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#openttd IRC Logs for 2014-08-27

---Logopened Wed Aug 27 00:00:18 2014
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03:05<Supercheese>what's the deal with {STRING} vs. {STRING1} vs. {STRING2} in the lang files?
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03:50<Eddi|zuHause>don't use {STRINGn} in files other than english.txt
03:50<Supercheese>ah, I see
03:50<Eddi|zuHause>basically it means "the string that is passed here will consume n additional parameters"
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06:49<andythenorth>so brake vans
06:49<andythenorth>should wagons have lower speed limit if no brake van in train?
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07:13<V453000>making consist requirements is quite wtf to me
07:13<V453000>and there are people with less game experience I believe
07:15<andythenorth>sometimes the answer to a question is known in advance
07:15<andythenorth>we should teach the bot to answer
07:15<V453000>kind of often :D
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07:17<__ln__>the speed limit should correlate to track maintenance budget rather than wagons. to be more _eal__tic.
07:17<V453000>what award do I win?
07:18<__ln__>darwin? no, not suitable here.
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07:49-!-mode/#openttd [+b *!*Andy@194.168.185.*] by peter1138
07:49-!-mode/#openttd [-b *!*Andy@194.168.185.*] by peter1138
07:49<^Spike^>woops... wrong button?
07:55<Eddi|zuHause><andythenorth> we should teach the bot to answer <-- you mean like a magic 8-ball?
07:56<V453000>ban andythenorth instead! :D
07:56-!-andythenorth is now known as v453000_
07:56<Eddi|zuHause>we tried tht, didn't stick! :p
07:57<V453000>hi v453000_
07:58<^Spike^>you sure you want to do that andy... i bugged V alot last few days ;)
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08:03<Eddi|zuHause>all the cool people use qwertz
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08:14<Eddi|zuHause>"a clothing chain had to withdraw a children's shirt with stripes and a star on it, because it resembled a concentration camp uniform"
08:14<__ln__>does the US flag resemble a concentration camp uniform too?
08:15<V453000>everything resembles of concentration camp uniform
08:15<Eddi|zuHause>if it had one star, and the star was on the other side, and the stripes weren't black?
08:15<Eddi|zuHause>err.. *were
08:16<Eddi|zuHause>oh, and if the stars were six-sided
08:16<Eddi|zuHause>all in all, there are probably things closer than that :p
08:17<^Spike^>what Eddi|zuHause said.... i saw the picture... i can understand ppl getting upset about it... :)
08:17<^Spike^>design wise it looked alot like what the children had to wear at that time
08:18<V453000>clearly sheriff :D
08:35<Eddi|zuHause>why is "tsunami" an "obscure" word?
08:36<andythenorth>it is?
08:38<Eddi|zuHause>according to xkcd?
08:40<andythenorth>oic :)
08:42<@peter1138>Isn't that the point? It's not, any more.
08:42<Eddi|zuHause>but it wasn't really before that either...
08:43<Eddi|zuHause>if i went around in the 90's and asked a random set of people what a tsunami was, i'm sure i've gotten plenty of correct answers
08:49<@peter1138>It wasn't on people's minds though.
08:49<@peter1138>Not that any of that is now.
08:51<Eddi|zuHause>anyway, either that definition of "obscure" is weird, or things in america are much different than here...
08:55<Eddi|zuHause>also, you can easily make that list backwards, like the time when "radio" became a word, or "christianity", or...
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10:39<andythenorth>more horses
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12:22<@Alberth>hi hi
12:31<Eddi|zuHause>V453000: didn't we have that already?
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12:42<andythenorth>hi lo
12:42<@Alberth>hi hi
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13:35<andythenorth>is it done yet?
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13:42<@Alberth>can't be done yet, I haven't finished my termite/iron horse game yet
13:45<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r26761 /trunk/src/lang (3 files) (2014-08-27 17:45:46 UTC)
13:45<@DorpsGek>-Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<@DorpsGek>catalan - 2 changes by juanjo
13:45<@DorpsGek>english_US - 3 changes by Supercheese
13:45<@DorpsGek>spanish - 2 changes by juanjo
13:46<andythenorth>Alberth: add road hog :P
13:46<andythenorth>you can it to a running game :P
13:46<@Alberth>I can easily start anew, I just built one train :p
13:47<andythenorth>I released a new IH btw :)
13:47<@Alberth>the fun never stops! :)
13:47*andythenorth biab
13:48<andythenorth>-> bike
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14:34<andythenorth>oh DanMacK
14:34<andythenorth>won’t you come bacK :(
14:35<frosch123>DanBacK ?
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14:40<andythenorth>Alberth: so is your game any good? o_O
14:42<@Alberth> it will be awesome, I am sure
14:42<@Alberth>I started in 1895, which should be interesting :)
14:46<andythenorth>it’s about as early as you want to start
14:46<andythenorth>EnoFIRS :P
14:55<@Alberth>opengfx+industries will do fine
14:55*andythenorth was trolling
14:55<andythenorth>any ships? o_O
14:55<@Alberth>except for the invisible forests, in transparant mode :(
14:56<@Alberth>no ships yet, hopefully they'll come as I have a lot of water :)
14:57<andythenorth>got squids?
15:00<@Alberth>water is not really ideal, but alas
15:01<andythenorth>very fast
15:01<andythenorth>but not in 1895
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15:02<@Alberth>total bridge replacement set looks wrong, bridges with 150+ km/h :)
15:04*andythenorth prefers ‘expensive short & slow bridges’ :P
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15:08*andythenorth should fix road hog I guess
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15:10<@Alberth>lol, ever read the description of "very large ships?"
15:10<@Alberth>you need permission for everything, as it's "public domain" :D
15:11*Alberth restarts the game
15:12<andythenorth>shall I draw flat dock graphics?
15:12<andythenorth>then we can admire them whilst not adding them to the game
15:13<andythenorth>if I call it NewDocks, does that help? o_O
15:14<Eddi|zuHause>if for nostalgic effect you also shout "peter1138! NewDocks!" every morning :p
15:15<@Alberth>trying to win a bet?
15:15<andythenorth>all I want for christmas is
15:15<Eddi|zuHause>anyone here actually remember that?
15:16<andythenorth>to build a dock without lowering or raising about 20 tiles
15:17*andythenorth arrived in this channel after all the fun stopped :P
15:17<andythenorth>or just before ;P
15:17<andythenorth>maybe causal
15:18<andythenorth>at least we can finally all stop talking about roadtypes, eh?
15:18<SpComb>openttd solar roadways
15:24<@Alberth>unloading the train is a bit quick? it jumps to 0% immediately :)
15:25<andythenorth>what wagon type?
15:25*Rubidium considers not taking the 18:05 train from Paddington next time...
15:26<@Alberth>open car, refitted to coal
15:27<andythenorth>Rubidium: to Newbury? Terrible idea
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15:27<andythenorth>worst possible time pretty much
15:27<andythenorth>did it go via Reading?
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15:27<andythenorth>Alberth: loading speed is 20, too high
15:27<andythenorth>you found me a bug, ta
15:28<@Alberth>yw :)
15:28<@Alberth>the downside is mostly that you fix them and make a new release :p
15:29<andythenorth>upgrade newgrds on your game :P
15:29<andythenorth>never goes wrong, ever
15:29<andythenorth>is there an emoticon for “I am lying”?
15:29<@Alberth>oh, it's no big deal, I like building networks, restart means more building :)
15:30<Eddi|zuHause>first time i heard 'you're making too many bugfixes' :p
15:30<andythenorth>I probably introduce new ones in every release :P
15:30<Eddi|zuHause>that's a corrolary to murphy's law :p
15:30<andythenorth>Alberth: try some narrow gauge trains too, they’re cheap, not too slow, and may have bugs to find
15:30<@Alberth>Eddi|zuHause: many bugfixes is ok, just don't release the fixed version :p
15:31<@Alberth>:o I have more track types!
15:31<andythenorth>you get 4 in termite
15:31<@Alberth>hadn't found those yet :)
15:32<@Alberth>only 2 active in 1895
15:32<Rubidium>andythenorth: yes... to Newbury via Reading
15:33<Rubidium>luckily 2/3s got off at the first station
15:33<andythenorth>crush hour
15:33<andythenorth>on some kind of small unit?
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15:34<andythenorth>DanMacK: !
15:34<Rubidium>compared to what we'd get in the NLs it was small
15:34<Rubidium>but it was the whole platform of Paddington long (8 coaches)
15:34<andythenorth>public transport: the place where the English invert their usual attitude to personal space
15:34<Rubidium>in the NLs we'd probably have a 12 coach double decker
15:35<andythenorth>we consider standing in someone else’s armpit to be more effective
15:36<Rubidium>and they're doing all kinds of work to get to 6 14 coach double deckers an hour (inter city) and then 6 8 coach stopping trains an hour for a certain stretch of about 150 km
15:36<Eddi|zuHause>in my book on "murphy's computer laws" (1993) it says: "fundamental understanding of software industry: every major program development happened because of serious programming errors.", and draws three conclusions: "1) every program has errors", "2) every program has always one more error", "3) fixing one error causes two new ones"
15:37<Rubidium>oh, actually two stretches... so there'll be a bit of 50 km where there'll be 12 of those beasts an hour (plus stopping trains)
15:37<Rubidium>they actually did a test with it and it mostly failed due to huge queues at level road/rail crossings
15:39<Eddi|zuHause>oh, it seems to be a reprint, the original appears to be 1990
15:39<andythenorth>Rubidium: we just grumble instead
15:39<andythenorth>actually maybe not, we do seem to be building stuff
15:39<LordAro>Rubidium, just be glad that it wasn't the tube, at rush hour, in the middle of summer (and not during the holidays). Those are *fun*
15:42<Eddi|zuHause>i was only in london for like 3 days, in the late 1990s
15:43<Rubidium>LordAro: okay, it isn't the middle of summer... but the tube arriving at 17:45-ish at Paddington (from KX) was not that busy
15:43<Rubidium>there was way more space in the tube train than the FGW train
15:44<LordAro>it's holiday time :)
15:44<LordAro>also, you do get lucky
15:44<Rubidium>so... how full would the FGW train be outside of the holidays?
15:45<Eddi|zuHause>i vaguely remember there being two separate tube stations in paddington
15:45<LordAro>you'll probably get a seat on the mainline trains
15:45<Rubidium>as I can't imagine it getting much more people (beyond really pushing it)
15:45<LordAro>Eddi|zuHause, i wouldn't be surprised if there were more
15:46<andythenorth>LordAro: are you smoking crack?
15:46<andythenorth>a seat on the Bristol train, without reservation?
15:46<andythenorth>have you seen how fast people run?
15:46<andythenorth>it’s brutal at the gate, old people and toddlers are regularly crushed
15:47<LordAro>andythenorth, alas, i do not have any experience with the south-west train network
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15:47<LordAro>east + north-east, sure
15:47<Rubidium>I'd guess at 3 tube stations for Paddington
15:47<andythenorth>Bakerloo, District, and the other one
15:48<andythenorth>the pink one
15:49<LordAro>have i ever mentioned how much i hate wifi?
15:49<Rubidium>green and yellow line between Edgeware Road and Bayswater, yellow and pink line between Edgeware Road and Royal Oak (you had to change for the direction Bayswater at Edgeware) and the brown like between Warwick avenue and (an unconnected Edgware road)
15:49<Rubidium>LordAro: try bifi
15:50<LordAro>much sooner try wired...
15:51<Wolf01>I have this wifi cable which works really well
15:52<Eddi|zuHause>i don't remember the pink one
15:53<LordAro><LordAro> but this hotel wifi is dropping out every minute or so, but only if i use a browser
15:53<LordAro><LordAro> it's perfectly stable when ircing
15:53<LordAro>because i'm not sure how much of that sent
15:53<Rubidium>though I think the main problem w.r.t. Paddington (and many other London termini) is the fact that they are termini and as a result all the cleaning and preparing for direction changes needs to be done at the station instead of at some space slightly further away
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15:54<Rubidium>e.g. in Amsterdam many trains terminate few stations beyond Amsterdam Central station
15:54<andythenorth>issue might be line capacity
15:54<andythenorth>it’s a 4 track railroad to Didcot or so, but still busy
15:54<andythenorth>125mph pax, at least 2 per hour, probably 4 or 6
15:55<andythenorth>90mph local, many per hour
15:55<andythenorth>70mph (max) freight - containers, stone, coal in daylight hours
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15:55<@Alberth> narrow gauge tracks seem a bit off-center
15:55<andythenorth>and the stations can’t handle many coaches, even if there were any available to buy or lease
15:56*andythenorth is guessing, doesn’t know much about trains
15:56<@Alberth>interestingly, the ISR stations (bottom left) do it better than chips
15:56<andythenorth>only what wikipedia says
15:56<andythenorth>CHIPS hates railtypes :(
15:57<LordAro>andythenorth, you should fix that
15:57<@Alberth>narrow1.png is the transparent image, you can see it better there
15:57<@Alberth>LordAro: but chips is finished :)
15:58<LordAro>alternatively, you should fix nml so you can fix that ;)
15:58<Rubidium>andythenorth: busy? 8 ICs and 4 local trains per direction per hour on a four track is easily doable
15:59<Rubidium>it's going to be upgraded to 12 ICs and 6 local trains when a major bottleneck station's track layout is redone (remove more than 60% of the switches)
16:00<Rubidium>and the removal and relayout is done in such a way you can pass the station at 80 km/h although the only trains doing that are goods trains (IIRC 2 per hour per direction)
16:01<andythenorth>someone should tell someone
16:01<andythenorth>I do believe it might get fixed in the next few years
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16:01<andythenorth>Alberth: yeah that’s a known defect with CHIPS
16:01<andythenorth>afaict the NG rails are in the right place
16:01<Rubidium>for which that passing speed is needed not to mess with the paths of ICs
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16:02<andythenorth>station foreground sprite is an overlay
16:02<Rubidium>andythenorth: Crossrail?
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16:02<andythenorth>and GW main line electrification + upgrade
16:03<@Alberth>it's just one pixel less wide than normal tracks? that looks much better aligned to me
16:03<Eddi|zuHause><Rubidium> and the removal and relayout is done in such a way you can pass the station at 80 km/h although the only trains doing that are goods trains (IIRC 2 per hour per direction) <-- increasing the passing speed usually speeds up entering and exiting as well
16:03<Rubidium>that's true as well
16:06*andythenorth looking if there’s a fix
16:06<andythenorth>tried to fix this once before
16:08<LordAro>ooh, ooh, what about diagonal stations?
16:08<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: just add a ground sprite?
16:08<andythenorth>removes some of the challenge
16:08<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause: station spec doesn’t work that way
16:08<andythenorth>me and yexo went around it for ages
16:08<@Alberth>stations isn't that bad but the tracks at the normal ground shift from one side to the other when changing direction
16:08<Eddi|zuHause>LordAro: make diagonal bridges first
16:09<andythenorth>Alberth: sounds like a bug :o
16:09<andythenorth>Alberth: how do I reproduce that?
16:10<andythenorth>we just stole Narrow Gauge Rails, so I disclaim all responsibility :)
16:10<LordAro>Eddi|zuHause, ...fair point
16:10<andythenorth>but I do have to fix it :P
16:10<@Alberth>lay some tracks at the ground? :)
16:12<andythenorth>odd position
16:12<andythenorth>I see
16:13<andythenorth>that’s what happens when we merge 2 different railtypes, and use original / ogfx base sprites for the ‘standard’ rails
16:13<andythenorth>railtypes / railtype grfs /s
16:13*andythenorth was hoping for free lunch
16:13<@Alberth>sorry :(
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16:50<andythenorth>je vais
16:51<andythenorth>a mon lit
16:51*andythenorth not french
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---Logclosed Thu Aug 28 00:00:21 2014