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#openttd IRC Logs for 2015-03-13

---Logopened Fri Mar 13 00:00:34 2015
---Daychanged Fri Mar 13 2015
00:00<Katje>there is an unserviced oil refinery entirely in the way
00:04<Katje>production last month: 0 crates of goods (0% transported)
00:23<supermop>just have to wait
00:24<supermop>i think the more industries are on the map, the less likely that one will be chosen for closure
00:24<Katje>ah
00:32<DanMacK>Could always Ctrl+alt+C it
00:32<Katje>?
00:33<DanMacK>Ctrl+Alt+C and use the Magic Bulldozer
00:33<Katje>ah yes
00:33<Katje>was tryign to avoid that
00:33<DanMacK>well yeah...
00:41<Katje>I should bed
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00:48<Katje>*FINALLY* that oil refinery has closed
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01:10<supermop>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1144644#p1144644
01:10<supermop>damnit danmack left
01:28<Flygon_>supermop: I do wish the game could dynamically adjust for things such as driveways
01:28<Flygon_>Or, as you've pointed out
01:28<Flygon_>Tramlines
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04:15<frodus>Hi Guys, Just wanted to say that we now have a fully working docker.io container for OPENTTD :) So setting up a dedicated openttd server have never been easier
04:19<frodus>https://registry.hub.docker.com/u/bateau/openttd/ Let us know what you guys think :)
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04:39<alluke>has anyone got an idea how to install and use python scripts in gimp?
04:39<alluke>this piece of shit program cannot export layers into .psd
04:41<V453000>why do you use the piece of shit program then :D
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04:47<alluke>because someone thought it would be great idea to convert ALL the source files from psd to xcf
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04:50<alluke>saying that xcf is free, but i have never paid a single cent to adobe either
04:55<V453000>bad shit then :)
04:59<alluke>yep
05:03<alluke>yay success
05:04<alluke>had to export all the layers as png, then load into stack via photoshop script :)
05:07<V453000>nice enuf
05:09<@peter1138>So you pirated Adobe software?
05:10<@peter1138>And that makes it "free"
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05:12<alluke>yes?
05:15<@peter1138>xcf is free.
05:15<@peter1138>I can use it, I can modify it, I can do what I like with it.
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05:16<alluke>will adobe send you a bill if you save a file as .psd in gimp?
05:16<@peter1138>No, because I have no dealing with Adobe, including not pirating their software.
05:16<V453000>I dont think piracy is something that bad
05:17<V453000>if you pirate software, there is likelihood you will eventually buy it
05:17<V453000>if you use free software from start, you probably wont change
05:17<V453000>example, if someone models in blender for years, learning to use 3Dmax is annoying to say the least
05:18<V453000>and nobody will buy $5000 software just because they want to start learning it
05:18<@peter1138>Very very minimal likelihood.
05:18<@peter1138>To argue that software is free, because you pirated it... that is idiotic.
05:18<V453000>I dont say it is free
05:18<V453000>I say it isnt harming the author if you pirate it
05:19<@peter1138>V453000, alluke did.
05:19<V453000>because it is still making the software more used, and the lost profit is probably nonexistent since you would use free software instead
05:19<V453000>well sure alluke is an idiot, so idiotic
05:19<V453000>anything surprising? :P
05:20<alluke>ha ha
05:20<alluke>i couldnt care less about multi-million american corporations
05:20<@peter1138>"It's okay for me to use this software for free because I won't pay for it" is a stupid argument too.
05:21<V453000>sure but one argument doesnt mean that the whole thing is terrible :)
05:23<jonty-comp>yes but gimp is fucking awful anyway so any point is moot
05:23<V453000>XD
05:23<V453000>I wont argue against that because I also think it is
05:24<@peter1138>Gimp is terrible so it's okay to pirate Photoshop...
05:24<V453000>I think it is okay to pirate useful software in general
05:24<V453000>it makes more people use the software, and even if small part of them, even some will pay for it
05:24<V453000>and even those some is already an increase in profit for the company, instead of all those using free software
05:25<alluke>peter, how does that affect your life? do you own adobes shares?
05:25<V453000>another bullshit argument alluke
05:25<V453000>well done
05:25<alluke>what?
05:25<V453000>it matters in priciple obviously
05:26<alluke>yes of course
05:26<Ketsuban>Gimp won't get any better if people just waste time and bandwidth pirating Photoshop and complaining on forums that Gimp sucks in ways they can't elaborate on because they haven't used it in six years.
05:27<V453000>that applies to anything anywhere, and on both sides Ketsuban
05:27<V453000>that doesnt really make much sense
05:27<V453000>especially since then the pirating of photoshop furtherly helps Adobe to slow down progress of their competitor - Gimp
05:28<Ketsuban>Adobe can pay companies (in the form of discounted copies of Photoshop) to use Photoshop and tell them what sucks. The Gimp developers don't have that luxury.
05:29<V453000>with similar logic Adobe can also buy a nuclear weapon and get rid of Gimp
05:29<V453000>sure, money can solve that
05:53<juzza1>alluke: Can you have indexed palette and layers in psd? No. Can you use a unix command-line tool to export pngs directly from the source psd files? No (ignoring broken imagemagick export and slow&broken gimp export)
06:13<alluke>those dont sound really revolutionary features to me
06:14<alluke>indexing in ps and exporting as png don't take many clicks
06:17<@peter1138>It takes clicks at all.
06:18<@peter1138>That completely breaks automation.
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07:23<jonty-comp>i never pirated photoshop!
07:23<jonty-comp>although technically i'm not supposed to have CS2 at home, but they released it for free, so who cares
07:23<jonty-comp>at uni we had CS5 and it was lovely :(
07:25<V453000>the CC is just great
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07:45<Flygon_>...
07:45<Flygon_>My avatar is stupid
07:45*Flygon_ changes it
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07:46<Flygon_>Faaaaaaaaaaaaar better
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09:21<Samu>hi
09:22<Samu>maglev don't have tractive effort. how they work ?
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09:47<Leander_>it would have been faster to ask wikipedia
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09:49<Samu>what is tractife effort for maglev?
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10:00<V453000>none
10:00<V453000>just observe how it works :)
10:04<Samu>none means 0?
10:04<Samu>trying to put that into excel
10:05<V453000>the fuck do you need that for XD
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12:40<@Terkhen>hello
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13:45<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r27182 trunk/src/lang/luxembourgish.txt (2015-03-13 17:45:21 UTC)
13:45<@DorpsGek>-Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:45<@DorpsGek>luxembourgish - 4 changes by Phreeze
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14:28<Wolf01>hi o/
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15:38<andythenorth>o/
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15:42<andythenorth>does the cat even exist?
15:42<andythenorth>if it’s never found, how do we know it’s there?
15:42<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r27183 trunk/src/table/object_land.h (2015-03-13 19:42:49 UTC)
15:42<@DorpsGek>-Fix: GCC5 compilation
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15:49<andythenorth>eh
15:49<andythenorth>cargodist and “over-production”
15:49<andythenorth>how to fix?
15:51-!-shadowalkerAFK is now known as shadowalker
15:51<frosch123>add a waifu-mode setting
15:52<frosch123>sets all stations to fixed "50 items" of cargo waiting
15:54<andythenorth>winner
15:54<andythenorth>my prescription is ‘moar’ vehicles
15:55<V453000>CAT FOUND
15:55<andythenorth>which will raise station waitings
15:55<andythenorth>V453000: there’s a cat? o_O
15:55<TrueBrain>www.google.com
15:55<V453000>CAT EVERYWHERE
15:55<FLHerne>andythenorth: town-cargo production multiplier in settings, there's a patch for that
15:55<TrueBrain>has plenty of cats
15:55<V453000>EVERYTHING IS CAT
15:55<V453000>THAT IS THE SECRET
15:55<V453000>hi TB :)
15:55<TrueBrain>so tempted to do @kick ... but I like your humor too much :P
15:55<andythenorth>FLHerne: how does that fix it? o_O
15:56<FLHerne>Not so useful in multiplayer, but the sorts of styles where 'overloading' is a nuisance rather than a challenge don't work so well for that anyway
15:56<V453000>WAT
15:56<V453000>:(
15:56<TrueBrain>:D
15:57<V453000>TB I am completely relevant to 99% of andythenorth's lines in this channel
15:57<FLHerne>andythenorth: Reducing overloadedness-before-trying-something-else tends to spread loading quite evenly on anything not totally linear
15:57<TrueBrain>so many easy remarks to make ....
15:57<TrueBrain>so many ..
15:57<TrueBrain>*total overload*
15:57<V453000>asdf
15:57<TrueBrain>lkjh
15:58<frosch123>who is left-handed? :p
15:58<@peter1138>zxcv
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15:58<andythenorth>the thing with gaffer tape solutions
15:58<andythenorth>is that if they don’t work
15:58<andythenorth>you can add more tape
15:58<FLHerne>So CDist is already reasonable at not overloading particular routes when there's an option, IME, it just manages to overload the entire network simultaenously once the spare capacity runs out
15:59<FLHerne>"Duct tape is not a perfect solution to anything. But with a little creativity, in a pinch, it's an adequate solution to just about everything."
15:59<frosch123>andythenorth: what is the gaffer tape solution to the problem of not having enough gaffer tape?
15:59<andythenorth>frosch123: that’s a meta problem
15:59<TrueBrain>more gaffer tape, duh
16:00<andythenorth>is there a solution where more transport doesn’t produce more cargo?
16:01<FLHerne>andythenorth: Your nice supplies mechanic applied to towns?
16:01<V453000>is the question "would it be a dumb solution" ? :P
16:02<FLHerne>Growth rate 0 for 0 crates goods, multipliers up to some limit if you pile in a lot
16:02<TrueBrain>*lolz*
16:02<andythenorth>ho ho, TTD is missing http://www.bbc.co.uk/timelines/zt23gk7
16:02<andythenorth>we made all the good games except Doom
16:02<FLHerne>People keep thinking that goods increases growth rate, so maybe it ought to :P
16:02<TrueBrain>what is this TTD you talk about?
16:04<andythenorth>a thing from 1994
16:04<andythenorth>or so
16:04<andythenorth>dunno
16:04<andythenorth>it’s dead and buried I guess
16:05<V453000>or dying
16:05<TrueBrain>HARTMASSAGE
16:05<TrueBrain>SAFE IT
16:05<TrueBrain>NOW
16:05<V453000>IMA MAKE SOME 32BPP
16:06<V453000>HOPE IT HELPS
16:06<TrueBrain>WE NEED MORE CAPSLOCK TO SAFE IT
16:06<V453000>MOAR PIXULZ R THE SOLUTION
16:06<TrueBrain>BUT THE GAME IS NOT REALISTIC!
16:07<V453000>oh shet
16:07-!-Klanticus [~quassel@179.234.179.109] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:07<V453000>lets increase vehicle scale to times 4 then
16:07<V453000>hope it solves shit
16:07<V453000>train as big as 2 houses
16:07<V453000>no problem
16:07<andythenorth>moar capacity
16:07<frosch123>just at a 3 in front of the year
16:08<frosch123>*add
16:08<V453000>... am actually doing that :P https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/20419525/DOOM/CHOOCHOOO3.png
16:08<frosch123>trains move that fast in 31955
16:08<TrueBrain>cool :D
16:12<TrueBrain>if we do not have teleports in 31955 I am going to be really upset
16:14<frosch123>there are, but they are considered uncool
16:14<TrueBrain>for the plebs
16:14<TrueBrain>real people go by train :D
16:23<andythenorth>what about real cats?
16:32<TrueBrain>cooked or fried?
16:37<andythenorth>dunno, which do you prefer?
16:47<V453000>baked
16:49<TrueBrain>boiled
16:49<TrueBrain>like a lobster!
16:52<andythenorth>also bye
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16:53<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r27184 /trunk/src/lang (36 files in 2 dirs) (2015-03-13 20:53:29 UTC)
16:53<@DorpsGek>-Cleanup: remove some removed strings
16:54<@DorpsGek>Commit by rubidium :: r27185 trunk/src/window.cpp (2015-03-13 20:54:35 UTC)
16:54<@DorpsGek>-Fix: prevent the compiler from optimizing an assignment away which caused GCC 5 to actually crash
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17:35<Samu>TerronAI crashed
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17:46<Samu>daium, ChooChoo is a really slow pathfinder
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18:30<Samu>I m slightly disappointed by ChooChoo, it station spreads
18:30<Samu>cheater
18:30<Samu>and its pathfinder takes soo much time
18:31<ST2>a cheater AI... whoooohooo \o/
18:31<Samu>5 game years to built a rail connection to a junction
18:31<Samu>then 5 other years to built the rest for the way back
18:32<ST2>any Admiral running? somehow I liked that AI ^^
18:32<Samu>AdmiralAI was tested a few days ago
18:33<Samu>it doesn't clear failed train stations
18:33<Samu>its pathfinding is relatively slow for my liking, but not as slow as choochoo
18:35<Samu>may take 1 year before completing a route or giving up
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18:35<Samu>choochoo is currently 20 years in-game and still pathfinding :(
18:37<Samu>i have choochoo vs terron
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18:40<Samu>I wish NoCarGoal could just stop popup the storybook every year
18:47<Samu>i see what choochoo is trying to do, a nice feeder system with trains and buses
18:48<Samu>but I don't quite understand what's the junction for
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19:18<Samu>no money :(
19:29<Wolf01>'night
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19:53<@Terkhen>good night
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21:13<bereasonable>Hey guys - just have a signal question, wondering if anyone could take a look at it for me. http://i.imgur.com/hPvY7rN.png It's an entry signal that is showing red, but I've got a green exit signal afterwards. What gives? (I'm a pretty big newb so I'm probably missing something obvious)
21:15<bereasonable>I'm thinking it might be something to do with the angle of the track - I've got a similar setup with more space and it works fine.
21:16<Supercheese>change everything to path signals
21:16<Supercheese>avoid headaches like that
21:16<Supercheese>pull those two signals at the front of the station there and convert the rest to path signals
21:17<Supercheese>oh, and you'll have to edit the tracks at the end of the station to add another signal there
21:17<Supercheese>I can illustrate, one moment
21:22<Supercheese>Ok so: http://i.imgur.com/7Tb99Ro.png at the end of your station as shown you have a problem, there is no signal in the area corresponding to the red circle in my image. You'll want to edit the track so you can stick a signal immediately after the station as shown in the green circle at bottom.
21:23<Supercheese>and as you can see, only 1 path signal is needed right before the branch in front of the station, and 1 signal per platform immediately behind the station
21:28<bereasonable>Oh!
21:28<bereasonable>Brilliant.
21:29<bereasonable>So I don't need to futz around with those entrance-exit bollocks? the paths will sort themselves out?
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21:31<bereasonable>Yep! I made those changes, and it's working. Thanks so much. So should I just universally use one-way paths? are they much simpler than the entrance/exit/block stuff? or are they just different?
21:37<Supercheese>Yeah, much simpler
21:37<Supercheese>follow the paradigm of "only place signals where you want trains to wait", so right before branches and right after platforms
21:38<Supercheese>and of course spaced at intervals along the mainline
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23:43<DanMacK>Anyone alive in here? lol
23:44<Pikkaphone>Nope
---Logclosed Sat Mar 14 00:00:51 2015