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#openttd IRC Logs for 2017-06-02

---Logopened Fri Jun 02 00:00:16 2017
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06:33<Wolf01>o/
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08:42<andythenorth>o/
08:44<Wolf01>o/
08:46<crem>\o
08:51-!-nekomaster [~Matthew@104-247-234-139.cpe.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd
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08:51<nekomaster>Hmm
08:51<nekomaster>So for some reason my Narrow Gauge reefer cars default to goods, which means that 15 Crates of Goods turns into 8 Tons of Food
08:52<nekomaster>How do I force a freight wagon to be fitted for a certain cargo by default?
08:52<nekomaster>in NML
08:56<andythenorth>default_cargo_type
08:56<andythenorth>property
08:56<nekomaster>thats actually a thing?
08:56<andythenorth>set it to the label you want
08:56<nekomaster>ahh
08:56<andythenorth>it’s at hing
08:56<andythenorth>thing *
08:57<nekomaster>I can just plop that in to the ITEM code like "default_cargo_type BOOM"?
08:57<nekomaster>no other switches or anything?
08:58<nekomaster>Syntaxt Error :(
08:58<nekomaster>it doesnt like FOOD
08:58<nekomaster>oops, probably forgot the ;
08:58<nekomaster>Ok its not working, I did it wrong
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09:04<andythenorth>is FOOD in your cargo table?
09:05<nekomaster>yes
09:05<andythenorth>default_cargo_type: PASS;
09:05<andythenorth>or so
09:05<andythenorth>in the property {} block
09:05<nekomaster>oh, I didn't know it needed the semi-colon
09:05<nekomaster>:
09:06<nekomaster>there, that worked
09:06<nekomaster>thanks for that
09:06<nekomaster>now i have to go through my cars
09:06<nekomaster><_<
09:08<nekomaster>How do I make my wagons carry the same number of units, rather then having a situation where a car can hold 30 Crates of Goods but 15 tons of Food
09:08<nekomaster>I want it the NARS 2.51 way where it can be 30 crates of goods and 30 tons of food
09:10<andythenorth>switches to handle capacity
09:10<andythenorth>Iron Horse does it
09:10<andythenorth>I think
09:10<nekomaster>I looked thorugh iron horse
09:10<nekomaster>I couldn't figure anything out in the py code
09:12<andythenorth>can’t remember how IH does it for goods
09:12<andythenorth>it handles mail something like https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pjqby5fvc
09:12<andythenorth>maybe using the switch causes goods to be treated like other cargos
09:12<nekomaster>hm
09:13<nekomaster>is it possible to specify specific cargo_types?
09:13<nekomaster>like FOOD, GOOD, or MAIL?
09:13<nekomaster>or BOOM
09:13<nekomaster>:P
09:14<andythenorth>it is yes
09:14*andythenorth afk for a bit though
09:14<nekomaster>ok
09:48<Deactivated>guys should I go for a TL3 with double-Lev4 instead of just a single Lev4 engine?
09:48<Deactivated>need dat acceleration...
09:53<Deactivated>whatever will just downgrade all my trains to like Lev3 x4
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11:30<nekomaster>Btw, I hope I haven't upset anyone or any mods/admins with my NARS ADD-ON SET 2CC edition
11:30<nekomaster>considering now i'm using stuff fromt he US and Can Sets
11:30<nekomaster>But I did ask for permissions
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11:42<Deactivated>I have no idea what I'm doing lol, just going to random servers and dominating them
11:42<nekomaster>lol
11:42<nekomaster>it would be nice if I could have more feed back on my NARS ADD-ON SET 2cc
11:44<Deactivated>k when I wake up tmrw I may take a look at it
11:44<Deactivated>rn it's 2345
11:44<nekomaster>I'm working on north american narrow gauge stuff right now
11:44<nekomaster>I have one more steam engine to add and a handful of diesels
11:45<Deactivated>k hf I guess?
11:45<nekomaster>i guess
11:45<nekomaster>it'll all be in the next release
11:46<Deactivated>alright
11:46<Deactivated>so when's it gonna happen? hyppe phaps?
11:47<nekomaster>who knows, I need to make sure each of these cars are positioned proeprly
11:47<nekomaster>I have serveral "early" cars to finish up and then its on to the last engines I have sprites for
11:47<Deactivated>true
11:47<nekomaster>might be in a day or two
11:47<nekomaster>depending on what happens today with life
11:48<Deactivated>well rn I have a trains extension set in mind, basically just add more trains to default set
11:48<nekomaster>yeah
11:48<nekomaster>where as the NARS ADD-ON is turning out to be more of a train set then just an add-on but I still have it piggy backing on nars 2.51 stuff
11:49<nekomaster>though the narrow guage stuff could be used without nars 2.5
11:49<nekomaster>just need Nutracks or some other track set that provides narrow gauge rails
11:49<nekomaster>seperate narrow gauge rails
11:50<Deactivated>I rarely play with those but now you convince me to xD
11:51<nekomaster>heres what I have for narrow gauge
11:51<nekomaster>https://www.dropbox.com/s/5zsjo7bibjqkzkq/derp.png?dl=0
11:51<Deactivated>derp.png...
11:51<nekomaster>yeah, i have a tendancy to use a quick and random name when im in a hurry
11:53<Deactivated>like Foo and Bar
11:53<nekomaster>Foobar
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11:57<@Alberth>as long as you don't use the same random name for different projects :)
11:57<nekomaster>What?
11:57<nekomaster>lol
11:58<nekomaster>DERP TRAINS
11:58<@Alberth>:D
11:58<@Alberth>transporting stuff 'n things
11:58<nekomaster>Also I'm using NARS ADD-ON SET 2CC to get experience and knowledge for what might be the largest single country set I've ver done
11:58<nekomaster>How about an all encompassing set that covers everything North American
11:58<nekomaster>OMEGA NARS
11:59<nekomaster>Theres also the chance I might do a Central American Rail Set or CENTARS
11:59<@Alberth>I prefer train sets that are designed for game play, not too much choice
11:59<nekomaster>well if you prefer that, then stick with regular nars :P
11:59<nekomaster>Omega nars is going to be for the die hard fans of North american rail roading and variety
12:00<nekomaster>Plus maybe by then I'll figure out a way to have livery refits or randomised liveries
12:00<@Alberth>try beating xussr :)
12:00<nekomaster>I dunno
12:00<nekomaster>Heres what i have for the nars addon set 2cc
12:00<nekomaster>https://www.dropbox.com/s/p17zqjsof7a7xq9/~Nars%20Add-on%20Set%20-%20Data%20Sheet~.ods?dl=0
12:00<nekomaster>thankfully you should be able to view it in your browser through dropbox :)
12:01<nekomaster>I really do like working out of my dropbox folder on windows
12:01<nekomaster>which means even if my coputer dies or I get drunk and wipe my hard disks again like I did last year after 20 beers, i should be fine
12:01<nekomaster>unless I also delete my dropbox too :P
12:02<@Alberth>too bad it needs Google access
12:03<nekomaster>No, just a dropbox log in
12:03<@Alberth>I can't get in without enabling google access, I tried
12:03<nekomaster>wtf
12:04<@Alberth>you get a nice blank white screen
12:04<@Alberth>you have to enable google.com scripts
12:04<nekomaster>I tried it in a different browser and I just clicked on No thanks
12:04<@Alberth>but the list is too long for me :)
12:04<@Alberth>likely you don't block scripts by default
12:04<nekomaster>no
12:04<nekomaster>I have no need to
12:05<nekomaster>I rarely venture outside of the websites I frequent
12:05<@Alberth>I am just somewhat paranoid
12:05<nekomaster>and I have no quelms with any particular tech corperation
12:05<nekomaster>I'm not, i have nothing to hide
12:06<@Alberth>give me your bank-account :p
12:06<nekomaster>I have -6 dollars
12:06<nekomaster>:p
12:06<nekomaster>from bank fees
12:06<nekomaster>Also money rarely stays in my bank for long because I take it out to pay for the internet and my booze
12:07<@Alberth>really you do have things to hide, "I have nothing to hide" doesn't mean everybody should be able to access anything about you
12:08<nekomaster>what i mean by that is I have no reason to hide my internet activity aside from the usual personal things
12:08<nekomaster>living in Canada, it would be pointless to try and hide my activity anyways
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12:13<@Alberth>o/
12:13<nekomaster>hoi
12:13<nekomaster>thanks for helping me earlier andy
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12:16<andythenorth>np
12:17<nekomaster>Though I still need that code to deal with goods wagons halving their cargo when you refit them
12:21<nekomaster>also my cargo classes might not be set up properly to use the code you gave me earlier
12:21<andythenorth>:P
12:21<andythenorth>https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/VehicleRefitting
12:21<andythenorth>capacity and cargo refit is....complex
12:21<andythenorth>I’m wary of giving bad advice :)
12:21<nekomaster>Yeah
12:22<nekomaster>I just need some way to keep the capacity I set for a wagon universal across all cargos except on Mail wagons
12:22<andythenorth>that’s just a switch
12:22<andythenorth>I am trying to remember _why_ it works :P
12:22<andythenorth>but eh
12:23<nekomaster>right now because I'm using my narrow gauge flat cars for goods, they're defaulted for wood and carry 20 tons of wood
12:23<nekomaster>but now they carry 40 crates of goods
12:23<andythenorth>you can copy the Iron Horse switch, and just check the mail class, return mail capacity if mail, otherwise return the default value as the amount you want
12:23<nekomaster>seems like a lot for a small narrow gauge flat car
12:24<andythenorth>you’ll need to connect the capacity switch to the capacity callback in graphics {} block
12:24<andythenorth>and maybe also for purchase menu capacity
12:24<nekomaster>none of which I have any idea how to do
12:25<andythenorth>got the paste from earlier?
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12:26<nekomaster>yeah, but i have no idea how to impliment it
12:27<andythenorth>something like https://paste.openttdcoop.org/ptqwpdna7
12:27<andythenorth>change ‘box_car_antelope_gen_1_1_switch_cargo_capacity’ to suit your vehicle
12:27<andythenorth>set the values on line 3 and 4 to the capacities you want
12:27<nekomaster>in this case WAGON_NG_CARGO_FLAT_CAR
12:28<andythenorth>line 11 and 12 you need to add to the graphics {} block for the vehicle
12:28<nekomaster>yeah
12:28<nekomaster>whad do I change the swith name to then?
12:28<nekomaster>WAGON_NG_CARGO_FLAT_CAR_switch_cargo_capacity?
12:28<andythenorth>yes
12:28<nekomaster>ok
12:29<andythenorth>keep the case all the same though, neater
12:29<nekomaster>I know
12:29<nekomaster>well, I typically keep the name of the cars/vehicles in upper case to help me find that stuff
12:29<nekomaster>when lacking the ability to bold things, upper case letters is much more noticable to me
12:29<andythenorth>fair enough
12:30<nekomaster>thats tjust the way i code
12:33<nekomaster>Yay! my code exploded
12:34<nekomaster>nmlc ERROR: "src/Wagons/WAGON_NG_CARGO_FLAT_CAR.pnml", line 223: Unrecognized identifier 'WAGON_NG_CARGO_FLAT_CAR_switch_graphics' encountered
12:35<nekomaster>ok nice, so removing that one switch and the code works :)
12:35<nekomaster>My flat car can hold 20 crates of goods or 20 tons of wood
12:36<nekomaster>:)
12:38<nekomaster>damn, now I gotta go and punch that code in for everything
12:41<andythenorth>you need templating :P
12:41<andythenorth>well you probably don’t
12:41<andythenorth>but eh
12:41<nekomaster>Oh i have templating
12:41<nekomaster>or rather I just reused the same code
12:41<nekomaster>but its called now I need to add this to all of the stuff
12:42<nekomaster>I set up my code in a way that makes it easy to reuse for me
12:46<nekomaster>ALso, I love how the cargo table has BOOM for the Explosives cargo
12:46<nekomaster>50 tons of BOOM
12:46<nekomaster>Leave it to andy to find a way to make me chuckle :P
12:48<andythenorth>I think someone else suggested the label
12:48<nekomaster>really? I figured it being BOOM and used as explsives cargo in FIRS steeltown, I figured it was you
12:52<andythenorth>probably Wolf01
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12:59<nekomaster>btw, is that new paper mill you drew up and the peat farm/industry suppose to be part of a new econemy?
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12:59<@Alberth>2016-11-18 09:21:29 CET: andythenorth: explosives: “BOOM” or “BANG”?
13:00<nekomaster>Heh
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13:00<nekomaster>KBOM
13:00<nekomaster>XPLD
13:00<nekomaster>NUKE
13:00<andythenorth>NUKE is for the nuclear chain :P
13:00<nekomaster>DKNM
13:00<andythenorth>the paper mill and peatlands are in new Arctic Basic
13:01<nekomaster>Its time to kick ass and chew bubble gum, and i'm all outta bubble gum
13:01<andythenorth>http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/LATEST/docs/html/economies.html#arctic_basic
13:01<@Alberth>oh, right, figured the version number mess out?
13:01<andythenorth>nah
13:01<andythenorth>is one of the numbers a days count?
13:01<andythenorth>and it happens to be relatively close to the hg rev?
13:01<@Alberth>that would be possible
13:02<@Alberth>hmm, so I need to convince openttd to pick that particular version, I guess
13:03<andythenorth>not sure what applies that
13:04*andythenorth looking
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13:05<@Alberth>hmm, someone may have updated nml since dec 2016?
13:05<andythenorth>locally I can’t get these version numbers to appear
13:05<andythenorth>yes nml is updated :)
13:06<@Alberth>so it's likely in the devzone build
13:06<andythenorth>I wonder if bundles has scripts of its own, seems likely
13:06<andythenorth>it’s only the containing dir that has ‘wrong’ version
13:07<andythenorth>seems like days since year 2000
13:07<andythenorth>planetmaker ^ any recollection? o_O
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13:16<nekomaster>also, whats with the error with FIRS on older versions of OpenTTD?
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13:16<nekomaster>anything before 1.7
13:16<andythenorth>uses new newgrf stuff
13:16<nekomaster>ahh
13:16<nekomaster>why?
13:16<nekomaster>what did you need in 1.7 that isn't in the old versions?
13:16<nekomaster>what does that call back do?
13:16<andythenorth>more text strings
13:17<nekomaster>ahh
13:17<nekomaster>Hmm
13:17<nekomaster>I wonder if openttd will ever support more input and output cargos for industry
13:17<Eddi|zuHause>probably never
13:18<@Alberth>hmm, firs 1.4.4 :p
13:18*andythenorth really doesn’t want more input / output cargos :P
13:18<andythenorth>design would be harder
13:18<nekomaster>how about a 100 input cargos to make 1 ton of a single cargo :P
13:19<andythenorth>also Eddi|zuHause is here
13:19<andythenorth>which is good
13:19*andythenorth has questions
13:19<nekomaster>what questions?
13:21<Wolf01>I have answers, exactly one: 42
13:21<@Alberth>you didn't tie the "basic" economies to the actual climate :p
13:21<andythenorth>nope
13:21<andythenorth>seemed restrictive and confusing :)
13:22<@Alberth>playing arctic basic in the desert? yep :p
13:22<nekomaster>like what if I want to grow cassava and rubber in the Yukon?
13:22<@Alberth>but fair enough :)
13:22<nekomaster>and transport it with Russian Broad Gauge trains
13:22<nekomaster>With African town names on canada
13:22<Wolf01>Better than selling fridges to Eskimo
13:23<@Alberth>that might work better than you think :p
13:23<Wolf01>Or even ice creams
13:23<nekomaster>Um, some of them might actually need one if they live in a town
13:23<nekomaster>Fun fact, I once trudged through a blizzard with low visability just to buy two 4 liter tubs of chocolate ice cream :)
13:23<nekomaster>-23 and the snow hurt
13:26<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause: remember HEQS trams and the refittable lengths?
13:26<Eddi|zuHause>vaguely
13:27<nekomaster>hmm
13:27<andythenorth>were they a good idea? o_O
13:27<nekomaster>I still ike it
13:27<andythenorth>generally I don’t like hokey subtype refit stuff
13:28<andythenorth>but I want to add some Feldbahn to Road Hog
13:28<nekomaster>but it would be nice if you could just build custom trams like you can with trains
13:28<andythenorth>I wonder if they would need variable capacity
13:28<andythenorth>the Road Hog freight trams don’t
13:28<nekomaster>I like having the long trams for short lines where a trainw ould be over kill
13:29<nekomaster>Someone ought to code a way to attach your own trailers to road vehicles (but only ones that support it)
13:29<nekomaster>I imagine that in code you could either have something set up as a rigid or articulated vehicle, or allow it to be built as a seperate tractor/engine
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13:30<nekomaster>would probably also require some "max length" thingy in the code to limit the length of trams and trucks
13:33<@Alberth>they'd just become trains
13:33<nekomaster>well thats why you'd need the max length thing
13:33<nekomaster>unless someone codes something stupid
13:33<nekomaster>like allowing 100 trailer long road trains
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13:37<@Alberth>that will happen
13:39<nekomaster>so
13:40<nekomaster>I could make a super train that costs nothing :p
13:40<nekomaster>whats stopping me?
13:40<nekomaster>65536 km/h with 65536 HP and 1000 kg, and 1.00 TE
13:40<nekomaster>and holds 5000 of everything
13:40<nekomaster>:p
13:43<nekomaster>Hmm, would it be possible to incorperate a HEP system in code in a different way then nars 2.03?
13:43<nekomaster>like having a seperate value used for locomotives that have a seperate HEP generator
13:43<nekomaster>and will give you an error if you meeet or exceed the HEP limit on a locomotive
13:45<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: if you don't like the refit stuff, make them fixed 1 tile length with like engine+4 wagons (4+3+3+3+3)
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13:53<Wolf01>Quak
13:54<frosch123>miao
13:54<nekomaster>I made flat cars that can do 65535 km/h
13:54<nekomaster>with 64435 HP
13:54<nekomaster>and 517 kN TE
13:55<andythenorth>fixed 1 tile length has worked well for the freight trams
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14:20<frosch123>hmm, so f party will be crowded
14:21<nekomaster>So I built 5000 of my super powerful super fast flying wood boards
14:21<nekomaster>i can't click on any of them
14:21<Eddi|zuHause>there's an f party?
14:21<nekomaster>they zip around too fast XD
14:23<frosch123>Eddi|zuHause: last week they talked about running bets at the office about how many people would attend. this week they are booked out
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15:12<Eddi|zuHause>so, anybody got any ideas on the "how do i get win10 to boot" issue?
15:13<frosch123>why would you want to?
15:13<Eddi|zuHause>reasons...
15:13<Eddi|zuHause>winXP just doesn't cut it, and wine neither
15:13<frosch123>the last news was that xp is safer against wannacry compared to newer versions
15:14<Eddi|zuHause>it's only safer because it crashes harder :p
15:14<frosch123>apparently xp bluescreens before it can be infected
15:15<Eddi|zuHause>anyway, i installed win10 on the partition that xp was before, but grub won't boot it
15:15<Eddi|zuHause>and i have this other magic partition that win10 created on an area that it thought was unpartitioned
15:16<Eddi|zuHause>and i don't know where i should put that
15:18<Wolf01>To boot win10 from grub you must disable the fastboot first
15:19<Wolf01>Or edit the bootmanager from windows
15:20<Wolf01>Admin console: bcdedit /set {bootmgr} path \EFI\ubuntu\grubx64.efi
15:20<Wolf01>That's for ubuntu
15:22<Wolf01>Or just install win10 and use the ubuntu subsystem, so you don't have to tamper with bootmanagers :P
15:23<nekomaster>I do believe there are ways to install your own boot loarder if you need to
15:23<nekomaster>so you dont have to reinstall windows 10 or linux
15:23<Eddi|zuHause>Wolf01: i have never booted that windows, i can't change things from inside it
15:23<nekomaster>Could even just try installing puppy linux somewhere on a tiny partition
15:24<nekomaster>maybe use it for simple drive stuff
15:24<nekomaster>like gparted
15:28<Wolf01>nekomaster, you can install which bootloader you want, but you must tell windows where to find it
15:28<nekomaster>I know
15:28<nekomaster>thoug I know that grub boot loader can be used to boot windows
15:29<Wolf01>It can
15:29<nekomaster>so long as windows already has its stuff installed
15:29<Wolf01>But grub can't see the windows partition when hybernated
15:29<nekomaster>hmm
15:29<nekomaster>that sucks
15:30<Wolf01>Maybe it's even not fully installed, since Eddi never booted to it
15:30<Wolf01>As the install process just copies the files and then you must boot it to install
15:30<Eddi|zuHause>i suppose it didn't boot because the disk it thought would be the boot disk wasn't actually the boot disk
15:31<nekomaster>you mean like an active partition?
15:31<Eddi|zuHause>no, like different HDD
15:32<Wolf01>Do you have an EFI system partition in your partition table?
15:34<Wolf01>https://superuser.com/questions/1167484/what-if-i-switch-to-uefi-mode-after-install-windows-10-in-legacy-mode ha, nice to know this
15:37<Eddi|zuHause>you know what i hate in linux? every script starts with a giant GPL message, but not a single line about what the script is meant to do
15:39<+glx>hehe
15:39<andythenorth>hmm
15:39<andythenorth>cargo colours
15:39*andythenorth has to fix those
15:40<Eddi|zuHause>make a cargo graph, and apply the 4-color-theorem
15:40<andythenorth>:D
15:40<frosch123>cargo graphs are not planar
15:40<Eddi|zuHause>(note: it probably won't be planar :P)
15:40<andythenorth>I _think_ the usual expectation is that each cargo gets a unique colour in game
15:41<andythenorth>:P
15:41<andythenorth>when cargos are combined in different economies, this is harder :P
15:41<frosch123>start with the 16 step greyscale then
15:41<andythenorth>nicely played
15:41<Eddi|zuHause>pick a color for each chain, and different brightness for primary/secondary
15:43<andythenorth>maybe it could be determined by an algorithm :P
15:43<andythenorth>256 colours, 63 cargos
15:43<andythenorth>any colour that appears as a window background is eliminated
15:43<andythenorth>so maybe 250 colours?
15:44<frosch123>andythenorth: good point, start with the animated water colors
15:44<andythenorth>and they have to contrast, so perhaps space in 4s or so?
15:44<andythenorth>fire cycle?
15:44<andythenorth>:P
15:44<andythenorth>would work for me, palette animation is disabled in andythenorth-land
15:45<frosch123>well, the animation colors actually do not use any new shades compared to the non animated ones
15:48<nekomaster>SEIZURE GRAPHS
15:49<frosch123>if your kids are still young enough, you could let them color it :p
15:49<nekomaster>lol
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16:01<andythenorth>is bed
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16:30<Eddi|zuHause>man i don't understand grub2 at all :/
16:31<Eddi|zuHause>grub1 had like 3 commands you could remember
16:31<Eddi|zuHause>grub2 is just a giant wall of magic
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16:45<Eddi|zuHause>aw man... i managed to get grub to boot from the windows boot partition, but it just showed a blank screen :/
16:46<nekomaster>dam
16:46<nekomaster>well the nice thing is that I'm on windows 10 right now
16:46<Eddi|zuHause>also, turns out you can't "chainloader +1" anymore
16:46<Eddi|zuHause>you need to add "insmod chain" first
16:46<Eddi|zuHause>who thought that was a great idea?
16:46<Eddi|zuHause>grub2 needs a web browser and an online help :/
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19:06<Wolf01>'night
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---Logclosed Sat Jun 03 00:00:17 2017