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#openttd IRC Logs for 2013-03-12

---Logopened Tue Mar 12 00:00:25 2013
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01:03<Pikka>Maybe it's because I'm Peruvian
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05:10<andythenorth>sometimes I wonder if I could not import 1 bazillion things to every python module
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05:14<Pikka>I don't
05:14<andythenorth>I bet
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05:15<andythenorth>Pikka chops, where is your HOQSV untracking table?
05:15<andythenorth>so I can copy it
05:15<andythenorth>for BANDIT
05:15<andythenorth>with sprinkles
05:15<Pikka>http://www.pikkarail.com/junk/after.png
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05:16<Pikka>It's not really bandity though
05:16<Pikka>http://www.pikkarail.com/junk/before.png is the old one
05:18<andythenorth>looks pretty bandity to me
05:18<andythenorth>as I cba to work out my own set
05:19<andythenorth>so nothing below 12t, because that's pointless
05:19<andythenorth>and you have unrealistically high top end
05:19<andythenorth>k
05:20*andythenorth considers a capapacity param
05:21<andythenorth>Pikka: you refitting the body type on rigids?
05:21<Pikka>yes
05:21<andythenorth>even with autorefit
05:21<andythenorth>?
05:21<Pikka>I think so
05:21<andythenorth>ugh :)
05:22<andythenorth>I am thinking dropside, tanker
05:22<andythenorth>covers most evils
05:22<Pikka>it may be possible to avoid it
05:22<andythenorth>maybe a fridge
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05:22<Pikka>you may not have this problem with bandit, but I feel like limiting autorefit to certain vehicles is an unnecessary imposition of realism :)
05:23<@peter1138>:(
05:23<Pikka>otherwise I would probably limit autorefit to semis
05:23<andythenorth>I just don't like the visual hoo-haa when a tanker turns into a flatbed :P
05:23<@peter1138>not enough vehicles! ;(
05:23<andythenorth>there are 8
05:23<Pikka>andythenorth, it might be difficult to avoid
05:23<andythenorth>it's a nice number
05:23<andythenorth>Pikka: it's impossible to avoid afaict
05:23<andythenorth>unless you like broken orders
05:23<Pikka>especially with no prop 25 for road vehicles
05:23<Pikka>:)
05:24<andythenorth>hmm
05:24<Eddi|zuHause>it's easy to avoid, just offer flatbeds and tankers as separate vehicles
05:24<andythenorth>Squid is 30CC
05:24<andythenorth>BANDIT might be 16CC
05:24<Pikka>there are 8?
05:24<andythenorth>do you see a pattern there?
05:24<Pikka>there are 16
05:24<andythenorth>there is no spoon
05:24<andythenorth>biab
05:25<Pikka>bye
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05:43<@peter1138>Eddi|zuHause, yes
05:47<andythenorth>hmm
05:47<andythenorth>4 tankers, 4 flatbeds, 3 artics
05:47<andythenorth>11CC
05:48<V453000>severe lack of unicorns
05:48<andythenorth>they go in HEQS
05:50<Eddi|zuHause>you miss the boxcars of course
05:50<V453000>boxcars are boring
05:50<V453000>cargo aint visible in them :(
05:51<andythenorth>bye
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06:22<Eddi|zuHause>"if you write cryptocode, make sure that the memset that deletes your key does not get optimized out"
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06:37<@peter1138>heh
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08:08<Pikka>hoh
08:12<@planetmaker>huh
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09:26<Sacro>SET BLASTER=A220 I5 D1 T3 P330 H6 E620
09:27<goodger>I am fairly sure you don't need to write AUTOEXEC.BAT any more, sacro
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09:29<Sacro>goodger: but then how does TTO know how to find my soundcard?
09:29<Sacro>best load mscdex as well
09:55<@peter1138>dosbox or real?
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10:04<Eddi|zuHause>Sacro: but dosbox sets these automatically by default
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10:29<@Belugas>hello
10:32<Sacro>Eddi|zuHause: ooh nice
10:32<Sacro>i should use a full screen dosbox at work
10:32<Sacro>with norton commander
10:40<Eddi|zuHause>and mscdex you don't need either, you just mount with "-t cdrom"
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10:42<Sacro>:(
10:42<Sacro>:o
10:42<Sacro>there's no Eddi
10:43<goodger>I am sure he'll be back
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11:14<andythenorth_>Bon apples
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11:25<andythenorth_>So original ttd has about 30 trucks per climate
11:25<andythenorth_>I was thinking 10 :p
11:25<andythenorth_>Too boring?
11:27<@peter1138>original trucks aren't refittable though
11:28<andythenorth_>Nope
11:28<andythenorth_>I forgot mail trucks
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11:28<andythenorth_>Probly better have some of those :p
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11:29<andythenorth_>Does anyone transport nail by truck ? ?
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11:29<andythenorth_>Nail / mail / phone keyboard
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11:33<@peter1138>yeah i have done
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11:42<andythenorth_>Postman pat van? Or 18 wheeler? o_O
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12:03<Pikka>in OpenTTD, andy, or IRL?
12:03<Pikka>http://www.flickr.com/photos/quarterdeck/8459968861/
12:08<Pikka>looking at the main north brisbane mail centre in google earth, I can see about 30 postman pat vans, half a dozen 3-axle heavy rigids, and about 8 artics
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12:09<Pikka>the postman pat vans are used for brisbane distribution, actual delivery is done by motorbike for letters and contractors for parcels
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12:10<Pikka>hmm, maybe those aren't semis, they're very large 3 axle trucks
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12:40<andythenorth_>In that case, no pat vans
12:41<andythenorth_>Big rigid trucks ftw everywhere
12:41<Pikka>hooray
12:41<Pikka>more realistic than pat vans for inter-city transport, which is what you're mostly doing in OpenTTD anyway
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12:43<andythenorth_>I still haven't figured out any theme
12:43<andythenorth_>I like a thene :p
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13:12<supermop>i want a grid/line drawing monochrome base set
13:13<supermop>so i can play at work more surrepticiously
13:13<HerzogDeXtEr>lol
13:16<supermop>green dimetric grass and cartoonish hills looks blatantly like non work from across the room
13:17<V453000>lol
13:18<V453000>you could replace all sprites with letters
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13:27<V453000>is it just me or does TTRS+FIRS wtfbork?
13:27<V453000>3.13 for TTRS and 0.10.0 for FIRS
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13:34<frosch123>ttrs has some parameters to disable banks
13:34<frosch123>or other fancy cargos/industries
13:35<V453000>it doesnt :s
13:38<frosch123>ah, well, you need version 4
13:38<frosch123>http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/ttrs4
13:39<frosch123>iirc the main feature of that version is that switch
13:39<frosch123>to enable compatibility with industry sets
13:39<V453000>o_O
13:40<frosch123>http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/ttrs <- hmm, maybe that one is more correct
13:40<V453000>that aint on bananas though
13:40<V453000>hasnt there been some bank changing in version like 3.10 already?
13:41<frosch123>so, i only dreamed all of that?
13:42<frosch123>planetmaker: tell me :)
13:42<V453000>idk I havent heard about anything such going on lately ... but that doesnt mean it couldnt have happened :)
13:42<frosch123>http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1287
13:43<V453000>Updated by foobar over 2 years ago
13:43<frosch123>"That is a good idea. IF (VALU/GOLD/DIAM) THEN have bank as industry; ELSE have bank as house."
13:43<frosch123>so, apparently it is compatible with firs
13:44<V453000>well yea, but I just tried FIRS 0.10.0 and TTRS3.13 and all houses were banks
13:44<V453000>it used to work as far as I remember
13:44<frosch123>ah, that's a different issue
13:44<frosch123>it's fixed in r42
13:44<frosch123>which is unreleased
13:44<frosch123>http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/ttrs/repository <- r39 is 3.13
13:45<frosch123>r42 fixed banks appearing in too early years
13:45<frosch123>so, you have to start your game after 1930
13:45<frosch123>or all will be banks :)
13:45<V453000>alright it only happens with some certaion settings
13:46<frosch123>startyear is the important one
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13:47<V453000>oh
13:47<V453000>WTF :d
13:47<V453000>I dont want to start the game before 1930 :d
13:48<frosch123>add another house set :p
13:48<frosch123>with houses before 1930
13:49<frosch123>or poke pm or foobar to release an update :p
13:49<V453000>well I just used japanese buildings instead of TTRS but I will give them a poke when I see them
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13:58<@planetmaker>frosch123, V453000 IIRC I added a switch to disable banks as industries to TTRS
13:58<V453000>any chance you remember which version is that in? :)
13:58<@planetmaker>So yes, I added it specifically to be compatible with FIRS ;-)
13:58<frosch123>planetmaker: nope, you didn't :p
13:59<@planetmaker>I did not? Hm...
13:59<frosch123>foobar added an autodetection of cargos
13:59<@planetmaker>Maybe I detected FIRS and then disabled the industry banks only
13:59<frosch123>and v's issue was a different one
13:59<frosch123>but nevertheless there is no current ttrs release :)
14:00<@planetmaker>with the house thing fixed?
14:00<frosch123>r39 is the last tag
14:00<frosch123>r42 fixes the bug v encountered
14:00<frosch123>fix is from 2012-06, last release from 2011-11
14:00<@planetmaker>hm, I guess I could make a new release :-)
14:01<@planetmaker>but first I'll try get still some bread and then dinner before I starve to death
14:01<@planetmaker>finding drivers for old hardware... is a big PTIA
14:01<@planetmaker>especially obscure hardware
14:01<V453000>ho :)
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14:45<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r25084 /trunk/src/lang (3 files in 2 dirs) (2013-03-12 18:45:19 UTC)
14:45<@DorpsGek>-Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
14:45<@DorpsGek>catalan - 2 changes by arnau
14:45<@DorpsGek>korean - 2 changes by telk5093
14:45<@DorpsGek>gaelic - 2 changes by GunChleoc
14:46<andythenorth>Game Script?
14:46<andythenorth>MP?
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15:06<andythenorth>frosch123: ^ ?
15:06<frosch123>not today
15:06*andythenorth makes newgrfs in that case
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15:38<Wolf01>hello
15:38<@Alberth>hi Wolf01
15:39<Wolf01>"Optimizing game files"... taking ages
15:39-!-k4be [~k@2001:5c0:1502:8c00:6e62:6dff:fec0:87cb] has joined #openttd
15:40<k4be>hey
15:40<@Alberth>hi
15:42<k4be>i'm looking for solution to this message "Error: Failed to find a graphics set. Please acquire a graphics set for OpenTTD. See section 4.1 of readme.txt." on a dedicated server built from source
15:42<k4be>compared the directories with working server on gentoo, found no differences
15:42<k4be>i think it can't find the files
15:43<Wolf01>is the openttd.cfg in the same directory of the game or it is in a user directory?
15:43<frosch123>k4be: emerge opengfx
15:43<k4be>~/.openttd user directory
15:44<k4be>this is not gentoo, i'm trying building from source on centos
15:44<k4be>it works correctly on gentoo
15:44<Wolf01>I usually make "portable" installations (with the .cfg in the same directory) and always works
15:45<k4be>the ~/.openttd is copied from working system
15:45<frosch123>it should be in /usr/share/games/openttd/baseset
15:45<frosch123>or so
15:45<frosch123>maybe share and games is switched :)
15:47<Wolf01>uh, nice, I have 14MB of updated grfs to download :P
15:47<k4be>also not starting after rm -r ~/.openttd
15:47<@planetmaker>not much. Use zbase. And wait for an update there, Wolf01 ;-)
15:48<@planetmaker>lol, k4be of course not :-)
15:48<k4be>it installed in /usr/local atm, different than in gentoo
15:48<@planetmaker>you need to provide a base set in one of the search paths of the openttd binary
15:49<k4be>how to find out which are these paths?
15:49<@planetmaker>which easiest is done by using your package manager
15:49<@planetmaker>readme :-)
15:49<@planetmaker>line... 188 or so...
15:49<@planetmaker>http://vcs.openttd.org/svn/browser/tags/1.3.0-RC2/readme.txt#L266
15:50<Wolf01>whoa, what you have done?! I updated the game and suddenly buttons, buttons everywhere
15:52<k4be>it installed its files in /usr/local/games and /usr/local/share/games
15:52<k4be>do i have to change install prefix for it to work?
15:54<k4be>or is there a way to put paths in command line arguments or openttd.cfg? can't find any info in docs
15:55<@planetmaker>k4be, just symlink opengfx then into your homedir's ~/.openttd/baseset
15:55<@planetmaker>or the whole baseset dir
15:56<@planetmaker>ln -s /usr/local/share/games/baseset ~/.openttd/baseset/sys-base
15:56<@planetmaker>or something like that
15:56<@planetmaker>IFF there's a baseset folder in /usr/local/share/games/baseset
15:59<k4be>/usr/local/share/games/openttd/baseset/ it's there
15:59<k4be>but still won't start
16:00<k4be>gentoo tools often breaks things (as in avr-gcc case - source build works, gentoo build does not), but in case of openttd they did good job :)
16:03<szaman>you may use: strace -e open ./openttd
16:03<szaman>to see where the binary try to search
16:05<@Alberth>Alternatively, read the donotreadme: http://vcs.openttd.org/svn/browser/trunk/readme.txt#L266
16:07<k4be>i just read it for the sixth time :)
16:07<@planetmaker>note that there's no search path with *local* in it
16:08<@Alberth>k4be: please make a pastebin with what you have where
16:09<k4be>http://wklej.org/id/979978/ looks like it finds some files from baseset (search for "= 4")
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16:11<szaman>and there *is* some *local* paths :]
16:11<szaman>*are*
16:12<@Alberth>what .grf files are in that sys-base ?
16:16<k4be>/home/k4be/.openttd/baseset/sys-base/openttd.grf
16:16<k4be>on working system: /usr/share/games/openttd/baseset/openttd.grf
16:16<@Alberth>that's not a base set
16:17<@Alberth>http://vcs.openttd.org/svn/browser/trunk/readme.txt#L194
16:18<@Alberth>describes base sets
16:18-!-Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd
16:18<@Alberth>ie zbase, open-gfx, or trg* (the original ttd files)
16:18<@Alberth>hi Zuu
16:19<Wolf01>lolwut, how I'm supposed to download 5.3GB @49KB/s?
16:19<Zuu>Hello Alberth
16:19<Wolf01>hi Zuu
16:19<k4be>it seems there is missing share/games/openttd/data directory
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16:23<k4be>ok, probably solved, copied /usr/share/games/openttd/data/ from gentoo to /usr/local/share/games/openttd/data/
16:23<@Alberth>base sets don't hide in non-existing directories :)
16:24<k4be>and it seems to start correctly
16:24<DDR>\o/
16:24<k4be>but i don't know why "make install" did not put it there
16:25<@Alberth>make install of what? openttd?
16:25<@Alberth>if so, it's because openttd does not come with a base set
16:26<@Alberth>you typically share the baseset with all openttd copies, no need to have a new baset set for every openttd install
16:26<@Alberth>so most users already have a base set when downloading or building openttd
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16:27<k4be>but in gentoo it did come, also windows users seemed not to have such problems
16:27<TWerkhoven>even on gentoo, the baseset only comes along because emerge has opengfx/sfx/msx as dependencies, they are separate ebuilds
16:28<Rubidium>k4be: sounds like your centos compile is without freetype/fontconfig, so the automatic downloading of base sets when one is missing does not work
16:29<k4be>so why haven't i learned it after reading readme file for 6 times?
16:29<Rubidium>also the windows installer has the option to download a base set (which might even be the default)
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16:31<@Alberth>k4be: what is missing in the readme file?
16:32<Rubidium>k4be: that freetype+fontconfig are needed for "automatic" downloading of a base set seems to be an omission, however I doubt many people will read it if it is hidden in section 7.1
16:32<Rubidium>which is where it belongs, just like the lzma/zlib 'requirements'
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16:34<WOOHOO>"www.iBooter.us - Cheap, Affordable, Strong Output, Dedicated Servers. Best Booter on Market"
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16:34<Wolf01>I do want! Oh, too late
16:35<k4be>so i think configure should say i'm going to have problems :)
16:35<Rubidium>it's not necessarily a problem
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16:47<Zuu>Once you have a base set in ~/.openttd/baseset you will not have any problem if the bootstrap base set downloading is not working due to missing dependency.
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16:51<frosch123>night
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17:11<Wolf01>where is hidden the news ticker configuration panel?
17:11<Zuu>You can configure news in advanced settings in 1.3/nightly.
17:11<@Alberth>in the advanced settings it is in
17:11<Zuu>Just enter "news" in the advanced settings filter and those settings should probably appear.
17:12<Zuu>(given that you use OpenTTD in English)
17:13-!-mathieumaes [~Mathieu@ip-83-101-77-55.customer.schedom-europe.net] has joined #openttd
17:13<mathieumaes>Hi all! I have a question
17:14<mathieumaes>is it possible to reserve a certain station track for certain trains or goods ?
17:14<Wolf01>waypoints http://bbsimg.ngfiles.com/1/24030000/ngbbs4fde12a1a93b4.jpg
17:14<mathieumaes>I have 4 trains loading stuff and 6 trains unloading stuff in the same station with only 4 tracks... I want to make sure that the 4 loading trains don't block all 4 tracks
17:15<Zuu>You can use a waypoint to force all other trains to use the other platforms, and a separate for the trains to use the reserved platforms.
17:15<Zuu>I usually split unloading and loading into two separate stations.
17:15<Zuu>Those have no reason to use the same station ID.
17:16<mathieumaes>I suppose that could work
17:16<mathieumaes>thanks!
17:16<@Alberth>it also reduces head-aches about blocking :)
17:17<mathieumaes>yeah
17:17<mathieumaes>but what if you are loading 2 different goods ?
17:18<@Alberth>3 stations?
17:18<Zuu>Either split loading into two stations or use waypoints to restrict access.
17:18<@Alberth>loading needs just a few platforms
17:19<@Alberth>you can have the other trains waiting in front of it
17:19<Zuu>Eg. use one entry at the left for grain and one entry to the right for liverstock. The grain trains have access to plattform 1 to 4 and livestock is given access to plattform 3 to 6.
17:19<@Alberth>at least, if you have enables the advanced/improved loading algorithm
17:19<Wolf01>mmmh, I think I need a setting for "closing of industries served by the player", it desn't seem to be handled by the "production changes of industried served by the player"
17:20<Ristovski>Jokes about german sausages are the wurst
17:20<@Alberth>Wolf01: industry closures are all put on one big heap indeed
17:21<@Alberth>but in my experience it happens very seldomly that an industry closes on you, just turn on the negative profit warning instead :)
17:22<Wolf01>meh, I have a fruit plantation near a city and already got an alert, so I wanted to know if it closes down
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17:24<Zuu>You can set up a dummy truck that loads fruit from it while building your rail connection.
17:25<@Alberth>Wolf01: ah, a warning in the industry window or so?
17:25<Wolf01>no, it closes down because is too near to the city, it doesn't have production problems
17:26<Wolf01>I already blocked the city from that side, but I don't know if it's enough
17:28<Wolf01>nothing that I can't handle by keeping the industry window open minimised, so if it closes, it mean that the industry has gone
17:28<@Alberth>I didn't even know it did that :o
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17:31<SigHunter>setting engine_renew is "on" but vehicles dont get renewed automatically when old, using 1.3.0 RC2, is there some other setting required for this to work?
17:32<@planetmaker>you gotta have enough money, engines need have possibility to visit depot. and they need still be available
17:33<SigHunter>i have cars that are 20/15 years old, i have 14 million €, limit is set to 200k €, engine is availlable, renew date is set to 5
17:33<SigHunter>when i send them to depot they drive in and out without anything happening
17:33<Wolf01>maybe they are lazy
17:34<@planetmaker>savegame?
17:34<@Alberth>try it manually?
17:34<SigHunter>Alberth: you mean send to depot and then press that "renew button"? doesnt do anything either
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17:35<SigHunter>planetmaker: is this setting savegame dependant?
17:35<SigHunter>it was disabled but i enabled it later with rcon
17:35<@planetmaker>yes, fo course.
17:35<SigHunter>crap
17:35<@planetmaker>changing it in the main menu won't change it ingame
17:35<@planetmaker>only for newly started games
17:35<@Alberth>SigHunter: No, I mean drive in, drag/drop the engine yourself
17:35<SigHunter>and even not with rcon?
17:36<@Alberth>not if you loaded the game after that
17:36<@planetmaker>it's a setting every player can set themselves in MP
17:36<@planetmaker>so no rcon needed
17:36<@Alberth>but look in the settings to see its status
17:36<@planetmaker>thus rcon will be ineffective. It's a per-company setting
17:37<SigHunter>i dont know why i tried it that weird way
17:37<SigHunter>just set it in advanced settings and it works :D
17:37<SigHunter>thought it was some kind of serverside setting
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17:53<Wolf01>"oil refinery decreases production essentially"... what?
17:54<@Alberth>'essentially' is not in the current language files here
17:54<Wolf01>ecs
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17:59<@Alberth>I found ecs way too demanding to be much fun
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18:02<@planetmaker>Wolf01, he probably means eventually (instead of essentially)
18:03<@Alberth>good night
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18:15<Wolf01>good night too
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18:18<CR7>portuga
18:18<CR7>
18:18<CR7>?
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18:56<Eddi|zuHause>http://i.imgur.com/WBTEwKs.jpg
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19:02<__ln__>might be photoshopped
19:05<Eddi|zuHause>WHAT?!? i was so sure it was a real photo :/
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---Logclosed Wed Mar 13 00:00:26 2013