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#openttd IRC Logs for 2016-05-02

---Logopened Mon May 02 00:00:53 2016
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03:50<andythenorth>o/
03:55<V453000>mine mined enough yet?
03:56<andythenorth>need to code it
03:59<V453000>don't you have coding automated?
04:05<andythenorth>that would be nice
04:05<andythenorth>also drawing
04:06<V453000>XD especially
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04:34<Wolf01>o/
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04:37<andythenorth>hai Wolf01
04:38<Wolf01>meh, for just 1 part I might need to open the 42030's box :/
04:51<Wolf01>and I need to build a 5x5 frame with horizontal holes in center, 6 of them :/
05:00<V453000>special big assembling machine with holes for power poles at the center?
05:00<V453000>innovative
05:01<Wolf01>yes, and maybe it will be possible to fit a flux capacitor somewhere
05:02<Wolf01>so you can build stuff with the resources from the past in the future!
05:04<Wolf01>or with the resources from the future in the past, which makes more sense
05:10<Wolf01>rekt!
05:10<Wolf01>the moment when you miss the magic piece...
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05:37<Flygon>I do wish I could build bridges over stations, hahaha
05:38<Wolf01>you are not the only one, my pokémon friend
05:39<Flygon>P- oh right
05:39<Flygon>My name's Flygon, lol
05:39<Flygon>I've had this name for so long I forget it's a Pokemon
05:40<Wolf01>I still play with the games
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05:40*Flygon nodnod
05:40<Flygon>Doing that 4k*4k Hokkaido map
05:40<Flygon>It's really nice
05:51<Leanden>Hmmm well thats an interesting bug
05:51<Leanden>someone might be able to help me with this
05:51<Leanden>I have coded a steam train with a tender
05:52<Leanden>It works absolutely fine, however if i place 2 of the trains into a consist, the second loco has two heads and no tender.
05:52<@peter1138>hmm, moving the pointer is buggy for me
05:52<@peter1138>(1.6.0)
05:52<Leanden>i suspect there is something in my code I can do to prevent this
05:53-!-Samu [~oftc-webi@po-217-129-255-23.netvisao.pt] has joined #openttd
05:53<Samu>hi
05:53<Leanden>anyone know much about NML Trains?
05:53<@peter1138>is it just me?
05:54<Leanden>I havent noticed any cursor issues
05:54<Leanden>but then im not really using 1.6.0 yet
05:54<Leanden>switch (FEAT_TRAINS, SELF, switch_articulated_GNRA1, extra_callback_info1) { 1: return item_GNRA1; //use same vehicle for all parts return CB_RESULT_NO_MORE_ARTICULATED_PARTS; //stop adding vehicle parts }
05:54<Leanden>Is there anything i can put in here so that it ignores the rest of the train and only looks at the loco itself for position in consist?
05:55<andythenorth>peter1138: define ‘buggy’?
05:55<@peter1138>bits are not drawn properly. if i move it fast the whole thing disappears.
05:56<andythenorth>hmm, different bugs to the ones I see :P
05:56<Samu>@logs
05:56<@DorpsGek>Samu: http://irclogs.qmsk.net/channels/openttd
05:56<andythenorth>I have variants of: system cursor shown; laggy ottd cursor; missing ottd cursor
05:56<Leanden>Is it in both full screen and windowed mode peter?
05:56<andythenorth>Leanden: you are switching graphics based on lead engine?
05:57<Leanden>im using a position in consist switch
05:57*andythenorth tries to remember if the cb was extended to allow looking only at the articulated consist
05:57<andythenorth>it was discussed :P
05:58<andythenorth>you can do it with offsets to the front part, but you have to piss about with some clunky reading of variables
05:58<andythenorth>why not just use a different ID for tender? o_O
05:58<@peter1138>hmm
05:58<@peter1138>it's not doing it now
05:58<@peter1138>well, it is, but only once every couple of seconds instead of every frame
05:59<Leanden>different ID for tender?
05:59<Leanden>hold on let me get you a pastebin of the code so you can see where im at
05:59<andythenorth>I can envisage it
06:00<Samu>hmm what's up?
06:01<Leanden>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/ppwusiqlh
06:01<Leanden>well i believe im already using different IDs which is why you have me confused
06:01<Leanden>the train itself works perfectly
06:02<Leanden>but if i take two articulated trains in a double headed the train
06:02<Leanden>the second tender is replaced by the head graphics
06:02<Leanden>Ths sprites are selected by "position_in_consist"
06:03<Leanden>but even if i extend these in multiples two in case of double headed trains, i still can't guarentee the positioning will always be correct, as if for example an extra wagon isnt added between the two locos
06:04<andythenorth>afaict, that’s a locomotive with a single ID, and two parts
06:04<andythenorth>there’s nothing wrong with this approach, but you could also do it with multiple IDs
06:04<Leanden>if i seperate the tender in a seperate ID, won't you have to buy the tender seperately?
06:04<andythenorth>no, not if it’s built as part of the articulated cb by another vehicle
06:05<Leanden>hmmm, i havent found a switch in the NML documentation that adds another vehicle ID to the consist
06:05<andythenorth>but if you want cargo subtype refits for liveries, the approach you’re using makes sense
06:05<Leanden>ahh :P
06:05<andythenorth>1: return item_GNRA1 <- this is returning the ID
06:05<andythenorth>you could return a different vehicle there
06:06<andythenorth>you also set articulated consist trailing vehicles to climate none
06:06<Leanden>oh i see
06:06<Leanden>but then if you want to refit the livery
06:06<Leanden>you'd have to do the tender and loco seperately?
06:06<andythenorth>no, the tender would have to read the subtype from the lead vehicle of the consist
06:06<andythenorth>it comes to about the same either way
06:07<Leanden>so how would i get the tender to read the loco subtype?
06:08<Leanden>if i returned additional IDs in that way
06:08<Leanden>i wouldnt need the position_in_consist switch at all would i?
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06:12<andythenorth>you would
06:12<andythenorth>but you’d use it to read the subtype in the front vehicle
06:12<andythenorth>hmm, actually the trailing vehicles might pick up the subtype when they’re built or refitted, I can’t remember
06:13<andythenorth>try it? o_O
06:13*andythenorth hasn’t used subtypes for a long time
06:16<Leanden>testing now ;)
06:18<Samu>i found a way to shut down my system while keeping company passwords of clients
06:18<Samu>hibernate
06:19<Samu>it worked!
06:19<Leanden>lol
06:19<Leanden>hmmm Andy
06:19<Leanden>i changed what i thought what fix the issue, but i now have 2 heads and 1 tender :P
06:19<Leanden>with only a single loco lol
06:20<Leanden>ahhh i know why ;)
06:21<Leanden>Nailed it :D
06:21<Wolf01>hibernate is not shut down :)
06:22<Leanden>no its not
06:22<Leanden>but i pretty much exclusively use hibernate on my PC :D
06:22<Wolf01>when it works and restores network, audio...
06:22<Samu>it shuts down, everything was turned off
06:23<Leanden>no shutting down explicitly refers to wiping all memory from your computer to a fresh state
06:24<Samu>i even turned off my router
06:24<Samu>today i turned both on, everything is back to yesterday
06:24<Leanden>Hibernate takes a screenshot of the status of your RAM and stores it on the hard drive, and then recalls this image when you boot up
06:24<Leanden>in a very basic explanation :)
06:25<Samu>i wonder what would happen if i had received a different IP address though
06:25<Leanden>Its like pausing your computer :P
06:26<Leanden>Andy
06:26<Leanden>http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=74766&p=1168065#p1168065
06:27<Leanden>Andythenorth: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=74766&p=1168065#p1168065
06:28<Leanden>It was quite easy to link the liveries together
06:28<Leanden>I set the Tender ID as the articulated part of the main engine
06:28<andythenorth>yes
06:29<Leanden>gave it its own cargo_subtype switch
06:29<Leanden>but placed the cargo_subtype_text switch into the main engine ID
06:29<andythenorth>yes
06:29<Leanden>and lo and behold the refit affects both vehicle_IDs
06:29<Leanden>(but not the whole consist) :D
06:29<andythenorth>trailing parts of an articulated consist take some properties from the lead articulated vehicle
06:30<Leanden>indeed
06:30<Leanden>well im glad i have that cracked
06:33<Samu>NoCAB just sold all trains, he's in the process of upgrading tracks, interesting
06:33<Samu>this is where he usually crashes, let's see what happens
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06:36<Leanden>andythenorth: are you still with us? i want some quick advice on pnml
06:36<andythenorth>sure
06:36<Leanden>im going to split my NML file down into seperate pnml
06:36<@planetmaker>moin
06:36<Leanden>but i have two ideas and wondering which is more standard/accepted
06:37<Leanden>put each train in a seperate pnml, including all its switchs
06:37<Leanden>or split each code block type, livery_switch, articulated_switch, sprite_set etc. into a seperate pnml
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06:38<@planetmaker>a separate file for each switch etc? That's madness
06:38<andythenorth>nah
06:38<@planetmaker>The idea to split code in different files is to allow *easier* finding of the interesting part or buggy part of whatever
06:38<andythenorth>splitting the switches is ok, if you have a reason
06:38<Leanden>no each type of switch
06:39<Leanden>so all the articulated switches in a single pnml file
06:39<Leanden>all the livery switches in another
06:39<andythenorth>Leanden: have you seen how the templating works in pnml?
06:40<Samu>NoCAB upgraded all tracks, but only got 3 trains out, he had 23 trains before :( hmm he's really slow
06:40<Leanden>hmmm sprite templating or something else? :P
06:41<andythenorth>code templating
06:41<andythenorth>basically, until you understand the templating, you’re not gaining anything from pnml or similar
06:41<andythenorth>you’d just be moving code around to different files
06:41<andythenorth>in which case, one file per vehicle is best
06:41<@planetmaker>ah. Well. That might be a matter of personal taste, Leanden. Using an appropriate sprite template with the right parameter (e.g. a filename) might actually make all your switches for all the vehicles the same - except the filename parameter given
06:41*andythenorth wonders if there is a good example set to look at
06:42<@planetmaker>Anyhow, not everything refers to sprites, and then NML templating won't help much
06:43*andythenorth lost in HEQS
06:43<andythenorth>wow, that was a bad approach
06:43<@planetmaker>And then the grouping by function (e.g. all refit switches) or grouping by vehicle (everything related to one) is more a matter of personal preference
06:43<Leanden>i use sprite templates already
06:44<Leanden>saves me rewriting all the offsets, widths, etc. etc.
06:44<Leanden>well ive seen how SBB breaks down their pnml
06:44<Leanden>but it just seems spread out for the sake of spreading out
06:45<Leanden>my understanding is that with reference to each vehicle, as long as the switches come before the item before the graphics, and you dont reference an ID that hasn't yet been reached in the code, then it doesnt matter about the order
06:46<Leanden>so you could go: Train 1 Switch, Train 1 Item, Train 1 Graphics, Train 2 Switch, Train 2 Item, Train 2 Graphics, etc. etc.
06:47<andythenorth>if I were in your place, I’d just do it like HEQS for now
06:47<andythenorth>one file per vehicle, don’t bother templating the switches etc
06:47<andythenorth>write all the nml out longhand
06:47<andythenorth>reasons:
06:48<andythenorth>(1) if you’ve never used a code templating system before, the C macro system is not a very pleasant place to start
06:48<Leanden>oh i get what you mean by tempalting now
06:48<andythenorth>(2) learning all this slows you down and makes it harder to make initial progress
06:48<Leanden>ye i dont like templating code as a rule
06:48<Leanden>id much prefer to write all my code out in full
06:48<andythenorth>(3) you don’t know what templates you need until you have coded a range of common cases
06:49<Leanden>:)
06:50<andythenorth>I would not work without templates personally, but I have learnt from writing nml and nfo out longhand
06:51<andythenorth>this is the properties block for *every* train in Iron Horse http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/iron-horse/repository/entry/src/templates/train_properties.pynml
06:51<andythenorth>there’s one and only one
06:52<Leanden>yeah i dont like that
06:52<Leanden>to me it gives you less visibility on exactly what is going on
06:52<andythenorth>you have to hold two languages in your head at once
06:53<andythenorth>ok, well just split all your vehicles to individual files
06:53<andythenorth>and use includes to turn them on and off
06:53<Leanden>yup thanks :)
06:53<andythenorth>it can be very useful for debugging, or when you want to compile fast
06:53<Leanden>i assume that the order you include them is the order they will appear in the purchase list?
06:54<andythenorth>nah, default order is by ID
06:54<andythenorth>ah, you’re allowing nml to manage IDs?
06:54<Leanden>yep
06:54<Leanden>thats what the tutorial recommended
06:54<andythenorth>ok, that means if you change the order of includes, you break savegames
06:55<Leanden>ooo thats interesting to know
06:55<andythenorth>so you (1) can’t change the order unless you bump savegame (2) can’t turn includes on and off for debugging
06:55<Leanden>so i should be adding my own IDs then?
06:55<andythenorth>you can manage IDs explicitly, which C macro templating is quite good at
06:55<andythenorth>up to you
06:55<andythenorth>you could centralise them into one file
06:55<Leanden>is it just number IDs?
06:55<andythenorth>yes
06:55<Leanden>hmmm
06:56<Leanden>well breaking down into pnml now is going to break savegame compatibility anyway once i add the IDs
06:56<andythenorth>item(FEAT_TRAINS, kessler, 1990) {
06:56<andythenorth>1990 is the ID
06:56<Leanden>well i have an idea for that
06:56<Leanden>whats the highest number an ID can take?
06:57<andythenorth>depends
06:57<andythenorth>around 16000 is the limit if you want to use it as trailing part of articulated vehicle
06:57<andythenorth>you have ‘enough’ though
06:57<Leanden>im not worried about how many
06:57<Leanden>i mean the explicity number itself
06:58<Leanden>could i have 999999 for example
06:58<Leanden>even if the total number of IDs is less than 16000?
06:58<andythenorth>check the spec :)
06:58*andythenorth can’t remember
06:58<Leanden>lol
06:59<andythenorth>newgrf wiki knows
06:59<andythenorth>but max ID number for articulated trailing parts is around 16000
06:59<andythenorth>you *can* centralise IDs to one file, http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/heqs/repository/entry/sprites/nfo/ids.pnfo
07:00<andythenorth>but I found that was only helpful for nfo; for nml, better to put the ID directly into the vehicle file
07:02<Leanden>i have an idea for a system on how to define the numerical ID
07:03<Leanden>but i want to see if NML will actually accept it first :P
07:04<andythenorth>I tried systems
07:04<andythenorth>I wouldn’t bother
07:04<Leanden>xx-yy-zz
07:04<andythenorth>nope
07:04<Leanden>xx being a company identifier
07:04<andythenorth>has to be a number, int
07:04<Leanden>yy being the year of production
07:05<andythenorth>it’s converted to a hexadecimal value
07:05<Leanden>and zz being an incremental number for that year
07:05<Leanden>so for example 016901
07:05<andythenorth>it’s overkill
07:05<andythenorth>just start at one and work up
07:06<Leanden>unfortunately its not, because of the scope of the set, i can't predict when im going to add trains earlier in the list otherwise the production list will look ridiculous
07:06<andythenorth>you end up chasing your tail with fancy ID systems
07:06<andythenorth>you can control buy menu separately
07:06<Leanden>you can!?!
07:06<andythenorth>literally one big nml block
07:06<Leanden>oh well balls to it then, i dont need to even change the order of #include in that case :p
07:07<andythenorth>sort(FEAT_TRAINS, [1990, 2060, 2040, 2070, 2050, 2080, 2000, 2010, 1840, 1970, 1800, 1960, 1620, 2030, 1870, 2020, 1980, 1790, 1610, 1590, 1600, 1550, 1540, 1580, 1560, 1730, 1760, 1770, 1750, 1740, 1630, 1660, 1670, 1680, 1720, 1690, 1700, 1570, 1640, 1650, 1780, 2130, 1940, 2120, 1950, 2090, 1830, 1820, 2100, 1850, 1860, 1890, 1910, 1920, 2150, 1900, 2140, 2110, 1930, 1880, 90, 20, 340, 150, 310, 40, 370, 510, 180,
07:07<andythenorth>80, 410, 440, 250, 350, 60, 1460, 1440, 260, 320, 50, 540, 200, 400, 10, 30, 330, 1470, 1480, 1490, 780, 790, 800, 960, 970, 980, 860, 1330, 590, 600, 610, 1100, 1110, 660, 670, 680, 1250, 1260, 1040, 1430, 1210, 1220, 1390, 1400, 1180, 1510, 1300, 810, 1350, 1370, 990, 1380, 1450, 870, 1320, 620, 1310, 1120, 1130, 690, 1360, 1050, 1520, 1410, 1420, 520, 1500, 110, 480, 380, 70, 230, 0, 390, 500, 300, 270, 170, 120, 4
07:07<Leanden>but i suppose i should still use IDs in case i need to remove any
07:07<andythenorth>280, 220, 450, 100, 160, 130, 470, 530, 460, 360, 210, 290, 490, 240, 140, 430, 880, 740, 750, 760, 920, 930, 940, 1000, 820, 830, 840, 550, 560, 570, 1070, 1080, 1090, 630, 640, 1270, 1230, 1240, 1010, 1020, 1190, 1200, 730, 720, 1060, 1140, 1150, 1160, 890, 900, 910, 710, 700, 1530, 1280, 770, 950, 850, 580, 650, 1030, 1170, 1290]);
07:07<andythenorth>buy menu for Iron Horse :P
07:07<Leanden>haha
07:07<andythenorth>should have pastebinned that :P
07:07<andythenorth>do your IDs starting at 1
07:07<andythenorth>and do your includes in alphabetical order, imho
07:07<andythenorth>and do the buy menu order manually
07:11<Leanden>:)
07:11<Leanden>thanks for your help andy
07:11<Leanden>I should probably credit you as a coder after all your help :P
07:11<andythenorth>nah
07:12<andythenorth>Leanden: test your refit code early with things like autoreplace and station refit
07:12<andythenorth>I had a lot of trouble trying to abuse refit, and I don’t bother anymore
07:12<Leanden>ive disabled station refit on the locomotives
07:13<Leanden>as it doesnt make sense to me that a loco should be able to change at a station
07:22<Leanden>ugh
07:22<Leanden>im having a different issue but i cant look into it right now
07:23<Leanden>my makefile was set up to produce from an nml file
07:23<Leanden>not with pnml
07:23<Leanden>how do i modify it now to use pnml instead? :P
07:24<andythenorth>makefile has evolved over time
07:24<andythenorth>HEQS one is very old, but uses “MAIN_SRC_FILE ?= $(BASE_FILENAME).pnml”
07:24<andythenorth>with a comment
07:24<andythenorth># uncomment MAIN_SRC_FILE if you do not want any preprocessing to happen to your source file
07:26<Leanden>got a cc error
07:26<Leanden>Error 127
07:27<Leanden>hmm
07:27<Leanden>it isnt looking for the pnml
07:27<andythenorth>planetmaker is your best bet for makefile help, but he might be busy :)
07:28<Leanden>gotta go
07:33<andythenorth>more win from Garry G http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1168069#p1168069
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08:31<Wolf01>andythenorth, do you have some info about making a contained joystick for the pf controllers? I need to put 3 of them really close, and the one I found doesn't work well
08:32<andythenorth>nah
08:32<andythenorth>there are designs around though?
08:32<andythenorth>flickr?
08:32<Wolf01>yeah, but they are big or wobbly
08:39<Wolf01>I know I'll end up with something like this: https://youtu.be/r6_CUtmS_Pc?t=22s
08:40<@peter1138>pom te pom
08:55<@planetmaker><Leanden> id much prefer to write all my code out in full <-- then just do that
08:55<@planetmaker>oh, he's gone
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09:10<andythenorth>o_O http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/7805/manganese_mine_animated.mov
09:11<V453000>OMG IT MOOOOVS
09:12<andythenorth>animation cat
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09:50<supermop>yo
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10:02<argoneus>good morning train friends
10:11<Eddi|zuHause>does it ever MOOO?
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10:50<@Alberth>o/
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11:17<supermop>rail types are newgrf bullshit huh
11:18<V453000>?
11:18<V453000>like you cant have it in base set
11:18<V453000>you mean?
11:20<@Alberth>nobody forces you to use them :)
11:25-!-OsteHovel [~OsteHovel@c7815BF51.dhcp.as2116.net] has quit [Quit: Coyote finally caught me]
11:32<supermop>no thats a quote from forum
11:32<supermop>"No one is forcing you to use the new track types. So many great and doable ideas have been smothered by the "there's a NewGRF for it bulls***"! Seriously! how long do you want this game to be unchanged for?"
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11:36<@Alberth>ah :) well, that's easy, "forever" :)
11:36<V453000>XD
11:36<V453000>g
11:36<V453000>g
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11:47<@Alberth>the author seems a bit confused about how openttd gets extended
11:57<FLHerne>Well, I do sympathise a bit. There are a lot of useful non-newgrfable patches that have been floating around for years.
11:57<FLHerne>But for the kind of features he's on about...nah, clueless
12:01<@Alberth>good post :)
12:05<_dp_>imo worst thing about newgrfs is that they're way too often used as an excuse for not adding anything to the base game
12:06<FLHerne>Examples of what I'm muttering about: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=836749, http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=42598, http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=72855
12:07<_dp_>even for stuff that being done with newgrfs is ugly as hell and completely impractical
12:07<FLHerne>Small, clean patches that add uncontroversial features, that can be easily applied to current trunk
12:08<FLHerne>Not being an OTTD dev, it's hard to see why these need to be left alone for years
12:08<FLHerne>I know Eddi's can crash vehicles immediately on loading a new savegame, but those vehicles were *already* doomed by the current LC behaviour
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12:19<Eddi|zuHause>it's not that, it's vehicles that were previously perfectly safe also just run into a train in front of them
12:19<Eddi|zuHause>which is "only" a problem for old savegames, but one that should not just be ignored
12:20-!-FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:24<_dp_>make "invincible" flag for vehicles?
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12:28<Eddi|zuHause>well, one option would be to make two different closed states for crossings
12:28<_dp_>or, mb, flag for using old signal behaviour
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12:29<Eddi|zuHause>a "closed" flag for the entire crossing, and an "unsafe" flag for the crossing where actually a train is on
12:30<Eddi|zuHause>a "closed" tile will allow a vehicle to enter if coming from another "closed" tile
12:30<Eddi|zuHause>and an "unsafe" flag will not allow a vehicle to enter regardless
12:30<Eddi|zuHause>where "unsafe" is the old behaviour, and "closed" the new one introduced by that patch
12:30<_dp_>oh, I know the simplest solution, add game setting for using adjacent crossings
12:31<Eddi|zuHause>i'm very against that
12:32<Eddi|zuHause>the problem with the "unsafe" approach is that it will break again when a long tram suddenly stops in the middle of the track
12:32<Eddi|zuHause>or with the follow-up patch of "diagonal crossings"
12:36<_dp_>anyway, you need to combine both mechanics
12:37<_dp_>so, what about per-vehicle flag then? set it for some rv in old saves, and reset at some point (rv leaving signal block)
12:37<Eddi|zuHause>that could work
12:38<_dp_>hm, what if more crossings are added while vehicle already entered block?
12:40<Eddi|zuHause>that's a user error and of no concern
12:40<Eddi|zuHause>like modifying signals with trains nearby, if a train crashes, it's the player's fault
12:41<Eddi|zuHause>not the game's responsibility to fix
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12:44<_dp_>yeah
12:45<_dp_>I misinterpreted this patch at first, it's not like it competely prevents crashing, just adds a way to do save crossings
12:45<_dp_>*safe
12:47<_dp_>or, rather, slightly more safe
12:47<_dp_>if rv breaks down on rail it's doomed anyway
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12:49<Eddi|zuHause>i can't help with that :p
12:50<_dp_>well, technically, you can stop train but...
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12:50<Eddi|zuHause>that's getting a bit complicated
12:51<Eddi|zuHause>and stops it from being a "small, clean patch"
12:51<_dp_>also unrealistic :p
12:51<Eddi|zuHause>it's not actually unrealistic
12:51<Eddi|zuHause>some level crossings have a signal whether the crossing safely closed
12:52<Eddi|zuHause>and if that is not on, the train must stop before the crossing, and manually check it's safe
12:53<_dp_>but trains braking is unrealistic in openttd :p
12:53<@peter1138>fix it!
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12:57<_dp_>better not, that would break everything
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13:11<FLHerne_>Eddi|zuHause: Sorry, was afk
13:11<FLHerne_><Eddi|zuHause> it's not that, it's vehicles that were previously perfectly safe also just run into a train in front of them
13:11<FLHerne_>That was what I meant by "those vehicles were *already* doomed by the current LC behaviour"
13:12<Eddi|zuHause>how are they "doomed"?
13:12<FLHerne_>With the current setup, any vehicle crossing a double-track line is going to be destroyed eventually
13:12<Eddi|zuHause>any 8/8 vehicle parked between two rails is safe
13:12<Eddi|zuHause>only longer vehicles, or a second vehicle is "doomed"
13:12<FLHerne_>RVs have a tendency to clump, though
13:13<Eddi|zuHause>sure.
13:13<Eddi|zuHause>but that's not relevant.
13:13<FLHerne_>Okay, the majority of vehicles crossing a double-track line are doomed, unless the operator was really careful to timetable things
13:15<FLHerne_>I still think a few lost vehicles, many of which were going to be squashed anyway at some point, isn't worth the years of lost vehicles that we get :P
13:15<Eddi|zuHause>again. that's irrelevant to the problem. SOME vehicles that were SAFE in the original safegame are DOOMED, when loaded with this patch
13:15<Eddi|zuHause>which is a regression
13:15<Eddi|zuHause>and thus not allowed to happen with a "clean" patch
13:15<Eddi|zuHause>hence the patch is not "clean"
13:18<Eddi|zuHause>gtg
13:18<FLHerne_>Ok, bye :-)
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13:47<supermop>Eddi|zuHause: just automatically crash all player vehicles on load regardless of if they are near a crossing
13:48<V453000>I like it
13:48<@Alberth>call it new disaster
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13:57<supermop>improved breakdowns: train explodes for no reason
13:59<V453000>also blows up tracks under it?
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14:07<supermop>some times the train blows up, sometimes the tracks
14:07<frosch123>https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/8247 <- is that answer subtle enough? :p
14:08<supermop>sometime train derails and drives into an industry and blows up your high-production steel mill
14:09<Samu>i swithed to another ISP, servers aren't being recognized by the master server
14:09<Samu>t.t port forwarding is hard
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14:27<@Alberth>o/
14:27<andythenorth>o/
14:31<frosch123>hoi
14:36<Wolf01>o/
14:38<Wolf01>nice one frosch ;)
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14:52<@planetmaker>o/
14:52<@planetmaker>loool, frosch123 @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/8247
14:53<frosch123>just to add: i looked at the locale setting in the user's profile. i am not completely retarded :)
14:56<Wolf01>so you'll look like a wizard to him
14:58<Wolf01>maybe he really wanted to translate the placeholder language
15:00<@planetmaker>thought so :)
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15:10<Wolf01>could I apply for translating in qps-ploc?
15:11<frosch123>https://msdn.microsoft.com/de-de/goglobal/bb964664.aspx <- is it listed on that page?
15:12<frosch123>and in iso 639-1 ?
15:13<Wolf01>it's a language used by Microsoft to test the UI
15:13<Wolf01>https://msdn.microsoft.com/it-it/library/windows/desktop/dd319106(v=vs.85).aspx
15:16<Wolf01>http://archives.miloush.net/michkap/archive/2011/04/11/10152035.html
15:23<V453000>nice frosch123 :D
15:26<andythenorth>iz new gamescript yet? o_O
15:26*andythenorth wants to play a game
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16:01<andythenorth>oops, forgot to re-apply my tropic landscape patch
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18:37<Eddi|zuHause>man, frosch read that request all wrong. he clearly asked to be a translator for the "insert" language.
18:38<Supercheese>hahaha
18:44<Wolf01>:)
18:45<Wolf01>also, 'night
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---Logclosed Tue May 03 00:00:55 2016