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#openttd IRC Logs for 2015-05-27

---Logopened Wed May 27 00:00:04 2015
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02:11<Pikka>exactly
02:13<andythenorth>yes
02:13*andythenorth has probably finished vomiting now
02:13<andythenorth>also a bonus
02:13<Pikka>that's definitely a good thing
02:14<andythenorth>seems better
02:14<andythenorth>all things consdered
02:14<andythenorth>FIRS Ports eh
02:15<Pikka>does it?
02:16<andythenorth>think so
02:16*andythenorth should code ‘level up’ for supplies
02:17<andythenorth>looks like a day in bed for me, owing to gastric reasons
02:17<Pikka>as long as you have a computer in reach, no reason not to have FIRS all fixed up by tonight, right?
02:17<andythenorth>by lunchtime probably
02:17<andythenorth>totally 2.0
02:17<Pikka>then you can make a start on roadtypes
02:18<andythenorth>done by teatime
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02:40*andythenorth makes pixels
02:40<andythenorth>Pikka: have you worded then?
02:40<Pikka>the uni words? yes
02:40<Pikka>the industry words, not yet.
02:43<andythenorth>one thing at a time
02:43<andythenorth>or two
02:45<andythenorth>silos at the grain mill eh?
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09:44<supermop>some day i hope to play Eddi|zuHause 's train set
09:59<Eddi|zuHause>don
09:59<Eddi|zuHause>'t hold your breath
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10:55<kamnet>Any NFO ninjas hiding in here?
10:55<@Alberth>we probably wouldn't know, would we? :)
10:55<kamnet>Well, I'm assuming an NFO ninja would know if they're hiding here.
10:56<@Alberth>true, but if he told you, he wouldn't be hiding :)
10:56<@Alberth>but there is very little nfo talk here, in general
10:57<kamnet>Not anymore, no. but if I were to need his or her assistance, how else would I know?
10:58<kamnet> Well fiddle-faddle. i was hoping to get an answer today.
10:58<@Alberth>in general, you don't know, until you get an answer
11:06<kamnet> Meh. Guess I'll go post it.
11:07<@Alberth>probably a good idea
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11:20<@Alberth>kamnet: euhm sure you posted in the right forum?
11:21<kamnet>Did I? Hm good question. Lemmie go look.
11:22<kamnet>Well, of course I didn't! Why would I do that?
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11:25<@Alberth>but if that's all, my guess is that you can simply delete the nfo
11:26<@Alberth>the 8 action is identification of the grf, and the A action is 'replace a TTD sprite'
11:31<kamnet>AH! Now I think I got it.
11:32<kamnet>So I should be able to replace 2 * 5 0A 01 12 2D 04 with 2 * 4 01 04 01 02, yes?
11:32<@Alberth>it's Graphics Development instead of OpenTTD Development ?
11:33<kamnet>*headdesk* Lord help me. I'm not having a good day today.
11:33<kamnet>I'm trying to distract myself, really. My cat injured himself last night andd he can't be seen by a doctor until tomorrow.
11:34<@Alberth>as for your suggestion, don't know. My Ninja-ness of action 1 is less than present, unfortunately :(
11:34<@Alberth>:(
11:34<kamnet>well I guess I could just try it. What's the worst that can happen?
11:34<@Alberth>crash of openttd, probably
11:34<@Alberth>but that's not a real problem
11:35<kamnet>As long as it doesn't activate Skynet
11:35<@Alberth>we hope that every time :)
11:35<Eddi|zuHause>you should never be able to crash openttd with a newgrf
11:36<Eddi|zuHause>kamnet: maybe you should look at m4nfo for station making, and then just put the sprites in there
11:38<kamnet>I'd consider it if I was going to do anything more than just convert this one over
11:39<Eddi|zuHause>that is really the same effort
11:40<Eddi|zuHause>turning the actionA into an action1 is the least of your problems...
11:40<Eddi|zuHause>because an unused action1 really does nothing at all.
11:41<Eddi|zuHause>all the other station infrastructure, like categorizing it into the GUI, defining a spritelayout, making it compatible with railtypes, etc. is not in the old .exe
11:47<kamnet>*grumbles* Yeah... arglebargle.
11:47<kamnet>alright bbiab
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12:05<@Alberth>hi hi
12:05<andythenorth>o/
12:06<kamnet>Good afternoon
12:06<kamnet>Or evening
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12:26<@Alberth>o/
12:26<frosch123>hoi
12:28<andythenorth>quak
12:28<frosch123>kamnet: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=62069 <- the grf2nfo is useless, you can only reuse the sprites, nothing of the nfo. start from scratch :)
12:29<kamnet>This may be more of a headache than I want right now :D
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12:51<frosch123>None does not compare with None, right?
12:51<frosch123>so, None sucks, i need some NO_PARAMETER
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12:58<@Alberth>?
12:58<@Alberth>None == None gives True
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12:59<frosch123>oh, it does?
13:00<@Alberth>maybe you are confused with NaN? :)
13:01<@Alberth>as None is a singleton, you're recommended to use None is None
13:02<frosch123>well, i am comparing lists
13:02<frosch123>and some members may be None
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13:05<@Alberth>[0, None] == [None, None] is False
13:06<@Alberth>or pair-wise: for a, b in zip([0, None], [None, None]): if a == b: ...
13:12<frosch123>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pvqtvtuku?/pvqtvtuku <- ok, that leaves only the ugly ternary :)
13:14<@Alberth>can't you do that in the bottom hunk?
13:15<frosch123>it uses the base_cmd inbetween
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13:16<frosch123>and it needs to compare literal with get_translated_cmd
13:16<frosch123>hmm, though one could remove the entire if think
13:16<frosch123>and always compare per element
13:17<@Alberth>I'd rewrite to explicit loops with an 'if', or insert a function in it
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13:30<frosch123>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pguqqq4ko?/pguqqq4ko <- now the diff is unreadable though :p
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13:35<@Alberth>since the length of both lists matches:
13:35<@Alberth> for base_name, lng_name in zip(base_info.commands, lng_info.commands): if base_name is not None: base_name = base_name.get_translated_cmd(); # similar with lng_name
13:35<@Alberth>otherwise seems fine
13:37<frosch123>weird stuff :)
13:37<@Alberth>bit of functional programming :)
13:38<frosch123>but i cannot get the "i" for the position
13:38<Eddi|zuHause>enumerate(zip(blah))
13:38<@Alberth>ha! for i, (base_name, lng_name) in enumerate(zip(base_info.commands, lng_info.commands)): ...
13:38<Eddi|zuHause>for i, (a, b) in enumerate(zip(x,y))
13:38<frosch123>2i, (base_name, lng_name) in enumerate(zip())" <- are you sure?
13:39<frosch123>isn't that a bit silly? :p
13:40<Eddi|zuHause>why?
13:40<@Alberth>for i, base_lng in enumerate(zip(base_info.commands, lng_info.commands)): base_name, lng_name = base_lng; ... :p
13:41<frosch123>it's as magic as c++'s template selection
13:42<Eddi|zuHause>i don't understand your problem
13:42<@Alberth>it's just 2 function-calls nested
13:42<frosch123>that's not the problem :)
13:43<frosch123>the weirdness is the left side of the "="
13:43<frosch123>assining nested touples to single variables
13:44<Eddi|zuHause>i do that all the time in CETS
13:44<@Alberth>well, you can unpack as a next statement if you like
13:44<frosch123>no, it's fine, it's just magic that it works
13:44<@Alberth>but unpacking and packing is very common Python idiom
13:45<andythenorth>weird the first time you see it
13:45*andythenorth has learnt to trust the magic :P
13:45<@Alberth>in time, you'll miss it in other languages :)
13:47<frosch123>i doubt that
13:47<frosch123>dynamically typed languages remain terrible
13:48<@Alberth>oh, the number of times I have wanted to do unpacking in Java or C++.... :)
13:48<frosch123>due to the lack of proper syntax checks at compilation
13:49<@Alberth>I run a lot of pylint and friends on Python code
13:49-!-FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:49<@Alberth>unfortunately, pylint crashes on the newgrf_info file
13:52<frosch123>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/ponhg7ag6?/ponhg7ag6 <- that reduces it to the additional language pragmas
13:53<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r27293 /trunk/src/lang (62 files in 2 dirs) (2015-05-27 19:53:35 +0200 )
13:53<@DorpsGek>-Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
13:53<@DorpsGek>traditional_chinese - 4 changes by siu238X
13:53<@DorpsGek>danish - 4 changes by beruic
13:54<V453000>watup humanz
13:54<V453000>0 desyncs frosch :)
13:54<frosch123>magic :) two translators change 62 files :p
13:54<frosch123>V453000: play more :p
13:54<V453000>XD
13:54<V453000>cant
13:55<V453000>I actually built so much shit lately that
13:55<V453000>I cant even think of more improvements in openttd anymore
13:55<V453000>for the time being
13:55*andythenorth can
13:55<andythenorth>want a list?
13:55<V453000>I dont mean functional and feature wise andy
13:55<V453000>just "what more can you build with the current shit"
14:03<@Alberth>frosch123: ponhg7ag6 looks fine
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14:12<frosch123>Alberth: the stuff in language_info is actually only used when creating a new translation, right?
14:13<@Alberth>and for listing available languages, and probably for sanity checking
14:13<frosch123>well, but it does not enforce the plural form, or the case/gender names
14:14<@Alberth>ah, could be, I was lenient for the newgrf author :)
14:14<frosch123>well, it would also involve some tricky conversions :p
14:14<frosch123>so, possibly we also just store the other pragmas?
14:14<@Alberth>hmm, perhaps language deductions from filename or so, for game scripts
14:15<frosch123>i.e. allow any ##pragma for the openttd project type?
14:15<@Alberth>and keep language_info ?
14:16<frosch123>well, we need that nevertheless
14:16<@Alberth>yesterday you proposed to read it from file
14:16<frosch123>but if eints would just preserve the ##pragmas we do not have to validate them before commit
14:16<frosch123>so, eints does not be up-to-date on edge
14:16<frosch123>it only needs to know the languages at all
14:16<frosch123>but not all the details
14:17<@Alberth>sounds fair enough, I have no use for currencies etc
14:17<frosch123>[20:16] <Alberth> yesterday you proposed to read it from file <- yes, i would still like to see that
14:17<@Alberth>k, but only read a subset
14:17<@Alberth>would be fine
14:17<@Alberth>and then assume any other ##thingie is comment
14:18<frosch123>eints likely needs: name, ownname, isocode, plural, grflangid, gender, case
14:18<frosch123>it does not need: textdir, digisep, digitsepcur, decimalsep, winlangid
14:19<frosch123>it also only needs plural, gender and case for new translations
14:19<@Alberth>I even wonder about ownname, but possible
14:19<frosch123>which would never be the case in the case of openttd
14:19<frosch123>https://translator.openttdcoop.org/languages <- well, ownname looks pretty :p
14:20<@Alberth>quite :)
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15:11<Wolf01>hi hi
15:12<Wolf01>today performance: outstanding; mood: appalling; I should fix it
15:14<andythenorth>L)
15:14<andythenorth>:) even
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15:33<V453000>frosch123: I think the railtype bridge overlays for reserved tracks are misaligned by a few pixels ... I dont think it is newgrf problem
15:34<V453000>it should be 3px to the left
15:34<V453000>at x1
15:35<V453000>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/20419525/reserved_bridges.png
15:35<V453000>on sloped tracks without bridges it is fine
15:36<V453000>hm, or is purr wrong?
15:38*andythenorth hates slow compiles :(
15:39<andythenorth>I have a LESS compile for a UI that takes 4 seconds :(
15:39<andythenorth>so boring
15:42<frosch123>V453000: the railtype sprites are drawn in the exact same position
15:42<frosch123>one is track+underlay, the other is only track
15:50<V453000>ok so my bridge overlays are moved
15:50<V453000>hm
15:50<V453000>thats shit
15:50<V453000>basically means the bridge heads they are aligned against are wrong XD
15:51<V453000>... btw both should be track + sprite?
15:53<frosch123>"+ sprite"?
15:53<frosch123>both are sprites, yes :p
15:57<V453000>k. :D
15:57<V453000>anyway, gnight
15:57<V453000>moar research later
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16:15*andythenorth ponders
16:15<andythenorth>FIRS builders yard is meh
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16:24<andythenorth>hmm
16:24<andythenorth>FIRS uses tile location checks
16:24<andythenorth>which iirc, means no terraforming to build the industry
16:27<andythenorth>which might be why FIRS industries are so much less evenly distributed than default industries
16:29<andythenorth>the ‘flat space’ OpenTTD setting has no effect when FIRS is used
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17:04<frosch123>Error: {G=..} may only be used for the default string (that is, without case extension) <- someone knows whether that is true, and if why?
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17:07<frosch123>it is
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17:09<Wolf01>nighty night
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---Logclosed Thu May 28 00:00:05 2015