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#openttd IRC Logs for 2013-07-06

---Logopened Sat Jul 06 00:00:09 2013
---Daychanged Sat Jul 06 2013
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02:34<@Terkhen>good morning
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03:16<@orudge>Rubidium: Oops, yes. Should be back now.
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03:51<Vinnie_nl>Hello, any OSX users that expierence jittering (mouse jumps/slow reactions of newgrf selections) in the multiplayer menu when they select a server? It occours in 1.3.2-RC1 and its a simple question to see if its my PC or something else.
03:52<@Alberth>sounds somewhat like the increase in CPU usage mentioned at the forums
03:53<Vinnie_nl>yes i've read that
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04:22<Wolf01>quak
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04:37<Supercheese>'night
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04:38<@Alberth>quek
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05:01<__ln__>http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/mediatechnologyandtelecoms/media/10158311/Sky-Deutschland-to-broadcast-adverts-directly-into-train-passengers-heads.html
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05:05<NGC3982>That sounds interesting.
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05:24<fonsinchen>I hate that idea
05:26<peter1139>yeah
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05:52<permagreen>Hm... it might cool to be able to boost profits by selling ads on your vehicles. Not that most players really need much of a boost in that area
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06:47<@Alberth>o/
06:47<frosch123>moin :)
06:48<Wolf01>o/
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07:26<y2000rtc>Hi all. Don't you know how I can set another parameter for vehicle of OpenTTD? I would like to have some locomotive early then is.
07:27<y2000rtc>For TTD exist tool which know set vehicle's parameter.
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07:32<@Alberth>find a nice vehicle NewGRF
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08:18<@DorpsGek>Commit by frosch :: r25564 trunk/src/gfx.cpp (2013-07-06 12:18:20 UTC)
08:18<@DorpsGek>-Add: a simple clipping rule to decide whether a string without linebreaks is visible before computing the layouting. This skips around 2/3 of layout computations in usual-sized list-like windows.
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09:45<andythenorth>the cranes in this extend beyond their tile https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/4988/DockMockup.png
09:45<andythenorth>how should I implement that?
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09:52<frosch123>the tile below shall still be traversible?
09:52<andythenorth> not essential
09:52<andythenorth>preferable though
09:52<@Alberth>looking good!
09:52<andythenorth>Dan drew it
09:52<frosch123>well, then split the crane in two parts, and make the tile below draw some of it
09:53<andythenorth>figures
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09:53<frosch123>if you make it higher, you can also draw it with the duck tile behind it
09:53<frosch123>but that does not work if the crane touches the water like in the picture
09:54<andythenorth>I'll do the tile in front
09:54<andythenorth>I can add some boats and such
09:54<frosch123>:p
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10:02<andythenorth>bbl
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12:08<alluke>is that dock going to be in chips
12:09<andythenorth>yes
12:09<andythenorth>along with salt and vinegar
12:09<andythenorth>no, it's in FIRS
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12:41<andythenorth>anyone understand how I should set station prop 11 to show pylons?
12:41<andythenorth>http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Action0/Stations#Pylon_placement_.2811.29_and_wire_placement_.2814.29
12:41<andythenorth>wtf are tile types?
12:44*andythenorth never did figure out stations
12:51<peter1139>just numbers
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12:52<andythenorth>FF would probably work for prop 11 :P
12:52<andythenorth>it bugs me I don't know why though
12:53<andythenorth>can't find an action 0 for the tiles either :)
12:53<andythenorth>CHIPS codebase was not my creation
12:54<andythenorth>hmm
12:54<andythenorth>found one
12:55<andythenorth>hmm
12:55<andythenorth>buy menu doesn't show electrified stations at all?
12:59<frosch123>depends on whether you open the elrail or normal toolbar, doesn'T it?
13:00<andythenorth>not sure :)
13:00<frosch123>hmm, otoh, since most station grfs use complete custom purchase list sprites
13:00<frosch123>that would fail
13:00<frosch123>so, likely ottd does not draw catenary
13:01<@DorpsGek>Commit by fonsinchen :: r25565 /trunk/src (3 files) (2013-07-06 17:01:31 UTC)
13:01<@DorpsGek>-Codechange: Rewrite order prediction logic to introduce proper refit prediction
13:04<andythenorth>fonsinchen: ^ if that's what I think it is, how does it handle auto-refit (any cargo)?
13:04<andythenorth>(out of interest)
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13:06<frosch123>it reports the user to openttd.org
13:07<frosch123>mind that we do nothing with the report, but the nsa inbetween will take action and visit you
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13:12<andythenorth>any station set with graphics for sacks?
13:12*andythenorth needs some
13:13<fonsinchen>It predicts future links of vehicles which are refiting at some place
13:13<fonsinchen>It does not predict "refit to available cargo". If a vehicle does that somewhere the logic just assumes it will stay the same
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13:46<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r25566 /trunk/src/lang (10 files) (2013-07-06 17:45:58 UTC)
13:46<@DorpsGek>-Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:46<@DorpsGek>catalan - 21 changes by smauleon
13:46<@DorpsGek>simplified_chinese - 11 changes by siu238X
13:46<@DorpsGek>traditional_chinese - 4 changes by siu238X
13:46<@DorpsGek>hungarian - 2 changes by IPG
13:46<@DorpsGek>japanese - 9 changes by guppy
13:46<@DorpsGek>norwegian_bokmal - 27 changes by cuthbert
13:46<@DorpsGek>polish - 1 changes by p0358
13:46<@DorpsGek>brazilian_portuguese - 2 changes by Tucalipe
13:46<@DorpsGek>slovak - 1 changes by Milsa
13:46<@DorpsGek>turkish - 63 changes by emremeydan
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14:08<alluke>andythenorth: whats the difference between chips mud platform and grain silos base tiles
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14:10<@Alberth>4 characters?
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14:11<@Alberth>Eddi|zuHause: trying to increase post count? :p
14:12<Eddi|zuHause>just too lazy to do something important, i suppose
14:14<@Alberth>re-using the same text twice is a bit suspicious ;)
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14:41<andythenorth>alluke: I don't know, is it a riddle?
14:41<y2000rtc>Hi all, sorry for my question. But don't you know if I can change some parameter on locomotive in newgrf file? I like using invisible locomotive for design but it is verry slowly. I would like to change speed on this locomotive. Exist some possibility?
14:41<Supercheese>There should be an invisible power boost engine that's not slow
14:41<Supercheese>check the newgrf parameter
14:42<y2000rtc>How supercheese? And thanks for your answer.
14:42<Supercheese>Newgrf settings -> Click Invisible Leading Engine grf -> Click "Set parameters" at the bottom-right of the window
14:42<Supercheese>(presuming you're using the "invisible leading engine" grf)
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14:43<Supercheese>you should then see the option to active the power boosting engine
14:45<y2000rtc>Ok, in parameter of grf file? I'm using invisible leading engine.grf. Is there name of parameter or I must know it?
14:45<y2000rtc>I'm going to try.
14:45<Supercheese>Once you click "set parameters", there should only be one option in the window that appears
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14:52<y2000rtc>Ok, you are right. But without change. Still slow speed.
14:53<Supercheese>You'll have to start a new game, changing the parameter in the main menu will not affect running games
14:53<y2000rtc>Parameter was changed by me but engine is still slow.
14:53<y2000rtc>Aha, ok. This is problem.
14:53<Supercheese>and also that option will enable a new engine
14:53<Supercheese>you'd have to replace the existing ones with the power boosting one
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14:54<@Alberth>just use NUTS vehicles, plenty of power :)
14:54<@DorpsGek>Commit by frosch :: r25567 /trunk/src (3 files) (2013-07-06 18:54:26 UTC)
14:54<@DorpsGek>-Codechange: Revive dead DrawStringParams as FontState.
14:55<y2000rtc>Supercheese, exist some tools for edit all parameters on engines? For example. On czech engines i would like to change year of produce engine.
14:55<Supercheese>That's possible, but not particularly easy
14:55<@DorpsGek>Commit by frosch :: r25568 trunk/src/gfx_layout.cpp (2013-07-06 18:55:38 UTC)
14:55<@DorpsGek>-Fix: Non-ICU layouter started new lines with the space which triggered the linebreak.
14:55<Supercheese>you'd have to decompile, edit NFO, and recompile with grfcodec
14:56<Supercheese>unless the sources are available, in which case you just edit then compile
14:56<@DorpsGek>Commit by frosch :: r25569 /trunk/src (3 files) (2013-07-06 18:56:23 UTC)
14:56<@DorpsGek>-Codechange: Cache all Font instances in a static container.
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14:57<Eddi|zuHause>Alberth: what do you mean?
14:57<Eddi|zuHause>Alberth: oh, it posted twice. weird
14:59<y2000rtc>Which tool must I use for decompile grf Supercheese?
14:59<Supercheese>http://www.openttd.org/download-grfcodec
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15:00<@DorpsGek>Commit by frosch :: r25570 /trunk/src (3 files) (2013-07-06 19:00:33 UTC)
15:00<@DorpsGek>-Add: cache for ParagraphLayouts.
15:05<andythenorth>hmm
15:05<andythenorth>I might remove the config file -> python step from FISH
15:05<andythenorth>config file seems over-engineered now
15:05<andythenorth>might as well just write python module for each ship IMHO
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15:06<y2000rtc>I decoded Grf file, now I have two files. Nfo and pcx. What next? How can I find right parameter for year of produce, change and encode again back.
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15:09<Supercheese>That's the tough part
15:10<Supercheese>You need to find the appropriate action0 http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Action0
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15:15<Eddi|zuHause>alternatively, you can do this tutorial http://www.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NMLTutorial (you can skip the parts about graphics, only worry about the basic syntax and the properties) and then use this http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Overriding_vehicles_in_other_NewGRFs to change the properties of other grfs (you need to find out the Vehicle IDs of the other GRF, though)
15:15<Supercheese>ah, I suppose
15:16<Eddi|zuHause>hm, my mouse is acting up...
15:17<Eddi|zuHause>double clicking when i do single clicks, letting go of things during drag&drop...
15:17<Supercheese>you've got a mouse like a rat
15:18<Eddi|zuHause>also, why is dolphin such a (relative) ressource hog? 6% while being idle and minimized
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15:23<@Alberth>it's a web browser in disguise :)
15:23<Eddi|zuHause>but konqueror doesn't have that much "idle" usage either
15:28<@Alberth>perhaps it's polling directory contents or so?
15:29<Eddi|zuHause>if so, it's doing a poor job at that either, because on my sshfs it fails to update when a new file appears
15:30<Eddi|zuHause>not to speak of the free space display, which even fails to update on normal folders
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15:31<Eddi|zuHause>next on the list of idle ressource hogs is kopete
15:32<y2000rtc>Ok, NML says You use these commands. But I have to write these command to cfg file? And how can I find ID from engine?
15:33<Eddi|zuHause>"commands" you run from a console, like on windows start->run->"cmd"
15:35<Eddi|zuHause>the other nml stuff, you write into a text file, which you rename to .nml
15:35<Eddi|zuHause>(make sure it's not ".nml.txt")
15:36<Zuu>Except, that in the later Windows versions, they've hidden 'run' quite well so that it is much easier to just hold the windows key and press R.
15:36<y2000rtc>Yes, it is no problem. I'm going to test.
15:36<Eddi|zuHause>you can also just type "cmd" in the search box of the start menu
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15:44<Zuu>yes you are right. Although that requires that the computer you currently use is fast enough to not take 5-10 seconds or more to respond to a simple start menu search.
15:45<Zuu>If you use a laptop with a non-SSD disk that has been used for some time, the start menu search is quite slow.
15:45<Supercheese>shift+right click -> select "open command window here"
15:45<Supercheese>is best, IMO
15:46<Eddi|zuHause>is that built in meanwhile?
15:46<Zuu>That is built in since win 7 or even vista.
15:46<Zuu>For XP, you had to get one of their power addons.
15:46<Zuu>(it was a free addon though)
15:46<Eddi|zuHause>yes. that one i know
15:47<Supercheese>built in on Windows 7 at least, s'what I've got
15:47<Eddi|zuHause>but i'm not really up to date with windows hidden features :)
15:47<Zuu>What makes it hidden is that you need to hold shift while right clicking :-)
15:47<Eddi|zuHause>as i have no win 7 myself
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15:59<andythenorth>hmm
16:00<andythenorth>sugarcane station cargo sprites
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16:19<alluke>andythenorth: no i meant technically
16:19<alluke>shouldnt they look the same? https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1004368/dafug.png
16:19<andythenorth>ah
16:19<andythenorth>ogfx
16:20<andythenorth>I see the issue
16:20<andythenorth>I don't use ogfx
16:20<alluke>whats the difference in their coding that makes they look like that
16:20<andythenorth>one of those tiles uses a sprite I've drawn, the other two use ogfx tile
16:21<alluke>the default dirt tile?
16:21<andythenorth>yes
16:21<alluke>why cant you make them all use default tiles
16:21<Supercheese>Yeah, I've never noticed that either, I always use TTD stuff
16:22<alluke>i dont see the difference between drawn tile and default ttd tile anyway
16:24<andythenorth>does the default ogfx mud tile match FIRS?
16:24<alluke>yep
16:25<andythenorth>oh yes
16:25<andythenorth>FIRS uses that ugly ogfx mud tile if ogfx is enabled
16:25<andythenorth>that's possibly a bug
16:26<alluke>ugly?
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16:28<andythenorth>I should disable CHIPS if ogfx is in use
16:28<andythenorth>that would solve it
16:28<alluke>i think ogfx tiles look the best in ogfx environment https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1004368/N%C3%A4ytt%C3%B6kuva%202013-07-06%20kohteessa%2023.26.58.png
16:29<alluke>nah
16:29<alluke>make them use default tiles if ofgx is in use
16:29<Eddi|zuHause>you can't detect OpenGFX's presence, though :p
16:29<andythenorth>indeed
16:29<alluke>that too
16:29<andythenorth>I should fix that bug in FIRS too
16:29<alluke>firs doesnt have anything wrong
16:30<andythenorth>it's using the ugly mud tile
16:30<andythenorth>I should fix that
16:31<Eddi|zuHause>you should probably use a helidepot instead of a heliport for industrial areas :p
16:32<alluke>yeah could work
16:33<alluke>its hard to move the stuff up there via elevators
16:36<alluke>andythenorth: you should make a poll about the mud tiles
16:36<alluke>i think most of ogfx users would prefer ogfx mud tiles
16:39<andythenorth>I don't care
16:39<andythenorth>I file it as a bug with your configuration: you're using opengfx and CHIPS together. That's not supported.
16:40<Eddi|zuHause>there's lots of things wrong with this mindset
16:41<DDR_>alluke: Agreed.
16:41<andythenorth>pj well
16:41<andythenorth>oh well*
16:41<@Alberth>I prefer the concrete tiles
16:41<andythenorth>good night
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16:41<alluke>hahahha
16:42<DDR_>He's outtahere.
16:42<alluke>ragequit
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16:45<@Alberth>good job
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17:19<__ln__>http://edition.cnn.com/2013/07/06/world/americas/canada-train-derailment-fire/index.html
17:19<Wolf01>I reply with http://tech.slashdot.org/story/13/07/06/2046226/boeing-777-crashes-in-san-francisco
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17:31<alluke>__ln__: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4KzGKnuUuc
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17:54<Supercheese>http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/soccer/2013/07/06/soccer-referee-decapitated-brazil-stabbing-maranhao/2495199/
17:54<Supercheese>and people say American Football is violent
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18:27<Eddi|zuHause>there's also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrés_Escobar#Death
18:32<Eddi|zuHause>alluke: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbChSuSQIo4
18:33<alluke>sorry i dont understand german
18:34<Eddi|zuHause>you should learn it :)
18:35<alluke>why
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18:38<alluke>George: why does ecs use CERE instead of GRAI?
18:38<Eddi|zuHause>because!
18:38<alluke>because hitler?
18:38<Eddi|zuHause>germany doesn't only consist of hitler, you know
18:41<alluke>sauerkraut and sausages too
18:42<Eddi|zuHause>or maybe Goethe
18:45<alluke>dat feel when youve drawn so many nice sprites and the coder just plays world of tanks ;______;
18:50<Eddi|zuHause>get a code generator :)
18:51<alluke>get what?
18:51-!-valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.online.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:52<Eddi|zuHause>https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/cets/repository/entry/scripts/generate.py#L16
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18:52<Eddi|zuHause>man this mouse button thing is getting annoying
18:53<alluke>whats that
18:54<Eddi|zuHause>says so in the beginning "a program that takes table entries and turns them into code"
18:54<alluke>but that mouse button thing
18:55<alluke>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_aRKeDfqYo im laughing my ass off
18:55<Eddi|zuHause>[06.07.2013 21:16] <Eddi|zuHause> hm, my mouse is acting up...
18:55<Eddi|zuHause>[06.07.2013 21:17] <Eddi|zuHause> double clicking when i do single clicks, letting go of things during drag&drop...
18:55<alluke>ah
18:56<alluke>what kind of mouse is it
18:56<Eddi|zuHause>logitech something...
18:56<Eddi|zuHause>wireless mouse/keyboard combo
18:56<alluke>combo?
18:56<alluke>keyboawd with a trackpad in it
18:57<Eddi|zuHause>no
18:57<Eddi|zuHause>a mouse and a keyboard which use the same wireless receiver
18:57<alluke>ah ok
18:58<Eddi|zuHause>hm... and of course the 2 year warranty ran out a month ago :/
18:58<alluke>planned breakdown fuck yeah
18:58<alluke>dont buy anything from that same manufacturer anymore
18:58<Eddi|zuHause>well logitech is usually not known for that
18:59<alluke>hmm
18:59<alluke>idd
18:59<Eddi|zuHause>and that was already a replacement for some other manufacturer thingie that i returned twice
18:59<alluke>i have their speaker set
18:59<alluke>which has worked without problems for years
19:01<alluke>but ask if you can get the mouse replaced since its been so little time from the warranty expire
19:03<Eddi|zuHause>maybe i'll try the shop on monday, and if they refuse i'll send a mail to customer support or something
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19:05<alluke>ddr quit 24 years ago
19:06<Eddi|zuHause>we made that joke a dozen times, i'm not sure he ever realized it :)
19:06<alluke>i dont think he ever saw it
19:08<alluke>ai logic: narrow gauge steamer and transrapid coaches
19:09<alluke>and mail bulldozers xD
19:18<Eddi|zuHause>trains DO cry :) http://www.flickr.com/photos/lumixfan68/9223096197/
19:20<alluke>that looks something else to me......
19:21<Wolf01>'night all
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20:48<Eddi|zuHause>ah, i found the original box, and this sheet of paper says 3 years warranty
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22:31<sound>i am facing a sound problem on windows
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---Logclosed Sun Jul 07 00:00:54 2013