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#openttd IRC Logs for 2018-05-12

---Logopened Sat May 12 00:00:08 2018
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02:05<andythenorth>o/
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03:03<Wolf01>Moin
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03:45<andythenorth>but where is cat?
03:45<Wolf01>Oh, there is cat
03:46<Wolf01>Did you see the new technic crane?
03:46<Wolf01>*HUGE*
03:46<Wolf01>>4000 parts
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03:51<andythenorth>such big
03:52<andythenorth>probably buy
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04:24<andythenorth>;/.54
04:25<Wolf01>Was it a spider on the keyboard or is some andy's child?
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04:37<andythenorth>my mac now turns the screen off when it's plugged into the charger
04:37<andythenorth>I was pressing keys to try and stop it doing that :P
04:38<andythenorth>this is what a 33% price premium gets you
04:43<Wolf01>Why do you still buy mac?
04:44<andythenorth>lock in
04:44<andythenorth>no way out
04:45<Wolf01>Like me with MS, but at least I'm happy
04:45<andythenorth>relearning computing from scratch would be too hard
04:47<Wolf01>You wouldn't be changing to a commodore and basic 1.0, most of the softwares you use on a mac are available for windows and linux too
04:48<Wolf01>And if you switch to another unix based system you don't even need to relearn the basic commands
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04:49<andythenorth>UI is very different
04:49<andythenorth>and there's not much gained by switching to Linux, same endless "but it doesn't work" issues
04:49<andythenorth>it would be Windows (10?) or nothing
04:50<Wolf01>Sure you wouldn't switch to windows XP, 10 is the right choice :P
04:50<andythenorth>everyone I know who has recent Windows says it's awesome
04:51<andythenorth>100% reliable, totally user friendly
04:51<Wolf01>100% is a bit too much, let's say 95%, but it's really easier to use now
04:53<andythenorth>if Apple continues to nosedive I'll have to switch
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04:59<andythenorth>ugh, had to restart
04:59<andythenorth>should never ever ever have to restart
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07:12<peter1138>Hello
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07:17<andythenorth>lo peter1138
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08:44<Wolf01>I could have lunch now, that should be a good idea
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10:59<snail_UES_>does the SVN server for OTTD still work? I’ve been trying for a few days, but it seems I can’t connect
11:00<LordAro>snail_UES_: read yo news http://www.openttd.org/en/news/235
11:01<snail_UES_>thanks! I seem to have missed that
11:02<snail_UES_>someone should also updated Wiki pages such as https://wiki.openttd.org/Compiling_on_(GNU/)Linux_and_*BSD
11:03<LordAro>almost all of the wiki is in need of updating :p
11:05<LordAro>but that's the lovely thing about wikis - anyone can update them
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14:25<peter1138>Those devs refusing to add things
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15:35<Wolf01>Back from lunch
15:35<LordAro>lunch?
15:35<Wolf01>-> [14:44:12] <Wolf01> I could have lunch now, that should be a good idea
15:36<LordAro>but that was... 5 hours ago?
15:36<Wolf01>So?
15:36<Wolf01>More like 7
15:37<TrueBrain>very tempted to move a topic into the naughty-bin .. are random rants of unneeded porpotions bannable offenses on forums?
15:37<TrueBrain>I dont know the forum rules ....
15:37<Wolf01>Link?
15:38<TrueBrain>hmm, seems it is not against the rules
15:38<TrueBrain>*sad panda*
15:38<peter1138>;(
15:38<TrueBrain>owh, no, rule 1d
15:39<peter1138>What've I done!
15:39<TrueBrain>meh .. I am not really a forum moderator :P I just have rights ... hmmm
15:39<TrueBrain>guess I should leave it to a moderator :P Who is moderating the forums?
15:41<peter1138>Hmm, I wonder what brought that on.,
15:41<TrueBrain>no clue either; just a very misplaced way of trying to get a point across
15:42<TrueBrain>orudge: lot of spam on the forum lately; something we can do about that? (something I can do about that?)
15:43*LordAro looks
15:43<LordAro>aw, babby had tantrum
15:43<TrueBrain>its one of the few ways to get on my bad side :)
15:44<peter1138>Hmm, weather forecast was wrong, it's been raining for hours :(
15:44<peter1138>Soggy trails tomorrow then :(
15:46<TrueBrain>locked the topic, and asked orudge / moderators if this should result in a warning or not ..
15:46<TrueBrain>at least the minimum I could do :)
15:47<TrueBrain>I just love these posts .. telling a community is shit in the most shittiest way possible .. that is some self-reflection right there yo!
15:48<LordAro>depending on how serious they are, they might not see/care about any warning
15:48<TrueBrain>I once got the manual how to ban spammers etc ... really cannot find it :D
15:48<TrueBrain>and the person I thought could do something about it, reported it .. so clearly he cannot :D
15:49<TrueBrain>it is also possible my rights are more limited than they used to be ... :D
15:50<Wolf01>https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=75637&p=1206985#p1206985 could I write something like this? Oh wait, I did
15:50<peter1138>It's way too complex.
15:51<TrueBrain>Wolf01: did you really write "hookers"? :D
15:51<Wolf01>Yes
15:52<Wolf01>Is it a forum for families?
15:52<TrueBrain>I see I can move the topic to the right place .. but I cannot ban the spammer it seems
15:52<TrueBrain>Wolf01: who knows!
15:52<TrueBrain>so we really need orudge I guess to ban the spammer? Hmm
15:52<peter1138>https://github.com/PeterN/OpenTTD/commit/bdfc1daebb60079daec391c8ea987f615f6fc38c#diff-ab96138f12d2f8f9159fa122ab5e789e
15:52<peter1138>^ That really is just nasty
15:53<TrueBrain>that really really is :P
15:53<Wolf01>Split value in 2 sets of bits?
15:53<TrueBrain>still fighting the map bits ...
15:53<peter1138>Wolf01, there's other places where it's already done.
15:53<peter1138>But yeah, nasty.
15:53<Eddi|zuHause>back when i was admin on a forum you could "ban" people by moving them into a group that had no permission to post anything
15:54<TrueBrain>I know there is also a warning system, but I cannot find that too .. guess I no longer have permission :P
15:54<Wolf01>Mmmh, move the bits to make space? Savegame conversion
15:54<+glx>pure maparray abuse
15:54<peter1138>Wolf01, I don't think it's possible.
15:54<peter1138>You'd end up splitting something else.
15:55<peter1138>bridge ramps have very little space available.
15:55<Wolf01>And they want more roadtypes too..
15:55<Eddi|zuHause>need to rewrite them for custombridgeheads anyway :p
15:55<peter1138>Oh, they have loads, but in a different place to everything else.
15:56<peter1138>And railtype is an oddity. It's always in the same place regardless of tile type (if the tile type has rails)
15:56<Wolf01>Makes sense
15:56<TrueBrain>orudge: I know we asked this 10 years too, but how many cookies do we have to give for patchpacks to get their own subforum? Is that possible?
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15:57<TrueBrain>getting a bit annoyed by a 70-page-topic
15:57<Eddi|zuHause>maybe we should have classes in the map array, that do all this bitstuffing with properties?
15:57<peter1138>Eddi|zuHause, just write it in a modern language :D
15:58-!-sla_ro|master [~sla.ro@78.96.209.89] has quit []
15:58<peter1138>Eddi|zuHause, C structs can have bitfields anyway.
15:59<Eddi|zuHause>well, structs and classes are really the same thing
16:00<peter1138>NewMapArray!
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16:01<TrueBrain>I tried to move a topic ... I totally failed ... I so hate forums .. impossible to moderate :(
16:01<TrueBrain>so we will have to do with the spam a bit longer :P
16:02<Wolf01>Couldn't you just delete the spam?
16:02<Eddi|zuHause>well, the idea would be that you encapsulate all the map accessors by (virtual?) functions, so the code that tries to access the map can work without knowing whether it's now a rail, road or bridge tile
16:02<TrueBrain>Wolf01: as I remember, tt-forums never (ever) deletes stuff; we have an (invisible) spam bin for that
16:03<TrueBrain>but ... the way I think it should work, doesn't :P
16:03<Wolf01>Oh
16:03<Wolf01>Funny
16:03<Eddi|zuHause>yeah, that's how it worked in that other forum i was involved with as well
16:03<TrueBrain>YES! I MANAGED! \o/
16:04<Eddi|zuHause>a hidden forum where all the garbage posts went to rot
16:04<Wolf01>\o/
16:04<TrueBrain>owh, found a "warn user" button
16:04<TrueBrain>but only when people report something
16:04<peter1138>Problem with bit-fields is the compiler can "optimise" them.
16:05<TrueBrain>lol
16:05<TrueBrain>irony
16:05<TrueBrain>peter1138: volatile, fixed
16:05<TrueBrain>:P
16:06<LordAro>heh
16:06<LordAro>static_assert(sizeof(..)) ?
16:06<peter1138>:(
16:07<peter1138>We could just do what every other game does.
16:07<LordAro>or do you mean optimise in another sense?
16:07<peter1138>Just not care about memory usage.
16:07<LordAro>haha
16:07<peter1138>LordAro, it may or may not honour the bit-field packing you intended.
16:08<LordAro>hrm
16:08<TrueBrain>awh, I cannot warn myself
16:08<LordAro>i guess that would come after any static_assert too
16:08<+glx>but it can be handled by save write/load function
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16:09<Wolf01>"If the limit is raised, it should be raised to something sensible, like 16k or 65k. " :D
16:09<LordAro>is it a case of compilers "can" not honour the bitfields, but every compiler does anyway?
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16:10<Wolf01>Also o/ andy
16:10<LordAro>iz
16:10<TrueBrain>its an ANDY
16:10<Eddi|zuHause>64k railtypes?
16:10<TrueBrain>64k? GO FOR THE MOON OR GO AWAY
16:10<Wolf01>YEAH WHY NOT?!?!?!? Just make an addition for the map array, like an external drive or such
16:10<TrueBrain>I totally and utterly forgot OpenTTD uses a bit array :)
16:11<andythenorth>I am quitting btw
16:11<andythenorth>I am fucked off with this community
16:11<TrueBrain>good riddance
16:11<LordAro>finally
16:11<TrueBrain>wondered when you would sodd off tbfh
16:11<TrueBrain>AWH NO andythenorth PLEASE STAY
16:11<+glx>the good old time when the array was accessed directly :)
16:11<TrueBrain>dont make me lock your topic too :P
16:11<andythenorth>try playing world of tanks blitz
16:11<+glx>without accessors
16:11<Eddi|zuHause>andythenorth: while at it, replace all your GRFS on bananas with garbage versions, and edit all your posts to "..."
16:11<LordAro>glx: oh no
16:11<TrueBrain>owh, tempting Eddi|zuHause
16:11<TrueBrain>I can do that for him
16:11<Wolf01><andythenorth> try playing world of tanks blitz <- AHAHAHAHHA
16:12<Wolf01>Replace all your GRFs on bananas with bananas
16:12<Wolf01>Banana trains, banana vehicles, banana ships, banana industries
16:12<TrueBrain>I wonder how long it will take for someone to take away my admin rights on the forum, if I just go and change every topic andythenorth makes into ...
16:12<andythenorth>in Blitz, you get DMs saying 'get cancer and die'
16:12<andythenorth>that's a bad community
16:13<TrueBrain><3 andythenorth
16:13<peter1138>Nah, that's normal. Toxic is when a dev refuses to add features.
16:13<TrueBrain>I wouldnt do that to you
16:13<Eddi|zuHause>toxic communities in competetive free-to-play games? unheard of!!!
16:13<andythenorth>mostly played by early teen males?
16:13<TrueBrain>peter1138: exactly! Devs are here to do their job! MAKE THEM DO THEIR JOB
16:13<TrueBrain>ffs
16:13<andythenorth>this is old though
16:13<andythenorth>let's do something fun
16:13<andythenorth>can we commit NRT as one big diff pls?
16:14<peter1138>I figured out what that 32 railtype patch needs.
16:14<TrueBrain>I mean, why did NOBODY review the PERFECT work of peter1138 yet! I has been there for over 24 hours!? Omg .. we are doooooommmmeeeeeddddddd
16:14<peter1138>9 bit bytes.
16:14<andythenorth>I'm bored of worrying about how we finish NRT
16:14<TrueBrain>peter1138: 9? Why not 16? :)
16:14<Eddi|zuHause>TrueBrain: that would be too easy :p
16:14<andythenorth>can we not just rewrite the map?
16:14<TrueBrain>andythenorth: honestly nothing wrong with 1 big diff
16:14<Wolf01>peter1138: just implement trits and all problems are solved, plenty of space
16:14<andythenorth>peter1138: ^ that's 2 votes
16:14<TrueBrain>we did so many things with 1 big diff
16:14<Wolf01>+1
16:14<TrueBrain>NoAI
16:14<TrueBrain>TGP
16:15<TrueBrain>YAPF
16:15<TrueBrain>Network Rewrite
16:15<TrueBrain>Makefile Rewrite
16:15<TrueBrain>should I continue? :)
16:15<Eddi|zuHause>C++ rewrite
16:15<andythenorth>NoGo
16:15<peter1138>TrueBrain, I did suggest it but nobody else cared :p
16:15<LordAro>tbf, there are several PRs that have been sitting there for a while...
16:15<TrueBrain>LordAro: yeah, we lack code reviewers
16:15<TrueBrain>feel free to step up
16:15<LordAro>i haven't looked to see who they're waiting for
16:16<peter1138>Anyone, usually.
16:16<TrueBrain>peter1138: it is a balancing act; if making several patches out of it just for that as goal, we are doing it wrong
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16:16<TrueBrain>if the code is good, or good enough ...
16:16<peter1138>I did find some TODOs when I reviewed NRT.
16:16<TrueBrain>of course more patchesis nicer, IF anyone is going to review them
16:16<peter1138>Wolf01, andythenorth, any idea if they were looked at?
16:17<andythenorth>let's look now
16:17<TrueBrain>we need at least 1 extra pair of eyes to go over all the code, at some point .. so if that was already done .. I mean ..
16:17<Wolf01>Yes, they are harmless
16:17<TrueBrain>code reviews are not to add more work
16:17<andythenorth>https://github.com/andythenorth/NotRoadTypes/issues/22#issuecomment-381306216
16:17<Wolf01>Nothing that couldn't be addressed in a second step
16:17<TrueBrain>LordAro: regarding code reviews .. every time I come to the same conclusion: we need a github app, that adds a workflow
16:18<TrueBrain>as I really have no clue what stage those PRs are in
16:18<TrueBrain>are we waiting on author or not
16:18<TrueBrain>but just adding labels is not enough
16:18<andythenorth>Wolf01: I have NFI what those TODOs are supposed to say :)
16:18<TrueBrain>as if it has label: waits-for-author, and author pushes new stuff, the label should be removed
16:18<andythenorth>do you?
16:18<TrueBrain>introducing, GitHub Apps ..
16:18<LordAro>adding assignees?
16:18<Wolf01>BTW I would like to change some things before, so we could set them on the clay (so it can be changed again in future)
16:18<LordAro>looks like both the music & osx stuff requires michi_cc
16:18<TrueBrain>we already notice that the default GitHub workflow is just annoying as fuck .. it makes comments "outdated" at the time of posting ...
16:19<TrueBrain>and I did notice we should be more decicive in feedback
16:19<peter1138>Wolf01, make it 5 bit instead of 4 ;)
16:19<Wolf01>Like: remove the check for electrification downgrading the town roads
16:19<Wolf01>Community has spoken, there is no griefing, so no need to be so strict on downgrading towns
16:19<andythenorth>can we add that in a later commit?
16:20<Wolf01>And I would like to finish the town roadtypes branch too, so we could have that too (which should remove 1 or 2 TODOs too)
16:20<LordAro>6751 is waiting on zuu, i think. 6754 is waiting on either frosch or wants closing
16:20<TrueBrain>peter1138 / andythenorth / Wolf01: btw, NRT is exactly what a fork would be perfect for btw, if we could produce nightlies for them
16:21<LordAro>6771 looks done, pending a review
16:21<andythenorth>TrueBrain: remember you did that? o_O
16:21<Wolf01>Eh, I agree
16:21<TrueBrain>andythenorth: I dont .. which is I guess the issue?
16:21<TrueBrain>I really wanted to avoid creating a GitHub app ....
16:21<LordAro>same for 6777
16:21<andythenorth>https://www.openttd.org/en/download-ratt
16:21<TrueBrain>owh, yeah
16:21<TrueBrain>fair enough
16:21<andythenorth>^ you built my fork for last year or so
16:21<andythenorth>proves that the whole Github route is valid
16:22<LordAro>and 6780, which probably also needs some testing
16:22<andythenorth>fork route + official binaries has been awesome
16:22<LordAro>TrueBrain: wait wait, what do you want a "github app" for?
16:22<andythenorth>gets newgrfs to appear, and gets tested
16:22<TrueBrain>LordAro: for many things ... workflow for one
16:22<TrueBrain>but I hit a bit of a roadblock with the current Jenkins plugins
16:22<LordAro>how so?
16:22<TrueBrain>they are shit :D
16:23<TrueBrain>how to explain best ... so many tiny issues :D
16:23<LordAro>the workflow bit :p
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16:23<TrueBrain>workflow I explained a bit earlier
16:23<TrueBrain>I would like the labels to be done for me
16:23<TrueBrain>GitHub doesnt really supply this
16:23<TrueBrain>(as I doubt we can learn a PR author to reassign his PR .. they are most often just not aware of a workflow)
16:24<TrueBrain>but maybe more important .. I would like to be able to do in a PR: bot, build release
16:24<TrueBrain>and that he creates a release for me for anyone to download
16:24<TrueBrain>you would think that already exists ... and it does .. just nowhere in a form you can apply it on your own project
16:25<TrueBrain>btw, LordAro, feel free to review any of the PRs above
16:25<peter1138>Remember that guy who flounced and also edited the content of every old post?
16:26<TrueBrain>LordAro: and a GitHub App can do exactly what I want .. and it is not difficult to create
16:26<andythenorth>he later did similar thing on simuscape
16:26<TrueBrain>just .... we do have to create it
16:26<andythenorth>anyway
16:26<andythenorth>let's make stuff
16:26<TrueBrain>I was hoping to use stock stuff .. as custom stuff never goes well (nobody wants to support it)
16:26<TrueBrain>and I dread the fact I have to write it by myself (again?)
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16:26<andythenorth>Wolf01: do you know what each TODO is for?
16:26<Wolf01>Some of them yes
16:27<andythenorth>do they just need better comments?
16:27<TrueBrain>LordAro: other cool shit you can do, that if something is tagged, it releases and publishes it
16:27<TrueBrain>which is REALLY cool
16:27<Wolf01>Some others are just placeholders for new implementations
16:27<LordAro>TrueBrain: by app, do you mean bot?
16:27<TrueBrain>GitHub Apps
16:27<TrueBrain>look them up
16:27<TrueBrain>they are "sort of" a bot
16:27<LordAro>oh, right
16:27<TrueBrain>(just a way of GitHub to interact with other stuff)
16:27<andythenorth>is this like greenlight deploy stuff?
16:28<peter1138>I might just play Elite: Dangerous.
16:28<LordAro>incidentally, there was a check thing announced the other day
16:28<TrueBrain>and ...... 5 days ago they added Checks API, which is VERY cool
16:28<LordAro>seems to be travis on- yes
16:28<TrueBrain>yes ...
16:28<LordAro>:p
16:28<TrueBrain>but no Jenkins integration yet or something
16:28<TrueBrain>like shit :P
16:28<Wolf01>Like the town one: rtid = RoadTypeIdentifier(ROADTYPE_ROAD, ROADSUBTYPE_NORMAL); <- has a TODO for towns to chose their own roadtype
16:28<TrueBrain>so possible we should just use Travis
16:28<TrueBrain>and it is not difficult to do all this stuff .. just time
16:28<TrueBrain>and the weather is nice outside
16:28<andythenorth>Wolf01: so that could just be deleted as a comment, or expanded to explain future work?
16:29<andythenorth>TrueBrain: isn't it
16:29*andythenorth had a BBQ
16:29<TrueBrain>me too!
16:29<Wolf01>Maybe explain it as future work could be the right way
16:29<TrueBrain>were you .... at my BBQ?
16:29<peter1138>Nice? It's been pissing down :(
16:29<Eddi|zuHause>why did nobody tell me ESC was on?
16:29<TrueBrain>all my windows are currently open :)
16:29<peter1138>Because it's tedious rubbish.
16:29<TrueBrain>Eddi|zuHause: because absolutely nobody gives a fuck?
16:29<Wolf01>There are 2 cases where there is an actual bug (a plain return true because the proper check doesn't seem to work)
16:29<TrueBrain>LordAro: either way, go review PRs PLZZZZZ :D
16:29<Eddi|zuHause>that used to be different :p
16:31<+glx>TrueBrain> all my windows are currently open :) <-- too cold outside right now to do that
16:32<Wolf01>The NRT code really need to be revised, but I'm not the right one, I'm like a construction worker, I build the rooms, but for the refinement you would need a painter :P
16:33<LordAro>TrueBrain: i'm supposed to be playing a boardgame!
16:33<LordAro>later
16:33<TrueBrain>LordAro: enjoy :D
16:34<andythenorth>http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/9043/IMG_4209.JPG.JPG
16:34<andythenorth>^ was warmer and sunnier than picture suggests
16:34<Eddi|zuHause>.jpg.jpg?
16:35<Wolf01>:D
16:35<andythenorth>Eddi|zuHause: shrug apple
16:35<andythenorth>"so good they named it twice"
16:36<peter1138>https://github.com/PeterN/OpenTTD/commits/nrt-block < some changes I made to NRT
16:37<andythenorth>let's just fix the TODO comments and merge that then
16:38<Wolf01>this->roadtypes[ROADTYPE_ROAD] = ROADSUBTYPES_NORMAL; // Road is always available. // TODO <- this one is... I don't have words
16:39<andythenorth>me neither :P
16:39<andythenorth>what does it mean? o_O
16:39<Wolf01>All and nothing
16:40<Wolf01>It ensures you have at least road with no grfs
16:41<Wolf01>But with grfs you might not want road
16:41<Wolf01>And it's a bit of bullshit imho
16:41<+glx>weird this chan is not talking about eurovision ;)
16:41<Wolf01>I don't listen to pop
16:42<Wolf01>At least not actively
16:43<andythenorth>nil points
16:43<andythenorth>oh is this the 'road is always available' thing?
16:43<nielsm>any chance my DOS music PR will get looked at soon? :/
16:44<LordAro>glx: i got a breaking news alert about some guy crashing our country's song
16:44<LordAro>other than that, nothing
16:44<Eddi|zuHause>maybe initialize the default roadtypes by some file in src/table?
16:47<Wolf01>How could I see a text diff on github?
16:47<LordAro>Wolf01: add .diff to the url
16:48<Eddi|zuHause>i hate github for not making these things more obvious
16:48<Wolf01>Clearly I need to install a github extension to add buttons for these hidden features
16:50<Wolf01>if (tile == end_tile && !CanConnectToRoad(tile, rtid.basetype, dir)) { // TODO <- what?
16:50<Wolf01>And 2 lines below, what again
16:50<Wolf01>/* Trying to convert other's road */ // TODO allow upgrade? <- no, only town roads
16:51<Wolf01>return ::Company::Get((::CompanyID)company)->infrastructure.GetRoadTotal((::RoadType)roadtype); // TODO <- again, what?
16:51<Eddi|zuHause>those are the best TODOs
16:52<Wolf01>Maybe they were just placeholders to remember where to change for rtids, and they weren't removed
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16:54<Wolf01>The only one I'm sure about is this: IsRoadAllowedHere() ... RoadTypeIdentifier rtid(ROADTYPE_ROAD, ROADSUBTYPE_NORMAL); // TODO <- there is a patch for this
16:54<Wolf01>At least all the ones in town_cmd.cpp
16:55<Wolf01>The patch need to be finished, the random algorythm is flawed and need to be implemented better maybe with an UI
16:55<Wolf01>Also towns need to store the roadtype somewhere and not in the tile in the center
16:56<peter1138>Towns only have one road type?
16:56<Eddi|zuHause>surely towns have enough off-map storage
16:57<andythenorth>so are the TODOs invalid?
16:57<Wolf01>I made it so towns decide a random roadtype when they get founded, and that is the roadtype of the center tile, if you upgrade it, towns continue to build with the new one
16:58<Wolf01> if (company == OWNER_DEITY || company == OWNER_TOWN || _game_mode == GM_EDITOR || _generating_world) {
16:58<Wolf01>- avail_roadtypes = ROADTYPES_ROAD;
16:58<Wolf01>+ return true; // TODO
16:58<Wolf01>This one is valid
16:59<Wolf01>It should perform a check, but which one?
16:59<Eddi|zuHause>surely there should be some logic where towns evaluate the available roadtypes
16:59<Eddi|zuHause>and build the "best" one available at the time
17:00<Wolf01>I can't agree, towns my build the one they like between a set of available
17:00<Wolf01>*may
17:00<peter1138>That may be the "best"
17:00<Eddi|zuHause>and surely i don't want the towns to expand with troleybus roads, just because i happen to build a route through the center
17:00<peter1138>But the "best" definitely needs to come from a list of actually available roadtypes
17:01<Wolf01>Eddi|zuHause: right, that's what I want to solve
17:01<peter1138>Just add the road type to the town struct.
17:02<Wolf01>But if you have asphalt, stone, cement, wetroad, all of them may be equivalent as "best one"
17:03<Eddi|zuHause>sure, but you still have to decide for one
17:03<andythenorth>dice roll
17:03<peter1138>Wolf01, "best" is in quotes for a reason :-)
17:03<andythenorth>there is pretty much no way to know
17:03<Wolf01>Or they might depend on the age, towns start with stone and then continue with asphalt, so you have an old fashioned city center
17:03<andythenorth>dice roll
17:03<andythenorth>some towns make 'dumb' choices
17:04<Wolf01>I now can decide for all the roads set as buildable by towns in the grf
17:04<Wolf01>Sure I should move the roadtype to the town struct so you can make the center tile what you want
17:05<Wolf01>But towns can't build trolleywire if that's not set in the grf as buildable
17:05<Wolf01>And it's already working
17:05<Wolf01>Supermop already made a test grf
17:05<andythenorth>peter1138: does the 32 railtype patch actually work?
17:06<peter1138>andythenorth, yes.
17:10<peter1138>The drop down list is horrible when it has so many items.
17:13<Wolf01>That's why we split trams and roads
17:14<Wolf01>BTW, what about a pool with 30 positions for roadtypes instead of hard 15/15?
17:15<Wolf01>It shouldn't be so hard to change
17:15<Wolf01>And the UI just need to filter
17:16<peter1138>I don't understand what you mean.
17:16<peter1138>Isn't it split at 15/15 because you have 4 bits for road and 4 bits for tram?
17:16<Wolf01>You could have 25 roadtypes and 5 trams
17:17<Eddi|zuHause>i don't think that works as easy as you think
17:17<Wolf01>Mmmh, yes, the map array need 2 more bits
17:17<peter1138>And if you have 2 more bits, you can just make it 31/31 :p
17:17<Wolf01>:P
17:18<peter1138>Also, why 15 not 16.
17:18<Wolf01>I'm a bit stupid
17:18<Wolf01>Because 0 is invalid
17:18<peter1138>Why do you need invalid?
17:18<Wolf01>Or 15 is invalid, I don't remember
17:18<Wolf01>That's a good question
17:19<Eddi|zuHause>i think we discussed that before, but i don't remember the outcome
17:19<Eddi|zuHause>i think i suggested something along the lines of "invalid is when there's no roadbits"
17:19<peter1138>Eddi|zuHause, that's what I was thinking.
17:20<Wolf01>Maybe it wasn't enough
17:21<peter1138>Only one I can think of is bridge/tunnel tiles and level-crossings don't have road bits.
17:22<peter1138>(But may have enough bits free to use 2 bits as a road bit for each base type)
17:23<peter1138>Hmm
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17:23<peter1138>Otoh.... 8 bits
17:24<peter1138>8 bit index to a roadtype/tramtype combination table
17:25<peter1138>then you can have "no limit" to either type, as long as there is no more than 256 combinations on the map :p
17:25<peter1138>(possibly per company but that makes buyouts harder)
17:26<peter1138>I was considering doing the same for railtypes, although keeping it a 4 bit index.
17:26<peter1138>As you don't actually have combos there.
17:27<peter1138>But 4 bits is more restrictive.
17:27<Wolf01>Interesting
17:27<peter1138>And also the use of bitmasks elsewhere makes going beyond 32 a pain.
17:29<andythenorth>65k or bust :P
17:29*andythenorth not helpful
17:29<peter1138>Could be some weird edge-cases where you couldn't remove a road type from a tile for no logical gameplay reason.
17:29<peter1138>andythenorth, adding another 32 bits per tile?
17:29<andythenorth>smaller maps
17:29<peter1138>That'll please the 16kx16k map players :D
17:30<andythenorth>those players already have terrible lives
17:30<andythenorth>it's a service
17:30<andythenorth>to reduce the map size :P
17:30<peter1138>Meh, only 1GB. I have 32GB, don't care about others.
17:31<andythenorth>lucky you :P
17:31<peter1138>> bed
17:31<andythenorth>fair plan
17:31<andythenorth>you convinced me too
17:31<andythenorth>bye Wolf01
17:32<Wolf01>nn
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17:38<Wolf01>Here he is, see what you have done!
17:40<supermop>hello
17:40<supermop>agree with andy - either 1M or 4 rail types
17:41<Wolf01>:)
17:47<Eddi|zuHause>more railtypes than you can have vehicle IDs?
17:47<peter1138>Why not? It's just stupid devs refusing to do it.
17:48<peter1138>(My bed sheets were still damp, so waiting on the dryer)
17:48<Wolf01>Customer wants it, make it... code is a mess... it's your problem, not customer's
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18:39<Wolf01>'night
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---Logclosed Sun May 13 00:00:09 2018