:36<@peter1138>moin
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02:45<andythenorth>hey look
02:45<andythenorth>v2.0 is 50% done
02:45*andythenorth just re-read the original post http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=47238
02:45<andythenorth>now just need to convert those newgrfs, the squirrel code etc to C++
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02:47<andythenorth>I do feel sorry for the chap who thinks he's being trolled
02:47<andythenorth>not nice for him
02:47<andythenorth>even if he's entirely wrong
02:47<andythenorth>and doesn't have a shift key
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03:18<@peter1138>Core0 Temp: +9.0°C
03:18<@peter1138>nice
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03:34<Supercheese>a steampunk mod needs to be made
03:35<Supercheese>airships, airships everywhere
03:35<__ln__>while you're at it, make the steam engines run with steam power.
03:36<FLHerne>av8 has two airships :P
03:36<FLHerne>*three, even
03:36*FLHerne forgot the modern one
03:37<FLHerne>*four
03:37<FLHerne>There were two modern ones, and I forgot both of them :-/
03:39<Supercheese>Well, the first first powered and steerable aircraft was a dirigible made in 1852
03:40<Supercheese>with a whopping 3 hp engine
03:40<Supercheese>6 mph wheee
03:40<FLHerne>A complete airship/blimp set would be quite awesome , true :-)
03:40<Supercheese>So if the headwind is more than 6 mph you go backwards :)
03:41<@planetmaker>moin
03:41<@planetmaker>oh, hi Supercheese, just for you, r24923+24924 ;-)
03:41<Supercheese>Yes, :D
03:41<Supercheese>muchas gracias
03:42<@planetmaker>did you also look at the screenshot I added to the issue before I actually looked at it?
03:43<@planetmaker>it tells two things: you want a slope check in your NewGRF. And what needed adding to the patch :-)
03:43<@peter1138>i think i alluded to it too
03:44<Supercheese>Yeah, I already added disable autoslope
03:45<Supercheese>didn't update grf on flyspray
03:46<@peter1138>right, should i replace my steamers with diesels or lectrics?
03:57<Supercheese>steam >> all else
04:00<@peter1138>i beg to differ
04:06<Supercheese>I'm not judging by efficiency, speed, power, or any of those silly things
04:06<Supercheese>steam locomotives are just more awesome™
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04:29<@peter1138>corr, 8 deg C
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04:30<Supercheese>I think your processor may have a cold, you should see a computer doctor :P
04:30<@peter1138>yeah
04:30<@peter1138>wonder what the air temp is
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04:33<Supercheese>Meanwhile in Russia: http://rt.com/news/winter-snow-russia-weather-275/
04:35<@peter1138>i remember car-high snow drifts in the early 80s
04:39<MNIM>Supercheese: I believe in Russia they call that "the streets are free of snow, good driving weather"
04:48<Supercheese>Well, good night
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05:18<Flygon>MNIM: In Australia, hoons call 47c weather "Good burnout weather"
05:18<Flygon>Then they fry their engines
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05:57<__ln__>http://wien.orf.at/news/stories/2567971/
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06:36<@peter1138>just looked outside and my eyes hurt :S
06:36<@peter1138>so bright...
06:39<@peter1138>bah
06:40<@peter1138>MC EMU from 191x is better than MC DMU from 1955 :S
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06:43<@peter1138>tube trains are too low capacity too :S
06:46<Flygon>Tube trains are built on the loading gauge of a toothpick
06:46<Flygon>For real capacity, you go Sydney Suburban
06:46<Flygon>Shame about the loading time
06:46<Flygon>Sooo
06:46<Flygon>Go for Melbourne Comengs
06:46<@peter1138>yeah but they're crammed full instead :p
06:47<Flygon>Melbourne Comengs aren't?
06:47<Flygon>http://images.theage.com.au/2008/09/24/216454/st_flindersstreet-420x0.jpg
06:49<Flygon>That's part of the reason DD trains failed in Victoria
06:50<Flygon>Only 2 doors per car practically exploded loading times
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07:14<__ln__>http://fpganes.blogspot.se/2013/01/luddes-fpga-nes.html
07:16<@peter1138>cool
07:17<Flygon>__ln__: I wish him luck
07:18<Flygon>Y'know what'd be genius though?
07:18<Flygon>Using an FPGA to replicate the Mega Drive for the 32x extension on the Mega Drive
07:21<Flygon>Oh, wait
07:21<Flygon>He actually did it
07:28<@peter1138>hmm, order lists
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07:35<@peter1138>anyone done hierarchical groups?
07:35<@peter1138>or thought it might be useful?
07:37<Pinkbeast>I'd settle for non-exclusive groups
07:38<@peter1138>that's harder than hierarchical
07:39<Pinkbeast>I don't know what the data structure is, alas.
07:40<@peter1138>non-exclusive means you need to store an entry for each item, which introduces a dynamically sized list
07:40<Pinkbeast>Linked lists are surely not beyond human ingenuity. :-/
07:40<@peter1138>heirarchical means there's still only one entry, and the group gets a single parent entry
07:41<@peter1138>Pinkbeast, sure it's possible, but arguably more work for less benefit
07:42<FLHerne>peter1138: I thought it might be useful
07:42<Pinkbeast>What I really want from groups is to say "Nominate one train in this group" (or RV etc, but it's more use for trains); "autoreplace/renew will make any other train in the group like this train". It is nontrivial because of the need to see if any of the existing components are useful, but...
07:42<@peter1138>would also be nice for group names to be unique per company per vehicle class, rather than just per company
07:43<Eddi|zuHause>peter1138: "non-exclusive groups" as in "filter results" may be useful
07:43<Eddi|zuHause>it's already done for stations
07:43<Eddi|zuHause>for certain values of "already done"
07:43<@peter1138>Eddi|zuHause, in the window which lists the groups?
07:44<Eddi|zuHause>no, but on each station you can get the filtered list of all vehicles using this station
07:44<Pinkbeast>Ah, but I can get the extra utility with hierarchies as well as non-exclusivity. Perhaps better with hierarchies.
07:44<Eddi|zuHause>peter1138: i think Alberth had some thoughts about groups
07:44<@peter1138>Eddi|zuHause, i don't know what you're asking for there
07:45<@peter1138>you get a list of vehicles using the station, then what?
07:45<Eddi|zuHause>peter1138: i'm not sure either
07:46<@peter1138>i also think a separate way of listing order lists would be cool
07:46<@peter1138>similar to how simutrans does lines
07:46<Pinkbeast>Giving order lists a life in and of themselves would be brilliant.
07:46<Eddi|zuHause>peter1138: have you checked out the recent Timetable Improvement Patch on the forum?
07:46<@peter1138>no
07:47<@peter1138>NIH! reinvent!
07:47<Eddi|zuHause>it attempts to do routes in a sane way
07:47<Eddi|zuHause>i haven't had time to test it, though
07:47<@peter1138>sounds like another thing that should be split up
08:05<Flygon>Incidentally, one thing always bugged me about autoreplacing trains
08:06<Flygon>The inability to replace a double-headed train with one single head
08:06<Flygon>I've had cases where an American 10 Wheeler evolves into a LOK2000 Double Head
08:08<@peter1138>come up with a way to tell the game to replace 2 heads with 1
08:08<Eddi|zuHause>there is a patch for that :p
08:08<@peter1138>haha
08:08<@peter1138>it was probably crap then
08:08<Eddi|zuHause>"template based train replacement" or so
08:09<@peter1138>it's all newgrf's fault
08:09<@peter1138>too many variables
08:09<@peter1138>could be handled by pinkbeast's earlier suggestion
08:10<Flygon>Eddi: I agree with that
08:10<Flygon>MOST USEFUL
08:10<@peter1138>no idea how to fit that into the gui though
08:10<@peter1138>but i suck at uis apparently
08:10-!-FLHerne_ [~quassel@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd
08:11<Flygon>Let's play textmode OpenTTD
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08:14<@peter1138>damn it, i replaced an aging unreliable ship
08:15<@peter1138>(manually replaced)
08:15<@peter1138>sent the old one to the depot and it autorenewed :S
08:16<Flygon>Y'know what'd be cool?
08:17<Flygon>Me thinking before talking
08:22<Pinkbeast>peter: I'd do it by having a way to nominate the master train in the group UI.
08:22<@peter1138>:-)
08:22<Pinkbeast>All other autoreplace commands would then only affect the master train.
08:22<Pinkbeast>[ I say train but clearly this should work for anything, just less usefully ]
08:23<Pinkbeast>An obvious gotcha is that it has to check for autorefit orders and refit/not refit vehicles appropriately.
08:30<@peter1138>hmm
08:34<FLHerne_>peter1138: Diagonal bridges or tunnels would help the Trarningworth situation a bit :P
08:34<FLHerne_>Alternatively, crossing tunnels, with a sanity check...
08:39<Pinkbeast>peter: I would suggest; if a vehicle has no autorefit orders it refits to match the master. If it has an autorefit order which would be impossible to execute when vehicles changed, COMPLAIN. If neither is true, change to master, refitting in depot to match the previous consist as best as possible.
08:39<@peter1138>well i'm not coding it :p
08:48*Maedhros wonders what's happened to beningway transport's ship 5, on peter's server
08:48<Eddi|zuHause>"can't compare datetime.datetime to function" ... so would you PLEASE tell me WHERE that is done?!?
08:54<@peter1138>heh
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09:42<@Belugas>hello
09:44<@peter1138>Belugas
09:44<@peter1138>http://imgur.com/gallery/lo6xQ
09:46<@Belugas>sir peter1138 :)
09:47<@Belugas>lol
09:47<@Belugas>that's what I call a bump on the head ;)
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09:47<@Belugas>"porpoise" ???
09:48<@peter1138>i know right
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10:04<dots>trying to build(learn) fail safe shifters, but i can't find out what kind of signals to use
10:05<dots>anyone push me in the right direction?
10:06<Pinkbeast>Surely http://blog.openttdcoop.org/2010/01/13/fail-safe-joiners-priorities-and-the-cyclotron-example/ has screenies with the right signals?
10:09<dots>thanks, can't believe i didn't see that :)
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10:15<@peter1138>pfft, path signals all the way :p
10:17<NGC3982>http://blog.openttdcoop.org/files/pictures/fail_safe_joiners/quadruple_full_featured_cyclotron.png
10:17<NGC3982>Sweet jesus.
10:21<@peter1138>crazy
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10:43<V453000>not quite effective, either :)
10:44<Eddi|zuHause>so wth is this supposed to do?
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10:45<V453000>its "aim" is to keep trains joining at full speed -the cyclotron that is
10:45<V453000>which is pretty worthless, as it works on probability so trains do not really join too precisely
10:45<V453000>the fail-safe shifter is a bit better
10:45<NGC3982>I understand the fail-safe
10:46<V453000>but there is probability again - but in this case can "easily" be fixed
10:46<NGC3982>But i guess experimentation is never to be frowned upon.
10:46<NGC3982>:P
10:46<Eddi|zuHause>but what is the point of "joining in full speed" if you make a giant useless loop into the whole line?
10:46<V453000>that loop is aside Eddi, it is the loop where train is waiting for the time when it could join the main line
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10:47<V453000>http://blog.openttdcoop.org/2010/08/02/prozone-game-13-timed-aka-insane-sml/ this is probably the absolute maximum possible
10:47<V453000>200 000 goods per months from the refinery complex kind of confirms that :)
10:48<Eddi|zuHause>i know, the cyclotron is the small loop in the middle, which works on "if gap is not big enough, do another round"
10:48<V453000>but there is one thing to note
10:48<V453000>yeah exactly Eddi
10:48<Eddi|zuHause>the giant loop around it makes pretty much zero sense
10:48<NGC3982>It looks hilarious.
10:48<@peter1138>you know my thoughts on this stuff
10:49<Eddi|zuHause>they're probably along my thoughts on this stuff :p
10:49<V453000>point this, the shifting mainline is done for one thing - to make expanding extremely easy - you just clone another set of shifters and a line, done ... which is extremely boring and dumb
10:49<V453000>therefore we dont use this technique ever anymore, since that game I posted
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10:54<V453000>NGC3982: an overview page here http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/Shift_Mainlines
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10:57<@peter1138>fuuuuu
10:57<@peter1138>just burnt my mouth on hot cheese :S
11:08<@peter1138>when planting trees is there a max range?
11:08<@peter1138>for it to affect town rating
11:09<V453000>I think so
11:09<NGC3982><@peter1138> just burnt my mouth on hot cheese :S
11:09<NGC3982>Life sure is unfair.
11:10<@peter1138>bloody town hates me despite providing a service and planting trees :p
11:10<@peter1138>NGC3982, first-world-problems
11:10<V453000>that was for <@peter1138> you know my thoughts on this stuff :P
11:10<V453000>justice
11:10<@peter1138>:p
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11:15<andythenorth>http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=421972&nseq=0
11:15<andythenorth>^ neat
11:16<@peter1138>woo, HST
11:17<@peter1138>not much point mind you, i don't have any fast empty lines
11:17<Rubidium>peter1138: we got a fast empty line
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11:18<Rubidium>if the HST doesn't desintegrate upon hitting snow flakes, it'll be good enough ;)
11:20<@peter1138>wrong type of snow
11:23<andythenorth>peter1138: who is winningest?
11:23<@peter1138>green yellow teal blue
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11:27<andythenorth>my trains are old
11:27<andythenorth>and broken
11:27<@peter1138>yeah
11:28<@peter1138>FISH ships appear immune to reliability
11:28<@peter1138>(maybe normal ships are too)
11:28<@peter1138>last serviced 17 years ago, reliability 58%
11:29<@peter1138>ooh, better, reliability: 81%
11:29<@peter1138>last serviced 58 years ago
11:29<@peter1138>156 breakdowns in that time
11:29<V453000>they are awesome, face it
11:29<V453000>:))
11:30<@peter1138>fish dates are weird anyway
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11:42<Eddi|zuHause>is that like dog years?
11:56<Sacro>hrrrm, so sound works in single player
11:56<Sacro>this is strange
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12:58<@peter1138>ahh, weird al on the radio
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13:08<frosch123>my name is darth vader?
13:10<@peter1138>eat it
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13:23<@peter1138>hmm
13:23<@peter1138>any way to specify a default value for missing saveload variables?
13:24<Rubidium>"set" it in saveload
13:24<@peter1138>yup
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13:29<@Terkhen>hello
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13:30<Wolf01>oink
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13:46<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r24931 /trunk/src/lang (10 files) (2013-01-21 18:45:47 UTC)
13:46<@DorpsGek>-Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:46<@DorpsGek>croatian - 1 changes by VoyagerOne
13:46<@DorpsGek>danish - 7 changes by Elias
13:46<@DorpsGek>dutch - 1 changes by habell
13:46<@DorpsGek>finnish - 1 changes by jpx_
13:46<@DorpsGek>icelandic - 1 changes by Stimrol
13:46<@DorpsGek>italian - 1 changes by lorenzodv
13:46<@DorpsGek>korean - 61 changes by telk5093
13:46<@DorpsGek>brazilian_portuguese - 11 changes by Tucalipe
13:46<@DorpsGek>russian - 2 changes by Lone_Wolf
13:46<@DorpsGek>turkish - 18 changes by magnum06
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14:27<@Alberth>moin
14:31<Wolf01>hello Alberth
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14:47<Snail>meow
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14:57<FLHerne_>Typical, no andythenorth :-(
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15:32<@Alberth>you missed him by about 12 minutes :)
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15:38<andythenorth>FLHerne_: I rejoined
15:38<FLHerne_>andythenorth: Hi
15:39<FLHerne_>I left you a message ;-)
15:39<andythenorth>peter1138: is this game on fast forward somehow?
15:39<andythenorth>FLHerne_: where? :P
15:40<FLHerne_>Spaghetti Jct. :P
15:42<andythenorth>ah the tug bug
15:42<andythenorth>known issue ;)
15:42<andythenorth>thanks
15:44<FLHerne_>Ah, known already...I guess it is quite obvious :P
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16:34<frosch123>night
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16:52<andythenorth>planetmaker: for the 'build a big stable network' style of coop play - how does industry production increase fit?
16:53<andythenorth>'just add more trains'?
16:55<@planetmaker>yes. That's how it's handled
16:55<@planetmaker>but what is bad is erratic production changes, or very large ones. Especially decreases :-)
16:55<andythenorth>thinking of nicking Pikka's idea about eras for industry production
16:56<andythenorth>so increases come with technology changes
16:56<andythenorth>simply time based
16:56<andythenorth>with some randomness per industry instance
16:56<Supercheese>technology increase + supplies delivered?
16:56<andythenorth>supplies stays
16:56<Supercheese>or just the former?
16:56<Supercheese>k
16:57<andythenorth>supplies = boost
16:57<andythenorth>time-based = base production
16:57<Supercheese>roger
16:57<andythenorth>base production for ships / horses / steam engines needs to be quite low
16:57<andythenorth>then later it needs to be higher
16:57<andythenorth>p1kka has charts and crap about it
16:58<Supercheese>powerpoints? :P
16:59<Supercheese>it's not a believable presentation without crappy powerpoints!
17:00<andythenorth>also I might make supplies requirement less onerous
17:00<andythenorth>currently 30t / 120t
17:00<andythenorth>15t / 60t might be better
17:00<andythenorth>all the games I've played, not enough supplies
17:00-!-oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit []
17:00<Supercheese>Parameter!
17:01<andythenorth>might be valid in this case
17:01<Supercheese>Divide supply requirements by param
17:01<Supercheese>default 1
17:01<andythenorth>but it's yet another thing to forget to set in an MP game :P
17:01<andythenorth>all those people who recommend parameters...
17:01<andythenorth>...are people who have newgrf developer tools on :P
17:01*Supercheese likes parameters
17:01<andythenorth>most players don't get to test them much imo
17:01<andythenorth>we see the grf lists
17:01<andythenorth>they're big
17:02<Supercheese>yeah, I do agree the newgrf dev-folk do a lot more with params than most
17:02<andythenorth>can't imagine people starting lots of games just to find perfect parameter setting
17:02<andythenorth>it's fine when you can change them in game :P
17:02<Supercheese>I sat down once and configured the parameters on my giant grf list, saved it as preset so I won't have to do it again
17:02<andythenorth>then I change the grf :P
17:03<Supercheese>problem comes when ... yes that
17:03<andythenorth>Supercheese: have you played FIRS with the boost behaviour?
17:04<Supercheese>not as much as I should
17:04<Supercheese>been too busy making grfs to play much, last game was Jan4-5 IIRC
17:04<@peter1138>bah, can't work out my tree list method
17:04<Supercheese>I am currently making a Montgolfier balloon, aircraft in 1783!
17:06<andythenorth>carry mail
17:06<Supercheese>mostly crazy Frenchmen :P
17:09<Zuu>Hmm, using "show game options" as debug action for testing new GUI features is quite useful as it simplifies changing back to a English from Arabic :-p
17:12<Supercheese>Blah, Login to Bananas --> "This page does not yet exist"
17:12<Zuu>Its knows since ages
17:12<Supercheese>login still works, just the redirect doesn't, yeah
17:12<Zuu>just go to the page you want.
17:13<Supercheese>minor annoynace
17:13<Supercheese>Hmm, if I update a grf on bananas, I can't change the name?
17:14<Zuu>imho, improving bananas on dependency management have higher priority than fixing the login redirect.
17:14<Zuu>The name is afaik not possible to change.
17:15<Zuu>Of course anyone with dB access could change it, but the webUI doesn't allow it. The reason for this is probably to keep things sane.
17:15<Supercheese>I was thinking of updating the Hot Air Balloon grf to change the name to "Eyecandy Aircraft" and add more stuff to it than just a modern hot air balloon
17:16<Supercheese>Or should I upload it as a separate grf entry?
17:16<andythenorth>barrage balloon
17:16<andythenorth>for my castle
17:16<andythenorth>also
17:16<andythenorth>bye
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17:16<Supercheese>that would be a stationary object :P
17:16<Supercheese>d'oh, he bailed
17:16<Wolf01>'night
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17:25<@peter1138>ah, a bit of recursion works
17:26<Supercheese>God, the orange company color recolors are terrible
17:26<Supercheese>there's so little difference in lightness everything just looks bleagh
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17:32<@peter1138>you need an rgb remap!
17:32<Supercheese>Why, yes, I suppose I do :)
17:35<@peter1138>oh dear, a mix of portishead's glory box and war of the worlds... along with some rapping
17:36<Supercheese>wat
17:36<@peter1138>you need an rgb remap!
17:36<@peter1138>oh dear, a mix of portishead's glory box and war of the worlds... along with some rapping
17:36<@peter1138>even
17:36*Zuu tries to figure out a easy use case for click-on-parameter detection.
17:37<@peter1138>on bbc 6music
17:37<Zuu>I only can think of allowing to click the URL in content download window.
17:37<Supercheese>O_o
17:37<@peter1138>ah, it's tricky - hell is around the corner
17:37<Zuu>Allowing to click town names in chat may also be possible and probably not too hard to do.
17:38<Zuu>as long as the chat window can receive clicks...
17:38<Supercheese>If someone pastes a url in chat, clickable on that as well?
17:39<Zuu>My WIP allows inserting control codes into strings which can the be used to detect if somone clicked on one of the prepaired regions within a string.
17:40<Zuu>If one implements a pharser to indentify URLs, that is possible.
17:41<Zuu>My biggest argument against it all togeather is that the usability may get damaged if it is applied wrongly for things where a clear button would be easier to discover.
17:45<Zuu>The reason why I made a serious attempt on this was however to allow users to click on eg. town names, industries etc. in the story book: http://devs.openttd.org/~zuu/goal-gui/story-book3.png
17:46<Zuu>(note that it should say "click on next to continue", it is just a typo in the screenshot)
17:47<Supercheese>Yes, I can see how linking to specific towns would be very helpful there
17:54<@peter1138>cool, hierarchical groups
17:55<Supercheese>all right, I really should actually play a game; all code and no play makes for dull cheese
18:06<Eddi|zuHause>Zuu: HTML!
18:07<@peter1138>http://fuzzle.org/~petern/ottd/hgroup1.png
18:07<@peter1138>http://fuzzle.org/~petern/ottd/hgroup2.png
18:08<Zuu>peter1138: Looks nice (except that I never play with groups ;-) )
18:09<Eddi|zuHause>peter1138: i need a "manage list"->"split this group into sub-groups based on <criterium>" feature
18:09<@peter1138>code it then
18:10<Eddi|zuHause>most notably "split the ungrouped-group into shared orders"
18:16<Eddi|zuHause>also: group-based livery colours!
18:16<Supercheese>^
18:18<Eddi|zuHause>with hierarchical groups, i'd want to split my roadvehicles into: top-group: "(largest) city in its orders", sub group: "shared orders (lines)"
18:19<@peter1138>now i remember why we don't discuss ottd related stuff in here
18:19<Eddi|zuHause>then give each city its own colour scheme
18:19<@peter1138>it's always off-topic suggestions :p
18:19<Stimrol>I was trying to start openttd with crontab, that doesnot seam to work. Is it difficult to make openttd to a service job
18:19<Eddi|zuHause>Stimrol: you need to set DISPLAY and stuff in the crontab
18:20<@peter1138>not for a dedicated server
18:20<Stimrol>yes trying to start dedicated server with autopilot
18:20<Eddi|zuHause>whatever, it's mostly the "stuff" probably
18:21<Stimrol>what I am trying to do is to update server after nightly update then start it again
18:21<Stimrol>so it checks if updateded at 20:00 then stop server and start again, little script run from crontab
18:22<Eddi|zuHause>Stimrol: you could try starting a login shell (su -) so it loads the profile, then run the script within that
18:22<Eddi|zuHause>Stimrol: otherwise we need more information (like actual error messages)
18:23<Stimrol>problem is there is no error message, I used "tee" to make log. The server seams to start but then it is not started. Can pase last line of log
18:25<Stimrol>paste*
18:26<@Terkhen>good night
18:26<Supercheese>night
18:29<Stimrol>I am going to try to start the server with debug level 2 and see what it says
18:31<Eddi|zuHause>Stimrol: have you tried it without autopilot first? do you load a specific savegame?
18:32<Stimrol>no, that is true, I should maybe try that. And not I dont load a savegame, just random seed
18:33<Stimrol>if I run the altered update script from bash then it works, but if I do it from crontab then it stops after "Starting year: 1950"
18:35<Eddi|zuHause>that does not look like openttd is actually started
18:36<Eddi|zuHause>again, you're probably missing some environment setup that your usual bash-profile has, but the crontab doesn't
18:38<Stimrol>that is probably the case, could maybe fix it if I would cd to the right directory, just thinking aloud :)
18:39<NGC3982>Did anyone of you ever use Sketchup?
18:39<Stimrol>no I do that, try with openttd -D next
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18:48<Maedhros>doesn't a dedicated server listen on stdin?
18:49<+glx>there is the admin port or the console
18:50<Maedhros>i was thinking that since cron doesn't open stdin, openttd might just exit immediately if you tried to run it that way
18:51<Stimrol>this crontab work if the script calls openttd -D but not autopilot.tcl
18:51<Maedhros>hmm, ok
18:52<Stimrol>I am using autopilot because it is very nice to have the server connected to the irc to read if there was some problem or sugestion from players afterwards
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18:53<Stimrol>problem is there is no error message why the autopilot stops, it just seams to stop after is announces what year it starts at
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18:57<Stimrol>if I make the script sleep for like some sec before it finishes, does it work like that that autopilot can finish running all it does?
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19:01<Eddi|zuHause>that sentence does not parse
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19:04<Stimrol>what I am trying to say is does the autopilot.tcl stop because it is not given enough time to finish starting openttd because the crontab script is done running. Would it maybe change anything adding sleep to the end of the script
19:04<Stimrol>this is even more complicated sentence :)
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19:05<Maedhros>it shouldn't make any difference
19:06<Maedhros>i don't think cron works that way -- the commands it starts should continue until *they* stop
19:06<Maedhros>it won't stop them for you
19:07<Stimrol>I am google running tcl script with google, and it seams to have to do with enviroments like Eddi says, but I dont know what more enviroments it needs than the path, and I run the program from full path
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19:14<Supercheese>Oy gevalt: http://www.simuscape.net/simutalk/viewtopic.php?f=120&t=377#p4433
19:15<Eddi|zuHause>no such content
19:15<Supercheese>Likely registered only
19:16<Supercheese>Lemme link the crazy parts
19:17<Supercheese>Actually, no, not worth linking
19:17<Supercheese>drama is bad™
19:22<Eddi|zuHause>when was simuscape ever not drama?
19:23<Supercheese>yeah, anything I link has basically been covered before
19:26<Eddi|zuHause>i really don't care anymore... let them have their shut-in monastery
19:30<@peter1138>daemontools might be a reasonable tool for running openttd servers
19:30<@peter1138>djb's tools
19:30<@peter1138>not the cdrom drive emulator that is weirdly named daemon tools for whatever stupid reason
19:33<Eddi|zuHause>if autopilot catches sighup, you might also send that from a cronjob, avoiding all the other mess
19:33<Eddi|zuHause>(i'm sure there are more crazy workarounds of that sort)
19:39<Stimrol>I use SIGQUIT to stop it so sighup is maybe there also
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19:52<Stimrol>this is more complicated than I thought, probably because I dont know programming. But I thought I could scratch my way around some problems
19:55<Stimrol>dont know how to make SIGHUP.tcl run, the other is done by calling "/ap-signal.sh SCHED_QUIT" but ap-signal is used for kill commands only and halts if autopilot is not running
20:01<Stimrol>and probably even to late to be wondering about this problems :)
20:15-!-Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:16<Supercheese>Man, at 4x zoom vehicles sure "jump" when moving
20:16<Supercheese>stop-motion
20:23<__ln__>so, umm, yo, season 5 of breaking bad started in july, continued until september, and will continue next july. wtf, yo?
20:27<Stimrol>Eddi|zuHause, SIGHUP doesnt reload openttd, so it still keeps running the old version, have to shut down to make newest nightly build available
20:27<Supercheese>http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=167931
20:28-!-KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20:28<Stimrol>nice
20:28<Supercheese>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montgolfier#Manned_flight
20:29<Supercheese>Rendered from http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=969b33987c291e03a4ac4a98c8485637
20:29<Stimrol>well done
20:39<Supercheese>Next on the list: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giffard_dirigible
20:56<Stimrol>good night
20:56<Supercheese>'night
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21:14<@peter1138>hmm
21:15<@peter1138>32bpp 4x eh
21:21<Supercheese>indeed
21:22<@peter1138>what's the range on that?
21:22<@peter1138>:p
21:23<Supercheese>eyecandy, no range
21:23<Supercheese>no running cost, no purchase
21:23<@peter1138>heh
21:23<@peter1138>eyecandy vehicles? is that even a thing?
21:23*Supercheese is sort of the eyecandy vehicles dude
21:24<Supercheese>I've been gathering ideas and sprites steadily over the past year or so
21:24<@peter1138>damn, that's big
21:24<Supercheese>50ft in diameter, IIRC
21:25<Supercheese>49ft, I was close
21:25<Supercheese>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:1783_balloonj.jpg
21:25<@peter1138>yeah that's what i'm on
21:25<Supercheese>≈75 ft tall
21:26*Supercheese is off to dinner
21:26<@peter1138>aeronaut is a nice word
22:15<Supercheese>Ouch, new Simuscape license even disallows decoding the grf
22:15*Supercheese promptly violates the license
22:16*peter1138 tuts
22:16<@peter1138>it's not that CC license anymore?
22:16<Supercheese>she changed
22:16<Supercheese>SAC is a she, no?
22:17<Supercheese>http://www.simuscape.net/simutalk/viewtopic.php?f=120&t=378
22:17<@peter1138>that isn't going to be visible without a login
22:17<Supercheese>"Custom files downloaded from Simuscape, (http://www.simuscape.net) are for personal use only. Modifications or content extractions are not permitted as it may violate licenses granted by artists where fragments of their works may or may not be part of the custom file where this license apply. Uploading, hosting, (including content download services), or any other attempt to provide a custom...
22:17<Supercheese>...file downloaded from Simuscape to users elsewhere is not permitted."
22:18<@peter1138>bit different from CC
22:18<@peter1138>why are you even on there?
22:18<Supercheese>180° opposite, even
22:18<Supercheese>Well, I like North American Roads
22:18<Supercheese>and that's the only place to get them
22:18<Supercheese>well, newest ones anyway
22:18<@peter1138>simuscape is a clique of artists who never released anything in case people used it
22:20<Supercheese>Well, in the event new grfs or updates to existing grfs are released there, I'd like to be able to download them
22:54<@DorpsGek>Commit by peter1138 :: r24932 /trunk/src (lang/english.txt newgrf_gui.cpp) (2013-01-22 03:54:40 UTC)
22:54<@DorpsGek>-Fix [FS#5158]: Prevent more NewGRFs being selected than is possible to load.
22:55<@peter1138>easy bugs :p
22:56<Supercheese>Hmm, those poor sods using unmodified OTTD are still limited to 63-64 grfs, eh?
22:56<@peter1138>58
22:56<Supercheese>Ouch
22:56<@peter1138>more than you ever need
22:57<Supercheese>Need ≠ want
22:57<Supercheese>Also you don't "need" any at all
22:58<@peter1138>sheesh
22:58<@peter1138>why would you even ...
22:58<Supercheese>You've seen my grf list
22:58<@peter1138>you'll end up with a horrible mishmash of graphics styles
22:58<@peter1138>conflicting prices
22:58<@peter1138>it wouldn't make sense
22:58<Supercheese>To you, perhaps
22:58<Supercheese>but for those of us who want to, well, we do
22:59<Supercheese>beauty of open-source stuff eh
22:59<@peter1138>sick
22:59<Supercheese>:P
23:08<Supercheese>Blarg, that took forever, I need to automate these palette conversions...
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---Logclosed Tue Jan 22 00:00:12 2013