Back to Home / #openttd / 2017 / 10 / Prev Day | Next Day
#openttd IRC Logs for 2017-10-23

---Logopened Mon Oct 23 00:00:51 2017
00:16-!-Cubey [~Coobies@pool-96-241-233-56.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:33-!-orudge` [~orudge@000128f1.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:34-!-orudge` [~orudge@000128f1.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd
01:34-!-orudge` is "orudge" on #thesinner #openttdcoop.devzone #openttdcoop.dev #bukkit #jontylog #tycoonexiles #z.aud #z.radio #locomotion #transportempire #openttdcoop #openttd #tycoon
01:34-!-mode/#openttd [+o orudge`] by ChanServ
02:14-!-Progman [~progman@p548D9C0B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
02:14-!-Progman is "Peter Henschel" on #openttdcoop.dev #openttdcoop #openttd
02:36-!-joseph222 [~joseph222@183.90.37.194] has joined #openttd
02:36-!-joseph222 is "Joseph Lee" on #openttd
02:37<joseph222>Hi
02:39-!-Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-137-142.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
02:39<joseph222>Is it working
02:39<joseph222>I am testing it on a app
02:39-!-Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-137-142.natnow.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd
02:39-!-Supercheese is "Supercheese" on #openttd #openttdcoop.devzone +#openttd.dev
02:39<joseph222>Hi
02:40<joseph222>...
02:49-!-andythenorth [~andytheno@cpc87219-aztw31-2-0-cust178.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd
02:49-!-andythenorth is "andythenorth" on #openttd
02:49<andythenorth>supermop: https://static1.squarespace.com/static/56cc404a356fb0ad1dc8a012/t/59b8ee0b9f7456ccb0a23798/1505291796375/SR+Newsletter+September+22+Middleton+steam+tram.jpg?format=1000w
03:17-!-Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-137-142.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Valete omnes]
03:22<V453000>iz?
03:23<andythenorth>yup
03:33*andythenorth drawing Yeti transport http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-JiLgyu1YLLY/UPHBDjdvUiI/AAAAAAAAAbg/wAM6QW9mWI0/s1600/CD0GGJan2013B.jpg
03:38<V453000>sick
03:38*V453000 finishing BRIX
03:38<V453000>release tonight motherfuckers :>
03:41<andythenorth>countdown clock
03:42<joseph222>??
03:45<V453000>yeah
04:07-!-orudge` [~orudge@000128f1.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:07-!-orudge` [~orudge@000128f1.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd
04:07-!-orudge` is "orudge" on #thesinner #openttdcoop.devzone #openttdcoop.dev #bukkit #jontylog #tycoonexiles #z.aud #z.radio #locomotion #transportempire #openttdcoop #openttd #tycoon
04:07-!-mode/#openttd [+o orudge`] by ChanServ
04:26-!-andythenorth [~andytheno@cpc87219-aztw31-2-0-cust178.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth]
04:30-!-JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc80683-stap13-2-0-cust1171.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd
04:30-!-JacobD88 is "JacobD88" on #openttd.dev #openttd.notice #openttd
04:37<FLHerne>joseph222: It is, yes
04:39<FLHerne>V453000: All the pictures on your preview page http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/yeti/wiki/Previews are broken
04:39<FLHerne>(also the v1->2 comparison)
04:39<V453000>yes because dropbox is a piece of trash
04:39<FLHerne>Ah
04:39<V453000>I'll probably fix it someday
04:39<V453000>for now publishing BRIX is top priority
05:10-!-andythenorth [~andytheno@194.168.185.226] has joined #openttd
05:10-!-andythenorth is "andythenorth" on #openttd
05:46<V453000>8 pages of bullshit text
05:46<V453000>nice
05:46<andythenorth>?
05:47<V453000>big BRIX blog article
05:47<V453000>iz
05:48<andythenorth>error
05:48<andythenorth>not on coop site
05:48<andythenorth>type faster
05:49<V453000>evening will bring shitstorm
05:49<V453000>BRIX flooding openttd universe
05:51<V453000>oh also
05:51<V453000>what was the thing which was stripping newgrfs of 32bpp and EZ?
05:55<V453000>was it also musa?
05:55<V453000>or some nmlc thing?
06:05-!-Gja [~Martin@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has joined #openttd
06:05-!-Gja is "Martin" on #bcache #openttd
06:15-!-Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd
06:15-!-Wolf01 is "Wolf01" on #openttd
06:15<Wolf01>Moin
06:15<__ln__>buon moin
06:37<@planetmaker>V453000, iirc it was grfcodec
06:37<V453000>ooo
06:38<V453000>thank you :) will try to fiddle
06:45-!-Gja [~Martin@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has quit [Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com)]
06:50-!-Samu [~oftc-webi@pa4-84-91-142-34.netvisao.pt] has joined #openttd
06:50-!-Samu is "OFTC WebIRC Client" on #openttd
06:51<Samu>hi
06:51<Samu>looking for english help
06:51<Samu>I want to shorten "distance travelled during flight"
06:51<Samu>distance flawn? flewed? flown?
06:51<Samu>flought?
06:53<V453000>"flying distance" ?
06:53<V453000>"flymeters"
06:53<V453000>:D
06:53<Samu>:(
06:54<Samu>"distance travelled since last takeoff" is too much to put on vehicle detail window
06:57<Samu>well, there's "breakdowns since last service"
06:57<Samu>not short as well, but ...
06:57<LordAro>Samu: "flown"
06:57<Samu>ty LordAro
06:57<LordAro>although that would only replaced "travelled"
06:58<LordAro>replace*
06:58-!-Gja [~Martin@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has joined #openttd
06:58-!-Gja is "Martin" on #bcache #openttd
06:58<Samu>"distance flown since last takeoff"?
06:58<LordAro>yeah
06:58<Samu>ugh, still big
06:58<Wolf01>It depends on what do you want to tell to the user: "distance travelled during flight" is the total distance? You don't tell much about it; "distance travelled since last takeoff" is more understandable
06:59<LordAro>maybe get rid of flown/travelled entirely?
06:59<LordAro>the word is a bit redundant - it's a vehicle, of course it's travelled to move any distance
06:59<V453000>"distance since last takeoff" seems to make sense to me
07:02<peter1139>current flight distance
07:05<Samu>oki peter1139
07:06<Samu>STR_VEHICLE_INFO_RELIABILITY_BREAKDOWNS_DISTANCE :{BLACK}Reliability: {LTBLUE}{COMMA}% {BLACK}Breakdowns since last service: {LTBLUE}{COMMA} {BLACK}Current flight distance: {LTBLUE}{COMMA}{NBSP}tile{P "" s}
07:06<Samu>like that?
07:07<Wolf01>Make it 2 strings
07:08<Samu>STR_VEHICLE_INFO_RELIABILITY_BREAKDOWNS
07:09<Samu>STR_VEHICLE_INFO_RELIABILITY_BREAKDOWNS_DISTANCE
07:09<Samu>2 strings
07:10<peter1139>It was a suggestion.
07:34<V453000>order
07:37-!-JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc80683-stap13-2-0-cust1171.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: JacobD88]
07:39-!-sla_ro|master [~sla.ro@78.96.209.89] has joined #openttd
07:39-!-sla_ro|master is "slamaster" on @#sla #openttd #love
07:42<Samu>there is a flaw with this counter :(
07:42<Samu>horizontal/vertical counting is faster than diagonal
07:47-!-Gja [~Martin@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has quit [Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com)]
07:48<Samu>halp!
07:48<Samu>https://imgur.com/644D8vF
07:48<Samu>1,125 til...
07:48<Samu>why not tiles
07:49<__ln__>drop the 'current'
07:49<Samu>oki
07:49<__ln__>or 'flight', i guess it can be assumed that an aircraft flies by default
07:50<Samu>the counter resets to 0 immediately after touching the ground... hmm
07:50<__ln__>or how about 'distance flown'
07:50-!-ToffeeYogurtPots [~ToffeeYog@4G4AAC2I6.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #openttd
07:50-!-ToffeeYogurtPots is "realname" on #oftc #privacytech #privacytools.io #openttd #privacybadger #https-everywhere #i2p #tor-offtopic #tor-onions #tor-project #tor #apparmor #debian-offtopic #debian-hurd
07:50<Samu>ok, seems right
07:50<Samu>will change
07:51<__ln__>but i'm not a native englishman, and i rarely even drink tea
07:52<Samu>i still have to see what the heck happens with the counter when the aircraft is outside the map
07:54<Samu>there's virtual coordinates stuff which I really don't get how it works
07:57<peter1139>Moo.
07:58<andythenorth>isn't it
07:58<Samu>i like the idea of showing it in red if it travells too much
07:58-!-Gja [~Martin@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has joined #openttd
07:58-!-Gja is "Martin" on #bcache #openttd
07:58<Samu>considering my patch and all, makes sense
08:13<Samu>there is no start take off for helicopters?
08:15<peter1139>Helicopters are rubbish
08:15<peter1139>I was fixing something but didn't
08:15<peter1139>Usual for my patches, I suppose.
08:15<Samu>AircraftEventHandler_TakeOff
08:16<Samu>this should suffice for both
08:16<Samu>let's see
08:16<Samu>i'm still trying to figure when it's the best time to reset the counter
08:17<Samu>and when it's the best time to start counting and when to stop counting
08:18<Samu>when the sound starts playing, the counter resets to 0
08:19<Samu>seems like a good time to reset
08:21<V453000>how would you expect I should give it the zoom and depth parameters? https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8713/grfstrip.png
08:21<V453000>it seems to just remove both 32bpp and EZ for me
08:21<V453000>can I make a 8bpp + EZ newgrf with this?
08:21-!-Gja [~Martin@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has quit [Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com)]
08:23<Samu>damn it, helicopters are a difficult specimen
08:35<Samu>it's all too confusing for helicopters
08:54-!-Progman [~progman@p548D9C0B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
08:56-!-Progman [~progman@p548D9C0B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
08:56-!-Progman is "Peter Henschel" on #openttdcoop.dev #openttdcoop #openttd
09:03-!-josephlee222 [~joseph222@58.182.163.157] has joined #openttd
09:03-!-josephlee222 is "Joseph Lee" on #openttd
09:09-!-ToffeeYogurtPots [~ToffeeYog@4G4AAC2I6.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
09:09-!-ToffeeYogurtPots [~ToffeeYog@8L3AACDNT.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #openttd
09:09-!-ToffeeYogurtPots is "realname" on #debian-hurd #debian-offtopic #apparmor #tor #tor-project #tor-onions #tor-offtopic #i2p #https-everywhere #privacybadger #openttd #privacytools.io #privacytech #oftc
09:10-!-joseph222 [~joseph222@183.90.37.194] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:38<supermop_>andythenorth: did you see this yet? https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1863728218/inter-city-125-poster?utm_source=Kickstarter+%231&utm_campaign=9c17693294-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2017_10_22&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_55ce0e4a21-9c17693294-160903481&mc_cid=9c17693294&mc_eid=76deb86b76
09:39<andythenorth>supermop_: think it will make it? o_O
09:39<supermop_>yeah
09:40<supermop_>i was debating the 100 quid level yesterday when it launched
09:40<supermop_>now thats all gone
09:40<supermop_>only hope is to drop enough hints to my wife re
09:40<supermop_>: birthday gift
09:40<andythenorth>I'd buy it, then leave it in cupboard
09:59-!-TheMask96 [martijn@wrath.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:01-!-TheMask96 [martijn@greed.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd
10:01-!-TheMask96 is "Martijn Zweistra" on @#altcontrol #openttd #openttd.notice
10:03-!-ToffeeYogurtPots [~ToffeeYog@8L3AACDNT.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
10:03-!-ToffeeYogurtPots [~ToffeeYog@8VQAAC67I.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #openttd
10:03-!-ToffeeYogurtPots is "realname" on #debian-hurd #debian-offtopic #apparmor #tor #tor-project #tor-onions #tor-offtopic #i2p #https-everywhere #privacybadger #openttd #privacytools.io #privacytech #oftc
10:08<supermop_>16px wide curtain side for cargo tram
10:09<supermop_>thinking of taking every 4th 1px vetical strip and scrunching them to one side
10:09<supermop_>but idk if asymetrical opening will bother me
10:09<supermop_>lets see
10:12-!-josephlee222 [~joseph222@58.182.163.157] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:12-!-Gustavo6046 [~Gustavo60@177.18.73.138] has joined #openttd
10:12-!-Gustavo6046 is "I open with sandwich!" on #openttd #ohnx @#gusbot #doom64ex
10:17-!-Flygon [~Flygon@124-148-158-195.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
10:30-!-Cubey [~Coobies@pool-96-241-233-56.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd
10:30-!-Cubey is "Jaybar" on #openttd
10:37-!-Alberth [~alberth@00015f9e.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd
10:37-!-mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ
10:37-!-Alberth is "purple" on @#openttd
10:38<@Alberth>o/
10:40<andythenorth>hi Alberth
10:56<supermop_>https://imgur.com/a/VQ11P
10:56<andythenorth>interesting
10:56<supermop_>needs dark creases in the scrunch
10:58<supermop_>https://meidresden.de/images/stories/Pressefotos/Dresden/VW-Bahn_Logistik/cargpotram-DSC_6185.jpg
10:58<supermop_>folds hang out a bit when open
10:58<Samu>i managed to find where exactly an helicopter starts raising up
10:59<supermop_>ooh this looks cool: http://www.6-tram.ch/images/d_e_14_0058_580.jpg
10:59<Samu>it's a bit messed up, but it's here if (amd.flag & AMED_HELI_RAISE) {
10:59<Samu>if (--u->cur_speed == 32) {
11:00<Samu>when speed matches 32, it starts raising up
11:00<Samu>peter1139:
11:01-!-mindlesstux [~mindlesst@2001:19f0:5:238:5400:ff:fe30:7f01] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in]
11:02-!-mindlesstux [~mindlesst@2001:19f0:5:238:5400:ff:fe30:7f01] has joined #openttd
11:02-!-mindlesstux is "ZNC - http://znc.in" on #virtualization #virt @#tuz-oftc @#tuz #qemu #osm #openttd #openconnect #observium #linode #ipv6 #OpenRailwayMap
11:03-!-frosch123 [~frosch@00013ce7.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd
11:03-!-frosch123 is "frosch" on #openttdcoop.devzone #openttd.dev #openttd
11:04<@Alberth>o/
11:06<andythenorth>quak
11:07<frosch123>moo
11:07<supermop_>also not sure i need gangways on those cargo tram cars
11:12<supermop_>hmm 1 shade darker not enough
11:12<supermop_>might lighten the bumps of the folds
11:18-!-sim-al2 [~sim-al2@108-221-157-231.lightspeed.mmphtn.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:20<supermop_>problem is the opening is big enough now i have to draw mail bags in there
11:20<supermop_>slash beer kegs and bottles
11:25<Wolf01>o/, quak
11:32<Gustavo6046>Oathfinder works :D
11:32<Gustavo6046>Pathfinder*
11:32<supermop_>haha
11:32<supermop_>aol+yahoo branded pathfinder
11:33<Gustavo6046>oath of fealty
11:39<supermop_>yeah. when aol and yahoo merged in preparation of selling to verizon, they changed the name of the joint company to Oath
11:52<Samu>what does {NBSP} mean, I forgot
11:52<Samu>on strings
11:53<@Alberth>non-breaking space
11:57-!-Breckett [~DDD@pool8021x172-230.RZ.HS-Augsburg.DE] has joined #openttd
11:57-!-Breckett is "Breckett" on #openttd #openttd.dev
11:57<Gustavo6046>^
11:58<Samu>ok, still not sure what it does
11:58<Samu>but will use it lol
12:01<juzza1>it prevents line breaking at the space character
12:01<@Alberth>it looks like a space, but it's not
12:01<@Alberth>so sentences cannot be broken at that point
12:02<Samu>ah, i see
12:20-!-ToBeFree [uid51591@id-51591.tooting.irccloud.com] has joined #openttd
12:20-!-ToBeFree is "ToBeFree" on #debian #openttd @#freiwuppertal #https-everywhere #oolite-dev #oolite-ger #oolite #tor #linux
12:30<Samu>https://i.imgur.com/CXvCW53.png
12:30<Samu>nice, i like it
12:32<Gustavo6046>I have a bit field, where:
12:32<Gustavo6046>• left two bits are X;
12:32<Gustavo6046>• right two bits are Y.
12:33<Gustavo6046>Being X and Y the normalized downhill direction of a slope, where:
12:33<Gustavo6046>• 10 is -1;
12:33<Gustavo6046>• 11 is 0;
12:33<Gustavo6046>• 01 is 1.
12:33<Gustavo6046>Nevermind
12:33<Gustavo6046>• 00 is now the same 0 instead, and now it works, so ignore me.
12:34<@Alberth>wouldn't 11 be 2-complement -1 in 2 bit ?
12:34<Gustavo6046>Alberth, I'm using just three numbers
12:34<Gustavo6046>I'm comparing the bits, and doing a & b != 0
12:35<@Alberth>I guessed as much
12:35<Gustavo6046>I want to know if a & b != 0 gets whether a road can be built between two slopes.
12:35<@Alberth> (a & b) != 0 then
12:35<Gustavo6046>So, e.g. a = [-1, 0] and b = [-1, 1] does 100 and 110.
12:36<Gustavo6046>Or rather, 0100 and 0110
12:36<Gustavo6046>Oh wait, 01 is -1 and 10 is 1, I swapped :P
12:36<Gustavo6046>Not important, it's symmetrical.
12:36<@Alberth>but wouldn't int x:2 not get expanded as 2 complement? I wonder
12:36<Samu>so now there's aircraft range and distance flown
12:37<Gustavo6046>LOL line 1101 is within the slope bitwise code https://i.imgur.com/eYrMYSV.png
12:37<Gustavo6046>Alberth, no
12:37<Gustavo6046>x and y must be between -1 and 1
12:37<@Alberth>bummer
12:37<Gustavo6046>?
12:38<Samu>what are the pros of aircraft range?
12:38<@Alberth>"too bad, I had hoped it would"
12:38<Gustavo6046>Slopes are a direction; directions are normalized to a unit vector where -1 <= n <= 1 and n in {x, y}.
12:38<Samu>slopes aren't a direction, they're a big mess of stuff
12:40<Gustavo6046>I know
12:40<Gustavo6046>Samu, I know
12:40<Samu>i worked on slope directions when working on river tiles :(
12:40<Gustavo6046>that's why I clear the SLOPE_ELEVATED and SLOPE_STEE bits.
12:40<Gustavo6046>SLOPE_STEEP*
12:40<Samu>trying to make friendly rivers
12:41<Gustavo6046>?
12:41<Samu>during map generation, try to make lock friendly rivers
12:42<Samu>during town growth, try to make lock friendly town bridges
12:42<Samu>i ended up fattening rivers, not really what I wanted to do :/
12:43<Samu>which aircraft set got aircraft ranges?
12:43<Samu>i wanna see how distance flown + aircraft range interact with each other
12:43<Samu>av8?
12:46<Samu>Range: 96 tiles, Distance flown: 103 tiles
12:46<Samu>:|
12:49<Gustavo6046>oh
12:49<Gustavo6046>Samu, it's radius flown
12:49<Gustavo6046>so I guess you half the distance
12:49<Samu>https://i.imgur.com/hcadBxE.png
12:49<Gustavo6046>if the range is in a radial circle
12:49<Gustavo6046>and the aircraft reached the edge
12:50<Samu>i count every time the aircraft changes tile coordinates, i'm not sure what aircraft range do
12:50<Samu>i think it counts the distance between the 2 airports
12:50<Gustavo6046>Samu, you should instead count to X everytime it moves in X
12:50<Gustavo6046>and count to Y everytime it moves in Y
12:51<Gustavo6046>then the distance is sqrt(X*X + Y*Y)
12:51<Gustavo6046>idk if Squirrel has pow
12:52<Samu>i got a problem with identifying coordinates outside map
12:52<Samu>it uses virtual coordinates when outside the map borders, and i have no idea how they work
12:53<Samu>i can't calculate distances
12:53<Gustavo6046>Samu, I had that too
12:53<Samu>i can only count how many times it has moved from a tile to another
12:53<Gustavo6046>so I did a TileVec class for coordinate
12:53<Gustavo6046>it would always turn n < -1 to n = 0
12:53<Gustavo6046>s/</≤/
12:57-!-glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd
12:57-!-mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ
12:57-!-glx is "Loïc GUILLOUX" on +#openttd
13:01-!-Wormnest [~Wormnest@s5596abd2.adsl.online.nl] has joined #openttd
13:01-!-Wormnest is "Wormnest" on #openttd
13:05-!-Breckett [~DDD@pool8021x172-230.RZ.HS-Augsburg.DE] has quit [Quit: Verlassend]
13:15-!-andythenorth [~andytheno@194.168.185.226] has quit [Quit: andythenorth]
13:29-!-sim-al2 [~sim-al2@108-221-157-231.lightspeed.mmphtn.sbcglobal.net] has joined #openttd
13:29-!-sim-al2 is "sim-al2" on #openttd @#/r/openttd
13:36<Samu>https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=76044&p=1184036#p1184036 done
13:42-!-sla_ro|master2 [~sla.ro@78.96.209.89] has joined #openttd
13:42-!-sla_ro|master2 is "slamaster" on #sla #openttd #love
13:47-!-sla_ro|master [~sla.ro@78.96.209.89] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:48-!-Gustavo6046 [~Gustavo60@177.18.73.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:50<Samu>do aircraft have a weight concept in them?
13:50<Samu>feature?
13:51<Samu>the more loaded it is, the least it accelerates
13:56<@Alberth>the biggest problem is getting enough lift
13:57<@Alberth>but you obviously have that when it flies :p
13:58<V453000>hi guys, does anybody remember how exactly should I use grfstrip? it tells me to give it input and output, that much is clear, but then it says [<depth> <zoom>]
13:58<Samu>i was thinking of something like ... making the big capacity planes accelerate slower than the lower capacity ones
13:58<V453000>how do I figure out the syntax and values it wants for the depth and zoom?
13:58<V453000>Rubidium: ? :)
13:58<Samu>depending always on how much is loaded, of course
13:59<V453000>also can I get 8bpp with EZ from grfstrip? aka remove only 32bpp x4 and 32bpp x1
13:59<@Alberth>V does -h work?
13:59<supermop_>samu - planes in game are pretty close to max speed by the time they are in the air
14:00-!-HerzogDeXtEr [~farci@dslb-188-106-019-050.188.106.pools.vodafone-ip.de] has joined #openttd
14:00-!-HerzogDeXtEr is "purple" on #openttd
14:00<@Alberth>V, right it does :p
14:00<supermop_>acceleration doesn't really have much gameplay effect for planes in game
14:01<Samu>wanted it to be much like how trains do
14:01<V453000>Alberth: yes but yeah it tells me that :)
14:01<supermop_>also, as Alberth says, so long as it can reach take off speed it flies
14:01<Samu>some engines take a long time to reach their maximum speed
14:02<supermop_>Samu: that's probably the wrong approach - acceleration is also fairly inconsequential for planes IRL
14:02<@Alberth>V depth looks like 32bpp 8bpp
14:02<@Alberth>zoom[] = { "normal", "zi4", "zi2", "zo2", "zo4", "zo8" };
14:02<supermop_>even heavy cargo plains will reach several hundred kmh in a few seconds
14:02<Samu>oh well, there goes my logic
14:03<supermop_>the biggest issue in 'balancing' weight of planes is rather how much fuel they burn
14:03<supermop_>heavy load = need more fuel to take off and fly
14:03<V453000>:D
14:04<supermop_>to a lesser extent (not important for openttd) heavy load = less weight allowance for fuel = less range
14:04<V453000>ok so I write grfstrip.exe BRIX.grf BRIX-8bpp.grf 32bpp zi4 ?
14:04<V453000>well it did something
14:04<@Alberth>something like that
14:04<V453000>ah so I tell what to keep
14:04<frosch123>i think grfstrip command line is broken
14:05<Samu>my own laws of physics differ from that of real world :(
14:05<Samu>keks
14:05<supermop_>Samu: if you want to do something that operates on the load of aircraft, it would be more logical to have running cost increase with load weight
14:05<frosch123>it misses some "i++"
14:05<supermop_>but planes in game (and most airliners IRL) pretty much always fly full
14:06<Samu>increased running costs, again
14:06<Samu>hmm
14:06<V453000>how do I tell if it also removed x1 8bpp from the grf ... it should never do that, right?
14:07<frosch123>yes, it won'T do that
14:07<frosch123>what resolutions do you have?
14:07<V453000>x1 x4
14:07<frosch123>8bpp 1x, 8bpp 4x, 32bpp 1x, 32bpp 4x, more?
14:07<frosch123>less?
14:07<V453000>it did keep x4 so it should work
14:07<V453000>8bpp x1, 8bpp x4, 32bpp x1, 32bpp x4
14:08<V453000>seems functional :) cool
14:08<V453000>thanks
14:08<supermop_>samu, i don't even know if aircraft in game have a power property
14:08<frosch123>so you want: grfstrip bla.grf bla-8bpp.grf 8bpp zi4
14:08<frosch123>but if will fail if you have more zoomlevels
14:08<frosch123>*it
14:09<V453000>ok, I won't :P
14:10<Samu>aircraft don't have weight, from what I can find
14:13<Samu>they have no power either
14:13-!-andythenorth [~andytheno@cpc87219-aztw31-2-0-cust178.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd
14:13-!-andythenorth is "andythenorth" on #openttd
14:14<Samu>only rail and road vehicles have weight
14:14<Samu>ships and aircraft don't have
14:14<andythenorth>no
14:14<andythenorth>I have wondered about ship physics
14:14<andythenorth>but I think it's negligible gain
14:17<frosch123>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pjasirl2o?/pjasirl2o <- fixes grfstrip to allow more than one additional format
14:18<frosch123>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pe46uito2?/pe46uito2 <- another return was missing
14:18<Samu>aircraft have image_index, cost_factor, running_cost, subtype, sfx, acceleration, max_speed, mail_capacity, passenger_capacity, max_range
14:19<Samu>no weight :(
14:19<Samu>not even air_drag
14:19<supermop_>samu: for the purposes of the game, there is no need to have those
14:20<supermop_>speed is determined by thrust, weight (somewhat) and drag (a lot)
14:20<supermop_>if it is important that plane 1 goes 300kmh and plane 2 goes 600 kmh
14:20-!-ProfFrink [~proffrink@84.51.144.184] has joined #openttd
14:20-!-ProfFrink is "Alan Blanchflower" on #tycoonexiles #openttd #tycoon
14:21<supermop_>there is not really much need to do something more complex than just giving what the final max speed should be
14:21<Samu>there is acceleration
14:22<Samu>will take a loog at acceleration
14:22<Samu>look*
14:22<supermop_>rather than trying to approximate drag and thrust such that the result is the speed you want
14:22<supermop_>acceleration is only really relevant when taking off
14:23<supermop_>and OpenTTD doesn't have or need airplanes that don't make it off the runway because they are overweight
14:24<supermop_>because again, the capacity is the max weight a plane can take off with
14:24<supermop_>a plane can't be too heavy to take off because it would be over capacity
14:25<supermop_>whether a plane needs half of the runway or all of the runway isn't really simulated by game
14:25<supermop_>you could make plane crashes at short runways dependant on plane weight - but the plane size property already handles that
14:26<Samu>plane crashing is too drastic for balancing... :(
14:27<Samu>i don't like the idea of crashing to make them fair
14:29-!-ToBeFree [uid51591@00019d36.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
14:35<supermop_>make what fair?
14:35<supermop_>what is unfair about planes? every player can buy them
14:36<supermop_>if you want to nerf particular planes, pretty much range, speed, and running costs are the only aspects that will have a noticeable effect relative to capacity
14:42-!-andythenorth [~andytheno@cpc87219-aztw31-2-0-cust178.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth]
14:42-!-oskari89 [oskari89@213-186-253-145.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd
14:42-!-oskari89 is "Oskari Kvist" on #openttd
14:43-!-sim-al2 is now known as Guest7274
14:43-!-sim-al2 [~sim-al2@108-221-157-231.lightspeed.mmphtn.sbcglobal.net] has joined #openttd
14:43-!-sim-al2 is "sim-al2" on #openttd @#/r/openttd
14:45-!-ToBeFree [uid51591@id-51591.tooting.irccloud.com] has joined #openttd
14:45-!-ToBeFree is "ToBeFree" on #openttd @#freiwuppertal #https-everywhere #oolite-dev #oolite-ger #oolite #tor #linux
14:46-!-Gustavo6046 [~Gustavo60@177.18.73.138] has joined #openttd
14:46-!-Gustavo6046 is "I open with sandwich!" on #openttd #ohnx @#gusbot #doom64ex
14:49-!-Guest7274 [~sim-al2@108-221-157-231.lightspeed.mmphtn.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:52-!-gelignite [~gelignite@x5ce33e86.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #openttd
14:52-!-gelignite is "gelignite" on #openttd #openttdcoop.devzone
15:14<@Alberth>latter looks good frosch123
15:15<@Alberth> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pe46uito2?/pe46uito2
15:15<frosch123>thanks for checking
15:16<@Alberth>hmm, perhaps also add texts for the parameters in the help?
15:17<@Alberth>avoid looking it up again from the source :p
15:17-!-ProfFrink is now known as Prof_Frink
15:17<frosch123>like names for zoom levels?
15:17<@Alberth>yes
15:54-!-sla_ro|master2 [~sla.ro@78.96.209.89] has quit []
16:04-!-quiznilo [~CC@pool-96-245-188-65.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.9.1]
16:04-!-quiznilo [~CC@pool-96-245-188-65.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd
16:04-!-quiznilo is "CC" on #openttd
16:09-!-tokai [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: c('~' )o]
16:10-!-quiznilo [~CC@pool-96-245-188-65.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.9.1]
16:11-!-Gja [~Martin@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has joined #openttd
16:11-!-Gja is "Martin" on #bcache #openttd
16:11-!-quiznilo [~CC@pool-96-245-188-65.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd
16:11-!-quiznilo is "CC" on #openttd
16:12<Samu>question, how did you come up with those base acceleration values in engines.h table?
16:12<Samu>18, 20, 35, 40, 50
16:15<V453000>666
16:17<Samu>let's make yate haugan acceleration = 5
16:17<Samu>see what happens lol
16:18<supermop_>Samu: certainly chris sawyer just made them up to feel right
16:20<Samu>hmm yate haugan acceleration is lower, hmm hmm :) but it's still a fixed amount
16:20<Samu>accelerates at the same rate
16:21<Samu>this game needs a realistic acceleration for aircraft? :p
16:21<supermop_>Samu: why?
16:22<supermop_>'realistic' would be almost instantaneous relative to other vehicles
16:22<Samu>okay, not that kind of realistic
16:23<supermop_>also you run the risk of then making only very very long flights desirable
16:23<supermop_>where aircraft already heavily favor long flights
16:23<Samu>was thinking of acceleration rate slowing down the closer it gets to max speed
16:24<Samu>yeah, i see
16:27-!-Breckett [~DDD@dslb-088-064-067-091.088.064.pools.vodafone-ip.de] has joined #openttd
16:27-!-Breckett is "Breckett" on #openttd #openttd.dev
16:28<supermop_>still though, a 747 flying 1000 tiles will spend more time at a high speed than a embraer 135 flying 50 tiles
16:36<Samu>with acceleration = 1
16:36<Samu>it took 676 tiles to reach max speed, on yate haugan
16:37<Samu>seems like for each x acceleration, the cur_speed increases x per tick
16:38<Samu>this is all interesting, but i'm not sure if this is what I want to do
16:38<supermop_>what do you want to do?
16:39-!-Mazur [~mazur@5ED2923C.cm-7-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:39<Samu>not sure if I really want to touch acceleration
16:40<Samu>if i want the more cargo loaded, the slower it accelerates
16:40<Samu>idea
16:41<supermop_>with aircraft, you cannot build more, or more powerful turbines for a given plane
16:41<supermop_>a plane will always have the same 'power' and the same capacity
16:42<Samu>what you're saying is that it's not how real physics work
16:44<Samu>major goal is profits
16:45<Samu>something that punts a dent on aircraft profits
16:45<Gustavo6046>The difference is the technology: Embraer, being from Brazil, automatically advantages from high technology index. Unfortunately my country is still poor.
16:46<Samu>the acceleration thing seems to only promote long long distances
16:46<supermop_>it is not like a train where the player makes a choice about the loading ratio compared to the motive power
16:46<supermop_>planes pretty much always fly at 100% loaded
16:47<V453000>Ah I guess musa needs python 2.6
16:47-!-Mazur [~mazur@5ED2923C.cm-7-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd
16:47-!-Mazur is "Stefan Linnemann" on #oolite #openttd #openttdcoop.stable #openttdcoop
16:47<supermop_>so there is no real reason to make planes that are 50% full cheaper or faster than planes that are 100% full
16:48<Samu>what about the opposite
16:49<Samu>place accelerates to max speed as it usually do, but then it loses speed if it travels too much
16:49-!-Alberth [~alberth@00015f9e.user.oftc.net] has left #openttd []
16:49<Samu>akin to my breakdown idea, but instead of breaking down, it decelerates gradually
16:50<Samu>plane accelerates* typo
16:51<Samu>something like... travel 500 tiles at max speed, then the rest, gradually slow down
16:52<Gustavo6046>Samu, aerodynamics boi
16:52<Samu>what?
16:52<Samu>sorry im noob
16:53<supermop_>Samu: what behavior do you want to affect
16:53<Samu>profits
16:53<supermop_>not effect, but affect
16:53<supermop_>what change in player behavior do you want to create
16:54<Samu>make them use aircraft without them being retardedly profitable
16:54<supermop_>profit is probably a weak motivator for many players then
16:55<Samu>hmm no one likes to use aircraft on competitive servers, i'd like to change this fact
16:55<supermop_>i never use aircraft because 1) it is boring, 2) plenty of occupation on other thing to ever get around to building airports
16:56<supermop_>3) often soon have plenty of money without aircraft, so don't need them for funing
16:56<supermop_>funding
16:56<Cubey>I think most people who play openttd are mostly interested in the trains
16:56<supermop_>so people are largely discouraged from using aircraft already
16:57<supermop_>profit is largely not interesting in the game
16:57<Cubey>Personally I find playing with the aircraft not very satisfying...not much challenge, nothing really interesting you can do with them
16:57<supermop_>if you are competing to move the most cargo, or to grow a city largest, aircraft do not provide much of a competitive advantage anyway
16:58<V453000>https://blog.openttdcoop.org/2017/10/23/brix-0-0-2-is-here/
16:58<V453000>=D
16:58<V453000>iz
16:58<supermop_>OpenTTD is difficult because it trying to approximate a scale where both trains and planes are applicable
16:59<Samu>infrastructure maintenance costs on aircraft are way too drastic for small maps
16:59<supermop_>Samu: the infrastructure cost was supposed to be a tool to balance out the profitability of aircraft
17:00<_dp_>I solved aircraft balance on our servers by disabling large aircrafts
17:00<_dp_>small ones are still decently profitable but loose to trains
17:00<Samu>my main issue is indeed the big planes
17:01<supermop_>aircraft ranges are another tool, but default will not have those
17:01<Samu>small planes, i noticed they're fine
17:01<supermop_>and again, bigger plane = bigger range
17:01<_dp_>range is weird
17:01<_dp_>and does nothing to balance profit
17:02<Samu>what do you think of this https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=76044
17:02<Samu>_dp_:
17:02<supermop_>_dp_: it was less to balance profit, more to just force some more consideration in route planning beyond 'build two airports as far apart as possible'
17:03<supermop_>in real life, a380 doesn't print money because people want certain flexibility in flights, so you cannot have every take off slot from LHR be an A380 to PVD every 2 minutes
17:04<supermop_>OpenTTD cannot provide that self-balancing
17:04<_dp_>there is a reasonable distance limit, you need fast income when starting
17:04<_dp_>it's like 1000 tiles but whatever)
17:05<Cubey>Any balance in openttd is opted-into by the user
17:05<supermop_>range also can only make sense for one map size
17:05<_dp_>Cubey, it doesn't work like that on competitive servers :p
17:06<supermop_>if you are playing a map of the UK at 4k^2, any range limit at all will not make sense
17:06<Cubey>That's why competition servers only reflect a very small subset of all the styles of gameplay used by players
17:06<supermop_>_dp_: i have never seen a competitive server i wanted to play on
17:07<Cubey>I see openttd as being in basically the same category as minecraft
17:07<Cubey>There are all sorts of games that can be played within the game
17:07<Cubey>Goal servers, city builder, etc.
17:08-!-tokai [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd
17:08-!-tokai is "Christian Rosentreter" on #openttd
17:08-!-mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ
17:08<Cubey>But there are many many more "non-game" ways to play the game
17:08<_dp_>supermop_, well, not everyone likes competitive play I know
17:08<Samu>I was medling with this idea... instead of promoting a breakdown aka limit speed to 321 km/h, make it gradually lose speed after x tiles
17:08<supermop_>i wouldn't mind competition
17:09<Samu>but it makes no sense, or yada yada...
17:09<Samu>I need ideas :(
17:09<supermop_>but servers always have things like, newgrf settings that make no sense, or no newgrfs at all
17:09-!-ToBeFree [uid51591@00019d36.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
17:09<supermop_>or no cdist, so passenger networks make no sense
17:09<supermop_>or very narrow goals
17:10<Cubey>There are no regularly operating servers that are configured remotely like how I have my single player
17:10<_dp_>among competitive ones I'm sure we have the best ones on CityMania xD
17:10<_dp_>cdist is like a gs of it's own, it's hard to combine it with any other goal
17:10<Cubey>It is strange to me how there are practically no servers with a moderate amount of newgrfs and the vanilla/stable version of the server
17:11<supermop_>Cubey: exactly
17:11<_dp_>It's very hard to configure vanilla
17:11<Samu>i only care about vanilla
17:11<supermop_>like a plain silicon valley GS with Firs and a nice train set would be fun and competitive
17:11<_dp_>newgrfs can at lest do something about gameplay
17:12<Cubey>I mean, the configs I use would never work for a multiplayer server, because I limit my behavior through choice rather than restrictive settings
17:12<Cubey>E.g. you could never leave the max station spread set to maximum on a public server, it would be abused too much
17:12<_dp_>well, you can set some rules about it
17:13<_dp_>but better to be coded ofc
17:13<_dp_>but sadly some things can't be coded so still need rules, mods, etc
17:13<Cubey>Even stuff like cargodist has problems
17:13<Cubey>Since cargo only appears with destinations that the network graph already knows are connected
17:14<Cubey>You can "game" the system by only building point to point routes
17:14<Cubey>There's no way to force players to build "realistic" routes under cargodist, it's just something they have to choose to do
17:15<supermop_>Cubey: exactly, in a city builder system, even with cdist on, you can set up your routes so it is only possible for any passenger in your network to get dumped at your city
17:16-!-Gja [~Martin@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has quit [Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com)]
17:16<Samu>i feel that i need to do something about aircraft :(
17:17<Cubey>And I don't see any of that as a problem, because I prefer open-ended sandbox-like games anyway
17:17<Cubey>And I think a lot of people who play simulation games do
17:17<_dp_>well, what's the point of cdist on competitive server then if it can be cheated anyway?
17:18<Samu>cargo dist, i rather call it cargo with personality
17:18<Samu>hi, I'm coal, and i want to go to that train, not this one
17:19<_dp_>and btw, there is no way to force players to build "realistic" because no one knows wtf does "realistic" mean in openttd :p
17:20<_dp_>everyone builds whatever he likes and calls it "realistic"
17:20<Cubey>Yeah that's true
17:20<Samu>:(
17:20<supermop_>_dp_: because building passenger networks without cdist is incredibly frustrating
17:21<V453000>+1 _dp_
17:21<Cubey>I'm working on some scripts to pull data from the GS API through the admin port and help me analyze my cargodist graph
17:22<_dp_>Samu, btw, as for breakdonws I think as long as they're random they're bs. I disabled breakdowns for planes where it matters (aka where it's a best way to start).
17:22<ST2>damn, and now that I'm out of popcorns :(
17:22<Samu>when i hear of cargo dist, i always think about how cargo is distributed to the nearby stations
17:22<Samu>so confusing
17:22<Cubey>But I'm realizing that even with access to a lot of information I can slice and dice, it's not immediately clear what my goal should even be
17:23<Samu>i prefer breakdowns enabled for aircraft, but aircraft crashes disabled
17:24<Samu>i just wish big planes couldn't just land on small airports
17:24<Samu>but oh well
17:26<supermop_>i once tried a polish GS that tried to control town growth by type of passenger service provided.
17:26<supermop_>was pretty nice
17:26<supermop_>encouraged growth in cities that were hubs of the network
17:27<Samu>ST2: give me ideas for aircraft
17:27<ST2>change the atendants :P
17:28<Samu>so ppl want to play with breakdowns disabled and aircraft
17:28<Samu>there goes my patch :(
17:28<supermop_>Samu: some people do
17:28<supermop_>some people never touch aircraft
17:28<ST2>actually, on SP people can play with the settings they want ^^
17:28<supermop_>aircraft breakdowns are weird as is
17:29<_dp_>oh, right, I meant crashes, but whatever, another random bs
17:29<Cubey>Yeah the default aircraft breakdown behavior never made any sense to me
17:29<_dp_>basically on competitive server it mean if crashed first year -> restart
17:29<ST2>MP servers, and specially the ones with goals, try to balance things to all cargo types/ways to trasnport it be more or less equal
17:29<Cubey>Crashes are a huge pain so I always disabled them, but at least that corresponds to something I can imagine actually happening
17:30<Samu>when it's disabled, noobs will use big planes on small airports... I wish they wouldn't do it
17:31<supermop_>ST2: i never understood 'balancing' like that though - if everything is balanced to be equivalent, what is the point of choosing any particular thing
17:31<ST2>exactly supermop :P
17:31<supermop_>it makes more sense for the game to have optimal uses for certain things
17:31<Cubey>There have been a number of proposed ideas in the past having to do with improving the layouts of airports and making a bigger difference in throughput for the larger layouts
17:31<ST2>it's where the human factor comes up
17:31<Cubey>Which would be a good reason to use the big ones instead of just whatever has the smallest footprint
17:31<Cubey>But none of that has ever made it in trunk
17:31<_dp_>Samu, usually it's pro's who do that not noobs, noobs buy big airports, one plane and go bankrupt :p
17:32<Wolf01>It's the blizzard syndrome
17:32<supermop_>rather than balancing so that for any route length there is no difference between a bus or a 747
17:33<_dp_>but as long as game balanced for it it's fine to do whatever
17:33<supermop_>Samu: i think "make the game harder for 'noobs' and easier for expects" is the opposite of balancing
17:33<_dp_>like, sure, big planes with small airports are the best start on our tropic cb blitz, so what?
17:33<Samu>a big airplane on a small aircraft always gets me on my nerves :(
17:33<Samu>small airport*
17:33<ST2>hire better pilots xD
17:34<Samu>if i disable aircraft crashes, they get away with it
17:34<supermop_>maybe they have thrust reversers
17:34<Samu>if i enable crashes, there may be accidental crashes early game, ruining it
17:34<supermop_>Samu: punishing players is probably not fun
17:35<_dp_>idk what ST2 means by balancing cargo, but for me balancing usually means don't let stupid shit to be the best way of doing smth xD
17:35<ST2>_dp_: touch� xD
17:36<Samu>like 2 airports in the 2 corners
17:36<Samu>and a plane
17:36<_dp_>yep, exactly xD
17:37<ST2>supermop_: you said don't like goal servers - probably never tried the one using BusyBee ^^
17:37<Samu>slowing them down past x tiles, goes against the idea of what aircraft is
17:37<ST2>and it's goal based to restart when goal is reached and get a new map, to new players join and build
17:37<_dp_>have you fixed your bb to not be a p2p truck fest?
17:37<supermop_>ST2: i sometimes play busy bee SP, its a bit too random for me
17:37<ST2>that's the magic of it xD
17:38<supermop_>_dp_: BB is always p2p biased
17:38<Samu>balancing cargo is making coal suck
17:38<_dp_>idk, I think with a lot of big goals it can favor networks or some sort
17:38<Samu>coal too stronk
17:38<supermop_>it is fun trying to rework a p2p train route to become a network as targets change in SP though
17:38<_dp_>like 100+ big
17:38<_dp_>*log
17:38<_dp_>*lot dammit
17:38-!-Breckett_ [~DDD@dslb-088-064-067-091.088.064.pools.vodafone-ip.de] has joined #openttd
17:38-!-Breckett_ is "Breckett" on #openttd
17:38<supermop_>but it would always be easier to spam trucks
17:39<supermop_>Samu: don't use default cargo
17:39<_dp_>coal is only good as a starting cargo
17:39<ST2>BB gets resumed to short tracks when cash income is stable
17:39<Cubey>"Balance" to me means that coal is stronker than most cargos because it also has no secondary
17:39-!-Breckett [~DDD@dslb-088-064-067-091.088.064.pools.vodafone-ip.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:39<supermop_>yeah
17:39<supermop_>in vanilla coal just goes to black hole at power plant
17:40<Samu>i compared coal to grain/livestock combo and I was a bit surprised by the results
17:40<supermop_>there is no other complex chain
17:40<Samu>they're equal
17:40<Samu>with the advantage of goods being produced
17:40-!-sim-al2 is now known as Guest7285
17:40-!-sim-al2 [~sim-al2@108-221-157-231.lightspeed.mmphtn.sbcglobal.net] has joined #openttd
17:40-!-sim-al2 is "sim-al2" on #openttd @#/r/openttd
17:41<_dp_>Samu, goods pay better than coal even if you don't count livestock
17:41<Cubey>So the farm->factory chain is actually well balanced with coal
17:41<_dp_>but iron ore chain is probably even better
17:42<_dp_>because of 3 steps
17:42<Samu>iron one feels disappointing
17:42<Cubey>That means more cost of overhead though
17:42<Samu>yeah, it has that potential, but still disappointing
17:42<Cubey>I tend to look at wood right away because it's almost as good as coal and also causes goods to be produced
17:43<_dp_>speaking of disappointing, if there decent cities pax beats everything :p
17:43<_dp_>or if cities are allowed to grow for that matter
17:46<_dp_>actually, why are we even theorizing about it, just check this: https://citymania.org/goal/1031/best-scores
17:46-!-Guest7285 [~sim-al2@108-221-157-231.lightspeed.mmphtn.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:47<ST2>btw _dp_: already got players complaining of this? https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=77042
17:47<_dp_>saber did it with pax mostly and goods iirc, da with goods, me with iron ore
17:47<_dp_>ST2, nah, no players - no complaints xD
17:47-!-gelignite [~gelignite@x5ce33e86.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Quit: I have always found that mercy bears richer fruits than strict justice.]
17:48<ST2>well, only happens with W10 with latest update
17:48<ST2>mine still not updated so, no self complaints xD
17:48<_dp_>and mine is not even windows xD
17:48<ST2>that's why I asked about players... not you :P
17:49<_dp_>psst, I have windows too, just don't tell anybody
17:49<ST2>secret kept ^^
17:49<_dp_>for mashinky xD
17:50<_dp_>and compiling cmclient ofc
17:50-!-sim-al2 [~sim-al2@108-221-157-231.lightspeed.mmphtn.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:00<_dp_>omg, brix evolved to something crazy since last time I checked it xD
18:04<_dp_>80 megs tho *sigh*
18:04<Wolf01>'night
18:04-!-Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.]
18:08<_dp_>V453000, how do I get both snow and sand in game like on reddit picture?
18:12<_dp_>oh, yeah, toyland replacement doesn't go well with it :(
18:12-!-oskari89 [oskari89@213-186-253-145.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit []
18:12<_dp_>and not just on toyland
18:13-!-Breckett_ [~DDD@dslb-088-064-067-091.088.064.pools.vodafone-ip.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend]
18:15<_dp_>signal selection is goofy
18:16<Eddi|zuHause>what reddit picture?
18:17<_dp_>Eddi|zuHause, https://www.reddit.com/r/openttd/comments/78au2v/brix_002_has_been_released/
18:19-!-HerzogDeXtEr [~farci@dslb-188-106-019-050.188.106.pools.vodafone-ip.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
18:21<_dp_>disabling tracks in grf settings also disables ground sprite for tracks and rivers
18:22<_dp_>am I mumbling too much?)
18:34<Gustavo6046>GUYS
18:34<Gustavo6046>IT WORKS
18:34<Gustavo6046>https://i.imgur.com/PufMfmw.png
18:34<Samu>i'm trying to fix something
18:35<Samu>when an aircraft breaks down, it currently goes from 2000 whatever km/h to 321 km/h instantly
18:35<Samu>i'm trying to make it gradually lose speed towards 321 km/h
18:35<Samu>smooth it
18:48-!-Wormnest [~Wormnest@s5596abd2.adsl.online.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
18:52<frosch123>ads for ad blockers are weird
19:05<Samu>looks like i did it, but... unsure if it's done the right way for implementation purposes
19:15<Samu>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pcsi29tuh
19:15<Samu>what u think
19:15<Samu>lines 24-28 are added
19:15<Samu>and i removed some, hmm let me post patch too
19:16<Samu>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pq65cf6fi
19:18-!-Progman [~progman@p548D9C0B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:48-!-Laedek [~quassel@24-113-145-42.wavecable.com] has quit [Quit: Laedek]
19:49-!-Laedek [~quassel@24-113-145-42.wavecable.com] has joined #openttd
19:49-!-Laedek is "Laedek" on #openttd
20:00<Samu>https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=77176 - new patch, discuss :p
20:01-!-Samu [~oftc-webi@pa4-84-91-142-34.netvisao.pt] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
20:15-!-sim-al2 [~sim-al2@108-221-157-231.lightspeed.mmphtn.sbcglobal.net] has joined #openttd
20:15-!-sim-al2 is "sim-al2" on #openttd @#/r/openttd
20:21-!-Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-137-142.natnow.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd
20:21-!-Supercheese is "Supercheese" on #openttd #openttdcoop.devzone +#openttd.dev
20:25-!-frosch123 [~frosch@00013ce7.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: be yourself, except: if you have the opportunity to be a unicorn, then be a unicorn]
20:26<Supercheese>Oho
20:26<Supercheese>there be brix
20:38-!-Flygon [~Flygon@124-148-158-195.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #openttd
20:38-!-Flygon is "Flygon" on #openttd
21:12-!-Gustavo6046 [~Gustavo60@177.18.73.138] has quit [Quit: yay]
21:24<Supercheese>water not animated :(
21:24<Supercheese>trees are sexy though
21:56-!-efess [~Efess@c-73-4-253-159.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has joined #openttd
21:56-!-efess is "afsd" on #openttdcoop #openttd #/r/openttd
22:02-!-glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Bye]
22:27-!-tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd
22:27-!-tokai|noir is "Christian Rosentreter" on #openttd
22:27-!-mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ
22:34-!-tokai [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:54-!-joseph222 [~joseph222@183.90.36.8] has joined #openttd
22:54-!-joseph222 is "Joseph Lee" on #openttd
22:56<joseph222>Hello world
22:57<supermop>yo
23:01-!-ToffeeYogurtPots [~ToffeeYog@8VQAAC67I.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
---Logclosed Tue Oct 24 00:00:02 2017