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#openttd IRC Logs for 2018-03-07

---Logopened Wed Mar 07 00:00:36 2018
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10:17<supermop_work_>apparently my RV set has a bug whereby it disables default vehicles as intended....
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10:59<Eddi|zuHause>your bug is that it works as intended? that is a really tricky one to solve
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11:04<Eddi|zuHause>so my current working theory is that somebody directly involved with valve tried out portal 2 on some supercomputer cloud thingie for "testing", and then they had to fix the bug to get it working
11:05<LordAro>Eddi|zuHause: "the bug"?
11:05<Eddi|zuHause>the bug. of the last portal 2 patch
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11:28<Eddi|zuHause>don't have steam running right now
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12:06<supermop_work_>i have steam very loudly running out of a radiator valve in my office right now
12:09<Eddi|zuHause>that sounds fun
12:10<Eddi|zuHause>just pretend you're at a train station and you're watching an old steam engine
12:23<supermop_work_>sometimes you try to add easter eggs to names, and someone demands that you instead use the original vehicle names
12:23<supermop_work_>forcing you to spoil the joke
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12:31<supermop_work_>yo frosch123
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12:43<supermop_work_>yo andythenorth
12:43<andythenorth>supermop_work_: what time span does MGNRTRV cover?
12:43<andythenorth>1850-2050 or something?
12:43<supermop_work_>but mostly 1900-2000
12:44<supermop_work_>last tram is 2040 or 45
12:44<supermop_work_>first is 1860
12:44<supermop_work_>but it could be 1830 i guess
12:45<andythenorth>I posted in thread
12:46<supermop_work_>i assure you there are more than 'about 5' generations
12:47<supermop_work_>also uprading trucks every decade is a pain
12:48<supermop_work_>nfc how to respond to request for original vehicle names though
12:49<andythenorth>you already did
12:50<supermop_work_>i mean other than ' i dont want to and no one else does'
12:50<andythenorth>that's fine
12:50<supermop_work_>thats about all there is to say
12:50<andythenorth>I make things my way
12:50<andythenorth>and I seek feedback where I want feedback
12:50<andythenorth>and in other cases, I can point to the repo and GPL
12:51<andythenorth>and there are at least 3 FIRS forks I'm aware of
12:51<andythenorth>and at least one fork of FISH
12:51<andythenorth>are your sets on devzone yet? Or github?
12:51<supermop_work_>not yet
12:51<supermop_work_>codes still too messy
12:52<andythenorth>see original HEQS :P
12:52<supermop_work_>have to hide from wife or she'll make fun of it
12:52<andythenorth>it's marriage
12:52<andythenorth>gonna happen
12:55<supermop_work_>trams are all very melb influenced
12:55<supermop_work_>might need american/english/HK rosters
12:57<supermop_work_>with bow collectors or double armed pantos instead of trolley poles
13:00*andythenorth might need a nap
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13:05<@Alberth>a small nap, and some tea :)
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13:09<supermop_work_>double espresso redeye
13:09<andythenorth>I need to fix NRT :(
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13:18<@peter1138>Anyone had to revert anything I did yet? :p
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13:22<andythenorth>ho you made commits
13:22<andythenorth>I should merge to NRT
13:23<stefino>Hi. Is possible to change height of Catenery bounding boxes in NML? Thanks
13:23<frosch123>is there a method to delete the word "bounding box" from the world?
13:24<andythenorth>do bounding boxes do anything?
13:24<andythenorth>I have the impression they're meaningless
13:24<frosch123>yes, they are very meaningless
13:25<stefino>so I can't change foreground/background with boxes size
13:26<stefino>frosch123: so how does it call? :D these boxes?
13:26<frosch123>ignore them
13:26<frosch123>they have no meaning
13:26<andythenorth>in FIRS I found that setting all zextent, yextent etc to 16 resolved numerous sprite flickering bugs
13:26<andythenorth>previously they were set to size of sprites, or arbitrary nonsense values
13:27<stefino>mm mmm, okay
13:28<stefino>in the picture you can see that pylons from catenary are covered by platforms roofs
13:29<stefino>this is our problem and our coder said that it could be due small it doesnť
13:32<frosch123>sorting problems are caused by overlapping boxes
13:32<frosch123>smaller boxes make it better
13:33<frosch123>reduce the width of the bottom platform boxes
13:37<stefino>okey, we will try it :)
13:37<frosch123>essentially there are two methods to sort boxes
13:38<frosch123>boxes of same size can be sorted by barycenter (which is done by modern games with "pixel sized" boxes)
13:38<frosch123>boxes of different size can be sorted if they do not overlap and do not form a circle
13:38<frosch123>boxes of different size which overlap are always broken
13:39<stefino>okay okay, I'll send it to our coder and try to do it :)
13:47<andythenorth>so did we decide I need to unify RoadVehUpdateCache and CargoChanged?
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14:22<supermop_work_>my buses have 'much other flaws'
14:24<frosch123>can you squareroot the amount?
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14:47<Wolf01>Ok, lego parts arrived, time to finish the diorama
14:50<andythenorth>supermop_work_: probably better I don't reply?
14:52<andythenorth>I don't get on with acs121
14:52<andythenorth>I was putting it down to a language barrier, but I think this person is just an ass tbh
14:52<andythenorth>I still don't understand why Unsinkable Sam is a problem
14:53<supermop_work_>also i mean there are 8 generations of buses in game
14:54<andythenorth>forums is as forums does
14:56<andythenorth>should we require ships to follow sealanes?
14:56<andythenorth>rather than just bouys?
14:57<andythenorth>sealanes would have to be constructed by player
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15:01<Eddi|zuHause>i'd say no
15:03<Eddi|zuHause>but we need to cache ship paths in the buoys, so you don't have to rerun the pathfinder for ships
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15:03<Eddi|zuHause>essentially ships would do PBS-reservations
15:04<Eddi|zuHause>which now means ship paths cannot cross
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15:05<andythenorth>Wally has made a quirky grf
15:05<andythenorth>interesting use of objects
15:07<Eddi|zuHause>buoys are probably better placed in tile corners
15:07<Eddi|zuHause>instead of in the middle
15:08<frosch123>how weird, i am used to andy posting images with 4x zoom, this seems to be zoomed out
15:09<Eddi|zuHause>because it's not posted by andy?
15:10<andythenorth>I actually do 2x zoom, but my screen is hidpi
15:10<andythenorth>so that doubles the pixels
15:11<frosch123>Eddi|zuHause: andy posted it here
15:11*andythenorth is busy avoiding RoadVehUpdateCache
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15:16<andythenorth>the reason I'm not sure about consolidating CargoChanged into RoadVehUpdateCache
15:16<andythenorth>is that sometimes CargoChanged is called conditionally
15:16<andythenorth>and sometimes not
15:17<andythenorth>and that would appear to be significant, at first glance
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15:25<frosch123>it's not about never calling CargoChanged
15:25<frosch123>it's about always calling CargoChanged when UpdateCache is called
15:27<andythenorth>L328 if (_settings_game.vehicle.roadveh_acceleration_model != AM_ORIGINAL) v->CargoChanged();
15:27<andythenorth>is that optimising much?
15:27<andythenorth>or can the conditional just be removed?
15:27<andythenorth>it's called in CmdBuildRoadVehicle
15:28<frosch123>i would rather expect it to crash or something when original acceleration is enabled
15:28<andythenorth>also it's not limited to the first vehicle there
15:29<frosch123>but argueably it would then also crash when called via UpdateCache :p
15:29<frosch123>anyway, i have no idea
15:29<frosch123>the names are all glibberish, one would have to look at the details
15:34<andythenorth>I am going to ship it with calls to both functions and wait for more bug reports
15:34<andythenorth>I don't like refactoring things I don't have knowledge of
15:34<andythenorth>there aren't tests, right? o_O
15:35<Eddi|zuHause>what kind of tests?
15:44<andythenorth>regression tests
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15:55<Wolf01>andythenorth: not sure what you are doing there, just call both CargoChanged and RVUpdateCache in the right order in the remaining places wasn't enough?
15:56<andythenorth>it's probably enough yes
15:56<andythenorth>frosch recommended code quality improvements
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15:58<Wolf01>Not at the same time as bufixes
15:58<Wolf01>Refactoring and bugfix don't go well together
15:59<andythenorth>I'm convinced
15:59<andythenorth>I'll fix whitespace and push
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16:09<andythenorth>@calc 14(3/5
16:09<@DorpsGek>andythenorth: Error: unexpected EOF while parsing (<string>, line 1)
16:10<andythenorth>my os calculator parses 14(3/5
16:10<andythenorth>and returns 8.4
16:10<Wolf01>Your OS is broken
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16:27<andythenorth>it's inferring what the operators should be I think
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16:28<Wolf01>Yeah, it does, but the missing ) :(
16:28<andythenorth>I really disagree with treating order of operations as a convention
16:29<Wolf01>@calc :3 + :-)
16:29<@DorpsGek>Wolf01: Error: invalid syntax (<string>, line 1)
16:29<andythenorth>I'm probably weird
16:29<andythenorth>someone should do a calculator with emoji for april fools
16:29<Wolf01>There is a number
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16:29<Wolf01>I didn't see a lot of numbers in the latest years of school
16:30<andythenorth>a^2 = b^2 + c^2 / 2a
16:30<andythenorth>and so on
16:30<Wolf01>Also, diorama seem to be finished
16:31<andythenorth>you can be responsible for lego profits going up
16:31<Wolf01>Now I need to print the "you are seeing" guides
16:31<Wolf01>I was responsible for lego profits going down for sure
16:31<Wolf01>I almost stopped purchasing last year
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17:05<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: you're probably missing some ()
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17:10<andythenorth>I was *never* taught order of operations in school or university
17:11<andythenorth>I only learnt about it from one of those stupid facebook '99% of people get this sum wrong' memes
17:11<andythenorth>I am reading more about it, it's bonkers
17:11<andythenorth>they literally have these stupid rules with acronyms to remember them
17:12<andythenorth>just to avoid parentheses
17:12<andythenorth>and the rules are really confusing to parse
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17:24<supermop>Wolf01: would you do an italian translation for me?
17:24<supermop>mostly so i can say i don't need one from forum guy?
17:24<andythenorth>have you got eints hooked up yet?
17:25<supermop>not much to translate in my grf
17:25<supermop>andythenorth: no, i think i'd need better code for that?
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17:25<supermop>i just need the parameter descriptions translated i think - don't think brand names should be translated
17:26<andythenorth>you have lang files?
17:26<supermop>just english.lng
17:27<andythenorth>if you get a devzone repo, it's possible to eints then
17:28<andythenorth>eints just reads the default lng file, offers it for translation, and writes other lng files back to the repo once daily
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17:30<andythenorth>also bed
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17:31<Wolf01>Bed too
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17:35<andythenorth>@calc 1+1+1+1+1+1+1*0
17:35<@DorpsGek>andythenorth: 6
17:35<andythenorth>that's so dumb
17:35<andythenorth>it should be 0
17:36*andythenorth back to bed
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17:36<LordAro>bro do you even bodmas
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18:21<Eddi|zuHause>what i see often wrong is that people don't use () with / because when written on paper, the / is horizontal and the () are unneded
18:21<Eddi|zuHause>but this information is lost when written on one line
18:22<Eddi|zuHause> 2ab
18:22<Eddi|zuHause>is clear
18:22<Eddi|zuHause>but a^2+b^2/2ab is not
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18:23<Eddi|zuHause>well, it is clear to me, but it's something different from what you probably meant
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18:25<Eddi|zuHause>however, schools with their focus on handwriting won't even realize that this is something they should teach
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19:51-!-ccfreak2k is "Got ZNC?" on #moocows #openttd #slackware
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20:04-!-TigerbotHesh is "TigerbotHesh" on #openttd #tor-project #debian
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21:56-!-TinoDidriksen is "Tino Didriksen" on #openttd #opendune #debian-science #debian-nordic
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22:24-!-Vadtec is "Vadtec" on #openttd
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22:42-!-supermop is "A CIRC user" on #openttd
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22:42-!-joe__ is "realname" on #/r/openttd #openttd
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---Logclosed Thu Mar 08 00:00:37 2018