Back to Home / #openttd / 2017 / 04 / Prev Day | Next Day
#openttd IRC Logs for 2017-04-27

---Logopened Thu Apr 27 00:00:26 2017
00:16-!-sla_ro|master [] has quit []
00:31-!-cosmobird [~cosmobird@] has joined #openttd
00:31-!-cosmobird is "realname" on #open-maps-more-than-maps #osm #openttdcoop #openttd #OpenRailwayMap #josm #hot #communitydata
01:17-!-chomwitt is "chomwitt" on #debian #debian-games
01:17-!-chomwitt [] has joined #openttd
01:25-!-chomwitt [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:26-!-Cubey [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:30-!-nekomaster [~Matthew@] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
01:30-!-nekomaster [~Matthew@] has joined #openttd
01:30-!-nekomaster is "purple" on #openttd
01:37-!-andythenorth [] has joined #openttd
01:37-!-andythenorth is "andythenorth" on #openttd
01:38-!-andythenorth [] has left #openttd []
01:45-!-Supercheese [] has joined #openttd
01:45-!-Supercheese is "Supercheese" on #openttd #openttdcoop.devzone
01:45-!-chomwitt is "chomwitt" on #debian #debian-games
01:45-!-chomwitt [] has joined #openttd
01:55-!-chomwitt [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:56-!-keoz [~keikoz@2a01:e35:2fd5:51e0:1037:e61d:fbf:2ba8] has joined #openttd
01:56-!-keoz is "Grmph" on #openttd
02:05-!-sim-al2 is now known as Guest1259
02:05-!-sim-al2 [] has joined #openttd
02:05-!-sim-al2 is "sim-al2" on #openttd @#/r/openttd
02:09-!-Guest1259 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:10-!-sim-al2 is now known as Guest1260
02:10-!-sim-al2 [] has joined #openttd
02:10-!-sim-al2 is "sim-al2" on #openttd @#/r/openttd
02:14-!-Guest1260 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:25-!-Biolunar [] has joined #openttd
02:25-!-Biolunar is "Biolunar" on #openttd #suckless
02:35-!-Biolunar [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:49-!-keoz [~keikoz@2a01:e35:2fd5:51e0:1037:e61d:fbf:2ba8] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:12-!-berndj [] has quit [Quit: ZNC -]
03:12-!-Sova [] has joined #openttd
03:12-!-Sova is "realname" on #openttd #openttdcoop
03:14-!-berndj [] has joined #openttd
03:14-!-berndj is "Bernd Jendrissek" on #openttd #openttdcoop #osm #osm-za
03:14-!-sim-al2 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:14-!-berndj is now known as Guest1267
03:27-!-Alberth [] has joined #openttd
03:27-!-mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ
03:27-!-Alberth is "purple" on @#openttd
03:30-!-nekomaster [~Matthew@] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
03:31-!-nekomaster [~Matthew@] has joined #openttd
03:31-!-nekomaster is "purple" on #openttd
03:35-!-Biolunar [] has joined #openttd
03:35-!-Biolunar is "Biolunar" on #openttd #suckless
04:08-!-smoke_fumus [~smoke_fum@] has joined #openttd
04:08-!-smoke_fumus is "Crapping wizard" on #qemu #oolite #openttd
04:40-!-Supercheese [] has quit [Quit: Valete omnes]
04:54-!-Wolf01 [] has joined #openttd
04:54-!-Wolf01 is "Wolf01" on #openttd
04:55<__ln__>i wasn't expecting you for another 27 minutes
04:56<Wolf01>Eh salesman of worwerk from hell decided is a good thing to awake the wolf
05:01-!-TrueBrain [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
05:03-!-TrueBrain [] has joined #openttd
05:03-!-TrueBrain is "Patric Stout" on #openttd #opendune
05:06-!-TrueBrain-Bot [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
05:11-!-TrueBrain [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
05:24-!-andythenorth [~andytheno@] has joined #openttd
05:24-!-andythenorth is "andythenorth" on #openttd
05:31-!-nekomaster [~Matthew@] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
05:32-!-nekomaster [] has joined #openttd
05:32-!-nekomaster is "purple" on #openttd
05:52-!-cosmobird [~cosmobird@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:00-!-andythenorth [~andytheno@] has left #openttd []
06:04-!-efess [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:05-!-efess [] has joined #openttd
06:05-!-efess is "afsd" on #openttdcoop #openttd #/r/openttd
06:20-!-Sova [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
07:08-!-Sova [] has joined #openttd
07:08-!-Sova is "realname" on #openttdcoop #openttd
07:31-!-sim-al2 [] has joined #openttd
07:31-!-sim-al2 is "sim-al2" on #openttd @#/r/openttd
07:32-!-nekomaster [] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
08:01-!-FLHerne [] has joined #openttd
08:01-!-FLHerne is "Francis Herne" on #openttd
08:39-!-nekomaster [] has joined #openttd
08:39-!-nekomaster is "purple" on #openttd
08:42-!-chomwitt is "chomwitt" on #debian #debian-games
08:42-!-chomwitt [] has joined #openttd
08:52-!-sim-al2 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:04-!-Wolf01 [] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.]
09:09-!-welshdragon [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:12-!-Wolf01 [] has joined #openttd
09:12-!-Wolf01 is "Wolf01" on #openttd
09:15-!-cosmobird [~cosmobird@] has joined #openttd
09:15-!-cosmobird is "realname" on #communitydata #hot #josm #OpenRailwayMap #openttd #openttdcoop #osm #open-maps-more-than-maps
09:31-!-Biolunar [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
09:32-!-Wormnest [] has joined #openttd
09:32-!-Wormnest is "Wormnest" on #openttd
10:07-!-keoz [~keikoz@2a01:e35:2fd5:51e0:1037:e61d:fbf:2ba8] has joined #openttd
10:07-!-keoz is "Grmph" on #openttd
10:12-!-nekomaster [] has left #openttd []
10:34-!-Guest1267 is now known as berndj
10:45-!-smoke_fumus [~smoke_fum@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:55-!-TrueBrain [] has joined #openttd
10:55-!-TrueBrain is "Patric Stout" on #openttd #opendune
10:55-!-TrueBrain-Bot [] has joined #openttd
10:55-!-TrueBrain-Bot is "Patric Stout" on #opendune #openttd
10:59-!-Sova [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
11:15-!-Gja [] has joined #openttd
11:15-!-Gja is "Martin" on #bcache #openttd
11:34-!-Arveen [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:41-!-kiwitree [] has joined #openttd
11:41-!-kiwitree is "kiwitree" on #openttd
11:46-!-Progman [] has joined #openttd
11:46-!-Progman is "Peter Henschel" on #openttdcoop #openttd
11:55-!-Snail [] has joined #openttd
11:55-!-Snail is "Jacopo Coletto" on #openttd
12:05-!-keoz [~keikoz@2a01:e35:2fd5:51e0:1037:e61d:fbf:2ba8] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.7]
12:40-!-sla_ro|master [] has joined #openttd
12:40-!-sla_ro|master is "slamaster" on @#sla #openttd #love
12:49-!-gelignite [] has joined #openttd
12:49-!-gelignite is "gelignite" on #openttd #openttdcoop.devzone
12:59-!-glx [] has joined #openttd
12:59-!-mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ
12:59-!-glx is "Loïc GUILLOUX" on +#openttd
13:00-!-Hiddenfunstuff [] has joined #openttd
13:00-!-Hiddenfunstuff is "Geth" on #openttd #/r/openttd #openttdcoop
13:02-!-FLHerne [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:27-!-HerzogDeXtEr [] has joined #openttd
13:27-!-HerzogDeXtEr is "purple" on #openttd
13:46-!-kiwitree [] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
14:16-!-frosch123 [] has joined #openttd
14:16-!-frosch123 is "frosch" on #openttdcoop.devzone #openttd
14:19-!-Alberth [] has left #openttd []
14:24-!-Arveen [] has joined #openttd
14:24-!-Arveen is "realname" on #openttd #openttdcoop
14:24-!-andythenorth [] has joined #openttd
14:24-!-andythenorth is "andythenorth" on #openttd
14:56-!-cosmobird [~cosmobird@] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
15:05-!-Stimrol [] has joined #openttd
15:05-!-Stimrol is "Stimrol" on #openttd
15:09-!-Arveen2 [] has joined #openttd
15:09-!-Arveen2 is "realname" on #openttdcoop #openttd
15:13-!-Arveen [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:21-!-Cubey [] has joined #openttd
15:21-!-Cubey is "Jaybar" on #/r/openttd #openttd #openttdcoop
15:41-!-DDR [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:42-!-Hiddenfunstuff [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:01-!-sim-al2 [] has joined #openttd
16:01-!-sim-al2 is "sim-al2" on #openttd @#/r/openttd
16:36-!-sim-al2 is now known as Guest1295
16:36-!-sim-al2 [] has joined #openttd
16:36-!-sim-al2 is "sim-al2" on #openttd @#/r/openttd
16:42-!-Guest1295 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:49-!-Defaultti [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:08-!-DDR [] has joined #openttd
17:08-!-DDR is "David" on #openttd
17:08-!-Snail [] has quit [Quit: Snail]
17:19-!-nekomaster [] has joined #openttd
17:19-!-nekomaster is "purple" on #openttd
17:20<nekomaster>So I have my Canada heightmap done, sorta
17:20<nekomaster>but its at 8192x8192 resolution
17:20<nekomaster>and while at that resolution I have nice shore lines, if I downsize it I loose the shore lines and end up with two tile high cliff's
17:23-!-frosch123 [] has quit [Quit: be yourself, except: if you have the opportunity to be a unicorn, then be a unicorn]
17:23<Cubey>You mean if you pick 4096x4096 in game, or if you downscale it in GIMP or whatever?
17:23<Cubey>Or both?
17:24<nekomaster>Yeah, is there some way to downsize in GIMP or some other program and keep the shore lines. I can give you examples of what I mean
17:24<Cubey>I mean, if you think about a heightmap as a 3D surface
17:24<Cubey>Then it makes sense that your coasts become steeper when you shrink the image
17:25<nekomaster>yeah but at 8K I have long coasts which I dont really want either, but at 4K the shores become too steep with no step
17:25<Cubey>Like let's say your map has x, y, and z dimensions, where the brightness of the pixel denotes the z value
17:25<nekomaster>though I could always just turn down the brightness I would like a bit of a shoreline
17:25<Cubey>If you shrink the x and y coordinates by 50%, you also have to shrink the z by 50%
17:26<Cubey>When you generate a game from a heightmap, you have to pick the maximum map height...the default is 16 I think? I'm not sure
17:26<nekomaster>I believe the default is 16
17:26<Cubey>Have you experimented with smoothing the image? For example applying a gaussian blur to the whole thing
17:27<Cubey>If you have weird artifacts on the coasts that you don't like
17:27-!-FLHerne [] has joined #openttd
17:27-!-FLHerne is "Francis Herne" on #openttd
17:27<nekomaster>No, but I was using Lanzcos resizing in irfan view
17:28<Cubey>Lanczos might induce ringing artifacts
17:29<Cubey>Sharper filters like lanczos are best for upscaling, because they make a less blurry image
17:29<Cubey>But for downscaling that isn't necessarily the case
17:30<Cubey>When you are upscaling, you wish you had more detail in the image than you actually do, so you use a filter that makes more complex decisions to trick the viewer's eye into thinking the upscaled image is still sharp
17:30<Cubey>When you are downscaling you have more detail than you need, and you need to throw away some
17:30<Cubey>But also heightmaps are different from images and they also get mangled by OpenTTD, because it can only depict one type of slope
17:30<nekomaster>btw I can give you a dropbox link to show the map I have, maybe someone with better skills then I do can figure out how to keep some of hte shore line
17:31<Cubey>Ok let's take a look at this
17:31<nekomaster>Though if its not possible, then I'll just have the map at 1 tile above sea level
17:33<Cubey>What do you mean by "long" coasts?
17:33<nekomaster>Oh and another problem I've had while trying to resize, is that some rivers end up closing up
17:33<Cubey>Yeah, you are probably going to have to manually clean those up
17:33<Cubey>Because of that slope problem I'm talking about
17:34<nekomaster>I wonder if its even worth the trouble to make a shoreline
17:35<Cubey>Hey this looks pretty good
17:36<nekomaster>I tried to add most of the major lakes and rivers and put some in area's where water is sparse
17:36<nekomaster>to keep things interesting
17:37<Cubey>The west coast is really messy (because the heightmap is so noisy around there with all the mountains), so some smoothing might help that
17:37<Cubey>And I think you can fix the coastal flats being one step too high by playing with the levels tool or curves tool a little more
17:38<nekomaster>thing is I already set the levels, the brightness goes up by 5 steps from 0 for each tile
17:38<Cubey>Smoothing and leveling will probably close off some of the rivers, but you can prevent that to some extent by making a layer on top of the image of just the water
17:38<Cubey>And leaving the water alone
17:38<nekomaster>Oh yeah, I totally forgot about htat
17:38<nekomaster>just use the color select tool before I smooth out things and then fill the selection with black for the water
17:39<Cubey>Like once you have the water the way you want it, select all the solid black pixels and paste them into a new layer that you don't change anymore
17:39<Cubey>Yeah exactly
17:39<nekomaster>that way it'll keep all of the water ways open
17:39<Cubey>But some of them may still get closed off when the game generates the map, because of the slopes
17:39<Cubey>So you will still have to check it and manually dig them out in the scenario editor
17:39<nekomaster>Thing is though theres so many water ways
17:40<Cubey>Surprisingly they all seem to be OK as it is right now, so keeping the water layer static might just work
17:40<Cubey>I can even see little islands in like the hudson river and st lawrence river that are properly surrounded by water
17:41<nekomaster>yeah, I'm not too too worried about loosing tiny islands
17:42<Cubey>I'm just saying that islands would be a place you'd expect to see the waterways closing up when the map generates
17:42<Cubey>Because the transition from sea-level to ground level might be too steep for the openttd grid
17:42<Cubey>But that seems not to be the case here, so that's a good sign
17:44-!-Stimrol [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:44-!-Snail [] has joined #openttd
17:44-!-Snail is "Jacopo Coletto" on #openttd
17:45-!-Snail [] has quit []
17:45-!-Snail is "Jacopo Coletto" on #openttd
17:45-!-Snail [] has joined #openttd
17:46-!-andythenorth [] has left #openttd []
17:46<nekomaster>if anything though, I wonder what people prefer, having a bit of a shore line/beach, or just having the lowest ground across the map at 1 tile above the sea
17:47<Cubey>The random map generator and most scenarios I've seen tend to have like, coastal plains at height level 1
17:48<nekomaster>maybe I should do that to make things simpler for people
17:48<nekomaster>I did say before I wanted this to be fun, not super realistic
17:48<Cubey>I finally got GIMP open and I can see what you mean about the color steps
17:48<Cubey>Like the darkest shade is 5 steps darker than the second darkest
17:49<Cubey>It looks like you only have about 13 or 14 shades in use
17:49<Cubey>So you should generate the map with max height 14 I guess. Or maybe someone knows if that is zero indexed or whatever
17:49<ugu>what projection is that?
17:50<nekomaster>its been stretched
17:50-!-sla_ro|master [] has quit []
17:51<Cubey>Smoothing will just blend all these distinct shades together, so maybe that will make things worse... I'm gonna mess around with it and see
17:51<nekomaster>also I would like to make an even smaller version at 2048x2048 while keeping the water ways
17:52<nekomaster>I'd like to make two scenarios, one at 2048x2048 for most peole, and at 4092x4092 for the crazy people that want to try and make a realistic railroad
17:52<Cubey>Putting the waterways in a separate layer will probably help with that
17:57<Cubey>Wait on a closer look I just realized you specifically defined two brightness layers between the plains and the water
17:57<Cubey>Like your 8192x8192 image has coasts two or three pixels wide around the entire landmass
17:58<nekomaster>thats what I was talking about but I might scrap that idea
17:58<Cubey>I thought it was like a mystery why that was happening
17:58<nekomaster>For example, I believe each level is 50 meters
17:59<nekomaster>and Toronto, Ontario, is only 76 meters above sea level
17:59<Cubey>Most of the densely populated places on Earth would be at lvl1 in openttd maps
18:00<nekomaster>so it probably would be best if I scrapped the beach/shoreline idea then
18:00<nekomaster>its only really useful when trying to recreate maps from games that have that kind of thing
18:03<Cubey>Well I guess it's a creative choice that's up to you
18:03<Cubey>I was just misunderstanding before, I thought you didn't want it and were looking for a way to get rid of it
18:03<nekomaster>Well I might prefer to go down the route of "its my mod for my own thing"
18:03<nekomaster>but I also want to share it with people
18:03<nekomaster>and I want people to have fun with it
18:04<nekomaster>also having a two step/level coast everywhere might make bridges more expensive when crossing rivers
18:04<Cubey>I did try putting the water in a separate layer, downscaling, and then smoothing the land layer
18:04-!-Progman [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:04<Cubey>And it came out OK, not too many problems with waterways closing up
18:05<Cubey>A lot of your rivers will still have 2 and 3 high banks because they are cutting through higher ground
18:05<Cubey>I think that's totally Ok though. A lot of rivers in north america do have very high and steep banks!
18:07<nekomaster>perhaps you could send me what you got, perhaps through a forum PM if you dont have dropbox or one drive
18:07<nekomaster>or too lazy to put it up somewhere else
18:08-!-HerzogDeXtEr [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:14-!-Netsplit <-> quits: bwn, Cybertinus, SpComb, Sheogorath, @planetmaker, czaks, Keridos, Prof_Frink, Cubey, @DorpsGek, (+105 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them)
18:15-!-Sacro [] has joined #openttd
18:15-!-Netsplit over, joins: funnel, LongyanG, FLHerne, Eddi|zuHause, glx, Cubey, DDR, sim-al2, Arveen2, gelignite (+103 more)
18:15-!-Sacro is "Ben Woodward" on #tycoon #openttd #simsig
18:15-!-funnel is "funnel" on #mci #flect #acal #antlr @#cursive @#exvm
18:15-!-LongyanG is "long yang" on #gcc #debian-it #powerdns #linux-rt #debian-ubuntu #qemu #openjdk #debian-java #ooni #tor-bots #qtile #kvm #fish #debian-reproducible #C #lowRISC #python #ext4 #debian-kde #debian-gnome #sepia #debian-gnupg #linux #php
18:16<nekomaster>Ungh, what is with these netsplits
18:16-!-FLHerne [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:17-!-berndj [] has joined #openttd
18:17-!-berndj is "Bernd Jendrissek" on #tor #osm-za #oftc #openttd #osm #gcc #openttdcoop #geda
18:17-!-tycoondemon2 [] has joined #openttd
18:17-!-tycoondemon2 is "..." on #openttdcoop.stable #openttdcoop #openttd
18:18-!-orudge` [] has joined #openttd
18:18-!-orudge` is "Owen Rudge" on #thesinner #openttdcoop.devzone #bukkit #jontylog #tycoonexiles #z.aud #locomotion #transportempire #openttdcoop #openttd #tycoon
18:18-!-tycoondemon [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
18:18-!-TrueBrain [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:18-!-orudge [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:18-!-TrueBrain [] has joined #openttd
18:18-!-TrueBrain is "Patric Stout" on #openttd #opendune
18:19-!-berndj is now known as Guest1334
18:20<nekomaster>one thing that sucks is that Montreal doesnt get enough space to have Mount Royal
18:33-!-gelignite [] has quit [Quit:]
18:49-!-Wormnest [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
18:51-!-supermop_ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:56-!-nekomaster [] has left #openttd []
19:19-!-Biolunar [] has joined #openttd
19:19-!-Biolunar is "Biolunar" on #openttd #suckless
19:34-!-Snail [] has quit [Quit: Snail]
19:38-!-Wolf01 [] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.]
19:38-!-Supercheese [] has joined #openttd
19:38-!-Supercheese is "Supercheese" on #openttd #openttdcoop.devzone
19:43-!-ricus [] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.7]
20:17-!-Biolunar [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:34-!-Gja [] has quit [Quit: Going offline, see ya! (]
20:43-!-Snail [] has joined #openttd
20:43-!-Snail is "Jacopo Coletto" on #openttd
20:43-!-HerzogDeXtEr [] has joined #openttd
20:43-!-HerzogDeXtEr is "purple" on #openttd
21:18-!-chomwitt [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:39-!-Lejving [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:59-!-Guest1334 is now known as berndj
22:00-!-berndj is now known as Guest1358
22:06-!-glx [] has quit [Quit: Bye]
22:10-!-Guest1358 is now known as berndj
22:38-!-Alkel_U3 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:58-!-cosmobird [~cosmobird@] has joined #openttd
22:58-!-cosmobird is "realname" on #open-maps-more-than-maps #osm #openttdcoop #openttd #OpenRailwayMap #josm #hot #communitydata
22:59-!-cosmobird [~cosmobird@] has quit []
22:59-!-cosmobird [~cosmobird@] has joined #openttd
22:59-!-cosmobird is "realname" on #open-maps-more-than-maps #osm #openttdcoop #openttd #OpenRailwayMap #josm #hot #communitydata
23:42-!-CompuDesktop [~Compu@] has joined #openttd
23:42-!-CompuDesktop is "Compu" on #/r/openttd #openttdcoop #openttdcoop.stable #openttd #help
23:43-!-Compu [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:45-!-CompuDesktop [~Compu@] has quit []
23:45-!-CompuDesktop [~Compu@] has joined #openttd
23:45-!-CompuDesktop is "Compu" on #/r/openttd #openttdcoop #openttdcoop.stable #openttd #help
23:46-!-CompuDesktop is now known as Compu
23:46-!-Compu [~Compu@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:46-!-Compu [] has joined #openttd
23:46-!-Compu is "Compu" on #/r/openttd #openttdcoop #openttdcoop.stable #openttd #help
---Logclosed Fri Apr 28 00:00:27 2017