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#openttd IRC Logs for 2013-05-19

---Logopened Sun May 19 00:00:20 2013
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01:12<V453000>hm for some reason I had some higher hopes for the finnish train set, but it is just another realistic train set without gameplay structure
01:14<V453000>the starting steamers seem to be nice though, some stronger but slower one, some faster ones
01:15<V453000>well it isnt that bad
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01:15<V453000>a better train every 10 years is actually quite good
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01:17<V453000>oh, 60+ unit capacity wagons
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01:56<@Alberth>good morning
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02:49<@Terkhen>good morning
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03:33<@peter1138>leaving .pt in an hour :(
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04:28<apiecux>is it possible to set a special color for trains of a group?
04:30<@planetmaker>not directly. But possibly you can do so for different types of trains
04:46<apiecux>do you think this is easy to patch?
04:46<apiecux>as it is already possible to set different colors for different type of vehicles on a same company
04:51<@planetmaker>well. Depends on how you approach that, I guess
04:52<@planetmaker>The concept of train groups possibly would need a bit more improvement, but... one cannot tell till one tries :-)
04:53<apiecux>ok, I'll try to code that
04:53<apiecux>do you think there will be difficulties to store that information in saves?
04:53<@planetmaker>apiecux, it might be worth to dig a bit through forums. There migth be one or two patches which deal in different ways with train groups
04:54<@planetmaker>It must be stored in savegames
04:54<@Alberth>I think having better train groups would be useful for many things
04:56<@planetmaker>and I don't see any particular difficulty in storing that info in savegames.
05:01<apiecux>ok nice
05:01<apiecux>also, I would like to set names to trains
05:01<apiecux>I guess it isn't possible currently?
05:01<@planetmaker>you guess wrongly
05:02<apiecux>oh yes!
05:04<apiecux>it was hidden:)
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05:06<@DorpsGek>Commit by planetmaker :: r25252 trunk/src/lang/english.txt (2013-05-19 09:06:24 UTC)
05:06<@DorpsGek>-Change: Clarify the meaning of the server advertisement settings
05:07<@DorpsGek>Commit by planetmaker :: r25253 /trunk/src (lang/english.txt network/network_gui.cpp) (2013-05-19 09:07:43 UTC)
05:07<@DorpsGek>-Codechange: Rename the strings of the advertisement settings to better reflect what they do
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05:08<@DorpsGek>Commit by planetmaker :: r25254 /trunk/src/lang (57 files in 2 dirs) (2013-05-19 09:08:50 UTC)
05:08<@DorpsGek>-Cleanup: Remove the changed / unused strings from translations
05:14<@planetmaker>^ went for your way to updating strings, Alberth ;-)
05:15<@planetmaker>the night's sleep told me that it will result in better translations
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07:28<Wolf01>hi o/
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10:02<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r25255 /branches/1.3/projects (4 files) (2013-05-19 14:02:50 UTC)
10:02<@DorpsGek>[1.3] -Fix: forgot running project/generate for the newly added languages
10:06<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r25256 /trunk (6 files in 3 dirs) (2013-05-19 14:06:26 UTC)
10:06<@DorpsGek>-Add: small matrix type (like vector, but for matrices) (fonsinchen)
10:11<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r25257 /trunk (11 files in 4 dirs) (2013-05-19 14:11:20 UTC)
10:11<@DorpsGek>-Add: basic link graph (fonsinchen)
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10:17<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r25258 /trunk (9 files in 3 dirs) (2013-05-19 14:17:02 UTC)
10:17<@DorpsGek>-Codechange: save linkgraph (fonsinchen)
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10:18<FLHerne>Hmm. Is CargoDist going to be in 1.4 then? :D
10:18<+glx>nobody said that
10:19<FLHerne>glx: All the linkgraph commits rather imply some form of cargo destinations, presumably the one that the files come from? :P
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10:21<@Rubidium>FLHerne: oh, like implicit orders?
10:22<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r25259 /trunk/src (18 files in 2 dirs) (2013-05-19 14:22:04 UTC)
10:22<@DorpsGek>-Codechange: track capacities and usage of links
10:22<FLHerne>Rubidium: Perhaps I'm just wildly optimistic, but you do seem to be putting in a lot of the stuff from the CDist patch :-)
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10:23<FLHerne>I remember those files being added by CDist, because I kept forgetting to svn add them after applying the patch :P
10:24<@Rubidium>FLHerne: yeah... started with it in 2009
10:25<@Rubidium>@commit 17739
10:25<@DorpsGek>Rubidium: Commit by rubidium :: r17739 trunk/src/cargopacket.cpp (2009-10-07 17:46:58 UTC)
10:25<@DorpsGek>Rubidium: -Cleanup: compiler didn't warn about an unused variable, fonsinchen did
10:26<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r25260 /trunk/src (date_type.h station_cmd.cpp) (2013-05-19 14:26:14 UTC)
10:26<FLHerne>Rubidium: I can speculate in an uninformed manner anyway, and continue to be hopeful :P
10:26<@DorpsGek>-Codechange: occasionally clear dead links and compress link graphs (fonsinchen)
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10:30<@planetmaker>hallo ;-)
10:30<Kibyts>wie jetzt?
10:30<Kibyts>ah, sorry :D
10:30<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r25261 /trunk (7 files in 3 dirs) (2013-05-19 14:30:40 UTC)
10:30<@DorpsGek>-Add: abstract implementation of linkgraph overlay for GUI (fonsinchen)
10:30<Kibyts>Hallo sonds really german :P
10:31<@planetmaker>even is, yes. Still, this is an English channel
10:31<Kibyts>no problem :)
10:31<Kibyts>is any cargodist developper here?
10:32<Kibyts>and planetmaker please don't send me back to :D
10:33<@planetmaker>I won't
10:33<Kibyts>Because we want to try this mod, but get desync errors the whole time. Now I got told that I might find someone in this channel that could halp...
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10:34<@planetmaker>better describe your problem in detail... what CD version, for instance will be very helpful to know :-)
10:34<@planetmaker>is it reproducable?
10:35<Kibyts>yes, it is reproducable - we are trying it for 3 weeks now using different Windows versions (32 & 64 bit)
10:35<Kibyts>we tested the last 3 versions
10:36<Kibyts>we tryed dedicated servers as well as client hosted servers
10:36<@Alberth>CD author does not seem to be around currently
10:36<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r25262 /trunk/src (6 files in 4 dirs) (2013-05-19 14:36:35 UTC)
10:36<Kibyts>Is there any platform where I can drop a message for him?
10:36<@DorpsGek>-Feature: linkgraph overlay for smallmap
10:37<Kibyts>DorpsGek - is this an information for me?
10:38<@Alberth>Kibyts: nope, DorpsGek is just spamming commit messages
10:38<@Alberth>Kibyts: is the usual place to contact him
10:38<@planetmaker>Dorpsgek our channel bot
10:38<@Alberth>he'll want a save game and a description how to reproduce the desync
10:38<Kibyts>Thank you :)
10:39<@planetmaker>yes, the savegame is vital for finding desyncs
10:39<Kibyts>well, it works with every game...
10:39<@planetmaker>still :-)
10:39<@Alberth>Kibyts: if it was really every game, he would have encountered it already
10:39<@planetmaker>sometimes "every game" is only "every game with exactly the same things we do"
10:40<@Alberth>ie perhaps you have a special way of making orders, or use a different way of creating them, etc
10:40<Kibyts>as soon as we connect 3 cities (only for passangers) we get the problem
10:40<Kibyts>oh, okay
10:41<@Alberth>the save game is not only for demonstrating the problem, it is also for checking that a fix actually works
10:41<@planetmaker>in any case, an existing savegame makes the part "show me" quicker than if he needs to play-test it to that point himself
10:41<@planetmaker>and... alberth is faster than me
10:41<Kibyts>sounds reasonable
10:42<@Alberth>preferably a savegame with few newgrfs, and all from bananas
10:42<@Alberth>no newgrfs is even better :)
10:42<@planetmaker>yeah... non-bananas newgrfs will need providing by some way. None is best
10:42<@Rubidium>for what it's worth, I've seen my fair share of desyncs that were "easy" and/or "always happening". However, quite often I couldn't reproduce them because it required a particular setting to be set a particular way, a specific NewGRF configuration, or what not
10:42<@planetmaker>some way likely is private forum message
10:43<@planetmaker>that's what I'm saying, Rubidium ;-)
10:43<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r25263 /trunk (11 files in 5 dirs) (2013-05-19 14:43:23 UTC)
10:43<@DorpsGek>-Add: legend for linkgraph overlay (fonsinchen)
10:43<@Alberth>ie eliminate as many sources that may cause problems, and make it as easy for fonso to reproduce your problem. That way he can quickly start working on the fix
10:44*Alberth seens to be missing a few words :)
10:44*planetmaker hands bag of words. Pick whatever you like ;-)
10:45<@Alberth>thank you :)
10:45<@Alberth>I needed a "seems" as well, it seems :)
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10:49<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r25264 /trunk/src (7 files in 3 dirs) (2013-05-19 14:49:25 UTC)
10:49<@DorpsGek>-Feature: linkgraph overlay over main viewport (fonsinchen)
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10:54<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r25265 trunk/src/lang/english.txt (2013-05-19 14:54:52 UTC)
10:54<@DorpsGek>-Fix: cargos vs cargoes inconsistency
10:58<@planetmaker>seems we should later tonight update our servers :-)
10:58<@Rubidium>I hope fonso doesn't have much problems updating, though I fear some issues
11:06<@planetmaker>many new strings :-)
11:06<@planetmaker>not exactly easy to translate in all cases
11:17<@planetmaker>hm, I find the colouring of the green part of the load density unfortunate, Rubidium. IMHO it should be reversed, from dark green to bright green
11:17<@planetmaker>would give a better transition to yellow
11:17<@planetmaker>and I'd like to have someone comment on it who has difficulties to distinguish red and green
11:18<@planetmaker>(thus maybe blue instead of red?)
11:19<@planetmaker>also, what does a gray line mean... gray is not in the legend
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11:24<@planetmaker>nice. 15 .. 20% more CPU usage with link graph enabled :-)
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11:44<@DorpsGek>Commit by glx :: r25266 trunk/config.lib (2013-05-19 15:44:09 UTC)
11:44<@DorpsGek>-Fix: gcc4.6 removed -mno-cygwin option
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12:35<@peter1138>well damn, my pc's hdd is dead :s
12:36<__ln__>it's resting
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12:37<@peter1138>in peace
12:38<FLHerne>And of course you have complete backups of everything important from within 24 hours? :D
12:38<@peter1138>but i have a separate data drive
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12:55<tuomas>Has there been game economy improvements from transport tycoon deluxy, like destinations for cargo? In TTD long routes brought the greatest profit
12:56<FLHerne>tuomas: Not yet, unless you use the CargoDist patch
12:57<FLHerne>The infrastructure maintenance costs and aircraft range change things a bit though
12:57<@planetmaker>NewGRFs can screw with cargo payment, station rating, cargo aging, maintenance costs, ... ;-)
12:57<@planetmaker>there are goal scripts as well
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13:04<tuomas>Ok. I made a rail network connecting four cities, but it is pretty sad that the best profit would come from only hauling passengers between the cities that are the farthest apart, skipping stations in between.
13:06<@planetmaker>so best profit should be from passengers within town? ;-)
13:06<@planetmaker>Would cause quite an outcry of how unrealistic and insane that is :-)
13:06<tuomas>planetmaker: The best profit should come from the line that stops at the intermediate towns too
13:07<@planetmaker>that's also unrealistic. Best profit comes from the ICE trains. Regional trains stopping at every stop are subsidised in the country I live in
13:08<tuomas>Of course, not including some super-fast line that skips stops to save passenger time
13:08<@planetmaker>yeah. They make thus best profit. As in OpenTTD :-)
13:08<tuomas>Usually they have trains that do both, ie. serve real world needs of people to go to some specific town
13:10<FLHerne>tuomas: Nothing stops you building that in OTTD, money isn't everything :P
13:11<tuomas>I also tried simutrans, it has destinations, but I can't even succesfully place a bus stop
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13:46<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r25267 /trunk/src/lang (13 files) (2013-05-19 17:46:09 UTC)
13:46<@DorpsGek>-Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:46<@DorpsGek>croatian - 20 changes by VoyagerOne
13:46<@DorpsGek>czech - 2 changes by Eskymak
13:46<@DorpsGek>english_US - 21 changes by Rubidium
13:46<@DorpsGek>faroese - 4 changes by FastNinja
13:46<@DorpsGek>finnish - 7 changes by jpx_
13:46<@DorpsGek>german - 20 changes by planetmaker
13:46<@DorpsGek>icelandic - 1 changes by Stimrol
13:46<@DorpsGek>italian - 18 changes by lorenzodv
13:46<@DorpsGek>polish - 4 changes by wojteks86
13:46<@DorpsGek>russian - 20 changes by Lone_Wolf
13:46<@DorpsGek>swedish - 21 changes by Zuu
13:46<@DorpsGek>tamil - 10 changes by aswn
13:46<@DorpsGek>vietnamese - 1 changes by nglekhoi
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15:05<__ln__>Eddi|zuHause: would you have time and/or interest to review and comment on one A4 page of bad german, comparing it to one page of english?
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15:55<@Terkhen>good night
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---Logclosed Mon May 20 00:00:21 2013