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#openttd IRC Logs for 2017-01-03

---Logopened Tue Jan 03 00:00:45 2017
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09:19<supermop>good morning
09:19<supermop>hmm i was mentioned it seems
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10:20<supermop>hi Alberth
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10:42<supermop>hi frosch123
10:44<@Alberth>what's the usecase for supporting symbolic links in tarfiles?
10:48<frosch123>do you remember the days when there were dos and win paletted grfs and 32bpp in tars?
10:48<@Alberth>never very consiously, but yeah :)
10:49<frosch123>someone thought: if grfs only differ by filename and 8bpp graphics, but shall share the 32bpp, then symlink them
10:49<frosch123>i.e. i think you can safetly trash the symlink stuff :)
10:50<@Alberth>makes sense
10:50<supermop>what case would they share 32bpp? to save file space?
10:51<@Alberth>and move the files of a tar inside the tarfile object, at least that seems like a good idea to me too :)
10:53<@Alberth>ie move elements of TarFileList _tar_filelist[NUM_SUBDIRS]; into elements of TarList _tar_list[NUM_SUBDIRS];
11:05<@Alberth>supermop: 32bpp doesn't change if you switch from DOS to WIN palette for 8bpp
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11:07<@Alberth>ie dos.grf win.grf and some form of dos32.grf and win32.grf (names are wrong is my guess)
11:07<@Alberth>o/ W
11:18<Wolf01>So, something interesting happened while I was busy with flu?
11:19<@Alberth>the number of the year changed?
11:19*frosch123 was about to ask the same :p
11:19<Wolf01>Besides that?
11:19<@Alberth>so that pretty much sums it up , I think
11:23<Wolf01>Seem that the most wanted features now are: define roadtypes a city could build and elevated roadtypes with disabled collisions
11:26<frosch123>first one sounds like "build newest roadtype that has flag 'city buildable'", and raises the question when to update
11:26<frosch123>otoh, roads could just have date-dependant graphics
11:27<frosch123>the latter would make sense for suspension rail
11:27<frosch123>it would increase the loading capacity of roadstops when using both buses and trams )
11:29<frosch123>problem might be that people want ordinate tram under suspended tram :p
11:30<Wolf01>Also I was trying to get if a road was a "country road" some days ago, but somebody told me is already possible to check it with varaction 2 or something
11:30<frosch123>but we need fence-support
11:30<frosch123>currently roadtypes do not supply any roadsides
11:31<Wolf01>It shouldn't be that hard
11:31<frosch123>Wolf01: all road tiles have a reference to the owning or nearest town btw
11:31<frosch123>so, querying any town stuff is generally easy for roads
11:31<Wolf01>Yes, I figured that out
11:32<Wolf01>About roadsides, we should change completely the code which handles the stuff drawin in town zones
11:33<Wolf01>Because one roadtype in a town zone might not want to follow the default
11:35<frosch123>i think about adding a flag "do not draw default roadsides", setting it by default for the tram typesa
11:35<frosch123>and then adding a123 graphics for fences
11:37<Wolf01>What about adding an array of roadsides so a roadtype could configure it how it wants? The default roads uses an array of the defaults roadsides
11:37<frosch123>hmm, andy spammed fs
11:38<frosch123>did andy have some disease? why would anyone comment on fs suggestions?
11:47<@Alberth>christmas present by andy, perhaps :p
11:48<Wolf01>What did he do this time?
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11:52<LordAro>frosch123: iirc, he was going through things that should be closed
11:52*LordAro waves
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11:53<LordAro>guess he was hoping you'd(or some admin) would get the content of his messages, rather than just that he'd made a message
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12:11<Wolf01>Meh, I should start building my micro-scale city diorama, I only have 2 months to do that
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13:27<supermop>i feel so liberated nolonger having a computer at home
13:27<supermop>although it means i only get to play openttd at work
13:28<Wolf01>Aren't you supposed to work while at work?
13:29<supermop>supposed to
13:30<frosch123>where do you sleep?
13:30<supermop>i have stayed late to push pixels around lately
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13:36<andythenorth>^ ‘small’ were drawn last night; ‘micro’ and ‘mini’ are old FISH sprites that need a bit more work
13:37<andythenorth>oops, forgot to un-retina the image :)
13:37<andythenorth>might be big
13:37<frosch123>browser zoom
13:40<frosch123>no houses in the middle
13:40<andythenorth>there will be
13:41<frosch123>large freighter does not really look larger than the small one
13:41<frosch123>wrt. cargo space
13:41<andythenorth>I wondered that
13:42<andythenorth>even looking at photos of ships, size is really hard to tell
13:42<andythenorth>for similar shapes
13:42<frosch123>large livestock and fridge front lacks the black floor
13:42<frosch123>looks kind of hollow
13:43<frosch123>also large piece
13:43<frosch123>is it supposed to look like that?
13:43<andythenorth>it is, but if it looks weird…it could look different
13:44<andythenorth>it can continue the grey
13:45<andythenorth>eh, by volume the large freight is 3.75 times more capacity than the small
13:45<andythenorth>the in-game capacity is 2.4 times
13:45<andythenorth>but that is totally not discoverable by eye
13:47<frosch123>it is somewhat wider
13:48<andythenorth>it doesn’t look bigger; looks further away
13:48<andythenorth>eh how about this?
13:49<frosch123>did something change? except the alignment?
13:50<andythenorth>alignment only
13:50<frosch123>i prefer the centered one
13:51<andythenorth>yes, it’s graphically preferable
13:51<andythenorth>it just causes an unfortunate size perception effect :)
13:51<andythenorth>it’s related to
13:52<supermop>Yo andythenorth
13:52<frosch123>well, the large freighter mostly grows in the back and the front, but not in the cargo space :)
13:57<@Alberth>cargo space extends under the front and back :p
13:59<andythenorth>I think the bow is too long relative to hold space
14:00<andythenorth>and maybe the house too
14:00<andythenorth>I don’t mind redrawing these a lot
14:01<andythenorth>I’m going to write a compositor to make the different models from each hull type
14:01<andythenorth>draw each hull+house combo once, get it good
14:01<frosch123>i thought you already did :o
14:04<andythenorth>not until the perception is right :P
14:04<andythenorth>the size effects on ships have been bugging me for a long time
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14:05<andythenorth>any forums? o_O
14:06<frosch123>didn't dare reading them yet
14:14<Wolf01>I think is the same video I saw months ago
14:23<andythenorth>yeah it was shared here
14:24<andythenorth>relatively high effort to derail a train
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14:30<andythenorth>are hard to judge size of :P
14:36<Lejving>I wish this wasn't a somewhat decent chat, then I'd make an adult joke :(
14:40<andythenorth>it’s ok, we can make it in our heads
14:43<andythenorth>think I should push the house back a couple of pixels, and bow forwards
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14:56<andythenorth>frosch123: any noticeable improvement?
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15:03<frosch123>not sure whether you made the large one larger, or the small one smaller, but i think they look different now :)
15:05<andythenorth>the hold is 4px longer in the big one
15:05<andythenorth>and the shape is changed enough, the small one doesn’t look like a further-away repeat of big one
15:10<Wolf01>While you are at it you could do a tribute to Cussler's Oregon :P
15:17*andythenorth googles :P
15:18<Wolf01>It's difficult to find the real one, or at least good pictures of it
15:18*andythenorth found the books
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15:23<andythenorth>I could make the big ship 1px wider also
15:23<andythenorth>not sure
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15:35<Wolf01> I think this is the best one so far, from the corsair book
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15:41<andythenorth>big ship :)
15:44<Wolf01>Make it only haul logs ;)
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15:48<andythenorth>@calc 128/96
15:48<@DorpsGek>andythenorth: 1.33333333333
15:49<andythenorth>2.4x increase in ship capacity, but my sprite length rules say only 1.3 increase in length
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16:13<@Rubidium>@calc 1.333333333333333**3
16:13<@DorpsGek>Rubidium: 2.37036859259
16:13<@Rubidium>close enough if you assume length, width and height are increased by 1.|3|
16:15<andythenorth>volume, it’s bigger than you think :P
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16:17<@Rubidium>it's only about 1.25% off
16:20<andythenorth>I’ll buy that for a dollar :)
16:21<andythenorth>@calc 9/7
16:21<@DorpsGek>andythenorth: 1.28571428571
16:21<andythenorth>9px wide big ship, 7px wide small ship, not far off
16:21<andythenorth>@calc 7/4
16:21<@DorpsGek>andythenorth: 1.75
16:22<andythenorth>@calc 1.75*1.33*1.29
16:22<@DorpsGek>andythenorth: 3.002475
16:22<andythenorth>yeah, ok
16:28<andythenorth>added small flatdeck
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16:42<Redirect_Left>It's nice the livestock get windows.
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16:56<supermop>stakes on a boat?
16:58<V453000>don't question :D
16:59<Lejving>snakes on a plane?
16:59<supermop>andy will be drawing flatbed 747s next
16:59<V453000>slug edition
16:59<Lejving>slugs on a train?
16:59<supermop>oversize piece goods concordes
16:59<V453000>it's coming
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18:14<supermop>doing this instead of work
18:14<supermop>if anyone interested
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---Logclosed Wed Jan 04 00:00:46 2017