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#openttd IRC Logs for 2017-05-17

---Logopened Wed May 17 00:00:54 2017
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04:27<Alkel_U3>@logs
04:27<@DorpsGek>Alkel_U3: https://webster.openttdcoop.org/index.php?channel=openttd
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04:36<Wolf01>o/
04:44<Alkel_U3>o/
04:45<crem>\o
04:46<Alkel_U3>question - is it possible to code dual-gauge track so I can have a shared track for narrow-gauge and standard one? I want this because of reasons (Iron Horse actually).
04:47<Alkel_U3>I couldn't find whether I asked already :-)
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04:50<Wolf01>I think it is possible, look at the compatible railtypes section
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05:23<Alkel_U3>so, one railtype would have multiple labels?
05:26<Alkel_U3>the 'compatible railtypes' affects rolling stock of this particular railtype, it doesn't say what other types can run on it
05:27<Wolf01>Then is the powered railtypes, or both
05:28<Alkel_U3>that's also 'Provide a list of rail types that trains of this type are powered on.'
05:30<Wolf01>Then you should make a XYZ railtype and change both RAIL and NG to have power on XYZ
05:32<Alkel_U3>oh, right, I took RAIL for something untouchable but it probably is overridable...
05:33<Wolf01>I always find this way not intuitive, it should be the current railtype to define what it can run on it, not the others
05:35<Wolf01>But I think it was made this way to not lookup continuously the tile railtype from a vehicle
05:35<__ln___>https://i.imgur.com/jaU0iTI.jpg
05:36<Wolf01>:D
05:37<Alkel_U3>I'd like to see them encrypt punch cards :-)
05:37<Arveen>aes256 encryption sure is fast on that box
05:38<Alkel_U3>well, thanks for adwice Wolf01, I hope I'll actually amount to make use of it
05:40<Wolf01>Luckily on NRT is easier as there isn't the "compatible" stuff
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06:43<EnraBahn>hi all.. just wondering if there is a 32bpp build available since i can't seem to find it on the site
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06:44<Wolf01>You need to download a 32bpp baseset from the content download within the game
06:47<EnraBahn>ahh, the turorial i found must be a bit outdated then lol
06:48<EnraBahn>thanks for that Wolf01
06:54<FLHerne>Are there any such basesets yet that aren't zBase?
06:55<@planetmaker>there's only zBase as a complete 32bpp baseset
06:55<@planetmaker>iirc. Unless something changed
06:56<Wolf01>There's aBase (derived from zBase) and the one from V, which might take some time to be finished
06:56<@peter1138>heh yeah, all builds for years are 32bpp :p
06:56<@planetmaker>Alkel_U3, one railtype can only have one label. but it can have compatible railtypes. thus you could make one which is compatible to two others
06:58<Wolf01>planetmaker, I think there's a bit of confusion, we should make a drawing XD
06:58<@planetmaker>:)
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07:12<Alkel_U3>planetmaker: yes, but if I understand the issue correctly I can't just make DUAL and declare "RAIL vehicle type can use this", only that DUAL vehicle can go on RAIL track. So if there isn't a way of altering/overriding RAIL (and possibly ELRL) I'd have to make a new arbitrary regular railtype in place of RAIL and have the trainset use that railtype as default. Right?
07:15<Alkel_U3>or just that all RAIL vehicles would become DUAL vehicles. DUAL vehicles can also go on RAIL and NRGL can also go on DUAL.
07:16<Alkel_U3>tl;dr: is it possible to bend the default railtype to allow the compatibility?
07:19<@planetmaker>Alkel_U3, yes, you can change the meaning of RAIL. And you can define a tracktype which is compatible with RAIL, so that RAIL vehicles can drive on it, too (e.g. like RAIL vehicles can use ELRL by default)
07:19<@planetmaker>it should suffice to define for an arbitrary type to be compatible with RAIL so that RAIL vehicles can drive on it
07:21<Wolf01>You have to make the vehicles as DUAL and RAIL.powered -> DUAL, NG.powered -> DUAL as far as I remember
07:22<@planetmaker>so yes... you probably want to modify RAIL with the property compatible_railtype_list and add your DUAL to that
07:22<@planetmaker>and define a new NRGL which is also compatible with DUAL
07:22<Alkel_U3>ok, thanks for clarifying
07:22<@planetmaker>then any vehicle powered for RAIL *or* NRGL can drive on DUAL
07:23<Alkel_U3>yeah, that's the way I hoped would be possible :-)
07:23<@planetmaker>(you might additionally need to define them also in the powered_railtype_list property
07:24<@planetmaker>there is another way: define all your own track labels. And make use of the alternative_railtype_list; add RAIL to the railtype which shall replace RAIL.
07:25<@planetmaker>then it works in an environment where RAIL is not available - or re-defined by some other NewGRF to something else
07:25<@planetmaker>but that seems to be thought around too many corners :)
07:30<Alkel_U3>I think I'll stick with just bending the defaults :-)
07:46<@planetmaker>good choice, I think
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10:02<Wolf01>o/
10:02<@Alberth>hi hi
10:02<supermop>yo
10:03<Wolf01>supermop, I agree with your post about unspooled, but it would be really cool to have some road connections between cities pre-generated too
10:03<Wolf01>I should look into that
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10:19<supermop>Wolf01: i think a GS that builds some would be nice
10:19<supermop>or let cities build more types of roads
10:20<supermop>obviously, like i real life, a trucking company will be more profitable when the state builds nice roads it can use
10:27<Wolf01>A gamescript which runs on map generation
10:35<supermop>if a freight company build's it's own roads, they usually are dirt or gravel, or some other lower speed type
10:36<supermop>that may not be fun for those players who like to play the role of a public transit company shaping an urban area
10:36<@Alberth>they favour safe driving of their employees :)
10:38<Wolf01>I think a gamescript or such, configurable to [try to connect major cities|try to connect all cities|try to connect cities and industries] could be a good approach
10:39<Wolf01>Maybe with NRT support too
10:39<Wolf01>IIRC there was something already on some gamescript tutorial
10:42<FLHerne>There's an AI that tries to do it in-game
10:42<FLHerne>But it's too slow
10:42<FLHerne>WMDoT, IIRC
10:54<@Alberth>CityConnector may also work, it seems https://wiki.openttd.org/Comparison_of_AIs#Other_AIs
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11:07<@Alberth>o/
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11:10<andythenorth>hi
11:10<andythenorth>bye
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11:11<LordAro>short visist
11:11<LordAro>visit*
11:34<quiznilo>since when was ottd 1.7 released?
11:34<quiznilo>hell, I didn't even notice 1.6 was in my package system and installed
11:35<@Alberth>it's old anyway :p
11:35<Alkel_U3>since 1st april as tradition dictates
11:35<quiznilo>perhaps I'm getting my versions mixed up
11:36<Alkel_U3>what system / repo are you using?
11:38<quiznilo>gentoo portage, but I was doing out of band downloading from the repo
11:38<quiznilo>compiling
11:39<@Alberth>as long as you don't install in system-space, it should be alright
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11:53<supermop>Wolf01: i don''t think it should build fast highways at game start though
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12:25<supermop>maybe dirt trails to small villages
12:39<supermop>planetmaker: is there any apetite, if i output my trolleybi sprites with 1st CC cabs and no trolleypoles, use those in ogfx+?
12:39<supermop>to use?
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12:46<supermop>i don't know if i really want a separate, non-trolleybi truck set as weel, seeing as the intent was to match the stats and function of ogfx+ RVs
12:46<supermop>and the truck cabs/bus bodies are still same as ogfx
12:47<supermop>just the truck bodies are a bit more 'improved', and 2cc is added
12:55<quiznilo>don't have to open no browser to get train radio scanner now: mplayer -cache 256 http://relay.broadcastify.com/569957272.mp3
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14:04<frosch123>how many stations does isr have?
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14:06<LordAro>Bhootrk_: you need a better internet connection
14:06<andythenorth>o/
14:06<frosch123>andythenorth: how many station does isr have? :)
14:06<andythenorth>‘lots’
14:07<andythenorth>want me to count?
14:07<frosch123>more than 200?
14:07<andythenorth>tiles?
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14:08<frosch123>things to select from the build menu
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14:09<andythenorth>I count about 168 buildable things
14:09<andythenorth>approx
14:10<andythenorth>it’s quite hard in my station gui as I have 2x zoom, and it’s hard to use :D
14:10<frosch123>some unknown (to me) guy submitted a patch to increase the limit of stations per newgrf from 255 to 65535
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14:10<andythenorth>that’s….useful?
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14:11<andythenorth>probably useful for AIs
14:11<frosch123>@ban Bhootrk_
14:11<andythenorth>I think the game doesn’t need any more patches :)
14:11<frosch123>@mode +b Bhootrk_
14:11<andythenorth>it’s done
14:11-!-mode/#openttd [+b Bhootrk_!*@*] by DorpsGek
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14:12<andythenorth>is it a good patch?
14:13<frosch123>it bumps the grf version to 9
14:13<frosch123>i would rather modify grf version 8 retroactively
14:14<andythenorth>seems like it’s worthy-but-useless
14:14<andythenorth>how many station tiles does Michael need?
14:14<andythenorth>maybe he has a case for it
14:14<frosch123>and modify some related things in a similar way
14:14<andythenorth>are there 65536 name strings?
14:15<frosch123>only the recently added 8k
14:16<frosch123>but i guess 8k is also enough for the gui :p
14:17<FLHerne>frosch123: Dutch Stations Addition is another one with an insane number of buildable types
14:18<FLHerne>(counts)
14:20<FLHerne>frosch123: Dutch Stations Addition has 248 buildable types
14:20<frosch123>ok, so people really reach the 256 limit
14:20<frosch123>thanks :)
14:21<frosch123>i wanted to know whether it's one of the "i can easily make a savegame with 5k trains" guys
14:21<FLHerne>Well...I've hit 5000 RVs before
14:21<andythenorth>they shouldn’t be making so many station tiles :P
14:21<andythenorth>but nobody put andythenorth in charge
14:22<FLHerne>andythenorth: It has, like, ten different kinds of lineside cabinet ;-)
14:22<andythenorth>right
14:22<FLHerne>All of which are about six pixels of tiny box
14:22<andythenorth>but the realism
14:22<frosch123>andythenorth: you only have not reached that amount with cargos/industries, because you remove them at about the same speed as you add them
14:23<andythenorth>it’s important to cull the weakest
14:31<@Alberth>think of all the evolutionary buildings you could have throughout the ages! :p
14:37<supermop>i honestly could see myself doing that
14:49<andythenorth>is FIRS done yet?
14:49*andythenorth keeps finding new bugs :P
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14:50<@Alberth>I agree with andy, it's simple to throw everything at one big heap and dump the selection problem onto the user, as author of set however, it's very nice if you save that work for your users
14:50<@Alberth>bugs in new stuff, or also in old? :)
14:50<andythenorth>newly found old bugs
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14:50<andythenorth>or genuine refactoring needed
14:50<andythenorth>also…station names need work
14:50<andythenorth>http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/LATEST/docs/html/code_reference.html#industries
14:51<andythenorth>(sort by ‘station name’)
14:51<andythenorth>ideally there would be more variety, or all unique
14:51*andythenorth is out of ideas right now
14:51<andythenorth>mines particularly could use more
14:52<FLHerne>andythenorth: I tend to rename them to "North Shaft" or so
14:52<FLHerne>Er, coal
14:53<@Alberth>I mostly disable station names, so I don't see them at all :p
14:54<andythenorth>ha
14:54<@Alberth>but I'd remove the bad ones, and leave it at that
14:54<FLHerne>Of course, in multiplayer it's just <Foo> Coal Mine #n :P
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14:54<andythenorth>it’s tempting to remove them all and use the industry name :P
14:54<andythenorth>but that might be in the same direction as making all cargo units 'tonnes'
14:54<@Alberth>hmm, I'd think the ones with the industry names are bad :p
14:55<andythenorth>logical, but less interesting
14:55<@Alberth>as well as "power plant", but ymmv
14:55<andythenorth>it appeals to me to use quirky UK-specific things
14:56<andythenorth>just to test the will of translators :)
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14:57<@Alberth>UK-specific things add flavor, imho
15:00*andythenorth googles
15:02<@Alberth>google is not a UK company :p
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15:04<andythenorth>they have a UK campus :P
15:04<andythenorth>I saw it today
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15:45<@Alberth>:)
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22:23<supermop_home>hmm when the town starts to put sidewalks on your dirt road, it's probably time to upgrade
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---Logclosed Thu May 18 00:00:55 2017