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#debian IRC Logs for 2007-08-25

---Logopened Sat Aug 25 00:00:03 2007
---Daychanged Sat Aug 25 2007
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00:01<pmitros>Is there some package repository somewhere that allows people running stable (Debian 4.0) to install modern applications from KDE?
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00:02<rob__>uptime[21m 19s]
00:02<rob__>os[Linux 2.6.20-16-lowlatency i686] distro[Debian 4.0] cpu[2 x Dual Core AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 165 @ 2.70GHz] mem[Physical : 2026MB, 92.6% free] disk[Total : 390.22GB, 80.80% Free] video[nVidia Corporation Northbridge] sound[]
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00:07<pabs>pmitros: either use apt-pinning and install apps from testing, or use (ask the maintainer if the package doesn't exist there)
00:07<chealer>pmitros: what do you mean by modern?
00:09<pmitros>pabs: Apt-pinning isn't too useful for a massive system like KDE. I'm looking around backports, but I haven't found krita there yet, but I might just need to look harder.
00:09[~]pmitros keeps looking harder
00:11<pabs>pmitros: if it isn't there, I'd suggest contacting the maintainer and asking for a backport
00:13<pmitros>pabs: Is that considered polite?
00:14<pabs>depends on the maintainer, but it should be ok.
00:14[~]pmitros never really considered backports to be part of a maintainer's job
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00:17<CutMeOwnThroat>and updating kde to testing/unstable is out of question?
00:19<CutMeOwnThroat>so what was that
00:19<CutMeOwnThroat><rob__> uptime[21m 19s]
00:19<CutMeOwnThroat><rob__> os[Linux 2.6.20-16-lowlatency i686] distro[Debian 4.0] cpu[2 x Dual Core AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 165 @ 2.70GHz] mem[Physical : 2026MB, 92.6% free] disk[Total : 390.22GB, 80.80% Free] video[nVidia Corporation Northbridge] sound[]
00:19<CutMeOwnThroat>* rob__ has quit ()
00:19<pmitros>I'd rather not. It gets really messy to have a mixture of stable/unstable sometimes. But it's not a big deal. I was just wondering if someone knew of a good repository that would have the latest krita backported as much as possible. I'm not grabbing that much from unstable, so I can probably just recompile it myself.
00:20<CutMeOwnThroat>you could have a try :)
00:20<CutMeOwnThroat>mixing stable and testing/unstable has worked pretty well for me that far
00:20<CutMeOwnThroat>would look out for weird dependencies, though
00:21<CutMeOwnThroat>like... wanting to install a new kernel or another glibc or something that could cause trouble
00:21<CutMeOwnThroat>or important packages that are to be removed because of conflicts
00:22<pmitros>kernel and glibc is usually not an issue when compiling yourself. KDE libraries might be. Regardless, I'm at the point where I know what to do next.
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00:33<RottNE>would it have been possible that gzip compressed a file from 1.8G to 216M
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00:34<chuy_max>Qt stylesheets are not properly displayed, does somebody know something about this?
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00:35<chuy_max>I compiled it in Ubuntu Feisty with Qt 4.2, copied it to Debian lenny but stylesheets don't work
00:35<chuy_max>then I recompiled it in Debian but the same thing happened
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00:41<CutMeOwnThroat>RottNE, why not?
00:42<CutMeOwnThroat>RottNE, "gzip </dev/zero" :)
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00:44<CutMeOwnThroat>gzip < /dev/zero > tst.gz
00:45<CutMeOwnThroat>$ du -h tst
00:45<CutMeOwnThroat>$ du -h tst.gz
00:45<CutMeOwnThroat>1.5M tst.gz
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00:46<CutMeOwnThroat>gunzip tst.gz
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00:46<CutMeOwnThroat>du -h tst
00:46<RottNE>so yes? that is possible?
00:46<CutMeOwnThroat>999M tst
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00:46<CutMeOwnThroat>my disk had only 1GB space, it's 100% full now :)
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00:47<CutMeOwnThroat>well, I just compressed >1 GB into 15 MB
00:47<RottNE>i am running out of disk space and i cannot figure out which file is growing
00:47<CutMeOwnThroat>so why not :)
00:48|-|dbldtx [] has joined #debian
00:48<dbldtx>I got all my problems fixed, you guys were really helpful!
00:48<CutMeOwnThroat>all depends, how random the information is... i.e. how much "real" information there is
00:49<RottNE>i'm not sure how much is "real", do you know a command where i can see the biggest files
00:49<RottNE>i have tried a few i found on the net but have not been helpful
00:49<CutMeOwnThroat>oh yeah...
00:49<CutMeOwnThroat>cant remember, but I sent a mail to someone I can look for
00:49<CutMeOwnThroat>because it was neat
00:50<RottNE>it would be greatly appreciated
00:50<CutMeOwnThroat>graphical even
00:50<CutMeOwnThroat>try gdmap
00:52<RottNE>ok, i will look into that
00:52<CutMeOwnThroat>else, i normally just did "du -hs *", then worked my way down to the biggest culprits :)
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00:52<RottNE>that sounds better :)
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00:53<CutMeOwnThroat>would be great, if a channel like this existed for medicine...
00:54<CutMeOwnThroat>but I guess the big difference is, that software can always be fixed :-/
00:54<RottNE>yeah, that would save lives
00:54<CutMeOwnThroat>cancer? well, buy a sharp knive, open you body up _there_, then [...]
00:55<RottNE>throat cancer :p
00:55|-|ssb changed nick to |
00:55<CutMeOwnThroat>that's something else
00:55<dpkg>well, dibbler is Cut Me Own Throat (C.M.O.T) Dibbler is a most enterprising 'merchant venturer' in Terry Pratchetts Discworld series. He is famous for selling meat by-products, i.e. sausages to unsuspecting souls (often referred to with "Can't make both ends meat"). His name originates from his catchphrase 'I'll even sell it to you for $XX, and that's cutting me own throat.'
00:55|-|| changed nick to ssb
00:56<CutMeOwnThroat>gdmap or du -hs?
00:56<RottNE>i tried du -hs * and it stopped listing after like 9
00:57<CutMeOwnThroat>then you only got 9 entries...
00:57<RottNE>and a blinking cursor
00:57<CutMeOwnThroat>well, takes some time
00:57<CutMeOwnThroat>if it's several 100 files...
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00:57<RottNE>200 GB worth
00:58<CutMeOwnThroat>so you didnt try gdmap?
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00:58<RottNE>not sure i know how
00:58<RottNE>im very new
00:58<CutMeOwnThroat>aptitude install gdmap
00:59<CutMeOwnThroat>then open any folder where you want to see which is taking most space within it
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00:59<CutMeOwnThroat>shows me, that most space is taken up by, ahem, films :) ...
00:59<RottNE>aptitude command not found
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00:59<CutMeOwnThroat>hope the RI AA doesnt have spies in here
01:00<CutMeOwnThroat>well, apt-get then
01:00|-|buzztracker [] has joined #debian
01:00<CutMeOwnThroat>apt-get install gdmap
01:00<RottNE>only Me >:)
01:00|-|pabs [] has left #debian [Don't rest until the streets are paved in poems.]
01:00<CutMeOwnThroat>or apt-get install aptitude; aptitude install gdmap
01:00<RottNE>its going
01:00<CutMeOwnThroat>the guys in here are pretty hot on aptitude...
01:00<RottNE>or not, broken packages?
01:01<RottNE>had to do aptitude first
01:01<RottNE>its been a long ass day
01:01<CutMeOwnThroat>apt-get update or aptitude update could be necessary
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01:02<CutMeOwnThroat>that gets the latest list of packages from the net...
01:02<RottNE>i wish i had my own linux box
01:02<RottNE>i see that
01:02<RottNE>gaming linux box would be nice
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01:04<RottNE>why cant i dl and install gdmap
01:04<RottNE>could i be typing the command wrong
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01:05<CutMeOwnThroat>what does it say
01:05<RottNE>aptitude command not found
01:05<CutMeOwnThroat>well, yeah
01:05<CutMeOwnThroat>I said, then use "apt-get install gdmap"
01:06<CutMeOwnThroat>but do "apt-get update" first
01:06<RottNE>im sorry, im not very smart
01:06<RottNE>did update
01:06<CutMeOwnThroat>alternatively, you could do "apt-get install aptitude" because aptitude is supposedly better according to the guys here
01:07<CutMeOwnThroat>perhaps dpkg knows why
01:07<dpkg>[aptitude] "the preferred program for package management from console. aptitude supports most command line operations of apt-get and has proven to be better at dependency resolution than apt-get." (4.0 Release Notes). A mostly drop-in replacement for apt-get. Don't mix use of apt-get and aptitude. See <why aptitude> <why not aptitude> <aptitude-fu>,
01:07<CutMeOwnThroat>!why aptitude
01:07<dpkg>aptitude has more advanced conflict/dependency resolution than other tools, it has far more advanced searching available, and will automatically uninstall unneeded dependencies, read /usr/share/doc/aptitude/README for more info
01:07<CutMeOwnThroat>!why not aptitude
01:07<dpkg>aptitude has many bugs, such as #299009, which other APT frontends do not have.
01:08<dpkg>To list uninstalled recommended or suggested packages: aptitude search '~RBsuggests:~i!~i'; upgradeable packages: aptitude search '~U'; manually installed packages: aptitude search '~i!~M'
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01:08<CutMeOwnThroat>so now we know all about it...
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03:01<Giacomo>is there any logfile for "cron" daemon?
03:01<Giacomo>my cron tasks are never being executed, or it seems like so
03:01|-|SUPERSLADAK [~ADRI@un1adri.ddns.HomeLan.BG] has joined #debian
03:01<Giacomo>is there any report like "At 10:10 I did this..."
03:01<SUPERSLADAK>thehe is enybody from Bulgaria ?
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03:02<SUPERSLADAK>i have a question my procesor is Intel core 2 duo and my pc support AMD64 bu show me X86-64 GNU unknown linux
03:02<SUPERSLADAK>why ?
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03:04<ghostrider>i have tested debian in this day and now i don't understand because a lot of people switch to ubuntu, debian is better
03:04<SUPERSLADAK>ubuntu = Debian
03:04<SUPERSLADAK>but ubuntu have a new interface
03:05<ghostrider>for n00b
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03:05<SUPERSLADAK>i have question to :)
03:05<CutMeOwnThroat>to whom
03:06<SUPERSLADAK>my procesor is Intel core 2 duo
03:06<SUPERSLADAK>and support AMD64
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03:06<metalqga_>is it possible
03:06<SUPERSLADAK>but when i`m work with gcc
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03:06<SUPERSLADAK>show me X86-64 GNU unknown linux
03:06<gsimmons_>Giacomo: You'd want to check your /var/log/syslog file.
03:06<SUPERSLADAK>and have error with usr/bin/ld
03:07<Giacomo>thank you gsimmons_
03:07<SUPERSLADAK>i cant understand
03:07<Giacomo>really helpful
03:07<CutMeOwnThroat>an intel processor from AMD?
03:07<SUPERSLADAK>Debian AMD64
03:07<SUPERSLADAK>and i dont know
03:07<metalqga_>well a new kernel
03:07<SUPERSLADAK>what i do
03:08<metalqga_>dl the correct kernel
03:08<CutMeOwnThroat>cant run an amd64 kernel on an intel
03:08<SUPERSLADAK>32 bit ?
03:08<CutMeOwnThroat>32bit support should be excellent
03:08<SUPERSLADAK>686 ?
03:09|-|mode/#debian [+l 291] by debhelper
03:09<SUPERSLADAK>a wood :)
03:09<SUPERSLADAK>i wood :)
03:09<tcsetattr>AMD64, x86_64, and Intel EM64T are different names for the same thing.
03:09<CutMeOwnThroat>what intel is it
03:09<SUPERSLADAK>just second
03:10<CutMeOwnThroat>tcsetattr, are they?
03:10<SUPERSLADAK>(CPU) Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU 6400 @ 2.13GHz, x86 Family 6 Model 15 Stepping 6, GenuineIntel - Central Processor - Load: %0 - 2127 Mhz
03:10<SUPERSLADAK>this is a procesor
03:11<SUPERSLADAK>cant support IA64
03:12<SUPERSLADAK>i think 32 bit Debian i386 i good for my pc ?
03:12<tcsetattr>ia64 is something else. It's the "Itanium" 64-bit processor that Intel came up with before the AMD64. ia64/Itanium never really caught on in the home PC market, and the 64-bit Intel processors now are mostly EM64T, which is their name for AMD64
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03:13<SUPERSLADAK>just tell me i386 ot amd64 ?
03:13<tcsetattr>they didn't want to admit that the roles had reversed (AMD invented something that became popular, and Intel had to clone it to keep up), so they invented their own name "EM64T" and pretended it was their idea
03:13<CutMeOwnThroat>i386 will work in any case
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03:13<SUPERSLADAK>have a nice day
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03:14<CutMeOwnThroat>tcsetattr, but do you want to say you CAN run an amd64 kernel on an intel processor because of that?
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03:15<CutMeOwnThroat>I wasnt aware something like EMT65T existed... havent followed the news a lot lately
03:16<tcsetattr>well they mainly use "EM64T" in their technical manuals. it's not something you see in the TV commercials with the dancing weirdos.
03:16<tcsetattr>if you look at the documentatino of one of those "Core 2 Duo" processors you'll find EM64T in there. It won't say "AMD64" but that's what it really is.
03:17<tcsetattr>and yes, amd64 is the correct architechture to run the recent Intel processors in 64-bit mode
03:18<CutMeOwnThroat>tcsetattr, I dont have a tv for 6 years :) no blue dancing weirdos here
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03:19<CutMeOwnThroat>ok, then why didnt that work for SUPERSLADAK?
03:19<tcsetattr>they aren't blue any more but the commercials are still baffling. (advertising a product that people don't buy directly, based on features they don't understand, how CAN that make sense?)
03:19<CutMeOwnThroat>well... "intel inside"
03:20<tcsetattr>I didn't see what he was complaining about, except that he saw the name "x86-64" and didn't recognize that it was equivalent to amd64
03:20<CutMeOwnThroat>it makes sense for them, that they buy computers with an intel non-amd processor in it
03:21<CutMeOwnThroat>hm, come to think of it (and read it a 2nd time) I'm not sure either
03:21<CutMeOwnThroat>seems to have nothing to do with the kernel
03:21<CutMeOwnThroat>dpkg knows nothing about that
03:21<CutMeOwnThroat>perhaps you want to change !intel
03:21<dpkg>rumour has it, intel is
03:22<CutMeOwnThroat>that aint too useful
03:22<dpkg>i heard architecture is a word for a design concept, it can be applied to software and hardware. In the common sense, it is often used as a synonym for "processor type", although that's not quite correct.
03:22<CutMeOwnThroat>already tried a couple of others while talking to S.
03:23<CutMeOwnThroat>either I can't guess the correct one, or there is no such information yet
03:24<dpkg>ports is, like,, or, or the FreeBSD ports system etc etc
03:24<tcsetattr>!listkeys amd64
03:24<dpkg>Factoid search of 'amd64' by key (11): _default openoffice amd64 ;; #debian amd64 ;; #debian amd64 ;; amd64 ;; a: no. "amd64" ;; #debian openoffice amd64 ;; debian-amd64 ;; amd64 ;; openoffice amd64 ;; _default amd64 ;; _default amd64.
03:24<tcsetattr>as long as we're bored...
03:24<CutMeOwnThroat>anyways, tcsetattr when you say "how CAN that make sense" - I did not know that advertising was known in any major way for the "sense" it made... or for the common sense it had
03:24<tcsetattr>! amd64
03:24<dpkg>hmm... amd64 is See and the #debian-amd64 IRC channel, or, now official, will be a supported arch on Etch, or a generic name. it also supports xeon etc, see Consider using debian/i386 if you do not have a good reason to use debian/amd64. for flash on amd64, ask me about nspluginwrapper
03:25<dpkg>it has been said that ia64 is (Intel Architecture-64), a 64-bit processor architecture developed in cooperation by Intel and Hewlett-Packard, implemented by processors such as Itanium and Itanium 2. The goal of Itanium was to produce a "post-RISC era" arch using EPIC. see -- if your CPU is opteron/athlon64/turion/sempron/xeon/em64t/pentium/core2duo/core*, then it is NOT ia64
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03:25<tcsetattr>last sentence of that one is pretty clear
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03:26<CutMeOwnThroat>well, there it is... if one knows what em64t is
03:26<tcsetattr>it also mentions "core*" though.
03:26<CutMeOwnThroat>but that's not a really obvious one, I guess
03:26<tcsetattr>I still don't know what question we are trying to answer though.
03:26<CutMeOwnThroat>there is one I will definitely answer in a couple of minutes
03:27<CutMeOwnThroat>it's the one "how nice will it feel, when I climb into my bed and close my eyes"
03:28<klys>sounds like the thing about being bored from earlier
03:28<CutMeOwnThroat>I think the answer will be "very"
03:29<CutMeOwnThroat>!_default amd64
03:29<dpkg>amd64 is probably See and the #debian-amd64 IRC channel, or, now official, will be a supported arch on Etch, or a generic name. it also supports xeon etc, see Consider using debian/i386 if you do not have a good reason to use debian/amd64. for flash on amd64, ask me about nspluginwrapper
03:30<CutMeOwnThroat>!a: no. "amd64"
03:30<dpkg>a: no. "amd64" is probably the name chosen by AMD for their 64-bit architecture. Before release, it was called "x86_64", and some distributions continue to use this name. Intel refers to its x86_64 instruction set CPUs as "EM64T". The architecture is still the same, and Debian amd64 will run on AMD and Intel x86 processors with 64-bit support. In honor of the inventing company, AMD, Debian uses the name
03:30<tcsetattr>_default is probably magical in some way we don't know.
03:30<CutMeOwnThroat>or damn stupid :)
03:30<tcsetattr>that one looks like an accident
03:30<CutMeOwnThroat>a: no. is ...
03:30<CutMeOwnThroat>pretty definitely stupid
03:31<CutMeOwnThroat>but there it is...
03:31<CutMeOwnThroat>now that was an obvious one to ask for *g*
03:33<klys>dpkg: a: no. "amd64" is probably already something else
03:33<dpkg>...but a: no. "amd64" is already something else...
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03:34<tcsetattr>since some are prefixed with "_default" and "#debian" I guess that means there are channel-specific responses
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03:35<CutMeOwnThroat>sounds reasonable
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03:35<CutMeOwnThroat>!_default amd64
03:35<dpkg>amd64 is, like, See and the #debian-amd64 IRC channel, or, now official, will be a supported arch on Etch, or a generic name. it also supports xeon etc, see Consider using debian/i386 if you do not have a good reason to use debian/amd64. for flash on amd64, ask me about nspluginwrapper
03:35<CutMeOwnThroat>!#debian amd64
03:36<dpkg>amd64 is, like, See and the #debian-amd64 IRC channel, or, now official, will be a supported arch on Etch, or a generic name. it also supports xeon etc, see Consider using debian/i386 if you do not have a good reason to use debian/amd64. for flash on amd64, ask me about nspluginwrapper
03:36<CutMeOwnThroat>looks pretty much the same to me
03:37<CutMeOwnThroat>!a: no. "amd64"
03:37<dpkg>rumour has it, a: no. "amd64" is the name chosen by AMD for their 64-bit architecture. Before release, it was called "x86_64", and some distributions continue to use this name. Intel refers to its x86_64 instruction set CPUs as "EM64T". The architecture is still the same, and Debian amd64 will run on AMD and Intel x86 processors with 64-bit support. In honor of the inventing company, AMD, Debian uses the name
03:38<CutMeOwnThroat>klys must love eliza :)
03:38<CutMeOwnThroat>well good night
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03:49<whooptedoo>hi im a ubuntu user, used to use debian. I Like both systems. Can anyone tell me your personal recommendations of one or the other? Ive googled it and there is a lot of personal opinion rather than hard fact
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03:50<whooptedoo>Perhaps Ubuntu is better for the desktop and newbies but Debian is a more appropriate server OS?
03:51<dzs>whooptedoo: the only "hard fact" i can think of right now is, that Ubuntu uses most Debian packages without any changes
03:51<klys>whooptedoo: do 'apt-cache search /'
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03:52<dzs>and if you ask "what is better" you can only get opinions as response. cause there is no scientific work out there on the Internets as far as i know
03:53<klys>run a diff with yours
03:53<klys>I'd like you to upload yours too
03:54<noflash>!tell whooptedoo -about why debian
03:54<klys>no rush on that
03:54<whooptedoo>hang on ill follow that link cheers for your help
03:54<dzs>whooptedoo: but you can get closer to an answer if you define for yourself what a good desktop OS should have, what a good server OS should have, and then check if that is covered by Ubuntu and Debian
03:54<klys>wget it
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03:55<dzs>klys: how is that package list answering the question of whooptedoo?
03:55<klys>dzs, it's debian-unstable, and his diff could
03:55<whooptedoo>hang on a mo
03:56<dzs>klys: yes, could do what?
03:56<whooptedoo>sorry, dialup
03:56<klys>compare them
03:56<dzs>and then?
03:56<klys>he should run sort on the diff
03:56<dzs>and what does that say about quality?
03:57<klys>it's more about facts
03:57<dzs>unrelated facts
03:57<klys>unrelated to the quality of my selection?
03:57<dzs>the list would make sense if you compare the differences of the packages of the same version
03:58<klys>well, they're not all the same version in ubuntu
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03:58<klys>do you have a better fix?
03:58<dzs>and if you do that for the entire distribution and are done with that by next year, then i would be interested to read about the results
03:59<shawn_>Can someone tell me how to change the default sound device with a command?
03:59<klys>there aren't differences in packages that are the same version, unless they are configured differently. it's no big deal
03:59<dzs>klys: no offense, but i fail to see how "is package XY installed" is any criteria to measure quality of a distribution
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03:59<klys>hmm, sound 'device'? are you using alsa?
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04:00<klys>the quality of selection in a claimant to the distribution tactic
04:00<shawn_>may be may be not
04:00<shawn_>how do i tell?
04:01<klys>do you have...two sound cards?
04:01<dzs>if you think around 5 corners and tend to like obscurity
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04:01<klys>what would solve the problem tonight then?
04:01<shawn_>yeah klys
04:01<shawn_>i have twosoudn cards
04:01<whooptedoo>Ok I ran apt-cache search / > myubuntu.txt then diff debian-unstable.txt myubuntu.txt > ubuntu_debian.txt
04:02<klys>shawn_: then check /dev/dsp2
04:02<shawn_>how do i set /sev/dsp2 default?
04:02<klys>whooptedoo: do you have hosting?
04:02<whooptedoo>i guess the file ubuntu_debian.txt shows the differences in packages
04:02<whooptedoo>sorry what is hosting?
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04:05<whooptedoo>oh yeah Ive got a few crappy web pages Ive made, hosted in various places but Im not a pro system administrator just like fooling around
04:05<klys>whooptedoo: do you mind posting it?
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04:05<cahoot>shawn_, - see 3.14
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04:06<whooptedoo>oh i see sorry i don't really have anywhere to post it
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04:07<AndyJ_Australia>Hi people! How do I find files on my mobile phone?
04:07<klys>whooptedoo: sign up for something then and get back to me on it
04:07<AndyJ_Australia>I can see it with gammu/wammu and kmobile, but cannot see any of the files (pictures etc.)
04:07<whooptedoo>ok can you recommend one?
04:08<klys> supports perl and php4 but not python
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04:09<AndyJ_Australia>Anyone have experience moving files on and off Nokia mobiles?
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04:10<whooptedoo>klys:do you want to see the result of that diff?
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04:14<whooptedoo>sorry Im new to irc, can i give it to you here or can i have your email address?
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04:15<whooptedoo>cheers check your mail
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04:16<klys>I have a fetchmail script that deposits maildir every minute or so, and alpine is open on tty11
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04:17<klys>I just need to come up with a decent notification system, rather than terminal beeps
04:17<whooptedoo>sorry mate you're streets ahead of me. What is alpine?
04:17<klys>it's text-mode and works with courier imap mail server
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04:19<AndyJ_Australia>anyone? Howto mount a Nokia mobile?
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04:21<whooptedoo>noflash: just read the why debian page you gave me, it seems to apply to ubuntu too. Isn't Debian a subset of Ubuntu
04:22<dli>!tell whooptedoo about #ubuntu
04:22<klys>whooptedoo: it wasn't delivered, if you sent it at 3:15
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04:26<whooptedoo>klys: still in process of sending. Dialup.
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04:29<klys>run it through sort and see what you've got
04:30<klys>also don't forget about
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04:31<whooptedoo>how do i interpret the output of sort?
04:31<klys>well, each line starting with < or > is debian or ubuntu...or ubuntu or should be able to tell
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04:32<klys>pipe it into less, so sort debian-ubuntu.txt | sort | less
04:32<klys>hit q when done
04:32<klys>hit /search to search for 'search'
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04:33<klys>then / CR for the next occurrence
04:33<whooptedoo>do you mean sort ubuntu_debian.txt | sort | less or should that be cat at the start
04:34<klys>ok, cat | sort | less ;)
04:35<whooptedoo>ok.... i guess that is helpful if im looking for a specific package
04:35<klys>does your question go further?
04:36<klys>for bugtraq see
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04:37<whooptedoo>but it doesn't answer my question. As a new Ubuntu convert from Debian, it seems that Ubuntu = Debian + extras. So I am asking for a reason why I might want to go back to Debian. Can't I just add debian repos if I need some debian packages?
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04:38<MoDaX>whooptedoo: higher quality
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04:38<klys>whooptedoo: which distribution you are using depends solely on the package `libc6' and where you got it
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04:40<whooptedoo>ok can you please explain?
04:40<klys>everything you use depends on libc6 and it interfaces with the main part of the kernel. X also interfaces with supplementary kernel drivers like DRM, etc.
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04:42<klys>libc6, ldso, and binutils for developers form a major part of system stability
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04:43<klys>this is why you are not considered a mac user ;)
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04:44<whooptedoo>ok thanks Im just doing some reading on libc on wikipedia
04:44<klys>I mean, adobe would probably crash on linux too, but not for as long as it had been doing on a mac. people would fix it
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04:52<whooptedoo>so correct me if I'm wrong, but Ubuntu and Debian are pretty much the same thing except for a few packages. And you say libc6 is the defining package? What is the difference between libc6 for Debian and Ubuntu?
04:54<klys>I have 2.6-2
04:54<klys>what does ubuntu have? (apt-cache show libc6)
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04:55<whooptedoo>klys:Version: 2.5-0ubuntu14
04:55<klys>so, mine is newer
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04:55<klys>it's unstable distribution after all
04:55<Gregory>what package do i need for making .h, .o, and .c files
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04:55<dpkg>well, libc6 is the GNU C library version 2, which Debian uses since 2.0. Do not try to downgrade it. It is a essential component of your Debian system, and we are not responsible if it breaks.
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04:56<Gregory>file.o: file not recognized: File format not recognized
04:56<klys>gregory: all .h files are typically made by hand. same with .c
04:56<Gregory>is the error i recieve
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04:56<klys>do `file file.o' with fileutils installed
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04:57<whooptedoo>klys:so are you suggesting that debian is a more up to date OS than Ubuntu? I thought it was the other way around. You are using unstable, after all
04:57<klys>I believe debian unstable matters and is more up to date than ubuntu, since you're asking for my opinion
04:57<Gregory>it says ASCII C program text
04:58<dbldtx>Small problem = 2.6.18-5-686 and 2.6.18-5-486 are both installed. GRUB picks 686 for me which I do not want because my /dev doesnt see my USB keyboard until boot. How can I remove the 686 kernel?
04:58<klys>gregory, rename it to .c
04:58<dbldtx>How can I see what it's package name is at least?
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04:58<Gregory>well it already is a .c file
04:58<Gregory>i did file file.c
04:58<klys>dbldtx: add a default=1 line to /boot/grub/menu.lst
04:59<dbldtx>KLYS; thankyou
04:59<klys>dbldtx: if you still need help, emacs and read the tutorial
04:59<whooptedoo>klys:you are a machine. What do you do for a living?
04:59<dbldtx>.lst or 1st?
04:59<dbldtx>okay got it
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04:59<klys>whooptedoo: I stay up at night and do stuff like
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05:01<klys>gregory: gcc -c -o file.o file.c
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05:02<whooptedoo>Klys: sorry that link doesn't work?
05:05<klys>I didn't misspell it and it worked
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05:05<klys>maybe you need a .jpeg file association
05:05<whooptedoo>what is that?
05:05<klys>or ln -s desk006.jpeg klys.jpg
05:06<klys>then view the jpg
05:06<whooptedoo>i tried to open it in my browser, ill try wget now
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05:17<rdd>Hello ! Right now im trying so switch from lilo to grub. but when i try to grub-install it gives me . thanks for help !
05:17<rdd>and i dont know what this file is for
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05:19<rdd>some time ago i read the message that /dev/sda3 i not set active which is my /root/ . how can i set it active ?
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05:21<rdd>well, i set it active now with fdisk -a but grub-install still dont work
05:23<rdd>the file stage2 is there why cant it be read correctly ...
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05:25<AndyJ_Australia>Hi team, I'm trying to access a mobile telephone, I can see it, but need help to mount it.
05:26<AndyJ_Australia>It's showing up as /dev/ttyACM0
05:26<AndyJ_Australia>What type should I use in a mount command?
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05:27<Blaheva>damn penguins, no i wont burn the neighbours house down!!!
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05:30<AndyJ_Australia>It shows up with lsusb as:
05:30<AndyJ_Australia>Bus 001 Device 004: ID 0421:0802 Nokia Mobile Phones
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05:30<rdd>why i get these errors ? look very strange
05:30<Blaheva>does it have a minisd card orsomething?
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05:31<AndyJ_Australia>No this phone only has onboard memory, I have card readers for the other devices
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05:53<whooptedoo>klys: I never saw that jpg?
05:54<klys>whooptedoo: what did wget say?
05:55<whooptedoo>klys: HTTP request sent, awaiting response...
05:55<klys>say --timeout=3
05:56<whooptedoo>klys: ok now it fails alltogether
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05:58<klys>hmm, I hope your hosting turns out better than mine. wget
05:59<Aleric>If I want to run over values aaa bbb and ccc outputted by an appliction foo, I can do: for x in `foo`; do ...; done; But what if foo outputs values with spaces? How can I run over "a a", "b b" and "c c"?
05:59<whooptedoo>klys: that worked ok
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06:01<whooptedoo>klys: could you email me that jpg?
06:01<klys>still haven't got your mail though
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06:02<whooptedoo>really? That hotmail for you I guess. Bill Gates is probably still busy reading it.
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06:05<whooptedoo>klys: please let me know when you've sent the jpg
06:08<klys>whooptedoo: if you sent me a /msg it probably didn't do through, my nick is not currently available to me
06:08<dpkg>rumour has it, nickserv is the nickname registration bot for Freenode. /msg nickserv help for more details.
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06:11<klys>whooptedoo: so I don't have your email. if you're still interested
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06:11<klys>man, I'm so shameless
06:11<klys>but nobody's talking and it's the middle of the night, so what can I say
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06:15<whooptedoo>middle of the night? where are you?
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06:16<whooptedoo>ok. Yep ive got the jpg now.
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06:17<whooptedoo>do you program in python?
06:17<klys>well, If I had web hosting what would allow it I probably would
06:18<klys>I just have a couple of per scripts I'm working on
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06:20<joachim>&nick RalfG
06:20<klys>the browsers are with xulrunner and the terminals use eterm and screen. the windowmanager is fluxbox
06:20|-|joachim changed nick to RalfG
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06:22<whooptedoo>man I must be behind the times, I don't even know what that jpg is showing. Is that your desktop?
06:25<whooptedoo>klys: thanks for your help re debian vs ubuntu. Ive got to go.
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06:39|-|mode/#debian [+l 297] by debhelper
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06:51<sheldonh>should "module-assistant auto-install alli" build and install (if not already installed) just those packages that are already installed?
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06:52<sheldonh>i'm looking for any easy one-liner for staff documentation, that will ensure that all custom modules are rebuilt and installed for a new kernel when dist-upgrade upgrades the kernel
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06:54<dzs>sheldonh: maybe you could feed "dpkg -i | grep module" to "m-a a-i $list"
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06:55<sheldonh>dzzs: dpkg -i?
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06:55<dzs>"-l", sorry. but i saw it needs more filtering
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06:56<sheldonh>dzs: there doesn't seem to be a clear naming convention for them. sometimes it's foo-kernel, sometimes its foo-modules
06:57<dzs>that ruins my idea
06:57<sheldonh>dzs: but perhaps i could look for the running kernel's version in the package name (e.g. 2.6.18-4-686)
06:57<dzs>ah, thats an idea yes
06:58<dzs>or you just keep a hand written text file with the modules you manually build. should not be too many i assume
06:59<sheldonh>dzs: if i can figure out a way to distinguish custom vs vanilla modules in /etc/modules, that would work too
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07:00<sheldonh>dzs: i can get the running kernel package's contents with dpkg -L linux-image-`uname -r`
07:01<dzs>i would not make it too complicated. the entire thing wont run fully automated anyways, because you need to reboot
07:01<sheldonh>dzs: then, for each module in /etc/modules, see if it's in that package
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07:02<vilhjalms>hi all
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07:04<dzs>so basically, a skilled person needs to check anyways if the new kernel package should be installed or not. if the person installs a new kernel, then she/he can call for I in `cat manual-list.txt`; do m-a a-i $I; done
07:05<sheldonh>dzs: what makes you say a skilled person needs to check whether the new kernel should be installed? if sources have been configured appropriately, the only updated kernel updates are security updates
07:05<mike>Hi! I need help. I have 2 partition with Debian on each. How to delete second and make first bootable. Now is second bootable
07:06<dzs>sheldonh: yeah. but would you force the reboot also for the dummy person?
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07:07<sheldonh>dzs: the "dummy" person isn't a complete moron, just someone who may not be intimately familiar with the host. the staff documentation will instruct them to perform the reboot, assuming it's during a maintenance window
07:08<dzs>sheldonh: the point is the longer your chain of automated things gets, the more likely it is that something mysteriously works in an unexpected way
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07:08<Kalle44>hi can someone help i want to install a firefox32 bit with java support on debian etch 64 but i dont know how this work have someone a good tutfor me ....
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07:09<dzs>sheldonh: if you keep it at very simple and small tasks the possible failure is smaller and in case one small task fails, its easier to debug
07:09<sheldonh>dzs: got it. and i'm just trying to do the best i can to avoid mistakes. for example, if i keep a new file that contains custom built kernel modules, it won't be long before someone installs a new custom kernel module and forgets to update the list
07:09<sheldonh>dzs: the only thing i'm trying to do here is identify those kernel modules that were installed by m-a and should be reinstalled for the new kernel
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07:10<sheldonh>dzs: i'm not trying to create an entirely automated process. i'm trying to make one particular step of a clearly documented process harder to screw up
07:10<dzs>sheldonh: sure. you could put "for I in `cat manual-list.txt`; do m-a a-i $I; done" in a script and put some candy around it. so the person just has to call "" or whatever
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07:12<sheldonh>dzs: but then we have a special way of installing kernel modules that isn't the debian way :)
07:12<sheldonh>dzs: ultimately, i reckon "m-a a-i alli" should just do what i want
07:12<sheldonh>dzs: writing to manual-list.txt will be a magic step that isn't the debian way :)
07:14<dzs>i dont know where you made up this "alli" option
07:14<sheldonh>dzs: man module-assistant, search forward for alli
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07:15<sheldonh>this spits out the custom kernel packages i have: for name in `sed -e 's/*#.*$//' < /etc/modules`; do file=$(find /lib/modules/`uname -r` -name $name.ko); [ -n "$file" ] && dpkg -S $file ; done | awk -F: '$1 !~ /^linux-image/ {print $1}' | sort | uniq
07:15<sheldonh>wow, my client so cocked that up :)
07:16<sheldonh>dzs: this grabs all custom module packages installed for the running kernel:
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07:17<dzs>that you could have done with "m-a li"
07:19<sheldonh>dzs: ah, much better. i'll use that instead
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07:20<dzs>but maybe i am too tired to read, i cant find a reference to "alli" on Debian Etch
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07:21<sheldonh>dzs: you are indeed too tired to read :)
07:21<dzs>or do you fiddle with Ubuntu?
07:21<sheldonh>dzs: never seen ubuntu
07:21<dzs>or testing/unstable?
07:21<sheldonh>dzs: no, i have module-assistant_0.10.8 from stable
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07:23<sheldonh>dzs: you da man! m-a a-i -f -l <new-kernel-version> `sudo m-a li | awk '$3 == "installed" {print $1}'`
07:23<sheldonh>minus the sudo, of course
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07:24<sheldonh>m-a a-i -f -l <new-kernel-version> `m-a li | awk '$3 == "installed" {print $1}'`
07:24[~]sheldonh presses on with maintenance docs
07:25<sheldonh>the debian docs are a lot simpler than the gentoo ones :)
07:25<dzs>was a long way to go, but i am glad that i could give a few hints
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07:27<sheldonh>dzs: this is what comes of jumping around in a manual page, instead of reading it from start to finish, and then working up an approach based on what's available. "m-a li" was the cornerstone :)
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08:08<xbc>hi, does networkmanger overwrite resolf.conf, if it's manually set?
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08:12<mikkelorz>i need to start wpa_supplicant at default runlevel.. how do i do it?
08:14<dpkg>methinks wpa is Wi-Fi Protected Access. A WPA supplicant is provided in Debian Etch and Sarge in the 'wpasupplicant' package. Read /usr/share/doc/wpasupplicant/README.modes.gz to configure the supplicant as desired.
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08:16<mikkelorz>well if it works as described it's much cooler than manually doing it i suppose.. thanks gsimmons_ :)
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08:22<sheldonh>xbc: not networkmanager itself, but certainly the dhcp client you use might
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08:31<Asche>Hi All
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08:31<Asche>NOOB question
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08:33<Asche>trying to install Lenny on a quad proc PPro intel server, will not accept CD boot from Linux distros... what is the command for writing floppies in Linux? I have the floppy images on my desktop, just need to write them...
08:33<dpkg>well, wpa is Wi-Fi Protected Access. A WPA supplicant is provided for Debian Etch and Sarge in the 'wpasupplicant' package. Read /usr/share/doc/wpasupplicant/README.modes.gz to configure the supplicant as desired.
08:35<lupine>dd if=/path/to/floppy/image of=/dev/fd0
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08:35<lupine>assuming that fd0 is the right floppy drive, of course
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08:37<Asche>dd if=source of destination?
08:38<lupine>if stands for input file; of for output file
08:38<lupine>df --help or man df for more info
08:38<Asche>'k thanks!
08:38<lupine>erm. dd :D
08:38<Asche>heh! ok
08:39<Asche>(thanks Jimmy Finlayson for the D'Oh!!!
08:39<Asche>he predated Homer by about 50 years... and it is where Groenig got it...
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08:49<dzs>when you "dpkg --unpack" where does the stuff end up?
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08:51<stuart>if i buy an external hard drive, can i boot from it?
08:51<dzs>if your BIOS supports it
08:51<stuart>how do i know if it does or not
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08:51<dzs>the motherboard manual should reveal that
08:52<stuart>ok, thanks dzs
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09:03<tokemmm>I have a problem, could anyone help me? it's about the initializing proccess...
09:07<gsimmons_>tokemmm: Just go ahead and describe your problem.
09:08<tokemmm>I cant initialize my debian lenny. It says that there's not enough space in the disk...
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09:10<tokemmm>it happend after I transfered a plenty of files that were in my other HD to the "/dev/hda1 one".
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09:12<Asche>okay, back... helps if the computer you are trying to write floppies from has it's floppy controller turned ON!!!
09:13<Asche>got an error when trying to write the floppies that the disk is read only, and the lock window is open... how do i tell the filesystem that it is RW?
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09:13<klys>close the lock window
09:13<klys>it should b opaque
09:13<Asche>(trying to write floppies for Lenny install on old quad PPro that will not let me boot from CD
09:14<klys>actually come to think of it it should be open nm
09:14<klys>you using dd ?
09:14<klys>or rawrite3
09:15<klys>pop it out a few times?
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09:17<klys>hmm, there were old dos utilities to write to ro flopies. look around
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09:17<Asche>is there an easy way to use a hard drive to hold an image to load from? kinda like copying the CD used to do for win9X?
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09:18[~]Asche does not have win on this computer...
09:19<Asche>hmm... /me looks at WIFE's computer... rawrite....
09:19<frank>dd is similar to rawrite
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09:28<Asche>well, apparently... I have no good floppy disks! cannot format any of them...
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09:29<Asche>is there a way to load a cd image onto a small HD to initiate a network install?
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09:29<Asche>I have several IDE drives...
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09:30<WhiskyCola>hey evry1
09:31<WhiskyCola>how do i add a file to autostart ?
09:31<Eulex>Asche, no, but check out the hd-media option for installing debian.
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09:31<Eulex>WhiskyCola, 'file'?
09:31<WhiskyCola>a task
09:32<Asche>Eulex HD Media will let me install from a hard drive?
09:32<Eulex>WhiskyCola, autostart when in the boot process?
09:32<Eulex>Asche, afaik yes, but I've never tried it myself.
09:32<WhiskyCola>Eulex, yes
09:33<Eulex>no, that was a question about *when*, not a yes/no question
09:33<gsimmons_>Asche: Yes. See sections 2.2.3, 4.2.1 ("hd-media"), 4.5 and 5.1.2 of the Installation Guide.
09:33<WhiskyCola>before starting xserver
09:34<pcperini>what are you talking about?
09:34<Eulex>!tell WhiskyCola about init.d
09:34<Asche>'k because I have gone through TONS of CDR media trying to get it to accept... even took it's drive and burned the image from another computer and verified it to make sure it should see the disks...
09:34<Asche>'k tnx!
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09:37<pcperini>in knoppix, is there a way to save the config to a SD flash card, or a flash drive?
09:37<dpkg>Knoppix is _not_ Debian. Seek Knoppix help in freenode's #knoppix. Knoppix is a live CD distro which is <based on Debian>, useful as a rescue CD, to test hardware, and for situations where you have access to a computer but it isn't Debian. unoffical:
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09:42<Golfgeo>Got a question: looking for a webcam chat app that will run without the need of a server and will run on Debian and Windows, any ideas?
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09:43<lupine>Golfgeo: gnomemeeting is compatible with netmeeting, IIRC?
09:44<dli>!tell Golfgeo about ekiga
09:45<Golfgeo>Hmm, but than I'll still have to setup a sip account, and the point is to have a simple app for "p2p" communications...
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09:45<dli>Golfgeo, ekiga is p2p
09:46<Golfgeo>I looked at it but taking a second look (the voip put me off the last time)
09:47<lupine>IIRC, you can dial each other directly with SIP (e.g. username@ip, as opposed to username@broker)
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09:50<Golfgeo>Thanks mates
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09:54<Mindtech>With the debian multimedia repositories, how can I use APT to see a list of whats available?
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09:56<Mindtech>With the debian multimedia repositories, how can I use APT to see a list of whats available?
09:56<tolecnal>Mindtech: if you've followed the instructions on the site, and imported the key, it should be a matter of updating apt's cache and then do apt-cache/apt-get commands as usual
09:56<Mindtech>I did import the key
09:56<tolecnal>Mindtech: and there is absolutely no need to repeat
09:57<Mindtech>I just don't know whats available within the package
09:57<tolecnal>install apt-file, that gives you a chance to see what's inside a package
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10:02<Mindtech>What I mean to ask is, how can I find out what packages the multimedia repositry holds
10:02<@Ganneff>zless on its packages.gz file
10:02<simonrvn>go look
10:04<Mindtech>Which directory is it in?
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10:05<simonrvn>there's several
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10:05<Mindtech>For the multimedia repo
10:06<quasisane>Mindtech: after you have added the appropriate lines to your 'sources.list' and ran 'update' then the package files can be found in /var/lib/apt/lists
10:06<Mindtech>thanks quasisane
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10:06<quasisane>and most of the packages should show up in the 'New' section in aptitude or dselect
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10:25<DejaVu>hi all
10:25<prahal>how can one enable the debian menu in gnome ?
10:26<prahal>**** sorry I found out
10:27<DejaVu>etch 4.0r1 has support for via6421a (sata controller) ???
10:27<DejaVu>i try to install it but it doesn't found the disks and the controller
10:28<junio>latex2html isn´t debian?
10:29<@Ganneff>it is, but its non-free crap, so look into non-free
10:29<junio>Ganneff: thanks
10:29<mankod>junio, latex2html - LaTeX to HTML translator
10:29<junio>Have a free alternative to latex2html?
10:30<DejaVu>ah ok
10:30<DejaVu>not for me
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10:31<DejaVu>can u help me?
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10:33<gatto>ciao a tutti
10:35<dpkg>per aiuto in lingua italiana, provi il canale #debian-it sulla rete (non C'è anche il canale #linux-it là.
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10:36<dpkg>one warez list being sent to gatto
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10:37<fxiny>i was waiting fot it
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10:43<aycko>i get "Message could not be sent because a connection error occurred" all the time with gaim
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10:43<aycko>i googled it, but there is no satisfying answer.
10:43|-|emonge [~emonge@] has quit [Quit: That's all for now, folks]
10:43<aycko>is this a gaim protocol problem?
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10:46<gabrix>hello everyone
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10:46<gabrix>avrei bisogno di una mano ...
10:47<gabrix>su gnupg
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10:47<sheldonh>Unknown id: gnupg
10:49<sheldonh>gpg: Go ahead and type your message ...
10:49<gabrix>i need help on gpg
10:49<gabrix>i have several keys exported ...
10:50<sheldonh>try asking a question about gpg in english on this channel, or another language on another channel
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10:50<gabrix>i want to make one of those my private
10:51<sheldonh>gabrix: do you mean you want to make it your default signing key
10:51<sheldonh>gabrix: set default-key in ~/.gnupg/options
10:52<gabrix>but if i launc --list-secret-keys i see none
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10:52<sheldonh>gabrix: then you haven't imported the key you were expecting to import
10:53<gabrix>if i launch --list-keys i see it
10:53<ziringha>ubuntu it please
10:53<petemc>what does it mean to ubuntu something?
10:53<sheldonh>gabrix: you can't sign with only a public key
10:53<sheldonh>petemc: make pretty
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10:53<ziringha>channel it
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10:55<gabrix>i have to edit keys i have imported to make a secret one
10:55<sheldonh>gabrix: you sure about that? :)
10:56<gabrix>i don't want to make a new keypair
10:56<sheldonh>gabrix: if --list-secret-keys shows no secret keys, you haven't imported any secret keys. i'm pretty sure you can't "edit a key to make it a secret one"
10:56<sheldonh>gabrix: if you didn't export the secret key, you're screwed
10:57<gabrix>gpg --keyserver --recv keyid , right ?
10:57<sheldonh>gabrix: nobody puts private keys on a keyserver
10:58<sheldonh>gabrix: think about it. private key. public keyserver. :-)
10:58<gabrix>how do i make a private key not generating a new keypair
10:58<sheldonh>gabrix: you can't
10:58<sheldonh>gabrix: if you can, some people at the NSA would like to talk to you
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10:59<gabrix>i have a backed up keypair he same on 4 macines but they don't work
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11:00<sheldonh>gabrix: i suspect that you backed up the public key, not the private key. but let's see. what does "they don't work" mean?
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11:00<gabrix>enigmail or any mailclient they don't accept the keys
11:01<gabrix>i post u an output
11:01<sheldonh>gabrix: please use a pastebin, please don't paste the output into this channel
11:01<gabrix>a paste bin ?
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11:02<rjent>greetings: any ideas why a 3c905 card will not dhcp on lenny?
11:02<sheldonh>gabrix: google for paste bin
11:03<dpkg>Please don't paste anything into the channel; use a paste site instead, like: or or or for pics. --- Also ask me: pastebin pipe
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11:03<sheldonh>rjent: does ethtool report that the nic has link?
11:03<lupine>hello sailor
11:03<gabrix>i will be short
11:03<gabrix>error-bad passphrase
11:04<lupine>hmm. It's just a guess, but maybe the passphrase is bad?
11:04<gabrix>gpg: problem with the agent - disabling agent
11:04<rjent>hang on I will check
11:04<RottNE>hello room, how would i delete files by their file name through a range, such as foobar.txt01 - foobar.txt20
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11:05<dli>Ron242, rm foobar.txt[0-2][0-9]
11:05<lupine>RottNE: something like 'rm foo.txt[0-2][0-9]
11:05<sheldonh>heading out to shop, will scroll back when i return
11:05<RottNE>thanks, i will try that :)
11:05<Mike_>How long does debian provide security updates for old distributions versions?
11:06<dli>Mike_, usually, 1 year, debian maintains two releases
11:07<gabrix>bad passphrase --- impossible i use always the same one
11:08<gabrix>i cleared the saved passphrase
11:08<gabrix>i dunno what to do ...
11:09<gabrix>newkeypair ?
11:09<rjent>sheldonh: no
11:09<rjent>sheldonh: what package has the ip command that is something like ifconfig?
11:09|-|E0x [] has joined #debian
11:09<Mike_>thx dli
11:12<rjent>sheldonh: it was being aliased in as eth2
11:13<rjent>sheldonh: I installed something the other day that had the ip command for ip -a to list all interfaces found on the system but I can not remember what package it was. Supposed to replace ifconfig
11:13<petemc> /msg dpkg search
11:14<RottNE>ok, i guess my foobar.txt example didnt help me, say the file name was _log4j.txt.2007-07-12 and i wanted to delete to _log4j.txt.2007-08-17, what would the command be for that, i greatly appreciate it
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11:16<rjent>petemc: thanks
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11:20<fxiny>rjent: do you mean ipadrr ? iirc is in iproute
11:20<gabrix>ifconfig is in net-tools
11:21<fxiny>s/ipadrr/ip adrr/
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11:23<fxiny>ops , petemc said it already
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11:34<zangetsu>hi i have a question..
11:34<zangetsu>can you help me please?
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11:35<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For Example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. when I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, or if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask (ask the whole channel!). We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer, ask later or ask
11:35<zangetsu>my english is berinnger, my problem is ...i need install x-window and gnome , i install in my laptop debian netinstall minimal
11:36<zangetsu>in channel #debian-es , not responding me
11:36|-|lirovax [] has joined #debian
11:37<Valombre>just identify yourself as root and run "apt-get install gnome-desktop-environment x-window-system x-window-system-core"
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11:39<gabrix>i made a new gpg keypair
11:39<foxure>Hello.. Is there a way to limit some user to only be able to execute ssh and a small amout of other programss?
11:39<zangetsu>ok and what configurate my vga?
11:39<gabrix>would be possible use it just for signing
11:40<gabrix>not exporting it on a keyserver
11:40<gabrix>i have tons of keys on all keyservers of the planet
11:41<gabrix>it's such a mess
11:41<gabrix>but i'm getting into it
11:41<gabrix>not the mess the gpg ...
11:41<gabrix>i meant
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11:49<rjent>fxiny: and all thanks for help. All is now well.
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11:56<gabrix>ok i make my own way ... bye
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11:57<mzungu>moin! ich habe US-tastaturlayout -- aber unfreiwillig // im CC steht Deutsch --- wieso
11:58<mzungu>zeitzone uhrzeit stimmt auch nicht
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12:01<yosef>I have problem, it wasn't before, when I'm trying to delete any file, it say i don't have permission, so I want to go root for each file I want to delete, what can I do?
12:02<yosef>the files i'm trying to delete are mine
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12:04<dzs>could anybody give me a helping hand on chrooting sid under etch, having gdm in the chroot run on the vt9?
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12:05<dzs>as soon as i start gdm i end up with a blank screen and cant get to any console anymore
12:05<yosef>dzs: what chrooting mean?
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12:05<sheldonh>can you BELIEVE there are still pizza delivery places in this world that don't even have their menu online?
12:05<dzs>yosef: if you dont know what it means you wont be of much help :)
12:06<yosef>sheldonh: we have such
12:06<sheldonh>dzs: are you using a proprietary driver for x?
12:06<yosef>dzs: you much experienced then me, But for me know what's that, I'm begginer
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12:07<dzs>sheldonh: does the driver have to be the same in both environments?
12:08<fxiny>sheldonh: maybe you just discovered another mafia pizza connection shop :P
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12:12<sheldonh>dzs: well, i'd be surprised if the drivers that enable direct rendering worked inside a chroot
12:12<sheldonh>dzs: especially if you're using direct rendering on the outside :)
12:13<sheldonh>fxiny: ha! a buddy tried to order artichokes from these guys. once he'd explained what artichokes are, the guy said "oh, no, we don't got any of that funny stuffs here" :)
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12:17<fxiny>sheldonh: heheheh : i bet that one was a three letters agency cover up special officier then ;)
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12:18<shawn_>How do i set an essid on a wireless device instead of automated essid search?
12:18<shawn_>i know
12:18<shawn_>but i type iwconfig ra0 essid "My network essid"
12:19<shawn_>and when i retype iwconfig ra0 it says essid =""
12:19<ifvoid>oh, no idea then
12:19<ifvoid>I jus tuse network-manager
12:19<yosef>I have problem, it wasn't before, when I'm trying to delete any file, it say i don't have permission, so I want to go root for each file I want to delete, what can I do?the files i'm trying to delete are mine
12:19<shawn_>a commadn line prog?
12:19<azeem>shawn_: do you run iwconfig as root?
12:19<shawn_>lemme check
12:20<chealer>yosef: on which filesystem?
12:20<shawn_>yes azeem
12:20<ifvoid>yosef: for deleting you need write access on the directory
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12:20<shawn_>but maybe ti a command syntax probleù
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12:20<yosef>chealer: sorry, I post it by mistake, problem solved
12:20<shawn_>check if i write the good way
12:20<azeem>shawn_: what's your essid?
12:20<ifvoid>oh ok
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12:21<yosef>chealer: ifvoid: I solved by deleteing the .Trash folder and make another one
12:21<lanceallott>shawn_: are you setting behind a wireless router?
12:21<shawn_>its not a adhoc system
12:21<shawn_>its a access point with router
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12:22<lanceallott>shawn_: no problem. just acess it with a regular browser, then change essid to whater ever you want
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12:23<shawn_>the essid on teh router is already setup
12:23<shawn_>what i want is to set the same essid on my wireless card so it can connect to it
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12:23<adam_>hey someone is talking german?
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12:23<azeem>shawn_: and you don't get any error from iwconfig?
12:24<dpkg>somebody said de was deutschsprachige Hilfe bekommt ihr in (auf und - German speaking users please go to (on and freenode)
12:24<lanceallott>shawn_: funny I never haft to do anything with mine , it detects it auto magically
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12:24<shawn_>no not once
12:24<shawn_>yeah lance
12:24<shawn_>but i hide the essid on purpose
12:24<shawn_>cause i read in a magazine its safer to have your essid hidden
12:25<azeem>hidden from what?
12:25<shawn_>by default wifi routers broadcast essid to the surroundings
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12:25<lanceallott>shawn_: well what type of wireless card are you running on your machine
12:25<shawn_>so all computers can get to know the wifi is here and identify witht he essid
12:25<azeem>shawn_: maybe the ra driver is clever and notices that, and then hides the essid as well
12:25<shawn_>i just disabled this function
12:25<sheldonh>is down, or is my telco just being lame again?
12:25<azeem>shawn_: did you try to set a random essid instead?
12:26<azeem>on your wireless card
12:26<shawn_>so no one can know i have a wifi(nor can they know which essid iit is)
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12:26<shawn_>azeem maybe your right
12:26<cahoot>sheldonh, the latter
12:26<shawn_>how do i set a random essid?
12:26<Eulex>shawn_, well. finding out what essid it has is as simple as looking at the raw data sent wirelessly.
12:26<sheldonh>monopolies suck
12:26<lanceallott>shawn_: well unless you got into ad-hoc mode no one will be able to have access
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12:26<azeem>eh, iwconfig ra0 essid foo
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12:27<lanceallott>shawn_: thats why you have an WAP
12:27<adam_>hey luis
12:27<shawn_>its just to test
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12:27<shawn_>i jsut wnana tes it
12:27<adam_>yeah it works
12:27<luis>yeah it does
12:28<shawn_>btw does wpa slows down the connection or is it as fast as normal?
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12:28<adam_>luis can you tell me how i can change my massenger from psi to icq?
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12:29<Eulex>shawn_, as fast as normal, assuming computers at both ends are fast enough to encode and decode it in realtime. they should be, though.
12:30<lanceallott>shawn_: the thing that has the most speed effect on you connection, would be the signal strength
12:30<lupine>there's some bandwidth overhead
12:30<lupine>which was the point of the question, I think?
12:30<shawn_>the point
12:31<Eulex>shawn_, well, uses a bit more cpu, but that's it.
12:31<shawn_>is wpa interferes with teh flox of the connection
12:31<shawn_>at some point that its noticeable
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12:31<sheldonh>wpa has no documented impact on flox
12:32<lupine>what on earth is flox, anyway?
12:32<shawn_>hope your right people
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12:32<ifvoid>we are always right!!!!
12:32<sheldonh>flox is a combustion process
12:32<shawn_>no flow
12:32<shawn_>mystyped sorry
12:32<lanceallott>my girl friend is a flox
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12:33<sheldonh>shawn_: have you measured throughput across the wireless path in question, using WEP?
12:33<sheldonh>shawn_: if you haven't, you're not going to notice a difference using WPA
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12:36<lupine>eh, it's an RC4 cypher so bandwidth overheads will be minimal too
12:36<sheldonh>and anyway, WPA is a vastly superior drink to meths
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12:37<shawn_>how do you change wpa/web in iwconfig?
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12:37<lanceallott>I guess speed is also affected by wether you have a hetrogenious network or not, that is to say pure 802.11b or a mixture of /a/b/g/n
12:38<shawn_>how do i change wpa or wep in iwconfig?
12:38[~]sheldonh has only ever used wpa_supplicant and network-manager to set up wireless networking
12:38<sheldonh>i only use iwconfig to look at the state of the interface
12:38<kop>FYI, if you've problems with X and/or kdm then init (I think) can wind up trying to restart the X session forever. The interesting thing about this is that I never saw anything in top or ps even though almost a whole CPU was being used up. It was wierd not being able to tell where the CPU was going.
12:39<lanceallott>shawn_: iwconfig --help
12:39<shawn_>i already did it
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12:40<lanceallott>shawn_: I dont think you can change from wep to wap on the fly, you either have one or the other on the hardware level
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12:42<shawn_>how do i launch network-manager (it doesnt work with sudo)
12:42<sheldonh>lanceallott: i believe iwconfig is a tool that controls the hardware level :)
12:42<azeem>shawn_: I don't think iwconfig does WPA
12:42<azeem>though maybe it does these days
12:42<lupine>iwconfig doesn't do wpa
12:42<azeem>shawn_: it should be launched already after you installed it, run nm-applet
12:42<dpkg>somebody said wpa was Wi-Fi Protected Access. A WPA supplicant is provided for Debian Etch and Sarge in the 'wpasupplicant' package. Read /usr/share/doc/wpasupplicant/README.modes.gz to configure the supplicant as desired.
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12:42<lanceallott>iwconfig adjust communication with the kernel with the hardware :)
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12:43<sheldonh>shawn_: see /usr/share/doc/network-manager
12:43<shawn_>ok i think ill better use network manage
12:43<lupine>and neither are hardware level, surely? I'd have put them both on link-layer
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12:43<lupine>(assuming we're talking OSI)
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12:46<lupine>what is the internet for, if not nit-picking?
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12:46<lanceallott>i like KWIFImanager myself
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13:29<gabrix>What if i want change my gpg secret key
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13:33<JasonS>gabrix: so then change it
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13:41<Aleric>I'm having DNS problems...
13:41<Aleric>How can I find out which dns server 'host' is using?
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13:43<korny>comment the others out
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13:43<Aleric>It's more complicated...
13:43<lupine>it uses /etc/resolv.conf
13:43<Aleric>I have two PC's both running debian. One is my masquerading firewall. On the firewall I run 'bind' (as caching nameserver, or so is the idea).
13:44<Aleric>Host look ups from the other machine from within firefox very often fail, and then freeze firefox till the time out.
13:44<petemc>rndc querylog toggles verbose logging
13:44<Aleric>When, during such a timeout, I go to the firewall and type 'host', it resolves immediately.
13:45<lupine>FireFox uses ipv6 as well, by default
13:45<Aleric>On the internal PC /etc/resolv.conf is:
13:45<dpkg>Please do not paste anything at all to this channel. Instead, use: or or for pics.
13:45<Aleric>search localdomain
13:45<Aleric> is my firewall.
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13:46<Aleric>So, how is it possible that the dns often doesn't work - while it works on the firewall?
13:46<lupine>browse to about:config in firefox and turn off IPv6 resolution
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13:51<Aleric>network.dns.disableIPv6 set to true now
13:52<Aleric>I don't think that is the problem though, also 'host' doesn't work actually. I tried that while firefox is stalling in another window, and it simply doesn't resolve.
13:52<Aleric>Isn't it possible that 'host' and bind use different DNS servers?
13:52<petemc>did you toggle the logging, like i suggested?
13:52<lupine>only if you set a different server in the bind config
13:53<Aleric>petemc: On which machine? Both?
13:53<petemc>the machine running bind
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13:54<Aleric>It doesn't have rndc installed.
13:55<Aleric>ii bind 1:8.4.7-1 Internet Domain Name Server
13:55<Aleric>bind9: usr/sbin/rndc
13:55<Aleric>I don't have bind9
13:55<petemc>i think the command is ndc
13:55<petemc>tho im not sure that option is available
13:56<Aleric>Is it easy to upgrade from 8.4.7 to bind9 ?
13:56<petemc>you're just using it as a caching nameserver?
13:56<Aleric>Well, I have my own domain in it too.
13:57<petemc>should be fine
13:57<petemc>its easy to configure, anyway
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14:01<Mindtech>Sort of off topic, but does anyone know how I can setup a wireless network that forces a user to authenticare via username/password?
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14:02<petemc>Mindtech: google for captive portal
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14:03<klys>mindtech: consider if you want it to remain compatible with 802.11b clients.
14:03<klys>if so, use 40-bit WEP and no WPA
14:03<Mindtech>perfect, this is just what I need
14:03<Mindtech>Have you guys implemented this?
14:04<klys>on consumer-grade routers
14:04<Mindtech>what brand/make would you consider consumer grade? Linksys?
14:04<klys>they are popular
14:05<klys>linksys routers sometimes use cisco
14:05<klys>I have a bud that found him a good one. consider if you want your router to have a client mode
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14:07<klys>anything that uses cisco
14:07<klys>is probably business grade or better
14:07<azeem>well, cisco bought linksys, no?
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14:08<klys>so linksys is making cool stuff you can telnet into
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14:10<Aleric>petemc: Something I don't understand is that often I opened an url for some host just 5 minutes ago, and then it tries to lookup the hostname again (ie, when I reload the page) and fails. Shouldn't a *caching* nameserver use the previously looked up name? This is exactly why I started to use bind: to still have the IP's for hosts that I used before even if the dns servers are down.
14:10<petemc>Aleric: you should really determine what the problem is before you try to solve it
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14:10<petemc>but yes, it shoudl cache records
14:11<Aleric>I'm doing a apt-get dist-upgrade on the firewall now... takes a long time
14:13<lupine>well. it'll only cache records for as long as the ttl of the controling nameserver (usually an hour)
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14:16<petemc>i think you'll find most ttls set to much longer than an hour
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15:25<domin>estas alguien?
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15:25<dpkg>Esse canal e apenas em ingles. Por favor, use #debian-br (/j #debian-br) para ajuda em portugues.
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15:54<rodolfo>Hi hello I can't run beryl i got everything fine my configuration video is ok But i don't know what is the problem
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15:56<phrosty>top/ps freezes ssh connections immediately. lighttpd doesn't accept connections. but if you launch screen, ps, reconnect when it freezes, then screen -R, you can get the results. i'm at a loss for what could be causing this, because the server wasn't touched for a few days and was working yesterday - does anyone have an idea?
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16:02<wildchild>good evening (to anyone in europe :)
16:03<wildchild>i need some help with migrating ntfs disks to xfs or ext
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16:04<wildchild>i'm sitting in front of a windows server 2003 with roughly 1.5tb of data on ntfs arrays. lots of files have german umlauts (äüö)
16:05<wildchild>i've had this problem before... i need help figuring out what the best way to treat umlauts is, and how to migrate the data, i have additional hard disks attached to the server, i could format those with fat32
16:05<wildchild>is anyone even listening ? :P
16:06<alex__> is
16:06<wildchild>okay, that's helpful.
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16:07<alex__>wildchild: ask on freenode
16:07<wildchild>why? more people there?
16:08<alex__>yeah around 750
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16:11<ifvoid>wildchild: if you have enough space, you could just copy eveything over
16:12<wildchild>ifvoid, i have plenty of extra space. 1.5 tb over 2 arrays on pci raid controller. i currently have 6x500gb hds just for swap laying here, i can format those with fat32 under windows and then copy the data back when the arrays are reformatted with xfs
16:13<ifvoid>wildchild: I'd rather recommand mounting the ntfs ro in linux, and tarring everything
16:13<wildchild>what i'm unsure about is how to mount the target xfs/source fat32 (special parameters for umlauts?)
16:13<ifvoid>wildchild: that'll avoid any conversion problems
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16:14<ifvoid>wildchild: yeah, exaclty, just avoid fat
16:14<ifvoid>wildchild: linux can read ntfs (but not write)
16:14<ifvoid>so copying the data under linux to a decent fs should be no problem
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16:15<wildchild>okay, sounds cool
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16:16<wildchild>i need to swap the data onto the temporary hds either way, but then i'll probably choose ntfs
16:16<ifvoid>yeah, that would work too
16:16<ifvoid>can't you arrange it such that you only have to copy the data once?
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16:18<wildchild>ifvoid, no because the arrays the data currently is on are formatted with ntfs, and those arrays i need (want) to install linux on and use xfs instead
16:18<wildchild>but that shouldn't matter, hm? i'll just format the extra disks under windows and copy from ntfs to ntfs
16:19<ifvoid>jup, should work
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16:21<Sww24>buenos días
16:21<Sww24>tengo problemas con la tarjeta gráfica
16:21<Sww24>alguién que pudiera ayudar¿?
16:22<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor usen #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please use #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
16:22<wildchild>Sww24, i guess english is expected here ;)
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16:22<Sww24>thanks, and sorry
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16:32<Sww24>Hi, problem with Card grahip
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16:39<topo>Hi, anyone can explain me the sintax for the mount point in the cdrom URI of apt.conf?? I can't understand it the manual for that (please sorry my english)
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16:43<lupine>topo: I don't really understand it either ;), but apt-cdrom provides an easy interface to add new ones
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16:44<gabrix_>i would like to remove unecessary softwares from my etch
16:44<topo>lupine, I use apt-cdrom with the option -d=/media/cdrom1 but aptitude or apt-get still use /cdrom
16:45<gabrix_>are dbus and power manager necessary?
16:46<gabrix_>on my tower pc
16:46<lupine>gabrix_: dbus is essential for kde
16:46<gabrix_>how do i desable power manager ?
16:46<lupine>power manager, probably not
16:46<lupine>topo: make a symbolic link?
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16:47<gabrix_>acpi=off at the boot ?
16:47<topo>lupine, yes that work but i don't want to do that every time (i have 2 drives)
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16:47<Giacomo>I installed mysql
16:48<Giacomo>and it takes 98% of my 512MB ram
16:48<Giacomo>but when memory is needed
16:48<gabrix_>as windows manager i'm trying icewm
16:48<gabrix_>removed gnome
16:48<Giacomo>it reduces its "size"
16:49<gabrix_>too heavy unnecesarely
16:49<Giacomo>the memory it occupies is called "cached"
16:49<Giacomo>will you help me understand this concept?
16:49<gabrix_>do you know preload
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16:49<gabrix_>the best way for preload.conf
16:50<chealer>!tell gabrix_ about enter
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16:51<Brudus>I've been noticing something weird. I don't know if this is the right place to ask. I've noticed that certain sites scroll really site. Like when the page finishes loading and i scroll the webpage it goes really slow and jerky. I've tried this with iceweasel and konqurer.
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16:51<chealer>Giacomo: did you check Wikipedia?
16:51<lupine>Giacomo: MySQL loads data it /might/ need into any spare memory. If the memory is needed for something else, it gets unloaded to save space
16:51<lupine>well, the kernel does it, actually
16:51<Giacomo>thank you lupine
16:52<Giacomo>so the memory is virtually free
16:52<gabrix_>is any way to control the number of mysql children ?
16:52<Giacomo>and...this is not possible under Windows
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16:52<lupine>Windows probably does something vaguely similar
16:52<Giacomo>I mean...I never seen mysql service taking 500MB of memory
16:53<Giacomo>that's because the performance of MySQL under linux is much better...
16:53<gabrix_>if i run htop i see lots of mysqld processes
16:53<Giacomo>me too
16:53<lupine>if windows does do it, then no doubt it keeps it all under the hood
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16:53<lupine>and you should be able to control the number of children mysql can spawn in it's config file
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16:53<Giacomo>never heard about "cached" memory under linux
16:54<Giacomo>under Windows, sorry typo
16:54<lupine>well, maybe it doesn't have it
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16:54<lupine>would be mindboggling if it didn't, though
16:54<Giacomo>I see
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16:56<Brudus>anyone know why my browser would do this?
16:56<Giacomo>yes verified
16:56<Giacomo>Windows has got Cache memory
16:56<Giacomo>just like Linux.......
16:57<Giacomo>now I have 1431MB of physical memory occupied by 'cache' stuff...
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16:57<gabrix_>i was saying
16:58<gabrix_>improove debian performance
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17:07<kerneld>did kernel-package get replaced in unstable?
17:07<kerneld>or is it just currently broken
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17:09<simonrvn>haven't run it recently, worked last time i used it
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17:09<kerneld>I accidentally removed it in an upgrade ,now there are no available versions in my apt repo
17:10<kerneld>E: Package kernel-package has no installation candidate
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17:12<kerneld>Hmm there is a src package .. I'll just build that :)
17:12<chealer>kerneld: just install testing's version
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17:13<kerneld>Hmmm gcc jacked up too. oh my :P
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17:17<Sww24>join #debian-es
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17:26<Brudus>Excuse me. How do I quit X and go to a full screen comand prompt. I'm trying to intall some drivers.
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17:27<simonrvn>depends, brutal way is ctrl-alt-backspace; might not work if you have kdm, gdm or something like that running. then do sudo /etc/init.d/whateveritis stop
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17:28<Brudus>ctrl+alt+backspace just logged me out. what else did you say.
17:29<kerneld>goes to console 1
17:30<kerneld>Alt-F7 will prob take you back toX
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17:31<kerneld>openvt bash will also work
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17:35<tcsetattr>I don't know what driver can't be installed while X is running though. even the X config itself can be changed, then on the next restart (such as when you ctrl-alt-bksp and it respawns) the new config is used.
17:36<kerneld>maybe the missing voodoo was sudo
17:36<kerneld>or su -
17:37<kerneld>and root being dissalowed for X
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17:38<kerneld>ANyone using drbd ?
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17:39<kerneld>I was thinking of using it for cheapass high avaiability for /Homes and /Data with ietd for my doze box here that my wife uses
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17:41<kerneld>I could upgrade the drives in my router and desktop and make a clustered ietd config using mulpath iscsi
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17:53<justhereforamoment>hi all, I'm trying to install the latest flash so that I can watch a video on youtube on this box running etch
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17:54<justhereforamoment>i did aptitude install flashplugin-nonfree and it gave me a md5sum mismatch error....any suggestions?
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17:59<Brudus>I still can't shutdown xserver. I use ctrl+alt+F1 and when I try to install my video drivers it says x server is still running.
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18:00<kerneld>Brudus: Once you are on the console /etc/init.d/gdm stop
18:00<kerneld>or /etc/init.d/kdm ....
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18:01<kerneld>Is your login screen gnome, kde or something else?
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18:01<lupine>/etc/init.d/?dm stop is a good catch-all
18:01<Brudus>I'm using debian so I think it's something else. I'm using gnome.
18:02<kerneld> /etc/init.d/gdm stop
18:02<lupine>in #debian, using debian? now there's a first ;)
18:02<kerneld>ps aux | grep [gkx]dm
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18:03<lupine>zsh: no matches found: [gkx]dm
18:03<lupine>\[ \]
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18:03<kerneld>why you using zsh - you bsd freak :P
18:03<lupine>I've never used bsd in my life
18:04<icone>can anyone help me out ? trying to install php plugin in eclipse ...
18:05<tcsetattr>he just showed a good reason to use zsh: reporting a match failure when a glob doesn't match is far more logical than passing it through as a literal string
18:05<tcsetattr>likewise for expanding a $misspelled_variabel into an error instead of an empty string :)
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18:08<kerneld>well glob you too
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18:08<lupine>actually, I mainly use it to save 2 characters every time I change directory :D
18:09<lupine>but erroring on bad variables gets my vote as a Good Thing(tm)
18:09<lupine>~ == "cd ~"
18:09<lupine>a 50% saving in characters, for that particular path
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18:09<lupine>similarly, /var/www == "cd /var/www"
18:10<tcsetattr>hm... mine doesn't do that. must be an option I don't have enabled.
18:10<tcsetattr>ah, AUTO_CD
18:10<tcsetattr>seems silly though, I won't enable it
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18:11<kerneld>Can you make apt break a dist-upgrade into stages?
18:11<lupine>hehe. arguing about shells is almost as retarded as arguing about DEs though ;)
18:11<kerneld>purging between stages'
18:11<tcsetattr>you can look at its proposed list of packagse to upgrade, and "apt-get install" them individually
18:11<lupine>kerneld: not that I'm aware of. You could make it do main, contrib and non-free seperately?
18:11<kerneld>I mean apt-get clean
18:11<kerneld>I am on a space starved system
18:12<lupine>that might be enough, then
18:12<kerneld>98% is in main so that won't help
18:12<tcsetattr>for example you can start with "apt-get install apt", and let it figure out the minimal dependencies of that
18:12<lupine>ah, fair enough
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18:12<kerneld>tcsetattr: I have just been taking several lines at a time from tha packaghe list to be upgraded from dist-upgrade
18:12<lupine>surely it'll bail with an error when it runs out, and you can just run apt-get clean then?
18:13<lupine>well, after dpkg -u
18:13<lupine>erm. dpkg -i
18:13<kerneld>lupine: Yeah - but That could be at an inconvenient point. Plus my desktop don't behave nice when it runs out of space.
18:13<lupine>heh, I guess not
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18:22<eliteforce>hello, i'm trying to cdebootstrap from a chroot environment, but it's stuck at Setting up cdebootstrap-helper-makedev
18:22<eliteforce>O: /sbin/MAKEDEV: warning: can't read /proc/devices
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18:23<lupine>you need to mount /proc
18:23<lupine>if you exit from the chroot, you can mount --bind /proc /path/to/chroot/proc
18:23<eliteforce>lupine: thanks, i just re-mounted proc in the chroot t_t
18:23<tcsetattr>you don't need to bind it, it's safe to mount proc multiple tmies
18:24<eliteforce>tcsetattr: :)
18:24<paveq>should etch include safe ntfs writing?
18:24<lupine>mm, but mounting proc always confuses me :D
18:24<paveq>seems that mount -o rw works, but touching file there doesn't :/
18:24<lupine>"mount proc proc /proc" ? I dunno
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18:24<eliteforce>lupine: mount -t proc non /proc
18:25<eliteforce>none even
18:25<dpkg>ntfs is Microsoft's attempt to create a Unix-like filesystem. Start reading at For the kernel driver, you need umask=022,gid=xxx to access as non-root. See also or ask me about <ntfsro>, <ntfsrw>, <ntfs-3g> or <captiventfs> ... the latter is obsoletish.
18:25<lupine>mm, that too
18:27<eliteforce>"obsoletish", yuk.
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18:27<gabrix_>what's the copy cut and paste xfce4 official text editor
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18:31<eliteforce>anyway, thanks && bye
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18:33<Belorn3>I just came here with a problem, but the /topic pointed me to the FAQ on the wiki, which answered my question. Thanks!
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18:34<chealer>that must be a first
18:37<ricky>Hehe. Hooray for reading /topic.
18:37<Greg>which package is for the make command?
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18:39<[gloom]>Greg: make
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18:40<Greg>it says make is an unknown command
18:41<[gloom]>did you run "apt-get install make"?
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18:47<dondelelcaro>!b-e Greg
18:47<dpkg>Greg: Sounds like you need to aptitude install build-essential.
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19:00<rayrebel>hello ayy
19:00[~]rayrebel meant 'all'
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19:55<dbldtx_>All I need is is proper ATI support and I'll be rather excited, what! Thank you DEBIAN!
19:56<dbldtx_>Set in such a way, if you can't tell that if you slide your mouse off the desktop or drag an x11 it moves to the next it's so beautiful I found a minimilist beauty behind KDE Gnome. Behold XFCE4
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20:03<Aleric>dbldtx: So, why did you blur out 'dbldtx@coast' almost everywhere on the screenshot?
20:03<Aleric>It's your nick even!
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20:15<n1ck0>bonne nuit
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20:28<flami>How can i record stuff that i hear on my speakers ... Uhmm record the mixer :/ dont really know how to explain it right
20:28<flami>.. Oh forgot .. Hi
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21:12<darthPanties>Does anyone have Debian 4 working on a softRAID config?
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21:20<jeffcovey>hello, all.
21:20<jeffcovey>can anyone tell me how to make udev leave my wireless setup alone?
21:20<darthPanties>I don't use wireless, sorry
21:21<jeffcovey>i need to temporarily change my wireless to ad-hoc to reach and configure a wireless print server.
21:21<jeffcovey>i can set it up with iwconfig and ping the print server for a few seconds, but then the pings stop.
21:22<jeffcovey>iwevent shows that it happens because the wireless setup is turned back to a managed one with the ssid and other information of my usual network.
21:22<jeffcovey>udev seems to be doing this.
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21:23<jeffcovey>readme.debian says removing the /etc/udev/rules.d/z45_persistent-net-generator.rules symlink should stop persistent name generation, but removing it hasn't helped the problem.
21:24<jeffcovey>if it could just leave the wireless setup the way iwconfig set it for five minutes so i could reach the print server and change it to match my network.
21:25<jeffcovey>sooo frustrating to set it the way i need it and have this tool "help" put it back the way it was. :-\
21:27<darthPanties>Yeah, I hear wireless is a pain
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21:28<jeffcovey>(i did restart udev after removing the symlink.)
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21:54<blarson>jeffcovey: Put the driver for your wireless card in the udev blacklist.
21:55<blarson>jeffcovey: or you could just modify the startup scripts for it
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22:09<jeffcovey>blarson: thanks; i'll go check that out.
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22:14<jeffcovey>blarson: i added "blacklist ipw2100" to /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist and restarted udev, but the changes i make with iwconfig are still being reversed.
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22:18<jeffcovey>and i must to bed.
22:19<jeffcovey>thanks again, i'll check for any replies in the morning.
22:28<klys>how do I sort the output of diff?
22:28<klys>I want it to pay attention to the < and >
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22:33<Mindtech>Hey guys.... I just realized I may need the 64 bit version of etch running as opposed to the i386
22:33<Mindtech>I got a Pentium D processor
22:33<Mindtech>which is considered long (64 bit)
22:33<klys>ok I see now, LC_ALL=C sort
22:33<Mindtech>Should I reinstall or leave as is
22:33<dpkg>it has been said that ia64 is (Intel Architecture-64), a 64-bit processor architecture developed in cooperation by Intel and Hewlett-Packard, implemented by processors such as Itanium and Itanium 2. The goal of Itanium was to produce a "post-RISC era" arch using EPIC. see -- if your CPU is opteron/athlon64/turion/sempron/xeon/em64t/pentium/core2duo/core*, then it is NOT ia64
22:33<azeem>Mindtech: leave it as is
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22:34<Mindtech>azeem, would I see any big difference?
22:34<azeem>klys: ia64 isn't "the 64 bit version of etch"
22:34<azeem>Mindtech: do you plan to host databases with more than a few terabyte?
22:34<Mindtech>Of course ;-)
22:34<klys>Mindtech: what is your arch?
22:34<azeem>Mindtech: then you should install amd64
22:35<Mindtech>klys, I am running i386 at the moment
22:35<Mindtech>the ~ia64 answered it
22:35<Mindtech>I leave it as is in i386
22:36<azeem>you've got an amd64, not an ia64
22:36<dpkg>well, amd64 is See and the #debian-amd64 IRC channel, or, now official, will be a supported arch on Etch, or a generic name. it also supports xeon etc, see Consider using debian/i386 if you do not have a good reason to use debian/amd64. for flash on amd64, ask me about <nspluginwrapper>
22:36<Mindtech>I have a Pentium D chip
22:36<azeem>that's an amd64
22:37<azeem>Mindtech: it's either amd64 (64bit) or i386 (32bit)
22:37<Mindtech>How do I find out for sure
22:37<azeem>there's some flags in /proc/cpuinfo
22:37<azeem>but I dunno
22:37<azeem>anyway, I'm off
22:37<klys>see if it's not too new (and you've proved this) it supports both instruction sets
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22:52<fril19>hello, what would i use for gpg?
22:52<fril19>im new to debian
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22:58<fril19>i installed some programs using synaptic, why arent they showing up on my list?
22:58<fril19>maybe a restart?
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23:11<Brudus>wahhhh!! this sucks. I'm trying to install some video drivers but it keeps telling me I need a package called "gcc" i installed that package and it still gives me the same error.
23:11<amphi>Brudus: install build-essential perhaps
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23:26<CLIdiot>looking for a simple way to manage perl modules in Debian
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23:26<CLIdiot>does everyone pretty much use apt?
23:27<Brudus>I hate drivers i hate drivers I HATE DRIVERS. The nvidia program tells me to install gcc package, so i do. Then it tells me to install the kernel source package, so I do. Then it still won't work. says it can't find the kernel source.
23:28<blarson>CLIdiot: aptitude, apt-get, dselect, synaptic
23:29<blarson>Brudus: use the package from non-free. Installing directly from nvidia sources causes problems.
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23:47<Brudus>i installed a package called nvidia kernel, and it still won't work. The main error message i get is "No pre-compiled kernel interface was found to match your kernel" and "unable to fine the kernel source tree for the currently running kernel"
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---Logclosed Sun Aug 26 00:00:03 2007