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#openttd IRC Logs for 2016-11-30

---Logopened Wed Nov 30 00:00:05 2016
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02:00<dihedral>morning
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03:45<crem>Добрай раніцы.
03:45<crem>(moo/)
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06:47<andythenorth>o/
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06:51<V453000>sup yo
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06:56<andythenorth>ships are PITA
07:00<goodger>'Ship 4 is lost' --- lies
07:01<Eddi|zuHause>if you get "ship is lost" messages, you might want to change the pathfinder settings
07:02<andythenorth>I need 150t ships
07:02<andythenorth>I have 100t or 240t
07:03<andythenorth>this is why ships are lame
07:03<andythenorth>* one reason
07:03<Eddi|zuHause>yes, that's a problem
07:04<andythenorth>with trains, you add wagons
07:04<andythenorth>with RVs, 30t-40t is the correct size, and you just add more
07:05<Eddi|zuHause>that's why i suggested ships with n*sqrt(2) size steps
07:06<V453000>the fuck :D
07:06<Eddi|zuHause>no
07:06<Eddi|zuHause>k*sqrt(2)^n
07:06<Eddi|zuHause>so k is fixed an n travels from 1..inf
07:07<Eddi|zuHause>e.g. k=100 will give you 100t, 140t, 200t, ...
07:07<V453000>so like 1, 1.41, 2, 2.8 ... ?
07:07<V453000>right
07:08<andythenorth>the downside, it’s much work to make a 100t ship visually distinct from a 140t ship
07:08<andythenorth>whilst still being clearly of same ‘type'
07:08<Eddi|zuHause>just add pixels?
07:08<V453000>make trains ? :)
07:08<Eddi|zuHause>make it a few pixels longer
07:11<andythenorth>reminds me of http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8207/fish_205.png
07:11<V453000>WHICH WAS NICE XD\
07:12<andythenorth>simples eh?
07:16<Arveen>am i doing it right ? http://www.tiikoni.com/tis/view/?id=e044559
07:18<andythenorth>it will clip in depots
07:18<andythenorth>but yes
07:18<Arveen>:D
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07:30<Wolf01>o/
07:31<crem>o/
07:31<crem>moo/
07:39<Wolf01>o/
07:47<Wolf01>Nice, other 2 games for free.. not new but remastered editions
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09:21<andythenorth>ach ships
09:21<andythenorth>something should be done :P
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09:45<Wolf01>No ships, cats
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10:59<Wolf01>o/
10:59<@Alberth>o/
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11:16<andythenorth>lo Alberth
11:17<@Alberth>o/
11:33<BluesInTheNet>good luck guys
11:37<andythenorth>it is plausible that an industry tile check could pathfind to the map edge?
11:37<andythenorth>in a reasonable time?
11:39*andythenorth is trying to get a map where port-type industries are not trapped in enclosed seas
11:40<andythenorth>generated about 50 maps so far
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11:46<@Alberth>how do you do pathfinding in a newgrf?
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11:49<andythenorth>this would be handled by openttd, it’s a variable
11:49<andythenorth>for my case bool result would suffice, although they usually return a number (distance, count, whatever)
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12:04<@Alberth>worst case is a 4096^2 map, where the industry is in the center of the map, with water everywhere
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12:05<andythenorth>probably pathological :P
12:05<@Alberth>quite :)
12:09<andythenorth>I probably just have to keep generating maps :P
12:10<@Alberth>dig a canal to fix the problem :p
12:11<supermop_>ANDY DOESNT WANT INLANF BULK TERMINALS?
12:11<andythenorth>maybe we could adjust map gen :P
12:11<SpComb^>Dock on a pond
12:11<andythenorth>to not generate enclosed seas
12:12<andythenorth>all tiles of height 0 must be contiguous
12:12<SpComb^>yes, and there should be lakes at heights > 0
12:12<andythenorth>$someone should fix map gen
12:16<SpComb^>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5HPAOXDn8o&feature=youtu.be&t=353 "That's not a sea"
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12:22<andythenorth>not a sea
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12:38<andythenorth>Steeltown economy is a total PITA :D
12:38<andythenorth>everything is connected
12:41<supermop_>trump one bc of broken industry chains?
12:41<supermop_>won
12:41<supermop_>f
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12:44<andythenorth>to get ensp I need about 9 inputs
12:45<andythenorth>this is by design, but it’s very different to ‘basic’ games I’ve been playing
12:45<supermop_>well there is scope for something between 'basic' and 'extreme'
12:47<supermop_>tons of supplies flowing out of ports makes basic economies a bit too easy to have gung ho everywhere
12:47<supermop_>beyond what even IH can easily carry
12:48<supermop_>s i usually make the gung ho level produce a bit less
12:53<andythenorth>try steeltown
12:53<andythenorth>it’s pretty alpah though
12:53<andythenorth>alpha *
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12:54<supermop_>alpaca?
12:56<supermop_>andean basic
12:57<andythenorth>that’s tropic :P
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13:20<supermop_>cold in andes
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13:27<andythenorth>need a new climate
13:27<andythenorth>desert + snow
13:28<supermop_>bolivia
13:28<andythenorth>https://thumb1.shutterstock.com/display_pic_with_logo/951733/274297658/stock-photo-snow-cap-mountain-in-high-altitude-atacama-desert-in-bolivia-with-lagoon-274297658.jpg
13:28<supermop_>joshua tree caifornia
13:28<supermop_>utah
13:29<supermop_>are you going to patch game to allow that?
13:29<andythenorth>it could be done with a base set I guess
13:29<andythenorth>would need a new snow transition tile
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13:42<supermop_>then your desert would need to be grass
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14:03<andythenorth>such industries need drawing
14:03<andythenorth>basic oxygen plant, galvanising plant, slag grinding mill
14:03<andythenorth>electric arc furnace
14:04<andythenorth>shipyard, ore terminal
14:04<andythenorth>much pixels
14:08<supermop_>sheds
14:08<supermop_>sheds and pipes
14:08<supermop_>sheds and greeble
14:08<andythenorth>lots of pipes
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14:09<andythenorth>these are my current favourite industries: http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/LATEST/docs/html/industries.html#chemical_plant
14:09<andythenorth>http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/LATEST/docs/html/industries.html#pyrite_smelter
14:10<andythenorth>so much newgrf to do :P
14:12<supermop_>The terracotta block and shading makes it looks somehow too british?
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14:16<frosch123>you like pipes
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14:17<andythenorth>yarp
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14:20<frosch123>i like the cement plant
14:21<frosch123>also, apparently i never played basic temperate
14:21<andythenorth>basic temperate is probably the nicest
14:21<andythenorth>it’s like an upgraded default game
14:21<frosch123>i know for sure that i never played extreme, but some of the industries that only appear in basic temperate look very unfamilar to me :)
14:24<andythenorth>hmm, I could automate the industry graphics
14:24<andythenorth>for the docs
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14:24<andythenorth>I could write a sprite-comping routine in PIL
14:24<andythenorth>someone will now post the XKCD
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14:36<frosch123>i think we discussed automating them before
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14:36<frosch123>do you still have the white.grf?
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14:42<andythenorth>yes
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14:52<andythenorth>ach, ship capacities
14:52*andythenorth considers a ‘load factor’ refit option +/-25%
14:52<andythenorth>even though subtypes suck
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15:02<andythenorth>ach station refits can’t handle subtypes :P
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15:03<andythenorth>shame, I already had an implementation for ship refittable capacity
15:03<andythenorth>but I never use depot refit
15:10<andythenorth>http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8208/sam-refits.png
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15:16<Eddi|zuHause>just add a parameter to disable size refits, for people who want to use depot refits
15:16<Eddi|zuHause>and depot refits should work, as long as all cargos have the same subtypes with the same name in the same order
15:20<andythenorth>it’s station refits that aren’t supported
15:20<andythenorth>they simply have no UI for subtypes
15:20<supermop_>PATCH IT IN
15:21<supermop_>FULL SCREEN ORDERS GUI
15:22<andythenorth>station refit defaults to first subtype
15:22<Eddi|zuHause>uhm, that sounds wrong
15:23<Eddi|zuHause>it should keep the subtype, like all the other features
15:23<andythenorth>and what’s the default subtype of a vehicle? o_O
15:24<andythenorth>…the first one :)
15:24<Eddi|zuHause>well, you can change the default in the depot, and if you clone, it should also keep the subtype...
15:24<andythenorth>yes
15:24<andythenorth>but that’s not how I play, so eh :P
15:24<andythenorth>I never use depot refit, it’s a waste of time
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15:25<Eddi|zuHause>supermop_: for the gui, it's an unsolvable problem, because more than one vehicle type can share orders, and they might not all have the same subtype, and you can autoreplace and stuff, which would also invalidate the order
15:25<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: i think you're having too specific of a use case in mind
15:26<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: of course, you could try to implement refitting direcly from the purchase menu ("there's a patch for that")
15:27<Eddi|zuHause>+t
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15:27<supermop_>what is the use case here anyway
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15:28<andythenorth>should I get a more vague use case? :P
15:28<andythenorth>that sounds like a successful strategy ;)
15:29<andythenorth>the deficiency I see is that station refit is crippled :)
15:30<andythenorth>ok, so it’s already broken anyway
15:30<andythenorth>but what’s the rationale for crippling it as well?
15:30<andythenorth>I’ll ignore the silent breaking of orders, because eh, it’s not important :)
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15:38<andythenorth>maybe I could patch the station refit
15:40<andythenorth>maybe I could have a nap :)
15:47<@Alberth>do both? :p
15:48<__ln__>does "Abendkasse" have anything to do with Abend per se?
15:48<andythenorth>Alberth: sleep-patching? o_O
15:48<@Alberth>dreaming about patching, perhaps :)
15:49<@Alberth>sleep-patching seems quite difficult to me
15:49<Eddi|zuHause>__ln__: it's generally assumed that concerts are in the evening, and the "abendkasse" thus is the place where you buy tickets directly before the concert
15:51<@Alberth>so, the answer is "yes" :p
15:51<__ln__>looking at tickets to something that starts at 11am, and Abendkasse in that context sounded a bit weird
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15:56<Eddi|zuHause>the answer is "yes, but nobody cared about the exceptions enough to change it"
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16:45<__ln__>Eddi|zuHause: like the exception that buses don't actually run on tracks (bahn)
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16:46<Eddi|zuHause>__ln__: well, you have a "Busbahnhof", but no "Busbahn" actually goes there...
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19:38<Eddi|zuHause>__ln__: oh, also nice is a "Weltraumbahnhof", even though there aren't actually any rails into space :/
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22:46-!-ConductorCat is "realname" on #openttdcoop #openttd
23:04-!-Mek [~quassel@marijnalexwedding.com] has quit [Server closed connection]
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23:04-!-Mek is "Marijn Kruisselbrink" on #openttd
23:29-!-Darksecond [~darksecon@a82-94-53-70.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Server closed connection]
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23:31-!-Darksecond is "Tim Peters" on #openttd
---Logclosed Thu Dec 01 00:00:06 2016