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#openttd IRC Logs for 2017-12-27

---Logopened Wed Dec 27 00:00:13 2017
---Daychanged Wed Dec 27 2017
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03:04<andythenorth>o/
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03:09<@Rubidium>aloha
03:13<andythenorth>hi Rubidium
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07:12<andythenorth>quiet
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08:41<Borg>yoo.. any devel around? I wanna share little cleanup patch
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09:05<LordAro>Borg: share it anyway, the channel is logged :p
09:05<Borg>yeah.. and it will get lost..
09:05<Borg>Ill wait..
09:05<Borg>anyway.. da fuck.. guys
09:06<Borg>I just upgraded from 1.6.1 to 1.7.2 and... geez.. those messages at Industries
09:06<Borg>Requires: xxx tons of core waiting
09:06<Borg>looks terrible..
09:06<LordAro>?
09:06<Borg>I really liked old messages, like: Cargo waiting to be proceseed: xxx tons of coal
09:06<Borg>looks much more clear to read..
09:07<Borg>LordAro: I talk about this: http://ds-1.ovh.uu3.net/tmp/reserves.png
09:07<Borg>this is from 1.6.1
09:08<Borg>really...
09:08<Borg>new messages look damn akward..
09:10<LordAro>burn rate? that looks like a newgrf
09:10<Borg>yeah..
09:10<Borg>this one yes.. but Cargo waiting to be processed is from OpenTTD internals
09:11<Borg>lets RTFS..
09:13<__ln__>Borg: you'll die of old age before you find a dev here who is willing to look at a patch and apply it
09:13<LordAro>:(
09:14<@Rubidium>__ln__: don't you mean that the devs have died of old age?
09:14<__ln__>not necessarily
09:14<Borg>arghh!!!!
09:15<Borg>STR_INDUSTRY_VIEW_WAITING_FOR_PROCESSING :{BLACK}Cargo waiting to be processed:
09:15<Borg>its 1.6
09:16<Borg>now its completly redesigned..
09:16<Borg>:((((
09:16<Borg>why.. why people always change good old things to new.. worse things!
09:17<LordAro>https://xkcd.com/1172/
09:17<@Rubidium>check the changelog and maybe see some reasoning for that change?
09:17<LordAro>that said, it's just wording, maybe it can be changed back to some extent
09:17<Borg>LordAro: seems not.. I changed lang files.. IDs are changed completly..
09:18<Borg>Rubidium: but please.. take a look at screen shot
09:18<Borg>and take a look at 1.7.2 and tell.. yourself
09:18<LordAro>i didn't say it wouldn't require *some* code changes
09:18<Borg>what looks and reads better..
09:18<frosch123>yep, 1.7.2 is better
09:18<Borg>frosch123: wording?
09:18<LordAro>Borg: for those not currently at a computer, can you give a 1.7.2 example?
09:18<Borg>LordAro: okey, Ill do screenshot..
09:19<Borg>hang on..
09:20<Borg>http://ds-1.ovh.uu3.net/tmp/reserves.png
09:20<Borg>http://ds-1.ovh.uu3.net/tmp/new_ind_text.png
09:20<Borg>1.6.1 vs 1.7.2
09:20<Borg>really.. 1.6.1 looks better here.. clean and readable
09:21<Borg>1.7.2 looks just bad..
09:21<frosch123>now try a different grf
09:21<Borg>its not NEWGRF dude!
09:21<frosch123>you use a grf with stockpiling
09:21<Borg>yeah
09:21<Borg>but those strings are from OpenTTD itself
09:21<frosch123>1.6.1 looks terrible for grfs without stockpiling
09:21<frosch123>that's why it was changed
09:22<Borg>really?
09:22<Borg>didnt noticed...
09:22<__ln__>*didn't notice
09:22<Borg>I played a lot.. w/o stockpiling
09:23<LordAro>"requires ... x amount waiting" does not read well at all, tbf
09:23<Borg>http://ds-1.ovh.uu3.net/tmp/openttd_borg.png
09:23<Borg>its 1.6.1 w/o stockpiling
09:23<__ln__>*it's
09:23<Borg>looks ok
09:23<frosch123>that's plain ottd, without newgrf
09:24<frosch123>try firs
09:24<Borg>frosch123: why should I?
09:24<Borg>it fixes those strings?
09:24<Borg>I doubt it..
09:25<Borg>LordAro: yeah.. they could make IF.. to display w/ or w/o stockpiling..
09:25<LordAro>"requires x y z \n n amount of x waiting"
09:25<LordAro>maybe
09:25<frosch123>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pafao1c2t <- that's the "design document" for the 1.7 change
09:25<frosch123>it changes the text to fit best in most scenarios
09:26<Borg>LordAro: nah.. old one was just perfect.. :) in my opinion.. longer introduction texts.. and all the info about cargo waiting.. w/o any unnecessary teksts
09:26<Borg>lets see
09:26<@Rubidium>Borg: to be honest, my last (auto) save is from early April 2015 so I'm not really in the loop anymore
09:26<LordAro>Rubidium: :((
09:27<frosch123>i agree that the screenshots to not match the design
09:27<frosch123>the cargo was supposed to be in front
09:27<Borg>frosch123: I have my own GRF
09:27<Borg>so.. second case here
09:28<Borg>and they match... just looks bad
09:28<Borg>oh well...
09:28<Borg>I wonder if I could compile OpenTTD myself...
09:28<Borg>is mingw supported?
09:29<LordAro>mhmm
09:29<LordAro>there's a probably outdated guide on the wiki
09:29<Borg>ah shit..
09:29<LordAro>i'd imagine it's a lot easier now that msys2 is a thing
09:29<Borg>hmm..
09:31<Borg>hmm...
09:32<Borg>but!!
09:33<Borg>I see easier solution :>
09:33<frosch123>use 0.6.0?
09:33<Borg>changing lang file
09:33<Borg>should work..
09:33<Borg>STR_INDUSTRY_VIEW_REQUIRES :{BLACK}Requires
09:33<Borg>STR_INDUSTRY_VIEW_ACCEPT_CARGO :{YELLOW}{STRING}
09:33<Borg>STR_INDUSTRY_VIEW_ACCEPT_CARGO_AMOUNT :{YELLOW}{CARGO_LONG} {BLACK}waiting
09:34<Borg>what is used to convert .txt to .lng ?
09:34<Borg>hex editing .lng is probably not good idea
09:34<Borg>frosch123: haha, very funny ;P
09:34<Borg>1189360 Jan 24 2005 openttd-0.3.5-win32.zip
09:35<Borg>frosch123: ;P
09:35<frosch123>that version does not have that text
09:35<Borg>yeah. but its oldest one I have
09:36<__ln__>Borg: *it's the oldest
09:40<Borg>lets try
09:40<Borg>I already compiled 1.7.2 dedicated server
09:40<Borg>and lang files are there ;)
09:41<Flygon>Borg?
09:41<Flygon>Sounds Swedish.
09:41<Borg>hehe.. but I am not :) just nickname
09:41<Flygon>I gotta go soon, but...
09:41<Flygon>Tell Seven I said Hi. :3
09:42*Flygon re-lurks
09:42<frosch123>is that a startrek quote?
09:42<__ln__>indeed it is
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09:46<Borg>yes!!!!!! fixed :D
09:46<Borg>editing english_US.lng did the trick :D
09:46<Borg>muahuah... now im happy
09:47<Borg>frosch123: yeah.. Startrek.. BORG is interesting specie...
09:48<__ln__>but "Sounds Swedish" is also a star trek quote
09:48<Borg>__ln__: yeah, especialy when we speak about 7of9 ;D
09:48<Borg>I love the part when she asked Enson Kim: take off your cloths.. :D
09:50<Borg>frosch123: still, I think they should rethink reasoning of changing that Cargo strings in industries...
09:50<Borg>anyway.. fixed...
09:51<Borg>and as for patch.. nothing serious... more guards for NO_DEBUG_MESSAGES
09:51<Borg>few places lacks it..
09:52<Flygon>(I would've preferred the other version of the scene where she laughs for the first time. But, alas, they didn't film it. They went with the Copulation Scene instead. @_@)
09:53<Borg>;)
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10:23<Borg>LOL wait
10:24<Borg>frosch123: is actually right!
10:24<Borg>I didnt noticed it at first
10:24<Borg>it just doesnt match any of the "design document"
10:24<Borg>but nevermind....
10:24<Borg>anyway.. I cant compile OpenTTD myself.. because MSYS2 cannot be installed on WinXP..
10:24<Borg>no luck..
10:42<Samu>hi
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10:43<Samu>i'm testing this https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=77335
10:44<Samu>McZappkie post here?
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10:50<LordAro>Borg: ...you're on XP?
10:50<LordAro>fix, immediately
10:52<Borg>why?
10:52<Borg>works fine..
10:52<Borg>okey I made final lang fix...
10:52<Borg>"Requires" -> "Cargo input:"
10:52<LordAro>it's really not fine any more
10:53<Borg>looks good for stockpiled and normal industries
10:53<LordAro>many many security vulnerabilities that are not being fixed any more
10:53<Borg>haha..
10:53<LordAro>it's been end of life for 3 years
10:53<Borg>u think your precious Win10 is safe?
10:53<LordAro>safer
10:53<Borg>of course...
10:53<Borg>actually.. im on Win2003
10:53<Borg>but.. not much difference :>
10:53<LordAro>...no
10:53<Samu>tfw when your best ai crashes due to excessive cpu evaluator crap.... https://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=200718
10:54<LordAro>heh
10:55<Borg>okey! im set :)
10:55<Borg>1.7.2 dedicated server compiled..
10:55<Borg>my NewGRF seems to work fine..
10:55<Borg>time to play
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11:11<Borg>http://ds-1.ovh.uu3.net/tmp/borg_ind_text.png
11:11<Borg>best solution.. I came with... ;)
11:14<Samu>burn rate?
11:15<Borg>yeah.. ;) no production.. except electricity and heat ;) so.. I had to make indicator..
11:16<Samu>aren't GS's supposed to deal with industries?
11:17<Borg>in what sense? GS can spawn new.. or remove industries..
11:17<Borg>check some things.. but cannot alter productions
11:18<Samu>oh
11:19<Samu>hmm and what about towns?
11:22<Borg>they are consumers... cant think of indicators for them..
11:22<Borg>but Im thinking about changing how banks works..
11:22<Borg>they production should be related to City size..
11:22<Borg>I think I will code that later
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11:44<andythenorth>o/
11:45<RafiX>o/
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11:54<Samu>it took 15 years for trAIns to build
11:54<Samu>on a relatively simple map
11:54<Samu>5000 ops seems low for some ais
12:10<LordAro>trains is special
12:10<LordAro>it spends an awful lot of time getting the route right
12:11<LordAro>it was literally someone's masters project, iirc
12:12<Borg>:>
12:12<Borg>RafiX: yoooo ;)
12:12<Borg>RafiX: still cant join servers? ;)
12:13<Borg>I compiled 1.7.2 today...
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12:22<RafiX>Borg: yeah, still dial-up
12:30<Borg>crap... ;/
12:30<RafiX>well yeah
12:31<RafiX>maybe it will get better
12:35<Borg>ufff. converted everything to monorail..
12:35<Borg>took a while
12:35<Borg>operating profit went 50% down..
12:35<Borg>now production needs to adjust again.. itself
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12:35<RafiX>I haven't touched openttd for like week or two
12:36<Borg>uh :)
12:36<Borg>I yesterday finished my simple GRF...
12:36<RafiX>I must play some
12:36<Borg>yeah!
12:36<Borg>should I create server?
12:36<Borg>for test?
12:37<Borg>its more fun to play w/ someone
12:37<RafiX>hmm, I need to go in like 30 minutes..
12:37<Borg>ok
12:37<RafiX>I don't want to risk being late because I got sucked in
12:37<Borg>;)
12:38<RafiX>I remember years ago when I overslept to school because I was playing OpenTTD with my friend till like 2 or 3 AM
12:38<Borg>hehe. I know the pain
12:39<Borg>I yesterday got sucked in... finishmy mew GRF..
12:39<Borg>and went sleep late :)
12:39<RafiX>I got sucked in Mount & Blade recently
12:40<RafiX>and I'm scared because I will get Wii and PS3 this week
12:41<Borg>;)
12:42<RafiX>got some money for christmas and decided to catch up with some newer games
12:51<Borg>hmm 4k goods production.. we hit first threshold... we need more 26 good carts trainz..
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12:52<Wolf01>o/
13:11<Samu>Think globally, act locally
13:11<Samu>towns don't get higher than 1700 population, what's wrong?
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13:15<Borg>Samu: what climate?
13:15<Samu>temperate
13:15<Borg>huh. weird
13:15<Borg>I have exacly oposite problem.. damn towns grow too much ;)
13:16<Samu>have you tried this gs?
13:16<Borg>aaaaah :D no
13:17<Samu>maybe it needs to deliver mail? it only requests 80% passengers
13:17<Samu>some towns match that criteria and yet, they don't grow
13:17<Samu>Passengers & Mail last month: 95% / 80%
13:18<Samu>@calc 209/280
13:18<@DorpsGek>Samu: 0.746428571429
13:18<Samu>@calc (209+22)/280
13:18<@DorpsGek>Samu: 0.825
13:18<Samu>uh, how does he calculate 95%?
13:19<Samu>syntrans is using large airplanes on small airports :(
13:21<Samu>101%
13:21<Borg>;)
13:21<Samu>how can it go over 100% :(
13:21<Samu>i fail at undestanding this
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13:31<Samu>syntrans and fastptpai have the same author?
13:31<Samu>interesting
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13:34<andythenorth>frosch123: GroundTypes and DecorationTypes? o_O
13:35<Borg>oh I think I found a bug :)
13:35<Borg>when using stockpiling and recesion
13:35<andythenorth>?
13:36<Borg>factories eating my resources.. but output is reduced..
13:36<Borg>I have production CB
13:36<Borg>well.. we can say that ppl steal goods in recessions ;) minor glitch
13:37<andythenorth>sounds like production multiplier is used somehow
13:37<andythenorth>bad newgrf?
13:37<Borg>I checked sources.. and recession is handlign after production.. on cargo distribution stage.
13:37<Borg>it should be rather done on production CBs (production tickrate)
13:37<Borg>in my opinion
13:38<andythenorth>what is recession?
13:38<Borg>I play w/ smooth_economy=off
13:38<Borg>and recession randomly happens.. halfing all productions..
13:38<andythenorth>I play with it on, although I've been told not to :)
13:38<Borg>I dont like smooth_economy... too much small changes.. cant react on them..
13:38<frosch123>andythenorth: someone tm complained about the new industry gui
13:39<Borg>on normal. its fun to see news w/ 50% down or 100% up.. I can add trains.. etc
13:39<andythenorth>they did frosch123? o_O
13:39<andythenorth>was it alberth?
13:39<frosch123>http://ds-1.ovh.uu3.net/tmp/new_ind_text.png <- borg says the wording is wrong
13:40<frosch123>"requires xxx waiting" ENoEnglish or so
13:40<Borg>well, looks bad indeed :)
13:40<Borg>I managed to fix it via lang files myself..
13:40<Borg>http://ds-1.ovh.uu3.net/tmp/borg_ind_text.png
13:40<frosch123>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pafao1c2t <- that's the paste i found, it has "requires xxx: yyy waiting"
13:40<andythenorth>Waiting: xxx (required)
13:41<frosch123>it can only be one headline, iirc the lines can be mied
13:41<frosch123>*mixed
13:41<frosch123>so we need one headline to rule them all
13:44<Samu>simpleai airport location choice is really bad
13:44<Samu>i dont remember it being this bad
13:45<andythenorth>I thought we were moving the 'xxx t'
13:45<andythenorth>so it was 'xxx t waiting'
13:45<andythenorth>'Requires' is historically consistent and no reason to change it
13:45<andythenorth>stockpiling is not even a BAD FEATURE
13:45<andythenorth>so eh
13:45<frosch123>i think it's about putting a pointation character between "requires" and "waiting"
13:46<Borg>andythenorth: in 1.6.1 it was nicely done in my opinion... via if..
13:46<Borg>when no stockpiling.. it said Requires:
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13:46<Borg>when stockpiling: Cargo waiting to be processed:
13:46<Borg>looked good..
13:46<andythenorth>the colour change between 'amount cargo / waiting
13:46<andythenorth>makes no sense
13:46<andythenorth>and 'Cargo waiting to be processed' made no sense
13:46<andythenorth>for the common case
13:46<Borg>andythenorth: why?
13:47<Borg>it was displayed like that *only* when stockpiling
13:47<andythenorth>no it wasn't :)
13:47<Borg>huh? really?
13:47<andythenorth>it's a good example of distorting the game to support a specific niche gameplay idea
13:47<andythenorth>that happened a lot :)
13:47<Borg>andythenorth: ahh you speak about early versions? I am comparing 1.6.1 vs 1.7.2
13:47<andythenorth>yes
13:47<Borg>ok
13:48<andythenorth>1.6.1 was broken
13:48<andythenorth>as were many versions before ;)
13:48<andythenorth>The most important information is what the industry requires
13:48<andythenorth>not how much is waiting to be processed, which is 0 in the common case
13:48<Borg>haha :D I know that.. current.. is like: my greatest work has been completed! and then. you find another thing to fix/improve ;)
13:49<Borg>andythenorth: oh well.. it depends on... GRF.. I recently started playing w/ stockpiling.. and I really liked it..
13:49<Borg>andythenorth: can u accept patches as well?
13:50<Borg>I have simple cleanup patch.. for NO_DEBUG_MESSAGES
13:50<Borg>few places lack guard for it..
13:50<andythenorth>I can't commit to trunk
13:50<andythenorth>for reasons
13:50<Borg>hmm too bad..
13:51<Borg>andythenorth: and how about my Cargo input: thingie?
13:51<andythenorth>it doesn't say what the industry requires
13:51<Borg>Its best what I could figure out to handle both basic requirements and stockpiling ;)
13:51<andythenorth>it says what you delivered
13:51<Borg>well.. Cargo input: means.. what it requires... for me at least..
13:52<Borg>but it could get weird in translations I belive..
13:52<andythenorth>I read it as "what's been delivered historically"
13:52<andythenorth>input is stuff that's arrived
13:52<Borg>oh.. weird..
13:52<andythenorth>'Requires' is consistent with default game :D
13:52<Borg>well.. Input.. is input.. for ppl w/ programing in mind... its what you need to feed :) to get output
13:52<Samu>stuff that arrived is clearer to me
13:52<Borg>andythenorth: I agree with that... its best
13:53<Borg>but as I said.. in 1.6.1 it was nicely done via if..
13:53<Borg>no stockpilling, said "Requires: "
13:53<andythenorth>no
13:53<andythenorth>it said "Cargo waiting to be processed"
13:53<Borg>w/ stockpiling.. headline messages was changed to "Cargo waiting to be processed: "
13:53<Borg>andythenorth: can u tell in what case?
13:53<andythenorth>it was the source of multiple FIRS bug reports
13:53<Borg>because I had 1.6.1 few hours ago..
13:53<Borg>ahhh wait!
13:54<Borg>so GRF problem..
13:54<Borg>FIRS use production CB?
13:54<andythenorth>yes
13:54<Borg>but no stockpiling?
13:54<andythenorth>stockpiling isn't a thing
13:54<andythenorth>it's grf-specific
13:54<Borg>I know
13:54<Borg>production CB is.. thats what if used there
13:54<andythenorth>yes
13:54<Borg>okey ;) U have tought one to fix then ;D
13:54<Borg>good luck..
13:55<Borg>im happy w/ my lang hack :D
13:55<andythenorth>if it could be conditionally titled, likely frosch123 would have done that
13:55<andythenorth>I tend to defer to frosch123
13:55<Borg>well
13:55<Borg>u need extra industry flag ;D
13:56<Borg>lets see newgrf specs
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13:56<Borg>special industry flags
13:56<Borg>plenty of bits left :D
13:56<Borg>u can add extra flag.. industry using stockpiling or not ;)
13:57<Borg>and tada.. u can have if.. to display cargo waiting or not waiting
13:57<Borg>FIRS dude will addapt quickly
13:57<Borg>;)
13:57<frosch123>that flag already exists
13:58<frosch123>but it is a per-input-cargo flag, not a per-industry flag
13:58<andythenorth>FIRS doesn't display cargo waiting
13:58<andythenorth>it just displays 'required [cargos]
13:58<frosch123>so you can change the layout of each line, but there can only be one headline
13:58<Borg>frosch123: but we need industry flag for this!
13:58<frosch123>i don't :p
13:59<Borg>well.. other solution is to add new callback.. but its worst solution.. or wait
13:59<Borg>CB flag.. lets see specs
13:59<Samu>Requires, Stockpilled, Produces
13:59<frosch123>you do not need a new flag
13:59<andythenorth>what's the issue?
14:00<andythenorth>other than the weird formatting of the 'waiting' lines?
14:00<Borg>andythenorth: headline is wrong imo
14:00<andythenorth>headline is what's required
14:00<andythenorth>how else does player know requirements? :)
14:00<Borg>if you have stockpiling.. that Requires.... xxx coal waiting.. looks weird
14:00<andythenorth>that's because stockpiling is broken :)
14:00<andythenorth>it's a silly idea
14:00<Borg>its not!
14:00<frosch123>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pafao1c2t <- again, does the old proposal fix it?
14:00<Borg>lets see
14:01<Borg>frosch123: yeah, looks acceptable
14:01<Samu>ECS: (0000 - 03ff) Requires Livestock: 10 items waiting (300 max) Grain: 20 tons waiting (200 max)
14:01<Borg>also add that damn ':'
14:01<Borg>after requires
14:01<Samu>i like the ECS approach more
14:02<Borg>Samu: but ECS suplies that extra info about max
14:02<Samu>instead of "waiting", isn't it supposed to be "queued"? or
14:02<andythenorth>the colon is weirdly inconsistent
14:02<Borg>andythenorth: really? I see oposite :D
14:02<Samu>"waiting" = "stockpilled"?
14:02<Samu>what is the behaviour there?
14:02<Borg>noo.. waiting is good..
14:02<Borg>at least to me
14:03<Borg>queued and stockpilled will look weird
14:03<frosch123>4th case could use ":" instead of "( )"
14:03<Borg>https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pafao1c2t <- this one I like..
14:03<frosch123>hmm, but that is actually a grf decision
14:03<Borg>just add ':' after Requires
14:03<Borg>and we all happy
14:03<Borg>;)
14:04<andythenorth>'Production last month:' has :
14:04<Borg>of course
14:04<Borg>its everywhere
14:04<Borg>and it looks good
14:04<andythenorth>+1
14:04<Borg>it just informs u about list..
14:04<andythenorth>so all this is resolved by adding ':' to one string? o-O
14:04<Borg>andythenorth: no
14:04<Borg>look at screen shot
14:04<frosch123>so, only add ":" to require? or also to waiting lines?
14:05<Borg>you need to fix lang files
14:05<Samu>the waiting is a bit confusing, misleading for me
14:05<Borg>http://ds-1.ovh.uu3.net/tmp/new_ind_text.png
14:05<Borg>Samu: its on stockpilling.. whats misleading dammit? :D
14:05<Borg>it WAITs for being processed..
14:06<Borg>stockpilled.. means.. wait for whatever..
14:06<Borg>maybe for nuclear war
14:06<Borg>but wait.. means it will not sit there and wait forever.. it will be processed soon
14:06<LordAro>"Requires: ... cargo (x amount waiting)" would be better, imo
14:06<Samu>Requires livestock: 10 tonnes waiting, seems like it's waiting for 10 tonnes of livestock to arrive :p
14:06<Borg>andythenorth: it needs to look like on paste... 'Requires:\n Coal: 324 tonnes waiting'
14:07<Borg>Samu: english isnt your native?
14:07<LordAro>i'm with Samu on this
14:07<Borg>Samu: for that case.. it would look like this: 'waiting for 10 tonnes of coal'
14:08<Borg>LordAro: yeah this one looks good: 'Requires:\n Coal (10 tonnes waiting)'
14:08<Borg>too :)
14:08<Borg>but then u have problem w/ max values..
14:09<Borg>add it after ',' ?
14:09<Borg>like: 'Requires:\n Coal (10 tonnes waiting, Max: 50)' ?
14:09<Borg>dunno.. :)
14:09<Samu>Requires: Coal
14:10<frosch123>LordAro: additional ( ) fail in case 3
14:10<Samu>Currently stored: 10 / 50 tonnes of Coal
14:10<LordAro>ooh, yes
14:10<LordAro>^
14:10<frosch123> the " (300 max)" is from the grf, and cannot be changed
14:10<LordAro>ah
14:10<LordAro>fix the grfs :p
14:11<Borg>so go for Livestock: 10 items waiting
14:11<Borg>and add optional () to it.. looks good too
14:12<LordAro>seems reasonable
14:12<Borg>damn recession... ate my all stockpilled cargos...
14:12<Borg>produced nothing...
14:12<Borg>I would fix that too :)
14:13<frosch123>disable recession
14:13<Borg>nah.. its fun
14:13<Borg>random event..
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14:13<Borg>but implementation is broken :) for stockpiling of course
14:13<frosch123>i doubt a recession lets stockpiles grow just under the sun
14:14<Borg>hehe of course
14:14<frosch123>you can either steal cargo on input side or on output side
14:14<Borg>but current, this happens..
14:14<Borg>production CB is called.. stuff gets used. and we produce output..
14:15<Borg>now.. we go to DistributeCargo() function.. and here.. recession is handled.. doing 50% reduction on cargo distribution..
14:15<Borg>so.. we used X stuff.. produced Y.. but delivered Y/2
14:15<Borg>it could be better to just call production function or callback /2 when recession
14:15<Borg>more consistent
14:15<Borg>:)
14:17<Borg>its called every 256ticks right? around 8 times per months..
14:17<Borg>recession? call it every 512 ;)
14:17<Borg>s/months/month/
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14:19<andythenorth>who are these people who have hard drive crashes?
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14:20<@Rubidium>andythenorth: statistics? those with lots of hard drives?
14:20<andythenorth>I have lost lots of hard drives
14:21<andythenorth>but so far, not a lot of data
14:21<andythenorth>some, but not much
14:21<andythenorth>frosch123 any interest in a NewNewStations spec? o_O :P
14:23<@Rubidium>andythenorth: why not start with newnewgrf?
14:25<andythenorth>I thought you were working on that already Rubidium :)
14:25<andythenorth>apologies if I'm wrong
14:25<@Rubidium>no, the things I'm working on is too real for that
14:34<andythenorth>RL trains?
14:35<@Rubidium>yup
14:41<V453000>we got another set of lego duplo, total network right now
14:41<V453000>need moar junctionz per usual but yarrrr
14:41<andythenorth>duplo trains?
14:41<andythenorth>https://shop.lego.com/en-GB/Deluxe-Train-Set-10508?CMP=KAC-SAHCSEU8&HQS=10508&ef_id=WNUfdAAAABP8Fa7F%3A20171227194149%3As&s_kwcid=AL%21933%213%21104878546230%21%21%21g%21375299985993%21
14:41<andythenorth>?
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14:42<V453000>yeah that's our latest addition
14:42<frosch123>andythenorth: what are decoration types?
14:42<andythenorth>buildings and stuff
14:42<V453000>I was surprised that this deluxe box doesn't have any switchers
14:42<frosch123>so, newobjects?
14:42<andythenorth>choose ground, choose decoration
14:42<V453000>bastards want you to buy as many boxes as possible
14:42<andythenorth>yes newobjects, except split from ground
14:42<V453000>well they're winning that battle
14:43<LordAro>Rubidium: https://www.backblaze.com/blog/hard-drive-failure-rates-q3-2017/
14:43<frosch123>i have no hdd anymore, i am more interested in ssd failure rates
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14:44<frosch123>but i guess they correlate with psu failure rates
14:45<andythenorth>V453000 we skipped duplo trains
14:45<andythenorth>got enough duplo :P
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14:45<V453000>gotta start early enough
14:46<V453000>and it's still a female so chances are that things will go wrong later and she won't appreciate normal (lego) trains as much :P
14:47<frosch123>LordAro: why does the seagate 4tb one perform so bad? does it have a higher rpm?
14:48<frosch123>oh, text says "consumer" vs "enterprise"
14:50<frosch123>V453000: stop playing trains, say "trains are for girls", and tell your wife to play trains instrad
14:51<V453000>XD
14:51<andythenorth>play tanks
14:51<@Rubidium>just blame her father for a mistake in her upbringing
14:52<LordAro>frosch123: also, seagate sucks a bit
14:53<RafiX>WD is probably the best HDD manufacturer
14:53<RafiX>but I heard that Seagate makes good SSHD
14:54<frosch123>LordAro: i believe those things change over year. all hdd which broke down in my family were WD, while the rest survived
14:54<frosch123>but all those WD failures were late 90s
14:55<@Rubidium>RafiX: from the backblaze thing: the worst HGST disk is better than the best WD disk
14:56<LordAro>true enough, it's never an absolute
14:56<RafiX>well I never cared so much because I never had a brand new HDD
14:56<LordAro>i've got some harddrives that the power on time has overflowed
14:56<RafiX>and those I have currently have had been used by me for like 2 or more years
14:57<LordAro>frosch123: https://www.extremetech.com/computing/201064-which-ssds-are-the-most-reliable-massive-study-sheds-some-light is a bit dated, but i usually go back to it
14:57<V453000>btw frosch123 I finally managed to resolve my pushing problems to https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/part/repository ... if you could please please please have a look at why don't my trains draw in layers, it would greatly help me progress, I'm stuck and I have no idea what to fix with it :( there should be everything necessary to build the grf in the repo, important parts are in NML and gfx folders, rest is files for making the graphics
14:58<frosch123>bad timing, i leave tomorrow morning for a week
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14:59<V453000>can wait :) enough work on graphics :P
14:59<V453000>it's been stale for the last 2 weeks, so ... :)
15:00<frosch123>what was the pushing problem?
15:00<frosch123>or rather its solution?
15:01<V453000>I was probably pushing some bad files like .grf
15:02<V453000>and hg complained a lot
15:02<V453000>so I ended up making a backup, deleting the repo and cloning a new empty repository + re-pasting the files there, and carefully committing, and setting up hgignore properly
15:02<frosch123>ah, the hooks
15:02<V453000>I wasn't sure if .bat things are an issue as well, but seems fine
15:03<V453000>yes something with hooks it said
15:03<V453000>unfortunately not hookers
15:03<V453000>but I called it something along those lines afterwards in return
15:05<V453000>there is probably a similar issue with BRIX
15:05<V453000>I will fix it later because that's a shitload of files
15:05<V453000>but yeah I need to pay a bit more attention to it instead of doing "commit all, push, run"
15:19<frosch123>V453000: stop putting a space after the ":" in lang files :)
15:19<V453000>valid point :)
15:20<V453000>fixed
15:20<Wolf01>Oh, hi V
15:20<Wolf01>F is fucking my mind
15:21<Wolf01>21 hours in 3 days
15:21<Wolf01>No, 24
15:22<V453000>not bad but that's just a full time job? :P
15:26<frosch123>V453000: https://paste.openttdcoop.org/prouvurzx?/prouvurzx <- it can be that easy :p
15:27<V453000>:D
15:28<V453000>well damn, it was! :D
15:28<V453000>thank you very much frosch123, you saved me once again
15:29<V453000>sick :>
15:30<frosch123>damn... colors
15:30<V453000>I might need to figure out a way which changes the order of layering based on orientation but for now it will be enough :)
15:31<V453000>colors?
15:31<frosch123>industry gui
15:31<V453000>:d
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16:28<Borg>haha. funny harddisk talk
16:29<RafiX>consoles talk time then|
16:29<RafiX>?*
16:29<Borg>guys.. are you writing like 10MB/s avarage 24/7 to your hdd?
16:29<Borg>I like shitloads of HDDs...
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16:29<Borg>like from 1.2GB to 1TB
16:29<RafiX>well maybe they're data hoarders
16:29<Borg>and I had one disk failure so far.. on server, uptime 2200 days
16:30<RafiX>damn
16:30<Borg>disk started to had sector read errors
16:30<Borg>but... this server worked on suboptimal envinromnemt... HDD temp was high.. 40 45 deg..
16:31<Borg>so.. if you are not killing your HDD w/ writes.. most stuff will do...
16:31<Borg>but true is.. WD or Seagate.. same shit in quality..
16:32<Borg>HGST disk are good indeed..
16:32<RafiX>damn, those scrambled eggs are spicy
16:32<Borg>but as I said.. I care when I had constant write environment.. like DFS.. Object Storage.. VMs..
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16:55<@DorpsGek>Commit by frosch :: r27952 /trunk/src (industry_gui.cpp lang/english.txt) (2017-12-27 22:54:52 +0100 )
16:55<@DorpsGek>-Change: Reword texts in industry view, when stockpiling is used.
16:55<@DorpsGek>Commit by frosch :: r27953 /trunk/src/lang (30 files) (2017-12-27 22:55:30 +0100 )
16:55<@DorpsGek>-Cleanup: Adjust other languages for r27952
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16:56<frosch123>yay, regex
16:56<Samu>oh noes, a patch
16:56<andythenorth>power outages destroy tank game :P
16:56<andythenorth>nvm
16:57<frosch123>meta strategies
16:57<frosch123>are you playing your neighbour?
16:58<+glx>oh no, I have translations to fix
16:59<frosch123>really?
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17:00<andythenorth>such bed
17:00<frosch123>hmm, eints failed to get r27953?
17:01<andythenorth>no frosch123 for a bit then?
17:01<frosch123>yep, no frosch till next year
17:01<andythenorth>a whole yar
17:01<andythenorth>year *
17:02<frosch123>why did eints fail... :/
17:03<LordAro>oh no
17:04<andythenorth>power blips have set house alarms off :|
17:04<andythenorth>very annoying
17:04<andythenorth>not mine
17:04<frosch123>committed too fast or something
17:04<+glx>frosch123: anyway a space was missing before ":" in french ;)
17:04<frosch123>eints still has the old wokring copy
17:05<frosch123>oh, french puts NBSP there
17:05<+glx>yup
17:06<frosch123>well, my regex did not account for that :p
17:06<andythenorth>good luck :)
17:06<andythenorth>have fun
17:06<andythenorth>see you in a year
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17:08<@DorpsGek>Commit by frosch :: r27954 trunk/src/fileio.cpp (2017-12-27 23:07:59 +0100 )
17:08<@DorpsGek>-Cleanup [FS#6644]: Remove unused function (M3Henry)
17:08<frosch123>it's always good to have some fs task around to fix eints :p
17:09<frosch123>glx: you may have to change the translation again
17:10<+glx>:)
17:10<frosch123>STR_INDUSTRY_VIEW_ACCEPT_CARGO_AMOUNT
17:11<+glx>I was on it but decided to return to main page first
17:14<+glx>both fixed
17:22<Wolf01>Bah, more than 100 construction robots stuck somewhere because they chose the short path and they don't have enough charge to get near another roboport, so they start from the latest one and continue to go back to it to recharge
17:26<Wolf01>'night
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17:43<Samu>hmm fixing bugs
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---Logclosed Thu Dec 28 00:00:24 2017