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#debian IRC Logs for 2007-10-11

---Logopened Thu Oct 11 00:00:04 2007
---Daychanged Thu Oct 11 2007
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00:00<Frostex>Hi there, can anybody help me with my HDD access issue??
00:00<dondelelcaro>Frostex: best to just ask your question
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00:02<Frostex>umm... Well i had my HD in a windows machine, mobo died, so i put HD into another windows machine. but whenever i tried to access the files it would tell me i need to format the drives. so after some searching around, i was reccomended to try a knoppix live CD (i know this is the debian IRC but i couldnt find knoppix channel), all my other drives were detected and mounted and working fine. but it will not mount my HD from the
00:02<Frostex>other machine:S
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00:06<dpkg>Knoppix is _not_ Debian. Seek Knoppix help in freenode's #knoppix. Knoppix is a live CD distro which is <based on Debian>, useful as a rescue CD, to test hardware, and for situations where you have access to a computer but it isn't Debian. unofficial:
00:06<streuner>Frostex: or just try grml ( :-)
00:07<dondelelcaro>Frostex: I'm not sure I understand the problem; which other machine is unable to mount teh drives?
00:08<Frostex>it will not let me mount my HD which i got from the broken machine. sorry, i should have clarifed
00:08<Frostex>but all other drives are 100%
00:08<dondelelcaro>Frostex: well, if it can't mount it, then the drives may be toast, but try using grml or Debian or something else; or try asking in #knoppix on
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00:09<Frostex>nah the drive isnt toast, it was working fine. now it is just telling me that i need to format it, but it has some really important data on it
00:09<Frostex>so i definitly DO NOT want to format it
00:09<Serialkiller>was it ntfs?
00:10<Frostex>i always use ntsf for windows boxes
00:10<Frostex>not sure why, i think somebody told me to do it when i built my first computer.. it just kinda stuck
00:10<streuner>and you get that error in windows?
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00:11<Frostex>in windows it detects the drive fine, but i go to access it and it says "this drive needs to be formatted" or somthing similar
00:12<streuner>so do what it suggested and just install Debian :-)
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00:13<Frostex>install or use a live CD?
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00:13<streuner>!d-i Frostex
00:13<dpkg>Frostex, you want to go to Or (if you've got hardware that the 4.0r0 installer doesn't support) for your own good, and everyone else's.
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00:24<greenmang0>any avi to mpeg convertor available?
00:24<greenmang0>want to burn avi as a VCD
00:25<greenmang0>jm_: what
00:25<greenmang0>jm_: what is the name of package?
00:25<jm_>greenmang0: mencoder
00:26<greenmang0>jm_: thanks
00:27<greenmang0>jm_: is there any other way to burn avi to VCD or we have to convert avi to mpeg?
00:27<Nemoder>greenmang0: you might give avidemux a try, I believe it's a front-end to mencoder
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00:29<greenmang0>Nemoder: ok
00:32<jm_>greenmang0: no, VCD means MPEG, you can burn regular CD with AVI
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00:32<greenmang0>jm_: yeah.
00:32<greenmang0>jm_: ok
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01:07<coucou747>hi all
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01:35<Frostex>Ok, how can i force mount my drive NTSF, it is saying it cannot read the filesystem type. but i know it was formated NTSF ages ago
01:36<chuy>Frostex, recognition is automatic for me
01:36<jm_>how are you mounting it? does /proc/filesystems mention ntfs?
01:36<chuy>Frostex: mount -o uid=user /dev/hd?? /mountpoint
01:37<chuy>although I've heard it is bad for read/write, and use NTFS-3G instead
01:37<dpkg>i guess ntfs-3g is a NTFS driver with write support. Available in lenny but not for etch except as a backport at
01:38<Frostex>umm.. well it was in my old computer (windows) and that crashed. so i put the harddrive in this computer (windows), but it said i had to format it to acces the files. so i booted into linux and tried to mount it, but it says it cannot read the filesystem type
01:39<jm_>that doesn't answer my questions
01:39<Frostex>a chkdsk in windows said that it cannot work with drives in the RAW format
01:39<jm_>but it looks like your filesystem is severly corrupted
01:39<Frostex>lol i dont really know how to mount.. i just right click>mount, im a linux noob
01:40<Frostex>yer, but i need the files off this drive badly. and dont want to spend $300+ at a store:(
01:44<gsimmons>Frostex: Does "file -s /dev/hdaX" (where X is your partition number) state the filesystem as NTFS? (in the OEM-ID)
01:45<Frostex>OEM-ID?? (im a linux noob)
01:45<Frostex>im on a live CD here atm btw
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01:47<chuy>gsimmons, you sure that's the option?, I get this on a NTFS partition: /dev/hdb1: writable, no read permission
01:47<gsimmons>chuy: You need to be root.
01:47<gsimmons>Frostex: That's fine, execute the command. Output will be returned with the OEM-ID string of interest (if any).
01:48<chuy>OEM-ID "NTFS "
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01:49<Frostex>how do i know what partition number it is
01:49<gsimmons>chuy: s/root/have necessary read permissions/
01:49<Frostex>would it be hdd1?
01:49<gsimmons>Frostex: cat /proc/partitions
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01:52<Frostex>yes it says it is NTSF
01:53<Frostex>root@Knoppix:/ramdisk/home/knoppix# file -s /dev/hdd1
01:53<Frostex>/dev/hdd1: x86 boot sector, code offset 0x52, OEM-ID "NTFS ", sectors/cluster 8, reserved sectors 0, Media descriptor 0xf8, heads 255, hidden sectors 63, dos < 4.0 BootSector (0x80)
01:53<Frostex>wait.. wrong partition.. whoops
01:53<Frostex>root@Knoppix:/ramdisk/home/knoppix# file -s /dev/hdb1
01:53<Frostex>/dev/hdb1: data
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01:57<gsimmons>Frostex: Your NTFS filesystem is corrupt. You should be receiving similar output to /dev/hdd1.
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01:57<Frostex>so.. is there anyway to get my data back without going to a store?
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02:01<jm_>you'd need to talk to someone who's familiar with NTFS internals
02:01<Frostex>where could i find somebody ilke that without paying for it?
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02:03<jm_>good question, I have no idea, maybe asking on ntfs-3g mailing list might be a start
02:04<Frostex>lol how do i join there?
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02:06<jm_>uhm you subscribe and then send mail
02:07<gsimmons>Frostex: The mailing lists are described at <>. Try searching through the archives first. There's also a ntfs-3g forum which may be of interest.
02:07<Frostex>thanks for that
02:07<Frostex>so theres no possible way that you guys can think of to recover my data
02:07<jm_>not me
02:08<Frostex>hmm damn, well thanks for all the help
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02:57[~]gcosmin morning
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03:28<sep>I am trying to move a lvm root fs from one lv to another. from lv_root to lv_rootfs, i have edited grub, updated grubm, and even recreateded initrd in a chroot. but on reboot it's allways the old lv_root that becomes mounted as / how can i make it use the other ?
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03:32<gsimmons>sep: Did you also adjust /etc/fstab?
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03:34<sep>gsimmons, yes
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03:38<sep>what is /lib/init/rw/rootdev ?
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03:41<Onepamopa>hallo, I'm new to debian, and I want one question.. so, is there anyone online?
03:41<petemc>just ask
03:41<petemc>unless that was your question..
03:41<Onepamopa>well, I installed debian 4.0 testing
03:41<petemc>in which case, yes, there are people online
03:42<Onepamopa>my question ;)
03:42<Onepamopa>so, when I try to compile anything, it says that it cant compile basic C programs
03:43<petemc>!b-e Onepamopa
03:43<dpkg>Onepamopa: Sounds like you need to aptitude install build-essential.
03:43<Onepamopa>well, thanks a lot ;)
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03:45<gsimmons>sep: What does /proc/cmdline say?
03:45<sep>gsimmons, at the moment i dont know since i managed to make it unbootable
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03:48<sep># cat /proc/cmdline
03:48<sep>root=/dev/mapper/Debian-rootold ro
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03:49<gsimmons>sep: Looks like GRUB is still configured to use the old root LV. Amend kopt= and run 'update-grub'.
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03:51<jm_>heh wonderful world of editing menu.lst manually only to be overwritten by update-grub :)
03:52<sep>gsimmons, thats the first thingg i did itr still uses the old one
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03:54<jm_>sep: easy to verify what grub reads, just press e and it will display current entry - if it has an old one, you need to figure out where it gets it from
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04:33<debed>hello evryone...i am now running a system with debian...and i wanted to have internet in other system along with this
04:34<debed>can any one tell the process of connecting the internet in a group of two or three systems
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04:35<radoo>hello!i have this problem: i try to install this library libtiff4-dev, but all i get is this The following packages have unmet dependencies:
04:35<radoo> libtiff4-dev: Depends: zlib1g-dev but it is not going to be installed
04:36<radoo>i tried to find a repo for zlib1g-dev for etch, but ...
04:36<radoo>can you help me?
04:36<jm_>uhm zlib1g-dev is in Etch
04:37<radoo>i can't install it... i get that message again for another package that isn't there...wait
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04:37<jm_>then your sources.list/pinning is hosed
04:38<radoo>what does this mean?
04:38<jm_>hosed? there's an error there or "fucked up" if you prefer profanity
04:38<radoo>:) lol...ok, then i'll make a new one from scratch and give it a try...
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04:39<jm_>run apt-cache policy zlib1g-dev
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04:40<jm_>what happens if you try to install it?
04:41<jm_>and what's your APT::Default-Release set to?
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04:41<radoo>this happens
04:41<radoo>sorry, i didn't understand your second question...
04:42<jm_>grep -r Default-R /etc/apt
04:42<radoo>nothing happens when i type that command
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04:43<jm_>really? I wonder why you get 500 then - what's in your preferences file?
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04:44<radoo>sorry...i don't know what preference file? sources.list
04:44<jm_>look for it in /etc/apt
04:45<radoo>i have not such a file there
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04:46<jm_>what do you have in /etc/apt and /etc/apt/apt.conf.d?
04:46<Stumbles>does anyone else get aliased fonts in Iceweasel when Helvetica is mentioned in the style sheet? Seemed strange given that I don't even have Helvetica.
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04:47<radoo>in /etc/apt: secring.gpg sources.list trustdb.gpg trusted gpg
04:47<radoo>in apt.conf.d 00trustcdrom 10periodeic 70debconf
04:47<One\workin>strange, it seems that apt-get cannot find ipsec, last time it did..
04:47<jm_>radoo: inspect those files in /etc/apt/apt.conf.d
04:48<radoo>and in /etc/apt a empty directory sources.list.d
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04:49<radoo>70 debconf contains this // Pre-configure all packages with debconf before they are installed.
04:49<radoo>// If you don't like it, comment it out.
04:49<radoo>DPkg::Pre-Install-Pkgs {"/usr/sbin/dpkg-preconfigure --apt || true";};
04:49<radoo>10periodic contains this APT::Periodic::Update-Package-Lists "1";
04:49<radoo>APT::Periodic::Download-Upgradeable-Packages "0";
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04:50<jm_>that's standard yes
04:50<radoo>that's all that is n there
04:50<jm_>and in the other files?
04:51<radoo>in the 00trustcdrom only this APT::Authentication::TrustCDROM "true"
04:51<netspirit>Hi! Is there a way to easily downgrade a single package plz? (with dependencies if necessary would be great) I noticed the downgrade dpkg command but I'm not sure how to use it and I would like not to arm my system...
04:51<radoo>and the other files in the /etc/apt i can't access
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04:52<jm_>wait it's talking about lenny/sid version - where did that come from?
04:53<jm_>netspirit: not easy no, dpkg -i is your friend, but you'll need to sort dependencies manually
04:53<netspirit>jm_: Ok :\ thank you
04:53<alan>is there anyone in here?
04:54<alan>is there a server or network for new ppl?
04:54<jm_>radoo: yes, see versions mentioned in
04:54<jm_>radoo: recheck sources.list
04:54<dpkg>[newbie] someone who is new to linux or debian, and should read the docs (/usr/share/doc/)
04:55<dpkg>Before asking in here or on debian-user, you should read the install guide, or if you have already installed, the debian reference, the apt howto. Ask me about <ig>, <docs>, <manuals>, <reference>, <fundamentals>, <newbiedoc>, <refcard>, <faq>, <unix lessons>, <general cli tutorial>. (e.g. in your irc client, type /msg dpkg reference)
04:55<jm_>alan: ^^^^^^^^
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04:58<radoo>a, yes i forgot to mention that was a repo i found for that library- for unstable
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04:59<jm_>radoo: don't do that
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05:02<radoo>this is my sources.list
05:02<radoo>i removed that unstable entry
05:02<jm_>well it's all commented out ;)
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05:02<radoo>now are all of them uncommented, because i wanted to make a new sources.list..
05:02<jm_>except for d-m
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05:04<radoo>but...where should i look for that library?in multimedia, or?
05:04<jm_>naah, it's in Debian main
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05:06<radoo>i'm getting the same unmet dependencies message- even with only the main debian mirror checked...
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05:07<radoo>synaptic gives me the same result
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05:09<jm_>run apt-get update
05:09<radoo>i did
05:09<jm_>what does dpkg -s zlib1g say?
05:09<jm_>for version
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05:10<radoo>O_o it says it is installed.wait i'll paste that
05:11<jm_>heh you have a version from sid, that's causing problems, the only question is how many other packages are the same, start with libc6
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05:12<defiant>what package contains mount.cifs ? or has it been depreciated in favour of mount -t cifs ?
05:13<jm_>!tell defiant -about search
05:13<radoo>how can i see that?
05:13<jm_>mount -t cifs will call mount.cifs ...
05:13<jm_>dpkg -s libc6
05:13<dpkg>There is no record of a libc6 package
05:14<radoo>no, sorry :) this
05:14<jm_>congratulations, you have upgraded some base packages to unstable ;)
05:14<radoo>he :)
05:15<radoo>can i downgrade them back?
05:15<jm_>yeah but it's not easy
05:15<radoo>ok...then is there any way i can install that library- stable or unstable?
05:16<jm_>sure, but you'll need to use it form unstable now
05:16<defiant>i had tried searching for mount.cifs before hand and nothing is listed. i was under the impression smbfs was depreciated
05:16<jm_>how did you search for it?
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05:16<defiant>apt-cache search and through aptitude
05:16<jm_>ok then you haven't read everything that dpkg told you
05:16<radoo>you mean i must upgrade the kernel too?
05:17<jm_>naah, kernel can probably stay at the same version
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05:17<radoo>ok, what should i do next?
05:18<jm_>you should decide about that - downgrade or use testing/sid
05:18<radoo>downgrade sounds better :)
05:18<defiant>jm_: ok tried searching - even less results :(
05:18<goauld>do i have to compile kvm in kernel if im not going to use virtual machines? is it going to make overhead when not in use though compiled in kernel?
05:19<jm_>defiant: use the lower form on that page or apt-file
05:20<defiant>ah ok so smbfs (which has been replaced by CIFS) is the package that contains cifs...
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05:22<petemc>i told you that 10 minutes ago
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05:23<defiant>haha i know you did but i didnt believe you. i thought it was depreciated
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05:23<jm_>plus he learned how to search for stuff
05:23<petemc>thats true
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05:26<Cytrax>morning - does anyone know if there is a way to re-install debian remotely by using an iso and an answerfile? like an autometed install?
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05:27<petemc>you might want to look into preseeding
05:27<dpkg>i heard preseed is a method of doing a remote network installation, or, or
05:27<Cytrax>cool.. thanks - I hope this works :)
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05:28<goauld>yes its cool
05:28<Cytrax>see the thing is I dont have access to the machine :p
05:28<goauld>i have to have it even if i probably will never use it
05:29<radoo>ok, what i did was to install that libraries from sid- what a hell afterall- but i still have this problem: i needed that library in order to be able to export tiff sequences from it is installed but i stii can't export tiff you have any idea why?
05:30<goauld>how do i dpkg-reconfigure (something) so when i click on links firefox jumps in instead of konqueror?
05:30<debed>anyone please help to make three sytems into a LAN
05:31<One\workin>debed, configure your eth interfaces
05:31<goauld>something like update alternatives or dpkg-reconfigure alternatives i dont remember
05:31<petemc>update-alternatives --config x-www-browser
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05:31<One\workin>you need 1 switch (or hub) three cables and that's it
05:31<kubitz>Hello there I'm a new user and I have encountered an odd - well I'm not sure if it is a problem - but it's certainly and oddity from my point of view. When I ls in my home directory alongside what I expect I get a listing for a file called new file~ When I try to remove this file it says no such file exists and I can't see it in any of Gnome's file managers. What is the file for? It happened right after I'd finished using Vi so I'm ass
05:31<kubitz>uming it's related?
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05:32<debed>One\workin, hi.. can u tell me the process....I have one system running the net and I also have other two systems connected to the hub
05:32<petemc>kubitz: its probably a temporary file created by vi
05:32<debed>and i have a ADSL router
05:32<kubitz>petemc: so why can I only see it on the cmd line?
05:33<petemc>kubitz: probably because whatever file viewer you are using is configured to ignore such files
05:33<goauld>thanks petemc
05:33<kubitz>petemc: will it just disappear next time I restart?
05:33<petemc>kubitz: they should go away when you finish editing the file
05:33<azeem>also, you probably need to escape the ~ with \, dunno
05:34<kubitz>If I've closed Vi in the mean time?
05:34<kubitz>So I need to reopen the file and edit it?
05:35<petemc>i dunno, is it a big deal?
05:35<kubitz>When I tried that just now it saved it as another file telling there was one more file to edit?
05:35<kubitz>It's just I'm trying really hard to understand eberything
05:36<kubitz>I suppose it's not abig deal, but you know how it's anoying when you can't quite solve something?
05:36<kubitz>Or is that just me LOL
05:36<kubitz>okay I take your point
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05:38<petemc>theres nothing wrong with wanting to know how and why things work, its a good thing, in fact
05:38<petemc>i dont know for sure myself, is all..
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05:41<kubitz>petemc: Thanks! I just need to find a reference to files ending in whatever that ~ character is called. It would help if I knew the name of the character. Hang on my wife tells me it's called a tilde? - where did she learn that :)
05:41<kubitz>Right I'm off to fijnd out
05:41<kubitz>find out even
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05:41<jm_>tilde - man ascii
05:42<jm_>ahh it doesn't give names there
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05:42<jm_>debed: internet sharing? use ipmasq package
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05:59<kubitz>petemc: I really want to crow and say I found the answer. Oh well it may be bad form, but I found out you rm files tilde files by typing the whole file name including spaces in quotation marks. One day I'll be able to offer sometihng more useful I'm sure :)
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06:00<petemc>kubitz: yes, or escape the character with \ as azeem suggested
06:01<kubitz>I must have missed that - serves me right
06:01<kubitz>I'll try it that way now as well
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06:01<kubitz>I'm a bit obsessive when I decide to learn something new
06:01<petemc>you can also tell some commands the next argument is a filename with --
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06:03<kubitz>I came across another weird thing looking at the cmd: when I look at my Mp3 player it shows serveral files I've never seen before and they don't show up on windows at all even at the prompt. Is the cli the only way to see what's really there then?
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06:05<kubitz>I think I really need to get one of those in a nutshell books: what would people here recommend?
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06:05<petemc>books are good but theres no substitute for getting down and dirty with a system
06:05<petemc>break it, fix it, etc etc
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06:06<petemc>and dead tree is nice, but theres more documentation then you could ever read on the internet
06:06<kubitz>Yeah there's just so much
06:06<kubitz>Linux seems a much deeper subject than windows
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06:08<kubitz>With my nature it's going to be hard to stop myself. And I only intended Debian as areplacement for Win 98 on one of my systems.
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06:10<gsimmons>kubitz: You might want to read the Debian Reference first, then other documentation of interest.
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06:14<kubitz>I'm just starting.
06:15<kubitz>My next plan is to set up a printer. This computer hasn't really been used for awhile so I have to buy a printer for it first
06:15<kubitz>I'm just reading around which provide the best linux support
06:15<kubitz>It seems like HP are the best in most respects?
06:17<jm_>any potscript printer will work
06:17<Cytrax>hrm.. I think this machine is officially broken.. everytime I try to run something I get a floating point exception :(
06:17<goauld>i dont know but im osbsessed too i just bought a laptop and i was configuring my "old" pc amd k7, for a home server use
06:18<goauld>making it p2p downloader, wireless multimedia streamer, ftp server samba server, etc... so i can view movies in my psp via wireless
06:18<kubitz>jm_: I'll have to read all about that as well. I seem to remember ps printers are the ones that handle CMYK?
06:18<goauld>isnt it cool?
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06:19<kubitz>I didn't really do very much with this computer when I was running 98, since MS stopped supporting 98 I've been a little wary of letting out too often :)
06:20<petemc>im still using a NT4 desktop
06:20<petemc>it rocketh mightily
06:20<kubitz>I've never actually seen NT4.
06:21<kubitz>I've never used a Mac or NT up to 5
06:21<kubitz>Everthing else I've tried
06:21<kubitz>Even tried Freebsd briefly
06:21<kubitz>Didn't like that at all
06:21<kubitz>That's a mad system
06:21<jm_>kubitz: keep in mind postscript printers are often more expensive
06:21<kubitz>Yeah but you get better quality don't you
06:22<jm_>not really
06:22<pumpkin0>jm_: yes, but did you see the price on refills in the last ... 5 years ?
06:22<kubitz>And lower printing costs so I'm told
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06:22<jm_>pumpkin0: no, I have no idea about that
06:22<kubitz>I'm been meaning to get a ps printer for awhile
06:23<pumpkin0>jm_: it's not the printer that costs a lot, it's the ink/toner that kills you.
06:23<jm_>pumpkin0: so $2000 is not a lot for you?
06:23<kubitz>Is is that much?
06:23<kubitz>That is steep
06:23<pumpkin0>jm_: depends on the amount of paper i have to print.
06:23<jm_>kubitz: depends, some high end HP-s will cost you even more :)
06:24<kubitz>I thought I'd seen budget psps for about 400 GBP
06:24<jm_>kubitz: we have colour Samsung network printer here which is about $400, non-networked version should cost much less, and they also have another model below it too
06:24<kubitz>I suppose you're talking about usd?
06:24<jm_>yeah USD
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06:24<kubitz>Ah that's not so bad
06:24<jm_>our is Samsung 550N
06:24<kubitz>£2000 would have been really outrageous
06:25<kubitz>I nearly spilt my cofee till I remembered the exchange rate :)
06:25<jm_>but we also have a laser B&W HP (not sure about the price), which works great
06:25<pumpkin0>kubitz: there are printers in the 2000 GBP-range ...
06:25<jm_>there's, probably look there first
06:26<kubitz>Oh I've no doubt of it pumpkin0 but it's still ashocking price to me :)
06:26<debed>heyy naybody
06:26<debed>please help me how to set up a lan in three systems with DEBIAN OS
06:27<pumpkin0>debed: do you have a DHCP-Server running ?
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06:28<themill>kubitz: while the exchange rate is about GBP1=USD2, for hardware etc it's usually 1=1 and the local supplier gets a nice cut.
06:29|-|mode/#debian [+l 317] by debhelper
06:29<kubitz>Yeah we really get screwed on prices here in the Uk
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06:29<petemc>not quite as bad as rip off ireland
06:29<kubitz>I'm told it's because we earn more but I never met an american who earned less than me :)
06:30<kubitz>Irish BB prices are rough
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06:30<jm_>petemc: but you can get it from England for shipping costs only, no?
06:30<petemc>friends of mine work for a company that has offices here and in the US, the american counterparts get triple what the coders get here
06:30<petemc>jm_: most of the time, yeah
06:30<petemc>i like shops tho
06:30<petemc>walk in, pick something up, pay for it, walk out with it
06:30<jm_>yeah sometimes that's your only option
06:31<themill>jm_: only if you forgo your warranty. And you can get hit with import duties and taxes on top of that anyway.
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06:31<jm_>themill: crap, pretty much what we had say 2-3 years ago then
06:31<jm_>until then
06:32<kubitz>Are you in IE petemc?
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06:32<petemc>im in belfast, but im a bit of a nationalist...
06:32<debed>heyy can anyone help me how to setup a LAN
06:32<kubitz>We're always being told Dublin is the new Silicon Valley
06:32<debed>with MODEM connection in DEBIAN
06:32<One\workin>debed heh..
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06:33<petemc>kubitz: well, theres lots of the big tech companies there
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06:33<kubitz>My dad grew up in Carrickfergus that's not far from Belfast is it?
06:33<petemc>not at all
06:33<petemc>just outside
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06:34<kubitz>I've never been there
06:34<kubitz>And I'm not that young so I haven't got much time :)
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06:36<subha> hi all,i've been keeping a custom local repository where i've changed the distro name to testing & code name to etch and I am keeping my Release file ( in this way.The structure is same.But at the net installation time when i am preseeding the dists name & code name it is not taking.It is throwing errors.Not a valid release file.Codename can't found .how to solve this one?I am using netboot pkg. for
06:36<subha>pxe net installation.Plz.Plz help
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06:39<kubitz>We have to go out for dinner now cos we have no food in the house. Back later!
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06:41<EmleyMoor>Are there British voices available for festival, and are they easy to install on etch?
06:42<jm_>EmleyMoor: yes
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06:44<EmleyMoor>... are they perchance included?
06:44<jm_>yeah they're in main
06:44<EmleyMoor>jm_: in festival itself or in an additional package?
06:44<jm_>EmleyMoor: separate
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06:45<EmleyMoor>OK - what's it called?
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06:45<jm_>apt-cache search festival british
06:46<EmleyMoor>All it mentions is festlex-poslex
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06:46<themill>EmleyMoor: there is festvox-rablpc16k in contrib
06:46<EmleyMoor>Ah - in contrib...
06:47<jm_>ahh sorry, I missed that
06:47<jm_>because it's too obvious in apt-cache policy output
06:47<EmleyMoor>What if anything does it need from non-free?
06:48<themill>!info festlex-oald etch
06:48<dpkg>festlex-oald: (Festival lexicon from Oxford Advanced Learners' Dictionary), section non-free/sound, is extra. Version: 1.4.0-3 (etch), Packaged size: 2035 kB, Installed size: 13704 kB
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07:52<debed>One\workin, u there]
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07:53<tvisto>Hi all
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07:54<tvisto>We've just installed Ubuntu at work and wow what a great choice!
07:54<tvisto>But enyone knows what is best erp solution for small businesses? enterprise resource planning.
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07:55<tvisto>need help on this :D
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08:01<plokko>...what fs is better(mysql server with raid5 over 4 15000rpm disks)reiserfs,xfs or jfs?
08:01<plokko>i think xfs right?
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08:06<plokko>who fs have the better performance?
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08:07<plokko>sry what fs
08:08<js_>dont know
08:08<jm_>benchmark it yourself
08:08<nowhere_man>is there an application to actually *see* or at least test the current keyboard layout?
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08:08<Bluethunder>Ah, hallo :)
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08:09<plokko>ext4 is available on debian 4?
08:09<dpkg>extra, extra, read all about it, ext4 is a filesystem that is backward compatible with ext3, but also adds new features such as support for volumes up to 1 exabyte (1024 petabytes) and added extent support. Currently not supported by e2fsprogs (see bug #425477).
08:09<jm_>nowhere_man: try xkeycaps
08:10<jm_>xmodmap can also print it to stdout
08:10<plokko>...but it will have great performance
08:11<Bluethunder>Ich bin seit Tagen schon auf der Suche nach einem Tool, was ständig eine bestimmte IP tracert und die ergebnisse, wenn möglich, in einer DB abspeichert. Diese Ergebnisse möchte ich grafisch abrufen können. Gibt es da schon etwas? Hat einer schonmal sowas gesehen?
08:11<dpkg>deutschsprachige Hilfe bekommt ihr in (auf, oder - German speaking users please go to (on, or
08:11<Bluethunder>Oh, sorry.
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08:15<themill>Bluethunder: I don't know of any tools that will do that for you...
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08:16<Bluethunder>hm.... thats not good :/ I need this very important (bad english, i know ^^)
08:17<js_>i bad english ,too
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08:19<One\workin>js_, my english is bad too ;)
08:20|-|kart_ [~kart_@] has quit [Quit: \|--|/]
08:20<One\workin>but well... who cares? :>
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08:32<Aleric>How can I see the speed of my ethernet card?
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08:33<themill>(well, that shows the speed of the link)
08:34<Aleric>eth1: negotiated 10baseT-FD, link ok
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08:34<Aleric>My ISP asked me to set that ethernetcard to half duplex (they want to blame me for the packetloss I have)
08:34<Aleric>Any idea how to set an ethernetcard to half duplex?
08:35<Eva_>people i have a question not directly linked to ubuntu but this channel is the only i use
08:35<gsimmons>Aleric: You can also use mii-tool for that.
08:35<Eva_>if a machine is not a finite state machine, what is it ?
08:35<Eva_>what else could it be ? because i was thinking that verything has a state
08:35<Eva_>what do you think ?
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08:41<exlt>Aleric: if the switch port your server is connected to is not set for HD, then you will see more issues.. I would suggest that they check for errors on the switch port before blaming your server's duplex setting..
08:42<Fox_1_>people from where I must get overridefile for dpkg-scanpackages??
08:42<exlt>you can also use something like mtr to hunt down where the packet loss might be - run it bi-directionally, too, since the route is likely to be asymetric
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08:44<exlt>Aleric: you will many times see collisions on that interface in ifconfig, if there is a duplex mismatch
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08:50<themill>Fox_1_: you can use an empty file for that.
08:52<Aleric>exlt: I had no errors or collisions before. But they want me to replace the cable and the ethernetcard and set it to half-duplex before they send a technition (how do I write that?) again.
08:53<Aleric>exlt: I don't see any collisions now either.
08:53<Aleric>eth1: 10 Mbit, half duplex, link ok
08:53<Aleric> RX packets:9645819 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
08:53<Aleric> TX packets:8414057 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
08:53<Aleric> collisions:0 txqueuelen:1000
08:53<Aleric>It didn't reset the RX/TX count, that is a bit weird no? I did:
08:53<Aleric>sudo mii-tool --force=10baseT-HD --reset eth1
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08:55<Aleric>exlt: I don't know what you mean with server and switch port... This is a PC connected to a cable modem.
08:55<Aleric>The first IP that I can see/ping/traceroute is my gateway. That's to which I measure the packetloss to.
08:56<exlt>Aleric: like I said, if that is a good setting or not really depends on it matching the switch port that you are connected to - replacing the cable and card is a decent suggestion for ruling out the obvious, but the switch port, itself, would usually show errors if the cable or nic has issues
08:56<exlt>ahh, cable modem...
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08:56<exlt>thought you were talking about a server in a data center..
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08:57<Aleric>Well, the connection seems ok now... I moved the utp cable a bit and went to half duplex.
08:58<Aleric>When the problem returns, I'll replace the ethernet card and cable.
08:58<exlt>Aleric: did they give you a new modem?...
08:58<Aleric>I only do this because they want me to do this before they continue to investigate.
08:58<Aleric>I don't care, it's not the modem.
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08:58<exlt>in my experience, many times it is..
08:59<Aleric>Well, then maybe next time they will try that.
08:59<Aleric>Especially since my phone line, that also uses the cable, still worked fine when I don't have internet.
08:59<Aleric>That seems to indicate that's it's the modem indeed...
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09:00<Aleric>I can try what happens if I put an electrical heater on the cable modem...
09:00<exlt>phone traffic is pretty lenient with regards to a marginal connection - data is not
09:00<Aleric>Heat it up a few degrees.
09:00<Aleric>Yes, :/
09:01<Aleric>The mechanic that was here told me that though. I was thinking what you say. If I get 90% packet loss on internet, there is no reason whatsoever that the phone wouldn't work.
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09:02<Aleric>Well, I guess I'll start making graphs. A few year ago I had a similar problem, and then they did come into action when I started to put graphs of the packet loss on internet.
09:03<petemc>what they've suggested you try sounds very reasonable
09:03<Aleric>Then it turned out to be a disturbance signal caused by some TV somewhere. They added filters and then it worked.
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09:04<Aleric>petemc: From there point of view... however, I didn't change anything here and when it's REALLY bad, the 'online' led of the modem goes off too. That tells ME that it's not my UTP cable.
09:05<Aleric>What keeps bugging me too is that if I reset the cable modem (turn it off for 30 seconds), then it is often okay again for an arbitrary amount of time. Can be an hour, a few hours or even a few days.
09:05<Aleric>Not always though.
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09:05<Aleric>But it definitely has effect the badness of the connection.
09:05<Aleric>effect on*
09:06<One\workin>Aleric, try different type of cable modem
09:06<One\workin>maybe the problem is the modem?
09:06<Aleric>Well, I guess I'll first change the ethernet card, utp cable - then I can ask them to replace the modem - and if THEN I still have problem, they'll have to take it serious that it's somewhere outside of my livingroom.
09:07<Aleric>Yes, it might be.
09:07<Aleric>They have a strict policy to follow though, it seems.
09:07<One\workin>blah, strict policy bla bla..
09:07<Aleric>I have already started the process to switch to another ISP by the way... that is going to take 2 months though :/
09:08<One\workin>wow, 2 months..
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09:08<Aleric>First I need to get a phone line from another company, and then I can ask for an ADSL line on it, which takes another 3 weeks.
09:08<One\workin>we adding new clients in about one-two weeks ;) (max)
09:08<One\workin>Aleric, ah, phone..
09:08<One\workin>we still using good old lan ;)
09:08<Aleric>I have phone over the cable now, and therefore I can't even sign up for ADSL :/
09:09<One\workin>where are u from?
09:09<Aleric>The Netherlands
09:09<One\workin>in bulgaria we have 3in1 - internet, phone and tv
09:09<One\workin>over 1 calble ;)
09:10<Aleric>Sure, that's what I have.
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09:11<Aleric>But 1) I don't have a TV, but if I want internet over the cable, they force me to have radio/TV - so I pay extra for that, and never use it. 2) If I want to switch to another provider (non-cable), I'll have to use ADSL, but you can only ask for that if you have a copperwire phoneline.
09:11<One\workin>well phoneline always sux ;)
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09:12<Aleric>3) Once I have internet over ADSL, I can start to have phone over internet - in which case I don't need my phone abonnement anymore, but you can't get a phoneline under 1 year contract.
09:12<One\workin>Aleric, the best way is optic cable ;)
09:13|-|streuner [] has joined #debian
09:13<Aleric>So now I need to buy a one year phone line contract JUST to get ADSL, while I don't really need that contract.
09:13<One\workin>Aleric, there is not alternative ISP's around?
09:13<Aleric>One\workin: Well, it's optic of course-- but not the last meters.
09:14<One\workin>well, last meters = optic converter and RJ45 out ;)
09:14<Aleric>Sure, but all other ISP's use ADSL, all of which use the copperwire of a company called 'KPN' here. I can either use 'cable' (from UPC) or 'copper' from KPN. In the latter case I can choose between many different ISP's.
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09:17<Aleric>I now pay 930 euro per year for ISP1 (my old one that has my shell and website), phone, radio/TV and internet.
09:17|-|caat [] has joined #debian
09:17<Aleric>The latter is ISP2 then.
09:18<One\workin>Aleric, well, many "small" isp's offer more quality of internet connection ;)
09:18<One\workin>my isp is small one
09:18<One\workin>4000 users
09:18<One\workin>and it's all fine ;)
09:18<One\workin>I can choose from 1-10mbit/s
09:18<Aleric>If I drop ISP2, then I can also drop radio/TV, and drop the phone - because I can start to use phone over internet - AND I can combine what I still pay to ISP1 with my ADSL from them (another 120 per year savings) ...
09:19<nowhere_man>I can confirm that, my small ISP offers a static IPv4 address, a /48 IPv6 range and backup NS/MX
09:19<Aleric>So, then I only pay like 545 euro per year - same internet speed more or less, no radio/TV.
09:19<Aleric>I should switch anyway therefore.
09:20<One\workin>well, if you dont use radio/tv...
09:20<Aleric>Yes, that too. With the new ISP I'm going to I'll finally have a real static IP :)
09:20<One\workin>eheh ;)
09:20<Aleric>Never, I listen to internet radio all the time.
09:20<One\workin>I have real static ip from over 4 years :)
09:20<Aleric>I don't like DJ's
09:20<One\workin>well you can listen to iradio whenever you want :>
09:21<One\workin>live365 dot com ;)
09:21<One\workin>so.. we spammed the good channel ;)
09:22<Aleric>Hmm, I have had no packet loss since I switched to half-duplex :/
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09:22<Aleric>11 Oct 15:36:00 120 packets transmitted, 119 received, 0% packet loss, time 59731ms
09:22<Aleric>Not true, there was one there.
09:23<nowhere_man>did anyone also had scrollkeeper-update segfault when configuring GNOME packages?
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09:23<Aleric>Or maybe that was still before I switched...
09:23<Aleric>[15:37] <gsimmons> Aleric: You can also use mii-tool for that.
09:24<Aleric>Yup, that was before I switched.
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09:24<One\workin>--- ping statistics ---
09:24<One\workin>7 packets transmitted, 0 received, 100% packet loss, time 6001ms
09:24<One\workin>Aleric, no pacet loss at all ;)
09:24<monra>anyone knows how do i eject a cd in debian through command line?
09:24<Aleric>I'm going to eat breakfast, shower, dress and buy a new utp cable.
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09:25<Aleric>Can anyone tell me for sure that I do not need a cross-over cable between PC and cable modem? :)
09:25<interbird>eject /dev/cdrom
09:25<Aleric>Or do I?
09:25<padski>monra, man eject
09:25<One\workin>Aleric, well, check the cable
09:25<interbird>eject -t /dev/cdrom to load
09:25<One\workin>what was the word ...
09:25<monra>i got this: eject: unable to open `/dev/hdd'
09:25[~]Aleric unplugs the cable .. brb
09:25<One\workin>blah, I'm too bad in english ;)
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09:25<One\workin>monra, something is using your cd drive
09:26<One\workin>kill the process, and it will eject
09:26<interbird>then your /dev/cdrom symlink points to the wrong hdd device
09:26<monra>hm.... whcihc prosecc could it be when looking at ps -A
09:26<One\workin>monra, not in every case
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09:26<One\workin>I have 1 hard drive and 1 cd-rw
09:27<One\workin>so, hdd is "hda" and cd-rw is "hdd"
09:27<One\workin>don't know why's that, but it is
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09:27<One\workin>and it is working just fine
09:27<monra>how can i find the crdom device?
09:28<streuner>look into dmesg
09:28<padski>monra, the cdrom is quite likely the default. you may find simply 'eject' will work
09:28<interbird>monta: try eject /dev/hdc
09:28<lupine_nx>/dev/cdrom or /dev/dvd
09:28<monra>padski, nope doen's work
09:28<lupine_nx>ping failed
09:29<monra>interbird, neither does hdc and lupine_nx neither does dvd
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09:29<Aleric>It's not a cross over.
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09:29<One\workin>Aleric, well, you know what to buy
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09:30<One\workin>monra, check where is the cdrom mounted
09:30<One\workin>and try to umount
09:30<padski>hmm. isn't it supposed to read mtab ?
09:30<One\workin>padski, it is .. ;0
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09:31<interbird>monra: eject /dev/scd0
09:31<One\workin>monra, ps ax |grep kio
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09:31<One\workin>debed, at last....
09:31<One\workin>pvt ;)
09:31<Aleric>120 packets transmitted, 118 received :(
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09:32<One\workin>what are you ping-ing ?
09:32<Aleric>My gateway
09:32<One\workin>try to ping something inside your isp, and something outside
09:32<jthomas>how can i Bash script creating links from one file type to another? Currently I have "for fname in *.vfb do ln-s $fname $fname.ifb done" but my resulting files are foo.vfb.ifb and i only want foo.ifb
09:32<One\workin>loss to gateway ?!?
09:32<One\workin>that sux
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09:33<One\workin>Aleric, what is the packet size ?
09:33|-|xt [~xt@] has joined #debian
09:33<monra>nothing warks
09:33<themill>jthomas: either use basename to strip off the extension, or parameter substitution to remove it.
09:33|-|salman_ [~salman@] has joined #debian
09:33<themill>jthomas: man basename or man bash (and look for the ${param/foo/bar} syntax.
09:34<jthomas>will do, thank you
09:34<One\workin>monra, did you try ps ax |grep kio
09:34<One\workin>and check for process named kio_audiocd
09:34<monra> 4426 pts/1 R+ 0:00 grep kio
09:34<monra> that's all
09:34<interbird>monra: does lsscsi show an scd0 device?
09:34<One\workin>well, you use gnome
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09:35<interbird>or scd1
09:35<monra>interbird, lssci? no
09:35<Aleric>One\workin: 64 bytes
09:35<One\workin>Aleric, well.. bad
09:35<One\workin>try with larger packet size
09:35<One\workin>if you get the same loss
09:35<One\workin>it's not from the cable (or your lan-card in that matter(
09:36|-|jae_ [] has joined #debian
09:36<Aleric>What do you mean with 'cable'?
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09:37<One\workin>from your lan to the optic-converter (or to what is in the other side) :)
09:37<interbird>monra: we are talking about an ide-cdrom device ?
09:37<Aleric>I have no internet radio anymore :/
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09:37<monra>basically, what do u mean with ide?
09:37<monra>it's in the computer
09:37<interbird>monra: what does uname -a say?
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09:37<themill>Is this cd mounted?
09:38<monra>Linux debian 2.6.18-3-686 #1 SMP Mon Dec 4 16:41:14 UTC 2006 i686 GNU/Linux
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09:38<monra>themill, no
09:38<interbird>monra: does ls /dev/scd* return files?
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09:38<themill>ok... just checking.... no-one seemed to have asked that yet ;)
09:39<interbird>monra: does ls /dev/hd* return files?
09:39<monra>interbird, no
09:39<monra>interbird, hd does
09:39<interbird>which ones?
09:39<dpkg>hmm... cn is China, or for help in chinese please /j #debian-zh, or for help in chinese please /j #debian-zh Please use UTF-8, for IRC help see | Qt/KDE è¿æ¸¡æå¼å§ï¼è¯¦æ请é读
09:39<themill>maizeysl: ^^
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09:40<interbird>monra: is the cdrom working in gnome, kde or whatever gui you use ?
09:40<themill>maizeysl: /join #debian-zh
09:40<themill>maizeysl: and please do not private message people
09:41<maizeysl>themill, OH
09:41<monra>interbird, yes
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09:42<interbird>monra: eject /dev/hdb ?
09:43<themill>monra: what error message do you get from that
09:43<monra>eject: unable to find or open device for: `/dev/hdb'
09:44<interbird>monra: can yo paste the outcome of ls /dev/hd* here?
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09:44<monra>/dev/hda /dev/hda2 /dev/hda4 /dev/hda6 /dev/hda8 /dev/hdc
09:44<monra>/dev/hda1 /dev/hda3 /dev/hda5 /dev/hda7 /dev/hda9 /dev/hdd
09:45<interbird>monra: looks like /dev/hdd is your cdrom
09:45<monra>eject: unable to open `/dev/hdd'
09:45<lupine_nx>permissions problem?
09:46<themill>monra: are you in the cdrom group (command: groups)
09:46<interbird>monra: lupine_nx has a valid point, are you member of the cdrom group ?
09:46<interbird>monra: id will show your membership
09:47<monra>how can i know that?
09:47<themill>or groups
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09:49<interbird>monra: usermod -a -G cdrom $(whoami)
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09:49<monra>doens't return anything
09:49<interbird>monra: now logout and login again and you will be member of the cdrom group
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09:50<itachik>good morning
09:50<itachik>any1 know here how to use enviroment with socks5 proxy ?
09:50|-|Depressure [] has joined #debian
09:50<monra>i don't have usermod.. only as root
09:51<itachik>like export socks_proxy localhost 1060 ?
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09:51<interbird>monra: sorry, thats true. what is the username you are logged in as ?
09:51<Depressure>hi all =) how do i merge files after they have been splitted with split? i have read the man pages, but it looks like i'm to stupid to understand it
09:51<monra>interbird, monra
09:51<lupine_nx>Depressure: you can just cat them all together
09:51<interbird>monra: as root run: usermod -a -G cdrom monra
09:52<lupine_nx>cat part1 part2 part3 [...] > full-file
09:52<themill>interbird: under debian, there's also: adduser username groupname which is even easier.
09:52<monra>still nothing
09:52|-|Aleric [] has joined #debian
09:52<lupine_nx>group changes require a relog to take effect, right?
09:53<themill>monra: nothing from a command implies success; you have to log out and log in again to actually join the group
09:53<interbird>themill: i know but usermod is always present and adduser might not be
09:53<monra>still nothing
09:53<monra>thanks for you rhlep
09:53<interbird>monra: what does whoami say ?
09:53<Depressure>lupine_nx: thanx I'll try =)
09:54<monra>interbird, monra
09:54<interbird>monra: did you run the usermod command as root ?
09:54<One\workin>interbird, nice nickname
09:54<monra>interbird, yes
09:54<One\workin>one of my city's ISP have that name
09:54<interbird>monra: now you have to logout and login for the group adding to be effective
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09:58<Aleric>internet radio didn't work anymore... I switched back to full duplex, and now it works fine again :/
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09:58<interbird>monra: when you are reloggedin as monra, id should show the cdrom group
09:59<Aleric>It majorly sucks to switch ethernetcard though :/
09:59<interbird>monra: then eject /dev/hdd should work
09:59<monra>how can i get the cds back
09:59|-|buzztracker [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
09:59<monra>i mean the opposite of eject
10:00|-|buzztracker [] has joined #debian
10:00<interbird>monra: as root do ln -sf /dev/hdd /dev/cdrom
10:00<lupine_nx>eject -t to close the CD tray
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10:02<padski>interbird, shouldn't that be automagically created by udev ?
10:04<interbird>padski: yes, i've also experianced wrong symlinks after software installation or kernel upgrades. i even run a script to correct them at boot
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10:09<monra>anyway. any ideas how can i make vi have colours?
10:10|-|MoDaX [] has quit [Quit: Just leaving for now. But I guess, not for so long]
10:10<interbird>google vi with colors
10:10|-|One\workin [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
10:10<themill>you need the vim-full package and you need to run it as vim not vi and having a .vimrc helps too
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10:16<stew>monra: use vim, and uncomment the "syntax on" line in /etc/vim/vimrc or /etc/vim/vimrc.tiny if you are using vim-tiny instead of vim or vim-full
10:16|-|js_ [~js@] has joined #debian
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10:16<E0x>wrong channel
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10:20<js_>i have problem
10:20<JasonS>js_: we all do :)
10:21<padski>js_, you've taken the first step ;-)
10:21<js_>i dont know this where (bad english)
10:21|-|mankod [] has joined #debian
10:21<JasonS>js_: what language do you speak?
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10:22<dpkg>[cz] Czech Republic. Kanal pro cechy je #debian-cz
10:22<dpkg>from memory, cn is China, or for help in chinese please /j #debian-zh, or for help in chinese please /j #debian-zh Please use UTF-8, for IRC help see | Qt/KDE è¿æ¸¡æå¼å§ï¼è¯¦æ请é读
10:22<JasonS>ahh thats the one
10:23<js_>can you speak chinese
10:23<JasonS>no we cant, well i can a very little but debisn-zh may be best
10:23<Vakio>js_: try #debian-zh
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10:24<js_>are you where
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10:35<kurumin>can someone tell me how i can execute an install script
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10:35<chealer>kurumin: which Debian suite do you use?
10:35<JasonS>kurumin: in debian?
10:36<dpkg>Kurumin Linux is a Brazilian run-from-CD Linux distribution based on Knoppix. That means it's not Debian. Go away.. Ajuda pra Kurumin:
10:36<kurumin>i think it is debian based
10:36<chealer>kurumin: kurumin is not a Debian suite.
10:36<kurumin>that was nice
10:36<JasonS>ya not the best response from dpkg i admit
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10:37<JasonS>never the less its not debian
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10:38<kurumin>now i know
10:39<kurumin>debian= enemy
10:39<JasonS>no kurumin you just dont run debian so we cant help is all
10:40<kurumin>can i stay
10:40<kurumin>or should i go
10:40[~]JasonS slips into a clash song
10:40<interbird>if c is based on b and b is based on a and a is hostile would c be friendly ?
10:40<chealer>kurumin: you can stay, just don't ask offtopic questions.
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10:49<Aleric>is I back?
10:49|-|kurumin [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
10:49[~]Aleric changed ethernet card and is now using a cat 6 cable of 1 meter.
10:50<Aleric>And using 10baseT-FD... half duplex just totally doesn't work.
10:50<Aleric>So, if now I get problems again they have to replace the cable modem! }:-)
10:50<interbird>i note the change, your tekst is flying :-)
10:50<Aleric>11 Oct 17:51:56 100 packets transmitted, 100 received, 0% packet loss, time 10108ms
10:50<Aleric>11 Oct 17:52:06 100 packets transmitted, 100 received, 0% packet loss, time 10102ms
10:50<Aleric>So far so good.
10:51<Aleric>My firewall is close to the cable modem now, so I don't have a keyboard/monitor anymore for it :/
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11:38<tub>hi, what's the easiest way to remove all the rows that start with character "(" from a .txt file?
11:38<azeem>tub: grep -v ^\( .txt > new.txt; or so
11:38<amphi>tub: grep -v '^\('
11:38<cahoot>tub: sed is problably a good answer - sedfaq is something to google for
11:39<tub>trying those..
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11:40<tub>worked, you are my hero's for today! thanks
11:41<amphi>aarrggh, grocer's apostrophe ;)
11:42<tub>true, my bad. not my native lang.
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11:45<amphi>tub: and many native english speakers do this ;)
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12:04<pedro>one question: i have System Monitor, and i wonder if there's such a thing as a better process viewer etc. In the wacky windows world, Process Explorer is the best. Is there a program like that for Debian, or System Monitor is as good as it gets? thx for the help in advance
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12:07<pedro>but is it better, more detailed and so on
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12:35<cube>i installed my debian system, installed the xserver-xorg packege and wanted to start it, but it says no valid font path could be found
12:35<cube>how can i fix this?
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12:35<qbit>apt-get install x-window-system-core
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12:36<cube>ut why isn't this then an dependency?
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12:38<qbit>so you can have the server with out the other stuff
12:39<qbit>you could also do x-window-system and get even more packages
12:39<qbit>but core should get ya moving
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12:42<stew>qbit: x-window-system-core and x-window-system install the same pacakges, which is the "xorg" package and everything it depends on
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12:43<stew>cube: you don't have xfonts-base. this is not a dependency becuase it is possible to run the xserver with it getting fonts from a remote font server over the network
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12:44<qbit>stew, ahh
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12:51<Thotter>Hi. When I login on a tty and type a wrong password, the login program will immediatly say "Login incorrect". Is there a way to change this so that it'll ask for the password too? This is on lenny
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12:52<stew>Thotter: what do you mean? it DID ask for the password, right?
12:52<Thotter>no, it immediatly went to "Login incorrect"
12:52<Thotter>err, I mean
12:52<Thotter>when I type a wrong login
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12:52<Thotter>not when I type a wrong password. Sorry
12:53<goauld>anyone knows when tickless kernel will be available for intel core 2 duo (EMT64)
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12:53<simonrvn>uh, means that it didn't find that user... that's normal
12:53<goauld>i mean, someone knows?
12:53<Thotter>Yes, but I rather have it ask for a password too, even if the user doesn't exist. This happens on another computer I have (etch)
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12:54<simonrvn>why should it bother asking for a password if the user isn't found?
12:54<goauld>it could be used with dictionary attacks to gess valid usernames
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12:55<Thotter>For example. But right now I'm trying to make the login thing work with a kerberos server too, and it fails immidiatly if the user doesn't exist yet
12:56<fxiny>see /etc/pam.d/common-password
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12:56<Thotter>That says the exact same thing as it does on my etch computer, where this works
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12:57<Thotter>I'm sorry. Dinner is here, thanks for trying to help anyway
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12:57<cube>stew x-window-system-core worked
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12:58<goauld>ok i need to know when tickless kernel will be available for 64 bit
12:58<stew>goauld: its not available from the kernels afaik (i haven't specifically checked the new 2.6.23, but i checked the changelog and didnt' see anything)
12:58<stew>goauld: so you are probably better off asking in a kernel specific channel
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13:00<goauld>stew i know, 2.6.23 has tickless and HPET thing but no for 64bit yet :-\ and this is the most populateed channel to ask
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13:00<Vakio>Populated by people who have no idea.
13:00<stew>goauld: the debian specific answer is that it will be available in debian unstable probably a few days or weeks after it is released upstream
13:00<stew>goauld: try #kernelnewbies
13:01<goauld>ok, that channel is full thanks
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13:25<Thotter>Does anyone here have a system setup where their login prompt asks for a password, even if the username they supplied doesn't exist?
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13:27<goauld>which login prompt?
13:27<lamby>Thotter: Yes. Most people will have that as it doesn't leak information about users on the system.
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13:29<Thotter>lamby: I don't seem to have it for some reason.
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13:30<Thotter>lamby: Any idea what configuration option does this?
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13:31<lamby>< goauld> which login prompt?
13:31<error3>hello :)
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13:32<Thotter>The login prompt on tty
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13:33<lamby>Mm, maybe something broke something in /etc/inittab. Or somewhere in PAM.
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13:34<Thotter>lamby: I've been working with PAM to get kerberos authentication working. Perhaps I changed something that shouldn't be changed
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13:34<Thotter>But I compared with my other computer where it works, and it seems to have the same configuration
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13:38<simonrvn>lamby: doh, that's a good reason
13:39<simonrvn>lamby: not leaking info about users
13:39<ejesus>i not
13:39<Thotter>I just rechecked, the pam files on both systems are the same (I removed the kerberos specific stuff on this computer to make sure that wasn't causing it), and I still don't get a password prompt if the user doesn't exist
13:40<lamby>You've restarted and everything, right?
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13:40<Thotter>Oh, I didn't. Is that neccesary?
13:40<lamby>Probably, with something like this.
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13:40<lamby>I are not PAM experts.
13:40<Thotter>Hmm. worth a try I guess. brb
13:40<simonrvn>no, no need to restart for pam
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13:40<Thotter>Do I need to reload anything then?
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13:41<simonrvn>no. this is why you need to keep a root console open, just in case you fuck up something in pam
13:41<Thotter>Hmm. Good point there
13:42<lamby>Meh, but the terminals might need restarting. Oh well, simonrvn clearly knows more than I do, he can help now. :)
13:42<Thotter>root console is open :P
13:42<simonrvn>init q; init u might do it... *checks*
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13:43<simonrvn>hmm, that would only matter if you changed something in getty itself
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13:44<Thotter>Okay... I think it's not in PAM, or it'd have to be in a file I never touched
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13:44[~]simonrvn is a bit tired due to lack of sleep
13:44<simonrvn>*blink* nm that, heh
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13:45<ejesus>i´m tired
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13:53<Thotter>This looks relevant (in auth.log): Oct 11 20:52:32 pc1320 login[3663]: FAILED LOGIN (1) on 'tty1' FOR `UNKNOWN', User not known to the underlying authentication module
13:53<Thotter>Perhaps it is PAM after all
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---Logclosed Thu Oct 11 14:42:55 2007
---Logopened Thu Oct 11 14:43:01 2007
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14:43|-|Ekipa kanalu #debian: Wszystkich: 317 |-| +op [2] |-| +voice [0] |-| normalnych [315]
14:43<goauld>throtter those files are correct, exactly same as mines
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14:43<Thotter>goauld: As I thought, thanks anyway
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14:43<twb`>Thotter: you say two identical machines are behaving differently?
14:44<stew>goauld: and you have the behavior that he desires? or the behavior that he currently has?
14:44<Thotter>twb`: Not identical. This is Lenny, the machine it works on is etch
14:44<goauld>i have behavior he desires
14:44<twb`>The lenny system is misbehaving?
14:44|-|Kanal #debian zsynchronizowany w 93 sekundy
14:45<goauld>are u sure u have not moddified any other file in pam.d ?
14:45<twb`>Thotter: are both systems authenticating aganist the same server using the same protocol?
14:45<Thotter>goauld: Very sure.
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14:46<Thotter>goauld: I've been playing with it today, and the last change this one lists apart from those 4 files was in september
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14:46<Thotter>twb`: I removed all kerberos related things now. It now is the same as what came with Lenny by default
14:46<Thotter>So it only checks local users
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14:47<Thotter>But if I try to login a user that doesn't exist, instead of going to the password: prompt anyway, it immediatly says "Login incorrect", without even lagging
14:48<twb`>Thotter: can you log in at all?
14:48<Thotter>And auth.log says Oct 11 21:47:46 pc1320 login[4211]: FAILED LOGIN (1) on 'tty1' FOR `UNKNOWN', User not known to the underlying authentication module
14:48<Thotter>Yes, I can, with accounts that exist
14:48<twb`>I don't understand pam well enough to say why, sorry.
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14:49<Thotter> No problem
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14:52<Carl0s>I got problem setting up reverse dns on my bind. anyone experienced to check what I did wrong?
14:52<sepski>what error do you get ?
14:54<goauld>Thotter: i made a mistake, i though i had the feature u want but i have the same problem as u
14:54<goauld>logins rejected if wrong
14:55<Carl0s>it just do not resolve back. i both suspect my fuckup as well as my isp not setting up the classless zone to me
14:55<redondos>I'm having problems with make-kpkg. I think the script is failing to find the version string in the makefile. Any ideas? Here's the output:
14:55<goauld>i was using ssh so i did not noticed
14:55<Carl0s>the problem is I set rev once ages ago for the whole C class, so it was trivial. this subclass is smaller (/27) so maybe I did something wrong with it. that's why I need someone to look at it
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14:58<Thotter>that seems to be the bug, but there's no solution
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15:05<error3>Thotter: solution is given on /usr/share/doc/
15:06<error3>you just have to replace requisite by required
15:06<error3>I don't know for which this solution is... goauld ?
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15:11<Thotter>error3: replace requisite by required where?
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15:13<error3>in the /etc/pam.d/whatyouwant
15:13<error3>example login
15:13<Thotter>Hmm, but it's not requisite :(
15:13<Thotter>wait, one thing is
15:13<error3>it's required ?
15:13<Thotter> is requisite
15:14<Thotter>and pam_nologin is as well
15:14<error3>yes I think that's it
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15:14<Thotter>error3: You're my hero
15:14<Thotter>It works :)
15:14<error3>No problem :)
15:15<kop>Carl0s: Read rfc2317 and then make sure you and your ISP are using the same conventions. Some use slashes, some dashes, some dots, and in various places.
15:15<error3>simply look on /usr/share/doc when something is not like you want
15:15<Thotter>I thought I read there already, not carefully enough it seems
15:15<Thotter>Or wait, I didn't.
15:15<Thotter>Right, thank you :)
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15:16<kop>Carl0s: You can use dig to check what your ISP has set up.
15:17<Carl0s>I know. I do not see he did it
15:17<Carl0s>still, my bind also do not resolv IPs correclty when 'asked' on localhost, so it may be we both fucked it up ;
15:18<Carl0s>kop: I was just checking if we match the conentions. It seems we did not. I am now going to see if that solves it
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15:18<Thotter>Right, now I'll probably be able to setup kerberos fine tomorrow
15:18<Thotter>thank you!
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15:19<Carl0s>hm, it does not help
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15:34<telenieko>hi ppl. there's a package in one ftp mirror whose md5 sum differs from another, where should I report that ?¿
15:35<lupine_85>the owner of the mirror
15:35<stew>telenieko: #debian-mirrors
15:35<telenieko>thanks stew
15:36<stew>telenieko: however you might just wait to see if it is fixed during the next mirror pulse
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15:36<telenieko>stew, it's been around for a long time ;)
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15:37<telenieko>the package moved to testing in 30/08/07 ;)
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15:44<stephen>hi guys.. would anyone know how to parse a document to move all lines into one single line? many thansk
15:44<stephen>I have a html document i just need all the text put into one line
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15:45<stew>stephen: tr -d '\n'
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15:45<stephen>stew thank you !
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15:50<Beshamo>is it possible to set up a ftp server that encrypts the login procedure, but leaves the data transfer unencrypted?
15:50<stephen>Hi stew.. have a problem.. an rss feed has an invalid <description> with return chars.. any idea how i can remove the lines between <description> ?
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15:51<stephen>or at the end of every </tag> do a new line?
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15:52<stephen>or do you know any program that cleans up rss text files?
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15:52<stew>stephen: i would probably write a perl script or a xslt template to do that
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15:58<brunoluiz>dskvhu8dsf gudfj
15:58<brunoluiz>gh[ m
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16:04<Sbo0b>Hi , have some problem with postfix ( one debian lenny with courier , maildrop , mysql ) , user account are ok ( tested with authtest ) , but when i try a mail user@domain it return me that " fatal: missing argv= command-line attribute ", i know that the error come from pipe but dont know how to fix it :'(
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16:04<Beshamo>sftp is quite slow, is there any way to have a secure ftp connection that perhaps doesn't encrypt the data transfer, but only the login?
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16:08<lupine_85>Beshamo: if the FTP server supports PAM authentication, then sure
16:08<lupine_85>you could get it to authenticate by ,or something
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16:09<lupine_85>erm, by certificate...
16:09<Beshamo>lupine_85, which ftp server supports that and how is it set up?
16:09<lupine_85>I don't know, and I don't know
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16:09<Beshamo>lupine_85, well, at least I have a new search string for google now:)
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16:11<stephen>OK.. next question.. do you know any software that will take a xml/html file.. and put one tag with contents per line?
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16:12<dondelelcaro>stephen: you can do that with perl
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16:12<dondelelcaro>(or any other language that has a non-sucky XML/HTML parser)
16:12[~]stephen knows no perl :-(
16:12<dondelelcaro>what are you planning on doing with that file once you've done that?
16:13<stephen>Im using linux to clean up a bad RSS feed..
16:13<stephen>The RSS feed contains new lines in the description tag.. which shows a square in the software that presents it
16:14<stephen>Im just trying to remove any plain text line.. so that each line will begin with its tag
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16:19<Nemoder>stephans: sounds like it is using DOS newlines and not unix
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16:19<Nemoder>er stephen sorry
16:19<stephen>Nemoder good point
16:19<stephen>There is dos to unix converterd in apt somewhere..
16:19<stephen>do you knwo the name of the package?
16:19<stephen>thank you so much!
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16:22<stephen>Nemoder flip didnt do the trick :-(
16:22<stephen>i think its the rss xml parser on the windows client..
16:23<Nemoder>oh, if it's a dos/windows app that is reading it then tell it to use dos newlines
16:24<stephen>Nemoder how do i do that?
16:24<Nemoder>flip -m file
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16:24<stephen>Nemoder yeah tried that too..
16:24<stephen>didnt work :(
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16:25<stephen>Nemoder any other ideas>
16:25<Nemoder>not without seeing the code for client
16:25<plokko>i have problem compiling kernel 2.6.18
16:25<plokko>make menuconfig report error 2
16:26<Supaplex>I let the compliler compile it. must eaiser.
16:26<lupine_85>stephen: does the XML/HTML file have blank lines in it, which is causing the trouble?
16:26<lupine_85>(as far as you know)
16:26<lupine_85>if you could put an example file up somewhere, it'd be helpful
16:27<stephen>lupine_85 No.. it has a new line in the middle of the description tag.. which is throwing the rss reader off
16:27<stephen>btw guys this is for a non-profit community tv channel.. so many thanks for the help!
16:27<stephen><description>Media&Marketing: How do you market something that
16:27<plokko>plz someone can help me?
16:27<stephen>more text
16:27<stephen>then more text </decsription>
16:27<JasonS>plokko: more information
16:27<lupine_85>plokko: not unless you report the /real/ erro
16:27<stephen>its on 3 + more lines
16:28<stephen>so at the end of "<description>Media&Marketing: How do you market something that" it is producing an unwanted square char
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16:28<lupine_85>stephen: ah, I see. Basically, you write a script that loads up the file, then for each tag, remove all \n 's, then output the nice shiny new file
16:29<plokko>make menuconfig report a lot of errors like scripts....error:expected '=',','
16:29<Onepamopa>can someone try to scan my ports ?
16:29<lupine_85>or if you can get away with it, you could remove /all/ newlines from the file (which would preclude the need to parse the HTML/XML, but make it really uglu)
16:29[~]lupine_85 haxx0rs Onepamopa and steals his pr0n
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16:29<stephen>lupine_85 Yep.. I think ill have to give it a shot.. can you think of an easier way.. possibly with awk?
16:30|-|ErJeDi [] has joined #debian
16:30<plokko>...what can be?
16:30<stephen>I know its powers.. but cant control it.. pretty much like the dark side :_)
16:30<lupine_85>I don't know awk, but if you look for >, then remove \n's until you hit <, that should work
16:30<Onepamopa>lupine_85: ahaha ;)
16:30<Onepamopa>just scan them...
16:30<Onepamopa>I'm trying something
16:31<Nemoder>plokko: paste all of the errors here:
16:31<lupine_85>and wh not use something like grc instead?
16:31<plokko>i can't
16:31<plokko>im on windows now
16:31<Onepamopa>lupine_85: some firewall rules
16:31<istoc>Hi, I wanna install fluxbox, how can I check what parts of xorg it needs to install?
16:31<Onepamopa>I want to know if they work
16:31<lupine_85>grc is your friend, then
16:31<Onepamopa>but I cant scan myself
16:31<stephen>hey lupine_85 thanks for the help!
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16:31<plokko>i must recompile kernel to work with wifi(try to work T_T)
16:31<Nemoder>plokko: well we can't help you if we don't know what all the errors are
16:31<lupine_85>sorry I can't be more. awk is, as you say, evil
16:32<plokko>some files in scripts are missed
16:32[~]lupine_85 could do it in $small_number lines of C, though :D
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16:33<Onepamopa>lupine_85: so?
16:33<plokko>i made make mrproper
16:33<plokko>but make menuconfig report a lot of errors
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16:34<Grueber>this is cool running deb off a USB drive
16:34<lupine_85>Onepamopa: so use grc
16:34<Onepamopa>grc ?
16:35<Nemoder>plokko: menuconfig requires all the ncurses libs, maybe you are missing some of them
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16:35<plokko> what command should i run?
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16:35<plokko>aaah it's the firs kernel rec.i can't make!
16:35<lupine_85>libncurses5-dev for the kernel, right?
16:36|-|E0x [] has quit [Quit: off]
16:36<Onepamopa>lupine_85: can you be more specific ?
16:36<plokko>i have all the errors in a file!
16:36<Eulex>plokko, what wireless network card?
16:36<lupine_85>Onepamopa: it's a website. Use google.
16:36|-|stephen [] has left #debian []
16:36<Grueber>isn't that the ralink 2500 chip
16:36<Eulex>plokko, how will recompiling help you? are you patching your kernel?
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16:37<plokko>no sis163u
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16:37<lupine_85>that's a new one on me, I must admit
16:37<Eulex>plokko, chipset and card brand are two different things.
16:37<plokko>i must reconfigure one thing in the kernel(and i want select some things)
16:38<Grueber>yeah make menuconfig? or is that the trouble you're having?
16:38<plokko>the chipset is sis163u and the card is one atlantis-land
16:38<plokko>make menuconfig don't run,report error 2
16:38<Grueber>ah ok, dunno if it's in the kernel
16:38<chealer>plokko: which thing?
16:38<plokko>...kernel from synpac
16:38<Grueber>then I assume you might need to install libncurses5-dev
16:39<Eulex>plokko, from what I read on the net it appears that you need to use ndiswrapper. but you don't need to recompile your kernel to use ndiswrapper.
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16:39<plokko>...i know
16:39<Grueber>yeah ndiswrapper if it isn't in the kernel
16:39<Grueber>I had to do that with my encore piece of shit
16:39<lupine_85>package ndiswrapper-source
16:39<plokko>but one thread report my same error and the solution is one little mod in the kernel
16:40<plokko>also i want to modificate something to improve performance XD
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16:41<plokko>asd i don't have libncurses
16:41<dpkg>*** NEWS FLASH! *** Your box does not come with every app, tool and utility known to debiankind installed already. If you find that the program you've been told to use isn't there, install it. Also ask me about <search>. if someone suggests an application to you, it's highly likely that it's available via apt-get
16:42<Grueber>then get libncurses5-dev and gcc and probably libstdc++5-dev
16:42<lupine_85>apt-get build-dep linux-image-2.6 ?
16:42<plokko>now run
16:42[~]Grueber chuckles
16:42<plokko>synaptic is cool but miss a lot of dependances!
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16:43<Grueber>this is sweet with deb on my portable 160G USB drive, hope I can get it set up that I can run it on multiple PCs
16:43<Eulex>plokko, synaptic is a graphical frontend to apt-get.
16:43<plokko>intel emt64 in kernel is core duo???
16:43<chealer>or rather, a frontend to APT
16:43<chealer>!tell plokko about ep
16:44<Grueber>dunno I'm not an intel guy lol
16:44<chealer>plokko: what do you mean by "intel emt64 in kernel"?
16:44<plokko>...i'm making also a dual opteron(duo)server
16:44|-|ao2 [~u@2001:1418:117::1] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
16:44<plokko>i'm brandless
16:44|-|ville83 [] has joined #debian
16:44<plokko>with 8gb of reg.ram and 4x15k hdds
16:45<Grueber>I was thinking about restoring my old Galaxy ALR700 with dual P2 333's in it lol
16:45<Grueber>talk about ancient history
16:45<lupine_85>intel core2duo uses amd64
16:45|-|varka [] has quit [Quit: took the red pill...]
16:45<lupine_85>/not// em64t
16:45<Grueber>there was someone on a few days ago with 16 GB of ram......
16:45<plokko>...what is em64?
16:45<Onepamopa>No Internet packets of any sort were received from your system as a side-effect of our attempts to elicit some response from any of the ports listed above. Some questionable personal security systems expose their users by attempting to "counter-probe the prober", thus revealing themselves. But your system remained wisely silent. (Except for the fact that not all of its ports are completely stealthed as shown below.)
16:46<Onepamopa>well, I think it's all right ;)
16:46<Grueber>I remember 16 MB was a luxury
16:46<lupine_85>plokko: Synaptic /doesn't/ miss dependencies
16:46<plokko>...8gb=150 euros
16:46<amphi>Onepamopa: t3h gibs0n?
16:46<Grueber>that's it? that's cheap
16:46<Onepamopa>amphi: ?
16:46<lupine_85>and em64t is "Intel's clone of AMD Athlon64/Opteron architecture - provides 64-bit extensions to i386 architecture. Use AMD64 Debian (/msg dpkg amd64), or Sarge with a -em64t-p4 kernel. Found only on Nocona and Irwindale Xeons, or the latest Extreme Edition Pentiums"
16:46<plokko>...synaptic don't miss dependencies if i don't miss it!XD
16:46<amphi>Onepamopa: you achieved TruStealth(tm) nirvana? ;)
16:46<lupine_85>it installs everything marked as Depends:
16:46<Onepamopa>ahah ;)
16:46<lupine_85>what more do you want?
16:47<Grueber>your mom?
16:47<Onepamopa>plokko: not exactly
16:47<lupine_85>you can have her
16:47<lupine_85>assuming you can find her
16:47<lupine_85>you think I'm kidding...
16:47<Eulex>lupine_85, adopted?
16:47<Grueber>I was :P
16:47<lupine_85>...she'd probably 'ave you too
16:47<plokko> bluewhite kernel i have also the core duo option in the kernel lol
16:47<lupine_85>sort-of estranged
16:47<Grueber>what version kernel do you have
16:48<plokko>2.6.18 in debian
16:48<Onepamopa>plokko: 2 of 3 tests passed
16:48<Grueber>ah ok
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16:48<plokko>i think .22 on bluewhite
16:48<lupine_85>plokko: there's a difference between what architecture the kernel is compiled for, and what architecture it's optimised for
16:48<Grueber>I'm compiling now
16:48<Grueber>on this USB drive it's slow as hell but I suspect my extension cable isn't USB 2.0
16:48<Onepamopa>blah, what the ...
16:49<Grueber>plus it spins at 5400 rpm lol
16:49<Onepamopa>XGate:/etc/rc2.d# ./S94rc.firewall start
16:49<Onepamopa>FATAL: Module ip_set not found.
16:49<Onepamopa>ipset v2.2.9a: Error from kernel: Protocol not available
16:49<Grueber>hehe recompile time?
16:49<Onepamopa>I recompile as we speak
16:50<Grueber>oh for god sake... I'm compling 22.10 and there's a .23? hehe
16:50<Onepamopa>it is ;)
16:50<lupine_85>.22 is stable, .23 might not be
16:50<Grueber>that's true
16:50<Onepamopa>it is stable as far as I know
16:50<lupine_85>.18 is /very/ stable :p
16:50<Onepamopa>haha ;)
16:51<Grueber>only because Debian uses it ;D
16:51<Onepamopa>there is no sush thing as very stable
16:51<lupine_85>course there is. It's called etch
16:51<Grueber>yeah say that to the FreeBSD junkies, "very stable and a retarded monkey can operate it"
16:51<Onepamopa>there is always some little thing that causes your system to crash ;))
16:51<lupine_85>Grueber: well, if you stick to the core and don't have ports, it is more stable
16:51|-|Sbo0b [] has quit [Quit: Quitte]
16:51<lupine_85>but... yeah. nobody does :D
16:52<Grueber>heh I'm a NetBSD type anyhow
16:52<lupine_85>eh, they're all the same to me (even though they aren't really :p)
16:53<Onepamopa>lupine_85: so, what i'm trying to do is adaptive firewall
16:53<Onepamopa>it detects and drops/accepts
16:53<plokko>mmh nothing wron with the kernel
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16:53<Onepamopa>scripting is finished but..
16:53<lupine_85>you should reject, not drop
16:53<Onepamopa>this ip_set ..
16:53<chealer>!tell Onepamopa about enter
16:53<lupine_85>and ip_set will be a kernel module that you haven't built
16:53<plokko>should i restart linux to use ndiswrapper drivers?
16:53<chealer>plokko: no
16:53<Onepamopa>hahh.. sorry chealer ;)
16:54<lupine_85>plokko: just modprobe ndiswrapper and set it up
16:54<plokko>omg usbls show the key but it's not working
16:54<lupine_85>that's... normal
16:54<plokko>what i should check in the kernel?
16:54<lupine_85>nothing. nothing at all.
16:54<plokko> what should i do?
16:55<plokko>iwlist wlan0 scan?
16:55<Grueber>what was the tool to measure hard disk speeds?
16:55<dpkg>from memory, ndiswrapper is a way to wrap Windows drivers so that they can be used on Linux (i386 only). If there is a Linux driver for your card, use that instead; if there isn't, email your manufacturer and ask for one (since it's better for everyone involved if there are real drivers), then ask me about <ndiswrapper one-liner> to set up ndiswrapper. If you don't yet own a card, consider buying one that has real Linux drivers.
16:55<chealer>plokko: if you don't mind, could you answer my question first?
16:55<plokko>what question?
16:55<chealer>plokko: [17:39:06] <chealer> plokko: which thing?
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16:56<plokko>o,O which whick thing? i was away for a moment
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16:56<chealer>plokko: [17:38:01] <plokko> i must reconfigure one thing in the kernel(and i want select some things)
16:57<plokko>...a page says networking -> network support
16:57<plokko>it's in french so i can't understand all
16:57<Grueber>lol french?
16:57<chealer>plokko: and what does it tell to reconfigure in network support?
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16:57<plokko>i don't know XD
16:58<chealer>plokko: the page says that you need to reconfigure something in network support to use a sis163u card?
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16:59<plokko>it say 802.11 support
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16:59<plokko>but it's already checked...
16:59|-|buzztracker [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
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17:00<plokko>...where i can find 2.6.22 kernel for debian?
17:00<chealer>plokko: you use Debian stable?
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17:00<chealer>plokko: on Debian mirrors (Linux 2.6.22 is in testing)
17:01<lupine_85>ooh, it's testing now?
17:01<plokko>mmh it's hidden lol XD
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17:01<plokko>6.22 should also enable my hd audio card
17:02<themill>2.6.22 it's also in
17:02<dpkg>rumour has it, is an unofficial repository of backports for the current stable distribution, prepared by Debian developers. Read ask me about <backports>. A sample line for your sources.list is: deb etch-backports main contrib non-free. Once you've added that line, aptitude update && aptitude install debian-backports-keyring && aptitude update
17:02<themill>plokko: ^^
17:03<plokko>zzz 00:02 and tomorrow at 7:00 to university
17:04<chealer>plokko: is that the option's exact name?
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17:06<chealer>plokko: is "802.11 support" the exact name of the option the page says you must enable?
17:07<plokko>i don't know lol
17:07<chealer>plokko: what is it?
17:07<plokko>it's french
17:07<chealer>plokko: is that exactly what the page says?
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17:09<plokko> can you find me the 2.6.22 kernel download link please?
17:09<plokko>(for debian etch 4.0 r1)
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17:10<chealer>plokko: why not following the factoid?
17:11<dpkg>extra, extra, read all about it, is an unofficial repository of backports for the current stable distribution, prepared by Debian developers. Read ask me about <backports>. A sample line for your sources.list is: deb etch-backports main contrib non-free. Once you've added that line, aptitude update && aptitude install debian-backports-keyring && ...
17:12<chealer>plokko: ^^ that's the bpo factoid
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17:12<plokko> sleepinh
17:13<chealer>plokko: the message doesn't say there's a need to reconfigure, just to verify that some option is enabled.
17:13<plokko>plz givve m3 the newest kernel download link
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17:13<plokko>i'll try to reconfigure wifi tomorrow
17:14<chealer>the describes it from memory, he must be wrong.
17:14<error3>oh you speak l337
17:14<chealer>s/the describes/the guy describes
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17:14<chealer>plokko: why don't you follow the factoid?
17:15<themill>plokko: you never just "download" packages for debian. You add the repository and use aptitude to install the package, just as that factoid described.
17:15<plokko>1 5p33k 1337 bu7 1m 45|33p n0w
17:16<themill>plokko: If you're tired, it's not the right time to play with your kernel....come back tomorrow and ask about the 2.6.22 kernel from again.
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17:17<plokko>...ajax,php,mysql,javascript ecc. drive me crazy
17:18<plokko>good night(IF IS NIGHt 4 u)
17:18<chealer>can't ndiswrapper be used on amd64?
17:18<themill>chealer: I'm don't know... there were a couple of guys here last night who were trying...
17:19<themill>chealer: gah... I'll let you parse that into a sentence...
17:19[~]themill needs coffee... but it's a bad idea at this time of night...
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17:20<chealer>themill: hehe, my parser auto-corrected, had to re-read to understand what you meant.
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17:22<Onepamopa>blah, my kernel doesnt have PSD (whatever that means)
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17:23<themill>chealer: from the website: "Can I use ndiswrapper in 64-bit mode for AMD64? Yes."
17:24<chealer>themill: thanks, I was heading there :)
17:24<themill>but you need a 64bit windoze driver to get it to work.
17:24<themill>dpkg: ndiswrapper =~ s/i386/i386 and amd64/
17:24<dpkg>OK, themill
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17:25<chealer>dpkg: no, ndiswrapper is a way to wrap Windows drivers so that they can be used on Linux (x86 only). If there is a Linux driver for your card, first consider that instead; if there isn't, ask me about <ndiswrapper one-liner> to set up NDISwrapper.
17:25<dpkg>chealer: okay
17:25<chealer>oh, sorry
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17:28<chealer>!ndiswrapper one-liner
17:28<dpkg>ndiswrapper one-liner is probably apt-get install build-essential module-assistant && m-a a-i ndiswrapper
17:28<chealer>that looks a little short
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17:29<chealer>I suppose it's better than nvidia one-liner
17:29<themill>much..... the uname piping into sed is always a bit interesting in htat one. You just *know* that people are going to bollox that up
17:30<themill>there's nothing about configuring it in there.... and it probably should use aptitude not apt-get these days, I guess.
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17:31<chealer>more importantly I don't see how it will install ndiswrapper-utils
17:31<themill>chealer: shouldn't it require the kernel-headers-$(uname -r) too? and ndiswrapper-source? (or does m-a pull them in)
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17:32<themill>(never having touched ndiswrapper, I'm at a bit of a disadvantage here)
17:32<chealer>themill: m-a a-i implies m-a prepare on > 3.1. prepare deals with linux-headers.
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17:32<themill>chealer: ok... I've got old habits with m-a :)
17:32<chealer>and m-a a-i implies m-a get
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17:42<otoole>some people want talk???
17:43<jae>Anyone have fglrx working in unstable? Maybe I'm too dumb, but I only see a Conflict... :P
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17:44<chealer>jae: I assume you checked the BTS?
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17:47<jae>Yes, but don't see the dependency error, only X not starting or misbehaving; which makes me think I'm an idiot. Which I strongly doubt.
17:47<themill>jae: what version of X are you running?
17:47<otoole>i don´t know...about are u talking??
17:48<jae>xserver-xorg is at 7.2-5, -core at
17:48<azeem>jae: what do you mean with "Conflict"
17:48<otoole>very good...
17:49|-|geewhiz [] has joined #debian
17:49<otoole>do you speak portuguese??
17:49|-|vander [~vander@] has joined #debian
17:49<dpkg>Este canal é apenas em inglês. Por favor, use #debian-br (/j #debian-br) para ajuda em portugues.
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17:49<jae>-core 1.4 has a Conflicts: with xserver-xorg-video-1.0, which fglrx-driver (most recent unstable) provides
17:50<jae> doesn't
17:50<otoole>don´t born....i write english just a little
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17:50<gravity>There's a good reason for that
17:50<azeem>jae: sounds like regular unstable breakage
17:50<themill>!btssmite jae
17:50[~]dpkg beats jae around the head repeatedly with and apt-listbugs, along with a chainsaw if jae is running Unstable
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17:50<gravity>The conflicts wasn't put there idly
17:50<gravity>It's because fglrx needs an update
17:50<gravity>If you want fglrx, downgrade your xserver to 1.3
17:50<gravity>It's pretty simple
17:50<interbird>dpkg is in a good mood again :-)
17:51<gravity>I don't know why people insist on trying to force it
17:51<dondelelcaro>gravity: they think you must not know what you're doing
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17:52<gravity>dondelelcaro: We clearly have no clue what "ABI breakage" means
17:52|-|EmleyMoor [] has joined #debian
17:52<dondelelcaro>gravity: isn't that an 80s punk band?
17:53<gravity>dondelelcaro: That's a damn good idea
17:53<jae>Ouch... /me thinks about a retitle on 443129
17:53<gravity>I should found a band named ABI Breakage
17:53|-|james_ changed nick to james3
17:53<EmleyMoor>Are there any interesting services I can reach (other than TellMe) on US/CA/DE/NO/UK toll-free numbers at present?
17:54<EmleyMoor>(oh, and NL)
17:54<EmleyMoor>azeem: Hardly interesting
17:54<EmleyMoor>interbird: I think I have a good 112/999 routine
17:55<interbird>so, you had the service all along...
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17:55<jae>gravity: and it's pretty simply fact that I don't have to downgrade since I didn't upgrade (I don't blindly let aptitude (or whatever) do whatever they want, I don't even use them)
17:55<EmleyMoor>interbird: Yes - even wrote a routine to clear the line for such calls
17:55<bahamat>does anybody know if it's possible to increase the number of channels in an SSH session? specifically for tunneling
17:55<EmleyMoor>(similar to one on TBH but modernised)
17:56<gravity>jae: Well that's good.
17:58<EmleyMoor>gravity: If I had a band, it would probably be called "Old Hat and the Rotaries"
17:58<gravity>That's a good one
17:59<EmleyMoor>(and yes, I do have a rotary phone)
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17:59[~]jae thinks he has a (broken, not sure in what way) rotary phone lying around here somewhere
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18:00<EmleyMoor>Mine dates from 1971, and apart from its brand new (amp and neon) handset and a new fingerplate, it seems to be fine
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18:02<EmleyMoor>I know a shop in Brighton that sometimes has rotary phones (even some French ones) for sale
18:02[~]cafuego pokes streuner with a glass shard
18:03<EmleyMoor>I have some annoying mains hum on my Zap phones at present - if I could find a low-hum PSU I would
18:03<themill>cafuego: cross-channel larting... that's getting nasty
18:03[~]streuner looks at cafuego and shakes his head
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18:04<hazard2>Aap phones?
18:05<cafuego>themill: my skillz are many and varied
18:05<themill>cafuego: heh
18:05<EmleyMoor>hazard: Old PSTN-type phones
18:05<hazard2>PSTN?...Come on, what's a REAL answer cost? Do I need to buy a vowel?
18:06<cafuego>Cheap entertainment!
18:06<EmleyMoor>The mains hum sounds like a 1970s dial tone only much quieter
18:06<hazard2>right, 60/50hz, or some multiple of it
18:06[~]lupine_85 uses POTS, mostly
18:07<lupine_85>except the ADSL ;)
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18:08<cafuego>themill: In general i mean, not specifically his case. if it's *NOT* idle, 43 isn't that odd.
18:09<themill>cafuego: yeah.... I just had to get the pr0n comment in somehow ;)
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18:12[~]interbird uses two tin cans connected with a tiny wet rope
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18:14[~]Supaplex ties a knot inbetween for AT&T's tap
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18:15<eins7ein>what's hapnin yall
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18:17<Supaplex>no news. :p
18:17<interbird>that, knot, yeah. blame it on the patriot act
18:17<dpkg>Slashdot Headlines (8 of 15): The Russian Mafia Doesn't Like Spam Either ;; Low-tech Inventions That Help Change Lives ;; New Telescope Array Goes Live For SETI ;; Red Hat Vows To Stand Up To Patent Intimidation ;; Qwest Punished by NSA for Non-Cooperation ;; ICANN Mulling Multilingual URLs ;; Paramount Casts New James T. Kirk ;; Mom Blasts Ballmer Over Kid's Vista Experience.
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18:20<el_isma>I have a networking question... My cellphone carrier provides me with internet (which I can use from my laptop) but it requires me to go through their proxy for webpages. I can however access my home-box with ssh. Is there any way to tell my laptop to send all the traffic through my homebox (thus avoiding the proxy)? Is "tunneling" what I need?
18:21<azeem>el_isma: ssh can setup a transparent socks proxy
18:21<azeem>or tunnelling, I guess
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18:22<el_isma>azeem: Like, set up a proxy in homebox and then in the laptop make all port 80 go through the homebox's proxy?
18:23[~]grummund figured gnome terminal needs to be configured to open as a 'login shell', otherwise ~/.bash_profile isn't sourced, and then ~/bin doesn't get added to $PATH
18:23<grummund>is there any downside to setting gnome terminal profile to use a 'login shell'?
18:23<azeem>el_isma: you just do ssh -D 1234 homebox, then tell your browser to use port 1234 as socks proxy
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18:23<azeem>1234 is the port number, which is up to you
18:23<chealer>jae: then you're not running unstable.
18:23<el_isma>ssh homebox -L 80: (assuming 8118 is my homebox proxy)?
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18:24<azeem>if your browser doesn't allow to configure a socks proxy, you can try to run it with tsocks, or do the tunelling stuff
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18:25<interbird>grummund: ~/bin should be added by the main login, make sure there's an export before the path
18:25<el_isma>thanks azeem, I'll try that tomorrow
18:27<grummund>interbird: there is export PATH in /etc/profile
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18:28<interbird>grummund: does ~/bin exist? it might be conditionally appended and if it does not exist it won't be
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18:28<grummund>yes and yes.
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18:28<grummund>if i set terminal to be login shell ~/bin is added to the path
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18:29<grummund>using terminal default settings i have to manually ". ~/.bash_profile"
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18:31<padski>evening all. when I try to add a button to a spreadsheet in ooo-calc, on coming out of design mode, it crashes.
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18:32<stew>padski: you might try #debian-oo
18:32<padski>stew: thanks, yes I'll give that a spin.
18:32<grummund>/etc/profile, /etc/bash.bashrc, and ~/.bash_profile are all as per default etch install
18:32<padski>is that here or freenode, dy'know ?
18:33<padski>some things are just easier to try aren't they. sorry!
18:33<grummund>padski: oftc i think, but also on freenode (i think)
18:33<interbird>grummund: what if you ctrl-alt-f2 and login and echo $PATH?
18:33<padski>grummund: very quiet on
18:33<interbird>grummund: ctrl-alt-f7 to get back to gnome
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18:35<grummund>interbird: console login adds ~/bin to PATH
18:35<grummund>as does ssh login from another box
18:36<grummund>gnome terminal is the only trouble, except i figured to fix that by setting the profile for 'login shell'
18:36<interbird>grummund: maybe create a ~/.profile to add it
18:37<grummund>would that be run for non-login shell?
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18:37<interbird>grummund: it should
18:37<grummund>interbird: ok i'll try
18:38<grummund>odd this is a default etch install
18:38<grummund>anyone else have a ~/bin dir?
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18:43<grummund>interbird: i think ~/.profile is only run for login shells
18:44<interbird>grummund: i'm currently on feisty and i know there are diffences with debian; i'm cheking with etch, monumento please...
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18:54<grummund>another way is to put it in .bashrc, after the test for interactive shell
18:54<interbird>grummund: if you add PATH=~/bin:"$PATH" to ~/.bashrc it will work
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18:55<grummund>yes i just did that
18:55<grummund>is that the default for feisty?
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18:56<interbird>grummund: no, i'm in etch for this test
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18:56<grummund>heh. ;)
18:56<interbird>grummund: it does not work like you say
18:56<interbird>adding it to .bashrc solves it
18:57<grummund>what do you mean it does not work like you say
18:57<interbird>adding it to .bash_profile on etch has a conditional add for ~/bin, it should be in ~/.bashrc i guess...
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18:58<interbird>what i mean is it does not work on etch if i login as root and then su to a user
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18:58<interbird>and that it works if i add PATH=~/bin:"$PATH" to the ~/.bashrc for that user
18:59<grummund>umm, i think it should work if you do su -
18:59<interbird>in etch
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18:59<interbird>of course, then tou have a login shell, we already know that works
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19:00<grummund>ah ok
19:01<interbird>and i modified ~/.bashrc and then su also worked
19:01<grummund>i understand
19:02<interbird>there is a conditional statement for adding ~/bin in ~/.bash_profile, you should copy that to ~/.bashrc
19:02<grummund>i did that
19:02<interbird>and it still does not work ?
19:02<grummund>it works now
19:03<interbird>ahh, ok.
19:03<grummund>i think we arrived at the solution at the same time
19:03<interbird>much better than no solution at all
19:04<grummund>you think this is more satisfactory than ticking the 'login shell' box in gnome terminal?
19:04[~]grummund wonders what might break in each case
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19:05<hargibi>Hello. I was wondering how i can limit my cdrom to UDMA1 on startup?
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19:06<interbird>a login shell is meant to be only used at first login. using it in a gnome terminal will cause it not to have the DISPLAY var set, so you cannot graphic stuff under another uid
19:06<grummund>i guess if someone running lenny could tell the contents of /etc/skel/.bash_profile and /etc/skel/.bashrc that could be telling of the correct solution.
19:07<bolivarian>hargibi, check out hdparm for tweaking drives
19:07<grummund>interbird: ah ok.
19:08<interbird>seems to be a profile-bug and if memory serves me right it was in sarge too, but not sure of that
19:11<grummund>interbird: DISPLAY var is set in gnome terminal as a login shell, and proof is i can run xclock
19:12<interbird>grummund: do you have more non-root users on your box?
19:13<grummund>interbird: yes
19:13<interbird>open a gnome terminal
19:13<interbird>su - otheruser
19:13<interbird>it will fail
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19:14<Supaplex>'su -' by design wipes out your ENV. good bye DISPLAY...
19:14<interbird>that's what i said earlier...
19:15<Supaplex>yup. we agree on that point.
19:15<grummund>interbird: yes i understand that too ;)
19:15<interbird>grummund: your DISPLAY var is present because you su - under the same uid
19:15<interbird>(i guess)
19:16<grummund>um, ok... call me thick
19:16<interbird>you can call me Al (Paul Simon) :-)
19:16<grummund>for the test you mention should i set gnome terminal as login shell, or not. (to prove your point)
19:17[~]Supaplex ponders !say grummund: Hi thick. ;)
19:17<interbird>not but modify ~/.bashrc (as you already did)
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19:17<grummund>yeah, i put bashrc and bash_profile back how they were
19:17|-|rtmex [~IceChat7@] has joined #debian
19:18<grummund>gnome terminal also set how it was, as non-login shell
19:18<rtmex>Does anyone know where can I find a review about pros of using Debian as a Desktop, Server or for a home user?
19:18<interbird>no, put the conditional path stuff from ~/.bash_profile to ~/.bashrc and not use login-shell in gnome-terminal
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19:19<grummund>that only affects PATH
19:19<hargibi>hmm. sorry i disconected.. How can i set to my cdrom is UDMA1 at grub?
19:19<hargibi>or is that even possible?
19:19<grummund>interbird: i would like to understand what you said about DISPLAY
19:19<interbird>grummund: just append the line PATH=~/bin:"$PATH" to ~/.bashrc
19:21<interbird>running a login-shell wipes your environment and thus the DISPLAY var, like Supaplex said. You asked earlier what the difference was between both solutions. The diff is that...
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19:22<interbird>using a login-shell in gnome-terminal you cannot start graphical apps under a different uit because the DISPLAY var gets wiped so X has no display
19:22|-|ErJeDi [] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 3.2.4 Anomalies]
19:22<grummund>except that if i set gnome terminal to run as login shell it doesn't affect DISPLAY (as i see it)
19:23<grummund>i can still run gedit without problem
19:24<interbird>i have not checked that, but the ~/.bashrc modification is better. you are not logging in but shelling...
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19:24<grummund>right-o. ;)
19:24<grummund>nuff said.
19:24[~]interbird puts fingers in warm water :-)
19:25<bolivarian>rtmex, are you run a debian machine if not pop over to and download your self a net installer disk " debian-40r1-i386-netinst.iso".
19:25<hargibi>Sorry for repeating myself but how can i set in grub or so, that my cdrom will run UDMA1? i get ALOT of errors at the startup cause its trying to set it to UDMA2..
19:25<lifelike>is there any way to choose a custom kernel (*.deb for instance) during the etch installation process? instead of the default 2.6.18-*
19:26<interbird>hargibi: use kernel parameters, or hdparm
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19:26<hargibi>interbird: whats the kernel parameter then to set it to udma1?
19:26<bolivarian>rtmex, and sort out a spare machine with net work in it and that to find out whats what with debian
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19:28<interbird>hargibi: i'll look it up...
19:28<hargibi>interbird: thanks :)
19:28<rtmex>bolivarian, I did not cathc your message before " rtmex, and sort ..."
19:29<rtmex>I see, I have another machine with Etch installed
19:30|-|dmb_ [~dmb@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
19:30<rtmex>but I'm trying to decide wich distro is better for what purpose
19:30<bolivarian>rtmex, download your self a debian cd and use that to do a install on a spare machine with a net work card on that machine. the best way to find out what debian is. is to have a play around with it
19:31<bolivarian>rtmex, the way software is install is one of debian strong points.
19:31<rtmex>Many people tells me Ubuntu is better for home user, but I'm trying to make a "decision table" writing down stregnths and weekness from Debian vs Ubuntu
19:31|-|jae [] has joined #debian
19:32<rtmex>Depending if using for Server, Desktop, or home user
19:33|-|matth_ [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:33<lupine_85>meh, debian >> ubuntu in all cases :p
19:33<bolivarian>rtmex, i use debian stable for all my use. home and server and no complains here
19:34<interbird>hargibi: you can use the ide=nodma kernel-parameter but this disables dma for all ide-devices.
19:34<bolivarian>rtmex, remember that ubuntu is built from debian. so debian give the building blocks
19:35<interbird>hargibi: better is to use hdparm where you can set the dma-mode for each ide-device seperatly.
19:35<rtmex>I know, but it seems that Ubuntu support newr hardware than Debian
19:35<hargibi>interbird: do i set that in grub?
19:35<lupine_85>rtmex: they support exactly the same hardware
19:36<lupine_85>you might just need a bit more work for some of it in debian :p
19:36<interbird>hargibi: yes, you can try it first by pressing e at the grub line and inserting this parameter, then press esc and b to boot with the modified line. this will be for this boot only.
19:37<rtmex>That's what mean, we are trying to decide if install Debian for Server and Ubuntu for the final users at the office :)
19:37<lupine_85>will the users be setting hardware up? oO
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19:37<hargibi>interbird: how can i make it permanent later?
19:37<hargibi>if it works.
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19:37<interbird>hargibi: to always use it you have to modify /boot/grub/menu.lst
19:38<rtmex>Maybe USB, digital cameras, etc.
19:38<lupine_85>you'll find no difference between debian and ubuntu in that area, really
19:39<hargibi>interbird: trying it now.. brb :)
19:39<rtmex>Been imparcial (I know this is a Debian channel :) ) what would you say is Debian weekness?
19:39|-|error3 [~error3@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
19:39<lupine_85>you don't get your hand held as much
19:39<lupine_85>but that's just a disguised strength
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19:40<dkr>too much rope? :)
19:40<lupine_85>exactly :p
19:41<bolivarian>rtmex, download "debian-40r1-i386-xfce-CD-1.iso " image and install it on a spare office machine. this install would give a desktop called xfce4 with light weight. and for office work meet the demand. install open office and bingo
19:41|-|OZ changed nick to Guest1517
19:41<rtmex>I already have Debian Etch r0 installed on a machine :)
19:41<rtmex>with KDE
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19:42<bolivarian>rtmex, aptitude update and aptitude install xfce4 and have a click around
19:42<rtmex>What about for a notebook toshiba Celeron 600Mhz, 64MB RAM 5Gb HD ?
19:43<lupine_85>xfce, or straight X if you can get away with it
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19:44<rtmex>I tryed to install Suse 7 once before and Redhat 8 I think to that notebook and it did not run :(
19:44<rtmex>I guess need more RAM
19:44<interbird>xfce4 is nice stuff
19:45<ameyer>yeah, that'd help
19:45<lupine_85>well, with enough swap you can do anything
19:45<ameyer>etch booting into X with fluxbox is about 30 MB of RAM I think
19:45<lupine_85>just... slowly
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19:45<bolivarian>rtmex, my be pushing it for xfce4 but icewm would do the job i bet, aptitude install icewm
19:46<rtmex>hehe, I see. I've been looking reviews, articles, etc. about etch but there's not too much, maybe is very new
19:46<ameyer>well, nobody* runs debian on the desktop
19:46<lupine_85>I do
19:46<interbird>i do
19:46<ameyer>*compared to several other distros
19:46<rtmex>Yes, why not?
19:46<lupine_85>ameyer: references, or you just made it up on the spot
19:47|-|agney [] has joined #debian
19:47<ameyer>well, in my experience, Debian tends to be less polished than a certain other distro
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19:48<rtmex>That's what I think it could be a myth, no ofense ameyer. But Debian now has a Graphic installer option for example
19:48<ameyer>that distro rhymes with poobuntu
19:48<lupine_85>and, of course, your experience reflects real-world usage over a wide class of users
19:48<ameyer>yeah, of course</sarcasm>
19:48<chealer>rtmex: for instance, it doesn't have an official live CD
19:48<bolivarian>rtmex, for help with getting to grips with a debian server setup bookmark
19:49<ameyer>then again, Ubuntu tends to do things... in a rather buggy way sometimes
19:49<interbird>The debian gui-installer is a 1-2-1 copy of the text-based one; it actually works slower
19:49<lupine_85>debian is stable, which is good. ubuntu is stuff tacked onto that... some good, some bad.
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19:49<rtmex>thanks bolivarian
19:49<lupine_85>interbird: I'd hardly say 1-2-1. It's missing LVM, for starters, right?
19:50<bolivarian>no problem
19:50<interbird>lupine_85: not in expert ?
19:50[~]ameyer searches for thelast linux desktop survey thing
19:50<lupine_85>it's been a while since I used it
19:50<lupine_85>the good, of course, makes it's way upstream to debian anyway
19:51<rtmex>forvige my ignorance, what's LVM? :(
19:51<dpkg>it has been said that lvm is at, Logical Volume Manager for Linux, or ask me about <lvm_tutorial>, or extremely sexy. almost as sexy as Theo
19:51<lupine_85>that's very, very sexy in case you were wondering)
19:52<interbird>To manage multiple harddisks as one; in short
19:52<rtmex>I see
19:52<lupine_85>well, you can do more than that with it, but that's the basics I guess :)
19:52<interbird>like beauty, sexy is in the eye of the beholder:-)
19:52<bolivarian>rtmex, subscribe your self to the debian user maining list, and check out the support first hand
19:53<rtmex>Well, I appreciate your help and comments (all)
19:53<lupine_85>bolivarian: you mean debian user maiming list, right?
19:53<bolivarian>sorry yes
19:53<rtmex>maiming = mailing, right? :)
19:53<lupine_85>no, maiming :)
19:53<rtmex>what's maiming?
19:53<lupine_85>very painful. lions do it to their prey quite a lot
19:54<bolivarian>its should be mailing list
19:54<rtmex>sorry, inglish is not my first languaje
19:54<lupine_85>stop spoiling the fun :p
19:54<lupine_85>rtmex: yes, mailing list :)
19:55<rtmex>Ok, thank you all. Got to go, I think I'll be visiting this channel more often
19:55<rtmex>c you
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19:55<interbird>it's good for learning english:-)
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19:57<ameyer>well, according to the 2007 Linux Dessktop Survey, Ubuntu had 30% market share, "other Debian" had 14% market share
19:57<lupine_85>and that tells us... what... about the relative suitabilities of each for the desktop?
19:57<interbird>ubuntu is not so bad; i'm more afraid of suse...
19:58<ameyer>I'm just saying that more people use several other distros on the desktop
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19:58<lupine_85>more fool them :)
19:59<ameyer>actually, Debian itself is in 3rd behind opensuse and *buntu
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20:00<lupine_85>according to that survey, sure
20:00<ameyer>I question counting all of *buntu as one distro and seperating SLED and OpenSuSE
20:00<lupine_85>I question counting SLED and OpenSuSE as distros :p
20:01<cafuego>Well, you can't change it now, as that would invalidate the survey altogether.
20:01<ameyer>unless there's more of a difference between SLED and OpenSoldOurSoulToAConvictedMonopolist
20:01<lupine_85>ameyer: you pay more money for SLED
20:01<interbird>debian does not have to be populair, maybe better not. i just hope it'll *never ever* tell me what to do...
20:01<ameyer>but, other than that, is there much of a difference?
20:02<lupine_85>eh, SLED includes pro support?
20:02<ameyer>or is it like old-school redhat where it was the same distro, but you had to pay for support?
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20:03<bolivarian>its doing its job well for Venezuela goverment complete migration over to debian
20:03<lupine_85>also, social contract ftw
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20:06<kop>bolivarian: If the Venezuelan government is migrating to Debian, why did they vote to pass OOXML?
20:06<interbird>good question
20:08<interbird>maybe ms gave them office2k7 for debian under the table :-)
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20:08<lupine_85>left hand, right hand, etc
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20:09<bolivarian>so the speaker from Venezuela at the debconf7 was incorrect when he said the distro of chause was debian
20:09<interbird>like ms is digging out ballmer ape from his recent speach you mean ?
20:10<dayami>hello all
20:10<ameyer>bolivarian: depends on how you define "Debian"
20:11<ameyer>Debian and its deriviatives are like 45% of the desktop linux market
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20:12<stew>i dont' know how one would begin to try to determine those numbers
20:13<ameyer>of course, I honestly don't know how good the numbers are
20:13<ameyer>voluntary response tends to lead to biased samples
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20:17<Geniustablet>I bought a Genius MousePen 8x6 after reading that it will work, and I am having issues. Is there a better channel to ask about it? I use lenny, but I thought I'd ask just in case there's a channel for ude or tablets.
20:17<bolivarian>ameyer, 132_Selecting_developing_and_deploying_Debian-based_IT_solutions_in_the_Venezuelan_migration_process.ogg
20:18|-|agney [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:18<Geniustablet>If someone here thinks I can be helped, I'll pastebin all of the necessary logs and config files
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20:18<interbird>you don't want to see Debian become #1 unless consumers get braincells added. otherwise Debian will get crippled
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20:19<lupine_85>haha, good point interbird
20:19<nowhere_man>interbird: not sure about that
20:20<lupine_85>oh, I dunno
20:20<lupine_85>your average consumer is just that - a consumer
20:20<nowhere_man>you could probably have all sorts of assisting software for people not wanting to learn, and still have a sane architecture behind
20:20<lupine_85>adding candy to help them out means making choices for them, which means restricting choices for people who don't want such crap
20:21<nowhere_man>any other distro "for users" will also restrict choices
20:21<lupine_85>so isn't it good that debian doesn't restrict your choice
20:21<nowhere_man>and the power user would still have all the choices
20:21<lupine_85>well, it does, but not in the same way
20:21<interbird>not only "assisting software" but also "disabeling" software; hastalavista baby!
20:21<nowhere_man>I don't see why you need to restrict choices for everybody
20:22<lupine_85>nowhere_man: you have finite resources
20:22<nowhere_man>see the installer
20:22<lupine_85>increase support for one area, and you must decrease it for other areas
20:22<nowhere_man>there is a simple mode and an expert mode
20:22<lupine_85>mm, and the simple mode is crap
20:22<lupine_85>(no offence)
20:22<nowhere_man>I heard good things about it
20:22<nowhere_man>people can install a debian in a few simple steps
20:23<lupine_85>and if they want to do anything non-basic, they have to "drop down" to the "expert" one
20:23<Geniustablet>if I've created a udev rule to map a tablet to /dev/tablet-event do I still have to use mknod?
20:23<nowhere_man>most other systems won't let any choice than the basic ones
20:23<nowhere_man>so that's still an improvement
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20:24<lupine_85>all the effort that went into developing the slow & buggy GUI installer could have been used to improve the expert installer ;)
20:24<interbird>bottom line remains: do you command your computer or do you let it to be the other way around ?
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20:24<dpkg>[freenode] a service of the Peer-Directed Projects Center, an IRS 501(c)(3) corporation. They have an irc network,, and you can visit their web page at You may be connected to Freenode. see also <oftc> and <fact sharing>
20:24<nowhere_man>lupine_85: how slow, and how buggy?
20:25<lupine_85>last time I used it, very, and very
20:25<nowhere_man>now that it exists, I always use the GUI
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20:25<lupine_85>maybe they've expended yet more resources and made it vaguely useful
20:25<nowhere_man>and it's a fine piece of software, they didn't rewrite anything from the installer
20:25<nowhere_man>it's just another interface to the same underlying system
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20:26<nowhere_man>lupine_85: I install quite regularily Debian systems, and I definitely find it useful and comfortable
20:26<lupine_85>fair enough, enjoy your choice
20:26<nowhere_man>I didn't find it especially slow, and having the mouse is an improvement
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20:27<interbird>i disagree, keyboard and tab works much faster
20:27<nowhere_man>not for lists
20:28<interbird>and page-down
20:28<nowhere_man>(I read mail in mutt, so I appreciate it when keyboard is more efficient)
20:28<lupine_85>ncurses is faster than gtk. this is well-known.
20:28<klys>it's not whether the mouse is faster, it's how fluent you are with the keyboard. mouse speed is not objective or quantifiable.
20:28<lupine_85>what's next, gtkping? ;)
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20:29<nowhere_man>it's a user-interface, not a server
20:29|-|mankod [mankod@] has joined #debian
20:29<nowhere_man>the only good metric is wether is responsive
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20:29<nowhere_man>and on any recent computer it is
20:29<nowhere_man>I didn't use the GUI installer on an old system, maybe there it's slow
20:30|-|xt [~xt@] has joined #debian
20:30<xt>请问在gcc中-Wmissing-prototypes -Werror这个参数是什么意思呀!怎么使用呀!
20:30<nowhere_man>xt: it's an english-speaking channel
20:30<lupine_85>hehe, fascinating, but my chinese is rather rusty :p
20:30<dpkg>it has been said that cn is China, or for help in chinese please /j #debian-zh, or for help in chinese please /j #debian-zh Please use UTF-8, for IRC help see | Qt/KDE è¿æ¸¡æå¼å§ï¼è¯¦æ请é读
20:31<nowhere_man>use LANG=C your-command-here
20:31<nowhere_man>LANG=C gcc foobar.c
20:31<nowhere_man>for example
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20:34<xt>Does the gcc - Wmissing - prototypes - Werror what is the meaning of the parameters! How to use!
20:35<lupine_85>xt: you're missing a prototype, which puts out a warning. Because -Werror is specified, the warning becomes an error. So the compile fails.
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20:37<xt>thank you
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20:42[~]interbird is watching some reruns of shogun to brush-up his japaneese for the next eastern guest
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21:15<otoole>where are u talking?
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21:20<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. when I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, or if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask (ask the whole channel!). We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer, ask later or ask
21:20<duekiller>can anyone help me with a sound problem ?
21:21<duekiller>lspci I get the right device, but everything else I try to do says that there is no sound device
21:21<duekiller>anyone ?
21:21<kop>duekiller: Sounds like a permissions problem. Are you in the audio group? (and check the device to see about what permissions/group it has.)
21:22<duekiller>i fixed that a while ago
21:22<kop>duekiller: Then I've no clue. You might tell people your exact error message, dmesg output logs etc.
21:22<kop>!tell duekiller -about paste
21:23[~]duekiller will try to get some error messages
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21:24<duekiller>snd: version magic '2.6.18-5-686 SMP mod_unload 686 REGPARM gcc-4.2' should be '2.6.18-5-686 SMP mod_unload 686 REGPARM gcc-4.1'
21:24<duekiller>snd_hwdep: version magic '2.6.18-5-686 SMP mod_unload 686 REGPARM gcc-4.2' should be '2.6.18-5-686 SMP mod_unload 686 REGPARM gcc-4.1'
21:24<duekiller>snd_page_alloc: version magic '2.6.18-5-686 SMP mod_unload 686 REGPARM gcc-4.2' should be '2.6.18-5-686 SMP mod_unload 686 REGPARM gcc-4.1'
21:24<duekiller>snd_timer: version magic '2.6.18-5-686 SMP mod_unload 686 REGPARM gcc-4.2' should be '2.6.18-5-686 SMP mod_unload 686 REGPARM gcc-4.1'
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21:37<duekiller>how do you chekc out which sound card is installed ?
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21:50<duekiller>how do you change the group of a file
21:50<silent>chown user:group
21:50<silent>man chown
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21:53<duekiller>chown root:audio dsp does not work
21:53<duekiller>the group is still root for dsp
21:54<duekiller>any ideas ?
21:54<Aleric>you are not root?
21:54<Aleric>audio doesn't exist?
21:54<duekiller>audio exists
21:54<duekiller>dsp0 is audio
21:54<Aleric>dsp is a symlink ?
21:55<Aleric>symlinks don't have groups imho
21:56<duekiller>then I get message xine was unable to initialize any audio drivers
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22:02<duekiller>So, any help on installing my audio device
22:02<duekiller>I been trying google for hours
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22:08<Aleric><duekiller> then I get message xine was unable to initialize any audio drivers
22:09<Aleric>You should give the EXACT error, a translation of your own is not useful.
22:09<duekiller>it is the error
22:10<duekiller>it just says it cannot find the audi device ?!
22:10<duekiller>even though alsaconf find it and installs it
22:10<Aleric>See? That is something totally different. And I still don't see an error, I just see your sentence.
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22:11<duekiller>i have no idea how to get the error
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22:11<duekiller>that is all I get with every application... even though the sound settings does not give me an error
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22:12<Aleric>You make no sense
22:12<duekiller>the situation makes no sense. Every application that uses sound gives me an error that it can't find a device. When I try to configure the sound settings in the control panel I get no errors
22:12<black_13>how can i get debian to work in networking invironment where the http traffic is controlled by a proxy
22:13<Aleric>You are giving free translation of whatever error you are getting (where you seem to think that "unable to initialize any audio drivers" and "cannot find the audi device" is the same thing), yet you claim that you have no idea how to get the error??
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22:14<duekiller>the error happens whenever I try to use a GUI sound application
22:14<Internat>HDA Intel: probe of 0000:80:01.0 failed with error -16
22:14<Internat>any ideas what error -16 is?
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22:14<Aleric>duekiller: See what Internat pasted? THAT is an exact error.
22:15<gsimmons>!tell black_13 -about http_proxy
22:15<Internat>be nice if someone knew what was causing my "Exact error" :P
22:16<duekiller>I have no idea how to get an exact error
22:16<black_13>gsimmons, thanks
22:16<black_13>so that is it is just export an environment variable?
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22:18<Aleric>Internat: No idea, but I found a forum with the same error:
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22:19<Aleric>Internat: Your best bet is looking in the kernel source, I guess.
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22:21<Internat>that sounds awfully painful
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22:22<gsimmons>black_13: That's it. You can define that environment variable within /etc/environment to apply it as a permanent, system-wide setting. It will be used by apt-get, wget, lynx et al.
22:23<black_13>gsimmons, thanks again freenode debian people told me to go F my self when i ask this same question
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22:27<Aleric>Internat: static int really_probe(void *void_data) in drivers/base/dd.c
22:27<Aleric> printk(KERN_WARNING
22:27<Aleric> "%s: probe of %s failed with error %d\n",
22:27<Aleric> drv->name, dev->bus_id, ret);
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22:28<Aleric>ret is returned by something->probe(dev), and seems to be a normal errno
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22:30<Aleric>Doesn't the kernel return negative errno's?
22:30<Aleric>In that case it would be errno 16, which is EBUSY Device or resource busy
22:31<Aleric> if (ret != -ENODEV && ret != -ENXIO) {
22:31|-|Atomo64 [~Atomo64@] has joined #debian
22:31<Aleric>Yup, negatice. So it's EBUSY.
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22:36<silent>dudes my head is going to explode
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22:36<silent>I need to aptitude clean gahhh
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22:39<Internat>hmm i wonder why its busy
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22:55<silent>so this morning I woke up and realized I'm one of those guys I used to call linux geeks
22:56<silent>and I died inside and was reborn, with tux tattood on my chest
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22:59|-|mode/#debian [+l 294] by debhelper
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23:09<s[exe]>Is anybody willing to help me use uupdate? I'm not sure how I'm supposed to set up the debian sources that I can patch the official ones against
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23:20<retrogran>took me a while to sort that as well - mine was still asking for disks
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23:20<retrogran>brand new here - not sure what the protocol is
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23:21<ozatomic>is there a way i can have an SSH Tunnel always open int eh background
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23:27<gsimmons>ozatomic: Take a look at the 'autossh' package.
23:29<retrogran><< goofed up - first attempt to install mysql-server-4.1 via apt-get managed to lock myself out of it - so removed and re-installed to find the original configuration still in place. After a few tries, updated. I believe it is now installing mysql-server-5.0 which is failing due to a long list of dependencies.
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23:29<retrogran>Running Debian version 31r4-I386 - kernel with multiple jails
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23:30<klys>what is mysql-server-5.0 offering to remove?
23:31<retrogran>it wants to upgrade glibc
23:31<ozatomic>gsimmons: can i run autossh as a service?
23:31<retrogran>A copy of glibc was found in an unexpected directory.
23:31<retrogran>It is not safe to upgrade the C library in this situation;
23:31<klys>retrogran: what is a simple request to apt-get install libc6 attempting to do out of the ordinary?
23:32<retrogran> is in several of the jail directories
23:32<klys>are any of them obvious to the operation of the system?
23:33<retrogran>hmmm not sure I follow
23:33<retrogran>the jails are all running but shouldn't have anything to do with the base operating system
23:34<klys>perhaps you are using a hard links to make visible elsewhere, you might have to delete
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23:34<Supaplex> chooo
23:35<ozatomic>how can i make a program start at boot?
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23:35<retrogran>let me look at something
23:35<kop>!tell retrogran -about aptitude
23:36<klys>ozatomic: have a look at the boot process: kernel commandline (lilo.conf/menu.lst), /sbin/init, /etc/inittab, /etc/init.d/rcS, /etc/rcS.d, /etc/init.d/rc, /etc/rc2.d
23:37<kop>ozatomic: There's the easy way, rc.local, and the right way, which is to use the rcN.d directories. See the debian reference manual at
23:37<retrogran>they are linked back in a couple of places
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23:38<retrogran>I'll take a look at aptitude thank you
23:39<klys>retrogran: both apt-get and aptitude use dpkg, which is advising you of the problem you just stated.
23:40<retrogran>if I use aptitude will I have the option of going back to 4.1 which didn't give this error?
23:40<klys>as long as you only upgrade libc6 package, you can use dpkg to downgrade.
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23:41<klys>as for downgrading all of debian, this is difficult.
23:42<retrogran>ok this is the other error coming up
23:42<retrogran>libc6-dev: Depends: libc6 (= 2.3.6.ds1-13etch2) but 2.3.2.ds1-22sarge6 is to be installed
23:42<retrogran>locales: Depends: glibc-2.3.6.ds1-1
23:42<retrogran>mysql-admin: Depends: libatk1.0-0 (>= 1.12.2) but 1.8.0-4 is to be installed
23:42|-|retrogran kicked [#debian] debhelper [use the paster bot or #flood]
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23:42<retrogran>2 line limit?
23:42<klys>you would have to set your sources.list to etch, purge all packages exclusive to sid, and make an apt-get commandline made up of all your packages
23:44<klys>and this might not even work because your newer installed packages list themselves as available. check /var/lib/dpkg/available
23:45<retrogran>did I explain I'm pretty new at debian - apt-get purge remove sid?
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23:46<kop>retrogran: Debian does super-good at upgrading, if you follow the release notes, but downgrading is not really supported (except maybe having to do with specific packages.)
23:47<klys>I don't know. you're a late adopter, and you have sid. where is your segfault happening, you probably don't have a stability problem in your system.
23:48<retrogran>hmmm this might have something to do with it - from available
23:48<retrogran>Depends: libc6 (>= 2.3.2.ds1-4), libglib2.0-0 (>= 2.6.0),
23:49<retrogran>libc6-dev: Depends: libc6 (= 2.3.6.ds1-13etch2) but 2.3.2.ds1-22sarge6 is to be installed - install error
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23:50<retrogran>system is stable - just don't seem to get mysql back on it
23:50<klys>you have set your sources.list to sarge. is sarge stiull the system you want?
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23:51<retrogran>I believe so
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23:51<klys>then try to think you can be brutal with your system and handle the errors
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23:53<klys>wait... you have etch in your souces.list. you probably now believe you want etch. add libc6-dev to the tagline.
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23:53<retrogran>let me verify my sources list
23:54<retrogran>am I allowed to paste that here?
23:55<klys>see topic
23:56<retrogran>doesn't appear that etch is in there specifically
23:56<klys>etch == stable
23:56<retrogran>ahh well then it is - duh
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23:58<retrogran>ok so it wants libc6-dev apparently - how do you add a tag line and should I take out the line referring to sarge as it is only one of 4 - the other 3 being stable
23:59<klys>apt-get install libc6 libc6-dev locales
23:59<dpkg>If you're running a recent version of Debian (etch or greater), do the following: add contrib and non-free entries in your sources.list and aptitude update; aptitude install ipw3945-modules-2.6-686 firmware-ipw3945 ipw3945d; If you are not using the 686 kernel, replace the 686 with the kernel variant you are using (486)
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---Logclosed Fri Oct 12 00:00:05 2007