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#openttd IRC Logs for 2015-12-28

---Logopened Mon Dec 28 00:00:39 2015
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00:40<__ln__>guten morgen
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---Logclosed Mon Dec 28 02:44:23 2015
---Logopened Mon Dec 28 03:00:05 2015
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03:43<V453000>hfeyoo
03:43<V453000>-f
03:43<frosch123>hoi
03:44<V453000>seen http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=188719 ? :)
03:44<frosch123>yes
03:44<frosch123>hmm, didn't notice the maglev last time
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03:46<V453000>I bet andy will tell me something more :P
03:47*V453000 slaps andythenorth
03:47<andythenorth>lo
03:47<V453000>seen them trax?
03:48<V453000>http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=188719
03:50<frosch123>the most weird part is at 1415,217
03:50<V453000>the extra sleeper?
03:50<V453000>not checking the coords yet, guessing
03:50<frosch123>no, rail continuation in corners
03:50<frosch123>1 out of 8 looks weird
03:51<andythenorth>track looks a bit ON30 or so http://www.geocities.jp/karatcreek/O-16NigorigoTramway_j.htm
03:51<andythenorth>that’s not a bad thing
03:52<V453000>ah well
03:52<V453000>hm.
03:52<V453000>I am not sure how far fixable is that frosch123
03:52<V453000>haha andy and toys :P cute stuff
03:53<@peter1138>did that patch to allow artists to provide all combos ever make it?
03:53<V453000>did that patch get finished?
03:53<V453000>I would also be interested
03:53<@peter1138>hmm i think it was done but never tested
03:54<V453000>but yeah that would be lovely
03:54<V453000>junctions are the biggest issue with tracks
03:54<V453000>especially the 3D ones
03:55<V453000>but honestly in this case I am not having as much of an issue with this little glitch
03:55<V453000>and even in pre-defined junction layout it would still have to be solved somehow
03:55<V453000>but yeah there would be room for fixing
03:56<@peter1138>it would be much easier to fix though
03:56<V453000>yes, definitely
03:56<andythenorth>V453000: proportions are good for chibi
03:56<andythenorth>don’t add any more realisms, it’s enough
03:56<V453000>yeah they are rather large
03:57<V453000>fuck realisms is the spirit of brix
03:57<V453000>sooo yeah
03:58<andythenorth>V453000: almost like this :P http://www.mbswindon.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/2012_06_24-Coate-Roadshow-Tom-02.jpg
03:58<andythenorth>yetis can ride on top
03:58<V453000>holy shit XD
03:59*andythenorth biab
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04:07<@peter1138>so, er, can vs2015 build openttd?
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04:35<@Rubidium>peter1138: it has been able to do so
04:36<@Rubidium>not sure whether the current version compiles, but a new CF instance with Windows 10 and MSVC 2015 exists on the server
04:36<V453000>Rubidium: happen to remember anything about the patch allowing newgrf to define all junction combinations for tracks? :)
04:37<@peter1138>it'll need updating
04:37<@peter1138>it's for r25013
04:37<@peter1138>http://git.fuzzle.org/openttd.git/log/?h=railtype_nocombine
04:38<@peter1138>actually it's tiny, might just apply
04:39<@Rubidium>V453000: I remember peter1138 doing something with that around r25k ;)
04:39<@peter1138>haha
04:39<V453000>:P
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04:58<@peter1138>yeah, git rebase master was able to work :p
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05:18<@peter1138>http://git.fuzzle.org/openttd.git/log/?h=railtype_nocombine_rebase
05:18<@peter1138>magic eh
05:19<@peter1138>it might even compile... i dunno
05:23<V453000>please get it to work :>
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06:48<Eddi|zuHause>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5R6LnsOwzTs
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07:27<Wolf01>o/
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07:42<Wolf01>finally i can browse the internet without worrying about star wars spoilers \o/
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07:45<Flygon>I'm growing very fond of all these mid-range Steam Locos in OTTD
07:45<Flygon>The 2CC ones
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08:16<@DorpsGek>Commit by michi_cc :: r27481 trunk/src/os/windows/win32.cpp (2015-12-28 14:16:41 +0100 )
08:16<@DorpsGek>-Fix: [Win32] Stdin/out/err need to be re-assigned differently if the runtime lib of MSVC2015 is used.
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10:41<andythenorth>o/
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10:46<Wolf01>o/
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11:08<debdog>http://pics.nase-bohren.de/german-school.jpg
11:08<alluke>bahahh
11:09*alluke waits for german to get offended
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11:33*debdog is german. "the o/ and \o reminded me of that sign"
11:34<Wolf01>good, so i propose to switch to a new greet... maybe 8=D doesn't offend anyone
11:35<andythenorth>offfends me :P
11:35<andythenorth>more chars
11:36<Wolf01>🐱 <- too bad this doesn't seem to work
11:36<Wolf01>at least not for everyone
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11:38<Wolf01>or this one 🐈
11:38<alluke>
11:39<debdog>uhm, I wasn't serious. don't care about the \o
11:39<Eddi|zuHause>that first one worked
11:39<Eddi|zuHause>the first one is a cat face, the second only a rectangle
11:39<Eddi|zuHause>and the third is a triangle with a huge space underneath (like 5 lines)
11:41<Wolf01>i can see mines but not the alluke one, so the outcome seem to be pretty random
11:41<Eddi|zuHause>depends on your font, mostly
11:41<alluke>its apple logo
11:41<alluke>visible only on iDevices
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11:45<Wolf01>🖐🚂👤👤👤
11:46<Eddi|zuHause>none of those worked
11:46<Wolf01>good
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11:49<@peter1138>Works here.
11:52*andythenorth sticks to o/
11:56<Wolf01>http://emojipedia.org/steam-locomotive/ lol, samsung always overengineering everything
12:00<Wolf01>bored... tried to code some more of my game, got annoyed by coordinate positioning of objects, now bored and depressed
12:04<andythenorth>3D or 2D co-ordinate space?
12:05<Wolf01>2D
12:05<andythenorth>what’s the problem? o_O
12:05<V453000>xd
12:06<V453000>andythenorth: remember offsets? :P
12:06<andythenorth>yup
12:06<V453000>I guess that is the shit he is going through
12:06<andythenorth>you have objects yes / no?
12:06<Wolf01>half of the game with offset and half of the game without offset, half of the game with centered sprites and the other half just at the exact coordinates
12:06<Wolf01>rotations and shit
12:07<V453000>mostly shit
12:07<andythenorth>your objects have an internal co-ordinate system
12:07<andythenorth>and you have a global co-ordinate space
12:07<andythenorth>and you may have intermediate containers
12:08<andythenorth>but basically it’s all just add/subtract
12:08<andythenorth>as long as you get the signs right
12:08<andythenorth>even flash developers can do it :P
12:08<V453000>XD
12:09<Wolf01>yes i know, i'm trying to switch the object with offsets to an internal coordinate system
12:09<andythenorth>you want to be able to reference the object reliably from the main loop or whatever without pissing about with offsets :)
12:09<andythenorth>let the object sort that out
12:09<andythenorth>and rotation
12:09<andythenorth>rotation and loc. point are internal props of the object
12:09<andythenorth>(imho)
12:10<Wolf01>but i need to change a lot of things now, only because i didn't even think about that at the first stage of development, i was too in hurry to get something moving on the screen
12:11<andythenorth>standard
12:11<andythenorth>when I started making games, it took me 5 or 6 flash games before I got anything clean
12:11<andythenorth>but we shipped the first 5 or 6 anyway, they worked fine :)
12:12<andythenorth>also I made another 10 or so games in macromedia director before that :P
12:12<andythenorth>you’ll end up making a framework :P
12:12<andythenorth>all games projects result in a reusable framework, which is never reused :D
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12:15<qwebirc25831>I need help witb activating an AI in single player mode
12:17-!-qwebirc25831 [~oftc-webi@173-216-61-102-eldr.mid.dyn.suddenlink.net] has quit []
12:17<V453000>way to get help
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12:27<Wolf01>the nice thing is that i already made this game, with a different system (gamemaker) and now i'm just rewriting it in c# with monogame/xna just to learn it better... but i have to replicate a lot of things which i don't have (i had to find and integrate even a circle drawing function because there isn't anything out of the box in monogame/xna
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12:46<andythenorth>:)
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12:55<@Alberth>moin
12:59<Wolf01>o/
13:00<andythenorth>lo Alberth :)
13:00<@Alberth>hi hi
13:01<andythenorth>I have been reading your PMs, but I had an OpenTTD break ;)
13:02<@Alberth>np, I suspected as much :)
13:02<@Alberth>had a good time I hope?
13:06<andythenorth>yup
13:12<V453000>:0 break
13:12<V453000>what is that word
13:13<__ln__>his OpenTTD broke down, that must be it
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13:18<andythenorth>:P
13:18<V453000>so my BRIX announcement has 15 upvotes but only 1 person actually told me what they think
13:18<V453000>that is a poor ratio of YES vs. actual opinion
13:19<V453000>I am assuming on forums it is very similar
13:19<@Alberth>I think the track layer was drunk, but the tracks themselves are looking very good, especially giving the weird tricks you did :)
13:20<@Alberth>but indeed "upvote" has a lot of not so useful uses :p
13:20<V453000>yeah :D
13:21<V453000>well track layer is old AI on drugs
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13:45<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r27482 trunk/src/lang/irish.txt (2015-12-28 19:45:35 +0100 )
13:45<@DorpsGek>-Update from Eints:
13:45<@DorpsGek>irish: 23 changes by tem
13:48<@Alberth>:o looks weird :p
13:53<LordAro>:D
13:53<LordAro>grats Alberth
13:53<LordAro>also o/
13:53<@Alberth>:D, and hi hi
13:54<LordAro>i just noticed i've been scrolled up, so i've been more than a day behind
13:55<LordAro>and now, i'm going to watch star wars
13:55<LordAro>...again
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14:09<TrueBrain>Alberth: I agree, looks weird :P
14:10<@Alberth>evenink :)
14:14<andythenorth>offroad truck on back of offroad truck :) http://www.offroadvehicle.ru/AZBUCAR/CATCO/Crowley-CATCO-Arctic-All-Terrain.jpg
14:14<V453000>typical andythenorth picture
14:14<andythenorth>yair
14:15<andythenorth>the engines are running on both vehicles :)
14:15<andythenorth>I should get that crazy russian truck game
14:15<@Alberth>I saw, probably to avoid freezing the engines :)
14:17*andythenorth looks at spintires
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14:22*peter1138 spins his tyres for andythenorth
14:23*andythenorth had probably better get back on the pixel treadmill
14:23<V453000>XD
14:23<andythenorth>I have built all the Lego, and Mariokart is now banned, by me, due to kids can’t cope with it
14:24<V453000>pixel creating slave camp consisting of 1 puny human
14:24<andythenorth>Wolf01: finished the Volvo, and the green racecar ;)
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15:28<Wolf01>andy, the store where i was trying to purchase a second volvo has most of the sets out of stock, i'll have to wait until february :(
15:29<andythenorth>what will you do with it? B model?
15:29<Wolf01>no, i think i'll do a backhoe loader
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15:38<andythenorth>sell me the big wheels, I’m going to do a mining truck :)
15:38<Wolf01>ahah i'll keep them to double the volvo's ones :D
15:41<andythenorth>https://youtu.be/zJQ-89Tu7iI?t=17s
15:41<andythenorth>I can get all the new panels in white, and they’re cheap
15:41<andythenorth>but white for *everything* might be hard :P
15:43<Wolf01>i think you won't find the white wheel rims
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15:53<andythenorth>nah, would have to be grey probably
15:53*andythenorth looks
15:55<andythenorth>ah, fits this, which is available in white http://alpha.bricklink.com/pages/clone/catalogitem.page?P=2998#T=P&C=1
15:55<andythenorth>and I have 6 of them already, from a failed MOC :)
15:55<andythenorth>but it’s an ugly wheel
15:56*Zuu battles with naming conventions in JavaScript
15:56<andythenorth>LikeThis
15:56<Zuu>likeThat :-)
15:57<andythenorth>arrayUnsureOfPurpose
15:57<andythenorth>flash style :P
15:58<Zuu>I learned that the JS way is that only functions that act as constructors should start with an upper case.
15:58<Zuu>With respect of this being defined by the caller. :-)
15:58<andythenorth>or you could name things like more than one fricking idiot I’ve seen
15:58<andythenorth>var a = 10
15:58<andythenorth>function b(c, d) {}
15:59<andythenorth>var d = 20
15:59<Zuu>That's minified code :-)
15:59<andythenorth>b(a, d)
15:59<andythenorth>yes but a worrying number of people actually write this raw
15:59<andythenorth>‘for optimisation reasons'
15:59<andythenorth>yeah right
16:00<Zuu>I am rather the opposite. Often using sometimes a bit too long names. :-)
16:00<andythenorth>me too
16:00<andythenorth>readable
16:00<andythenorth>searchable
16:00<@Alberth>nah, just using too few spaces :p
16:01<andythenorth>if you have a 5000 file codebase (including a big framework), being able to search for my_long_variable_name_that_is_unique is really handy
16:01<andythenorth>but you can kind of see how the “optimisers” get into the mess they do
16:01<andythenorth>“it’s smaller to download"
16:02<andythenorth>“it’s faster to execute” (allegedly, for a very dubious understanding of modern computers”
16:02<andythenorth>“it fits in my 80 char window easily"
16:02<Zuu>following likeThis(), my static modules should probably change to lower case. So only modules/"classes" ment to be constructed use upper case.
16:02<andythenorth>“I don’t have to think up meaningful names, it’s all just mathematical relations to my algorithm-focussed brain"
16:02<@Alberth>"you can write a script to minimize var names in production code"
16:03<andythenorth>somehow they don’t make that step :P
16:03<andythenorth>also debugging minified JS is a total PITA :)
16:03<@Alberth>I can only agree to that, even though I have no experience with it :)
16:04<Zuu>I learn't about sourcemaps but haven't yet added it to my gulpfile.
16:04*andythenorth wonders if shorter var names really are faster to execute :P
16:04<V453000>omg
16:04<V453000>XD
16:05<andythenorth>I would have assumed there was a symbol table for the interpreter :P
16:05<V453000>1s compile time saved
16:05<V453000>shorter stuff, get nfo
16:05<V453000>-> win
16:05<andythenorth>you arrived late to the conversation :D
16:06<V453000>skimming through it I dont think I missed much :P
16:06<Zuu>I heard there will be a web assembly side by side with JS.
16:06<@Alberth>symbol table may be a map from string to value
16:06<V453000>ah javafuck
16:06<V453000>am actually using a kind of simplified JS in after effects XD is awesome
16:07*Zuu writes a SimTower clone in JS
16:07<@Alberth>/me looks up what SimTower is
16:08<Zuu>https://github.com/Leffe108/Monster-Tower <-- my clone
16:11<LadyHawk>sim tower
16:11<LadyHawk>stick an office building in the bottom uhh.... right? corner
16:12<LadyHawk>nice game, unless you're aiming for the full stars.. lots of clicking involved
16:13*LadyHawk digs up sim tower & plays
16:13<V453000>fun I had with JS to make smoke preview for factorio: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/7592/AE-smoke.png
16:13<@Alberth>open a cookie-click game :p
16:14*Zuu completed all stars in SimTower. It was one of few games available for mac.
16:14<@Alberth>Zuu: typo Contorls
16:14<V453000>I dont know how close it is to a proper JS, but I read that it is JS XD
16:14<Zuu>As my version is JS and open source, it is trivial to cheat. :-)
16:15<Zuu>Alberth: Thanks
16:15<LadyHawk>zuu did you manage to get all stars without turning all office prices to the lowest it'll go?
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16:16<Zuu>I think I could keep some of them to second price. But I don't actually remember. Last time I played it was in at least 15 years ago.
16:16<LadyHawk>hehe
16:18<andythenorth>V453000 is now a programmer :)
16:18<Zuu>But I do plan to add a way to build a rectangle of similar rooms to Monster Tower. Probably by shift+build. :-)
16:18<V453000>I wouldnt say that but I use those simple programming tools for previewing stuff in factorio a lot
16:18<V453000>it is awesome
16:20<Zuu>Well then you are a just a slope on the way to become a programmer. :-)
16:21<V453000>the slope aint very slippery for me :P
16:21<LadyHawk>so now i'm trying to run Sim Tower (abandonware free download) but i can't for the life of me get it installed or ran or anything
16:21<V453000>though admittedly I am considering to have a peek at python because blender
16:21<LadyHawk>'runtime error 5!'
16:26<Zuu>It ran on PowerPC (mac) and I guess there was a windows version too. IIRC it was windows 95 or 98 that was available at that time.
16:27<Eddi|zuHause>was "runtime error 5" that thing that pascal programs had when the CPU is too fast?
16:28<+glx>google only directs me to VB errors
16:29<Zuu>I only written Delphi since 2007 and has not run into that error.
16:30<Eddi|zuHause>then it probably wasn't that
16:31<Eddi|zuHause>but delphi from 2007 probably doesn't have that
16:31<Eddi|zuHause>there was a problem in some pascal (7-ish) library that initialized some timer, which overflowed when the CPU was too fast
16:33<Eddi|zuHause>where "too fast" was in the range of 200 MHz
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16:34<Zuu>Nice :-). I have used delphi 7 (which is from 2002), but that one may still be newer than pascal 7.
16:36<Eddi|zuHause>this looks like what i meant: http://mtech.dk/thomsen/program/pasbug.php
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16:39<andythenorth>bye
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18:36<Keridos>can i remove a newgrf from a running game forcefully?
18:36<+glx>not recommended
18:36<Keridos>its just biggui
18:37<+glx>then it should be in the static section and not linked to the game
18:43<Keridos>and if it is in my newgrf list on my dedicated server?
18:44<+glx>you should not put it there ;)
18:44<+glx>https://wiki.openttd.org/FAQ_troubleshooting#The_User_Interface_buttons_are_too_small
18:45<Wolf01>'night
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18:45<+glx>https://wiki.openttd.org/FAQ_NewGRF#I_cannot_change_NewGRFs_in_my_game.2C_why.3F <-- to remove it from a running game
18:47<Keridos>ok thanks
18:50<Keridos>glx, do i need to DL the save to my local graphical interface for that?
18:50<+glx>yes
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21:04<Keridos>glx, got it working, thanks a lot, having a blast with my friends now :)
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21:56<Keridos>is there a way to replace vehicles in all trains without making them longer?
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22:06<Supercheese>Enable Wagon Removal
22:06<Supercheese>https://wiki.openttd.org/Replace_vehicles#Wagon_removal
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22:46<Keridos>Supercheese: thanks :D
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22:51<Supercheese>you're most welcome :)
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---Logclosed Tue Dec 29 00:00:40 2015