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#openttd IRC Logs for 2016-04-12

---Logopened Tue Apr 12 00:00:24 2016
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06:31<Samu>hi
06:33<andythenorth>o/
06:33<Wolf01>o/
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07:41<Samu>i'm back to the saveload.cpp file
07:42<Samu>when i save using the lzo encoder
07:42<Samu>i can't load it back
07:42<Samu>broken savegame - unexpected end of chunk.
07:44<Samu>is that intended? to never use lzo to create savegames?
07:44<Samu>i was only experimenting zlo
07:44<Samu>lzo
07:47<Samu>wait a minute
07:47<Samu>now it loads
07:48<Samu>so it depends on the build I had chosen to save?
07:50<Samu>i saved with debug x64, i can load with debug x64, but not with release x64
07:50<Samu>can't load in official 1.6.0 either
07:55<Samu>it loads on debug win32 and also on release win32. it's only release x64 that it doesn't load
07:56<Samu>turns out official 1.6.0 is x64 too
07:56<Samu>and i guess it's release
07:56<Samu>gonna try official 1.6.0 win32, brb
07:59<Samu>doesn't work on official 1.6.0 win32, downloaded from https://www.openttd.org/en/download-stable
07:59<Samu>what could this all mean?
08:06<Samu>can someone try loading this savegame in your openttd? https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=23B29F3DE45F6F1F!1263&authkey=!AHcsjB_LoOMjjK0&ithint=file%2csav
08:06<Samu>file name is Unnamed, 1950-01-02 lzo preset 0.sav
08:06<Samu>27.8 MB
08:07<Samu>does it load, or does it say broken savegame - unexpected end of chunk.
08:08<Samu>ty
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08:37<Samu>it appears to be a bug with openttd 32-bit version when saving a game with map sized 4096x4096
08:37<Samu>have to test this better
08:37<Samu>lzma error code
08:37<@peter1138>solution: don't play stupid map sizes
08:37<Samu>:O
08:38<Samu>seems to be the overhead of 15 AIs + the process of saving
08:38<Samu>I'm merely pushing openttd to its limit :)
08:39<Samu>it can save on the 64-bit
08:39<Samu>but not on the 32-bit
08:40<Samu>i currently got 16 GB RAM installed on the system, can't be that
08:44<Samu>with lzma preset 9, the overhead is an extra 690.000 KB just for lzma, on top of mem copy
08:45<Samu>what is the limit for 32-bit applications in openttd? what about large-adress aware stuff?
08:46<Samu>no i'm wrong, 690.000K already includes mem copy
08:50<Samu>weird, it doubles the effort for server to client, i just monitorized mem needed for a player to join a server
08:50<Samu>about 1.1 GB more memory
08:51<Samu>just during a client join
08:51<Samu>well i gotta go now, be back alter
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09:25<@peter1138>thanks rain, waiting for me to go outside :p
09:26<@peter1138>monitorized...
09:29<andythenorth>it will do that
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09:38<Wolf01>I'm tired :(
09:50<supermop_>yo
09:55<V453000>sup
09:58<supermop_>rain
09:58<supermop_>rhino modelling
09:59<supermop_>and designing interiors for conversion of an old grain elevator at a brewery in Guang Zhou into a boutique beer hotel
10:08<supermop_>andythenorth: does IH have some kkind of pallet means of switching headlights on and off, switching 1/2 cc etc?
10:08<andythenorth>headlights are drawn on
10:08<andythenorth>flipping 1cc and 2cc is automated with pixa
10:09<V453000>brewery sounds great
10:10<Alkel_U3>oh! Yesterday I should've checked TTD instead of TT for the water level settings. It was there in the original map generator, but not for Arctic and Tropic
10:10<Alkel_U3>it didn't occur to me until now
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10:18<Wolf01>o/
10:18<@Alberth>hi hi
10:18<andythenorth>lo Alberth
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10:27<CrazyIvan532>Hello everyone, so i am trying to compile the latest stable release on my rasberry pi 3 but ive hit an error and im not sure what it means. the error is makefile:234: recipe for target 'script/api/script_industrytype.o' failed
10:28<@Alberth>there should be a compiler error too
10:29<@Alberth>you can use a paste service, like paste.openttdcoop.org if you have more text
10:29<CrazyIvan532>make[1]: ***[script/api/script_industrytyper
10:29<CrazyIvan532>make[1]: ***[script/api/script_industrytype.o] Error 1
10:29<CrazyIvan532>is that it?
10:30<@Alberth>no, you run "make", which runs the c++ compiler. That program gives an error, and then "make" reports the build failed, and on what file
10:30<@Alberth>the c++ error is the root cause
10:30<@Alberth>anything "make[1]: ..." is from make
10:32*andythenorth needs to search forum PMs
10:32<andythenorth>can’t see how
10:33<CrazyIvan532>i cant copy and paste it because im not sure how to on a raspi
10:40<@Alberth>line number?
10:41<@Alberth>although not very useful without error message
10:42<@Alberth>it complains about a name?
10:43<@Alberth>try to find that name in other files
10:43<CrazyIvan532>im gonna have to run the compile again this may take a few minutes, i closed the terminal window
10:43<@Alberth>make should pick up where it error-ed the last time
10:44<CrazyIvan532>nope has to run it all over again
10:44<CrazyIvan532>for some reason
10:44<@Alberth>weird
10:45<CrazyIvan532>the latest stable is 1.6.0 isnt it?
10:45<CrazyIvan532>has anything changed since 1.5.3 to be able to compile it?
10:45<@Alberth>no idea, not much, would be my guess
10:46<CrazyIvan532>oh thats strange its failed at a different point this time
10:46<@Alberth>perhaps your compiler changed more than the openttd source :)
10:46<CrazyIvan532>viewport.cpp this time
10:47<CrazyIvan532>void viewportDODraw
10:51<@Alberth>pretty sure nothing changed there the last year
10:53<CrazyIvan532>ok ive actually made progress, not sure what i did differently, all i did was update the os on my pi
10:54<CrazyIvan532>rerun make and it did it fine this time :/ im not sure what was happening
10:55<@Alberth>you got an executable now?
10:56<CrazyIvan532>yep worked first time after the update
10:57<CrazyIvan532>is there a way to remove GFX files too, ive got an oversized gui which looks aweful on the raspi touchscreen
10:59<@Alberth>can't do that in the newgrf window?
10:59<@Alberth>otherwise, close openttd, and edit the openttd.cfg file
11:00<@planetmaker>oh, there's even an UI zoom setting in the game options. Maybe that helps?
11:00<@planetmaker>g'evening also :)
11:00<@Alberth>don't know what needs changing though, never installed such a file
11:00<@Alberth>evenink planetmaker :)
11:01<andythenorth>lo planetmaker
11:01<CrazyIvan532>cant seem to remove them from in there just activate or deactivate
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11:01<@Alberth>deactivate should be sufficient to disable
11:02<CrazyIvan532>it doesnt seem like it has
11:02<@Alberth>close openttd, and edit the cfg file?
11:03<@Alberth>program shouldn't load things that are not in that file
11:03<CrazyIvan532>where do i find the config file
11:03<@Alberth>~/.openttd/openttd.cfg ?
11:03<@Alberth>othewise, check the readme, it has a list of places to look
11:06<CrazyIvan532>is that the same when its built from source?
11:07<@Alberth>should be, unless you give weird configure values :p
11:08<@Alberth>but euhm, find / -type f -name openttd.cfg -print
11:08<CrazyIvan532>ive got a lot of files that have config in the title, just not one that looks like that
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11:24<CrazyIvan532>im confused as to why it still has them and my saved games since i extracted the new version to a different file
11:27<CrazyIvan532>ok i got it seems the zbase gfx set for some reason has bigger icons than the default base set, causing the toolbar to look odd
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11:29<@peter1138>zbase has a lot of things wrong
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11:29<CrazyIvan532>anyone perhaps recommend an alternative that looks similar without the issues?
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11:31<@Alberth>the opengfx baseset?
11:31<CrazyIvan532>i was hoping for one that looks a little less jagged round the edges
11:34<@Alberth>reduce zoom :)
11:34<CrazyIvan532>you mean zoom out or is that the name of a set lol?
11:35<@Alberth> I am always confused about zoom directions :)
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11:37<supermop_>do i need to draw 8/8 trains to look like 7.5/8 to get a visible gap between cars in / and \?
11:38<andythenorth>just leave a row of pixels out or so
11:38<andythenorth>it’s all not very scientific tbh
11:38<andythenorth>and full of mistakes :)
11:38<andythenorth>nobody really notices when playing
11:39<@Alberth>make train fast enough :p
11:41<supermop_>oof
11:42<supermop_>that throws off my set of placeholders
11:42<supermop_>can leave off two pixels easier than 1
11:42<supermop_>but i guess being placeholders it doesnt matter
11:43<@Alberth>remove random pixel in each row ?
11:44*andythenorth watches ‘real’ trains go round a circle
11:44<supermop_>lego?
11:44<andythenorth>no need to worry about lengths
11:44<andythenorth>HO
11:45<supermop_>need to "decide" on a remaining lengths in spreadsheet so can start assigning each vehicle a placeholder
11:45<supermop_>kids old enough for HO now, andythenorth ?
11:45<andythenorth>debatable
11:45<supermop_>andythenorth is old enough for HO at least
11:45<andythenorth>I am definitely old enough though
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11:46<supermop_>could use some Z gauge here
11:46<supermop_>no room for N in manhattan apartment
11:47<supermop_>maybe one N tram stop
11:49<@peter1138>have we done the 3d-model-graphics version of the game yet?
11:49<andythenorth>nobody finished it
11:51<supermop_>andythenorth: cargosprinter method for EMUs or fixed consists? or just single/double 8/8 units?
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11:52<supermop_>peter1138: what 3d model version?
11:53<@peter1138>the one we all want :p
11:54<supermop_>rendered base set?
11:54<supermop_>or in game rendering?
11:54<@Alberth>3D openttd :p
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11:56<andythenorth>supermop_: 8/8 units
11:56<supermop_>pointy ends go away when sticking them together?
11:56<andythenorth>assuming they’re blunt ended, and don’t have fancy end units
11:56<andythenorth>if they have fancy end units (1) choose a different one to draw or (2) I’ll have to figure something out
11:56<supermop_>duckbilled shinkansens,
11:57<andythenorth>shinkansens should be built as 4 tile fixed consists
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11:58<supermop_>would you allow this guy as a "shinkansen" graphically then, or am i pushing my luck?
11:58<supermop_>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KiHa_281_series
11:58<andythenorth>probably a case for doing it as two 8/8 units and using the cargo sprinter magic
11:59<supermop_>o
11:59<supermop_>k
11:59<supermop_>that just turns the intermediate units into a flat fronted versions?
11:59<andythenorth>yes
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12:01<supermop_>for shinkansen, 8 cars of 8/8, or some other amount of a different length (8+6+6+6+6+6+6+6+6+8?)
12:01<@Rubidium>andythenorth: I won't agree; E2/E5 are 10 cars
12:01<andythenorth>not realistic?
12:01<supermop_>Rubidium: no E2s in iron crane
12:02<supermop_>but the above 8s and 6s give 10 cars
12:02<andythenorth>you need to fake more :P
12:02<andythenorth>use pre-production prototypes or never-built units or something
12:02<supermop_>i only have 4 generic shinkansens
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12:03<@Rubidium>and the plethora of 12 car consists get even shorter?
12:03<andythenorth>don’t listen to Rubidium he’s a naughty troll :)
12:03<@Rubidium>just so it fits in 4 tiles
12:03<supermop_>a roughly 60s on, a roughly 80s one, a mid 90s one, and a late 90s/00s one
12:03<supermop_>Rubidium: i like short cars personally
12:04<andythenorth>supermop_: cargo sprinter substitutes an intermediate car when needed: https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/iron-horse/repository/entry/src/graphics/cargo_sprinter_template.png
12:04<andythenorth>see middle set of sprites
12:04<@Rubidium>supermop_: start with DHR
12:04<supermop_>andythenorth: stylistically i think i am set for shinkansen, just wondering if it looks better to have end cars a different length
12:05<andythenorth>if they’re fixed consist yes
12:05<andythenorth>otherwise no
12:05<andythenorth>we could build them as individual vehicles
12:05<andythenorth>with front and back engines separate
12:05<andythenorth>but eh
12:06<supermop_>have a 1000hp shinkansen dining car
12:06<supermop_>and hook it up to a steam engine
12:06<@Rubidium>supermop_: it would be realistic for the N700 series to have longer end cars
12:07<@Rubidium>likewise for the 500 series (my favorite)
12:07<@Rubidium>although the difference is about 10%
12:08<supermop_>Rubidium: "500" is my third shinkansen, 700/n700 basis for 4th
12:08<supermop_>2nd is amalgamation of 100 and 200, maybe 300 instead
12:08<supermop_>1st is 0 of course
12:09<supermop_>powers and speeds faked
12:09<@Rubidium>IIRC the odd first digit ones are for the east, the even ones for the west
12:10<supermop_>6/8 shinkansen cars may look too tiny next to the regular NG trains
12:10<supermop_>correct Rubidium
12:10<@Rubidium>uhm... I reversed east and west I guess
12:10<supermop_>300 is west
12:10<supermop_>yeah
12:10<supermop_>800 on kyushu
12:11<@Rubidium>oh, so they've messed the nice system up...
12:11<supermop_>Iron crane gets only 4 though, use on either side of your map as you please
12:12<supermop_>well east now uses E(n)
12:12<@Rubidium>and the bilevels?
12:13<supermop_>believe those are all to the east
12:16<supermop_>andythenorth: your CS sprinter looks like 7/8?
12:16<andythenorth>might be
12:16<supermop_>ok
12:16<andythenorth>it fits to the container lengths
12:16<andythenorth>you don’t have to use that length
12:17<supermop_>using 6/8 would necessitate rewriting all the weird cod though, right?
12:17<supermop_>code
12:17<supermop_>or cod too i guess
12:17<andythenorth>no
12:17<andythenorth>all units have to be same length, and the sprite swapping code doesn’t touch length
12:18<andythenorth>it should work with anything up to 10/8
12:18<supermop_>still easiest to just provide sprites same size as what you have and use same template though, right?
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12:19<supermop_>you have code that randomizes color of the pink and purple containers?
12:20<andythenorth>yes
12:20<supermop_>cool
12:20<andythenorth>only to blue and white currently, but that’s variable
12:21<supermop_>every container ive seen i japan is the same maroon JR Freight livery though
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12:21<supermop_>lunch time
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12:50<Wolf01>I always fail to understand how to pass data to event handlers :| I usually implement the handler on the same class (usually with a delegate) and get the data from the class, but what when I have a shared handler?
12:52<Wolf01>I don't know if I need to do some magic with that lambda brainfuck or just duplicate the code
12:52<andythenorth>does the code do the same thing?
12:52<Wolf01>yeah
12:52*andythenorth has no ideas
12:53<andythenorth>I have NFI about ‘proper’ OO code
12:53<andythenorth>I would just pass classes around that have some common interface
12:53<andythenorth>or better yet, try and avoid the whole situation :)
12:53<Wolf01>I could put the code on a common class and then use the handler to call it
12:54<andythenorth>I would end up having some class like ‘Application’ or whatever
12:54<andythenorth>but my ways probably aren’t recognisable to most OO coders
12:54<andythenorth>I just try and keep it really dumb as far as possible
12:55<andythenorth>and keep entities as self-contained as possible :P
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12:56<supermop_>ok
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13:23<Wolf01>o/
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13:29<frosch123>hoi
13:30<V453000>hy frog
13:39<frosch123>V453000: https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=73374&start=100 <- haha, i thought i already had encountered the most stupid message today
13:40<V453000>XD
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13:41<V453000>well at least he knows where to look :P
13:41<frosch123>yeah, not the most obvious place for f backstage photos
13:41<V453000>:D
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13:59<andythenorth>also
14:00<andythenorth>what to do about tropic landscape gen? o_O
14:00<supermop_>idk
14:01<supermop_>what is tropic supposed to be
14:01<andythenorth> a landscape for building trains on?
14:03<andythenorth>all landscapes should be much the same, irrespective of chosen climate
14:03<andythenorth>gameplay needs
14:03<andythenorth>- mountains (which can be suppressed by choosing flat landscape)
14:03<andythenorth>- valleys (which are created by mountains being formed)
14:03<andythenorth>- open water (which can be suppressed by turning down sea amount)
14:03<andythenorth>- rivers (which can be disabled)
14:04<andythenorth>all this crap about plateaus and sine waves is not doing anything for gameplay
14:05<supermop_>would be nice to have different shapes of mountains or canyons or plateaus , but not dependent on climate
14:06<andythenorth>so many tuning controls already, and then they behave differently depending on chosen climate
14:06<andythenorth>meh
14:07<supermop_>although with tropic, the shape of the land has a big effect of the greenness of the land
14:10<andythenorth>[shrug]
14:10<andythenorth>works fine for me with temperate terrain algorithm :)
14:11<supermop_>yeah that seems reasonable
14:13<andythenorth>maybe expose the algorithm in terrain gen window?
14:13<andythenorth>and make it an explicit choice, not a climate-dependent choice?
14:14<andythenorth>or could we provide a box to paste code into? o_O
14:15<supermop_>why not just have multiple generators selectable
14:16<andythenorth>V453000: your child shares birthday with mine? o_O
14:16<andythenorth>I think we knew that already?
14:16<V453000>we might have mentioned it but I haven't remembered it tbh
14:17<andythenorth>I remember nothing any more :P
14:17<andythenorth>due to ENoSleep
14:19<V453000>:D
14:21<andythenorth>I can’t remember what it felt like to have enough sleep most days :)
14:27<supermop_>andythenorth: just delete all but one, either temperate or arctic
14:30<andythenorth>that’s not how trunk commits get made ;)
14:30<supermop_>i just acheived a goal of deliver 1000 mnsp to a flour mill, then busy bee gave me a goal to deliver more mnsp to the same mill
14:31<supermop_>fine as i already have trains headed there, but is that intended?
14:36<andythenorth>there is code in recent BB to try and avoid it
14:36<andythenorth>it’s mostly succesful in my test games
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14:41<supermop_>ah this is rewarding bee
14:46<supermop_>express emus all seem to be 21,000 mm, and commuter all 20,000 (except for very old 17,000mm ones from the 20s)
14:47<supermop_>going to use 7/8 for all of those
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15:04<andythenorth>supermop_: sometimes it’s useful to consider visual progression
15:04<andythenorth>i.e. generations look longer / bigger
15:05<andythenorth>other times, it’s more useful to keep train lengths unchanged
15:05<andythenorth>potato / potato
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15:06<supermop_>assuming user replaces like for like, increasing car length could make trains protude from platforms and get stuck in termini?
15:06<frosch123>i prefer noodles and rice
15:06<andythenorth>noodles / rice
15:06<andythenorth>hmm
15:06<supermop_>frosch123 is still in singapore?
15:06<andythenorth>dunno if the analogy holds :)
15:06<frosch123>not necessarily together :p
15:07<frosch123>supermop_: nope, back to normal
15:07<andythenorth>rice noodles
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15:11<supermop_>pho
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15:46<Eddi|zuHause>wtf is a rice noodle?
15:47<Taede>thin noodles you usually put in soup
15:47<Wolf01>https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/66/d1/b6/66d1b6d8f6a87e368f9c07490f63be81.jpg
15:47<Taede>also known as glass noodle
15:48<Eddi|zuHause>yeah, glass noodles i know. never heard the term "rice noodle" for those, though
15:48<Wolf01>I always order that when I go on a chinese restaurant
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15:54<supermop_>don't think anyone calls banh pho "glass noodles"
15:55<Wolf01>indeed they are more like plastic
15:56<Samu>hi
15:56<Wolf01>hi
15:56<Samu>who's a savegame expert?
15:56<Samu>saveload.cpp file
15:59<Samu>the issue i have is a savegame file that used lzo encoder
16:01<frosch123>Eddi|zuHause: noodles made of rice
16:02<Wolf01>IE, is that you?
16:02<frosch123>about everything you can make from some grain you can make from about any grain
16:02<supermop_>man researching steam locomotives really doesn't hold my interest
16:02*andythenorth has been exploring this a lot
16:03<andythenorth>due to body can’t process wheat
16:03<supermop_>andythenorth: just eat pho
16:03*andythenorth is eating corn pasta
16:03<Samu>when the server is generating a map, the client attempting to join receives a timeout error
16:04<Samu>(because the server is taking time to generate a 4096x4096 map)
16:04<Samu>how do i increase this timeout thing?
16:04<frosch123>andythenorth: there is a gluten free restaurant in my town with corn pasta
16:04<frosch123>my niece cannot handle gluten
16:08<supermop_>just end up reading about old rail disasters instead
16:09<Samu>there is a bug somewhere in the saveload.cpp in one of the builds, i had a lzma error earlier today, and now i can't reproduce it for some reason
16:09<Samu>i was messing with the different builds
16:10<Wolf01>you saved it with x64 release, does it work now?
16:11<Samu>there is another issue with the lzo too, but the lzma error kind of surprised me
16:11<Samu>i'm testing all the different encoding methods
16:12<Samu>i remember lzma was set in the code to use preset 9 which is very memory intensive
16:12<Samu>i'm not really sure what was the build, if 32-bit debug or 32-bit release
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16:12<Samu>and then the issue was that i was using another client to joing the server
16:13<Samu>so, i had 2 builds, not sure if the 2nd build was also 32-bit or 64-bit, i have to test all combinations
16:14<Samu>it appears that the server failed to create the savefile
16:14<Samu>and the client attempting to join, could not load the save
16:15<Samu>but since this was me experimenting with preset 9, i don't know if you really care about it
16:19<Samu>about the lzo: when the build is release x64, it cannot load the savegame encoded in lzo. but apparently all builds can generate the savegame correctly
16:21<supermop_>andythenorth: 1870,1890, 1900, 1910, 1920, 1940 enough steam engines?
16:21<andythenorth>there’s no right amount :)
16:21<andythenorth>one every 10 years is quite closely spaced
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16:23<supermop_>ooh a DanMacK
16:24<supermop_>this guy seems like he may know a thing or two about steam trains?
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16:27<Eddi|zuHause>an andythenorth and a DanMacK can never be in the same place at the same time!
16:28<supermop_>andythenorth: that sequence is: general, express, general, general, heavy freight, general
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16:32<sim-al2>Small detail, but some cars seem to be 19500mm long, with 20000mm long end cars
16:33<sim-al2>Some private railways still use 18000mm long cars
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16:35<andythenorth>that is indeed a small detail
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16:40<Arioch>test
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16:40<sim-al2>oh
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16:41<Arioch_Tmp>hello! anyone is active ?
16:41<sim-al2>hi
16:41<supermop_>i feel like 6 engines is enough, but seems weird to be in a situation where the "fast engine" is much older than the "slow engine"
16:42<Arioch_Tmp>can anyon report bug for 1.6.0 ? i have no account there...
16:42<Arioch_Tmp>Sad, i did not make it timely with 1.6rc1
16:43<sim-al2>Yeah, seems that there used to be general-purpose engines that were used on passenger and freight, and geared high, but replaced with dedicated engines in recent times
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16:45<Samu>i have a bad habit of not taking notes of the tests I conduct :(
16:48<Wolf01>just read the chat logs
16:49<andythenorth>run a keylogger
16:49<andythenorth>:P
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16:51<Samu>generating a world in debug mode takes sooo much time :(
16:53<supermop_>should dates be revised so that there is a bigger gap between engines, but "different" engines are released closer together
16:53<andythenorth>I tend to release pax and freight at same time
16:53<andythenorth>otherwise you get weird effects where new pax engine is boss for freight, but only for 7 years or so
16:53<andythenorth>kind of odd
16:53<andythenorth>not good hax
16:55<supermop_>these wikipedia pages will say things like "x was the most powerful japanese steam locomotive" but not say what the HP was
16:55<supermop_>but they will give the diameter of every wheel
16:55<sim-al2>Steam locomotive horsepower is somewhat difficult, compared to combustion engine
16:56<supermop_>the "real" fastest JNR steam engine seems to top out at 80mph
16:56<sim-al2>There are formulas to calculate if you have the size of the grate, etc
16:56<supermop_>might need to fake that upward
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16:57<sim-al2>130 km/h is pretty fast on 1067mm gauge already
16:57<sim-al2>Especially pre-war
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16:57<supermop_>yeah that is the record for a NG steam train globally
16:58<supermop_>or at least was
16:58<sim-al2>Many of the normal carriages used into the 70's had a top speed of only 95km/h
16:58<sim-al2>Pretty much all locomotive-hauled express trains were timetabled for 100km/h, but allowed 110km/h if required to make up time
16:59<supermop_>i should make room for another 30s/40s/50s locomotive - because these huge smoke deflectors look badass
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17:00<andythenorth>steam locomotive HP is easy to set
17:00<andythenorth>the numbers in the brit roster are about right for the speeds needed
17:00<andythenorth>and there’s little to be gained from changing them, unless the whole roster is slower, in which case reduce by 10% or whatever
17:00<andythenorth>low HP is boring to play with though
17:01<sim-al2>Though when you're dealing with engines of less than 1000hp like many of these narrow gauge engines were, 10% is a big deal
17:03<sim-al2>Supermop, check this site out: http://homepage3.nifty.com/EF57/engines/LM-flame.html
17:04<sim-al2>Has maximum horsepower at the drivers (PS is a German horsepower unit, really really close to American/British definitions of horsepower)
17:06<sim-al2>The C62 seems to be rated for "only" 1620PS, and normal service speed is 100 km/h
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17:08<supermop_>1600 is fine i think
17:08<supermop_>ill just step each worse engine incrementally downward from that
17:09<sim-al2>It's worth mentioning, but often the record speed of a locomotive is far higher than what could actually be reasonably used in service
17:09<supermop_>i was thinking my little bear, which will be the first diesel, in the 50s or so will be 800 hp
17:09<sim-al2>The Mallard for example starting overheating during it's run
17:10<supermop_>if players want to run 1 car trains downhill they should be able to get high speeds though
17:10<supermop_>you can always set your service speed downward with timetables
17:11<sim-al2>True
17:12<supermop_>the shear number of types introduced there in the 30s has be wondering if my list is skewed too early
17:12<supermop_>i don't want to buy a ton of locomotive right before i start electrifying though
17:13<sim-al2>Electrification began very early in Japan, but didn't really finish all the major lines until the late 60's
17:13<sim-al2>Steam lasted into the 70's in the rural areas, especially the far north and south
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17:26<Wolf01>I really miss Japan :(
17:27<supermop_>sim-al2: any player starting a game in 1900 or so will have plenty of cash to electrify almost everything by the 50s
17:32<sim-al2>Yeah, the game mechanics allow that pretty easily, can't really prevent it
17:37<supermop_>i dont want to have only one locomotive from 1870 until 1920, then a flood of new options for the last 20-30 years of steam
17:37<sim-al2>There were a variety of imports during the 1870's
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17:57<Samu>sometimes i feel like i'm the only one testing stuff no one cares about
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17:57<Wolf01>it might be :/
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18:15<Samu>this is what I'm testing, still working on it
18:15<Samu>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pvxirfhhh
18:16<Samu>only made a few tests
18:17<Samu>lzma 2 means = using lzma filter with default compression which points to preset 2 of lzma
18:18<Samu>what openttd currently has set
18:22<Samu>the most boring part of these tests is generating a 4096x4096 map in debug mode :(
18:22<Samu>takes ~13 minutes :(
18:22<Samu>why is debug mode so slow'
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18:37<Wolf01>why don't you just load a savegame?
18:37<Samu>i do that in the 2nd phase of the test
18:38<Samu>first, generate, have clients load, then save, then load
18:38<Samu>clients join*
18:38<Samu>erm just 1 client in this case*
18:40<Samu>im surprised that the debug can save in less than 20 seconds, else the client would receive a "server did not answer in xx seconds" timeout :(
18:44<Samu>this wouldn't be the case with a stronger preset
18:45<Samu>t.t
18:52<Wolf01>\o/ 15 minutes to update the smartphone
18:52<Wolf01>ok... it was the first step
18:53<Wolf01>I had the impression it was too fast
19:00<Samu>seems like i triggered something erroneous
19:01<Wolf01>'night
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19:02<Samu>when the client was joining the server, and the server was doing the save to send to client, I went to the load game menu on the server and clicked a savegame from the list.
19:02<Samu>server got stuck
19:03<Samu>client got "network connection lost" error and went back to main menu
19:03<Samu>server is stuck...
19:03<Samu>cant interact
19:05<Samu>anything i can see on visual studio? it doesn't say anything special, just it lets me pause
19:05<Samu>gonna try pause
19:08<Samu>last action points to a Sleep(1) inside a for kind of loop
19:08<Samu>win32_v.cpp
19:09<Samu> /* The game loop is the part that can run asynchronously.
19:09<Samu> * The rest except sleeping can't. */
19:10<Samu> /* Release the thread while sleeping */
19:10<Samu>and the sleep is there
19:10<Samu>i think it's doing this indefinitely
19:10<Samu>but idont know for sure, i can't really understand this code
19:11<Samu>crap, sorry, i was looking at the wrong visual studio
19:11<Samu>ignore this sleep stuff
19:12<Samu>paused the correct openttd now, Call Stack says: [External Code]
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19:12<Samu> [Frames below may be incorrect and/or missing, no symbols loaded for ntdll.dll]
19:12<Samu>there's nothing below
19:12<Samu>what now?
19:21<Samu>HALP
19:21<Samu>just noticed the Thread dropdown menu
19:22<Samu>there's Main Thread with: WaitForSingleObject(this->thread, INFINITE);
19:22<Samu>there's 2 other openttd:start_threads with: this->BeginCritical();
19:22<Samu>both
19:23<Samu>oops thread_start*
19:24<Samu>everyone's asleep? :(
19:25<Samu>gonna try reproduce this with 1.6.0, see if it also happens there
19:28<Samu>yup, it happens
19:28<Samu>since everyone's asleep, i'm creating a bug report
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20:06<Samu>bug reported: https://bugs.openttd.org/task/6445
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---Logclosed Wed Apr 13 00:00:26 2016