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#openttd IRC Logs for 2013-03-25

---Logopened Mon Mar 25 00:00:46 2013
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03:35<plantain>is there a channel here to talk about FIRS?
03:36<V453000>most likely :)
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03:37<plantain>I notice the wiki page references a manual
03:37<plantain>but I can't find such a manual
03:38<V453000>not aware of a firs manual either
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04:22<dihedral>greetings
04:23<V453000>elo
04:33<peter1139>brrr
04:34<V453000>moo
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04:52*dihedral pets the cow
04:53*V453000 is happy
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05:04<@Terkhen>good morning
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05:11<V453000>moo
05:11<V453000>rning
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05:13*V453000 demands to be pat
05:15<V453000>or else
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06:10*planetmaker pats V453000 ;-) and says 'good morning everyone'
06:10<V453000>:P hi
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06:35<dihedral>i need some milk for my coffee ... V453000 ...?
06:36<peter1139>no
06:39<V453000>I didnt say I am a female cow.
06:39<V453000>:)
06:39<V453000>still want my milk?
06:39<peter1139>by definition a cow is female
06:40<dihedral>that must come as a shock to you, V453000
06:40<dihedral>you have no balls :-D
06:40<V453000>duno I always thought cow is the general term which could include bulls eventually
06:41<dihedral>after a sex change, yes
06:41<V453000>transsexual cow, amazing
06:41<V453000>:D
06:41<TinoDidriksen>Bovine is the general term, I think.
06:41<V453000>WELL, cow is confused so no milk
06:42<TinoDidriksen>Hm, or oxen.
06:43<TinoDidriksen>Oh, wrong twice. They're called cattle.
06:43<V453000>Also, I am a special species of a T-Rex Cow. Eggs only
06:44<dihedral>so you can stand straight while walking up mountains?
06:44<V453000>pretty much
06:45<V453000>never tried too many mountains though, spent most of my life in frosch's garage
06:48<peter1139>hmm
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06:48<peter1139>can i have some of what V453000's smoking? it sounds interesting
06:49<V453000>where did you think NUTS comes from
06:49<V453000>aint got no smoking though :(
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07:04<dihedral>it must be in the air ...
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07:47<@planetmaker>plantain, this is the channel to talk about FIRS
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08:23<HellTiger>any advice how to transport pasengers? maybe only with transfare station?
08:23<HellTiger>from one big city to other big city
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08:28<dihedral>planes
08:29<andythenorth>trains
08:29<andythenorth>automobiles
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08:34*ToBeFree suggests trains, preferably on a straight line from A to B, Maglev, with a length of at least 12 fields
08:34<ToBeFree>should be the most profitable way of transporting passengers in vanilla OpenTTD afaik
08:35<ToBeFree>oh, and build the stations *inside* a city if possible;
08:35<ToBeFree>you might need to sacrifice some trees to do that
08:37<ToBeFree>airplanes suck if trains are used correctly, imho
08:38<__ln__>the whole idea of a jet engine is that it sucks in one end
08:38<ToBeFree>xD
08:38<HellTiger>i mean
08:39<HellTiger>i have to transport them as far as possible?
08:39<HellTiger>ToBeFree?
08:47<ToBeFree>?
08:47<ToBeFree>oh
08:47<ToBeFree>depends on what you want to do
08:48<ToBeFree>if you want to get some money, the distance isn't too important, you will get money anyway and using trains already gives you nice profit
08:49<ToBeFree>if you are extremely rich and have a fast train with nearly 100% reliability, use it for a passenger transport over the whole map.^^
08:50<ToBeFree>to get 100%, I would suggest using only trains, but the distance is not too important as long as you get a minimum profit of x (I think this was ~20.000€; look at the detailed performance rating)
08:51<ToBeFree>getting 100% with trains is quite failsafe but becomes boring before you reached your goal, I think, however
08:52<ToBeFree>you might want to add something like the ECS vectors to make it more interesting
08:53<HellTiger>ecs vectors?!
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09:09<andythenorth>always station walk city stations
09:09<andythenorth>use CHIPS, I made tiles in it for doing station walks :P
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09:39<@Belugas>hello
09:40<dck42>hey guys - little problem occured here: I installed ur RC3 yesterday by downloading the deb for Ubuntu precise i386 and installing it through the software manager on Ubuntu 12.04 LTS.
09:40<dck42>result: everything worked fine and I played a while, but my whole unity desktop was gone after reboot!
09:41<dck42>I had to reinstall all using "apt-get purge lightdm" and "apt-get install lightdm ubuntu-desktop"
09:41<dck42>"dpkg-reconfigure lightdm" or using "gdm" was NOT working
09:42<HellTiger>sounds pretty serious
09:42<HellTiger>ToBeFree: where is this detailed performance rating
09:43<dck42>yeah - no damage done but wondering how this happened - I guess ottd is installing some display manager?
09:46<HellTiger>dck42: i wont think so
09:46<HellTiger>maybe openttd need a special dependency wich force you to use parts of a other displaymanager or so
09:46<HellTiger>just a idea
09:46<HellTiger>then it tried to fix it
09:46<HellTiger>wich results in uninstalling :D
09:47<HellTiger>you can try debian some day. most of them didnt like the fork ubuntu
09:47<Eddi|zuHause>dck42: sure it's not just you doing something completely unrelated and then forgetting about it?
09:47<dck42>mh
09:49<dck42>Eddi: yes pretty sure I think. I installed it, played it, nothing more. Also there was an error reported by the software manager during installation, but no specifics, just "An error occured". But since all worked I thought, "ok, never mind"
09:50<Eddi|zuHause>dck42: is there some test mode where you can list all the changes it's going to do when you try to install it?
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09:51<Eddi|zuHause>might be some obscure dependency going haywire
09:51<Eddi|zuHause>but i have no further knowledge about this stuff
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09:53<dck42>Eddi: yes that would be nice, but not sure how to preview changes for a "deb" file in Ubuntu
09:54<dck42>Helltiger: I agree that Unity is a cancer!
09:54<dck42>but Ubuntu I like
09:54<HellTiger>hm if you like ubuntu you can just install debian
09:54<HellTiger>and some kdm/kde or gdm/gnome you like
09:54<dck42>:)
09:55<HellTiger>but debian is always a bit behind :|
09:55<HellTiger>for some games it isnt that good
09:55<HellTiger>even some QT didnt work cause its to old
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09:58<dck42>I consider Debian being the "pro" Linux
10:00<dck42>but to be honest I kind of migrated to the "dumbest possible user" side, I just dont wonna spend time with my OS, I just wonna click pretty icons and thats it :)
10:01<V453000>you cant say that in this channel! Or unicorn penguins will eat you
10:01<dck42>haha :)
10:02<Flygon>Voraphillic unicorn penguins...
10:02<Flygon>It is my duty, as a furry, to see this drawn!
10:03*Flygon runs off to the shadows, once more
10:08<dck42>mmhhh that leaves me puzzled regarding the expression "to see sth drawn" - never heard that, does it mean "to see sth happen"?? :-)
10:08<dck42>does it mean the unicorn penguins are coming after me now?? ;)
10:08<V453000>given that you are a drawing freak who takes his drawings as "happening", yes
10:09<V453000>:P
10:09<HellTiger>in city info, is the max passengers number the one wich tell me how may passengers the city will accept if i deliver them?
10:09<V453000>either way penguins are coming
10:09<dck42>haha
10:09<V453000>HellTiger: no, it accepts endless amount. It is amount produced by the city
10:10<HellTiger>ah
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10:52<HellTiger>ho do i add fast to some cloned trains aditional waggons?
10:53<V453000>you dont
10:53<V453000>aka manually
10:53<V453000>if you still have them in the depot then probably quickest way is to sell them all but one and just redo it
10:54<HellTiger>ok
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10:58<HellTiger>should i focus early on valuables`?
10:59<Ristovski>HellTiger: naah, transporting valuables doesnt give you much profit
10:59<HellTiger>hmm
10:59<V453000>doesnt really matter but I dont think banks can grow anywhere to a nice production so I consider them quite worthless
10:59<Ristovski>yeah
10:59<V453000>any of the normal cargoes or even passengers or mail is a good start
11:00<HellTiger>my biggest city has now 3600
11:00<HellTiger>people.
11:00<Ristovski>coal -> power plant is the quickest way to make profit imo, to it's best with trains
11:00<HellTiger>yes
11:00<V453000>if you do a goods route well, it isnt too far behind
11:00<V453000>but yes coal is easiest
11:01<Ristovski>I have 4 billion on my server from like 5 planes, 13 trains and 2 boats xD
11:01<Ristovski>all trains are transporting coal, so yeah, go with that
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11:02<V453000>money is irellevant after about 30 minutes of playing
11:03<Ristovski>yeah
11:04<V453000>if your settings is expensive then perhaps longer than 30 minutes, but the logic stays the same, you just waste more time by waiting for having money
11:04<Zuu>In a current game there is a section with double tracks that adds up to 8 tracks for a strong slope up to the factory which is at the top of a mountain. Thats more fun for me than making money on a uniform coal transporting train fleet. :-)
11:04<V453000>:)
11:05<Ristovski>lol
11:06<Zuu>In this game I also play by the rule "make simple level intersections and only expand when the capacity is reached for the current solution"
11:06<Ristovski>hmm, are there any color codes for the multiplayer chat?
11:06<V453000>why would you ever expand when it isnt needed zuu :D
11:06<Ristovski>since ottd has like 16 colors
11:07<V453000>each company has its own colour name in chat?
11:07<Zuu>V453000: Because some like to make double track solutions with lots of tracks and no trains. Or to make symetric solutions without caring about that the demand is not symetric.
11:08<Zuu>Yes, each company uses its own color in the chat
11:08<Ristovski>V453000: I know that
11:09<Zuu>Although that is just the company/player name that get colored. The message remain in white IIRC.
11:09<Zuu>Unless I play with my patched OpenTTD version that color code town names and allow clicking on them. :-)
11:11<V453000>colourful message would not keep quite good readability im afraid :P
11:12<Zuu>Indeed, IIRC each OpenTTD client will reject color codes in received chat messages. So any such thing needs a modified client.
11:12<Ristovski>ah
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12:06<Zuu>Hmm the acronym of StoryPageItemType doesn't sound too good.
12:07<@Rubidium>is spet better?
12:07<Zuu>A bit better
12:07<V453000>Etem?
12:07<V453000>:P
12:07<Zuu>Element?
12:07<@Rubidium>or entry?
12:07<@Rubidium>or sppt (paragraph)
12:08<Zuu>If a goal or location can be a paragraph.
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12:09<Zuu>sppt - page part
12:11<Zuu>Why does naming always get in the way of coding :-p
12:12<V453000>just call it YAT yet another thing
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12:25<HellTiger>now after some basics, whats about multiplayer? do you just build/detroy in the way other players?
12:26<HellTiger>i think its not turn based :D
12:26<V453000>on my end, I always try to disturb others as low as possible
12:26<V453000>and I enforce that behaviour on our server accordingly
12:27<V453000>solves all issues with people raging who was where first
12:27<V453000>apart from having generally nice, friendly and peaceful environment
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12:51<LordAro>heyo
12:59<HellTiger>can i fast replace railway to powered railway?
13:01<frosch123>the icon on the right
13:06<HellTiger>frosch123: then all connected will converted complete?
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13:08<frosch123>it's an area drag tool
13:08<frosch123>http://wiki.openttd.org/Convert_rail
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13:11<HellTiger>ah.
13:11<HellTiger>i forgot i could make huge rectangle
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13:35<HellTiger>hm. i try to replace trains, diesel to electric, i send all my trains to depot, converted all rail (with one over map square) now i start replacing, nothing happens, so i launched them all together over train list, still no replacing!
13:35<HellTiger>they just driving as diesel
13:35<HellTiger>pretty long in fast forward.
13:36<HellTiger>frosch123! :>
13:36<ToBeFree>you need to tell the game which replacement you want
13:36<ToBeFree>and imho, don't ping random people ;-)
13:36<ToBeFree>1. open the vehicle list
13:36<ToBeFree>2. click the replacement icon
13:37<ToBeFree>3. select the replacement and enable it
13:37<ToBeFree>done, now send them all to the depot for maintenance
13:38<ToBeFree>oh, and check if the maintenance is blocked by the "minimum money" option in Advanced settings
13:38<ToBeFree>iirc, the default is at ~200.000€, so if you have less, the replacement order is ignored
13:38<HellTiger>i had start the replace over the list
13:39<HellTiger>picked the two train types
13:39<HellTiger>but it didnt worked yet
13:41<ToBeFree>how much money do you have?
13:41<HellTiger>1,6 millioin tokai|noir
13:41<HellTiger>ToBeFree: i mean.
13:42<HellTiger>EURO
13:42<ToBeFree>1,6 millions of anything should be enough afaik
13:42<HellTiger>i try now
13:42<ToBeFree>except Yen maybe
13:42<HellTiger>first convert trains to electric
13:42<ToBeFree>^^
13:42<HellTiger>then convert rails
13:42<ToBeFree>no; the order shouldn't matter
13:42<ToBeFree>if it doesn't work, there is another problem
13:43<HellTiger>now they are waiting all in depot
13:43<HellTiger>replacement should work, it worked all the time for steam to diesel
13:43<HellTiger>i know how it works, but for now i can imaginate
13:43<HellTiger>trains have to leave rails and cant go back
13:43<HellTiger>until rails are converted to electric
13:45<HellTiger>hmmm no i even cant convert them back to steam
13:46<HellTiger>also last time they replaced automaticly, i didnt needed to send them to depot.
13:47<HellTiger>i forgot the waggon replace
13:49<HellTiger>on some train types the convert without further actions wont work
13:49<HellTiger>i can fall back to steam and diesel, wagon replace on,
13:49<HellTiger>but the same mechanic didnt work for electric.
13:51<HellTiger>hm now it works sorry.
13:51<HellTiger>take much time even in fast forward.
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14:12<Zuu>Will anyone want to use a generic (and translated) page title: "Page {NUM}" in their Story Book or will everyone use a custom title that they need to ofer translations for themself?
14:13<Zuu>Currently I have code for a generic page title but feels like removing it as most users probably want to use their custom titles anyway.
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14:45<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r25122 trunk/src/lang/catalan.txt (2013-03-25 18:45:10 UTC)
14:45<@DorpsGek>-Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
14:45<@DorpsGek>catalan - 1 changes by arnau
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15:13<HellTiger>do signales change if i upgrade to powered rails?
15:14<HellTiger>they react different.
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15:49<Wolf01>hello
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15:55<HellTiger>man i love games with console.
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16:00<frosch123>did you try xterm? :)
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16:07<HellTiger>frosch123: i use screen under windows with cygwin
16:08<HellTiger>doing backup and sync stuff with rsync
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16:27<Zuu>HellTiger: Signals have the same function independent of track type
16:27<HellTiger>ok
16:27<Zuu>You can even use a maglev track to rely a signal from one part of your tracks to another part.
16:29<Zuu>The check if a block is occupied do not care about track types. Thus maglev can be used like a signal cable when you use regular tracks.
16:29<Zuu>(if you do insane stuff with block based signals)
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16:37<HellTiger>to highskill right now
16:37<HellTiger>still having much fun with basics
16:37<HellTiger>i started about 30 times or so
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17:00<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r25123 trunk/src/widget.cpp (2013-03-25 20:59:59 UTC)
17:00<@DorpsGek>-Fix: when the count for a scrollbar was 0, the inter distance was subtracted too much causing a scrollbar with a negative size
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17:03<andythenorth>lo
17:07<Zuu>Alternative B is starting to work now: http://devs.openttd.org/~zuu/goal-gui/story-book-alternative-b.png
17:07<Zuu>I "just" need to work on rendering of location/goals and detecting cilicks. :-)
17:08<Zuu>The image above use the same structure as posted yesterday in this image: https://secure.openttd.org/wiki/images/e/ea/Alternative-b-and-c.png
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17:10<Zuu>People who use scroll wheels, when a list have content (eg. images) that cause some lines to have a different line height, is it still prefered that the scroll bar works in steps of a normal line height?
17:11<Zuu>I have one option to allocate height for goals/locations in multiple of line_height. That however could give silly results in some combinations of GUI zoom and text size.
17:12<Zuu>Another option is to compute the total height in pixels and then divide by line_height to get an aproximate number of line-equivalents to pass to the scrollbar as how many lines tall the content is.
17:12<V453000>o_O
17:13<Zuu>The later may cause cut of lines at the bottom of the window.
17:13<Zuu>(which is common outside of OpenTTD, but is not used in other OpenTTD windows to my knownledge)
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17:15<Zuu>Hello V453000 :-)
17:15<V453000>hi :)
17:15<Wolf01>the first would be good, as match with TT style, but I know how much work there is behind, the second one is fixable by adding the remainder to the last interval after the division
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17:16<Zuu>The first works if images are about a multiple of the line height or slightly smaller.
17:18<Zuu>What will look silly is if the image is slightly taller than X * line_height. Especially if X == 1.
17:21<Zuu>I think I'll go for the first solution now. As you say it is closer to the TT style. If it sucks it can be changed later.
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17:36<HellTiger>i still dont understand this station hopping, how far is it possible?
17:39<andythenorth>there is an advanced setting for maximum station spread
17:39<andythenorth>that controls how big a station can be / how far you can walk one
17:43<HellTiger>ah
17:43<HellTiger>thx
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17:49<andythenorth>FIRS translations? o_O
17:49<andythenorth>April 1 gets nearer...
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17:50<V453000>andythenorth: wtf translation to be done? or ? :D
17:51<andythenorth>V453000: http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/nightlies/LATEST/translations/
17:51<andythenorth>oh looky, bundles built the documenation (prototype) :o
17:51<andythenorth>http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/nightlies/LATEST/docs/set_overview.html
17:51<andythenorth>:)
17:51<V453000>ho :)
17:52<V453000>hmmm czech not too complete, but I really, really, really do not want to do that :(
17:52<frosch123>night
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17:56<V453000>me too, bai
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17:58<Superuser>help
17:58<Superuser>help please
17:58<Superuser>http://wiki.openttd.org/Console#Server_commands
17:59<Superuser>aaanyone here
17:59<Fira>nope
18:00<Superuser>I need someone to help me with this server business
18:02<Superuser>oh nvm
18:02<Superuser>sorry for disturbing you
18:02<Superuser>I underestimated the power and ease of use of the OpenTTD server application
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18:07<Wolf01>'night
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18:09<HellTiger>how often you generate world until you pick it :P
18:10<HellTiger>there was some where a time based profit table for a unit i think,
18:10<HellTiger>cant remember
18:14<dck42>guys, can I ask a dumb question? (of course Im gonna ask it anyways, but I wanted to draw some attention)
18:15<dck42>the whole openttd team, the ways its organised in sub-projects etc - how did that originate? More specifically: if I want to try to establish sth similar for a web idea, where would u start?
18:15<andythenorth>it's not dumb
18:16<andythenorth>it's not a simple answer though
18:16<dck42>thx :)
18:16<Superuser>define web idea, dck42
18:16<andythenorth>afaict, a lot of the ottd 'team' came together via tt-forums
18:16<Superuser>tyou want to start an open source project?
18:16<Superuser>that relates to the WWW?
18:17<dck42>web idea: implementing a web app for some kind of creative exchange
18:17<dck42>yes www
18:17<dck42>yes
18:17<dck42>(@ Superuser)
18:17<Superuser>lol, irc is not twitter but thanks
18:17<andythenorth>you need a team to build the app?
18:17<andythenorth>or to be the people on the exchange?
18:17<Superuser>basically, you can find an artist in a day
18:17<Superuser>programmers for an open source project, not so easy
18:18<dck42>well yes, its about gathering a team but also about finding a neat way to organise it and keep it alive
18:18<Superuser>I'd recommend the book Open Ideas by Lydia Pintscher though
18:18<Superuser>and other open source notables
18:18<Superuser>oh Open Advice my bad
18:18<Superuser>http://open-advice.org/
18:18<Superuser>absolute gold for what you wanna do, free dl as well
18:19<dck42>mh ok thx for that already - a platform (sth like crowdsourcing) to originate such a cooperative u know of?
18:19<dck42>ok!
18:19<Superuser>crowdsourcing... what do you mean by that?
18:20<dck42>:) I mean there are countless pages for gathering money or ideas for a project - is there sth more or less well known for gathering ppl to implement an open source project?
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18:22<Superuser>oh uhh sort of
18:22<Superuser>there is openhatch
18:22<Superuser>but that's for really big projects
18:22<Superuser>like the python programming language, though that's had mixed success on there due to the high barrier of entry (C, plus it's a goddamn programming language)
18:23<Superuser>other than that GitHub is becoming the de facto source code host
18:23<Superuser>I feel its interface is very conductive to attracting developers
18:23<Superuser>e.g. showing you the code and languages upfront
18:24<dck42>mh mh i c - I kind of did not feel it could draw ppl to ur project but perhaps? The thing is I wouldnt need too many. Two more programmers, 1 artist and 3-4 support admins
18:24<dck42>sth like that to start with
18:25<Superuser>are you involved in any open source project already? You could try asking them (or programmer friends)
18:25<dck42>heck u could even start with just one more guy and keep graphics to minimum
18:25<Superuser>that works very well
18:25<Superuser>as for graphic designers (that's what you mean by artists, right? Unless you're doing a game) DeviantArt is your go-to place
18:25<Superuser>you can find an artist in a day I said
18:25<Superuser>as for support admins you will probably have to pay ;_;
18:26<dck42>well the thing is: im a scientific programmer at a university (c++) and all my friends and colleagues feel like sth like this would be... dunno, below their radar
18:26<Superuser>oh god C++
18:26<Superuser>THE HORROR
18:26<dck42>haha
18:26<Superuser>protip: don't use C++ for your webapp ;_;
18:26<Superuser>that said, hmm
18:26<dck42>yes C++, multi-inheritance cp11 project
18:26<Superuser>you identified a gap there
18:27<Superuser>what about a C++ web framework
18:27<Superuser>they are more or less nonexistent, or at least, they are not very good
18:27<dck42>nah im using code igniter to build a small hirarchical mvc framework for my web app
18:27<dck42>its neat but its hard to do all on ur own
18:28<Superuser>interesting
18:28<Superuser>but yeah read that book, it's short
18:28<Superuser>I read it on my phone while commuting
18:28<dck42>ok im gonna! Im kind of missing the insider knowledge and feelin where to get some ppl who are interested and decent programmers
18:28<Superuser>get FBReader off the Play Store if you have an Android device, you will be sooo much stamrter
18:29<Superuser>I would suggest that book, has everything you need to know about organising a project
18:29<Superuser>and some seemingly unrelated parts like how to read a traceback lol
18:29<Superuser>but it's good
18:29<dck42>:-)
18:29<dck42>well tracebacks u know well if u use cpp :)
18:30<dck42>no better language to implement almost untraceable mem leaks
18:30<Superuser>but yeah 5/5 book, most important section I find was the one about the person's failed project
18:30<Superuser>he set up a website, contribution guides, stuff like that
18:30<Superuser>wanted to make a powepoint-like program
18:30<Superuser>and had a design doc, everything...
18:30<Superuser>EXCEPT CODE
18:31<Superuser>so make sure that when you launch, you have some code to go with it
18:31<Superuser>I think the Discourse launch was an exemplary one
18:31<Superuser>they had a demo up
18:31<dck42>interesting
18:31<Superuser>heard of Discourse? Or 'Forum 2.0'
18:31<dck42>no
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18:32<Superuser>it's by Jeff Attwood
18:32<Superuser>so yeah for your mvc framework you want to have example code and stuff
18:33<Superuser>when you announce it
18:33<dck42>mh yes interesting - I know of such an example too, I think the problem is u should not and cannot start until u have some base code and at least one programmer
18:34<dck42>but that would be given in my case
18:36<Superuser>because... you are the programmer? lol
18:36<dck42>basically I have my HMVC and some base modules - now I would give out the modules and say work on their code or create some new missing modules. Later u would give out the graphic stuff and language files in the same way.
18:36<dck42>yes ;)
18:37<dck42>The only thing that really makes me worry is the frontend: AJAX stuff.. somehow I feel that the "view" part in an mvc is still quiet messy and interlinked with the rest and doing AJAX stuff means u need deep knowledge of the "model" part etc
18:38<dck42>I think finding a fronted person will be very very hard
18:38<dck42>And I have no clue of javascript, jquery and alike - and I dont wonna learn it
18:39<@planetmaker>dck42, it all started with a person eager enough and with enough time at his hands to get something working
18:39<@planetmaker>and being open enough about what he did, allowing others to chime in
18:39<Superuser>yeah JS is awful :(
18:40<@planetmaker>the rest grew.
18:40<Superuser>though if you can understand cpp it should be no trouble, hehe
18:40<Superuser>dart is nice
18:40<Superuser>it compiles down to js
18:40<Superuser>and introduces lots of features
18:40<Superuser>Google Dart, 5/5
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18:41<Superuser>* especially if you know Java or Smalltalk
18:41<Superuser>or something smalltalk-like like Ruby, it is heavily OO like that
18:41<Superuser>TL;DR: JavaScript is quickly becoming the assembly language of the web
18:42<Superuser>everyone is writing assembly... but very few people directly (jQuery reimplements like half the language anyway)
18:46<dck42>yes interesting thoughts Superuser
18:47<dck42>planetmaker: yes ur right - Im kind of missing the time to do all I guess. But we'll see
18:48<Superuser>well, most open source projects are one man projects for a while
18:48<Superuser>unless you can put at least half the effort in yourself... no cigar
18:48<Superuser>if you're new to open source I'd suggest contributing to someone else's project so you get a feel for the development model
18:49<Superuser>like something you use every day, that's the best one
18:49<Superuser>for instance, the best chess site on the net (http://lichess.org - fully free, no ads, anonymous play, fully open source)
18:50<Superuser>(and so HTML5 it hurts - backend = Scala + Play framework - used to use PHP with Symfony2 but it didn't scale well at all)
18:50<Superuser>ok that's enough plugging of lichess :)
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18:53<Zuu>Oh, and there we go: http://devs.openttd.org/~zuu/goal-gui/story-book-alternative-b-2.png :-)
18:54<Zuu>Clicking anywhere on the lines occupied by an item will trigger its action.
18:54<Zuu>Maybe it should have horizontal lines as to get a more TTD-ish look.
18:55<Superuser>wow
18:55<Superuser>is that for real or just am ockup
18:55<Zuu>It is real
18:56<Superuser>also it would be 5/5 if goals can be named
18:56<Superuser>omg i came
18:56<dck42>hm hm :) I definitely feel it would be nice to help out other projects first - but there we go with the time issue again :)
18:56<Superuser>when is that feature coming
18:56<Zuu>Superuser: As soon as it is done, reviewed and ready to be included
18:57<Superuser>will it be possible to name goals?
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18:57<Zuu>Goals can be named currently
18:57<Zuu>I mean in trunk.
18:58<Zuu>The progress thingy and ability to mark goals as done is a patchc that floats around at the bottom of my goal-GUI patch queue.
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18:59<Zuu>While I could include the second column in the Story book, it might be enough to just have a different icon for completed goals.
19:02<Superuser>omg omg omg omg help
19:03<Superuser>how can I set parameters for a server hgame
19:03<Superuser>like for map generation
19:03<Superuser>we want to start a new game as it is kind of f****d up on a 256 * 256 map
19:04<Superuser>how can I set different parameters for map generation? only the dedicated server works btw, dunno why
19:04<Superuser>well, this is 1.23, but basically I've run it through the terminal and it tries to set up an IPv6 connection when creating a server from the GUI. It does this with the -D flag too, but then it moves on to IPv4
19:05<Superuser>_______________________________________________
19:05<Superuser>so how do I set parameters for map generation on the server?
19:06<dck42>bb guys thx for the advice!
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19:09<andythenorth>bye
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19:15<Zuu>Superuser: If you apply patch 10, 20 and 30 you will have the functionality shown earlier: http://devs.openttd.org/~zuu/goal-gui/ . To actually use it you will also need a GS that add pages and page elements to the pages.
19:16<Zuu>It might work out of the box without patch 10 for the moment.
19:17<Superuser>so uhh
19:17<Superuser>do you have an answer to my question Zuu? ^^
19:18<Zuu>About map generation parameters?
19:18<Superuser>yes
19:19<Zuu>Make a map on your client, save it and upload to the server. That is usually the easiest way. But if you think you found a bug, try with trunk or see if the bug has been reported. If not report it to bugs.openttd.org.
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19:24<Superuser>ok thx
19:24<Superuser>you are a baws
19:39<Superuser>hey umm Zuu sorry to be an ass, but how can you change starting money
19:39<Superuser>and maximum denbs allowed
19:39<Superuser>debts*
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19:39<Zuu>Its in the advanced settings in 1.3 / trunk.
19:39<Zuu>For 1.2.3 you find it in the difficulty settings.
19:40<Superuser>ok thanks bro
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---Logclosed Tue Mar 26 00:00:50 2013