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#openttd IRC Logs for 2013-06-17

---Logopened Mon Jun 17 00:00:09 2013
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07:15<Ristovski>planetmaker: Hello, any idea why doing "make install" in opengfx dir doesnt install it?
07:24<MNIM>Eddi|zuHause: what's interesting about it?
07:25<Eddi|zuHause>MNIM: it looks exactly like a police car, but says "brewery" on it
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07:26<MNIM>ah. I thought german police cars were green-white?
07:26<Eddi|zuHause>they used to be, but some EU regulation made them switch to blue/silver
07:27<MNIM>also, that's not that uncommon - the brewery I worked at had its own fire department, with blue trucls
07:27<MNIM>a fire truck in police-y colours, with the brewery logo on it. :P
07:28<MNIM>and dammit, EU, can you not not meddle with stuff one day?
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09:00<oskari89>How about level crossing types feature by the way?
09:01<MNIM>Is that sentence even supposed to make sense?
09:01<oskari89>So one could choose level crossing type, like a bridge type, when built?
09:01<@planetmaker>Ristovski, what does "not install it" look like?
09:02<@planetmaker>and what is the OS environment you executed that command under?
09:02<oskari89>Dutch stations set has several types of level crossings, those could be made functional by that
09:02<oskari89>There's several types of Finnish level crossings too, and those would be nice :)
09:02<@planetmaker>oskari89, use the random (pseudo-)bits to show different ones ;-)
09:02<Ristovski>planetmaker: I did "hg up" to get the latest opengfx source, I compiled it, make install'ed, and openttd still says it's missing sprites, installing ot from "online content" works
09:02<Ristovski>using latest svn revision
09:02<oskari89>planetmaker: ok
09:03<oskari89>Can you use different graphics by placement year?
09:03<oskari89>With older remaining?
09:03<@planetmaker>hm... not sure about level crossings
09:03<@planetmaker>check with swedishrails
09:03<Ristovski>planetmaker: I even manually copied the built files from opengfx to the baseset folder, and still says sprites are missing
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09:03<@planetmaker>they have old and new types, oskari89
09:04<@planetmaker>but IIRC it is like switching automatically to new... so build year might not be available there
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09:04<oskari89>That would be nice :)
09:05<oskari89>More variation in level crossing graphics :P
09:05<@planetmaker>iirc the transition there is gradual from old to new. Using the 4 pseudo-random bits to avoid an all at once conversion
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09:06<@planetmaker>Ristovski, and that was also true after you restarted openttd, yes?
09:06<oskari89>planetmaker: i have 9 types of level crossing graphics ;)
09:06<Ristovski>planetmaker: Yes
09:06<oskari89>Ready to be coded
09:06<@planetmaker>oskari89, use them for different rail types
09:07<@planetmaker>e.g. one for rail, one for elrail
09:07<oskari89>Could make sense
09:07<oskari89>And the rural and non-rural gives variation also
09:07<oskari89>(City and non-city)
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09:09<@planetmaker>Ristovski, and which openttd did you use? some 1.4.0-alpha (trunk), yes?
09:09<Ristovski>planetmaker: I am using the latest svn revision
09:09<Ristovski>let me get the build number
09:10<Ristovski>planetmaker: r25420
09:10<@planetmaker>ok, and you compiled which opengfx version?
09:10<@planetmaker>was it actually successful?
09:10<Ristovski>planetmaker: It was
09:11<Ristovski>planetmaker: Again, I compiled the latest source, I am using the mercurial source
09:11<Ristovski>It works If I install the OpenGFX 0.4.7 version from online content
09:12<@planetmaker>what is 'latest'? please quote the revision. The source has two branches
09:12<@planetmaker>thus nml version used also matters
09:12<@planetmaker>whether it will compile successfully or not
09:13<@planetmaker>and what OS do you use? That's crucial info, too
09:13<Ristovski>planetmaker: I am now running Debian Wheezy, btw, how do I see what revision the OpenGFX source is?
09:14<@planetmaker>hg id
09:14<Ristovski>planetmaker: 10db0a4895e3
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09:15<Ristovski>planetmaker: And it does compile normally, I just tried it again, no errors
09:15<Ristovski>planetmaker: I found the problem, it errors out if you try to do "sudo make install", when i did just make install it worked
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09:17<@planetmaker>uh... that's not 'latest' at all the revision you built
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09:17<@planetmaker>didn't you update by chance?
09:17<Ristovski>planetmaker: I did do "hg update"
09:17<Ristovski>said it's already up-to-date
09:18<@planetmaker>hg id reported 10db0a4895e3. That's r1008, right?
09:18<@planetmaker>OpenGFX 0.4.7 is r1021 in the official repo
09:18<Ristovski>Thats weird...
09:18<Ristovski>planetmaker: How to see what repo I cloned?
09:19<@planetmaker>.hg/hgrc has the info
09:19<Ristovski>planetmaker: ""
09:19<Ristovski>Thats the official one afaik
09:20<Ristovski>Then why does it say it's the latest version when it's not?
09:22<@planetmaker>maybe automatic updating failed to to crossing branches?
09:23<Ristovski>planetmaker: How can I force it to update?
09:23<Ristovski>or should I just clone it again?
09:23<@planetmaker>hg up -C
09:25<Ristovski>planetmaker: I cloned it again
09:25<Ristovski>let me compile it and see if it works
09:27<@planetmaker>Ristovski, still... make sure you use the correct NML for the correct branch. I don't know, but I expect at least oddities when compiling the extra grf with an NML from the wrong branch
09:27<@planetmaker>though it *should* complain, if it's wrong
09:28<Ristovski>it works
09:32<Eddi|zuHause>i'm amazed and appalled at the same time how OzTranz et al. always figure out new ways to offend the community
09:36<MNIM>oh wait, wrong channel
09:37<MNIM>nevermind, nothing to see here, please keep moving
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12:58<Ristovski>Lol, only guy who has a OpenTTD series,
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13:45<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r25421 /trunk/src/lang (6 files) (2013-06-17 17:45:33 UTC)
13:45<@DorpsGek>-Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<@DorpsGek>simplified_chinese - 58 changes by siu238X
13:45<@DorpsGek>traditional_chinese - 12 changes by siu238X
13:45<@DorpsGek>galician - 6 changes by Michi
13:45<@DorpsGek>german - 3 changes by Jogio
13:45<@DorpsGek>korean - 4 changes by telk5093
13:45<@DorpsGek>thai - 54 changes by nirakanz
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14:10<George>It would be very nice to have FS#5588 provided. How hard this task is?
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14:40<@planetmaker>George, I don't feel like I can exactly answer it. But the main difficulty is the decision whether it's sensible. Or / if / how to solve the actual problem. IMHO the issue only shows a problem, not sure your suggestion is the fix
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15:03<@planetmaker>George, you're not serious about FS#5600, yes?
15:03<@planetmaker>Introduce a new vehicle
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15:04<George>planetmaker: I'm very serious
15:05<George>The change is for existing vehicles via CB36
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15:05<George>introducing now vehicles does not role at all
15:05<@planetmaker>yes. If the change is so drastical that you need to announce it via news message... it's a new vehicle
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15:06<George>The situation: there is a SS locomotive (produced in 1932-1934)
15:06<George>vehicle life is 40 years
15:07<George>In 1945 al the SS locomotives reduce their speed from80 to km/h
15:07<George>to 70
15:07<George>(reduce is more than 10%)
15:08<George>To inform a player about the problem the news message is required
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15:10<George>Of cause writing about it in a read me is not a solution - nobody reads it :)
15:11<@planetmaker>And why do they drive only 70 from 1945 onwards? That's not an engine but an operation limiation, I'd say
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15:12<@planetmaker>who reads news messages, George ? I read them less than actually readmes :-)
15:13<George>It's an operational limitation
15:13<George>And it id coded in xUSSR set
15:13<George>the questuion is to inform the player about it
15:13<@planetmaker>thus the vehicle doesn't change. It's wrong then
15:14<George>It is historical
15:14<@planetmaker>yes. But the player does operation. And buys *vehicles*. Not hires a taxi
15:14<@planetmaker>players can set a speed limit of 70km/h as operational limitation
15:15<@planetmaker>historical is to destroy half the world between 1939 and 1945
15:15<@planetmaker>it's unrealistic that the game doesn't?
15:15<@planetmaker>It's actually a design goal the game doesn't.
15:15<George>There is something like that in xUSSR - you do not get new locomotives in 1941-1945
15:16<@planetmaker>that's vehicles. Not operation
15:17<George>Anyway the speed reduce is historical and it is already coded. My request is to allow the GRF to inform the player about the change.
15:17<George>news message is the only way to do it
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15:21<@planetmaker>generally, the idea to be able to generate news events might not be bad... Problem is. CB 36 does not cut it
15:21<@planetmaker>CB 36 affects vehicles. Not models
15:21<George>Theoretically I can take one industry slot and provide 1x1 empty industry, which has 1 industry per map limitation, has high probability to be appear and have the only function to generate messages, but it is a dirty hack :(
15:21<@planetmaker>Thus every train of that type would trigger a news message. So you would... trigger 500 identical messages
15:21<@planetmaker>And you cannot have models generate it
15:21<@planetmaker>That concept doesn't exactly exist
15:22<frosch123>planetmaker: it's called purchase list :)
15:22<@planetmaker>hm :-)
15:22<George>yes, but why not to have a GENERAL message generator, that specifies what text, what type and wen to generate?
15:22<frosch123>technically it's easy. just do a monthly purchase list callback
15:22<@planetmaker>but that's only called... when purchase list is called. Thus... whenever the user opens it
15:22<@planetmaker>but hm...
15:23<frosch123>then you can make that cb trigger a news message, or even more annoying: a blue window :p
15:23<frosch123>but well, blue window does not make a lot of sense, if there is nothing to answer
15:24<@planetmaker>news message. which ends up in trigger at best :-)
15:24<@planetmaker>important to me is only "new vehicle", "accidents". That's it
15:25<@planetmaker>generally the ability to create a news message can make sense
15:26<frosch123>you use the ticker?
15:26<frosch123>i never read the ticker so disabled any of it
15:27<frosch123>i wondered about changnig the ticker to scroll vertical instead
15:27<frosch123>more like a scrolling news history or so
15:27<frosch123>like it is actually done in most modern games :p
15:27<frosch123>the slow tickering ticker is completely unreadable
15:28<frosch123>it's like reading a second, do 5 seconds something else, then catch back up :p
15:28<@planetmaker>I never read ticker either.
15:29<@planetmaker>your suggestion for change might be good. But means changing size of status bar. Kinda. Or you have not won reading time really
15:30<frosch123>it could also work like chat
15:31<frosch123>or like a tooltip
15:31<frosch123>show the complete message in normal sized font for a few seconds, then go to next one
15:31<@planetmaker>rather like chat maybe
15:31<@planetmaker>like chat is not bad
15:31<frosch123>i am not sure :p
15:32<frosch123>real chat on the left, news on the right
15:32<frosch123>might look fancy :p
15:32<frosch123>also you cannot click it
15:32<frosch123>hmm, ok, you cannot exactly click the ticker either, but you get the full news then, which you can click instead
15:34<@planetmaker>yes... seldomly used by me, though
15:35<frosch123>well, if you do not want to click it, you do not have to show it in the first place :p
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16:32<V453000>can someone please test what version is this ? [22:25] <PublicServer> V453000:
16:32<V453000>because when I unzip it, it gives 25396
16:32<V453000>tried multiple times
16:32<V453000>overwriting folders, making clean folders
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16:36<+glx>V453000: it's 25385 for me
16:36<frosch123>V453000: do you have some checksum utility on your site?
16:36<frosch123>maybe the mirrors service different files
16:37<frosch123>i.e. do you get the same file as we do :p
16:37<@DorpsGek>Commit by fonsinchen :: r25422 trunk/src/linkgraph/linkgraphjob.cpp (2013-06-17 20:37:07 UTC)
16:37<@DorpsGek>-Fix: properly initialize base capacity for paths
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16:37<@DorpsGek>Commit by fonsinchen :: r25423 trunk/src/linkgraph/linkgraphjob.h (2013-06-17 20:37:31 UTC)
16:37<@DorpsGek>-Fix: integer overflows in MCF solver
16:38<@DorpsGek>Commit by fonsinchen :: r25424 /trunk/src (3 files in 2 dirs) (2013-06-17 20:38:11 UTC)
16:38<@DorpsGek>-Fix: keep old flows around in an invalidated state to continue routing cargo if necessary
16:38<frosch123>V453000: 7703948 bytes here
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16:45<V453000>hm :o
16:46<V453000>the zip is somehow broken indeed
16:47<@planetmaker>opened too early?
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17:03<V453000>no it has 27mb
17:03<V453000>idk how
17:03<V453000>assuming I moved my openttd folder into it
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17:06<@Terkhen>good night
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---Logclosed Tue Jun 18 00:00:10 2013