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#openttd IRC Logs for 2014-02-25

---Logopened Tue Feb 25 00:00:14 2014
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03:05<dihedral>greetings :-)
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04:12<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r26376 /trunk (5 files in 3 dirs) (2014-02-25 09:12:24 UTC)
04:12<@DorpsGek>-Prepare: 1.4.0-beta5
04:16<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r26377 tags/1.4.0-beta5/ (2014-02-25 09:16:21 UTC)
04:16<@DorpsGek>-Release: 1.4.0-beta5
04:19<dihedral>peter1139, brings a song to my head... ghost busters... :-)
04:23<peter1139>Well that must have been wild leap...
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04:32<Xaroth|Work>Rubidium: nice :)
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06:57<Eddi|zuHause>did one of the policemen shake his beer can too much?
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08:07<drhese>why this isnt working? ./openttd -c server2.cfg
08:09<drhese> I have set different port to second server.
08:09<drhese>dbg: [net] [server] could not start network: could not create listening socket
08:09<drhese>ERROR: Could not start the server
08:09<drhese>dbg: [net] Generating map, please wait...
08:09<drhese>dbg: [net] Map generated, starting game
08:09<drhese>dbg: [net] Dedicated server could not be started, aborting
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09:15<Eddi|zuHause>drhese: well does it work if you give the port on the command line?
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09:31<drhese>Eddi|zuHause: how?
09:32<drhese>-P xxxx ?
09:33<Eddi|zuHause> -D [ip][:port] = Start dedicated server
09:33<Eddi|zuHause>so "-D:9876"
09:34<Eddi|zuHause>although i have no experience with that at all
09:34<Eddi|zuHause>anyway, if that works, your .cfg entry may be incorrect. if that doesn't work, your problem lies elsewhere (process still running?)
09:35<@planetmaker>maybe you specify an IP explicitly. An IP which you do not own?
09:37<Eddi|zuHause>specifying an IP address only makes sense if you have multiple network cards
09:40<Eddi|zuHause>your smilie is broken :p
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09:49<drhese>yeah the problem is that it dont accept my second cfg file.. so what command I need to use for setting different configs?
09:49<drhese>-C doesnt work
09:50<drhese>maybe I just need to install another copy of game.
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10:09<@planetmaker>it's -c. Not -C
10:09<@planetmaker>-d is also not -D
10:10<drhese>not working
10:10<@planetmaker>-h is actually of great utility to teach about correct spelling ;)
10:10<@planetmaker>the error description is also not working
10:18<drhese>dbg: [net] Dedicated server could not be started, aborting
10:18<drhese>dbg: [net] [udp] closed listeners
10:18<drhese>dbg: [net] [udp] initializing listeners
10:18<drhese>dbg: [net] [udp] closed listeners
10:18<drhese>dbg: [net] [core] shutting down network
10:18<@planetmaker>that's the obvious output when the IP and port are already blocked by something else
10:19<drhese>dbg: [net] getaddrinfo for hostname "][:3980", port 3980, address family either IPv4 or IPv6 and socket type tcp failed: Name or service not known
10:19<drhese>dbg: [net] [server] could not start network: could not create listening socket
10:19<drhese>ERROR: Could not start the server
10:20<drhese>I use this: ./openttd -D [][:3980] -c arctic.cfg
10:21<@planetmaker>try ./openttd -D :8980
10:21<@planetmaker>try ./openttd -D :3980
10:21<drhese>not working cuz I have already runnin one server..
10:21<@planetmaker>where did you get the brackets from?
10:21<drhese>I have to run second one with another port
10:22<@planetmaker>so... why don't you?
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10:23<drhese>just say how I can run another server? do I have to install another copy of game?
10:23<drhese>its always trying to run on same port with another one
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10:26<drhese>ok now its running :D
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10:36<oskari89>:D 4096x4096 maps \o/
10:37<Eddi|zuHause>i've never even managed to fill a 1024x1024 map
10:38<oskari89>It depends of "resolution"
10:38<Xaroth|Work>I.. fail to see how that is so
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10:40<oskari89>I'm using heightmaps sometimes and really, 4096x4096 map sizes allow big and detail-rich scenery-making
10:41<Eddi|zuHause>that seems only useful if you have more height levels as well
10:41<Rubidium>huge maps must be flat, otherwise you can't make your perfectly straight town destroying 8 track line through the map
10:42<Rubidium>(with only point-to-point trains)
10:42<Eddi|zuHause>sure :p
10:43<Eddi|zuHause>Rubidium: but that requires to make the payment function monotonous :p
10:43<oskari89>Maybe more height levels patch sees trunk someday... :)
10:47<Eddi|zuHause>random idea: industries might run YAPF to decide on how much they would pay for cargo from a specific industry, with pathfinder penalties for crossing sea/land border and stuff
10:48<Eddi|zuHause>taking into account "development factors" like vehicle speeds
10:51<Eddi|zuHause>so the industry has a rough idea how far the cargo goes and how long it would take, calculates a price for that, and reduces this price if delivery takes longer than estimated
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11:44<@planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause, that would mean that we have two places where cargo payment is determined: as an industry property. And as a cargo property
11:44<Eddi|zuHause>planetmaker: what?
11:45<Eddi|zuHause>planetmaker: cargo has the payment rate property, industry has the payment calculation. totally different things
11:45<@planetmaker>not quite
11:46<Eddi|zuHause>whatever the industry calculates will be based on the cargo property.
11:46<@planetmaker>cargo defines x, y and z. And industry defines how to use x, y and z. and a, b,c,d in order to come up with payment. According to your suggestion
11:47<@planetmaker>the definition of x,y, and z with cargo doesn't make sense in that scenario at all.
11:47<Eddi|zuHause>currently cargo defines x,y and z, and vehicle uses x, y, z and a,b,c,d in order to come up with payment
11:47<@planetmaker>nor do we have a anything we can call cargo payment rate or anything a player can count on when it comes to cargo payment then
11:48<Eddi|zuHause>nothing changes, except you switch out vehicle for industry
11:48<@planetmaker>yup. And you add another few factors
11:49<Eddi|zuHause>i don't see your problem
11:49<@planetmaker>I don't see any gain in your suggestion
11:50<@planetmaker>except that payment totally becomes unpredicatable
11:50<@planetmaker>"sorry, you delivered on Friday 13th. No payment, but we take it nonetheless"
11:50<Eddi|zuHause>au contraire. then there can be a payment rate window in the industry window
11:51<Eddi|zuHause>which gives you exact information on how much you get (when you stay within the estimated time frame)
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11:51<Eddi|zuHause>also, you can build a new model of inflation with that
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11:57<Eddi|zuHause>they must have got that idea from
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12:15<duxck>Hello friend!
12:15<duxck>I'm having some issues running ottd 1.4 beta05 on ubuntu 12.04 32-bit.
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12:16<duxck>nm might have just figured it out by actually reading the error i get :D
12:19<duxck>bah started the game in terminal with only "openttd" :P
12:19<duxck>doesn't work that well in terminal :P
12:21<sx>hi, i've seen a lot of images of a 32 bit rework of the opensfx baseset, does anyone know where to get it?
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12:22<duxck>yup LordAro solved it.
12:22<duxck>had to do apt-get -f install to fix som dependencies :)
12:23<LordAro>sx: assuming you mean opengfx (sfx is the sound set), you want zBase
12:24<sx>LordAro: yes, you are right, but i don't want zBase :D
12:24<sx>LordAro: zBase looks a bit cold
12:24<LordAro>if you mean the "old style" 32bpp "set", well, that's a bit more difficult
12:25<duxck>tried to start server with openttd -D
12:25<@planetmaker>there exists - but that currently requires you to build the NewGRF yourself
12:25<sx>LordAro: the wiki says it's in development, is that wrong?
12:25<duxck>got error "Error: Failed ot find a graphics set."
12:25<duxck>Why would I need that when I run it over SSH?
12:26<@planetmaker>duxck, you always need it. It's more than graphics
12:26<@planetmaker>it also contains some logic parts
12:26<Eddi|zuHause>duxck: the graphics set contains other stuff
12:26<duxck>so in the beta 5 that is out now there is no gfx included?
12:26<sx>planetmaker: thx, i will try that
12:26<duxck>or did i mess up the installation?
12:26<LordAro>sx: always assume the wiki is out of date
12:26<LordAro>especially wrt 32bpp stuff ;)
12:26<Eddi|zuHause>duxck: just install opengfx
12:27<@planetmaker>sx, as said: you need to build the whole NewGRF yourself. Might be a bit challenging. The wiki wrt 32bpp is terribly out-of-date
12:27<@planetmaker>duxck, there never is included any graphics set
12:27<Eddi|zuHause>there might actually be a "null" base set out there with minimal (transparent) graphics
12:27<sx>LordAro: the wiki is really horrible :)
12:27<LordAro>sx: D:
12:27<@planetmaker>but openttd offers you to obtain one on install. Package managers (should) recommend their installation
12:27<sx>LordAro: but it's sad, because the game itself has so much potential
12:28<LordAro>sx: it's a wiki, improve it!
12:28<duxck>planetmaker: I installed the beta 5 with "dpkg -i <package name>" which i downloaded from the website.
12:28<LordAro>Eddi|zuHause: might be an idea to include something similar with OTTD?
12:28<sx>LordAro: as soon as i have time i will :)
12:28<@planetmaker>well :) that is manual installation of a 3rd-party package (from the view of the package manager)
12:28<Eddi|zuHause>LordAro: might be problematic if it's used with "real" clients
12:29<@planetmaker>yet it's the way I'd actually recommend. Shipped versions usually are terribly out-of-date
12:29<Eddi|zuHause>LordAro: would probably be better to patch openttd to start dedicated without gfx
12:29<@planetmaker>just grab a graphics set and install opengfx via your package manager
12:29<LordAro>Eddi|zuHause: just modify the bootstrapper to trigger if only the null set is found?
12:29<LordAro>but yeah, removing the gfx dependency would be a good start ;)
12:29<@planetmaker>LordAro, Eddi|zuHause I'd actually advocate to move the few things actually needed into a small file always shipped with openttd
12:30<duxck>planetmaker: do you know the package name for opendgfx?
12:30<Eddi|zuHause>LordAro: IIRC the only "data" inside the grf files is for the original terrain generator
12:30<@planetmaker>"opengfx"? "openttd-opengfx"?
12:30<LordAro>well then
12:30<@planetmaker>depends on your OS
12:30<LordAro>planetmaker: duxck: the latter, iirc
12:30<duxck>planetmaker: aah, should have thought of that.
12:30<sx>duxck: why not use the tab key? (bash auto completion)
12:31<duxck>didn't search for openttd first, went with opengfx then tab :)
12:31<duxck>bam now i was able to start the server
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12:36<duxck>could someone test log on to my server, if you have 1.4.0 beta5 installed.
12:36<duxck>Server addess:
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13:17<frosch123>noone fixed my missing "not" :(
13:17<jjavaholic>if I have an airport with no planes in it but no planes landing what could possibly going wrong here?
13:17<frosch123>not even orolard
13:17<frosch123>jjavaholic: maybe you "closed" the airprot
13:17<frosch123>or a zeppelin crashed on it
13:18<frosch123>but you would see that one
13:18<jjavaholic>how does one close an airport?
13:18<frosch123>it's a button in the station view gui
13:18<jjavaholic>wow I never noticed that before
13:19<jjavaholic>what legitimate reasons are there for closing an airport?
13:19<frosch123>so you can bulldoze it
13:19<frosch123>and rebuild a different one
13:19<frosch123>or something like that
13:19<frosch123>no idea actually :)
13:20<jjavaholic>I didn't even think about that
13:25<@DorpsGek>Commit by frosch :: r26378 trunk/changelog.txt (2014-02-25 18:25:04 UTC)
13:25<@DorpsGek>-Doc [FS#5930]: Typos. (LordAro)
13:25<LordAro>^ i should point out that that was by no means complete
13:25<frosch123>i like documenting typos, instead of fixing them :)
13:45<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r26379 trunk/src/lang/polish.txt (2014-02-25 18:45:08 UTC)
13:45<@DorpsGek>-Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<@DorpsGek>polish - 92 changes by McZapkie
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14:13<Wolf01>hi hi
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14:15<andythenorth>@seen pikka
14:15<@DorpsGek>andythenorth: pikka was last seen in #openttd 21 hours, 3 minutes, and 56 seconds ago: <Pikka> and deinvisible the supplies
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15:14*andythenorth ponders...
15:14*Alberth gives andy some tea
15:15<andythenorth>I have switched back to coffee
15:15<andythenorth>superior drink
15:16<@Alberth>oh, sorry, don't have that at this time
15:18<Eddi|zuHause>you don't drink coffee at 21:00?
15:18<@Alberth>not usually, no
15:18<frosch123>there is nothing wrong with coffee in the evening
15:19<Eddi|zuHause>coffee loses its use when you drink it regularly
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15:19<frosch123>depends on the "use"
15:22<Eddi|zuHause>i was implying the primary use being "staying awake" :p
15:22<frosch123>warm drinks are generally tireing me
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15:40<andythenorth>time for coffee then
15:40<andythenorth>also, what about this deep sea business?
15:41<andythenorth>I am out of my depth with it
15:50<andythenorth>somewhat sunk
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15:55<andythenorth>lo Pikka
15:55<Pikka>lo bob
15:55<andythenorth>your AI is getting in my way again
15:55<Pikka>that's what it's for!
15:56<andythenorth>it's lovely
15:58<Pikka>so the newer nightly/beta may be less crashy, apparently
15:58<frosch123>prove the opposite :p
16:00<andythenorth>and also I can have SSL back in my OS :P
16:02<andythenorth>maybe I should fix this pruple hoppers
16:02<Pikka>I shall, frosch123
16:09<andythenorth>pruple fixed
16:09<andythenorth>there are two kinds of pruple in the palette
16:09<andythenorth>one is incorrect
16:11<andythenorth>also Silicon Valley is beating me currently :(
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16:34<@planetmaker>Eddi|zuHause, did or do you actually still work on CETS?
16:34<@planetmaker>I haven't seen any update or commit in a long long time
16:34<@planetmaker>not using repo any longer?
16:35<Eddi|zuHause>if november is a long time?
16:35<@planetmaker>probably :D
16:35<Eddi|zuHause>and i already said i'll continue in a month or so
16:36<@planetmaker>sorry, I don't keep of every of your words in each place :)
16:36<@planetmaker>I guess it's long as it's mostly about the time when I switched the CF. Thus my impression
16:37<frosch123>hmm, the internet is so small
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16:45<andythenorth>tanker ships don't refit milk
16:47<__ln__>would you drink milk that has been in a tanker ship?
16:47<frosch123>they refit to alcohol after all
16:47<__ln__>alcohol survives without refrigeration.
16:48<frosch123>delivering 500 m³ of alcohol is just as fun as 600 bags of sweets
16:48<andythenorth>I just did it to be annoying tbh
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17:16<andythenorth>Pikka: make game, play tomorrow?
17:17<Pikka>although I may not be awake at playing time... hmm
17:20<@planetmaker>what game is on tomorrow, andythenorth ?
17:20<andythenorth>whatever pikka makes...
17:20<andythenorth>I have fixed some IH bugs
17:20<andythenorth>although no release yet :P
17:21*andythenorth fixes that
17:25<andythenorth>512 downloads of a grf with no release announcement, and no description, marked as alpha-1 :o
17:25<andythenorth>the world is strange
17:25<SpComb>512 people clicking "Download all"?
17:25<andythenorth>oh yeah
17:26<andythenorth>also bed time
17:26<andythenorth>Pikka: I made a new IH alpha-2 if you care
17:26<andythenorth>if you care not, then we should use your grf or something
17:27<Pikka>or both :D I'm sure that would be balanced. :P
17:27<Pikka>I'll grab the new alpha anon
17:27<andythenorth>super balanced
17:27<andythenorth>maybe we should make half a grf each
17:27<andythenorth>and people could mix and match
17:27<andythenorth>also bye
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17:39<Eddi|zuHause><__ln__> alcohol survives without refrigeration. <- i don't refrigerate my milk
17:41<__ln__>any milk that doesn't need refrigeration consequently tastes like shit
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18:01<Eddi|zuHause>__ln__: possibly, but i don't drink milk often enough to care
18:01<Eddi|zuHause>(and thus, fresh milk would be impractical anyway)
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18:03<Eddi|zuHause>also, i never actually liked any pure milk, fresh or otherwise
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18:05<__ln__>cultural difference perhaps; i wouldn't enjoy living in a place where i can't buy fresh milk every day
18:05<Eddi|zuHause>you can
18:05<Eddi|zuHause>but nobody really does
18:06<Eddi|zuHause>or at least i don't know anybody who does
18:06<Eddi|zuHause>apparently some do, otherwise it wouldn't be sold
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18:08<__ln__>though there's only one option which has like 4..5% fat?
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18:48<Morgan_Freeman>Troll Bait ----->
18:50<Sacro>Morgan_Freeman: tf?
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---Logclosed Wed Feb 26 00:00:16 2014