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#openttd IRC Logs for 2017-08-03

---Logopened Thu Aug 03 00:00:37 2017
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02:36<dihedral>hej hej
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03:06<@Alberth>molin
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03:14<V453000>yo
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03:16<V453000>https://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=199146 vs https://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=199147
03:16<V453000>:)
03:18<Arveen2>i still have concept-1.png open in a browser tab
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03:36<V453000>:D
03:39<LordAro>mm, cell shading
03:44<@Alberth>V: sooo much better :)
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04:34<@planetmaker>nice signals :)
04:35<@planetmaker>the first one looks nicer with the dirt on the posts, the 2nd one a bit cleaner and clearer. But I don't think that overrules the gain in looks in the first one
04:40<@Alberth>2nd one gets a very bland look imho https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1184988#p1184988
04:42<@Alberth>new version is much better
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04:46<@Alberth>o/
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04:48<Wolf01>o/
04:48<__ln__>night/morning Wolf01
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04:55<@Alberth>o/
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09:35<Wolf01>So... if I have a voxel model (made with various parts), how do I animate it?
09:35<V453000>yes
09:35<V453000>just tell blender to do things
09:36<Wolf01>Eh... I don't use blender :(
09:36<V453000>rekt then
09:36<Wolf01>Good
09:37<Wolf01>Maybe I'll keep the tracks static and fuck, the turret is already static
09:38<V453000>planetmaker: thanks :)
09:38<V453000>Wolf01: what horrible thing are you working on?
09:39<Wolf01>http://imgur.com/a/cjeuB
09:40<V453000>no offense, but I think I am starting to grow an allergy to voxels, fucking minecraft :)
09:43<Wolf01>I'm not able to do 3D
09:43<V453000>2D isn't wrong :)
09:44<Wolf01>I wanted to make it 3d :P
09:44<V453000>well even for making voxels you have to be able to do 3D
09:44<V453000>of course you don't need to know as many polygon modelling tools, but it's more about the concept
09:45<V453000>take example, I also thought making BRIX in a clean style made out of just bricks is going to be easier
09:45<Wolf01>No, I'm not able to model at all, I already tried and can't make anything which is not a tutorial
09:45<V453000>from my current experience I know that it's actually much harder
09:45<V453000>did you try to draw a quick sketch on paper? doesn't need to be well drawn or anything
09:46<Wolf01>I'm not able to draw on paper too XD
09:46<V453000>me neither
09:46<V453000>and that's fine
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09:48<V453000>even when I was making nuts I was drawing totally random bricks which didn't really even resemble trains
09:48<Wolf01>I don't have sense of proportions, I just assemble stuff until I'm fine with it, on paper it doesn't even work, but I can do pixel drawing by copying stuff, and only top/front/lateral views, to make an isometric thing I need voxels
09:48<V453000>but you just draw around and it gives you the idea what you want to create
09:48<V453000>when I just open blender and start doing random things I usually run out of ideas very fast
09:49<V453000>I don't have a good sense of proportions either
09:49<Wolf01>I can do technical drawing on paper, but I don't have any space to do it, and it takes too much work with rulers, compass etc
09:50<V453000>by all means use whatever you want, but if I can give you a suggestion, try to sketch things when you are not at the computer :)
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09:50<V453000>lines don't need to be by a ruler ;)
09:50<V453000>just get a square paper
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10:00<Wolf01>I can't see how it can help me to make 3D models, I already have the ideas, I just can't use the tools
10:03<Wolf01>It took me a week to design a bookshelf in 3D, keeping all the right sizes etc, maybe if I just used autocad instead of sketchup it would have been better
10:23<@Alberth>I make a 3d model by assembling elementary shapes based on 3d coordinates, then throw it into a renderer
10:25<@Alberth>much drawing is much like programming, you suck at it for the first few years :)
10:28<Wolf01>BTW, we are going really off-offtopic, my question was how to move voxels in a program not how to learn 3D drawing :P
10:30<@Alberth>oh, translate all coordinates, isn't it?
10:30<@Alberth>by the same amount is probably a good idea :)
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10:31<Wolf01>Yeah, that was my thought too
10:32<@Alberth>moving the camera would also work, depending on how you measure "move voxels"
10:34<Wolf01>Oh, moving the models is not hard, they already rotate and I can make them rotate in circles or other things, it's animating the voxel itself which seem to be hard and I'm not going to write code for every single movement
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10:37<@Alberth>I don't understand what "animating the voxel" means
10:37<Wolf01>When I have a model composed of different parts
10:37<Wolf01>Which should move independently
10:37<@Alberth>ok
10:38<@Alberth>each part is a model, or a unit that you set coordinates and transformations to
10:39<Wolf01>Yup, I did that in 2D many times
10:39<@Alberth>then the whole is a collection of those parts, which is likely what you see now as "model"
10:40<@Alberth>ie the model is virtual thing, which gives a common base vector. Relative to that base vector you set each part, and those you actually draw
10:41<@Alberth>at least I think that is how it works, never done anything like that :)
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11:06<Wolf01>I still can't understand why it rotates on 2 axis (X and Z) when I rotate on X only
11:09<Wolf01>Meh... the tutorial site is down
11:10<Alkel_U3>does roadhog or anything have this? https://i.imgur.com/WoWt3CV.gifv
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11:18<Wolf01>I should really start to learn unity
11:19<Wolf01>And do things without knowing how to create evverything from scratch
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11:56<@Alberth>ability to define a transform doesn't go away, probably :)
11:57<Wolf01>Probably, but then I don't need to reinvent the camera, I should implement a gimbal lock but it doesn't seem to work
11:59<@Alberth>rotation around X axis is also on wikipedia, I would guess
11:59<Wolf01>I have the same problem as seen as in most 3D softwares when you rotate the model with the mouse, if you rotate one axis per time is all right, when you rotate X and Y a magical Z rotation appears
12:00<Wolf01>It's good for an airplane, not so good for a camera which looks at the terrain
12:02<Wolf01>Also I need to lock the movement on axis and not to the camera view
12:05<@Alberth>I am not sure that is wrong, you only need 2 rotation axes for 3d
12:06<Wolf01>Yes, up and forward
12:07<@Alberth>not sure what having X and Y is useful for
12:08<@Alberth>just rotate around "up", and move vertically would be enough ?
12:09<Wolf01>That's what I'm doing
12:09<@Alberth>so why do you rotate around 2 axes?
12:09<Wolf01>Forward = Vector3.Transform(Forward, Matrix.CreateFromAxisAngle(Up, amount));
12:10<Wolf01>For the pitch
12:10<Wolf01>I'm looking at 45°
12:10<Wolf01>But I want to be able to change that
12:11<Wolf01>Also Z stays 0 only when pitch is 0
12:11<@Alberth>hmm, maybe you don't rotate around the center point?
12:12<@Alberth>DirectX magic is quite magical to me, I have no knowledge what those functions do
12:13<Wolf01>https://pastebin.com/Wt4F321m I got the code from here, which is for a spaceship indeed...
12:13<Wolf01>It was from a tutorial which is not online anymore
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12:14<Wolf01>And I'm struggling with the camera because 98% of tutorials are for unity
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12:16<@Alberth>the only camera I ever created was fixed, and looking straight down :p
12:16<Wolf01>:P
12:17<@Alberth>required some computation to get everything in view, but that was about it :)
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12:18<@Alberth>where I manually constructed the matrices at first, and later by glm
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12:36<Wolf01>Quak
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12:47<frosch123>moo
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12:57<Wolf01>Ooops, I committed again too much
13:07<@Alberth>with git, I usually commit not enough :p
13:27<Wolf01>I think I have the axis wrong... I modify up and the view rotates along forward
13:38<@Alberth>that sounds wrong at least :)
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15:18<Wolf01>Good, now that I'm pissed off by not being able to fix the camera, I don't know what to do now
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17:06-!-tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@ip503d7ac1.speed.planet.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:06-!-tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@ip503d7ac1.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd
17:06-!-tycoondemon is "..." on #openttdcoop.stable #openttdcoop #openttd
17:18-!-Progman [~progman@p5DC5E72D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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18:00-!-wodencafe [~cboyd@cpe-66-25-21-153.tx.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd
18:00-!-wodencafe is "Woden Cafe" on #openttd #biz #help #linux #tor-offtopic #oftc #awesome #moocows #tor
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18:08-!-synchris_ is "Synesios Christou" on #openttd
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18:09-!-FLHerne is "Francis Herne" on #openttd
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18:29-!-glx_ is "Loïc GUILLOUX" on #opendune #openttd.noai #openttd.notice #openttd
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18:31-!-glx_ is now known as glx
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18:36-!-Smedles_ [~quassel@CPE-58-160-75-119.ssqn1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
18:36-!-Smedles_ is "Paul Smedley" on #openttd
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18:56-!-bwn [~bwn@c-67-174-159-210.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #openttd
18:56-!-bwn is "bwn" on #ext4 #debian-offtopic #zcash #virt #qemu #python #openttd #observium #mm #linux #kernelnewbies
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19:33-!-tycoondemon is "..." on #openttdcoop.stable #openttdcoop #openttd
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19:49-!-Warrigal_ is "Tanner Swett" on #openttd
19:51-!-Netsplit synthon.oftc.net <-> graviton.oftc.net quits: efess, Warrigal, Tharbakim, ST2, innocenat, quiznilo, dvim, greeter, jinks
19:51-!-Netsplit over, joins: efess
19:54-!-Tharbakim is "Tharbakim" on #slackware #openttd.dev #openttd #lxde #irssi #fish #bitlbee #/r/openttd
19:54-!-Netsplit over, joins: Tharbakim, innocenat
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19:56-!-mindlesstux is "ZNC - http://znc.in" on #virtualization #virt @#tuz-oftc @#tuz #qemu #osm #openttd #openconnect #observium #ipv6 #OpenRailwayMap
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20:37-!-jinks [~jinks@104.161.79.77] has joined #openttd
20:37-!-jinks is "Got ZNC?" on #openttd #awesome
21:06-!-Flygon [~Flygon@124-148-133-27.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #openttd
21:06-!-Flygon is "Flygon" on #openttd
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21:43-!-mindlesstux [~mindlesst@2001:19f0:5:238:5400:ff:fe30:7f01] has joined #openttd
21:43-!-mindlesstux is "ZNC - http://znc.in" on #virtualization #virt @#tuz-oftc @#tuz #qemu #osm #openttd #openconnect #observium #linode #ipv6 #OpenRailwayMap
21:51-!-mindlesstux [~mindlesst@2001:19f0:5:238:5400:ff:fe30:7f01] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in]
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21:52-!-mindlesstux is "ZNC - http://znc.in" on #virtualization #virt @#tuz-oftc @#tuz #qemu #osm #openttd #openconnect #observium #linode #ipv6 #OpenRailwayMap
22:19-!-debdog [~debdog@2a02:8070:418b:1400:7a24:afff:fe8a:d04d] has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.]
22:20-!-debdog [~debdog@2a02:8070:418b:1400:7a24:afff:fe8a:d04d] has joined #openttd
22:20-!-debdog is "Wowbagger" on #openttd
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---Logclosed Fri Aug 04 00:00:39 2017