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#openttd IRC Logs for 2013-02-22

---Logopened Fri Feb 22 00:00:59 2013
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02:28<andythenorth>la la la
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02:36<Supercheese>More drama! I've even joined in myself
02:36<Supercheese>what is the world coming to?
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03:31<@peter1138>hmm, well
03:32<Supercheese>Patch eh
03:33<andythenorth>you have a FIRS checkout?
03:33<Supercheese>probably should
03:33<andythenorth>you on windows?
03:34<andythenorth>you use precompiled nmlc, or you have python and such?
03:34<andythenorth>puts a few hurdles in
03:35<andythenorth>I don't know how you make it possible to write code on windows :)
03:35<Supercheese>Tortoisehg can spit out patches eh
03:35<andythenorth>I know it can be done
03:35<andythenorth>you have hg already?
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03:35<andythenorth>oh fine
03:35<andythenorth>just get a checkout
03:35<Supercheese>Devzone uses it a lot (exclusively?)
03:36<Supercheese>The last time I used a non-Windows operating system was... hmm, probably Macintosh II?
03:37<Supercheese>I was a wee lad
03:37<__ln__>i hear engineer dialect
03:38<andythenorth>so checkout, change, post a diff
03:38<andythenorth>or post the modified file as an attachment
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03:38<Supercheese>will do
03:38<andythenorth>you won't be able to build though :P
03:38<Supercheese>although I patched OGFX+ airports without building it, and the patch was accepted
03:38<Supercheese>so there's precedence :)
03:39<Supercheese>well, wasn't a patch per se
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03:46<@peter1138>i reckon the people wanting their own content repo wouldn't actually be able to host it anyway
03:47<@peter1138>but then again, i don't see people wanting their own content repo
03:47<@peter1138>i only see people saying other people want their own content repo
03:47<@peter1138>*might want
03:47<Supercheese>People generally want much more than they do
03:48<@peter1138>it'd be a massive amount of work to support multiple content repos in ottd
03:49<@peter1138>the content server isn't http
03:49<@peter1138>it's not like an apt repo
03:49<@peter1138>so you couldn't just run it on a standard web host
03:50<Supercheese>python is weird
03:50<Supercheese>programming languages are weird
03:51<Supercheese>blarg, no obvious "create patch" for Tortoisehg
03:55<Supercheese>to the documentation
03:59<Supercheese>what, it expects me to use command line stuff?
03:59<Supercheese>why bother providing a GUI then?
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04:06<@peter1138>gui is useful for browsing a repo
04:07<Supercheese>It's useful, but I guess hg doesn't like patches?
04:08<Supercheese>No "Create patch" button like SVN
04:08*Supercheese likes one-click buttons that do what you want
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04:16<@peter1138>Supercheese, svn doesn't have a ui
04:17<Supercheese>"Show log"
04:17<@peter1138>tortoise is not svn
04:17<@peter1138>it's another tool
04:17<Supercheese>me entiendes
04:18<@Alberth>hi planetmaker
04:19<Supercheese>good night
04:19<@Alberth>bye :)
04:19<Supercheese>valete omnes
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04:21<@peter1138>are you roman?
04:21<@peter1138>oh he left
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04:36<@planetmaker>some say 'bye all', some say 'valete omnes' :D
05:33<@peter1138>health all
05:33<@peter1138>or something like that
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06:09<jonty-comp>screen -Dr
06:13<Sacro>UDRR :P
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06:56<@peter1138>hmm, 43 windows in irssi
06:57<jonty-comp>huh, why did it do that
06:57<jonty-comp>oh i know why, my phone has it set as an autosendcmd
06:58<jonty-comp>but it's also in my .bashrc :p
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07:57<@planetmaker>oh... trolling going on in the bananas thread (again)?
07:58<andythenorth>I _think_ it's genuine not trolling
07:58<andythenorth>hard to be sure
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08:05<@peter1138>i think it's genuine but with a hint of sarcasm
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08:08<V453000>when I am connecting to a server and I am missing a grf from grfcrawler, will openttd indicate that the grf is available on grfcrawler?
08:09<V453000>or is it just "look that site exists" feature?
08:11<@planetmaker>just test it ;-) (or grfcrawler)
08:11<@planetmaker>grfcrawler will tell which grfs it knows, when given a list of grfIDs
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08:46<V453000>cute, but bananas is bananas :)
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08:50<SN4T14>I'm having a slight problem with my OpenTTD server, I've opened 3979 UDP and TCP through iptables, but when I connect to my server it times out...
08:57<SN4T14>Nevermind, figured it out
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08:57<jonty-comp>clearly user error
08:59<Maedhros>TrueBrain: is there any way i can recover my old account so i can merge it into a new shiny account?
09:00<Maedhros>eh, the password on the old old account, that is
09:02<@planetmaker>oi, that sounds like fun. I remember that question previously being answered along the lines of 'merge window is over'
09:05<Maedhros>ah, that's a shame. apparently i can't create a new account with this username cause it already exists in the merge database
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09:12<+michi_cc>planetmaker: I
09:12<andythenorth>the conclusion is that people who can't or won't use bananas
09:12<+michi_cc>'d guss the merge window purely depends on how much you beg TB :)=
09:12<andythenorth>shouldn't use bananas
09:12<andythenorth>well how useful
09:13<andythenorth>that was a worthwhile forum post
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09:21<@planetmaker>michi_cc, I guess that, too :-)
09:22<V453000>andythenorth: sac even said that they realized bananas isnt as bad as they thought it was, while she also basically said that the only reason they dont put stuff there is for their stupid reasons
09:23<andythenorth>I was referring to someone else that I don't get on with, but yeah
09:23<andythenorth>does forums have an ignore?
09:23<V453000>I know, but still; the only problem of this whole thing is a few stubborn idiots
09:24<V453000>"cant or wont accept bananas" my ass
09:24<andythenorth>I just thought it was a particularly meaningless point
09:24<andythenorth>"Those who don't want to use bananas should not use bananas"
09:24<andythenorth>yeah, uh, thanks
09:25<@planetmaker>forum has an ignore. But it's about useless
09:25<andythenorth>some forums have 'foe'
09:25<andythenorth>where is that
09:25<V453000>it is meaningless as 90% of his posts, not surprising
09:25<@planetmaker>somewhere in your user settings, andythenorth . Called 'foe'
09:25<V453000>ENEMY :D
09:26<@planetmaker>In the forums I have neither friends nor foes ;-)
09:26<andythenorth>my foes list just increased :)
09:26<andythenorth>it was previously 0
09:26<andythenorth>now the post is ignored
09:26<andythenorth>what it should really do is show the post, but hide the 'reply' and 'quote' buttons :P
09:27<@planetmaker>yes. It cuts down threads leading to out-of-context postings
09:27<andythenorth>what I want it to do is prevent me getting into pointless flame wars with dickheads
09:27<andythenorth>I'll have to prevent myself :P
09:28<andythenorth>V453000 where are your ship sprites then?
09:28<andythenorth>not done yet?
09:29<V453000>I have like one templated
09:29<V453000>kind of taking a break atm
09:29<andythenorth>shameful :)
09:29<andythenorth>I have been having a break too
09:29<andythenorth>in pubs
09:29<V453000>the tracks took too much initiative :P need to recharge
09:30<V453000>ha, I had such break last game, resulted in me being as drunk as never before ... so now having a break from booze as well
09:34<@planetmaker>but you didn't get drunk over / because of the game? :D
09:35<V453000>I meant last week
09:36<V453000>substituting games for weeks, check
09:37<V453000>andythenorth: kinda what I have atm
09:37<V453000>just the offsets really
09:37<andythenorth>and you'll have crashes
09:38<V453000>yes. :D
09:38<V453000>which will be funny because the ship segments (wagons) will start rotating during the crash
09:42<V453000>I could send you a template and you could draw the ship andy? :P
09:49<@Terkhen>hello :)
09:54<andythenorth>V453000 good luck with that :)
09:54<andythenorth>so who speaks french?
09:54<V453000>didnt expect that!
09:58<V453000>oh, also my minion doing the CHIPS extension hasnt appeared in at least a month
09:58<V453000>so ye
09:59<V453000>didnt expect that either
09:59<andythenorth>who speaks croatian?
10:00<andythenorth>or czech?
10:00<V453000>in fact I was even in a tram today and I thought the old woman I left to take my seat, and she didnt instantly ask me for permission do draw sprites for me - how unexpectable :(
10:00<V453000>I speak czech mostly
10:00<V453000>nobody draws sprites, weird world today
10:01<andythenorth>nmlc warning: "lang/czech.lng", line 63: String commands don't match with english.lng
10:01<andythenorth>^ FIRS
10:02<V453000>that means it sucks
10:02<V453000>exact translation
10:03<V453000>why is in english on line 63 STR_CARGO_UNIT_FRUITS while czech has on 63 STR_EXTRA_GRAIN_MILL ??
10:04<V453000>just multiple lines somewhere I guess
10:05<V453000>which STR_ is broken then?
10:05<V453000>63 from czech or english?
10:06<V453000>also I think cargoes should just have colours or icons, no translations needed
10:07<V453000>produces <image of pile of fecal matter>, accepts <image of pile of fecal matter> ... 5 <piles> > 3 <piles>, done
10:08<V453000>30 battery / tractor == smilie
10:10<V453000>120 == 2 smilies or happier smilie
10:10<V453000>get rid of the strings andy :P
10:12<@planetmaker>V453000, just update the whole language file and make the string lines match (again) :D
10:14<@planetmaker>I usually indeed try to match the line numbers - or at least the order. And using alberth's great language check tool on it... makes for quick check what needs changing
10:16<V453000>asdf :d
10:16<@planetmaker>hm... some more strings need adjustment in German...
10:18<@planetmaker>anyway, laters... first getting food from store :D
10:20<V453000>people should be able to play the game with english anyway
10:20<V453000>at least they will learn basic words
10:30<@peter1138>so the llama has been reawakened :p
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11:33<Bad_Brett>Llama farms!
11:33<Bad_Brett>FIRS needs Llama farms!
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11:40<Maedhros>does anyone know where i can find the code responsible for drawing the mouse cursor?
11:42<andythenorth>Bad_Brett: add on
11:42<Rubidium>hmm, all those returnees lately
11:42<Maedhros>i'm having trouble with the cursor being in the wrong place in OS X, and as far as i can tell it's being drawn by OpenTTD *and* Cocoa, but not in the same place
11:42<@planetmaker>Maedhros, it's OS-specifc
11:43<goodger>I just understood the etymology of the -ee suffix
11:43<andythenorth>Maedhros: I have the same issue
11:43<andythenorth>haven't raised a FS :(
11:43<@planetmaker>that issue is... annoying ... and tricky
11:43<andythenorth>arose recently, assuming it's 10.7.x specific
11:43<Maedhros>andythenorth: does it jump back to the right place again when you click somewhere?
11:43*planetmaker didn't update to 10.7 really. Tested and rejected here ;-)
11:44<andythenorth>I have to swich away frm openttd to fix
11:44<@planetmaker>Maedhros, it's probably the offset of the window to the upper right corner of the screen?
11:44<Rubidium>planetmaker: shouldn't you be on 10.8 already?
11:44<@planetmaker>should maybe... but I'm not
11:44<Maedhros>planetmaker: i think you're right, although as far as i can tell it's the offset to the bottom right corner instead
11:45<@planetmaker>Maedhros, does it depend on from where you move the mouse into the viewport?
11:45<andythenorth>planetmaker: that totally makes sense, the issue only noticeably occurs when the window is smaller than screen-size
11:45<andythenorth>usually I run ottd maximised
11:46<@planetmaker>andythenorth, that's different display drivers in cocoa then... kind of...
11:46<@planetmaker>Maedhros, the OSX-specific one is in os/macosx/cocoa*
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11:47<Maedhros>planetmaker: it doesn't matter from which side of the window you move into the viewport
11:49<@planetmaker>Maedhros, sorry, it's in src/video/cocoa/cocoa_v*
11:49<@planetmaker>setTrackingRect and friends might be of interest there
11:50<@planetmaker>or the whole of the OTTD_CocoaView class
11:51<Maedhros>heh. it doesn't help that i'm basically stumbling in the dark when it comes to cocoa :)
11:52<@planetmaker>didn't help me either
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11:59<Maedhros>huh. well, i think i know where the problem is: in WindowQuartzSubdriver::GetMouseLocation the mouse location appears to be relative to the screen, not the window
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12:02<+michi_cc>Maedhros: Hey, if you have mouse problems, you might be able to test (even if it probably isn't really related) :)
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12:04<Maedhros>michi_cc: that looks fairly related :) i'll take a look when i get back
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12:48<@DorpsGek>Commit by frosch :: r25035 trunk/src/lang/english.txt (2013-02-22 17:48:44 UTC)
12:48<@DorpsGek>-Fix: Improve english. (Joel A)
12:49<Maedhros>michi_cc: the patch in FS#4392 fixes this problem... but it makes the mouse disappear when the window is maximised and you have to click twice before the button press is registered
12:49<Maedhros>pretty much what planetmaker said in the comments, sadly
12:55<andythenorth>so I am just going to remove the lines in FIRS translations that are breaking
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13:09<supermop>someone? should make a realistic/generic monorail set
13:09<supermop>that ? was supposed to be a TM symbol
13:09<supermop>with slow alweg style monorails starting from the 60s ish
13:10<supermop>generically based on Alweg and hitachi designs
13:10<supermop>by someone of course i mean me, but i'll never get around to it
13:11<supermop>i think i expressed this idea to Eddi|zuHause like 3-4 years ago on irc
13:11<supermop>and clearly have done nothing since then
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13:12<Eddi|zuHause>who what how?
13:15<supermop>i recall wasting your time late one night maybe in 2010 ruminating about my ideas for a 'real
13:15<supermop>monorail set
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13:15<supermop>real in the sense that monorails would be cheap-ish slow urban rapid transit
13:15<jonty-comp>only if it includes the disneyland monorail
13:16<supermop>of course
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13:25<supermop>gameplay wish it would be stupid to do this, but alweg and hitachi buit trains should be incompatible as the train floor height is much different
13:25<supermop>same with disneyland vs. standard alweg/disney world
13:26<supermop>willing to bet no one wants 3 monorailtypes taking up slots in game though
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13:45<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r25036 /trunk/src/lang (4 files in 2 dirs) (2013-02-22 18:45:16 UTC)
13:45<@DorpsGek>-Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<@DorpsGek>esperanto - 29 changes by Asakha
13:45<@DorpsGek>gaelic - 198 changes by GunChleoc
13:45<@DorpsGek>swedish - 2 changes by Joel_A
13:45<@DorpsGek>thai - 1 changes by angelix
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14:13<@planetmaker>hi Supercheese
14:14<Eddi|zuHause>saliva yourself...
14:15<Eddi|zuHause>but better not tell us
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14:43<Supercheese>unresolved external symbol
14:43<Supercheese>uh oh
14:49<@Alberth>Wanna swap with "RuntimeError: dictionary changed size during iteration" ? :)
14:49<Supercheese>Maybe I should have checked that the unpatched OTTD compiled first
14:50<@Alberth>nah, that would be boring :)
14:51<Supercheese>and update the correct files to the correct revision
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15:02<tracerpt>good evening
15:10<oskari89>V453000 here?
15:10<TrueBrain>for you of course I make an exception Maedhros
15:10<TrueBrain>let me check how your account status is atm
15:10<oskari89>About Logic Engine 0.9
15:11<oskari89>If i set speed to 12000 km/h, speed will be 8300 km/h... Odd
15:11<tracerpt>i have an idea for u coding guys :p
15:11<oskari89>Same if i set 20000
15:12<V453000>well that is strange; but why would you actually do that? :D
15:12<oskari89>Because i want 20000 km/h train, of course!
15:12<TrueBrain>Maedhros: you had a bugtracker and a wiki account, right?
15:13<V453000>well yeah but for what :D
15:13<oskari89>For quick transportation
15:13<tracerpt>wouldnt it be great if there was a way to set an engine to a max speed? Like if I buy a faster engine but want it to run just 20km/h under it's max speed
15:13<Supercheese>you can do that
15:13<Supercheese>Go under orders -> timetable
15:13<Supercheese>you can set how fast it should run
15:13<tracerpt>i can?
15:13<tracerpt>never used timetables
15:13<Supercheese>yeah, "travel to the next destination with speed at most XX"
15:14<V453000>I think that is quite stupid oskari89 but I will see why it does such unexpected behaviour
15:14<Supercheese>you can even tell it to run at different speeds along different sections
15:14<tracerpt>tried to set a jet to fly just once a month and also failed miserably
15:14<oskari89>V453000: Thanks
15:14<oskari89>Same behaviour as i set 50000
15:14<tracerpt>maybe i'm just too dumb :)
15:14<V453000>note that the train isnt for transportation, it is for logic operations
15:15<tracerpt>gonna take a look at it Supercheese
15:15<V453000>for which around 2000 is functional maximum in 99% cases
15:15<oskari89>Yes, but i've used it for transportation in my one scenario
15:15<Supercheese>Yeah, Orders -> Timetable -> Change Speed Limit
15:15<Supercheese>Sort of a hidden feature
15:15<tracerpt>thanks, been looking for a mod for that and it was under my nose all that time
15:15<Supercheese>could use some better documentation
15:16<tracerpt>so in order to get it to run at diferent speeds
15:16<Supercheese>I'll probably edit the wiki later
15:16<tracerpt>ill need to setup some checkpoints
15:16<Supercheese>Oh yeah, the wiki is outdated
15:17<oskari89>Seems that the top speed is 8300 km/h and cannot go higher than that in that 0.9 version
15:18<oskari89>Even if you set it higher
15:20<tracerpt>cant figure out why make something that runs that fast
15:21<tracerpt>i tried the vacuum tube and found the speed ridiculous
15:21<oskari89>I should make a video from my game which has those 30000 km/h maglevs
15:21<Supercheese>might as well teleport at those speeds
15:21<Supercheese>Scotty, beam me up
15:21<tracerpt>thats an idea :x
15:22<tracerpt>teleport stations
15:22<Supercheese>Yeah, I've worked on them
15:22<Supercheese>I've worked on a lot of things
15:22<tracerpt>why use vehicles
15:22<Supercheese>but I only finish some :P
15:22<TrueBrain>right; all done and set for Maedhros .. now how to confirm his identity .. do we trust him? Hmmmmmm
15:24<jonty-comp>i think it's a very suspicious nick
15:24<jonty-comp>if you rearrange the letters...and add a few...and remove a few
15:24<jonty-comp>YOU GET SIMUSCAPE
15:25<TrueBrain>add a few, haha, nice :D
15:26<tracerpt>worked perfect :) thx again super
15:26<Supercheese>Yer welcome :)
15:28<tracerpt>now i have to sort out for them to speed up again xD
15:28<Supercheese>remove speed limit somewhere
15:29<Supercheese>but yeah, nifty feature
15:29<Supercheese>added, oh, not too long ago
15:29<tracerpt>ive got an order to go "non stop thru CP1" max speed 177
15:29<tracerpt>then from CP1 to next station no speed limit
15:30<tracerpt>dumbfk kept going at 177
15:30<tracerpt>damn those asian trains
15:30<Supercheese>r23947, just about a year ago
15:31<tracerpt>i'm guessing almost no one uses them
15:31<tracerpt>them as in the speed limit
15:32<Supercheese>@commit 23947
15:32<@DorpsGek>Supercheese: Commit by michi_cc :: r23947 /trunk/src (15 files in 6 dirs) (2012-02-14 17:04:06 UTC)
15:32<@DorpsGek>Supercheese: -Feature: Timetabled maximum travel speeds for non-flying vehicles.
15:33<Supercheese>As mentioned, they aren't the most well-documented feature
15:33<Supercheese>I'll add stuff to the relevant wiki pages later today
15:34<tracerpt>got it
15:34<tracerpt>i was setting the speeds at the wrong places
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15:35<tracerpt>still needed to add the max speed after the limit zone ends
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15:38<Superuser>this channel sure is dead today
15:39<tracerpt>i wouldnt know about that
15:40<@Belugas>we are ghosts
15:40<@Belugas>we are ghosts on a machine
15:40<@Belugas>we are ghosts on a machine and we don't even know
15:41<frosch123>yeah, poor old ghosts
15:41<@Belugas>pfff... old yourself!
15:41<frosch123>all the young guys want to be zombies
15:41<Supercheese>or shoot zombies
15:41<@Belugas>zombines.. no class...
15:42<@Belugas>if at least they wanted to be vampires... but ho no... so passé!
15:42<@Belugas>damned you Twilight! You killed teh vampires :S
15:42<@Belugas>mhh... so a propos...
15:43<@Belugas>Esben and the Witch - Skeleton Swoon
15:43<frosch123>Jackie Chan - Rob B Hood
15:44<@Alberth>o/ sir B
15:44<@Belugas>Haa! Al!!
15:44<oskari89>There's a 23 tile length train here...
15:44<oskari89>Weight 193 tons
15:45<@Belugas>there's a skeleton choking ona crust of bread!
15:45<oskari89>Power: 2857220 hp
15:45<@Belugas>Power to the People
15:45<@Alberth>oskari89: I hope you have added some foundations to your desktop
15:45<oskari89>Max speed is 30175 kph :P
15:45<oskari89>Kind of nice acceleration
15:46<@Alberth>utterly useless in a game :)
15:46<oskari89>There is 3 passenger coaches
15:46<oskari89>And the rest of train is those logic engines
15:46<@Belugas>Jackie Chan... yeh, i thnk i've heard about
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15:47<Supercheese>oskari89, you're murdering the poor passengers with those g-forces
15:47<oskari89>Still, it's not making much profit
15:47<Supercheese>all the customers are DEAD
15:47<tracerpt>figured it out
15:47<tracerpt><--- was doing it wrong
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16:38<LordAro>ha, 2 minutes :L
16:40*LordAro hates wireless. Has he mentioned that yet?
16:41<@Alberth>I think he may have said something in that direction
16:41<LordAro>only a few times
16:42<tracerpt>wireless sucks
16:43<frosch123>yeah, never use satellites
16:43<@Alberth>hmm, what's the mimetype of simple text ?
16:43<@Alberth>utf-8 text to be precise
16:44<frosch123>i don't think there are mimetypes for encoding
16:44<frosch123>try some bom in the file
16:45<@Alberth>it's a http connection, so I can state a charset ;)
16:47*LordAro plays some Kerbal Space Program while waiting for pages to load
16:47<andythenorth>I have been resisting KSP
16:47<@Alberth>hi andy
16:48<LordAro>hey andy
16:48<LordAro>i only started playing a couple of days ago
16:48<LordAro>even the limited demo is insanely fun :)
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17:06<heffer>who says wireless sucks? if it does you're doing it wrong
17:17<LordAro>now that's worthy of a screenshot:
17:18<frosch123>can you eat the other one?
17:18<Markk>...what is it?
17:18<frosch123>as in "you only live twice"?
17:19<LordAro>Markk: rendezvous in kerbal space program
17:19<LordAro>frosch123: almost :) if i had the full verion, i could dock with the other
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17:32<@Alberth>andythenorth: I have thrown out most of the language overview page (the page you get when you click at a language from a project).
17:32<@Alberth>It's a bit minimalistic now, perhaps a bit too much (or 'too less' :) ) Ideas are welcome, but not now :)
17:32<@Alberth>good night all
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17:33<LordAro>nIGHT aLBERTH
17:34<LordAro>also worth a screenie?
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18:13<andythenorth>is it harsh that I'm just deleting broken strings in translations?
18:13<Supercheese>"deleting" when the revision history is saved isn't really "deleting"
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18:45<Eddi|zuHause>don't put thoughts like that into andy's head :p
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19:13<@Terkhen>good night
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23:17-!-mode/#openttd [+v peter1138] by ChanServ
23:17-!-mode/#openttd [+v orudge] by ChanServ
23:17-!-mode/#openttd [+v SmatZ] by ChanServ
23:17-!-mode/#openttd [+v Terkhen] by ChanServ
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23:41<Pikka>innit though
23:56<Pikka>does anyone else have any ideas about ? Is the pattern I'm hearing due to a bug, or something else?
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---Logclosed Sat Feb 23 00:00:59 2013