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#openttd IRC Logs for 2015-02-09

---Logopened Mon Feb 09 00:00:05 2015
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00:29<V453000>256 precise thereabouts :P
00:36<supermop>what format should i send these in
00:37<supermop>idk how to scale it right if there is just the tram no tile, so i thought of sending a PSD with tile on layer 0 and rotated views on subsequent layers
00:37<V453000>I just render png
00:38<V453000>though as you can read on my technical documentation pages, I invest a lot of energy into postproduction pipelines to actually get final spritesheets from the renders
00:38<V453000>I can greatly recommend that.
00:39<V453000>for buildings it probably isnt terribly important
00:41<supermop>yeah id like a process like yours
00:42<supermop>i was fighting this morning with rhino's apparent inability to render a specific shape to a specific size as far as i can tell
00:43<supermop>i could set the render output to 256px wide, but could not lock the view so that the tile square was exactly same as render window
00:44<supermop>so now i am rendering larger so that i have pixels to squash when resizing in ps
00:44<supermop>i dont know if its just poorly documented or a function of me using very old software as i cant afford to upgrade
00:47<Pikka>supermop: seperate image per sprite, png format, all the same size and with the vehicle centred in the middle (or more precisely the ground point under the center of the vehicle centered in the middle) would be my preferred format if you want me to code them up quickly. ;)
00:48<supermop>ok
00:49<supermop>8 views per vehicle?
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01:11<Pikka>4 or 8, up to you
01:11<Pikka>4 is okay if it's symmetrical
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01:49<supermop>is .7z ok?
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01:51<supermop>ok i sent it
01:52<supermop>the images at least
01:52<Pikka>k
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02:09<supermop>let me know what else i should do to help
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02:26<Pikka>nice. :P
02:26<Pikka>are there supposed to only be 2 views with the sides open?
02:29<supermop>well i only have one 'car' with a door
02:29<supermop>and i figure stations are only / or \
02:29<supermop>so no need for the other views?
02:30<Pikka>it's not necessarily in the station during loading. and there's also the view in the vehicle info windows. :)
02:30<supermop>ahhh
02:30<supermop>i can render more
02:30<Pikka>I can just use the closed sprites for the other views while loading so it's not a fatal problem, just if you want to provide the extras. up to you. :)
02:31<supermop>i guess if its long it could be in a curve... closed is fine though i think
02:33<supermop>i left the 'bellows' part empty - i assume that when i redraw this as a real tram i'd either have those as part of the cars or as 4 very short vehicles?
02:33<supermop>not sure whats best
02:35<supermop>maybe ill model something from this era of braun design for W or Z class trams:
02:35<supermop>http://www.dailytonic.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/9.-Dieter-Rams-Braun-hair-dryer-HLD-4-1970.jpg
02:35<supermop>although that was designed by reinhold weiss and he hates that DR gets the credit for it
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02:54<Flygon>supermop: I forgot. Is there anything happening with that W-class/PCC hybrid? :D
02:55<Flygon>Ah, PCC 980, there we go
03:06<supermop>as in does it still exist?
03:06<supermop>idk
03:34<supermop>should i include it?
03:37<supermop>to be honest any tram set i make is most contingent on what other people want to help me with
03:39<supermop>but i am looking to provide breadth while keeping things simple
03:39<supermop>i am most worried about lack of large trams before the b class
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04:26<supermop>time to model another one of these
04:26<supermop>no classic braun gear evocative of e class though
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06:24<Flygon>supermop: It does still exist
06:24<Flygon>And it'll help fill the gap betwen the last W and the first Z
06:24<Flygon>There's also a prototype Z that was also officially a PCC car
06:25<Flygon>1048 or something like that
06:25<Flygon>It actually used some of PCC 980's parts
06:25<Flygon>http://www.hawthorntramdepot.org.au/trams/mmtb1041.htm 1041, there we go
06:26<Flygon>Ahh
06:26<Flygon>PCC980 was built 1949
06:26<Flygon>PCC 1041 was built 1972
06:27<Flygon>So... you still have a gap between 4 years before Casino Royale and the gap beteen Diamonds and Forever and Live and Let Die
06:28<Flygon>Or: 23 years without any new Tram models
06:28<Flygon>This kinda sucks, but...
06:28<Flygon>Still...
06:28<Flygon>It fills in the gap until the Z1-class came around irl (around 1978)
06:29<Flygon>Oh, 1975
06:29<supermop>well similar in most of the world, most cities were actively dismantling tram networks during that period
06:29<Flygon>So... right after Man With The Golden Gun
06:29<Flygon>supermop: True
06:30<Flygon>But in gameplay, it's still nice to give players as much variety as possible
06:30<Flygon>Also having a Tram that can go 115km/h in 1949 would be really cool :P
06:30<Flygon>(apperantly the PCC980 was driven to 70 miles per hour in testing)
06:30<supermop>but then no one would every upgrade to all of the later 80kmh trams....
06:31*Flygon shrug
06:31<Flygon>Make a toggle inside the .grf
06:31<Flygon>"PCC car can go 115km/h: On/Off"
06:32<Flygon>Of course, if we were obsessing too hard into this
06:32<Flygon>We would look into the history of MTA's operation of the Z's through to B's and see if they were tested PCC style
06:33<Flygon>And see if the C/D's overseas go 115km/h too :P
06:33<Flygon>Though, the PCCs going 115km/h, gameplay-wise... would actually be kinda interesting
06:33<Flygon>In terms of... you could totally use them instead of road coaches :B
06:33<supermop>the D class trams make so much noise outside my house even at 40 kmh that i don't want to imagine 100
06:34<Flygon>Though, then again, that 2CC bus set that's being made has road coaches breaking 160km/h by the 40s
06:34<supermop>i swear they all have wheel flats
06:34<Flygon>supermop: We'll give the passengers industrial earmuffs
06:34<Flygon>I always liked the B-class Trams best myself
06:35<Flygon>They're quiet, comfy, and look really fucking cool
06:35<supermop>also, you would never have street running at 100kmh especially the...
06:35<supermop>i like the A
06:35<supermop>i am considering the hypothetical B3 class to fill the gap until the C1
06:35<Flygon>Hmm
06:36<Flygon>Is it possible for a Tram to detect if it's running on Road+Rails and just Rails?
06:36<Flygon>Er, or just*
06:36<supermop>not yet as far as i know
06:36<Flygon>Bugger
06:36<Flygon>That'd solve a few things
06:37<supermop>but really trams neednt try too hard to be trains...
06:37<Flygon>I mean... mentally
06:37<Flygon>It'd be sensical to work around reality a bit if, say
06:37<Flygon>The PCCs could go 80 on a road, and 115 in the open...
06:37<Flygon>And have that apply to all the future Trams til the low floor ones
06:37<Flygon>Depends how realistic we're being
06:38<supermop>i dont agree with hyper-balance as it makes every game too 'solved', but i think some balance is helpful
06:39<supermop>maybe allowing at least the B class trams to do 90 or so
06:39<supermop>who knows
06:39<supermop>really i just want a super basic tram grf to get me kicked into gear to do houses
06:42*Flygon nodnod
06:42<Flygon>The eGVTRicantspellit set has nice Trams and all...
06:42<Flygon>And buses
06:42<Flygon>But the problem is...
06:42<Flygon>They just feel all weird until the 90s
06:43<Flygon>The speeds are off, the capacities are off... y'know?
06:43<Flygon>...if the author is in this channel, I know I'm going to get punched in the face
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06:56<supermop>alright im off to bed
07:06<Flygon>Sleep well!
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08:57<DanMacK>@seen andythenorth
08:57<@DorpsGek>DanMacK: andythenorth was last seen in #openttd 15 hours, 51 minutes, and 48 seconds ago: <andythenorth> bye
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09:21<@Belugas>hello
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09:30<Celestar>hello Belugas :D
09:32<V453000>hyhyhyhyhhyhyhhyhyhyh
09:40<Xaroth|Work>o/ Belugas
09:42<LordAro>i should look at this channel more often
09:42<LordAro>o/
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10:01<@Belugas>Celestar??? Hooowww!!!! That's a name that go4s back a looooong time ago :D
10:02<V453000>:)
10:02<@Belugas>Xaroth, V453000, hello to you too :D
10:06<Celestar>:D
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10:08<@Belugas>so, mister pilot, how is the sky over the old continent?
10:08<@Belugas>Ground Control to major Celestar hahahah!!
10:09<Celestar>:P
10:09<Celestar>not sure, I have just returned to the old continent after 3 months.
10:09<@Belugas>seriously?? where have you been?
10:09<@Belugas>don't tell me you were here and not waved at all!!!
10:10<Celestar>Southeast Asia, Australia, Hawai'i, LA and Vegas.
10:10<@Belugas>just one word: WOW
10:10<@Belugas>business trip or second honey moon ?
10:10<@Belugas>hahaha
10:12<Celestar>well since we didn't have a first honeymoon :P
10:15<@Belugas>you decided to take a really decent one then ;)
10:15<@Belugas>it was nice?
10:16<Eddi|zuHause>the weather was probably nicer :p
10:16<@Belugas>much nicer than here for sure ...
10:16<Celestar>lol
10:16<Celestar>the weather was mostly good :)
10:16<Celestar>not always.
10:16<Celestar>we managed to bring rain to Uluru/Ayer's Rock :D
10:17<Eddi|zuHause>pff :p
10:18<@Belugas>you expected 3 months of no rain at all? does Sahara rings a bell to you? hahaha!!!1
10:18<Eddi|zuHause>well, when it does rain in the sahara, you get crazy floods
10:19<Celestar>hah
10:19<Celestar>it was good.
10:19<Celestar>because temperature was down to 35 the following day
10:20<@Belugas>i've been to a few tropical islands, and one thing i always loved was the rain. small, refreshing, immediatly followed by nice sun ;)
10:21<@Belugas>so the guys must have praised you loike gods to bring some rain, in the end :D
10:21<Celestar>;)
10:21<Celestar>we loved the whole trip
10:23<@Belugas>i bet you did :) coming back from such a ling time must be a big cultural shock
10:24<Celestar>not only that.
10:24<Celestar>also a temperature shock
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10:27<Eddi|zuHause>i had that when i was on the US east coast (in 2000, when the world wasn't broken yet). i was there in april, and they had like 30°C, like the warmest day of the year, and when i got back a week later, it was here -4°C
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10:34<Celestar>good old times.
10:34-!-samu [~oftc-webi@a85-139-81-208.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #openttd
10:34<samu>hi
10:36<@Belugas>glad for you sir :)
10:36<@Belugas>hello samu
10:37<roidal>o/
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11:01<samu>i have a small request
11:01-!-Alberth [~alberth@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has joined #openttd
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11:01<samu>when typing a password into company, could it be hidden, or masked?
11:01<samu>****
11:02<samu>like that
11:02<samu>protecting it from twitch viewers
11:02<samu>or maybe a toggle button, show/hide
11:05<^Spike^>isn't that the show/hide button in xsplit/obs? ;)
11:07<@Alberth>it's stored in plain text in the openttd.cfg file, so displaying *** has no meaning anyway
11:07<@Alberth>just don't use an important password
11:07-!-zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:07<^Spike^>i think it's more to prevent viewers from randomly joining the game and the company he's in
11:07<Celestar>:P
11:07<^Spike^>which i can understand
11:07<@Alberth>/me wonders about a "****" password
11:08<^Spike^>cause twitch viewers can be a *&$()*@#$ :)
11:08<^Spike^>hehe
11:10<samu>yes, like spike says
11:10<^Spike^>but i would just go for a quick scene switch
11:11<^Spike^>or obscure the view where the pw is supposed to be in a scene
11:11<^Spike^>key bindings should make switching easy on that :)
11:11<^Spike^>but that's just on the obs/xsplit side :)
11:11<samu>what im doing right now is dragging the window
11:11<samu>outside the main view
11:12<^Spike^>or that
11:12<samu>password window dragging
11:12<^Spike^>but you could always make it a feature request if it's not there atm i can't say anything about when (devs are gonna hate me for this :))
11:13<samu>it's one of those "meh" requiests thoug
11:13<^Spike^>in the end if enough ppl want it... (yep and this is why the devs would hate me... for this comment :D))
11:14<@Alberth>like we run a democracy :p
11:15<^Spike^>hehe
11:15<^Spike^>well if you have 100 players ask for the same small thing are you gonna ignore it? :)
11:15<@Alberth>I never look at counts
11:15<^Spike^>:)
11:16<^Spike^>i try the same here
11:16<^Spike^>but if 10 customers say: it's broken
11:16<^Spike^>i can't say: Nope! :)
11:16<samu>http://www.twitch.tv/xarickpreto
11:16<samu>omg my password
11:16<^Spike^>well i can.... but my manager will prob kill me :)
11:19<roidal>is there a way to create a lake?
11:19<@Alberth>people actually watch this stuff?
11:19<@Alberth>roidal: make a hole, and a channel from the ocean
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11:19<@Alberth>then raise the channel again
11:20<roidal>hm
11:20<roidal>so there is no tool like "canal"
11:20<roidal>but only
11:20<roidal>"lake"?
11:20<roidal>:D
11:20<^Spike^>i think ppl would look weird at me if i watch twitch....
11:20<^Spike^>oh who am i kidding...
11:20*^Spike^ is running youtube on monitor 3 all day :)
11:21<@Alberth>ppl won't see the difference, except for it being a somewhat long YT movie :p
11:21<^Spike^>hehe
11:21<roidal>hm, what exactly is the difference game internally between "lake" and canal
11:22<roidal>it seems that "lake" converts canal?
11:23<@Alberth>we have different ship speeds for canals and non-canals (in some form of non-canals)
11:23<@Alberth>but I don't know the precise rule
11:23<roidal>k
11:23<roidal>ok, and rivers, is there a way to make a own river?
11:24<Eddi|zuHause>only in scenario editor
11:26<roidal>k
11:26<roidal>ty!
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11:44<@peter1138>Damn, Marten spent all weekend in bed...
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11:53<Eddi|zuHause>is that not what people do?
11:54<@peter1138>Well... not me :(
11:57<@Belugas>i wish i could. but not while been sick
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12:45<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r27141 /trunk/src/lang (indonesian.txt korean.txt) (2015-02-09 17:45:34 UTC)
12:45<@DorpsGek>-Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
12:45<@DorpsGek>indonesian - 57 changes by fanioz
12:45<@DorpsGek>korean - 3 changes by telk5093
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14:14<samu>who's been trying my newgrf?
14:14<samu>i see 530 downloads
14:15<frosch123>that means it is 4 days old
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14:16<DanMacK>@seen andythenorth
14:16<@DorpsGek>DanMacK: andythenorth was last seen in #openttd 21 hours, 10 minutes, and 19 seconds ago: <andythenorth> bye
14:18<samu>530 downloads means it's 4 days old? what the heck?
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14:18<frosch123>the majority of downloads is caused by people who download everything
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14:24<Wolf01>hi hi
14:24<@Alberth>moin
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14:25<chillcore>hello all ;)
14:27<chillcore>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pfvutcjny
14:27<chillcore>Alberth I threw that in your general direction yesterday but you had already left ;)
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14:28<chillcore>some more coding style in genworld_gui
14:29<chillcore>patches like these are fine or you prefer not?
14:30<chillcore>I mean I would not mind going over a few files now and then to change my mind a bit ...
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14:31<@Alberth>it looks like this code would be chopped to bits mostly
14:32<chillcore>how so? it is just trailing dots and there is only two comments I adjusted slighly
14:32<@Alberth>but it's all in the newgame code, which is planned to get turned upside down :p
14:32<chillcore>yes ...
14:32<@Alberth>in general, I rather sneak these changes in while doing other stuff
14:33<chillcore>hehe I can do other files ...
14:33<@planetmaker>sneaky Alberth :)
14:33<@Alberth>ssst! :p
14:33<chillcore>ok I understand ... it is just that I kinda plan of doing all files bit by bit
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14:34<chillcore>but as you wish ... there is plenty of other thing too
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14:36<andythenorth>o/
14:36<@planetmaker>hg log -u Alberth -r'keyword(-Doc)' --template='{desc}\n' | wc -l ----> returns 77 :)
14:36<Wolf01>nice... I just learned of real life math overflow
14:37<chillcore>don't mean to be nagging on but when we patchers do this in our patches (outside of code we modifie) Rubidiium tend to get a bit upset?
14:37<chillcore>damn keyboard ... grabbing cabled
14:40*andythenorth has been busy doing important things https://www.flickr.com/photos/andythenorth/16476001932/
14:43<frosch123>Wolf01: riemann sphere?
14:43<Wolf01>yeah
14:44<frosch123>circles and straight lines are the same :)
14:44<Wolf01>but just the sum of all natural numbers from 1 to +inf results to -1/12
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14:54<@Alberth>planetmaker: lots of doxymentation adding and pselling fixes, rather than just dots :)
14:55<@planetmaker>yeah, I know :) probably the search could be refined more :P
14:56<@planetmaker>but that's what I could quickly come up using revsets to search for it
14:57<andythenorth>ho station names aren’t going down well with Eddi|zuHause :)
14:57<chillcore>hmm not the right connectors ... shopping tomorrow and receiving strange look for asking where the cabled cabled are
14:57<chillcore>s cabled/keyboards
14:58<Wolf01>I had the same problem, had shopping time saturday and they had only wifi keyboards, then I was afraid to ask for a gaming cabled keyboard
15:00<chillcore>ok. so only dots mayhem if many other fixes are included ... gotcha. Alberth.
15:03<chillcore>Wolf01, I think this one is IR still ... when I point in the wrong direction it fails half of the time. and as I am in my sofa with keyboard on lap ...
15:07<@Alberth>dots are nice, but there are more interesting things to do :)
15:09<chillcore>yes indeed ... I just happened to have that file open ... I did think about adding extra comments at first but as you say that file is about to be garbled up ;)
15:09<@planetmaker>chillcore, it's no mistake to collect them
15:09<chillcore>And them dots need doing in the end anyways
15:10<chillcore>true planetmaker, but of little use if not commited at the same time? one commit and the patch has conflicts
15:10<chillcore>you'd still know where they are missing that I agree
15:11<@planetmaker>chillcore, yes... as alberth said, it often makes sense to commit them along with stuff which changes the vicinity anyway
15:11<@planetmaker>though I think his main argument is: it makes sense - except there where it's going to change anyway and where people have patch series which will break
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15:12<chillcore>where people have pacth series ... you mean the whole codebase :P
15:12<@planetmaker>(and no, this argument is not necessarily always consistent. It's a case by case argument ;) )
15:12<chillcore>I do get the point
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15:23<chillcore>quick question in regards of keeping consistancy in my coding style... which is prefered? "if (x == y) command;" or "x == y ? command;"
15:24<chillcore>going to clean up some of my if statements ...
15:25<frosch123>what? the latter is not even valid syntax?`
15:29<frosch123>anyway, if you mean the ? : operator, use it if the result of ( ? : ) is used
15:29<frosch123>use "if () {} else {}", if it is control flow only
15:30<chillcore>hmm ... right what was I thinking I thought I could omit the if ...
15:31<frosch123>well, and don't use the comma operator to trick that rule :p
15:31<@Alberth>we have some fine examples why that is a bad idea :p
15:32<chillcore>comma operator eh ... never used it ... at least not knowingly :P
15:32<frosch123>keep it like that :p
15:33<chillcore>thanks for the hint
15:34<chillcore>not very fond of my usage of extern neither ...
15:34<chillcore>it works but maintainability afterwards might suffer I think
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15:51<supermop>good morning
15:52<@planetmaker>hi hi
15:53<supermop>hows the top part of the world doing yesterday?
15:54<chillcore>warmer then yesterday, at least here ... hi supermop ;)
15:58<supermop>well might be close to 40 today and tomorrow
15:58<@planetmaker>close to 4°C today here ;)
15:59<supermop>or rather i think the forecast is 95 today because i still cant get used to using real temperature except for making coffee
15:59<supermop>maybe surf again tomorrow
16:00<supermop>I should make some more Dieter Trams
16:02<@planetmaker>hm... I dug out an ancient desktop. It has OpenTTD r12932 :P
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16:04<dreck>hi
16:06<@Alberth>o/
16:06<andythenorth>Iron Horse! http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=518175&nseq=12
16:08<dreck>andy doesn't that seem to share a cosmetic resemblence to the New Haven dual-cab carbody electric units?
16:09<dreck>ah name was easier than I thought..here http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/eb/New_Haven_EP5_1955.JPG/300px-New_Haven_EP5_1955.JPG
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16:10<andythenorth>yup
16:10<dreck>I dunno when it happened and why but also about that mesh over the window... Amtrak did the same thing to some of their own highspeed units for some apparent reason before
16:10<dreck>looks a bit ugly but meh
16:11<+glx>maybe to protect from birds
16:12<andythenorth>protects from kids throwing stones
16:12<dreck>ah, idiotic bridge patrons .. that would make sense
16:13<dreck>say that reminds me of a certain thomas story with Henry ... caused a bit problem as the initial release was worded "as black as niggers"
16:13<dreck>but the story was that some bored kids dropped stones onto the train causing several broken coach windows
16:14<+glx>broken window is not the main problem
16:14<+glx>but there can be people behing the window
16:14<+glx>*behind
16:15<dreck>the payback? (for anyone who may have not read it) the next visit .. henry was intentionally stuffed up then when they got close to the bridge henry left off a BIG sneeze of smoke causing the mischevious childrens to never ever come back to the bridge again
16:16<supermop>hey andy why cant my tropical citizens drink any of this fine coffee they are growing?
16:16<dreck>glx also believe it or not but some people still try putting coins and other small metal objects on the rails .. not a very good idea
16:19<dreck>anyway back to that other subject.. andy how about this for something a lot less flashy and more work in china? heh http://david-longman.com/sitebuilder/images/Fuxin_15_-_Electric_on_passenger_train-659x430.jpg
16:20<dreck>;)
16:20<chillcore>I used to to that as a kid ...putting coind on rails ... we did have the sense to hide behind the signalling house
16:20<chillcore>coins*
16:20<chillcore>still stupid though
16:24<samu>hi, i have yet some questions about cargo dist
16:25<dreck>how did your rigs go samu?
16:25<samu>some of my wood trucks have a last year profit that
16:25<andythenorth>supermop: dunno, they choose to export it
16:25<andythenorth>makes no sense to me, but eh
16:25<samu>is negative, higher than their running costs
16:26<samu>they are getting Cost: in some trips, how is that possible. I thought it would adjust itself in the end
16:26<@Alberth>http://wiki.openttd.org/Negative_income_with_feeder_service
16:28<supermop>not sure how much coffee is consumed in most coffee growing regions
16:28<supermop>quite high in VN though
16:29<supermop>wonder if an indochina economy would be much different
16:29<samu>my oil rig is finished. there's some side effect with it, but I can't do anything about it
16:29<samu>I'm gonna read that
16:29<supermop>just needs renaming something to be rice
16:30<supermop>nd add fishing grounds back in
16:31<dreck>allright then
16:31<dreck>at least hope you had fun samu
16:35<samu>i guess I gave a headache to some ppl here that were trying to help me
16:37<andythenorth>supermop: will probably do some Asian economy, not sure which sub-region
16:37<andythenorth>rice, maybe electronics
16:37<samu>at least something was fixed
16:37<samu>about the grfcodec or so
16:37*DanMacK wants a chance to do some Chinese steam
16:38<supermop>Vietnam has a small but varied assortment of locomotive history, SG and NG
16:38<supermop>i believe rest of indochina is all SG, as is Thailand and Malaysia
16:39<dreck>danmack as long as that includes the class that were the last ones to run in normal operations till late 90's or so .. I forgot the class but it was at least 4 or 5 coupled with the elephant ears too
16:39<dreck>coupled axles*
16:39<supermop>VN also has floating villages in case you want a reskin of a fishing ground
16:39<andythenorth>burma / malay states have rubber
16:39<supermop>lack of cliffs in ottd makes Ha Long bay pretty boring though
16:40<supermop>Burma has some mineral wealth I think
16:41<supermop>VN has large but undeveloped bauxite reserves, Gas and oil at sea contested with CN, and a lot of plastic and textile factories
16:41<supermop>Hmm, once you add in more than a couple SEA states you are just back to full firs with tropical names....
16:41<andythenorth>http://www.railpictures.net/showphotos.php?city=Namtu&country=Myanmar
16:42<andythenorth>it needs a subset
16:42<andythenorth>otherwise yeah, full FIRS
16:42<andythenorth>and it needs a distinctive gameplay
16:42<andythenorth>so Heart of Darkness is all about explorting primaries
16:42<supermop>Same issue with China
16:42<supermop>too big and varied
16:43<supermop>and subcontinent
16:43<chillcore>supermop: untill we get a rotating and tilting camera in openttd (and the shitload of graphics that goes with it) cliffs is a really bad idea because that will create invisible/unreachable areas.
16:43<supermop>even in the US you would need separate NE South and West regions
16:44<supermop>chillcore: best way to make karst formations until then is new objects i guess
16:44<chillcore>I dunno never gave it much thought after realising the above ...
16:44<dreck>anyway have to go for a while now sorry :-s
16:45<Eddi|zuHause>chillcore: an idea that was floating around was to introduce the ability to cut the terrain at a horizontal level
16:45<dreck>if anyone sees ngc..tell him I'll be back not too long later mr.sleepy :p
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16:45<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause: ?
16:45<Eddi|zuHause>chillcore: additionally, that would be a GUI for subterranean construction
16:45<supermop>Eddi|zuHause: that would have made locomotion playable for me
16:46<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: just don't display any tiles above y=<value>
16:46<Eddi|zuHause>like transparency
16:46<chillcore>there was a ptch for that ... underground construction ... not sure what happened to its development
16:46<andythenorth>makes sense
16:46<samu>i see, but there's still something very strange going on with cargo dist
16:46<Eddi|zuHause>chillcore: that was smatz's experiment
16:46<supermop>Fiance went to Burma but i couldn't take off enough time
16:46<supermop>these photos make me regret it
16:47<chillcore>I do not recall Supermop
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16:48<samu>I have 5 stations, 2 for 2 forests, 2 for 1 sawmill and 1 for another sawmill
16:48<samu>i have trucks picking lumber at where it was supposed to be accepted
16:49<samu>at one of the sawmill stations
16:49<Eddi|zuHause>samu: use "unload and no loading"
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16:50<samu>it takes it to transfer at one of the forest stations, and then I just get lost with it, it's like it's moving lumber around a couple times
16:50<samu>and once it really delivers it to a sawmill, I get the Cost
16:50<Eddi|zuHause>samu: it probably tries a zigzag route, because the direct link is saturated
16:51<Eddi|zuHause>samu: but this won't work properly, because the routes are not really an alternative
16:51<Eddi|zuHause>samu: with "unload and no loading" you prevent this alternate route
16:51<Diablo-D3>where does openttd store its user files on windows? ie, where is ~/.openttd
16:51<Eddi|zuHause>Diablo-D3: documents\openttd
16:52<Eddi|zuHause>or "my documents" in XP
16:52<andythenorth>always use ‘no loading’ with cargodist for deliveries
16:52<samu>oki
16:52<andythenorth>and ‘transfer and leave empty’ for transfers
16:52<Diablo-D3>Eddi|zuHause: thanks
16:53<andythenorth>anything else is prone to unwanted outcomes
16:53<Diablo-D3>also, Im surprised 1920x1080 doesnt appear in the resolution box
16:53<Diablo-D3>or 1280x720
16:53<Diablo-D3>seeing as I have a 16:9 monitor
16:53<Eddi|zuHause>Diablo-D3: that depends on what your graphics card driver reports
16:53<samu>1600x900
16:53<Diablo-D3>Eddi|zuHause: its a radeon, it shows up in other games =P
16:54<Diablo-D3>I just assume its GDI weirdness since no one legitimately uses that anymore
16:54<Eddi|zuHause>Diablo-D3: in any case, it's something outside the scope of openttd
16:54<Diablo-D3>yeah, I just had to manually edit the cfg
16:54<Diablo-D3>works now
16:56<samu>i got a radeon and i dont have that problem
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17:05<samu>cargo dist should be called cargo mess
17:05<samu>cargo split :p
17:06<samu>a more fitting name
17:07<Eddi|zuHause>so how would you distribute something without splitting it first?
17:11<samu>cargo with personality
17:12<samu>it's just quite confusing
17:12<samu>I understand it much better now, but still, sometimes... it surprises me
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17:14<andythenorth>it’s counter-intuitive
17:14<andythenorth>there is no convenient mental model, unless you understand graph theory
17:14<andythenorth>but it works
17:15<andythenorth>yacd was much more intuitive, but had the sad problem of not quite working
17:15<samu>"my name is wood. why are you taking me to that lumber mill? I don't like that lumber mill, I prefer the other one"
17:16<samu>:)
17:17<andythenorth>just keep your networks separate
17:17<andythenorth>*cargo networks
17:18<andythenorth>never supply two destinations from one source
17:18<andythenorth>unless it’s FIRS supplies :P
17:19*andythenorth -> bed
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17:38<chillcore>samu: what is strange about cargodist? Your vehicles have routes ad corgo wants to go somewhere, not always via the most logical (to you) route but that is what happens in the real world too ...
17:39<chillcore>drivers have their route and stuff gets shoved in the back that happens to be on their route, be it the final destination or a depot (transfer at station in this case)
17:40<chillcore>you can set it to manual ...
17:42<chillcore>^^^ for certain cargos so that only passengers are "cargodisted"
17:42<chillcore>or use explicit orders to overide cargodist for your wood trucks/trains
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18:21<chillcore>goodnight all
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18:40<dreck>hi
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18:47<Wolf01>'night
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---Logclosed Tue Feb 10 00:00:06 2015