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#openttd IRC Logs for 2016-11-24

---Logopened Thu Nov 24 00:00:56 2016
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04:10<crem>moo/
04:12<V453000>slug
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04:54<Wolf01>o/ù
04:54<Wolf01>Without the ù
04:55<__ln__>some kind of lantern you're holding in your hand?
04:57<Wolf01>Is the trash bag which smells a lot
04:59<Wolf01>V, I nominated F for the "5 minutes more" prize, fyi ;)
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05:01<V453000>of course, I am one of them nominating it :D
05:03<Wolf01>Uhm... I ran out of iron, bad, really bad
05:03<V453000>I feel like running out of everything atm
05:04<Wolf01>Also copper mine is not at its best
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06:15<Wolf01>V, is possible to select what to deconstruct with blueprints?
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08:03<Wolf01>Converted every kind of smelter/vehicle to run on wood... at least I found an use for the 40k+ wood I had in the crates
08:16<V453000>Wolf01: not yet :)
08:17<Wolf01>I installed the tree regrowth mod, it's fantastic if you would like to burn the world
08:17<Wolf01>Every now and then I need to get rid of some trees to be able to move between outposts
08:18<Wolf01>So I have *A LOT* of wood
08:24<Alkel_U3>Wolf01: there's some Upgrade planner mod which also lets you deconstruct selectively
08:24<V453000>^
08:25<Alkel_U3>also, a lot of wood calls for Charcoal burner mod :-)
08:26<V453000>^ :)
08:26<V453000>add bergius process and you got it all the way towards rocket fuel :>
08:29<Alkel_U3>I've got rocket fuel covered with Beyond - a little more complicated but also fun and also growable for the most part
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10:02<Eddi|zuHause>uhm, so this happened...
10:02<Eddi|zuHause>i had a job interview, and when the third thing i said was "i like python", they pretty much wanted to hire me on the spot
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10:04<Wolf01>Once upo a time, a month ago, it happened that I had a job interview, when I said I have experience they said "cool", and they looked for a 20yo to hire as apprentice
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10:29<V453000>XD
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11:01<@Alberth>o/
11:14<V453000>yo
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12:43<Wolf01>Quak
12:43<frosch123>moi
12:44<frosch123>is there new stuff to pull?
12:44<Wolf01>There's a patch for roadstops in my gist
12:44<frosch123>i.e. do you have stuff that is not in andy's repo?
12:44<Wolf01>No, only that, andy pulled everything
12:45<Wolf01>I have some weird problems getting the current roadtype on roadstops
12:46<Wolf01>https://gist.github.com/Wolfolo/21b9c4f6387c8d8546ddb1d165f90f6b
12:46<Wolf01>I would like to rely on m7 7..6
12:46<Wolf01>Or remove the assert for MP_ROAD from GetRoadBits()
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13:11<frosch123>that diff does not apply to andy's head
13:12<Wolf01>Maybe he updated more things
13:12<Wolf01>What does conflict?
13:12<frosch123>all of road_map, maybe it is an eol-style issue :p
13:13<Wolf01>Could be
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13:15<frosch123>RoadTypeIdentifiers::FromTile does not exist in my working copy
13:15<frosch123>you have some changeset before, which i do not ahve
13:16<Wolf01>Maybe andy pulled just before that change
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13:17<frosch123>there is also no new stuff in wolf/dev
13:17<Wolf01>Discard wolf/dev, I deprecated that
13:18<Wolf01>I work on andy/wolf
13:18<frosch123>there is also wolf/gui and wolf/master
13:18<frosch123>oh, origin/wolf
13:18<frosch123>did not know about that one :)
13:18<frosch123>yeah, that did a fast-forward
13:19<Wolf01>I would like to delete my clone, having all the branches with the same names created a lot of confusion
13:19<Wolf01>Also when andy merged my early gui to master which was even incompatible with my dev
13:21<frosch123>i merged andy/wolf into andy/road-and-tram-types
13:21<Wolf01>+1
13:21<frosch123>no idea what is the point of andy/wolf
13:22<Wolf01>I could work directly on road-and-tram, indeed
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13:40<frosch123>Wolf01: the assert in GetRoadBits is correct
13:40<frosch123>you are supposed to call GetAnyRoadBits
13:40<frosch123>if it shall work for all "roady" tiles
13:40<Wolf01>GetAnyRoadBits uses GetRoadBits
13:41<frosch123>hmm, do you mean GetRoadTypes?
13:41<Wolf01>No, bits
13:41<frosch123>GetAnyRoadBits does not use GetRoadBits for stations
13:43<frosch123>btw. doxygen comments start with /**, not /*
13:43<frosch123>how do i trigger your problem?
13:44<Wolf01>Remove a roadstop with base road or tram
13:44<Wolf01>All other ones work
13:44<Wolf01>They all restore the correct road type
13:45<frosch123>i see, it doesn't even set the right bits :p
13:46<Wolf01>Because it sees "0" and thinks there is no road, but 0 is the normal road
13:47<frosch123>sounds like it compares roadtypes with roadsubtypes
13:51<frosch123>RoadTypeIdentifiers::FromTile fails
13:51<Wolf01>Yes
13:51<frosch123>ah, there is a todo
13:51<Wolf01>Because can't figure out how to get the roadtype/subtype reliably
13:54<frosch123>why do you check the roadbits? there are roadtypes
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13:55<Wolf01>Because the spec said to deprecate the m7 bits 7..6
13:56<Wolf01>And use roadbits to check if road exists in the tile
13:56<Wolf01>I would like to not deprecate them and use them in RoadTypeIdentifiers::FromTile
13:57<frosch123>i don't know that spec then :)
13:57<frosch123>but for roadstops m7 7..6 are needed, they are the only criterion
13:57<Wolf01>https://github.com/andythenorth/NotRoadTypes/wiki
13:58<Wolf01>Ho, he didn't copy all the pastes
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13:59<frosch123>that page does not mention m7
13:59<frosch123>it talks about 15 subtypes, while we have 16
13:59<Wolf01>There's a rogue paste from openttdcoop
14:00<Wolf01>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/psgp4tw79
14:01<Wolf01>Dinner, bbl
14:02<frosch123>Wolf01: ok, that paste implies that we only have 15 subtypes, and one of them means "no road/no tram"
14:03<frosch123>not sure we really want to do that though
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14:03<frosch123>otoh, using 1 bit for road present, and then 4 for the type is also redundant
14:04<frosch123>ok, so using only subtypes without the roadtype, would mean to use subtype 0xF as "no type"
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14:22<Wolf01>Back, line 4 meant the RoadTypes bits, or m7 7..6
14:25<frosch123>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pwaywzcai
14:25<frosch123>i think the spec means option 1
14:25<frosch123>and i think i like it more than option 2
14:26<frosch123>it reduced the number of road/tramtypes to 15, but if we would add the extra bit we could rather support 31 types
14:26<frosch123>so, i prefer the 15 version
14:26<Wolf01>Me too
14:27<Wolf01>I already had a talk with andy about this, he decided for 16 because he liked the number, but no real need
14:27<frosch123>16 makes no sense, either 15 or 31 :)
14:27<Wolf01>So even with 8 is good... who'll use 16 different roads and 16 different trams?
14:28<frosch123>oh, i have no doubt that people could fill up 31 typs
14:28<frosch123>with different speed and weight restrictions
14:28<frosch123>but i would consider those newgrf to have BAD FEATURES :)
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14:31<Jinassi>NuTracks expaning features? I welcome the new NuRoads overlords
14:31<Wolf01>Lol
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15:40<V453000>anydbody haz link to jenkins?
15:40<V453000>I can't seem to find it :D
15:40<V453000>want to see how yeti goes
15:42<@Alberth>V453000: https://jenkins.openttdcoop.org/job/yeti/
15:42<V453000>thanks :)
15:43<@Alberth>just search "jenkins" on the site, then adjust a random link to yeti :)
15:44<V453000>hm I don't seem to have a login at jenkins
15:44<V453000>would love to cancel the current build and force the next one
15:45<@Alberth>you could try the #openttdcoop.devzone for more powerful users
15:46<V453000>I'll probably wait
15:46<V453000>I won't be awake when it finishes anyway
15:46<@Alberth>otherwise: https://xkcd.com/303/
15:46<V453000>so I will have to do in the morning regardless
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15:51<andythenorth>o/
15:51<@Alberth>o/
15:51<V453000>yo cat
15:51<andythenorth>is BRIX?
15:52<Eddi|zuHause>BRIXIT?
15:52<andythenorth>BRIXIT means BRIXIT
15:52<andythenorth>and tautology means tautology
15:52<V453000>BRIX dying
15:52<andythenorth>always
15:52<V453000>and being born at the same time
15:52<V453000>it's wtf
15:55<Wolf01>o/
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16:38<Jinassi>Farms in FIRS not grouping anymore? Or is it climate specific?
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16:43<andythenorth>FIRS v2 has grouping, but much wider spacing
16:43<andythenorth>and higher production
16:44<andythenorth>overlapping lots of little farms was a nice idea…but FAIL
16:44<andythenorth>as it’s very tedious to deliver supplies to each one
16:45<andythenorth>Jinassi: ^
16:45<Jinassi>Noted, the difficulty itself was very rewarding, as people had to figure out how to use them to their full potential.
16:46*andythenorth is too lazy :)
16:47<Jinassi>Is there a posibility to have that as a variable please?
16:48<andythenorth>no, it’s too intricate
16:48<andythenorth>needs to adjust probability, clustering distance and production amounts
16:48<Eddi|zuHause>the correct answer would have been "i'm too lazy" again :p
16:48<andythenorth>also
16:48<Jinassi>Not a problem, thank you for response
16:48<andythenorth>FIRS forks seem to be quite viable
16:49<andythenorth>couple of people succeeding with them who are clearly not experienced programmers
16:49<andythenorth>I encourage forks :) (but no support) :P
16:49<Eddi|zuHause>as if FIRS were coded by an experienced programmer :p
16:50<andythenorth>I am a highly experienced devloloper
16:51<Eddi|zuHause>emphasis on "LOL" :p
16:52<andythenorth>I have been *writing* code nearly all my life
16:52<Wolf01>Copy pasting from stackoverflow?
16:52<andythenorth>stack overflow in 1982 :P
16:52<andythenorth>copy-paste from the BBC Basic manual
16:52<andythenorth>now I have forgotten my next joke Wolf01 :(
16:53<andythenorth>it was great
16:53<Eddi|zuHause>then it was not a good one.
16:54<andythenorth>we will never know
16:54<andythenorth>a sad loss
16:54<Wolf01>I have a joke for you, 15 types are enough and 0xF to identify no road/tram? https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pwaywzcai
16:54<Wolf01>(proposal by the frog one)
16:54<andythenorth>that kind of question needs a programmer :P
16:54<Eddi|zuHause>15 types ought to be enough for everyone
16:55<andythenorth>there you go
16:55<andythenorth>what eddi said
16:55<Eddi|zuHause>i feel like every time that question came up i gave a different answer
16:55<Wolf01>640k
16:56<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause <= magic 8 ball
16:56<andythenorth>Wolf01: more than 15 is daft
16:56<Wolf01>Mmmh, we should port the factorio autorail to ottd
16:57<Wolf01>More than 15 is 16
16:57<andythenorth>that too
16:57<andythenorth>given that each type needs a tile, and that only one type per tile
16:57<andythenorth>fitting 15 types on the map would take dedication
16:57<andythenorth>and probably a lot of bridges
16:57<Eddi|zuHause>that's not really the question
16:57<andythenorth>or they’d all be compatible
16:57<andythenorth>which is silly
16:58<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause: better question?
16:59<Eddi|zuHause>{dirt, cobble, asphalt, concrete}x{bare, catenary}x{town,country} and you have 16
16:59<Wolf01>You wouldn't put catenary on dirt
17:00<Wolf01>-> 15
17:00<Eddi|zuHause>you sure? these electric mining trucks seem to disagree
17:00<Wolf01>Batteries
17:00<andythenorth>catenary
17:01<andythenorth>it’s trivial to use up all the types
17:01<Wolf01>Mmmh, I need to plan carefully this new station
17:01<andythenorth>it’s just not very interesting to support the people making model train sets
17:02<andythenorth>Wolf01: I am +1 for the record, I think it’s a non-controversial decision
17:03<andythenorth>if 15 is absolutely definitely needed, then 16 probably isn’t enough either
17:04<Wolf01>We should just decide a reasonable limit which makes also sense when developing it, 16 already proved to not make sense
17:04<andythenorth>15
17:07<andythenorth>also bed :)
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17:09<Wolf01>Cats going and coming... what this channel became?
17:10<Eddi|zuHause>the only thing missing is danmack joining and doing @seen andythenorth
17:13<Wolf01>ln even came back, what are the odds?
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19:18<Wolf01>'night
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---Logclosed Fri Nov 25 00:00:58 2016