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#openttd IRC Logs for 2017-07-03

---Logopened Mon Jul 03 00:00:32 2017
---Daychanged Mon Jul 03 2017
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04:50<Celestar>foo?
04:51<__ln__>a rare Celestar spotted
04:51<Celestar>:)
04:57<Celestar>how ya been?
04:58<__ln__>not much has changed
04:59<Celestar>is that good or bad? :)
05:08<@planetmaker>wooo
05:12<Celestar>wooooopm!
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05:51<Wolf01>o/
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08:47<UncleCJ>I just spent all saturday playing OpenTTD with a buddy - first multiplayer games for him. Desert scenario - time passed slowly and I over-invested so badly :-P
08:51<crem>OpenTTD is the second best game for the multiplayer! ( First one being Portal 2 ).
08:52<Wolf01>Wrong, the first is factorio
08:53<crem>Never played factorio multiplayer..
08:54<@peter1138>Portal 2 is kinda short.
08:56<Wolf01>Alkel_U3, do you have some time for that mp game?
09:40<Flygon>What's the third best?
09:40<Wolf01>Factorio again
09:40<Flygon>Drunk amateur 8 player Age of Empires II?
09:40<Flygon>Oh :V
09:41<Flygon>Seriously my best AoEII games are when everyone's completely wasted.
09:42<Wolf01>The only thing I did as completely wasted was to build a lego without instructions and just by looking at the box... And I did it :|
09:42<Flygon>I've never drunk.
09:42<Flygon>But everyone else sure was.
09:42<Wolf01>And that's the last time I got drunk
09:45<Celestar>fuck timezones
09:45<Wolf01>Oh, hello sir
09:45<Celestar>hi :)
09:46<Celestar>tzdata2006d: New data for Haiti, Sri Lanka, and Canada
09:46<Celestar>tzdata2012c: Haiti following US/Canada rules for 2012.
09:46<Celestar>tzdata2013b: Haiti uses US daylight-saving rules this year, and presumably future years.
09:46<Celestar>tzdata2016b: Haiti will not observe DST in 2016.
09:46<Celestar>tzdata2017b: Haiti resumed observance of DST in 2017.
09:46<Wolf01>Ha!
09:56<Alkel_U3>Wolf01: hi. I'm currently at a festival, away from computer. I'm going home this evening so maybe after 21 today or tommorow
09:56<Wolf01>Good
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11:43<@Alberth>o/
11:50<LordAro>/o
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12:43<Wolf01>o/
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13:19<UncleCJ>Wolf01: I suspect I will have to get Factorio... :-D
13:23<Wolf01>Everybody should
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13:33<Wolf01>Is it?
13:34<andythenorth>yup
13:34<andythenorth>still not sure about map colours
13:35<Wolf01>I'm still not sure about taking an IT security course
13:39<andythenorth>what’s it about?
13:39<Wolf01>Penetration testing
13:39<andythenorth>it’s a thing people do
13:41<Wolf01>Too bad it's really expensive
13:42<Wolf01>And I'm not sure about what piece of paper they will give me, maybe without some sort of degree in IT is useless
13:45<andythenorth>hmm
13:45*andythenorth porting FIRS docs to Bootstrap 3
13:51<andythenorth>sidebar navigation: on left or right? http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/releases/LATEST/docs/html/economies.html
13:54<andythenorth>maybe there’s a better way
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14:05<andythenorth>ach
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14:05<andythenorth>the FIRS makefile :)
14:05<andythenorth>needs work
14:10<@Alberth>make work :)
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14:11<andythenorth>the docs targets are still…weird :)
14:11<andythenorth>I tried to clean them up last week, but made a circular reference
14:11<andythenorth>also I need to teach docs about the .pt dependencies
14:11<andythenorth>but I don’t want it to build everything just because a docs file changed :P
14:12<@Alberth>.pt ?
14:13<andythenorth>page templates
14:13<andythenorth>it src/docs_templates, mostly
14:13<andythenorth>it / in /s
14:13<@Alberth>ah
14:14<@Alberth>you can't both have automagic building and not have automagic building :)
14:15<andythenorth>ideally ‘make docs’ would detect changed .pt files
14:15<andythenorth>but not trigger building the grf
14:15<andythenorth>I don’t think that’s possible
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14:24<andythenorth>quak
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14:25<frosch123>hoi
14:25<andythenorth>straw poll, how big is this svg in your browsers? http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/releases/LATEST/docs/html/temperate_basic.dot.svg
14:25<andythenorth>as % of viewport :P
14:25*andythenorth wonders about constraining it to 100% of viewport
14:26<frosch123>is that possible?
14:26<frosch123>anyway, it's wider than one screen
14:26<andythenorth>I can wrap it in html
14:26<frosch123>about 2500 pixels
14:26<frosch123>usually i scroll
14:26<andythenorth>how big is your screen? :D
14:27<frosch123>it probably would not be readable when zoomed
14:27<frosch123>2x hd
14:27<frosch123>@calc 1920*2
14:27<@DorpsGek>frosch123: 3840
14:27<andythenorth>mine is 1280 :)
14:28<frosch123>anyway, i can zoom it with ctrl+wheel
14:28<frosch123>if i really want o
14:28<andythenorth>same here
14:28<andythenorth>usually I load it, then zoom out :P
14:28<frosch123>next question: why does my ssh-agent not work?
14:29<andythenorth>poodle
14:29<andythenorth>outdated python ssh bindings?
14:29<andythenorth>bees?
14:29<andythenorth>sunspots?
14:29<frosch123>oh, it works on coop
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14:35<frosch123>i assumed old keys would only get rejected by new servers, but apparently new clients are also picky
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15:18<andythenorth>ach
15:18*andythenorth really needs to learn make :(
15:22<andythenorth>frosch123: better? o_O http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/LATEST/docs/html/cargoflow_extreme.html
15:22<andythenorth>also http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/LATEST/docs/html/cargoflow_in_a_hot_country.html
15:22<andythenorth>etc
15:22<andythenorth>they’re linked from http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/LATEST/docs/html/economies.html
15:24<frosch123>i can't read them, and zooming does not work anymore
15:25<frosch123>fullscreen works
15:25<andythenorth>ha
15:25<andythenorth>browser zoom actually makes it (smaller in chrome)
15:25<andythenorth>unexpected result :)
15:26<andythenorth>right
15:26<frosch123>same with firefox
15:26*andythenorth will try and find a better way
15:27<andythenorth>https://github.com/ariutta/svg-pan-zoom ? o_O
15:29<frosch123>http://ariutta.github.io/svg-pan-zoom/demo/thumbnailViewer.html <- i guess that variant could work
15:29<andythenorth>eh quite cool
15:30*andythenorth needs to assess the infosec risk of it
15:30<andythenorth>maybe Wolf01 could do that? o_O
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16:06<andythenorth>ach
16:06<andythenorth>http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/LATEST/docs/html/cargoflow_temperate_basic.html
16:06<andythenorth>can’t figure out why the pan-zoom isn’t enabled
16:06<andythenorth>probably bad path somewhere
16:06<frosch123>works for me?
16:09<frosch123>the bottom-left thingie is slightly buggy as it does not quite align to the mouse, but it mostly works
16:10<frosch123>the overall thing is also minimal bigger than the viewport, so it adds scrollbars
16:12<andythenorth>do you get the zoom icons?
16:12<frosch123>yes
16:12<andythenorth>chrome drops them
16:12<andythenorth>and in some of the docs examples
16:12<andythenorth>but not all
16:12<andythenorth>well it’s better than before :P
16:13<frosch123>it also works in chromium for me
16:13<frosch123>though different :o
16:13<frosch123>it chromium i have to click to drag the red border, in firefox is just follows on moving
16:14<andythenorth>works in safari, but thumbnail drag is absent
16:14<andythenorth>I will offer refunds to dissatisfied users :)
16:15<frosch123>it even works in konqueror
16:16<frosch123>except that konqueror seems to enforce a minimum font size, so the thumbnail looks kind of bad
16:19<andythenorth>ha
16:27<andythenorth>hmm works for me in chrome now
16:28<andythenorth>now it just needs to be in a modal :P
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17:02<Wolf01><andythenorth> maybe Wolf01 could do that? o_O <- ha
17:06<Wolf01>BTW the demos don't work at all on firefox
17:07*andythenorth wonders if it’s a flakey library
17:07<Wolf01>Oh, now they do, but only after I opened them in Edge
17:09<Wolf01>The resize svg container on page resize was tricky IIRC
17:17<Eddi|zuHause><Wolf01> And I'm not sure about what piece of paper they will give me, maybe without some sort of degree in IT is useless <-- a degree is probably the least important thing in IT...
17:18<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: have you had a look at my partitioning algorithm?
17:18<andythenorth>I have, but I didn’t figure out what I’d need to feed it yet
17:18<andythenorth>presumably just a list of economies and industries
17:18<Eddi|zuHause>yes, a dict, where the keys are industries, and the values are sets of economies
17:19<Eddi|zuHause>and it returns sets of industries that can share colours
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17:20<Eddi|zuHause>i've made no theoretical considerations on how "optimal" the result is
17:20<Eddi|zuHause>in terms of "this is the minimum amount of colours you need"
17:23<Wolf01>I should go to job talks with a classmate which got a degree in IT, usually he is rejected because with a degree they have to pay him more, then I could introduce myself :>
17:25<andythenorth>:P
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17:25<andythenorth>funny that in some countries, developers are v. hard to find
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17:25<andythenorth>and bits of Europe have them in surplus
17:26<Eddi|zuHause>i've never heard of IT people being rejected
17:26<Wolf01>Oh, there's plenty of vacant positions here, but nobody that suits them
17:26<Wolf01>Because they are picky
17:27<Eddi|zuHause>well, basically i was hired after i said "i like python" :p
17:27<Wolf01>The best candidate is 20-25 years old, with 10+ years of practice, master degree in IT, must not have worked before in the IT compartment because they need to hire him as apprentice
17:28<andythenorth>old http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/releases/LATEST/docs/html/economies.html
17:28<andythenorth>new http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/LATEST/docs/html/economies.html
17:28<Eddi|zuHause>they gasped a little when i said how much i wanted to be paid
17:28<andythenorth>[bearing in mind that new is designed to look better on mobile]
17:28<andythenorth>is new better or just different?
17:29<Wolf01>I was hired because I was the only one able to tell the difference between domain name and email
17:29<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause: too much or too little? o_O
17:29<Eddi|zuHause>bigger is better
17:30<andythenorth>I think it’s cleaner
17:30<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: well, i feel like i should have asked more, but they offered even less
17:30<andythenorth>:P
17:30<Wolf01><andythenorth> new http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/LATEST/docs/html/economies.html <- /me likes it
17:30<andythenorth>it’s a bit of a weird layout
17:30<andythenorth>the reading order is unclear
17:30<Eddi|zuHause>(and they said their number first)
17:30<andythenorth>but it seems to work
17:31<Wolf01>Here is pretty impossible to make an offer, basically they would like to not pay you
17:33<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: i never really liked graphviz, because i think the graphs could be more compact and cleaner if it relaxed a little on the hierarchical layout
17:34<Eddi|zuHause>the steeltown graph looks especially horrible
17:35<Wolf01>I used plantUML for a website
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17:38<andythenorth>it’s a shame about the steeltown layout
17:38<andythenorth>the flow is quite nice
17:40<Eddi|zuHause>totally unrelated to the topic, and really old: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXjhszy2f9w
17:40<Eddi|zuHause>(also mostly in german)
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17:41<Wolf01>I didn't understand a word, but I think I get the irony
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17:42<andythenorth>I don’t know of any graphviz alternatives :|
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17:44<Wolf01>I just made graphs in svg with the IDE plugin and then loaded them in the site :P
17:45<andythenorth>? http://www.yworks.com/products/yed
17:45<Wolf01>I use this one http://plantuml.com
17:46<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: i can't really help you with that
17:46<Wolf01>You need graphwiz too
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17:46<Eddi|zuHause>it would probably be fine if you just could drag around the nodes a bit after you've piped it through graphviz
17:47<Eddi|zuHause>but that's not really useful for automatted generation
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17:50<andythenorth>is bed
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18:03<Wolf01>Me too
18:03<Wolf01>'night
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---Logclosed Tue Jul 04 00:00:56 2017