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#openttd IRC Logs for 2016-01-17

---Logopened Sun Jan 17 00:00:08 2016
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01:16<supermop> yo Pikka
01:29<supermop>later
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02:18<andythenorth>o/
02:29<@peter1138>brrr
02:29<@peter1138>so much snow...
02:29<@peter1138>well probably just a thin layer
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02:30<andythenorth>snow?
02:30<andythenorth>pokka also?
02:30<andythenorth>all the things at once
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02:33<V453000>sup humies
02:36<andythenorth>FIRS innit
02:36<andythenorth>also maybe Horse
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03:40<Pikka>pokka or pikka
03:41<Pikka>hello andythenorth and V and others
03:55<@Alberth>moin
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04:05<Mazur>By Grabthar's Hammer, it _is_ a good morning!
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04:23<V453000>heyo
04:25<Eddi|zuHause>is there a quantifyable threshold for when a morning is "good"?
04:27<andythenorth>what ho Pikka
04:27<andythenorth>how are you?
04:27<Eddi|zuHause>we had like 3mm of snow...
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04:40<andythenorth>cargo label for 'edible oil' ?
04:41<andythenorth>EOIL?
04:43<andythenorth>ha ha
04:43<andythenorth>so the newgrf wiki blocks safari, but not chrome
04:43<andythenorth>bit special
04:44<andythenorth>ach no, neither work, /me was wrong
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05:13<andythenorth>V453000 what doing? o_O
05:13<Pikka>weren't there oilseeds or something before?
05:14<Pikka>in ECS?
05:14<andythenorth>probly
05:14<andythenorth>this is the squishy stuff you cook chips in though
05:15<Pikka>otherwise just make it livestock like UKRS milk ;)
05:15<andythenorth>yes that
05:16<andythenorth>Pikka: have you been away working for money? o_O
05:16<andythenorth>or uni?
05:16<Pikka>working
05:16<Pikka>and from march I will be working + uni
05:16<andythenorth>no more buses?
05:17<Pikka>nope. only vans.
05:18<andythenorth>transport co-ordinator?
05:18<Pikka>postman pat. :)
05:19<Eddi|zuHause>how is oil livestock? animals only produce solid (saturated) fats, liquid (unsaturated) fats come from plants or fish
05:19<andythenorth>same way milk is :)
05:20<andythenorth>not
05:20<Pikka>it isn't, but putting inappropriate things in tankers is a tradition
05:20<Eddi|zuHause>solid/liquid at room temperature
05:23<andythenorth>a silly tradition :)
05:24<andythenorth>Pikka: copper refinery http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=188654
05:24<andythenorth>such pixels
05:35<V453000>andythenorth: enormous amount of progress with BRIX lately
05:36<V453000>not much super visible stuff, but rather under the hood technical shit
05:36<V453000>it is great
05:39<andythenorth>yay
05:40<andythenorth>how do I make this not just same tank sprite on every tile?
05:40<andythenorth>http://www.arabianoilandgas.com/pictures/gallery/Places/HSTterminal_singapore_onlin.jpg
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05:49<V453000>have them in groups I guess
05:53*andythenorth works on it
05:53<andythenorth>eh I can do pipes and stuff
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06:29<argoneus>turns out VS15 is not very good software
06:30<argoneus>you need to enable microsoft language extensions to compile code that uses the stdlib
06:30<argoneus>or rather link
06:30<argoneus>else you get hundreds of linker errors
06:30<Eddi|zuHause>is there even such a thing as "very good software"?
06:31<argoneus>Eddi|zuHause: ottd
06:31<argoneus>also look at this
06:31<argoneus>https://connect.microsoft.com/VisualStudio/feedback/details/1331482/bug-in-stl
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06:32<argoneus>how does this even happen
06:32<Eddi|zuHause>ottd is clearly terribly designed software that barely holds together
06:32<argoneus>ottd seems well specified to me
06:32<argoneus>bit-perfect tailored code
06:33<andythenorth>ha ha ha ha
06:33<@Alberth>:D
06:34<argoneus>:(
06:34<argoneus>a man can dream, ok
06:35<Eddi|zuHause>ottd is a giant pile of historically grown wrong design decisions
06:35<argoneus>time to rewrite it in haskell
06:35<@Alberth>ha ha ha :D
06:36<@Alberth>you will soon find out real-world programs and functional programming don't go well together :p
06:36<andythenorth>yes but can you mathematically prove that?
06:36<argoneus>but people over in #haskell say how great funcprog is for real-world problems
06:36<andythenorth>functional programming is pure
06:36<andythenorth>everything is contractual
06:37<argoneus>that you can define a domain specific language for your problem pretty much
06:37<andythenorth>there is no chance of anything muting state behind your back
06:37<argoneus>and then it's easy to maintain
06:37<argoneus>n-no?
06:37<Eddi|zuHause>i have used functional-ish concepts in my python programs
06:37<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause: functional-ish doesn't count
06:37<andythenorth>nothing but _pure_ functional programming will save us from the clear failure of OO concepts and practice
06:37<andythenorth>it's mathematically provable
06:38<argoneus>tbh
06:38<argoneus>OO can be limiting
06:38<argoneus>it forces you to think within a certain mindset
06:38<argoneus>that may not make sense for your problem
06:38<Eddi|zuHause>and functional is not limiting?
06:38<Eddi|zuHause>or forcing you into a mindset?
06:38<argoneus>Eddi|zuHause: I haven't done funcprog enough to comment on that
06:38<argoneus>but from what they say not really
06:38<argoneus>that's just parroting though
06:39<andythenorth>from boilerplate import *
06:39<Eddi|zuHause>functional programming is used in universities around the planet do break the minds of young programmers.
06:39<Eddi|zuHause>s/do/to/
06:41<@Alberth>it's a nice paradigm, but it believes programs are simple input/output functions, which just fails in real world
06:41<Eddi|zuHause>because universities want you to un-learn all the misconceptions you have from dabbling in your early programming days
06:43<Eddi|zuHause>yeah, most of my "real world" programs are processes. i.e. you have a constant stream of inputs and a constant stream of outputs, and it never terminates.
06:45<argoneus>that's where monads come in :>
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06:48<andythenorth>V453000: https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/7614/liquids_terminal_1.png
06:48<andythenorth>o_O
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06:53<andythenorth>this one is accident, but looks more wtf? https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/7615/liquids_terminal_2.png
07:01<V453000>looks nice
07:01<V453000>the gray balls look flat
07:01<V453000>the bottom right side needs shadows I think
07:03<andythenorth>probly does
07:04<andythenorth>those things are used in about 50 different industries :P
07:04<andythenorth>copy-pasteo eh?
07:04<V453000>yeah I know
07:04<V453000>doesnt make them any better :P
07:05*andythenorth should fix
07:06<V453000>btw I will probably have various releases of BRIX, with various landscape colours
07:06<V453000>so people can choose between desaturated/green/darker green/desert-ish/...
07:09<andythenorth>nice
07:10<V453000>I got it all automated, so I just need to figure out how to change the materials to the various colours with as low amount of effort as possible
07:13<andythenorth>I like this layout enough https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/7616/liquids_terminal_3.png
07:13<andythenorth>maybe that's done, for now at least
07:13<V453000>looks grate
07:13<V453000>still them balls though :P
07:13<andythenorth>something a bit off about it
07:13<andythenorth>dunno what
07:13<andythenorth>nvm
07:14<andythenorth>needs a tanker barge is one thing
07:14<V453000>shadow at the bottom right is missing
07:14<V453000>and perhaps some on the right/top right as well
07:14<V453000>to make the edges darker
07:14<andythenorth>lacks definitiion?
07:18<V453000>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/20419525/liquids_terminal_3edit.png
07:18<V453000>probably needs it also a bit at the top
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07:18<andythenorth>better
07:18<Wolf01>o/
07:19<V453000>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/20419525/liquids_terminal_3edit2.png
07:20<andythenorth>yeah that
07:20*andythenorth needs it in a cutout png :P
07:20<V453000>feel free to use it :)
07:20<V453000>haha
07:20<V453000>where is the sprite?
07:21<V453000>lol one RAWR png is 75 MB XD
07:22<V453000>all sprites for one climate
07:22<andythenorth>https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/entry/src/graphics/industries/liquids_terminal_1.png
07:22<V453000>and do you have a sprite of 1 bally thing?
07:22<V453000>me bets they are copypasted
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07:27<andythenorth>all copypasted
07:27<andythenorth>I don't have a single one
07:27<andythenorth>but do the front one, I'll figure out the other 3
07:28<andythenorth>frosch123: http://tropico.wikia.com/wiki/Smuggler%27s_Dock o_O
07:28<V453000>I did the front one in the screenshot already :P
07:28<andythenorth>it's got AA crap in it :)
07:28<V453000>k
07:28<andythenorth>maybe from the screenshot or something?
07:28<V453000>yeah idk what screenshot software are you using
07:28<V453000>will fix the one in the actual sprite
07:29<V453000>need to make model for road crossing now, will do your sprite when it renders
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07:29<andythenorth>fanks :)
07:29<andythenorth>anyone played tropico?
07:29*andythenorth considers it
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07:30<frosch123>join
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07:31<frosch123>hmm
07:32<Wolf01>tropico is fun, but I never managed to win :D
07:32<frosch123>moin
07:32<Wolf01>o/
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08:02<V453000>andythenorth: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/20419525/liquids_terminal_1.png
08:02<V453000>I believe that should do it
08:10<andythenorth>nice :)
08:11<V453000>feel free to use in any way you like ... I also left there the sources for stuff so you can reuse it individually :P
08:13<andythenorth>going to copy-paste to all the other spritesheets using it :)
08:19<andythenorth>looks *much* better in game
08:19<andythenorth>thanks
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08:25<Hydros>howdy
08:26<@Alberth>hi hi
08:40<andythenorth> bbl
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13:45<@DorpsGek>Commit by translators :: r27499 /trunk/src/lang (catalan.txt korean.txt) (2016-01-17 19:45:36 +0100 )
13:45<@DorpsGek>-Update from Eints:
13:45<@DorpsGek>korean: 34 changes by telk5093
13:45<@DorpsGek>catalan: 10 changes by juanjo
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13:51<andythenorth>xo/
13:52<@Alberth>hi hi
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14:07*andythenorth pixels
14:07<V453000>:)
14:22<Wolf01>meh, no diablo this evening, blizzy ran out of servers :(
14:23<V453000>xd
14:24<frosch123>has there always been a mapeditor in F ?
14:24<frosch123>just noticed it
14:25<frosch123>(not that I would care, generated maps are better)
14:29<V453000>I think there was, at least for a long time
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14:30<V453000>but yeah I never used it either
14:30<andythenorth>I wish I hadn't upgraded mercurial :(
14:30<V453000>but yeah I never used it either
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14:31*andythenorth is having 'nothing works' trouble :P
14:31<V453000>love that
14:31<V453000>updates ftw
14:32<V453000>luckily I never updated tortoise hg
14:32<V453000>didnt dare
14:32<V453000>if tortoise would fuck up, I would probably just never fix it XD
14:34<andythenorth>hg can't understand graphics files anymore
14:34<andythenorth>so it just constantly reports them as changed
14:34<andythenorth>making hg status useless
14:36<@Alberth>the editor writes meta data in it?
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14:37<@Alberth>wb
14:40<andythenorth>probably does
14:40<andythenorth>it's frustrating, because hg status can see the change, but hg commit can't
14:40<andythenorth>so I have non-removable, non-commitable changes
14:41<andythenorth>the only solution I've found is to rm -r src, then hg revert --all
14:41<andythenorth>which is a horrible workflow
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14:51<@Alberth>huh, that's weird
14:51<@Alberth>what does "hg diff" say? https://www.mercurial-scm.org/wiki/FAQ/CommonProblems
14:52<@Alberth>"hg status shows changed files but hg diff doesn't!"
14:56<andythenorth>zero diff
14:56<+glx>multiple parents maybe then
14:56<andythenorth>how does one get multiple parents in hg?
14:57<+glx>after a merge
15:01<andythenorth>is this why I was warned to never merge in hg?
15:06<@Alberth>hg diff --git (or is that standard in your setup?)
15:11<andythenorth>I tried it :)
15:11<andythenorth>zero diff
15:13<andythenorth>biab
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15:34<V453000>lol my highscore table is empty :d
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15:38<@Alberth>work to do :)
15:38<@Alberth>mine is empty too btw, I never finish openttd :)
15:39<V453000>I used to have some but myeah :D
15:40<V453000>trying to upload BRIX screenshots fails badly, wifi fucked up :(
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15:42<V453000>BRIX is 12,5 GB folder atm :D
15:42<V453000>fuck humans
15:42<@Alberth>quite :)
15:43<V453000>almost 10GB is in 3D files though, which as latest version are only like 250 MB
15:43<@Alberth>soo many pixzelz
15:43<V453000>rest is sprites and renders though
15:44<@Alberth>good night
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16:40<argoneus>it turns out
16:40<argoneus>when you want to code something, and you're not sure how to structure it properly
16:40<argoneus>instead of trying to make up a complex design, just code things that work and refactor as needed
16:40<argoneus>._.
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19:12<drac_boy>hi
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19:14<Wolf01>'night
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---Logclosed Mon Jan 18 00:00:09 2016