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#debian IRC Logs for 2008-08-07

---Logopened Thu Aug 07 00:00:04 2008
---Daychanged Thu Aug 07 2008
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00:22<cesurasean>guess who's back?
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00:24<cesurasean>I'm still having the same problem with pnp os turned on.
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00:25<cesurasean>I guess it's time to research. :/
00:26<cesurasean>got the ganja in me now
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00:36<hachi>anyone know which hypervisor goes with linux-image-2.6.25 or 26-686-xen?
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00:41<enouf>cesurasean: i mean really, you could do a minimal install even with no net using netinstall - but, to make it easier for you, d/l CD1, done, no net needed - then worry about it when the system is installed and running
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00:42<enouf>expert mode, load module at boot: prompt, pass it acpi=force, switch to alt-f2 and modprobe needed modules , sigh ...many many of things i've told you about .. and you've done none
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00:49<hachi>there are bug reports against linux-image-2.6.25-2-xen-686, which would seem to hint that people are actually using it, but I can't find which hypervisor it goes with
00:50<peterS>3.2, pretty sure
00:50<peterS>I haven't used it much
00:50<hachi>update-grub checks /var/lib/linux-image-$version/xen-versions to see which hypervisors are allowed
00:50<hachi>the file is empty in the package
00:50<hachi>but it's frozen in testing
00:51<peterS>well hmmm, hold on, let me look at the 2.6.25 xen machine at work
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00:54<peterS>hachi: dang it, I'm running xen 3.2-1 but I must have booted those machines back into 2.6.18. I could've sworn I was trying 2.6.25 on those domUs but now I don't see that
00:55<peterS>(note 2.6.25 doesn't support dom0)
00:55<peterS>oh - now I remember why that is. it's an amd64 machine, 2.6.25 doesn't support xen on amd64 at all.
00:55<hachi>that's probably the answer then... though I wish there was documentation to say this
00:55<hachi>oh, I'm on 686
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00:56<peterS>right, I saw you had a 686 kernel
00:56<hachi>did I say that? jeeze... can't even remember
00:56<peterS>anyway, 2.6.25 supports domU but not dom0. same for 2.6.26. dom0 support is still in progress, you have to use 2.6.18 for now
00:56<peterS>yes, you mentioned linux-image-2.6.25-2-xen-686
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00:57<peterS>I think I recall 2.6.26 supports domU for amd64, whereas 2.6.25 did not.
00:57<peterS>what a mess.
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00:58<hachi>the 2.6.26 image doesn't even have a xen-versions
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00:58<hachi>, but it's in sid, so I can't really hold it to a candle yet
01:01<amol>hi to all i am getting error in printing..
01:01<amol>error log is E [07/Aug/2008:10:30:06 +0530] [cups-driverd] Unable to open PPD directory "/opt/share/ppd": No such file or directory
01:01<amol>E [07/Aug/2008:10:30:44 +0530] CUPS-Add-Modify-Printer: Unauthorized
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01:03<peterS>amol: /opt/share? debian packages should never refer to /opt.
01:03<jakeriver>which is the best web browser on debian?
01:03<peterS>jakeriver: which is the best car?
01:04<hachi>what's your favorite food?
01:04<jakeriver>plz. only asking which is really working. iceweasel is collapsing all th time.
01:04<hachi>iceweasel's been fine for a good long while for me
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01:04<peterS>in my opinion, the best browser is the one I use the most, which is elinks
01:04<peterS>but most people probably wouldn't agree
01:05<peterS>there is a significant links2 fan base, for example
01:05<peterS>and lynx may make a comeback
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01:06<jakeriver>hmm. have to make some research.
01:06<peterS>if you want a browser with javascript, css and graphics, you probably don't want the browsers I think are the best
01:06<amol>peter5:but this in my log file..
01:07<peterS>not that links2 doesn't have graphics, mind, but it doesn't exactly have top-tier javascript or css
01:07<jakeriver>yeah, i think i just need browser that shows pages right and doesn't fall. but there is a great possibility i've screwd something on the installs etc. but perhaps some more tea, summer flu \o/ ->
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01:09<enouf>jakeriver: i use links2 -g
01:10<enouf>ok; why?
01:10<enouf>~$ ls -ld /var/lib/apt/lists/partial/
01:10<enouf>drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 12288 2008-08-03 05:58 /var/lib/apt/lists/partial/
01:10<enouf>there's absolutely nothing in there .. from a ls -al /var/lib/apt/lists/partial/ .. ugh
01:10<peterS>because you last ran 'apt-get update' on 2008-08-03 early in the morning?
01:11<enouf>hrm, even lsof +d /var | grep partial yields nothing - there's nothing in there though
01:11<peterS>enouf: what is your question?
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01:12<peterS>nothing seems abnormal to me
01:13<enouf>peterS: i cd /var/lib/apt/lists/partial/ and ls -al and this is what i see drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 12288 2008-08-03 05:58 .
01:13<peterS>enouf: yeah ... what's the problem?
01:13<enouf>and drwxr-xr-x 3 root root 4096 2008-08-03 05:56 .. <== parent , as you know
01:14<enouf>peterS: no other empty dirs ever show that - i mean i've never seen it
01:14<enouf>it should say 4096
01:15<peterS>oh you mean the 12 kB? that just means that at one time in its history, /var/lib/apt/partial had enough filenames in it to fill up more than 8 kB of space, so it was expanded to 12 kB
01:15<peterS>directories never shrink, on most filesystems
01:15<enouf>oh? .. wow, never heard of that .... wtf? ;-0
01:15<peterS>I mean you can add and remove files from them, but the space taken up by the directory itself never shrinks unless you
01:15<peterS>...delete and recreate it
01:16<peterS>my /var/lib/apt/lists/partial is 16384, btw.
01:16<enouf>ahh .. all friggin news to me :-P .. i never ever heard of this? why not? .. gah! :-p
01:16<peterS>if it bothers you that much you can just rmdir and mkdir
01:17<enouf>sure .. but now it doesn't since you've provided a somewhat reasonable explanation
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01:17<enouf>Now, i have to go research all this stuff ...
01:17<enouf>wait a minute ...
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01:18<enouf>i'll be back .. since if what you say is true, i have MANY empty dirs that were once filled with files, sometimes huge ones
01:18<amol>peterS:but this in my log file./opt/share/ppd
01:20<amol>peterS:i am not waht is printing error reason for this?
01:21<enouf>peterS: is there a general number limit on ext2/3 of filenames (inodes?) that will fit into 4096 bytes? (1 block)
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01:23<enouf>haing fun? O_o
01:23<enouf>amol: are you using Debian? if so which release?
01:23<amol>peterS:i am using lenny
01:24<enouf>i'm enouf
01:24<enouf>amol: so, what are you doing in /opt ?
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01:24<enouf>amol: that's owned by root .. unless you change it
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01:25<amol>enouf:i haven't changed anything in my system..
01:25<peterS>I have a feeling he doesn't know what he's doing in /opt either
01:25<enouf>amol: and ever since i've been using debian, i've never seen an error mentioned /opt
01:25<enouf>so debian, afaik, doesn't even know it exists ;-)
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01:25<amol>enouf:CUPS-Add-Modify-Printer: Unauthorized what it means??
01:25<enouf>amol: unauthorized
01:26<amol>enouf:i have logged in as root..even thoug?
01:26<enouf>amol: i can only guess , something either WIne or OO.o related , or Java is in your /opt and somehow that's messing it's pants
01:26<amol>enouf what i have to do to become authorized?/
01:27<enouf>amol: i have no idea, sorry - but ask yourself, did you install software there? did you let a 3rd party install software there?
01:27<amol>no i am not having any software there..
01:28<enouf>amol: i guess maybe the print server is runnign something other than Debian?
01:28<enouf>amol: is that a networked printer?
01:29<enouf>peterS: did you miss my last question to you? i noticed you had some nick sorting going on there..
01:29<peterS>enouf: yeah I timed out. don't know why, my network _seemed_ to be humming along time
01:29<enouf>oh, ok, no worries - here it is;
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01:30<enouf>peterS: is there a general number limit on ext2/3 of filenames (inodes?) that will fit into 4096 bytes? (1 block)
01:31<peterS>enouf: an inode does not contain a filename, those are in directory entries, and I think the name length is a 2-byte field (i.e., 65535 bytes). I don't know if there's a limit shorter than 65535
01:32*peterS reads /usr/include/linux/ext2_fs.h
01:32<enouf>peterS: oh, i can do that then - thanks
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01:33<enouf>peterS: but it does have to do with amount of files in the dir, not the sizes of those files, correct?
01:33<peterS>enouf: ha. yeah, look for 'struct ext2_dir_entry' in that file
01:33<enouf>gotcha, thanks peterS
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01:34<peterS>enouf: directory entries are variable length, to accommodate long and short filenames. this is unlike MS-DOS FAT, which had a fixed 32 bytes per directory entry, including 11 bytes for the name (:
01:35<amol>enouf:yes it is network printer
01:35<koops>hi guys... One question, is it possible to delete the icon next to "Applications" "Places" "System" bar? so i only have like the names?
01:35<peterS>enouf: ooooh - check out ext2_dir_entry_2 - that implies that the real limit is 255 bytes
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01:36<enouf>peterS: ahh... see how messed up using ms makes one get? Still to this day it's doing me harm :-P
01:36<peterS>enouf: hehe. well, win95 vfat has variable-length directory entries. in the sense that if the long filename doesn't fit into the available bytes of the first 32-byte entry, it takes more 32-byte entries as needed
01:37*enouf hunkers down, and also starts reading amongst other texts
01:37<peterS>enouf: I should have noticed this at first: #define EXT2_NAME_LEN 255
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01:37<enouf>peterS: no no, not your fault - good work sherlock - and thanks again indeed ;-)
01:38<peterS>appears each ext2/ext3 directory entry is 8 bytes plus the filename, then padded up to the nearest multiple of 4 bytes
01:39<peterS>but that doesn't count the directory index which is stored alongside, in newer versions of the filesystem
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01:42<enouf>i see - peterS "Physical Structure" section -- that would imply that each dir entry contains an inode + filename + length of file name in bytes? + some other number?
01:42<peterS>enouf: not an inode, but an inode _number_. the actual inode is elsewhere, in tables full of them. an inode is something like 128 bytes
01:42<enouf>right rgith - my bad
01:44<peterS>4 bytes for inode number, 2 bytes for 'total length of the directory entry', 1 byte for name length, 1 byte for file type (this is basically a cache, the canonical place to see the file type is inside the inode), the name itself, and padding to the nearest 4 bytes
01:44<peterS>the 2 bytes for total length is not really needed since it can be deduced from the rest, but it provides a fast way to skip to the next directory entry without having to do any math
01:45<peterS>and this is useful because operating systems often have to scan a directory block linearly looking for a filename, so it pays for this to be fast
01:46<peterS>also, by having 8 bytes in front of the filename instead of just 6, the filename starts on a 4-byte boundary. this speeds up those filename string comparisons.
01:47<enouf>Indeed - makes sense now - way to go mr ts'o ;-)
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01:47<peterS>way to go mr enouf. a lot of people spell his last name t'so. I think I did for awhile before I noticed.
01:48<peterS>(anyway, ext2 was originally designed by Remy Card, not by tytso)
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01:48<enouf>hah, you may have infected me now - time will tell ;-)
01:48<enouf>right right .. duh
01:48<peterS>but we like tytso anyway, he is a debian developer
01:49<jm_>there's an exception for symlinks isn't it? if the name fits in inode it's stored there to speed things up
01:50<peterS>and in theory, other files could do that too - if a file is short enough, it could be put inside the spare space of an inode. in practice I don't know if ext2 does that.
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01:54<peterS>...looks like not: ln -s x foo_short_link; touch foo_empty_file; ln -s xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx foo_long_link; echo 'x' > foo_short_file; ls -s foo_*
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01:55<peterS>note symlinks up to 59 chars in ext3 take up no space outside the inode, but any file greater than 0 chars takes up at least one block
01:56<cesurasean>where do I download lenny? can anyone help me?
01:56<peterS>I don't know why this is. the 59 chars of free space in the inode are still there for regular files to use
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01:56<peterS>cesurasean: if you already have debian etch installed, just upgrade using the normal debian dist-upgrade mechanism
01:56<peterS>cesurasean: if not,
01:56<cesurasean>I can't get debian etch install.
01:57<cesurasean>does it have any new upgrades for the x86 ?
01:57<peterS>what do you mean by 'new upgrades for the x86'?
01:57<cesurasean>because I can't get my x86 to see my network cards, yet it works fine on Windooz.
01:57<cesurasean>any new patches.
01:57<cesurasean>fixing problems.
01:57<peterS>lenny ships with linux kernel 2.6.25. etch ships with linux kernel 2.6.18 or, with the latest version, 2.6.24
01:58<peterS>a lot of new hardware is supported in 2.6.25 but not 2.6.18, so it is possible that your network card is included
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01:58<cesurasean>I'm talking about old hardware. Did they patch anything for older x86?
01:58<cesurasean>or, do you think I have a bios issue??
01:58<peterS>I have no idea. I cannot read your mind or your monitor.
01:59<cesurasean>because, I have tried 3 network cards, 1 onboard, 2 pci.
01:59<enouf>peterS: hes been here a while - coming and going .. various people helping .. he has 2x NICs , both PCI. one onboard - one needs the 8139too or 8139cp module - the other needs the tulip module
01:59<peterS>it is odd that PCI network cards would not work, though. linux support for old network cards is generally excellent.
01:59<enouf>and an circa 2000 mobo with VIA chipset
01:59<cesurasean>I have tried failsafe, and also optimal bios settings, turned on pnp to yes
01:59<cesurasean>thank you enouf :P
01:59<cesurasean>you must be a dev?
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02:00<cesurasean>this is easier than for me to file bugs...
02:00<peterS>nothing wrong with 2000 mobos with via chipsets (:
02:00<cesurasean>so, I need to know if I found a bug, or not.
02:00<enouf>cesurasean: tell us about your Mepis Cd boot - all NICs are seen, yes?
02:00<cesurasean>mepis finds all nics
02:00<cesurasean>and then some more info with lspci
02:00<enouf>peterS: i know, i'm on a p2 circa 1999 ;-0 no issues ;-) natsemi module
02:00<cesurasean>but, when I pull up the command prompt when network card isn't found, then lspci does not find ANYTHING
02:00<cesurasean>just returns to a blank line again
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02:01<peterS>I must say, I've used a lot of realtek 8139 cards and a lot of tulip compatibles and never had _any_ trouble with linux kernel drivers on any of them
02:01<enouf>cesurasean: are you sure the CDs you burn are not corrupt?
02:01<cesurasean>so, do I just need to load the modules by hand? or is this an issue fixed in lenny?
02:01<cesurasean>or will it need to wait for past lenny to be added? do I require a bug report on this?
02:01<peterS>it kinda sounds like an issue with ACPI or something
02:01<cesurasean>or am I just being stupid, and I have something set wrong?
02:01<enouf>peterS: same with qq whom mentioned the same thing earlioer :-/
02:02<cesurasean>im downloading lenny
02:02<enouf>Damn - will you people stop typing so fast!!! .. gajh ...:-P
02:02<cesurasean>should I do a full install of lenny?
02:02<cesurasean>or the net install?
02:02<enouf>cesurasean: you still have not tried all those options i mentioned?
02:02<peterS>I always use the net install
02:03<cesurasean>no, I have not tried those options you have mentioned.
02:03<peterS>of course that relies on the installer being able to find my network card (:
02:03<enouf>and now , you also need to check the cd integrity, the md5sum, etc
02:03<cesurasean>I think it should be more plug, and play.
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02:03<cesurasean>the cd is fine...
02:03<peterS>I bet the etch kernel has an issue with your bios that other kernels like windows and whatever mepis uses do not have
02:03<cesurasean>yes, I love the net install as well.
02:03<cesurasean>it does
02:04<cesurasean>but, why?
02:04<enouf>cesurasean: plug what? play what? you have nothing installed?
02:04<peterS>acpi is one theory. io-apic is another
02:04<peterS>you might try installing etch with a boot parameter 'acpi=off'. as in 'linux acpi=off' at the Boot: prompt
02:04<cesurasean>ok, now we are getting something.
02:04<peterS>also the 'noapic' parameter
02:04<enouf>i told him - [00:42:59] <enouf> expert mode, load module at boot: prompt, pass it acpi=force, switch to alt-f2 and modprobe needed modules , sigh ...many many of things i've told you about .. and you've done none
02:05<cesurasean>sorry, I've not seen that chat.
02:05<cesurasean>let me try it now
02:05<peterS>there's also kernel options like 'pci=direct' or 'pci=bios', you might try each of those
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02:06<enouf>pci=routeirq .. there's plenty
02:06<enouf>but he still hasn't pressed F1 - F10 yet
02:07<bower>alguien habla español????
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02:08<peterS>non aqui, forse vada a #debian-es
02:09<bower>thx =)
02:09<peterS>ha, I knew he'd figure out my half-spanish-half-italian
02:09<enouf>peterS: i (and others) even referred him to where exactly in the installation guide to look [21:28:02] <cesurasean> I want to utilize both ethernet cards....
02:09<enouf>[21:28:10] <enouf>
02:10<cesurasean>so, you are saying to try linux acpi=off? where do I use the noapic parameter?
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02:11<enouf>all get passed at the boot prompt
02:11<cesurasean>so type linux acpi=off noapic
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02:11<cesurasean>it found it :)
02:11<enouf>well, yes, it means off, but you'd write that as noapic == off?
02:11<cesurasean>nice job
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02:12<cesurasean>found it right away
02:12<cesurasean>done deal
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02:12<cesurasean>so, what causes the acpi problems?
02:12<cesurasean>can you explain this to me, for future knowledge?
02:12<cesurasean>less headaches for these folks' in here.
02:12<peterS>cesurasean: there are a lot of BIOS bugs with ACPI, since ACPI is a very complex system. there are also some Linux kernel bugs with ACPI for the same reason
02:12<cesurasean><pimp slaps enouf>
02:12<enouf>proprietary BUGGY bioses
02:12<cesurasean>I see
02:13<cesurasean>whatever that means
02:13<cesurasean>how can it be fixed? it's just very complex?
02:13<cesurasean>what is the disadvantage of using acpi?
02:13<peterS>cesurasean: especially old motherboards, from when ACPI was brand new and everybody had to implement it so they could boot Windows 2000 ... those could be fairly buggy, since the only requirement was being able to run Windows 2000
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02:13<enouf>cesurasean: try acpi=force too - helps my p2 not sure whats better for your via
02:13<enouf>the Kernels have a CONFIG option
02:13<cesurasean>what is the disadvantage of losing acpi?
02:14<cesurasean>so, I wouldn't lose resources?
02:14<enouf>for a cutoff date - debian's generally are set at no acpi support before 2000
02:14<cesurasean>thanks for the knowledge
02:14<peterS>no, ACPI is optional, especially for old motherboards. for newer motherboards, you get extra functionality with ACPI that you can't easily get without it
02:14<cesurasean>10$ piece of shit mobos. haha
02:15<cesurasean>that's good
02:15<enouf>i override that with acpi=force at boot time
02:15<cesurasean>and it allows acpi to work?
02:15<enouf>for my earlier systems when using Debian kernels - yes
02:16<cesurasean>ok, so which one is my onboard nic? the eth0, or the eth1?
02:16<enouf>not that this Mobo ACPI implemetation is any good, but all devices work fine ;-)
02:16<cesurasean>I want to use the pci slot board
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02:16<cesurasean>I see
02:16<cesurasean>I think I understand now..
02:16<peterS>cesurasean: depends on the PCI probe order - and that can vary by motherboard too. best to figure out what type of NIC each one is
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02:17<cesurasean>I think the realtek is the onboard
02:17<enouf>cesurasean: udevinfo -a -p /sys/class/net/eth0
02:17<cesurasean>and ADMtek is linksys?
02:17<enouf>cesurasean: udevinfo -a -p /sys/class/net/eth1 <--2nd
02:17<enouf>dmesg also might tell you
02:17<cesurasean>I know the realtek is the onboard, because of booting up
02:17<enouf>you are hyper .. and type like a robot
02:17<cesurasean>just seeing you guys knew....
02:17<hachi>anyone know of a glitch where grub will list non-xen kernels paired with xen hypervisors for booting?
02:17<cesurasean>yep, I am a robot.
02:18<cesurasean>thanks to this channel
02:18<enouf>All those other tools i told you about will tell you too - hwinfo, lshw, dmidecode, lshal
02:18<cesurasean>thanks for the help fellas
02:18<cesurasean>much credit is due to you two
02:18<cesurasean>or three
02:19<peterS>I'm a big fan of dmidecode. I like seeing motherboard components with serial numbers like 000000000000
02:19<cesurasean>I understand now enouf. Thank you.
02:19<enouf>peterS: seen the !myram factoid ? ;-)
02:20<enouf>peterS: how about today's one, !youtube script ;-)
02:20<cesurasean>oh, youtube is working now...
02:20<cesurasean>thanks a lot.
02:20<enouf>peterS: haha .. ya know - i read something about that concerning CPU serial Codes ,.. nm though
02:20<peterS>enouf: hmmm. I always just use youtube-dl
02:21<enouf>ok,. well, i like it firing it up in mplayer - not sure how youtube-dl works, nor how many steps are involved ..
02:21<cesurasean>youtube-dl costs $$$ ;)
02:21<cesurasean>does your hard drive grow?
02:21<peterS>youtube-dl is really difficult to use: youtube-dl ''
02:22<cesurasean>I'll find a box to break lenny with one of these days.
02:22<enouf>peterS: i didn't know, i d/l it and looked at it (saw it was written in python) - does it fire up mplayer?
02:22<enouf>peterS: i thought it was meant for use in browsers, or something
02:22<peterS>no, it just scrapes and wgets
02:23<peterS>more or less
02:23<enouf>peterS: ""
02:23<peterS>sounds like a thin wrapper around youtube-dl --get-url and mplayer
02:24<enouf>no, it's a simple bash script
02:24<enouf>no python
02:24<enouf>#!/bin/bash if [ -z "$1" ]; then echo "No URL!"; exit; fi url=$1 echo \"`wget -q -O - $url | grep fullscreenUrl | awk -F'video_id=' '{ print $2 }' | sed -e 's/ /_/g' | tr -d \'\; `\" | xargs mplayer -
02:24<peterS>I'm sure that's important, because you might want to install mplayer on a system that is so cramped that it doesn't have room for python
02:25<enouf>and "n3kl" from freenode's debian helped me put it all together
02:25<peterS>awk -f'video_id=' is a nice touch though
02:26<enouf>yeah, that's him, but i pointed him to what was base, and what's needed after that defines each ID .. cause i used to do it manually, myself
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02:27<enouf> <-- as base - then all the gobbledy gook ;-)
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02:28<enouf>because the fullscreenURL= line in the HTML source has it -
02:28<enouf>i used to have to do grok the info, then pass mplayer this;
02:28-!-enouf was kicked from #debian by debhelper [use the paster bot or #flood]
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02:29<enouf>man i suck sometimes .. haha .. sorry
02:29<peterS>you've been around for _how_ long? (:
02:30<enouf>heh. no.. it's usually all on one line .. that tiume, i grabbed it from a file .. nm ;-)
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02:35<enouf>peterS: i meant, like this ;-) --> mplayer ""
02:35<amol>hi to all ..i am getting arror for printing in debian lenny,ppdev0: registered pardevice
02:35<amol>ppdev0: unregistered pardevice
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02:36<amol>enouf: i think problem in my network printer may be due to this ppdev0: unregistered pardevice??
02:36<enouf>hello amol .. wait. were you just here asking about a networked printer, a CUPS error concerning /opt dir?
02:37<amol>enouf:now that error has resolved even about authorization error also not coming
02:37<amol>enouf stiil i am not able to print..
02:38<enouf>i see - i was going to tell you my apologies, because i got wrapped up in my own conversation - and that i really had no more idea, ... and no, with this newer error i'm not sure either - hrm...
02:38<enouf>s/and no/and now
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02:42<cesurasean>Ok, guys. Now, I am getting input/output error when formating the hard drive.
02:42<cesurasean>is this because of acpi?
02:42<cesurasean>I know the hard drive works fine.
02:42<cesurasean><crossed fingers that he found a bug>
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02:44<enouf>cesurasean: what boot options did you pass to the installer?
02:44<cesurasean>linux acpi=off
02:46<jm_>it's either your disk or more likely reading from the cd
02:46<enouf>cesurasean: i personally would try "installgui acpi=force", did you ever run the "check cd integrity" option at boot?
02:46<cesurasean>let me try another cd. the hard drive is fine....
02:46<cesurasean>my cd is fine....
02:47<enouf>another cd?
02:47<cesurasean>this is a new mobo, everything else is the same.
02:47<cesurasean>yes, I tried the newer version
02:47<enouf>you have an old etch and a etch 4.0r4
02:47<cesurasean>and this laptop's dvd writer is screwed.
02:47<cesurasean>so it could be a write problem.
02:47<enouf>why did i always think this was a desktop?
02:47<enouf>i know
02:48<enouf>cause you were saying how you could "open the case"
02:48<enouf>and look inside to read the Mobo make/model
02:48<cesurasean>the server is a desktop
02:48<enouf>and fiddle with Jumpers and such
02:48<cesurasean>but the dvd writer wrote the cd on a messed up dell dvd writer
02:49<enouf>CMOS and other ones even
02:49<cesurasean>ok, let me go try installgui acpi=force
02:49<cesurasean>ill let you know the results.
02:50-!-sylvain_technic [] has joined #debian
02:51<cesurasean>but, I do love Debian. :D
02:51<cesurasean>she's my favorite to play with.
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02:52<cesurasean>I work for a start up, and me and my coworkers prefer Debian any day over any other flavor.
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02:56<cesurasean>Debian is from the USA too? Nice. I guess that's why people around the world tend to like users of it. ;)
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03:05<sasha>hi does anybody know how to recreate that route with shell command
03:05<sasha>default * U 0 0 0 ppp0
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03:09<weasel>route add default dev ppp0?
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03:11<sasha>weasel : i ll try it now
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03:12<sasha>but when i say route add default gw dev ppp0 it says dev unknow host
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03:14<jm_>he didn't have word "gw" in his command
03:15<reggae>hi peeps, i need help, has anyone encountered problems using rutilt in debian lenny? its not responding everytime i try to scan for AP in open areas..? i need help...thanks..
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03:23<tangwenmin>anyone else?
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03:31<reggae>hi peeps, i need help,has anyone encountered problems usingrutilt in debian lenny? its not respondingeverytime i try to scan for AP in open areas..? i need help...thanks. (incase i miss out)..
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03:39<Guest637>please help. I want to build a knoppix taking low ram (<128m)
03:40<Guest637>what have I to modify from a standard knoppix 5
03:41<sep>Guest391, you got the wrong channel and the wrong irc network, find freenode in your server list, and join the #knoppix channel
03:41<Guest637>ok thx
03:41<sep>if you have no list you can use /server and /join #knoppix
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03:42<cesurasean>linux acpi=force does not detect network card. linux acpi=off did however find a network card, but was unable to write to the hard drive.
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03:43<cesurasean>input/output error on the IDE hard drive
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03:46<Nazcafan>I am running lenny and after a dist-upgrade with synaptic, I see that synaptic is planning to remove package selinux-policy-refpolicy-targeted and replace it by selinux-refpolicy-default, is that normal behaviour, or do I have to cancel that action ?
03:46<Nazcafan>I realised that when trying to close synaptic after successfully upgrading
03:47-!-qq is now known as Guest638
03:48<reggae>or anyone can giv me a better solution instead of just untick and tick the wireless connection in network every login? it is just so inconvenient, im using ibook + dlink dwa110 + doesnt have light appear when i unplug and plug back the wifi dongle, instead i have to activate it everytime in network...
03:48<reggae>is it suppose to work that way?
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03:57<cesurasean>why are you using an ibook in the first place? heh
03:57<cesurasean>you need to upgrade man
03:57<cesurasean>maybe that'll work
03:57<cesurasean>pay 2kUSD + for one of those fancy pants macbook pros
03:59<cesurasean>or, a macbook air. sorry. it's been awhile since I've been around those things..
04:00<reggae>dude....i love this ibook man, its been business wif me 4 yrs, btw i believe an upgrade is not nessasary for me, it wouldnt help me solve this debian thingy....
04:00<cesurasean>this is very true
04:00<cesurasean>you must be a wise man
04:01<cesurasean>It's nice not to break your laptop cord sometimes though....
04:01<cesurasean>the mag thingy is a nice technology. magnets. <laughs>
04:01<cesurasean>and, the new solar panel cell phone is going to be neat, as well.
04:02-!-mode/#debian [+l 339] by debhelper
04:02<cesurasean>that's what I did too. hmmm
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04:03<reggae>aight i gotta go off for wile
04:03<reggae>n get some coffee
04:03<cesurasean>aight then pimpin
04:03<cesurasean>I know it ain't easy now
04:03<reggae>fresh up my mind n solve this ****
04:03<reggae>yeah it aint
04:03<reggae>see ya
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04:04<reggae>later man
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04:16<Baggy2>Hi guys! If I compile and build a new version of some library, and run ldconfig to make it default, will this mess up my system if some tools require the older version? If I remove the library and run ldconfig again, will this set everything back the way it was?
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04:19<jm_>better stick it in some non-default place
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04:30<Guest643>some body help me
04:32-!-mode/#debian [+l 346] by debhelper
04:32<Baggy2>jm_: you mean by configuring it with the prefix option? I want to compile gcc 4.2.3 and I've read that it should be compiled with the newest version of the gmp (4.2.2). Any harm in running default config followed by make, make install and ldconfig?
04:32<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. when I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, or if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask (ask the whole channel!). We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer, ask later or ask
04:33<Guest643>i have trouble on buddy list
04:33<simonrvn>Baggy2: are you planning on doing toolchain development?
04:33<jm_>Baggy2: if the lib is not backward compatible you'll run into problems, best to just put new version in non-default dir and build gcc so it knows where to find it
04:34<Guest643>I can't send message with avatar
04:34<Guest643>some body help me
04:34<suiside>Guest643: you have to be more specific if you want help
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04:34<Guest643>I send message to my friend
04:34<Lethalman>Guest638, what kind of message
04:34<Guest643>and I want add avatar
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04:34<Guest643>to the message
04:35<suiside>Guest643: err, atleast menation what software we are talking about
04:35<Guest643>but on buddy list witch I use
04:35<Guest643>I can't add avatar on message
04:35<Baggy2>simonrvn: yes
04:35<Lethalman>Guest638, please tell us what software are you using, the name of the application
04:36<Lethalman>which one
04:36<Guest643>buddy list on Knoppix 5.0
04:36<Guest643>I don't use pidgin
04:36<Lethalman>Guest638, in the menu you can see "Help" then "About"
04:36<suiside>Guest643: Knoppix is a linux disttribution, not a IM client
04:36<Baggy2>jm_: is there a way to figure out if a lib is backward compatible? I mean without running a test..
04:37<Baggy2>jm_: get both versions and diff the header files?
04:37<suiside>!tell Guest643 about Knoppix
04:37<jm_>Baggy2: that's not easy to answer - with properly built ones you could check soname
04:38<Guest643>knoppix is a linux distribution
04:38<Guest643>and I use buddy list for chat
04:38<Guest643>and when I want send message with buddylist
04:38<Guest643>I can't use avatar
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04:39<Guest643>sory my english not good
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04:39<ircMonkey>what would be a command line tool for xpath?
04:39-!-ccube [] has joined #debian
04:41<ircMonkey>I think I found: perl::XPath
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04:41<jm_>!tell ircMonkey -about search
04:41<suiside>Guest643: 1. Buddy list is not a name of a IM client, your client properly has a window named like that but that doesn't tell us what software you use 2. this is Debian support, Knoppix support is elsewhere
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04:42<Baggy2>jm_: How do I tell configure to first select libs from a certain directory? is --library-path=/path/to/dir a standard way of doing this?
04:43<Baggy2>Does all configure scripts support that option?
04:43<Nemoder>try ./configure --help
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04:44<jm_>Baggy2: setting LDFLAGS should work IMHO
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04:50<Baggy2>Thanks to both of you =)
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04:52<Lethalman>i'm getting free crashes with pygtk
04:52<Lethalman>>>> import gtk
04:52<Lethalman>this didn't happen yesterday, i've done no upgrades that i remember
04:53<Lethalman>no i'm sorry i was in a jhbuild environment, sorry :S
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04:57<reggae>Hi guys, im back, ok so now, can anyone help me with wifi? cus its very inconvenient for me to activate it all the time tru network (i have to untick and tick the wireless connection), all the there any better ways, so i can just automatically use it every login?
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05:06<reggae>or anybody here uses "RUTILT" mind to share with me? or theres any programs similar to that?
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05:07<ghostlines>hi all
05:08<ghostlines>i'm trying to run ldap, and the slapd daemon doesn't wan to start
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05:08<ghostlines>i run /etc/init.d/slapd start , this doesn't give me any errors but it just doesn't stat the daemon
05:08<ghostlines>can someone help me with this?
05:09<reggae>and me too with my "rutilt" problem..?
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05:13<jm_>verify /etc/default/slapd
05:14<ghostlines>this file exist and i have it open now
05:14<ghostlines>looks good i think, but i just begun with ldap :P
05:15<ghostlines>i just had the process running but now it doesn't want to start and i didn't change much at all just a few dc lines
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05:17<karadas74>hallo kann jemand deutsch reden?
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05:24<Baggy2>Also, do I have to download the source for glibc explicitly, or is this included if I build gcc and binutils?
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05:26<ghostlines>can anyone help me start this slapd process?
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06:04<dpkg>i heard cannabis is the wonderful herb that the unfortunate americans can't worship.
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06:18<Nazcafan>reggae, what is your chipset?
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06:32<Baggy2>is there a way to figure out where "make install" will copy compiled files by default?
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06:33<jm_>Baggy2: yes
06:34<Baggy2>jm_: how?
06:34<Guest649>I wan to learn debian can you tel me about debian?
06:34<Baggy2>jm_: I should start reading at this point, shouldn't I? ;-)
06:35<jm_>Baggy2: make -n
06:35<jm_>make -n install that is
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06:35<Baggy2>jm_: Thanks you
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06:39<Guest649>My connetion only by gprs, can I Install debian by gprs connetion?
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06:42<jm_>Guest649: sure, why not?
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06:46<Guest649>Now I using live cd, can you tell me how I install the debian now
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06:46<jm_>by following installation manual
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06:47<sasha>hi i have added thw wine repo in source.list but when i m trying to force that wine version under synaptic , i ve no error message but the checkbocks leve unchecked
06:48<sasha>hi i have added the wine repo in source.list but when i m trying to force that wine version under synaptic , i ve no error message but the checkbox leave unchecked
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06:55<Guest649>Thank you I want to try all your advice
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07:18<deconvolution>hi, I am trying to find a document about apt-get about its options. However, after reading man pages, apt-docs and apt howto, I still cannot find some options such as --reinstall --Install-Recommends etc. Where are the docs for such options?
07:18<jm_>apt-get's man page mentiones -reinstall
07:18<jm_>install-recommends is an option set via apt.conf
07:22<deconvolution>jm_, thanks, I got the --reinstall, but man apt.conf does not mention install-recommends option. I wonder if there is a complete list for these options?
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07:24<gsimmons>deconvolution: See /usr/share/doc/apt/examples/configure-index.gz
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07:37<deconvolution>gsimmons, right, I thought examples just contains some simple confs list in website docs
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07:40<zxxd>does anyone know if there is a method i can use in the network interfaces file for GRE tunnels?
07:40<zxxd>instead of enterting the ip tunnel commands manually under up ip tunnel .... or down ... in the interfaces file
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07:41<ichbins>Hallo zusammen :-)
07:41<RIKI>halo jga
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07:48<enouf>seeing your query here makes a bit more sense. but only a bit more - i have no idea what GRE is, but you might want to look at /etc/rc.local and /etc/init.d/rc.local
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07:49<Lethalman>why on a normal lenny pgsql has port 5432 while on debian live has 5433?
07:49<Lethalman>i've asked on debian-live but there's nothing specific for package configuration
07:49<Lethalman>so why this configuration diff?
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07:50<panthera>Lethalman: just to make sure: you're comparing the very same psql version on both the live and regular system, right?
07:50<Lethalman>mm maybe the debian live one is unstable
07:50<Lethalman>i'll check in a second
07:51<enouf>Lethalman: egrep '5433|5432' /etc/services
07:51<Lethalman>panthera, the one in debian live is postgresql-8.3_8.3.3-1_i386
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07:52<Lethalman>while i have postgresql-8.3_8.3.3-1_amd64
07:52<Lethalman>i found nothing in the postinst script in /var/lib/dpkg/info
07:52<Lethalman>and there're no bugs in the BTS
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07:53<panthera>build an live amd64 version, and compare again? :)
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07:53<Lethalman>panthera, you crazy :P
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07:55<Lethalman>enouf, panthera, which file should i look at? have i do download the source?
07:56<enouf>Lethalman: i don't know .. sorry
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07:56<panthera>Lethalman: what are going to do? switching the live systems architecture?
07:56<enouf>Lethalman: the only diff is ARCH it seems
07:56<Lethalman>panthera, no i can workaround by modifying the conf file
07:57<Lethalman>but i'd like to fix it in the package if i can
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07:57<panthera>Lethalman: i'm not familiar with psql packaging, sorry.
07:57<Lethalman>it's a boring thing, there's no reason why the config should have port 5433 -.-
07:57<Lethalman>panthera, no ok i was just asking generally :)
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08:01<Lethalman>nothing, there're scripts for port 5432, but nothing for 5433
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08:30<Kasperl>Where should I ask about what hardware to use? (As in, if I should go out to buy an nVidia card or an ATi/AMD one to get 3D performance in Debian)
08:31<jm_>i'd vote for nvidia
08:32<Kasperl>Drivers? I heard that AMD/ATi might release some proper open source stuff in the near future. I should add that I need an AGP card, something equivalent to my broken 9800 Pro..
08:32<Kasperl>I know the nVidia closed drivers are better then the ATi ones, but if there's a proper free solution available in the next six months, I'd prefer that...
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08:33<witte>Kasperl: are you planning to use debian stable?
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08:33<Kasperl>I'm currently running Etch, but I wouldn't mind switching to Lenny early
08:33<Kasperl>Sid might be a bit too much, since I'm not all that familiar with Debian just yet
08:33<witte>Kasperl: because those drivers will be "fixed" as soon as lenny releases in a short while
08:33<jm_>i don't think you can get agp cards for current nvidia lineup, AMD is your only option there
08:33<Kasperl>The free ATi ones?
08:34<jm_>and they are working on free nvidia drivers too
08:34<Kasperl>I can get an FX5500 in a shop here, but I've heard some bad stuff about the FX series
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08:34<Kasperl>But I haven't been paying attention to hardware in the last 3 or 4 years.
08:34<Kasperl>Do the free nVidia drivers also do 3D?
08:34<witte>Kasperl: the drivers in testing will remain more or less up with the latest standards, but to be sure what is best and what can be expected, better ask #xorg on freenode
08:35<witte>Kasperl: intel should be great for open source, but don't know about 3d...
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08:35<jm_>i wouldn't touch 5xxx series
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08:36<Kasperl>jm_: why not?
08:37<_mihkel_>Hey, why I can't launch X programs (gvim, xcalc etc) from command line?
08:37<_mihkel_>mihkel@debian:~$ gvim
08:37<_mihkel_>No protocol specified
08:37<_mihkel_>E233: cannot open display
08:37<jm_>Kasperl: because it's crap
08:37<_mihkel_>debian testing and gnome
08:37<jm_>_mihkel_: export DISPLAY=localhost:0.0
08:38<_mihkel_>mihkel@debian:~$ export DISPLAY=localhost:0.0
08:38<_mihkel_>mihkel@debian:~$ gvim
08:38<_mihkel_>E233: cannot open display
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08:38<jm_>what does xclock say?
08:38<_mihkel_>mihkel@debian:~$ xclock
08:38<_mihkel_>Error: Can't open display: localhost:0.0
08:39<jm_>there was a bug where it didn't handle some new local mode correctly
08:39<jm_>but IIRC using TCP solved it
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08:40<weasel>why not simply use DISPLAY=:0.0?
08:40<jm_>i think that's the one that triggered it, let me see
08:40<Kasperl>witte: #xorg on freenode seems a bit dead, but I'll wait and see what they say.. If I wanted an older card (since it's AGP anyway) would there be any difference between Etch, Lenny or Sid?
08:40<_mihkel_>mihkel@debian:~$ export DISPLAY=:0.0
08:40<_mihkel_>mihkel@debian:~$ xclock
08:40<_mihkel_>No protocol specified
08:40<_mihkel_>Error: Can't open display: :0.0
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08:41<witte>_mihkel_: what did you do to get there, in default it should just work
08:41<dpkg>Do not paste more than 3 lines to this channel. Instead, use: or or for pics. Remember to tell us the URL of your paste!
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08:41<_mihkel_>sorry for that
08:41<jm_>_mihkel_: is it listening on tcp port at all?
08:41<_mihkel_>witte, I did not do anything
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08:42<_mihkel_>just one day I doscovered that I cant' open X apps from cmd
08:42<witte>Kasperl: well, if amd does release drivers in a short while, they will be available in the new testing, and probably not directly in lenny (which will be stable then)
08:42<_mihkel_>jm_, I don't understand what are you saying :)
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08:43<jm_>_mihkel_: run strace -e open xlock - which file does it try to open?
08:43<witte>_mihkel_: can you upload the output of "env" to a pastebin
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08:43<dpkg>Please don't paste anything into the channel; use a paste site instead, like:,,, for pics. --- Also ask me: <pastebin pipe>
08:43<jm_>_mihkel_: uhm "strace -e open xclock"
08:43<jm_>not xlock
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08:44<Zathraz>!ask pastebin pipe
08:44<jm_>_mihkel_: uhm "strace -e open,connect xclock"
08:45<Staale>I am missing /etc/environment - are there scripts that generate that file, or can I just leave it as an empty file?
08:45<jm_>_mihkel_: please re-run it with the last command
08:46<Kasperl>witte: So for the next 3 years at least I'd be better of running nVidia if I didn't want to track sid?
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08:46<witte>Kasperl: i did not say that. there will be a testing after lenny gets stable
08:46<witte>Kasperl: and debian updates are faster than 3 years (1.5 is more like it)
08:47<witte>Kasperl: furthermore, there can be backports as well, but it is hard to foresee how those will evolve
08:47<Kasperl>witte: Where would I be able to find info on ATi/AMD creating more open drivers?
08:48<jm_>_mihkel_: this isn't the same bug, but I wonder why it says that, it can certainly find its PF_UNIX socket just fine
08:48<witte>Kasperl: other than google, or the ati website, i don't know any other places (that is because i don't know much about it)
08:49<Kasperl>witte: Thank you for the information so far, I'll have another look around
08:49<witte>_mihkel_: your term session says screen, which is strange i think
08:49<_mihkel_>I use gnu screen
08:49<_mihkel_>and rxvt
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08:50<jm_>_mihkel_: are you pasting entire error message? are you running X apps as the user who started X?
08:50<witte>_mihkel_: try it without screen
08:50<_mihkel_>I can open gvim in gnome terminal
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08:50<jm_>yeah it looks like you didn't paste all of the error text
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08:50<_mihkel_>without screen it works
08:50<_mihkel_>I pasted it all
08:51<jm_>that doesn't make sense, screen doesn't have anything to do with it
08:51<_mihkel_>beats me
08:51<witte>_mihkel_: it should work with screen as well, do you do some screen configuration or do you have a default screen?
08:52<_mihkel_>in .screenrc I have only: startup_message off
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08:53<reggae>hi peeps, anyone here uses rutilt? or can help me get my wifi work automatically in every login so that i no need to activate it everytime via network manager? i need help pls...
08:54<reggae>im using lenny + ibook + dlnik dwa110 (rt73 chipset)
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08:57<dpkg>Your network configuration is in the file /etc/network/interfaces ; "man 5 interfaces" for docs, (zless /usr/share/doc/ifupdown/examples/network-interfaces.gz for an example). Start and stop your networking with ifup -a and ifdown -a respectively. See also <dhcp client>, read "man resolv.conf" for DNS. Also ask me about <static route>.
08:59<reggae>tx but how bout rutilt?
08:59<reggae>or is there a irc channel mainly talks bout rutilt?
09:00<witte>reggae: there is a forum on the rt2x00 drivers, you could ask there
09:00<witte>reggae: i never used rutilt...
09:01<witte>reggae: just installed, but it does not work on my pc as i don't have a wireless device :-
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09:03<reggae>]witte: its ok pal.....i find help elsewhere bout the rutilt...or perhaps wait for sum1 here who knew it, btw thanks for the info for starting up a wifi, so "ifup -a" would start my wlan0?
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09:05<witte>reggae: if you configure your file /etc/network/interfaces correctly, it should be started automatically at boot... or ifup -a should work (depends on the config)
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09:10<reggae>witte: what if i configure via wireless connection in network? will that work? i meant not from terminal but from the gnome network prog...?
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09:14<stricken>hi, im wanting to program in c/c++ do i need a different compiler for linux?
09:14<reggae>witte: btw, what if i wanna get access point when im in some cafes? do i need to reconfigure the interfaces? can't i just scan and connect like mac or windows...?
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09:15<reggae>i need some sort of stuff that is convenient (but i love debian)
09:15<jm_>stricken: different from what?
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09:15<stricken>im used to windows OS and im wanting to get started learning some c/c++ i was wondering if i needed to download a compiler for linux os
09:16<dpkg>the GNU Compiler Collection. see or #gcc. In order to change which version it should use "export CC=/usr/bin/gcc-$whatever", or /usr/bin symlinks not handled using Debian <alternatives>, see /usr/share/doc/gcc/README.Debian
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09:19<stricken>Does gcc work for c++ aswell?
09:19<stricken>im new to linux
09:19<jm_>there's g++
09:20<Hideo>check out distcc too, it's quite a time saver
09:21<stricken>GCC used to stand for the GNU C Compiler, but since the compiler supports several other languages aside from C, it now stands for the GNU Compiler Collection. Does that mean it will support c++ programming language, im also new to programming i havent done hardly any
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09:21<stricken>im wanting to install it like i would on windows lol
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09:23<jm_>yes it works for c++
09:24<stricken>what does g++ mean jm?
09:24<jm_>gnu c++ compiler or somesuch
09:24<stricken>im on the mirrors and i have a few there just wondering which one is best to download
09:24<stricken>ok thanks
09:25<jm_>the one close to you, but in general - it doesn't really matter which mirror you use
09:25<dpkg>methinks apt-get is "apt-get install synaptic" for gui "apt-get install aptitude" for curses or just use apt-get command line. apt-get is a program part of the apt package used as a simple command line tool to libapt. apt-get is the most used front-end for apt. see also <apt> <apt-cache> <synaptic> <aptitude>, or unsoftware
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09:25<stricken>i mean which compiler to download from the link
09:25<jm_>perhaps you should ask elsewhere if you're not using Debian
09:25<stricken>i am using debian
09:25<witte>reggae: there are such programs certainly, i just don't use those as i like command line..., but there must be some of those
09:25<jm_>then install it with apt
09:26<stricken>im new to debian im only about 12 hours old with debian its my first linux
09:26<stricken>okay thanks
09:26<jm_>!b-e stricken
09:26<dpkg>stricken: Sounds like you need to aptitude install build-essential.
09:26<stricken>ill read the manuel you sent
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09:29<Lethalman>i've installed kqemu with module-assistant on lenny
09:29<Lethalman>but qemu has no -kernel-kqemu option
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09:34<stricken>did it take anyone else long to learn/firgure out how to use apt?
09:35<lukehasnoname>stricken: I'm still not an expert on it heh
09:36<stricken>when i learn how to use it most things will slot into place for me, this is a big part i need to get what i want done/started
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09:37<stricken>id hire a tuitor if i had money lol
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09:38<xanonus>Lethalman: I think that qemu detect/use kqemu without any additional parameters
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09:38<Lethalman>xanonus, after modprobing the module?
09:38<Lethalman>the speed is right the same
09:38<xanonus>Lethalman: because I get the warning "Could not open '/dev/kqemu' - QEMU acceleration layer not activated" without kqemu loaded
09:39<marco_>stricken, aptitude is very well documented on the internet..
09:39<Lethalman>i don't get such errors
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09:39<stricken>yep im reading marco im just slower than most ^^
09:39<Lethalman>but i didn't get such errors when i haven't kqemu installed yet
09:39<xanonus>Lethalman: I use debian sid. That could be the reason I get the warning
09:40<Lethalman>i'm using testing
09:40<Lethalman>and it's the same version as mine
09:40<Lethalman>xanonus, x86?
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09:41<xanonus>Lethalman: I use debian sid on x86.
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09:42<Lethalman>xanonus, i'm on amd64 this would be a reason maybe, but i was able to compile kqemu
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09:43<stricken>will the apt-get work if im not as root?
09:43<Hideo>stricken: no, apt-get/aptitude needs you to run as root to install/remove apps
09:44<stricken>okay thanks.
09:44<Hideo>stricken: use aptitude instead, it maybe a little easier than apt-get
09:44<xanonus>Lethalman: That could be the reason. I have no experience with amd64
09:44<stricken>umm aptitude, ill read up on it thanks
09:45<Lethalman>xanonus, thanks, i've filed in a bug in the while
09:45<dpkg>rumour has it, aptitude is now the recommended tool for managing packages on your debian system. You can use it as a cli replacement for apt-get; it keeps track of automatically installed packages and will offer to remove them when no longer required. Aptitude, like apt-get in lenny/sid, also installs "Recommended" packages that are usually required but you have the option not to install them. Ask me about <why aptitude> <why not aptitude> <aptitude-fu>
09:46<stricken>!why aptitude
09:46<dpkg>aptitude has more advanced conflict/dependency resolution than other tools, it has far more advanced searching available, and will automatically uninstall unneeded dependencies, read /usr/share/doc/aptitude/README for more info. Aptitude can also remove or purge one package at the same time as installing others all from the command line, making it much easier to recover from broken dependencies.
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09:50<lukehasnoname>!why not aptitude
09:50<dpkg>Aptitude has many bugs, such as #299009, which other APT frontends do not have. Also, aptitude currently does not have equivalents for "apt-get source" and "apt-get build-dep".
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09:51<stricken>i think i would be better learning apt-get
09:51<dpkg>i guess apt-get is "apt-get install synaptic" for gui "apt-get install aptitude" for curses or just use apt-get command line. apt-get is a program part of the apt package used as a simple command line tool to libapt. apt-get is the most used front-end for apt. see also <apt> <apt-cache> <synaptic> <aptitude>, or unsoftware
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09:55<stricken>Im wondering if im typing the apt-get commands in the right place? is it terminal?
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09:58<Hideo>stricken: yes
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09:58<stricken>thanks, ill be a guru someday dont worry lol
09:59<Hideo>it's not that hard, you don't need to know everything about it, just know what you need to do your job
09:59<Hideo>man apt-get will tell you the rest when you need more
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10:01<stricken>what it is i think i need to do before i can apt-get anything is get my sources.list configured
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10:02<dpkg>The list of repositories for installing packages is /etc/apt/sources.list and has lines like "deb http://ftp.<cc> etch main" and "deb etch/updates main" where <cc> is your country code. Be sure to run "aptitude update" after editing sources.list. Also see <mirrors> <apt-spy> <apt-setup> <etch security> <testing security> "man sources.list" and /usr/share/doc/apt/examples/sources.list
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10:08<stricken>wow i think i done it
10:09<stricken>that was kinda easy and quick, its installing my gcc now
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10:10<stricken>g++ *
10:12-!-mode/#debian [+l 365] by debhelper
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10:12<stricken>It has finished now, but i cant find the g++ compiler?
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10:14<Hideo>type which g++
10:14-!-xanonus [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:14<erKURITA>or whereis
10:14<stricken>which g++ worked
10:14<stricken>ill go navigate there now lol
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10:15<stricken>what is the command to type to open a directory such as /usr/bin to save time
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10:16<Hideo>you don't have to be in the same directory, since /usr/bin is already in your PATH, just type g++ from anywhere
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10:17<stricken>i dont understand that hideo
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10:17<stricken>where is anywhere?
10:18<stricken>what i ment was like if you type g++ then in terminal it doesnt open it
10:18<lukehasnoname>command not found
10:18<marc__>you could add it to your path
10:19<stricken>what paths
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10:19<marc__>export $PATH=$PATH, /usr/bin
10:19<marc__>/usr/bin should already be in your path
10:19<stricken>im new remember lol, been on windows machines forever
10:19-!-dpm [] has joined #debian
10:19<marc__>try typing
10:19<marc__>remember case sensitive
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10:19<erKURITA>echo $PATH
10:20<marc__>what does the terminal give you?
10:20<erKURITA>not all shells are the same
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10:20<jsumali>o/ erKURITA
10:20<Web>!tell stricken about windows
10:20<marc__>but if he's using the default install of debian
10:20<marc__>I'd say that he's using bash
10:20<dpkg>PCs are like air conditioners, if you open Windows(R) they don't work.
10:20<erKURITA>o/ jsumali
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10:20<Hideo>stricken: should learn about *nix in general first before you mess with compilers
10:21<marc__>I don't know, I started out learning programming
10:21<marc__>I learned a lot getting it to work
10:21<marc__>it was a difficult learning curve
10:21<erKURITA>It took me 1 week to get Debian installed
10:21<erKURITA>it was back in Sarge
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10:21<stricken>took me 12 hours lol
10:22-!-mode/#debian [+l 371] by debhelper
10:22<erKURITA>I had no experience with Linux before
10:22<erKURITA>Most of the problems were due to GRUB
10:22<erKURITA>or the lack of a swap (lol)
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10:22<dpkg>i heard debian is See
10:22<marc__>My comp doesn't even touch the swap space
10:23<marc__>3 GB of memory
10:23<jsumali>that's always nice to have :)
10:23<erKURITA>Neither does mine, but sometimes it does
10:23<marc__>typically I'm only using 250-350 megs
10:23<erKURITA>I've got 2 GB
10:23<jsumali>i have uhh
10:23<marc__>Its a good laptop
10:23<jsumali>2GB + 1gb swap maybe
10:23<jsumali>or 2gb.. i can't remember
10:23<erKURITA>1,25 GB here
10:23<stricken>i have about 30gb free space on this linux box
10:23<jsumali>%50-%100 is usually the way to go
10:23<marc__>I made a 1gb swap space but it just doesn't use it
10:24<Hideo>I'm planning on erasing my swap partition forever
10:24<dpkg>from memory, top is a command to "display top CPU processes," but top can handle more ('man top' for more info). Try: `top' and to quit, just 'q';; The Other Peter
10:24<Hideo>htop > top
10:24<erKURITA>htop > top
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10:25<marc__>I don't have htop
10:25<erKURITA>apt-get install htop
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10:25<marc__>what does it offer?
10:26<marc__>oh nice
10:27<stricken>im in the bin folder but it wont let me open g++
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10:27<marc__>well you would have to type
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10:27<marc__>if its not in your path
10:28<stricken>windows so much easier, but thats out of the question
10:28<marc__>windows isn't easier
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10:28<marc__>you are just used to it
10:28<lukehasnoname>stricken: watch your mouth saying that here
10:28<stricken>ive had windows for 7 years
10:28<Web>!slam stricken
10:28*dpkg slams web against a large cement Tux
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10:28<lukehasnoname>Windows has its good points and its bad
10:29<lukehasnoname>but once you get around *nix for 7 years it will be easy
10:29<Web>Tell me 1 good point.
10:29<lukehasnoname>I like their filesystem hierarchy better than the FHS
10:29<erKURITA>you can get Linux to work with 64 MB ram
10:29<stricken>yeah i want linux more becuase it is better than windows, im saying its easier becuase its like its made like easy friendly interfaces
10:29<marc__>Look at old people who use computers for the first time, if they start out on gnome then they'd think its easier and more straight forward
10:29<marc__>DirectX10 looks great
10:29<marc__>Linux is as well
10:29<stricken>yeah i will find linux easy at some point it just takes getting used to
10:30<marc__>setting up a development environment in windows is a difficult process as well
10:30<stricken>i found it easier on windows to install and set up compilers and such
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10:30<lukehasnoname>marc__: eh?
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10:30<Hideo>stricken: try "man <g++ or whatever>"
10:30<lukehasnoname>Oh, web, besides what I said, Visual Studio is really good
10:31<stricken>overall i prefer linux over windows
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10:31<Web>I know, but still.....
10:31<Hideo>stricken: knowing how to use man pages is a requisite in linux
10:31<marc__>lukehasnoname: Getting the windows development environment installed the .net software from M$ is difficult to get working for the average user
10:31<stricken>no manuel entry for g++
10:31<Maulkin>Web: Do you require Debian support?
10:32<lukehasnoname>marc__: Developers aren't average users
10:32<marc__>lukehasnoname: he's trying to setup a compiler, of course its going to seem difficult
10:32<Web>Not at the moment, ...... it's all up and running.
10:32<stricken>the only thing i like about windows is its simplicity
10:32<jsumali>stricken: you probably need the gcc compilers package installed?
10:32<jsumali>i find it so hard to work on windows :\
10:33<stricken>i installed them i think
10:33<Web>But windows ain't a friend of my wallet.
10:33<marc__>stricken: run ' locate g++'
10:33-!-Gekz [] has joined #debian
10:33<stricken>i know where it is located im looking at it
10:33<stricken>in /usr/bin/
10:34<marc__>ls -l |grep g++
10:34<marc__>what are the permissions set to on the file?
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10:35<Hideo>marc__: he just apt-get installed it, its permission should be alright
10:35<marc__>Oh okay
10:35<Hideo>stricken: you probably expected a GUI?
10:35<stricken>bash: ls: command not found
10:35<jsumali>^ uh
10:35<Lethalman>who uses virtualbox?
10:35-!-vanessa [~vanessa@] has joined #debian
10:35<Hideo>no ls?
10:35<marc__>there is a problem there lol
10:35<jsumali>no kidding
10:35<jsumali>echo $PATH ?
10:35<Lethalman>therare VirtualBox and virtualbox binaries which symlinks to the same file
10:35-!-vltre [~vltre@] has joined #debian
10:35<Lethalman>but machines don't start with virtualbox
10:35-!-vanessa_ [~vanessa@] has joined #debian
10:36<marc__>sounds like your $PATH is all kinds of broken
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10:36<stricken>no i think im typing it wrong
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10:36<stricken>ls -l |grep g++ i typed it properly now in terminal
10:36<erKURITA>l as in lowercase L
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10:37<stricken>nothing it jsut goes to next line with my $
10:37<stricken>i meen u know usernamethen#
10:37<stricken>to type another command
10:37<jsumali>ls -l / | grep g++
10:37<jsumali>in case you might be in your home directory
10:38<Hideo>why would it be in /
10:38-!-Lethalman [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
10:38<stricken>it is in /usr/bin
10:38<jsumali>ls -lR
10:38<marc__>in your prompt type: pwd
10:38<marc__>what is the output?
10:38<Web>dir -l
10:38<stricken>ls -lR works
10:38<Hideo>bah this pointless
10:39<stricken>why marc_?
10:39<marc__>striken: what is the output from pwd
10:40<stricken>that is irrelivant?
10:40<marc__>just so I can understand the basics of whats going on
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10:40<lukehasnoname> pwd = present working directory stricken
10:40<stricken>pwd is where your password stored i thought
10:40<dpkg>from memory, pwd is print current/working directory, or /home/web/is.a.luser
10:41<stricken>it is /home/stricken
10:42-!-kuraz58 [] has joined #debian
10:42<marc__>type cd /usr/bin
10:42<marc__>then type
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10:43<ranix>What are you trying to do stricken
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10:43<marc__>run g++
10:43<marc__>as far as I can tell
10:43<marc__>I'm not sure what the end goal is
10:43<ranix>apt-get install build-essential
10:43<stricken>g++ : no input files
10:43<ranix>you have g++
10:43<aniki>how can i asign different cpu time and ressources priorities to different running processes ?
10:44<stricken>its ok marc
10:44<erKURITA>his $PATH is messed up, it seems
10:44<erKURITA>aniki nice
10:44<marc__>there you go
10:44<ranix>stricken: you need to learn about make
10:44<stricken>do you think?
10:44<stricken>why do you think its messed up lol
10:44<erKURITA>!tell aniki about nice
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10:44<ranix>careful with extremely low or high nice values
10:45<stricken>what my goal is to do........
10:45<marc__>the problem is just that g++ isn't in your path
10:45<ranix>marc__: no, that's wrong
10:45<erKURITA> /usr/bin you mean
10:45<ranix>marc__: gcc executed and said "no input files"
10:45<stricken>Get a compiler working for c/c++ in this case "g++" and then learn some programming in c/c++
10:45<ranix>g++ rather
10:46<Hideo>he shouldn't even be here if /usr/bin is not in his path
10:46<marc__>"g++: no input files"
10:46<ranix>stricken: you've done it correctly, everything is properly set up
10:46<marc__>he ran g++
10:46<ranix>stricken: learn about make and g++
10:46<stevecotton>Lethalman: I don't use virtualbox myself, but that sounds like something that you should log a bug about.
10:46<stricken>i want to open the compiler
10:46<aniki>is it just me or can i only use it to assign higher priorities to processes i _want_ to start as opposed to programms already running
10:46<Hideo>I already told him to learn about *nix in general first
10:46<ranix>stricken: try "linux c++ howto" in Google
10:46<ranix>stricken: also learn vim
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10:46<marc__>Hideo, that seems a little harsh. He's here for help
10:47<ranix>yeah that is harsh
10:47<ranix>we've all been there at one point
10:47<Lethalman>stevecotton, fixed someway i don't know how :o
10:47<Hideo>marc__: the problem is he doesn't know how to invoke a binary or the path without being in the same directory
10:47<marc__>striken, like ranix is saying I'd try to get you to learn some c/c++ experience first.
10:47<Lethalman>stevecotton, well the two symlinks are there, but now it works
10:47<marc__>Hideo, all people are new at some point
10:47<stricken>i just want to program on the linux OS i dont need much more atm
10:47<Lethalman>stevecotton, thanks i'll search for it in the BTS
10:47<stevecotton>Lethalman: programs that change behaviour depending on the name of the symlink exist, for example {vi vim gvim rvim rgvim ex}.
10:47<ranix>Hideo: no, he's executing it fine and it's saying he has no input files, which is probably correct
10:48<stricken>i know a little bit of programming in a few areas from windows
10:48<Hideo>ranix: you have to scroll up
10:48<stevecotton>Lethalman: fixed someway >> :)
10:48<Lethalman>well here i have virtualbox and VirtualBox pointing to the same file
10:48<Lethalman>is this normal?
10:48<ranix>Hideo: he solved his previous problem already and just didn't give you info about it because he's inexperienced. Learn to adapt
10:48<ranix>Hideo: else, how would he be pasting "no input files"
10:48<stevecotton>yes (in general), not sure if it's normal for virtualbox
10:49<marc__>stricken: g++ is a command line compiler. You need to give it a file to compile aka: g++ test -o test
10:49<Hideo>ranix: I'm not gonna explain myself, scroll up if you wanna talk more to me
10:49<ranix>Hideo: stop giving newbies bad information
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10:50<marc__>stricken: if you want to add directories to your path check out the export command
10:50<stricken>hmm this is why i think windows is made for simplicity, you install it you see it, you can use it
10:51<Hideo>again marc__ it's not a path problem
10:51<Hideo>I already said he wouldn't be able to fire up an IRC client if he can't access /usr/bin
10:51<ranix>stricken: windows is click and pray. Any idiot can click checkboxes without knowing what he's doing. The only difference is that in linux you need to know what you're doing before you can alter/use things
10:51<marc__>He could if he did it from a gui
10:52<Hideo>well if only he did echo $PATH earlier
10:52<Hideo>but no, he failed at following directions
10:52<Hideo>scroll up
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10:53<stricken>i accessed /usr/bin from my folder on the desktop then clicked to keep going up directory to then navigate to> /usr then /usr/bin
10:53<marc__>I saw that
10:53<ranix>you clicked?
10:53<Hideo>marc__: and did he tell you the PATH?
10:53<ranix>what do you mean you clicked
10:53<marc__>he's trying, no reason to turn him away or tell him to leave
10:53<ranix>stricken: what do you mean "I clicked"
10:53<Hideo>you keep assuming that it's not in his PATH when by default Debian's PATH works fine
10:53<stricken>i went to the desktop
10:54<ranix>stricken: you are in the wrong place
10:54<stricken>click stricken home
10:54<Hideo>marc__: point out where I told him to leave
10:54<marc__>I agree, but you can't assume that he didn't run a command that ruined his path
10:54<stricken>im saying how i got to the folder before
10:54<marc__>You said he shouldn't be here
10:54<Hideo>marc__: where?
10:54<ranix>stricken: open a terminal
10:54<stricken>its ok guys chill
10:54<Hideo>take it to #debian-offtopic if you want to acuse me
10:54<ranix>stricken: you need to be not clicking things
10:54<stricken>yeah im in terminal aswell
10:55<stricken>i started clicking becuase i found it easier to get there
10:55<ranix>stricken: ok, ignore the GUI. You're using the terminal. That's good
10:55<ranix>stricken: A good way to start is to learn how to type things in vim, vim is most people's editor of choice
10:55<stricken>windows is a curse it gets you used to the " clicking "
10:55<ranix>(as I start an editor war)
10:56<Hideo>ranix: don't tell a newbie to use vi/vim
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10:56<stricken>ive used vim before through putty on a shell
10:56<ranix>Hideo: he's trying to code C. If he can't use vim he can't code C
10:56<ranix>stricken: ok. A good way to start learning the environment of c/c++ in Linux is to grab a quick hello world tutorial off Google and replicate it
10:56<dondelelcaro>everyone should learn how to use some vim
10:57<Hideo>if he can fire up vim from terminal, his PATH is fine
10:57-!-cmot [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
10:57<Hideo>without going to /usr/bin that is
10:57<ranix>stricken: a "debian c hello world" search in google brings up some tutorials
10:57<stricken>how would you open the vim
10:57-!-chattr [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
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10:57<ranix>stricken: type vim
10:57<stricken>thanks lol
10:57<ranix>stricken: if you don't have vim installed yet, you can apt-get install vim
10:57<erKURITA><ranix> Hideo: he's trying to code C. If he can't use vim he can't code <= BS
10:57<erKURITA>I use pico :/
10:57<stricken>i have vim
10:57<erKURITA>and I code C
10:58<ranix>erKURITA: CAN you use C?
10:58<ranix>erKURITA: CAN you use vim?
10:58-!-rgnr [] has joined #debian
10:58<marc__>Hideo you are too focused on why he isn't qualified to be here, we already found out he was using the gui to try to run it
10:58<erKURITA>I can, not to its full extent, but I can
10:58-!-adema [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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10:58<Hideo>marc__: take it to #debian-offtopic
10:58<ranix>erKURITA: the prosecution rests!
10:58<erKURITA>I prefer pico for the sake of simplicity
10:58<rgnr>how to congihure deluge?
10:59<Hideo>stricken: did vim work for ya?
10:59-!-Web [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
10:59<stricken>yep vim works
10:59-!-samy [~samy@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
10:59<Hideo>marc__: so there, PATH was fine
10:59<Hideo>all along
10:59<marc__>Haha, I know
10:59<marc__>He already said he was trying to run it from the gui
10:59<Hideo>no he typed it in the terminal
10:59<Hideo>try to keep up
11:00<aniki>whats the name of this one program akin to sequioa view in windows, which shows the filesizes as rectangles thus enabling one to see where the real sizetakers sit
11:00<marc__>okay, I'll let you help him out then
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11:01<stricken>i think its worked anyway, i typed vim and i see it saying VIM - Vi Improved etc
11:01<stricken>how to actually use it, to type my c
11:01<ranix>I for insert mode
11:01<Hideo>like I said, my problem is you making assumptions and him not knowing *nix and failed to follow directions
11:01<ranix>escape to exit back to command mode
11:02<ranix>vim howtos are all over the place
11:02<stricken>thanks was a while when i used it via shell account, even then i didnt use it much
11:02<stricken>thanks ranix
11:02<ranix>lots of people think vim is the best thing since sliced bread so there's a lot of info on the tubes
11:02<erKURITA>there's vim-tutorial I think
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11:02<stricken>alright ill have a browse on google for some tutorials
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11:03<stricken>no point arguing guys its my fault im just slower at learning and catching on
11:03<stricken>thanks for the help
11:03<marc__>No problem
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11:04<lukehasnoname>not enough people on #debian-offtopic
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11:07<w1dget>is there any way to completely uninstall X ?
11:08<Lethalman>w1dget, maybe aptitude remove --purge xserver-xorg
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11:09<cahoot>remov xlibs?
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11:09<w1dget>Lethalman: thanks, seems to be working :)
11:10<Lethalman>w1dget, run orphaned --purge after that
11:10<w1dget>cahoot: I think I will need to keep the xlibs as I plan on forwarding x sessions to another host
11:10<w1dget>thanks Lethalman, will do
11:11<Lethalman>ops *orphaner :)
11:11<cahoot>w1dget: so you didn't relly want to completely remove X ?
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11:11<w1dget>no sorry, guess I worded that badly
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11:20<dpkg>Etch is the code name for the current stable Debian release, version 4.0, released on April 8th, 2007. Ask me about <install debian>. Please read the release notes at which also contain the upgrade procedure for upgrading from the previous version of Debian stable (<sarge>). Ask me about <stable>. currently <4.0r4>
11:20<webmind-org>!install debian
11:20<dpkg>There are a myriad different ways to install Debian. See for a list of images. Ask me about <install guide> and <d-i> for detailed instructions. (If you've never installed Debian before, you should read the install guide.)
11:21<webmind-org>!install guide
11:21<dpkg>i guess install guide is The Installation Guide for stable can be found at: and for woody: For ETCH See . Also ask me about IG </msg dpkg IG>
11:22-!-mode/#debian [+l 365] by debhelper
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11:23<witte>dpkg: no, install guide is The Installation Guide for stable can be found at: Also ask me about IG </msg dpkg IG>
11:23<dpkg>witte: okay
11:23<lukehasnoname>Is there any tension between Ubuntu and Debian? I wouldn't think there would be, but I've heard that Debian thinks Ubuntu is stealing the show, and not giving back its updates to upstream, etc.
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11:24<witte>lukehasnoname: maybe tension is the correct word. as far as i know there are no real disputes but ubuntu uses the work debian has done...
11:25<aniki>stone them! :D
11:25*aniki redoes in a more manly voice: stone them! stone them!
11:25<witte>lukehasnoname: they are of course free to use it (it is open source), but still
11:26<witte>!stone ubuntu
11:26*dpkg hurls a boulder completely crushing ubuntu
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11:30<lukehasnoname>How are all the packages collected into ubstable? Are they fetched automatically or maintained manually, all 18k+ of them?
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11:31<witte>lukehasnoname: maintainers upload their packages...
11:31<bumpylight>I wish to ask a question to which the answer is undoubtedly simple; yet, it puzzles me.
11:32<stricken>hi there
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11:32<bumpylight>I've downloaded, with BitTorrent, the first three DVD diskettes for the new release of Debian.
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11:32<lukehasnoname>witte: the upstream maintainers, or Debian people assigned to "maintain" upstream packages for Debian?
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11:33<bumpylight>There is an "update" diskette on DVD. Does this need also to be downloaded?
11:33<stevecotton>aniki: "filesizes as rectangles" > I can't remember what it is, but remember using it, and it's definitely in Debian.
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11:33<stricken> you dont have to have all 3 disks
11:33<bumpylight>It's okay, I kind of like to have all three diskettes. The cost to burn is minimal.
11:33<witte>lukehasnoname: the debian developpers.
11:34<koan>stevecotton and aniki : baobab?
11:34<witte>lukehasnoname: who are mostly not the upstream maintainers
11:34<bumpylight>But is the forth diskette needed also? Or would this forth diskette be needed only if one had the older versions on three diskettes, and wished only to update those base diskettes?
11:34<bumpylight>I mean "debian-update-4.0r4-i386-DVD-1.iso.torrent".
11:34<witte>bumpylight: do you already have debian installed?
11:35<stricken>i didnt download the update personally
11:35<bumpylight>I will be installing it on another box.
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11:35<bumpylight>The box is under construction. :)
11:35<witte>bumpylight: but if you just use a install cd you already have and do an update and an upgrade, you will be having 4.0r4
11:35<witte>bumpylight: unless that machine has no internet
11:36<witte>bumpylight: and if the machine needs a real new kernel
11:36<lukehasnoname>witte: holy crap Debian does do a lot of work
11:36<bumpylight>Well, I'm pretty certain I want to keep the other box on an air gap, for development.
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11:37<stevecotton>koan: thanks. aniki:
11:37<stevecotton>now in gnome-utils, apparently
11:37<bumpylight>So, witte, you're saying the fourth diskette, "debian-update-4.0r4-i386-DVD-1.iso.torrent", is only needed if one didn't, for example, download the first three diskettes?
11:38<lukehasnoname>I'm an Ubuntu guy and am looking to try out Debian. I love Ubuntu, but want to appreciate where they're coming from, and how the OSes compare, and how Ubuntu changes from straight up Debian.
11:38<bumpylight>Sorry about the earlier typos with forth instead of fourth. ^^
11:38<qq_>bumpylight: a netinstall will be enough
11:39<qq_>169 MB
11:39<bumpylight>Thank you, qq, but I'd like to keep on hand a full install, in case there are net problems later.
11:39<witte>bumpylight: no, not really, i am not certain what those bittorrents contain, I just didn't want you to download everything if you already have a full version
11:39<bumpylight>I don't mind the extra effort.
11:39<dpkg>Debian GNU/Linux 4.0r4 was released on July 26th, 2008. This release contains an updated installer, the network-console installation option is no longer vulnerable to the issue described in <DSA1571>. It also includes 2.6.24 kernel images and related new packages, to provide support for hardware requiring updated drivers. Also ask me about <etchnhalf>.
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11:40<bumpylight>Hmmm. I assume dpkg is an answerbot.
11:41<witte>yeah, he is
11:41<witte>i hoped dpkg had some more info on the release and which cd's to download
11:41<bumpylight>It's a bit confusing.
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11:42<bumpylight>I'm really glad I finally upgraded to DVD-R on my boxes. It makes my hair stand up to think of burning all those CD-Rs.
11:42<_mihkel_>~Coming back to <_mihkel_> Hey, why I can't launch X programs (gvim, xcalc etc) from command line?
11:42<witte>bumpylight: the 4.0r4 is for 95% the debian 4.0, with only a certain number of packages changed (though some important ones). I am not sure what exacty is included on each of the torrents...
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11:43<_mihkel_>I did env | sort > fail in screen and env | sort > fail2 in rxvt (without)
11:43<_mihkel_>I'd really like to know why I can't launch X programs from screen
11:43<witte>bumpylight: if you connect your pc to the web, you only need the first one
11:43<bumpylight>Yeah, I understand that, witte.
11:43<_mihkel_>s/(without)/(without screen)
11:43<bumpylight>I certainly do plan to update over the Web, but want a full install on diskettes just in case.
11:44<qq_>!tell _mihkel_ newnick
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11:44<_mihkel_>what wrong with my nick?
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11:44<lukehasnoname>witte: Do those DVDs provide the entire repo of official packages?
11:44<mihkel>is that better?
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11:46<witte>lukehasnoname: i think so
11:46<mihkel>any ides why I can start x apps in rxvt but not when i put rxvt inside screen?
11:47<stevecotton>bumpylight: this is the opposite end of the discussion, but one of the mirror-admins is asking why people download the extra CDs.
11:47<witte>mihkel: WINDOWPATH=7:7 as opposed to WINDOWPATH=7
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11:47<witte>mihkel: maybe
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11:48<stevecotton>bumpylight: no responses to him so far
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11:48<mihkel>atleast export WINDOWPATH=7 did not work
11:49<mihkel>or export WINDOWPATH=7:7
11:49<cahoot>correct user?
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11:51<bumpylight>Hmmm. I'm not sure how hard it is to respond, stevecotton, but I shall try. :)
11:51<Hideo>mihkel: try logging out of all the session in screen, close screen, and reopen a new screen and session
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11:52<mihkel>Hideo, I have this problem for last 3 or 4 days by now
11:52<Hideo>have you tried the above ^
11:52<mihkel>and when i close screen i'll lose irc connection too
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11:53<mihkel>ok I'll try that
11:53<mihkel>I'll be back :P
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11:53<Hideo>mihkel: if you're afraid of losing irc, how about another test
11:53<bumpylight>Stevecotton, can I respond to that post by using Thunderbird to send an email to ""?
11:53<mihkel>I'm listening
11:53<Hideo>you can open a new terminal, open a new screen and try launching an app in there
11:53<mihkel>Hideo, ok
11:54<Hideo>don't attach to the old screen
11:54<mihkel>I won't
11:55<mihkel>I works!?
11:55<mihkel>but why
11:55<mihkel>I mean
11:55<Hideo>mihkel: something to do with /tmp/ and randomly generated ids
11:55<Hideo>mihkel: look at line 61 and 65 of your paste
11:56<Hideo>you probably logged out, but you only detached screen
11:56<mihkel>yes, but this has been happening for the past 3-4 days
11:56<Hideo>it's weird
11:57<mihkel>I allways type exit as long as all windows in scrren are closed
11:57<mihkel>when i turn my computer off
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11:58<Hideo>you turned it off or did you hibernate it?
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11:58<mihkel>hibernate don't work :P
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11:59<Hideo>in the case, I have no idea why, but that's the way it is *shrug*
11:59<mihkel>ok then. At least now I know what to do
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12:02<lukehasnoname>Here's what I don't get about the argument that Ubuntu or any OS for that matter doesn't pass their work "upstream": Why doesn't upstream apt-get source and take a look at what's been done? It's not like the GPL is being violated or anything.
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12:02<cahoot>lukehasnoname: I believe this is off topic
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12:04<karika200>I tried to make a live cd from my debian system with this howto:
12:04<karika200>But when it's booting, I'm get error..:\
12:04<bumpylight>Views on Ubuntu are simply too political, and lead to flames. That's why it's off topic. ^^
12:04<karika200>then comes kernel panic:
12:05<karika200>What can I do?:|
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12:08<stricken>i cannot get my c program to open, in the open with option i do not see the g++ compiler there. Can someone help me to get this up and running so i can start my programming?
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12:08<stricken>i just made a little test c program in gedit and saved as .cc
12:08<JackYF>stricken: install g++
12:08<stricken>i have g++ installed
12:08<JackYF>and use command line for compiling
12:09<stricken>it doesnt do nothing
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12:10<cahoot>no errormsg?
12:10<stricken>nope it just goes to next lline
12:10<karika200>It doesn't write anything? Then it was a successfully compiling :P
12:10<stricken>ready for another command
12:10<karika200>then type ./a.out
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12:11<stricken>thanks karika200
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12:12<JackYF>stricken: don't forget to 'man g++'
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12:13<stricken>man g++ doesn't work in terminal it says no manuel entry for man g++
12:13<karika200>man gcc
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12:13<witte>karika200: it looks like your root "/" is mounted in your root "/root" or at least that it searches there
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12:14<stricken>no manuel entry for gcc
12:14<cahoot>install gcc-doc?
12:14<JackYF>cahoot: +1
12:14<stricken>is there any GUI compilers that i could use, im not too keen on command line for compiling?
12:15<cahoot>stricken: build one now that you know how to?
12:15<witte>stricken: you want gcc, but there are gui frontends
12:15<karika200>witte, what do you think? Can I modify with a grub menu.lst editing?
12:15<JackYF>stricken: compiler is always command-line, there are programming IDEs
12:15<JackYF>eclipse, anjuta, kdevelop
12:16<stricken>im used to windows GUI, im still adapting to the linux enviroment
12:16<witte>karika200: could be, can you upload your menu.lst to a pastebin
12:16<JackYF>stricken: you may read linux forums about IDEs
12:16<karika200>ofcourse, just a minute
12:17<JackYF>there are a lot of IDEs, from tiny to big
12:17<stricken>@cahoot, i dont know how to build one right now
12:17<JackYF>use apt-cache search and google for them
12:19<Hideo>karika200: fstab?
12:20<karika200>In the howto, theres a part, where I delete the mtab and the fstab
12:20<witte>karika200: maybe also add root=/dev/hdaX (with hdaX the correct partition)
12:21<karika200>but it's a live disc, the root is variable, isnt it?:$
12:21<karika200>Hideo, thefstab and the mtab was deleted
12:22<karika200>because there's a part in the howto, what says I should delete them
12:22<witte>karika200: you have a live cd in a virtual environment?
12:22<karika200>just for test
12:22<karika200>I want to make a live cd..:)
12:22<witte>karika200: which howto are you talking about
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12:22<karika200>about this
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12:23<karika200>I have made a successful a live cd with this howto, from etch..
12:23<karika200>but in Debian lenny there's some changes
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12:24<karika200>for example there's no package called casper, insted of casper there is live-initramfs
12:24-!-egns [] has joined #debian
12:24<karika200>but they are the same, I think..
12:25<reggae>anyone here uses RUTILT? i need some technical help about scanning access points? tx
12:26<witte>karika200: there is also a debian live project with howtos:
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12:27<Hideo>witte: wow nice
12:28<Lethalman>debian live is nice, i'm using it for an usb hdd
12:29<karika200>hmm, ok, I try to build a live image with this guide too :)
12:29<Lethalman>karika200, much more better
12:29<Lethalman>there's also live-magic, a graphical front-end
12:30<karika200>just graphical? Is there a non-graphical FE too?:|
12:30<Lethalman>karika200, i said "also"
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12:30<karika200>ahh, sry ,]
12:30<Lethalman>if you want control over everything, use console and tweak with live helpers as you want
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12:31<Lethalman>for specific questions, #debian-live might be useful
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12:32<Lethalman>(on irc)
12:32<karika200>(I joined :P)
12:32<karika200>thx ^^
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12:32<karika200>I try the new howto-s and the live-magic
12:33<karika200>thx for the tips :)
12:33<Ascavasaion>I cannot view other's webcams through Kopete... any idea?
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12:43<markand>hi there
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12:45<markand>I installed Debian lenny with net install and graphical installer, no problems but the installer says that my hard drive is /dev/hdd. And at reboot, debian not boot I noticed that debian recognize my hard drive as sda
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12:45<markand>it is libata ?
12:46-!-sysop4 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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12:46<Lethalman>markand, if you can boot, modify menu.lst in the debian section
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12:47<karika200>but if you can boot, in the grub menu press e on the linux entrie, and u can edit
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12:47<Lethalman>karika200, once you boot there's no need to modify the linux entry, you must modify it permanently
12:48<markand>yes I set sda8 instead hdd8
12:48<alien>hello friends. Ciao a tutti.
12:48<Lethalman>markand, in the menu.lst?
12:48<markand>but there was an error about resume partition
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12:48<user56>êàêîé ïàêåò ïîñòàâèòü äëÿ IRC ñåðâåðà?
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12:48<markand>Lethalman, no at grub before booting
12:48-!-clint_ [] has quit []
12:48<Lethalman>mh can't realize
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12:50<bumpylight>In case some new users are here, I'll ask again.
12:50<bumpylight>I have "debian-40r4-i386-DVD-1.iso.torrent" and "debian-40r4-i386-DVD-2.iso.torrent" and "debian-40r4-i386-DVD-3.iso.torrent". Is "debian-update-4.0r4-i386-DVD-1.iso.torrent" also needed?
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12:50<user56>hay IRC server for debian-4.0-minimal ?
12:50<NCommander>bumpylight, what are you trying to do?
12:51<bumpylight>Trying to make a full set of Debian 4.0r4 on DVD, NCommander.
12:51<qq_>markand: ignore it
12:52<NCommander>bumpylight, I always used jidgo to do that, so I don't know offhand
12:52<bumpylight>Okey-dokey. ^^
12:54<Lethalman>user56, apt-cache search ircd
12:54<qq_>bumpylight: if so , do a local (etch, lenny ...) mirror
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12:55<bumpylight>I'm not sure what you mean, qq_.
12:55<bumpylight>Do you mean setting up a mirror for general public use?
12:56<bumpylight>Hmmm, I think you mean for local use only.
12:56<markand>how I update console fonts after dpkg-reconfigure console-setup ?
12:56<qq_> a local one
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12:57<qq_>so you may have the new things too
12:57<qq_>instead of a fixed images
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12:59<qq_>packages are live things, may change all the times, or so
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12:59<famelix>boa tarde senhores
13:00<dpkg>Este canal é apenas em inglês. Por favor, use #debian-br (/j #debian-br) para ajuda em portugues.
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13:01<qq_>bumpylight: ^^^
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13:07<bighornram>I'm having difficulty getting sound juicer to extract to m4a format. The gstreamer plugins bad and really-bad seem to conflict with each other. When I can select m4a in juicer rhythmbox won't play them, when rhythmbox will play m4a's juicer won't show the m4a option. Has anyone noticed this and is there a way for these to co-exist?
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13:12<bumpylight>Makes sense, qq_.
13:13<bumpylight>I'm stunned at the lucidity of luquito.
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13:13<bumpylight>When I go to Heaven, my English teacher is going to smack me for all the spelling and grammar and syntax errors.
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13:20<bizhan>Hi just upgrade my debian from sarge to etch, I want to install xorg, what should I do please?
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13:20<JackYF>bizhan: sudo aptitude install xserver-xorg
13:21<witte>!set up x
13:21<dpkg>To install X in etch or later "aptitude install xorg" , you may also want to install a window manager or ask me about <install gnome>, or <install kde>, or <install xfce>, or <install fluxbox>. To reconfigure your X server, ask me about <drxx>.
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13:22<bizhan>there are some dependencies that it complains are not installed, like xserver-xorg-core ?
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13:22<doctor>hola la tengo dura
13:23<bizhan>For example here is a one of the line: xserver-xorg: Depends: xserver-xorg-core (>= 2:1.1.1-11) but it is not installable
13:23<bizhan>what should I do?
13:23<doctor>pero muy dura
13:23<JackYF>bizhan: something wrong with your repo
13:23<JackYF>did update proceed normally?
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13:24<bizhan>I followed the process from debian instruction sets
13:24<bizhan>cat /etc/debian_version indicates 4 after reboot
13:25<bizhan>and had no issue
13:25<JackYF>bizhan: apt-cache policy xserverx-xorg-core
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13:25<JackYF>what's the output?
13:26<bizhan>W: Unable to locate package xserverx-xorg-core
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13:28<bizhan>Installed: (none) Candidate 2:1:1.1.-21etch5 version table: 2:1.1.1-21-etch5 0
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13:28<bizhan>and at the end there is a web link
13:29<bizhan>Is there anything wrong? Please help?
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13:30<JackYF>bizhan: give us your /etc/apt/sources.list
13:30<JackYF>by pastebin or similar
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13:31<lukehasnoname>all your sources.list are belong to us
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13:31<bizhan>deb etch main contrib
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13:33<bizhan><JackVF> do you see any issue or anything I need to do now?
13:35<JackYF>bizhan: I don't understand why is no installation candidate for xserver-xorg-core
13:36<bizhan>How I can over ride that?
13:36<JackYF>try push other mirror and do 'aptitude update' after that
13:36<bizhan>Could you recommand any mirror?
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13:39<bizhan>E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages. : Unable to correct dependencies, some packages cannot be installed E: Unable to resolve some dependencies!
13:39<JackYF>or any other ftp.<code>
13:40<bizhan>The above messages are after running aptitude install xorg
13:41<JackYF>bizhan: so, something is broken now...
13:41<JackYF>has you tried other mirror?
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13:42<bizhan>The newer one looks better, it is finished, how would I know xorg is installed or not?
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13:44<bizhan>W: Couldn't stat source package list etch/main Packages (/var/lib/apt/lists/
13:44<bizhan>There are some warrning like above after runnin aptitude install xorg
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13:48<JackYF>bizhan: startx
13:49<JackYF>or install kde or gnome or xfce or similar
13:49<JackYF>as bot have written abov
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13:50<bizhan>xorg is not installed something is wrong ....
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13:51<bizhan>startx still is using XFree86, something is wrong, need help ....
13:51<reggae>anyone here uses RUTILT on lenny?i need help on scanning?
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13:51<JackYF>bizhan: m? how do you noticed it?
13:52<oigres>Hi guys, I've got a brand new HP laptop and X (gnome) doesn't display the widescreen as it should. I then did dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg but it turns out that it is not asking me any more for resolution of the screen any more. Checked /etc/X11/xorg.conf and it has almost no information... I guess it is all now automatic. Guau.. I'm getting old! What to do to get it working !
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13:53<JackYF>oigres: then you should write in /etc/X11/xorg.conf the correct resolution
13:53<JackYF>google it
13:53<bizhan>The only reason upgrading to etch was to use xorg, and I see the same issue. So something is wrong in installation of the packages, how do I do to fix it
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13:53<JC_t>I am trying to install debian onto an old PC which has had a new hardrive and PSU added. I am doing this via the i386 cd iso on debain main site as the CPU is intel. Except when i try boot it does the first line, then gets about 15% on the second line before giving this error : 'isolinux : disk error 10, AX = 4200, drive EF' so i changed the master/slave on the CD and now it says same error but with AX = 4280
13:53<JC_t>Can anyone help me install etch on this pc please?
13:54<JackYF>bizhan: what issue?
13:54<bizhan>aptitue install xorg
13:54<JackYF>JC_t: try to use lenny-beta installer
13:55<JackYF>bizhan: try to do 'aptitude full-upgrade'
13:55<JackYF>and then 'startx'
13:55<JC_t>JackYF Is it something to do with the iso? I try not use betas for things which arent mine (i am doing this for a friend of my mothers)
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13:55<oigres>JackYF: why is the dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg command not doing what it should do then?
13:56<JackYF>JC_t: etch lacks support very new hardware
13:56<oigres>I can do everything by hand, but then I'll feel like back to the 90's :=)
13:56<JackYF>oigres: don't know :) fill the bugreport :)
13:56<bizhan><JackYF> aptitute full-upgrade, complains there is no option "full-upgrade'?
13:57<oigres>JackYF: Ok, back to the 90's .... Yupi. Configuring everrything by hand :=)
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13:57<JC_t>JackYF This hardware is nothing near new, the CD drive is roughly 1-2 years old, though working as far as i know.
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13:57<JackYF>oigres: not everything :)
13:58<JackYF>JC_t: may be. But try to use lenny-beta installer anyway.
13:58<reggae>anyone here usesRUTILT on lenny?i need help on scanning?
13:58<JC_t>JackYF I shall go home and burn one off then, However as i am not around to try 'fix' it, is lenny stable?
13:59<JackYF>lenny is frozen now, and its release scheduled to September
13:59<JackYF>so, "almost stable"
14:00<JC_t>stable enough that it wont need maintenance? she is technologically illiterate pretty much.
14:01<bizhan>JackYF: how I do full upgrade using aptitude, the command full-upgrade is not valid
14:01<JackYF>bizhan: then, 'aptitude dist-upgrade'
14:02<JackYF>JC_t: what maintenance?
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14:02<dpkg>dist-upgrade tells apt to also install or remove packages when handling dependencies; some security updates to stable require a dist-upgrade to install (they introduce new packages). Dist-upgrade does not mean changing from stable to testing; aptitude in Lenny has renamed dist-upgrade to full-upgrade to remove this confusion. Read man apt-get carefully. Also see <why not dist upgrade>, <sarge->etch>, <etch->lenny>, or <full-upgrade>
14:02<JackYF>on server or desktop?
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14:02<JC_t>Its just a desktop pc, but i want it so when its up and running she doesnt need to install or fix anything
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14:03<sejje>JC_t: what's to break if she's not installing anything?
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14:04<JackYF>JC_t: you always can upgrade on-fly
14:04<JC_t>so no-one knows what 'isolinux : disk error 10, AX = 4200, drive EF' means?
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14:08<sejje>well, he quit before i could answer
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14:08<reggae>ok, so anyone here know whats ralink's irc channel name?
14:09<reggae>i wanna ask bout rutilt....
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14:14<sejje>reggae: are you sure they have an irc channel? aren't they a hardware vendor?
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14:14<sejje>reggae: seems unlikely a hardware vendor would have an irc channel imo
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14:15<thejetset>anyone think they can help me with an apt-get problem
14:15<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. when I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, or if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask (ask the whole channel!). We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer, ask later or ask
14:15<thejetset>well, dpkg
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14:17<cahoot>it's a bot
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14:18<thejetset>I have a problem with spkg/apt; I'm running Debian version etch. when I try to install anything mailman says it needs an update and then stops at unpacking due to ctrl-c becuse its taken 30 minutes!
14:19<thejetset>cahoot, i got that
14:19<rgnr>'ישא ישפפקמד 'ןאי אחררקמא צשמשעקרד ןמ גקנןשמ?
14:19<thejetset>i was referring to dpkg the program not the bot
14:19<bizhan>After running aptitute dist-upgrade I get the following message what it means: W: Warning: could not lock the cache file. Opening in read-only mode
14:19<thejetset> << that is the output
14:19<rgnr>what's going on with torrent managers in debian? why are they so slow?
14:20<JackYF>bizhan: did you this by root or by 'sudo'?
14:20<bizhan>as root
14:20<rgnr>can any1 help?
14:20<JackYF>then, have you any other apt running on your machine?
14:20<JackYF>*apt tool
14:21<artista_frustrado>I've got a few etch machines that do not mount nfs shares at boot time. It all works well if I mount them executing "mount -a" as root. Does anyone know how to fix it ?
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14:21<JackYF>artista_frustrado: show us the /etc/fstab firstly
14:21<bizhan>I do not think so in any case, the command aptitude install xorg is not fixed yet..
14:21<thejetset>ianyone know whats up??
14:21<reggae>sejje: sorry for late reps, well im not sure, perhaps they have some fans who open up a channel for bout "rutilt" do they have irc channel then?
14:22-!-mode/#debian [+l 377] by debhelper
14:22<sejje>reggae: i'm have no idea, but i honestly doubt it.
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14:23<JackYF>bizhan: 'ps aux | grep apt'
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14:24<thejetset>that is the output
14:24<bizhan>root 3166 0.0 0.2 1748 516 ttyS0 S+ 19:16 0:00 grep apt
14:25<Lethalman>bizhan, dpkg --configure -a to unlock
14:25<artista_frustrado>JackYF, /home nfs defaults 0 0
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14:26<artista_frustrado>JackYF, but a few machines had the same problem using /home nfs rw,rsize=4096,wsize=4096,hard,intr,async,nodev,nosuid 0 0
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14:27<bizhan>How can I fix my repo, I am not able to install xorg because of the some dependencies which it reports no instabllable like xserver-xorg?
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14:28<jeremiah>bizhan: Your repo?
14:28<Lethalman>bizhan, nopaste: your sources.list
14:28<bizhan>I just upgrade from sarge to etch
14:28<Lethalman>can you paste?
14:29<bizhan>deb etch main contrib
14:29<Lethalman>only that?
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14:29<Lethalman>did you full-upgrade, dist-upgrade or upgrade?
14:30<thejetset>where can i find the debian package contents lists
14:30<thejetset>on my install
14:30<bizhan>I just finished doing dist-upgrade and I got the same issue.
14:31<bizhan>and yes I have only one line in source.lists
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14:31<Lethalman>so the problem is at dist-upgrade?
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14:31<Lethalman>os the dist-upgrade finished clearly?
14:31<JackYF>thejetset: dpkg -l
14:32<bizhan>only at the end there was a warring about cache being lock which I corrected as someone here suggested to do so.
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14:32<thejetset>JackYF: I am looking for where it keeps the list of files for each piece of software installed
14:32<jeremiah>thejetset: You mean each file installed for each package?
14:33<thejetset>'dpkg: serious warning: files list file for package `mailman' missing, assuming package has no files currently installed.'
14:34<jeremiah>So you want to get rid of that dpkg error or do you want to know about every file on your system?
14:34<thejetset>get rid of that error
14:34<jeremiah>So in short, you want to cleanly install mailman?
14:35<thejetset>no, i want to get rid of it
14:35<jeremiah>I think you might try this: `sudo aptitude remove mailman`
14:35<thejetset>becuase it wants to upgrade every time i run apt
14:35<thejetset>tried it
14:35<jeremiah>Did you try `sudo aptitude remove --purge mailman`?
14:36<sejje>apt-get remove --purge mailman
14:36<thejetset>again, tried it
14:36<Lethalman>bizhan, can you paste the error when installing xorg? nopaste:
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14:36<jeremiah>did you try to force it with apt-get -f remove --purge mailman?
14:36<thejetset>nope. will try now.
14:36<jeremiah>(Note the use of apt-get and not aptitude.)
14:36<Lethalman>thejetset, no
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14:36<Lethalman>thejetset, reinstall mailman and remove it again
14:36<thejetset>i cant reinstall it
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14:37<thejetset>it sticks at that
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14:37<cahoot>put it on hold ? (as a hackish resort)
14:38<Lethalman>thejetset, what if dpkg --purge -a?
14:38<jeremiah>Lethalman: So why not try to force it with -f?
14:38<bizhan>I just pasted the output
14:38<thejetset>'dpkg: serious warning: files list file for package `mailman' missing, assuming package has no files currently installed.'
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14:39<Lethalman>thejetset, it's not a problem that one
14:39<Lethalman>thejetset, you must reinstall mailman to fix that warning
14:39<Lethalman>there's no other solution
14:39<thejetset>but i can't do it
14:39<Lethalman>(that i know)
14:39<jeremiah>did you try to force it with apt-get -f remove --purge mailman?
14:39<thejetset>it just sticks. i left apt in the background for 2 days and it just ran
14:40<thejetset>jeremiah: nope
14:40<Lethalman>bizhan, use another source
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14:40<jeremiah>or even force re-install with apt-get update; apt-get -f install mailman
14:40<Lethalman>bizhan, instead of mirrors.kernel and apt-get update then retry
14:41<thejetset>jeremiah, am trying tat now
14:41<jeremiah>Using apt-get -f usually helps me. :)
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14:42<thejetset>jeremiah, that worked, thanks
14:43<jeremiah>thejetset: Sure, happy to help.
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14:43<bizhan>Here is the output:
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14:44<bizhan>I am on powerpc platform
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14:45<Lethalman>no clue, what if you retry?
14:45<JackYF>bizhan: dramatical :)
14:45<jeremiah>So gzip is having a problem with Packages.gz file you are downloading.
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14:45<jeremiah>bizhan: I'll run that same file through my gzip to see if it is corrupt. . .
14:45<JackYF>bizhan: go to Debian Mirrors page, choose random mirror, push it and retry 'apt-get update'
14:46<bizhan>same issue. However, if I change the source.lists to deb etch main contrib I do not get gzip error
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14:46<Lethalman>bizhan, try yet another mirror
14:46<bizhan>any suggestion for mirror ?
14:47<blathijs> seems to be down for me, is that a known fact?
14:47<JackYF>bizhan: random
14:47<JackYF>for example,
14:47<dpkg>I'd like to buy two vowels please. I'll have an E and an O. [If you mean people, it's not that hard to type.], or <Guerin> parts per litre? how many?
14:47<dpkg>If you want to laugh, use heh or hah or bwahahaha. lol doesn't sound like laughter at all and makes you look like an AOL user.
14:48<dpkg>lmao is probably laughing my ass off, or see lol
14:48<rgnr>anywayz ppl
14:48<rgnr>i gotta priblem
14:48<jeremiah>You can't spell or type?
14:48<rgnr>mytorrent downloads r slow
14:48-!-EagleScreen [] has joined #debian
14:49<rgnr>i don't know why
14:49<bizhan>I used another random site with same error message.
14:49<rgnr>like i have the client
14:49<rgnr>i dom portforwarding
14:49<rgnr>dammit am i drunk?
14:50<rgnr>so any1 can hlp me with that ?
14:50<jeremiah>bizhan: Can you do an md5 checksum on the Packages.gz file you have? It may be corrupt or not fully downloaded.
14:50<Lethalman>rgnr, can you talk with better english words please?
14:50<enouf>bizhan: my two cents (and i came late here), your /var/cache/apt/lists is messed a bit
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14:51<Lethalman>enouf, it's downloading it
14:51-!-lukehasnoname [a13303eb@] has quit [Quit: ajax IRC Client]
14:51<enouf>erm /var/lib/apt/lists
14:51<enouf>i meant ;-)
14:51<Lethalman>why is it a problem of apt/lists?
14:51<bizhan>Where is the location of the Packages.gz, also what should I do to fix the /var/cache/apt/lists ?
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14:51<rgnr>you asked for it
14:51<bizhan>remove it okay
14:51<rgnr>you're gonna get it hard now :D
14:51-!-EagleScreen [] has joined #debian
14:52<rgnr>apart from installing torrent client and forwardin router what else should I do?
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14:52<jeremiah>rgnr: This is not really a debian question because network latency can be caused by a myriad of things.
14:53<jeremiah>Not just the operating sytem
14:53<jeremiah>I would like to help you but I do not spend a lot of time with torrents and their clients so I am not of much help.
14:54<bizhan>enouf: removing the files gives me error: E: Lists directory /var/lib/apt/lists/partial is missing.
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14:54<Lethalman>who said to remove it? O_o
14:54<Lethalman>enouf, why?
14:54-!-oigres [] has quit [Quit: [BX] Bob Barker uses BitchX. Have your BitchX spayed or neutered.]
14:54<enouf>bizhan: i didn't say to remove it
14:55<bizhan>I moved it to another directory, sorry if I mis understood, what was your suggestion?
14:55<Lethalman>bizhan, ok try mkdir -p /var/lib/apt/lists/partial && apt-get update
14:55<enouf>you need /partial and .placeholder - and whatever else
14:55<Lethalman>ah lol gh
14:55<enouf>lock too
14:56<reggae>anyone here uses rutilt? pls dun mind to share wif me, ill pay $$$ cus im kinda desperate ;)
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14:56<bizhan>there is lock partial I do not see any .placeholder
14:56<Lethalman>i think it's only a problem related to the mirrors having a corrupted packages file
14:57<enouf>bizhan: correct, my bad
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14:57<bizhan>so now I have only partial and lock, should I do aptitute upgrade now?
14:57<enouf>bizhan: but partial is a dir, and lock needs the correct perms
14:57<enouf>-rw-r----- 1 root root 0 2008-08-03 05:56 lock
14:57<enouf>drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 12288 2008-08-03 05:58 partial
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14:58<bizhan>enouf: yes I have it the same way as you outline
14:58<enouf>Lethalman: (perhaps, i entered late)
14:58<enouf>ok, update
14:59<enouf>bizhan: ok, update
14:59<enouf>is your sources.list in order?
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15:00<bizhan>here is what I have in sources.list after changing to a random mirror: deb etch main contrib
15:00<bizhan>Before I was using us rather than cz
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15:01<enouf>bizhan: oh yeah, you're the powerpc, sarge->etch guy ;-)
15:01<SnitraM>I have an old program compiled with libc5. Trying to run it give: ./prime.libc5: No such file or directory. ldd is really stupid here: /usr/bin/ldd: line 117: ./prime.libc5: No such file or directory. Is ldd really supposed to react that way?
15:01-!-synz [] has quit [Quit: Hey! Where'd my controlling terminal go?]
15:02<enouf>bizhan: did you ever get other OS errors when running regular apps prior to your upgrade?
15:02-!-adema [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:03<enouf>bizhan: i was going to suggest run memtest86+, and/or clean and reseat the DIMMs
15:03<bizhan>No I did no errors. And here is the ouput:
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15:04<enouf>bizhan: gee - not sure .. yet some specific repos do work ok?
15:05-!-adema [] has joined #debian
15:05<enouf>maybe you should report a bug, let the ftp masters or maintainers know .. ask in #debianppc on or here? or mailing lists @ ?
15:05<bizhan>I had no issue with sarge, I needed to bringup a graphic card, everyone suggested to move to etch for xorg support, that is why I am here now. My main propose is to install the xorg
15:05<Lethalman>enouf, he was using mirrors.kernel but has problems with xorg
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15:06<enouf>bizhan: sure, i gotcha - Lethalman ok .. but does mirrors.kernel,org error out too with gzip errors?
15:07<enouf>X is another issue
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15:07<Lethalman>enouf, no errors
15:07<bizhan>with mirrors.kernel I do not get gzip errors, there is issue with the xorg dependencies
15:08<enouf>bizhan: ok, well, go back to using the mirrors.x.x repos
15:08<Lethalman>i'm downloading that Packages.g
15:08<Lethalman>wait a sec
15:08<enouf>bizhan: one moment
15:08<karika200>If I run "dpkg-reconfigure locales" I would get a list, to select my codepage, but It says "generation done." and thats all.. what package is missing?
15:08<karika200>and how can I change the default language?:|
15:09<enouf>try locale-gen
15:09<bizhan>okay I am back to the older deb
15:09<karika200>locale-gen and dpkg-reconfigure locales is the same:|
15:09<Lethalman>nono wait
15:09<karika200>or does the same...
15:09<Lethalman>i gunzipped that file
15:09<Lethalman>bizhan, are you using adsl?
15:09<enouf>karika200: see also /etc/default/locale
15:09*Lethalman thinks it's a net.ipv4 sysctl problem
15:09<bizhan>sorry what is adsl?
15:10<Lethalman>bizhan, oh ok :P nothing
15:10<bizhan>should I start installing xorg again and paste the errors?
15:11<enouf>karika200: you want to log out and log in again, IIRC, /etc/environment needs to be read as well , IINM
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15:12<enouf>bizhan: yeah - how are you installing xorg? and using apt-get and aptitude on sarge->etch could be flakey
15:12<SnitraM>I have an old program compiled with libc5. Trying to run it give: ./prime.libc5: No such file or directory. ldd is really stupid here: /usr/bin/ldd: line 117: ./prime.libc5: No such file or directory. Is ldd really supposed to react that way?
15:12<bizhan>okay it seems the gzip error I get it with apt-get if I use aptitute upgrade I do not get it.
15:12<enouf>they didn't play nice together then
15:13<enouf>!why not aptitude
15:13<dpkg>Aptitude has many bugs, such as #299009, which other APT frontends do not have. Also, aptitude currently does not have equivalents for "apt-get source" and "apt-get build-dep".
15:13<bizhan>aptitute install xorg
15:13<SnitraM>!why ldd
15:13<karika200>enouf, there was no /etc/default/locale and no /etc/environment:\ I have created them
15:13<Lethalman>bizhan, you updated back to mirror?
15:13<enouf>karika200: ???
15:13<enouf>is that debian?
15:14<Lethalman>screw up :D
15:14<bizhan>no mirror.kernel
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15:14<Lethalman>what if you use aptitude update with the other mirrors?
15:14<Lethalman>instead of apt-get? do you think the gzip error goes away?
15:14<bizhan>I will try
15:15<bizhan>NO gzip error either with cs mirror
15:16<bizhan>so is this what is stopping me from installing xorg?
15:16<JackYF>then, try aptitude to install xorg
15:16<Lethalman>bizhan, it's so strange because i could gunzip that file
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15:17<reggae>anyone here uses RUTILT program????
15:18<enouf>karika200: you likely needed to reinstall (had a broken installation of the locales pkg) .. i can't find which pkg installs/generates both /etc/environment and /etc/default/locale - but i bet it's the locale pkg .postinst srcipt
15:18<karika200>hmm, thx
15:18<enouf>karika200: so, apt-get (or aptitude) install -f
15:18<bizhan>Here is the output of aptitute install xorg:
15:18<enouf>will fix broken pkg installs karika200
15:19<Lethalman>bizhan, you can't, you have to update before
15:19<JackYF>bizhan: aptitude install xserver-xorg ?
15:19<Lethalman>bizhan, i'd suggest a thing
15:19<Lethalman>can you paste the error again when update?
15:19<karika200>enouf, rulz, it works ^^
15:19<bizhan>I did the update, the xserver-xorg has the same issue. Okay I will paste it
15:19<karika200>thx :)
15:20<rgnr>whis gui for iptables is good?
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15:20<Lethalman>bizhan, you did update with cz and xorg ith the same issue?
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15:21<rgnr>any1 uses iptables?
15:21<enouf>bizhan: why don't those files exist? are you using a non-official debian mirror or proxy?
15:21<gpb>i've got a comp at work that works fine under windows but whenever I try my installed lenny I get some strange hdd-probs
15:21-!-jclinton [] has joined #debian
15:21<gpb>giving an error about hda not responding every 5 seconds
15:21-!-reggae [~reggae@] has quit [Quit: Easy as 3.14159265358979323846... ]
15:21<bizhan>no I am not using any unofficial mirror
15:22-!-mode/#debian [+l 370] by debhelper
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15:22<gpb>is there an easy workaround or do i need to assemble more info? (difficult because of short interval bertween bott and beginning problems)
15:22<bizhan>Here is the original mirror I upgrade from sargeto etch: deb etch main contrib
15:22<gpb>-r -bort+boot
15:23<sejje>i installed somethign with apt, it finished, and the process is still running. can i kill it without reprecussions?
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15:24<Jefferson>oiiii galera
15:25<rgnr>ppl dfmmit!
15:25<rgnr>whish iptables gui is good?
15:25<EagleScreen>firestarter for GNOME, and guarddog for KDE
15:25<Jefferson>vc é de onde?
15:26<EagleScreen>KDE has also more guis
15:26<enouf>OMG .. is DOG slow
15:26<Alex__>Greetings. I am looking to experiment with PAM and LDAP to replace my default etc/passwd authentication to my machine...I have read a few articles and get the gist of the idea. One thing that confuses me though (as well as postfix setup) is why LDAP seems to require configuring with the servers FQDN (in the case When I'm installing LDAP on my local machine I have no domain...
15:26<JackYF>Jefferson: English, please
15:26<Alex__>...(just localhost or when on a remote machine inside my home network). What am I supposed to use? Why is FQDN so important for things like LDAP or Postfix, etc???
15:26<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
15:26-!-av6jj [] has joined #debian
15:26<gpb>FQDN is quite important, yes
15:26<gpb>but you set a domain when installing, right?
15:26<SnitraM>gpb: Try booting with ide=nodma.
15:26<Jefferson>tem alguem ai q fala portugues?
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15:27<Alex__>Why? I'm not sure I understand it's role or important...
15:27<Alex__>I have not installed anything yet as I am confused as to what I should use when installed locally behind my firewall when I have no domain or FQDN
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15:28<gpb>good idea, SnitraM
15:28<dpkg>rumour has it, po is Piss Off or Post Office
15:28<dpkg>Por favor use #debian-pt para ajuda em portugues ou #debian-br para ajuda em portugues do brasil. ( /join #debian-pt )
15:28<enouf>bizhan: use this mirror ffs =>
15:28<dpkg>i heard sv is a Perl "scalar value" in C <-> Perl glue code - also SV. Swedish's alpha-2 ISO 639 code. It is not <subversion>.
15:28<gpb>puh, spelling correct :)
15:29<dpkg>hmm... se is Svensktalande debian-användare hittar du i på FreeNode (
15:29<dpkg>rumour has it, cn is China, or for help in chinese please /j #debian-zh, or for help in chinese please /j #debian-zh Please use UTF-8, for IRC help see | Qt/KDE è¿æ¸¡æå¼å§ï¼è¯¦æ请é读
15:29<Alex__>The name of my local machine (hostname) is tango but because it's local I have no domain so would the FQDN be tango.localhost
15:29<dpkg>troubled: you un-stats whore
15:29<gpb>you *can* try to use no domain name
15:30*SnitraM sighs.
15:30<gpb>i know someone who tried that with Microsofts LDAP bastard, but I think he got problems
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15:30<enouf>gpb: looking for !br ? ;-)
15:31<enouf>Jefferson left years ago though - typical drive-by ;-)
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15:32<gpb>if you install or have some DNS server already (perhaps needed for linux ldap, dunno), you simply add all your machines in some self-made domain, like alex.local
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15:36<gpb>nice, everyone i answer leaves
15:37<gpb>do i have mouth "odor" or sth like that?
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15:43<AzaTht>If I though some gateways gets checksum errors unless I disable tx and rx offload in the network card, where should I start looking for the error?
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15:49<AzaTht>no one have a good clue?
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15:50<qq_>dmesg ?
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15:51<AzaTht>qq_: would reealy like a better clue ツ
15:52<qq_>not from me ;)
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15:53<qq_>try google may help
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15:53-!-AYca|Sevgi [~BirSevdam@] has quit [autokilled: Take your spambots elsewhere. - Contact for help. (2008-08-07 19:53:49)]
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15:55<rgnr>что мне надо сделать в этом гребанном ящике чтобы этот долбанный торрент пахал!
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15:57<rgnr>OK! Port 63536 is open and accepting connections. оооо блин ну хоть это
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15:59<rgnr>а хули толку
15:59<rgnr>блин все равно не пашет (
15:59<dpkg>Russian speakers, please use (Pogalujsta, zajdite na) (Pazhaluista, zahodite na) #debian-russian @
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16:04<gpb>AzaTht, have you looked if your network card really *can* do proper offloading?
16:04-!-klh [] has joined #debian
16:04<gpb>not that it's a bug in the driver because it sends this to a card that can't
16:06<loopde>can use testdisk on a dd image ?
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16:08<AzaTht>gpb: the strange thing is that I only noticed the error in one network
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16:09<gpb>strange... perhaps try wireshark to get the raw packets and see for yourself if the checksum really errors
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16:36<bizhan> All for those of you who tried to help me on my installation issue, Thanks I finally managed to install the xorg. Thanks for all your help, for questions regarding startx is this a right forum to ask?
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16:40<gpb>dont ask if you may ask, just ask :)
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16:41<gpb>we will burn you at the stake if you ask the wrong questions, but since we crucify for asking if you may ask... ;-)
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16:42<bizhan>okay, I have a ATI card and I am trying to get it to work, when I ran startx, it fails
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16:44<witte>bizhan: upload /var/log/Xorg.0.log and /etc/X11/xorg.conf to a pastebin
16:44<dpkg>Please don't paste anything into the channel; use a paste site instead, like:,,, for pics. --- Also ask me: <pastebin pipe>
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16:52<bizhan>witte: here are the files:
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16:56<witte>bizhan: you have etch?
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16:56<qq>Option "XkbModel" >>>> "pcpc101" <<< ???
16:57<witte>and is that the entire log file,
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17:01<bizhan>It is entire log file, and pcpc101 is wrong I am using a usb keyboard and not sure what to place there???
17:01<witte>bizhan: pc101
17:02<bizhan>okay I will change it to pc101, is this the reason startx is not showing any output
17:02<qq>or, pc104
17:02<witte>yeah, pc104 will be better most likely
17:02<witte>bizhan: probably not
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17:03<bizhan>so I am stuck on this need help please
17:03<witte>bizhan: did you already try to do dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg?
17:03<bizhan>yes, the xorg.conf is created by running above command
17:03<witte>bizhan: and what happens if you type startx
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17:04<gpb>what ati model is it? try lspci
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17:05<bizhan>0000:00:0f.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc RV280 [Radeon 9200 PRO] (rev 01)
17:05<bizhan>0000:00:0f.1 Display controller: ATI Technologies Inc: Unknown device 5940 (rev 01)
17:05-!-bizhan was kicked from #debian by debhelper [use the paster bot or #flood]
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17:06<bizhan>sorry got kicked out
17:06<witte>bizhan: don't paste here, and don't run x as root
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17:07<witte>mmm, unknown device
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17:07<witte>bizhan: try update-pciids
17:07<witte>and afterwards give us the output of lspci again (this time in the pastebin ;-))
17:08<qq>lspci |grep VGA
17:08<bizhan>okay 0000:00:0f.1 Display controller: ATI Technologies Inc RV280 [Radeon 9200 PRO] (Secondary) (rev 01)
17:09<bizhan>0000:00:0f.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc RV280 [Radeon 9200 PRO] (rev 01)
17:09<bizhan>so after update it is able to recognize the chip
17:10<qq>2 graphics cards ?
17:10<witte>I think it is one card with two ports
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17:10<bizhan>Actually it is one graphic card, with three interfaces VGA and DVI and one for TV
17:10<bizhan>yes two ports
17:11<witte>bizhan: did you add the busid in the xorg.conf?
17:11<qq> BusID "PCI:0:15:0"
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17:12<witte>because it could be your cable is on the wrong port (or the output on the wrong port)
17:12<bizhan>no, let me do it and try again
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17:12<witte>the other port is PCI:0:15:1
17:13*witte still thinks the Xorg.0.log is too short
17:13<bizhan>let me try the PCI:0:15:1 now
17:13<qq>and incomplete
17:14<witte>it is a ppc, don't know if they have less to deal with?
17:14<bizhan>Yes it is ppc
17:14<bizhan>is there any way I can turn some debug option?
17:15<qq>bizhan: what give the last changes?
17:16<witte>bizhan: and did you try running xstart as normal user?
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17:17<bizhan>I tried both PCI bus ID with the same result. I have not run as normal user, I need to creat an account. Does it matter to run as root or not?
17:18<witte>sometimes root is blocked from running X
17:18<qq> cat /etc/X11/default-display-manager <<< what does
17:19<witte>but i think that is only from kdm or gdm, but doesn't hurt to try
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17:20<bizhan>I can not type sorry: /usr/bin/gdm
17:20<qq> cat /etc/X11/default-display-manager
17:20<witte>qq: i think he just gave that answer ;-)
17:20<gpb>don't forget /etc/alternatives/x-window-manager etc, witte ;-)
17:21<witte>gpb: i think we are not yet that far, he has not X yet
17:21<qq>my bad
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17:21<bizhan>that is binary file,
17:21<witte>bizhan: what is a binary file?
17:21<meridian>nem megy a mercury messenger se
17:21<meridian>Please, make sure to have the Sun Java version 1.5 or later installed.
17:21<gpb>btw qq, my display problem is solved now by adding "Modes "1024x768" " etc
17:21<gpb>unclean but works
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17:22<qq>unclean ? not sure ...
17:22-!-meridian [] has quit []
17:22<qq>harded coded yes
17:22<gpb>well, no adding of river to use etc, just sayig which resolutions... he *ought* to get this automatically, but...
17:23-!-Gueno [] has joined #debian
17:23<gpb>now i still have the prob with the hdd, but that ought to be resolved "soon", too
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17:23<witte>bizhan: ok, what are you doing now?
17:23<Gueno>y a des francais dans le coin?>.<
17:24<bizhan>I need to reboot my system, when I did cat /etc/alternative/x-window-manager it dumpped garbage on my screen and killed the console, I do have a ssh connection .
17:24<dpkg>rumour has it, fr is Pour l'aide en francais, veuillez rejoindre le canal #debian-fr sur French users: for help in french, please go to #debian-fr on
17:24<witte>bizhan: just type reset
17:24<witte>even if you don't see it
17:24<bizhan>I can continue with ssh.
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17:25<bizhan>Let me create a user account and try startx, will be back with result in second, thanks for trying to help me.
17:25<qq>/etc/init.d/gdm restart
17:26<bizhan>okay I did that
17:26<qq>or reboot
17:26<gpb>reboot... are we windows?
17:27<gpb>i still need to finally figure out how to change kernel without rebooting... it's said in anecdotes that it works but I don't know how yet :)
17:27<bizhan>I am not rebooting , the serial console is unresponsive, but I have a ssh session open and I can continue working from ssh
17:28<witte>bizhan: you work with serial console, nice :-)
17:28<witte>bizhan: but slow :P
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17:29<bizhan>mpc8378 is the processor
17:29<witte>bizhan: why do you work with serial console? I have used it for headless and keyboardless systems,
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17:31<bizhan>This is a development system, the keyboard and mouse yet is not operational, since I do not have a graphic view like xwindow, or may be I am missing something and I could have used it.
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17:32<bizhan>okay I created an account and it failes: X: user not authorized to run the X server, aborting.
17:34<bizhan>any other idea , I should use please
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17:34<qq>/etc/init.d/gdm restart
17:34<witte>bizhan: that error is something completely different than the former
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17:34<qq>as root , sure
17:35<qq>startx too
17:35<bizhan>same result
17:35<witte>qq: startx would fail if gdm would start
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17:37<witte>bizhan: try this as root: chmod bizhan:bizhan ~bizhan/.Xauthority ~bizhan/.ICEauthority
17:38<witte>bizhan: with bizhan replaced by the username you just made
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17:38<bizhan>actually the use name is bizhan :) sure I will try
17:38<witte>next, try startx as normal user again
17:39<bizhan>chmod what mode should I set them too?
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17:39<witte>bizhan: i am an idiot, chown
17:39<witte>not chmod
17:40<bizhan>THere is no .Xauthority and .ICE... files should I copy them from somewhere?
17:41<witte>bizhan: they should be made by running startx
17:41<witte>if you run startx
17:41<witte>you only get one line output?
17:41<witte>that of user not permitted
17:42<bizhan>so chown only worked on bizhan:bizhan, no I get more output I will cut and paste that on the webside
17:43<witte>bizhan: that command does chown to username bizhan and groupname bizhan. That is the bizhan:bizhan
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17:43<qq>bizhan: cat /var/run/
17:43-!-abadr [] has quit []
17:43<bizhan>qq: there is no such a file
17:44<qq>ls -l /tmp/.X0-lock
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17:44<bizhan>everytime I ran startx I have to remove that file.
17:45<bizhan>witte: here is the output:
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17:48<witte>bizhan: on what kind of terminal are you logged in when you type that
17:48<witte>is that over ssh or over serial console
17:49<qq>cat /proc/cpuinfo |grep cpu
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17:50<qq>by curious
17:50<bizhan>cpu : e300c4
17:50<qq>cpu MHz
17:51<qq>bogomips ?
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17:52<bizhan>It is a powerpc from Freescale (old Motorloa CPU bussiness unit)
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17:52<qq>ya, and bogomips ?
17:52<bizhan>sorry I do not know what is bogomips
17:53<qq>cat /proc/cpuinfo
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17:53<bizhan>sorry got it 166.40
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17:54<bizhan>is any other channel that may know issue with xorg
17:54<witte>bizhan: i also get a "X: user not authorized to run the X server, aborting."
17:54<witte>when trying to run startx over ssh
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17:54<bizhan>yes, that is what I got. running ssh
17:55<qq>reboot , will do the trick
17:55<witte>bizhan: but, you should be able to restart gdm
17:55<witte>the question is whether you will see it on your display
17:55<bizhan>shoujld I start the gdm as bizhan user or as root?
17:55<witte>that depends i think on a combination of busid and output where you have your card attached
17:56<witte>bizhan: can you try for a while connect both vga and dvi if you have such monitors
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17:56<bizhan>Okay Let me look for DVI cable it should take me one min be right back
17:56<witte>bizhan: btw, while booting the ppc, there are messages on the screen, right?
17:57<witte>and i mean on the real screen, not serial console
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18:02-!-mode/#debian [+l 359] by debhelper
18:02<bizhan>okay I am back, let me give you a little background, our system is an embedded system with usb, serial port and one PCI slot. The bootloader is called uboot, I download the kernel image from tftb to our system, the file system is on an SATA disk, so when I boot the kernel it mounts the rootfile system (Debian). At this time the only thing that works is a serial console, after booting to linux then I can run ssh command. I got the DVI cable.
18:02<witte>bizhan: there is a screen attachted to the box
18:03<witte>bizhan: you were not trying to get X over serial console?
18:03<bizhan>Yes I have Sony LCD monitor which has vga and dvi port the both ports are connected to the ATI card. At this time I am running startx from ssh
18:03<witte>bizhan: ok, you got me worried :-)
18:04<witte>bizhan: i am not sure that connecting both to one monitor at the same time is a good idea though
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18:04<witte>bizhan: just do something and switch whenever needed, or use two seperate screens
18:04<bizhan>It has a switch that I can toggle between each input. VGA is input1 and DVI is input2
18:05<witte>bizhan: ah, sounds perfect
18:05<witte>bizhan: now try to startx through serial consoel
18:05<NeonLevel>I have a Toshiba Satellite Laptop, with a soundcard modprobe -v snd_hda_intel, but i can't seem to have it working using the speakers, but if i plug in headphones the sound works, anyone ?
18:05<dpkg>ALSA is the Advanced Linux Sound Architecture. Debian has documentation at or see <alsa install>, <alsa-checklist>, <alsa firmware>
18:05<NeonLevel>SOrry Debian Etch,
18:05<dpkg>1) run alsaconf as root 2) add yourself to the 'audio' group (log out and log in again) 3) use alsamixer and unmute channels and raise levels (also try muting some channels) 4) arts or esound stopped? 5) OSS modules unloaded? 6) speakers on? 7) modprobe snd-pcm-oss 8) does "aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav" work for root? Test your sound with aplay and a wav so codec issues don't confuse the situation. <list alsa users>
18:05<witte>NeonLevel: try the alsa-checklist, should work afterwards
18:06<bizhan>my serial console after cat /etc/... died and I can not start it till I reboot the system.
18:06<dpkg>1) run alsaconf as root 2) add yourself to the 'audio' group (log out and log in again) 3) use alsamixer and unmute channels and raise levels (also try muting some channels) 4) arts or esound stopped? 5) OSS modules unloaded? 6) speakers on? 7) modprobe snd-pcm-oss 8) does "aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav" work for root? Test your sound with aplay and a wav so codec issues don't confuse the situation. <list alsa users>
18:06<witte>if you have very new hardware, it might be usefull to upgrade alsa
18:06<NeonLevel>upgrade how?
18:06<NeonLevel>using source code?
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18:06<NeonLevel>00:14.2 Audio device: ATI Technologies Inc SB450 HDA Audio (rev 01)
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18:06<witte>bizhan: did you try "reset" at the serial console (and several ctrl-c's)
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18:07<dpkg>1) run alsaconf as root 2) add yourself to the 'audio' group (log out and log in again) 3) use alsamixer and unmute channels and raise levels (also try muting some channels) 4) arts or esound stopped? 5) OSS modules unloaded? 6) speakers on? 7) modprobe snd-pcm-oss 8) does "aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav" work for root? Test your sound with aplay and a wav so codec issues don't confuse the situation. <list alsa users>
18:07<bizhan>It does not take any input. Let me try one more time
18:08<bizhan>it does not work. but I have two ssh session that I can use.
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18:08<witte>bizhan: does it take long to reboot?
18:08<bizhan>no 2 min. should I try
18:09<witte>bizhan: yes, i want you to try it with the serial consoel
18:09<bizhan>ok thanks will be in 2
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18:09<witte>NeonLevel: i think you need a newer kernel (which is downloadable with apt-get) if you use etchnhalf or backports
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18:10<dpkg>Kurumin Linux is a Brazilian LiveDistro Linux distribution based on Knoppix. Website: User Forums:
18:10<kurumin>FALA EM PORTUGUÊS?
18:10<dpkg>Por favor use #debian-pt para ajuda em portugues ou #debian-br para ajuda em portugues do brasil. ( /join #debian-pt )
18:10<witte>kurumin: but those are also debian channels, not kurumin channels
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18:11<NeonLevel>should i try etchnhalf in apt.source ?
18:11<dpkg>"etch + 1/2" -- an update to Debian's stable release "etch" designed to provide support for newer hardware. It includes a 2.6.24 kernel along with an updated installer. Release notes: Installation instructions: See also, or <etchnhalf facts>
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18:12<witte>NeonLevel: you can try so, in the wiki the instructions are written (it is not exactly etchnhalf, but not much more difficult)
18:12<witte>NeonLevel: afterwards install 2.6.24
18:12<NeonLevel>ok, how do i access the wiki on how to install etchnhalf ?
18:13<witte>NeonLevel: dpkg told you (last link)
18:13<NeonLevel>ok reading...
18:14<witte>the first question in the faq should be sufficient for you
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18:17<Lethalman>why etchnhalf has 2.6.24 while there's .25 in the backports? isn't it sufficiently stable for etch?
18:18<witte>Lethalman: at the point of release, a certain kernel is chosen
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18:18<witte>backports is more 'flexible' as it is not released
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18:18<zobel>Lethalman: the kernel team chose to security support 2.6.24 via etch+0.5
18:19<Lethalman>ah yes also that
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18:20<NeonLevel>if i already have debian etch, what should i do update it to etchnhalf ?
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18:22<zobel>do you need etch+0.5?
18:22<zobel>NeonLevel: it is thought just for those whose hardware isn't supported by plain etch
18:22<NeonLevel>my sound card wont work
18:23<NeonLevel>00:14.2 Audio device: ATI Technologies Inc SB450 HDA Audio (rev 01)
18:23<zobel>apt-get install linux-image-2.6.24-etchnhalf
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18:28<witte>bizhan: what's the status
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18:29<bizhan>okay I got some problem I am back now, so As you suggested I will run startx from console as user bizhan
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18:30<bizhan>okay I still have the same issue with the not autorized to run
18:30<bizhan>let me cut and past that.
18:32<Lethalman>bizhan, why don't you put X in your init scripts?
18:32<Lethalman>i mean, this should be done by debian e.g. when installing gdm
18:32<witte>bizhan: i don't know, you could try #xorg at freenode
18:33<witte>Lethalman: his gdm also does not work
18:33<Lethalman>bizhan, what if you run gdm as root?
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18:33<witte>Lethalman: good question ;-)
18:33<bizhan>okay let me try
18:33<davi>What package to install nvidia proprietary driver on lenny?
18:34<bizhan>so I will do /etc/init.d/gdm restart is this what I should do?
18:34<dpkg>extra, extra, read all about it, nvidia_post_etch is update-pciids && apt-get install module-assistant nvidia-kernel-source && m-a prepare && m-a a-i nvidia && apt-get install nvidia-glx && depmod -a && modprobe nvidia && dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg
18:34<Lethalman>bizhan, yes
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18:35<bizhan>when I do: ps -ejf | grep gdm I do not see any gdm?
18:35<davi>thanks witte
18:35<Lethalman>bizhan, run gdm as root
18:35<Lethalman>without the init.d script
18:35<bizhan>where is the binary located?
18:35<Lethalman>just run gdm
18:36<Lethalman>as root
18:36<Lethalman>type 'gdm'
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18:36<bizhan>It can not find it. And when I do "which gdm" returns nothing.
18:36<bizhan>there is no gdm
18:36<bizhan>I have missed something in the installation perhaps
18:37<Lethalman>aptitude install gdm
18:37<bizhan>okay I will try that thanks
18:37<Lethalman>do you want gnome?
18:37<Lethalman>aptitude install gnome-core
18:37<Lethalman>this should set up everything to start X at boot
18:37<Lethalman>if it doesn't work then your installation is a bit messed up
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18:43<bighornram>how do I rid my life of sound-juicer? It is default when a CD is inserted. I would like to see grip instead.
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18:45<Lethalman>bighornram, i don't have the gnome system tool now but there's such an app to tune actions done on removable media
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18:45<Lethalman>oh yes Removable media and blabla
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18:45<Lethalman>that's what you were looking for bighornram
18:46<bighornram>tis wierd, dpkg -P sound-juicer complains that gnome-desktop-environment depends on sound-juicer.
18:46<Lethalman>why weird?
18:46<Lethalman>gnome-desktop-environment contains a set of gnome applications
18:47<Lethalman>you can remove gnome-desktop-environment and reinstall what you need as you need
18:47<Lethalman>it's like a moduleset
18:47<bighornram>i would think that sound-juicer would depend on gnome-desktop-environment. I would use sound-juicer but can't configure it to do m4a
18:48<Lethalman>bighornram, have you read what i said about "Removable media" system preferences?
18:48<bizhan>lethalman the gnome-core installation is finished, do I need to start the gdm? or...?
18:48<Lethalman>bizhan, yes start it with init.d
18:48<bighornram>Lethalman: yes looking it up right now.
18:49<Lethalman>gnome-desktop-environment is not a lib or such bighornram :)
18:49<Lethalman>it's like gnome-core, gnome, a meta package
18:49<Lethalman>bizhan, there?
18:49<bizhan>Lethalman: i did /etc/init.d/gdm restart , the ps command doesnot show any gdm running?
18:50<Lethalman>what if you run 'gdm' raw as root?
18:50<bizhan>where is the binary?
18:50<Lethalman>in /usr/sbin
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18:51<bizhan>three is no gdm in that directory. I do remember during installation of the x11-common it removed the gdm.
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18:51<Lethalman>bizhan, do aptitude dist-upgrade (even you are not upgrading to another distribution) and aptitude install gdm
18:52-!-mode/#debian [+l 352] by debhelper
18:52<qq>bizhan: is good time to say that ...
18:52<qq>24 h later
18:53<bizhan>I just remember that, I went through hell to upgrade from sarge to etch. It has been about 48 hours non stop.
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18:54<chattr>bizhan: I'm coming in this discussion late, but as I understand your problem, you are trying to run X over ssh, correct ?
18:54<bizhan>I just finished intall gdm, still I do not see the binary
18:55<bizhan>chattr yes
18:55<Lethalman>i didn't know that really
18:55<chattr>and you are getting the messages in ?
18:55<Lethalman>bizhan, why didn't you say about ssh? gh
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18:56<bizhan>why, it matter, I have an embedded system, I have console (serial) and ssh, what does it make difference?
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18:57<chattr>on the machine you are ssh'd into, what does ' grep allowed_users /etc/X11/Xwrapper.config ' return ? ( I bet it returns ' allowed_users=console ' )
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18:58<Lethalman>bizhan, it matters in term of permissions
18:58<chattr>' allowed_users=console ' means only local users may run the X server
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18:58<bizhan>Chattr yes you are correct. what is next
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18:59<chattr>you'll need to edit /etc/X11/Xwrapper.config and make allowed_users=anybody
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18:59<chattr>see ' man Xwrapper.config '
18:59<Lethalman>good night, good luck bizhan
19:00<bizhan>Lethalman: thanks so much
19:00<Lethalman>yw :)
19:00<chattr>if that edit doesn't work, change allowed_users back to console
19:00<bizhan>Chatter I have done that
19:00<bizhan>but i still do not have gdm binary would that be a problem?
19:01<chattr>no, gdm is a display manager, and is not required / necessary for X to run
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19:02<bizhan>okay now running startx, has produce lot us of output and of course it failed. SHould I paste that, could you help me on this too please?
19:02<chattr>paste the output in , please
19:02<bizhan>thanks one second
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19:03<enouf>Lethalman: wow, he's been trolling this long? lmao
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19:08<chattr>question: let's call the machine you're ssh'd into ' sshbox ' and the machine you're ssh'ing from ' local '
19:08<chattr>do you want X apps on sshbox to run and display on local ?
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19:09<bizhan>I want to enable the graphic card (ATI Radeon) on sshbox . And display graphic on the monitor which is connected to the graphic card.
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19:11<chattr>' monitor which is connected to the graphic card ' means the monitor attached to sshbox , correct ?
19:11<qq>bizhan: just not responded at witte question : may you see any boot messages on connected monitor on (remote) sshbox at boot time ?
19:12<bizhan>no, I can cut and paste the output but it does not,
19:12<chattr>and there's no mouse or keyboard attached to sshbox ?
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19:13<bizhan>Yes there is a usb keyboard and usb mouse, but I usually boot the system through the serial console and then ssh into ti.
19:13<kingsley>Two disk partitions overlap. Is my assumption correct that after deleting one, fsck will know if the remaining one is OK?
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19:15<chattr>from , it looks as if the X on sshbox has a problem with the mouse configuration: Cannot open device /dev/input/mice
19:16<bizhan>yes, prior to that it also complains about not being able to open the framebuffer fb ?
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19:19<chattr>well, the previous error is (EE) AIGLX: Screen 0 is not DRI capable
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19:21<chattr>which possibly indicates you're loading the wrong video driver
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19:22<bizhan>Okay, so I was under impression xorg has the driver for ATI chip and it gets loaded once it detect the chip. I am using Linux 2.6.25 and have configured all the ATI option within kernel.
19:23<qq>Fatal server error: failed to initialize core devices : RADEON(0):
19:23<chattr>please post your xorg.conf from sshbox on
19:24<bighornram>Lethalman: gnome-volume-properties Thankyou
19:24<qq>use >>> RADEON<<< not ati in xorg
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19:25<bizhan>Here it is:
19:26<bizhan>okay I chage the ati to radeon
19:29<chattr>I don't know if that'll make things better, but if you change ati to radeon and do ' startx ' , what gets outputted ? ( You'll probably still have a mouse problem )
19:29<gsimmons>qq: Your suggested change won't make any difference. The Xorg ati driver is just wrapper driver for the radeon, r128 or atimisc driver (as autodetected by Xorg). It is obviously loading radeon in bizhan's system.
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19:30<qq>if still nothing ,try "fbdev", "vesa", in this order
19:30<chattr>bizhan: what qq said
19:30<bizhan>you mean instead of "ati"
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19:32<chattr>bizhan: after tryign that change, change the ' Option "Protocol" "ImPS/2" ' line in xorg.conf
19:32<chattr>to ' Option "Protocol" "auto" '
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19:34<qq>i presume he use USB keyboard/mouse
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19:35<chattr>qq: yes to both
19:35<bizhan>Yes USB, something has changed, when I do startx I get very minimum output no error message even when I changed it back to ati I stil do not see any error message, is there a lock file (other than /tmp/.X0-lock) that needs to be removed.
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19:37<bizhan>How would I know if I have installed all the components of Xwindow correctly?
19:38<qq>what is passing with "fbdev " ?
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19:38<chattr>bizhan: would you paste the results of ' grep "(EE)" /var/log/Xorg.0.log ' in ?
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19:41<bizhan>chattr something has changed in my enviroment. the startx produces very little output with no more information regarding EE.
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19:41<bizhan>let me cut and paste the ps output command I see lot us of xinit process.
19:42<chattr>bizhan: there are no results of ' grep "(EE)" /var/log/Xorg.0.log ' ?
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19:42<chattr>' ps ' won't help
19:42<qq>bizhan: with witch driver ? ati or ...?
19:42<bizhan>There are lot us of Xorg defunt
19:43<abrotman>bizhan: aptitude install xorg
19:43<qq>xserver-xorg ?
19:43<chattr>bizhan: I wouldn't be concerned about xinit processes at this time
19:43<abrotman>i meant what i said
19:43<bizhan>First it did after I changed ati to radeon, now it is the same with ati.
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19:43<chattr>bizhan: there are no results of ' grep "(EE)" /var/log/Xorg.0.log ' ?
19:44<bizhan>I have already down aptitude install Xorg and xserver-xorg
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19:45<abrotman>'xorg' requires 'xserver-xorg'
19:46<bizhan>I have done both, okay after I killed the Xorg defunct processes I got some errors let me paste that
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19:46<bizhan>EE) No devices detected.
19:46<abrotman>bizhan: lspci | grep VGA
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19:47<bizhan>EE) No devices detected.
19:47<abrotman>bizhan: lspci | grep VGA
19:47<chattr>bizhan: change the ' Option "Protocol" "ImPS/2" ' line in xorg.conf
19:47<chattr>to ' Option "Protocol" "auto" '
19:47<bizhan>0000:00:0f.0 ffff: ATI Technologies Inc RV280 [Radeon 9200 PRO] (rev ff)
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19:48<bizhan>the rev is changed from 01 to ff.
19:48<chattr>and then do ' startx '
19:48<bizhan>chattr yes I did changed that
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19:49<chattr>try changing "auto" to "usb" , then
19:49-!-ewanm89_ is now known as Cap_J_L_Picard
19:49<chattr>and then do ' startx '
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19:50<chattr>if it fails, check the last lines of /var/log/Xorg.0.log for (EE)
19:51<abrotman>bizhan: did you compile your own kernel
19:51<Chatteur54811>i'm french
19:52<Chatteur54811>and i need help !
19:52<dpkg>hmm... fr is Pour l'aide en francais, veuillez rejoindre le canal #debian-fr sur French users: for help in french, please go to #debian-fr on
19:52<bizhan>abrotman: Do I need to enable some configuration in the kernel?
19:52<Chatteur54811>i have a bug with the charster
19:52<abrotman>bizhan: tried it with a Debian kernel ?
19:53<bizhan>no, I am using an embedded PowerPC and not sure Debian kernel can ran on it, Of course I believe the kernel should be generic.
19:54<abrotman>of course .. you got it installed somehow
19:55<abrotman>so apparently a debian kernel worked before
19:56<bizhan>no I never used debian kernel. I am using generic 2.6.25,
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19:57<abrotman>it would appear you missed some mouse components during your install .. or you need to tell X where your mouse device actually is
19:58<bizhan>Is there any config file I can use and configure does components. I also see the framebuffer errors too.
19:59<abrotman>xorg.conf is the config
19:59<chattr>bizhan: does ' lsmod | grep mouse ' return anything ?
19:59<abrotman>he may have compiled it in
20:00<bizhan>is there any option that I should pass to lsmod ?
20:00<chattr>no option
20:00<bizhan>I have compiled everything as part of kernel not module.
20:01<abrotman>bizhan: dmesg | grep mouse
20:01<bizhan>The mouse is USB
20:01<bizhan>if I remove the mouse from the usb and insert it back I see some messaged on the console
20:02<chattr>put them in
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20:11<bumpylight>It's later in the day, so I'll try again.
20:12<bumpylight>I confess to being puzzled by the hint that there is an additional update of Debian from 4.0r4 to 4.0r4a.
20:12<bumpylight>Does this mean that it is a good idea to obtain debian-update-4.0r4-i386-DVD-1.iso, even if the other
20:12<bumpylight>three have been downloaded through BitTorrent? (I refer here to the DVD version). Is this use of
20:12<bumpylight>4.0r4a only a temporary naming glitch which should be ignored? Is 4.0r4 the only current version?
20:13<bumpylight>Oops, that didn't work too well. Sorry.
20:13<chattr>bizhan: what is the manufacturer and model of your mouse ?
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20:14<bumpylight>I've been trying for a little while to find out which need to be downloaded, in #debian and #help, and also in the Debian list for CD/DVD distributions. No one seems to know anything.
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20:15<qq>bumpylight: again ?
20:15<bumpylight>I suspect that even insiders at Debian aren't certain. The distribution has become so large these days. :)
20:15<bizhan>chattr the company is called tarrgus I have another mouse if you think this trouble some.
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20:15<abrotman>bumpylight: if you have an http connection, just use that to update
20:16-!-gilmar [] has joined #debian
20:16<bumpylight>But I want to know about which DVDs to burn, abrotman.
20:16<qq>bumpylight: just all talking on it , so stop flooding !
20:16<gilmar>ola a todos, alguem mexe com xen?
20:16<abrotman>meh .. just use the netinst
20:17<bumpylight>It's a pity. I suppose it's one of those questions that never get answered.
20:17<abrotman>bumpylight: i haven't seen a reason yet .. and i've asked a few people
20:17<chattr>bizhan: what does ' lsusb ' return about your mouse ?
20:17<bumpylight>Oh. BTW, I've not been connected to the IRC channel, so if there was a discussion, I missed it.
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20:19<bizhan>I just changed the usb to :input: Microsoft Microsoft IntelliMouse® Explorer as /class/input/input3 the lsusb says:Bus 001 Device 005: ID 045e:0095 Microsoft Corp. Bus 001 Device 003: ID 045e:00dd Microsoft Corp.Bus 001 Device 002: ID 05e3:0608 Genesys Logic, Inc.Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002
20:19<bizhan>Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002
20:21<bumpylight>I did get the file debian-update-4.0r4-i386-DVD-1.iso through a torrent and mounted it in a virtual drive. The text files on it didn't shed any light.
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20:22<qq>[17:38:54] <qq_> bumpylight: a netinstall will be enough
20:22<qq>[17:39:02] <qq_> 169 MB[17:44:00] <bumpylight> I certainly do plan to update over the Web, but want a full install on diskettes just in case.[19:12:04] <bumpylight> Makes sense, qq_.
20:23<qq>so please stop it
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20:23<bumpylight>No, that doesn't help boxes that don't have any net link for security reasons, only to net boxes.
20:23<bumpylight>That's why also the full burned set.
20:24<qq>as said do a local mirror !!!
20:24<chattr>bizhan: change the ' Option "Device" ' line in xorg.conf to ' Option "Device" "/dev/input/input2" '
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20:24<chattr>you might also have to change the ' Driver ' line as well
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20:26<chattr>maybe Driver "evdev"
20:27<bizhan>okay let me try
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20:29<bizhan>chattr: (EE) evdev brain: Unable to initialize inotify, using fallback. (errno: 2)
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20:34<chattr>bizhan: are you getting more messages, or is the ' Unable to initialize inotify, using fallback ' the only message ?
20:34<bizhan>much more messages.
20:34<chattr>do you get messages such as ' (II) evdev brain: Rescanning devices (2) '
20:36<chattr>any message beginning ' (II) Mouse0-usb ' with a - and numbers following usb in the message ?
20:38<chattr>in your /home/bizhan directory, what does ' ls -la .Xauth* ' show ?
20:38<chattr>is there an .Xauthority owned by another user ?
20:38<bizhan>Chatter I have been running startx as root on the console . Do you want me be bizhan user and test it again
20:39<chattr>no, ignore my last question, then
20:39<bizhan>The same error as bizhan user
20:40<chattr>paste the messages you got which include ' Unable to initialize inotify, using fallback ' in
20:40<chattr>let's stick with starting X as user bizhan, as well
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20:45<chattr>what does ' ls /dev/input/ ' return ?
20:46<bizhan>There is no node input under dev, how could I creat that node using udev?
20:48<chattr>I'm beginning to think that this is a problem with your kernel, and you need to use either a Debian kernel or recompile yours with the correct mouse support
20:49<qq>maybe all USB tricks, that why he don't "want" to use "InputDevice"
20:50<bizhan>qq: sorry I did not understood the hint?
20:50<qq>keyboard/mouse ...
20:52<qq>why don't using direct attached USB keyboard/mouse , at least for starting X ...
20:54<bizhan>Does this mean I have to any changes to xorg.conf?
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20:56<interbird>i just joined but i don't know if i have -w on this #
20:56<chattr>bizhan: fix your kernel first
20:56<qq>do a working kernel , and install all needed X packages
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20:58<bizhan>okay thanks for all your help, I was not even close to here without your help. Thanks again
20:58<qq>bizhan: there are many lists on net for your machine
20:58<bizhan>qq: what list
20:59<qq>google your machine name
20:59<bizhan>oh okay, thanks will do
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21:03<chattr>bizhan: good luck
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21:05<interbird>i hate debian !!!!!!!!!!!!
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21:09<bizhan>chattr thanks
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21:15<interbird>muammar: ?
21:15<muammar>interbird, ?
21:16<interbird>muammar: sorry; wrong key...
21:16<muammar>interbird, don't worry :)
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21:17<interbird>muammar: i was but i'm not worried anymore :-)
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21:25<interbird>muammar: are you in the mood for a chat ?
21:27<dpkg>Please keep the discussions in #debian on-topic (i.e., Debian support), or return to the topic after a short while. #debian-offtopic is the place for longer off-topic discussions.
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21:29<interbird>abrotman: i know, but i can't help debian does not spur any need for support; so i just wanted to chat to fill the bandwidt :-)
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21:30<abrotman>not in here
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21:35<Txt-file>interbird: I have 2 big problems with my debian-pcs ... AMD RV630 & nvidia 8600 GS
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21:37<drakemobius>hi! I can't burn a cd. I installed cdrecord (wodim) and mkisofs and I recv 'wodim: no such file or directory. Cannot open SCSI driver!'
21:37<drakemobius>strace shows it is scanning for /dev/sg[0-9]
21:37<interbird>Txt-file: One at the time ?
21:38<drakemobius>i assume this is scanning for virtual scsi subsystem to IDE drive but how can I override? scanbus gives same error
21:39<Txt-file>interbird: sure ... no .. the ati in my main-pc and the nvidia in my 2nd
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21:40<bumpylight>Is qq a moderator?
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21:41<abrotman>bumpylight: no
21:41<bumpylight>Okay, thanks, abrotman.
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21:41<abrotman>Txt-file: we need more details
21:41<bumpylight>I didn't think so.
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21:41<interbird>Txt-file: ATI & NVidia; now how is that one prob at-the-time ? Or do you know already no solution ?
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21:42<abrotman>drakemobius: wodim --devices ?
21:42<bumpylight>I think the general solution requires as a practical matter full memetic networks. Otherwise, the brittleness problems seems to kick in.
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21:42<bumpylight>There's a reason Xanadu failed.
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21:43<drakemobius>abrotman: 0 found
21:43<drakemobius>i am in cdrom group
21:43<drakemobius>i have also tried via sudo
21:43<abrotman>drakemobius: did you compile your own kernel ?
21:43<drakemobius>HOWEVER i just discovered it works if i run from su
21:43<drakemobius>uh let me check, i have a lot of boxes..
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21:44<bumpylight>Ta to brittleness and lrnp.
21:44<drakemobius>it's 2.6.22 with no custom name. 99% change it's vanilla lol
21:44<abrotman>drakemobius: cat /proc/version .. show us
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21:45<drakemobius>Linux version 2.6.22 ( (gcc version 3.3.5 (Debian 1:3.3.5-13)) #3 SMP Thu Sep 6 19:15:15 EDT 2007
21:46<drakemobius>aaanyway the severity of the issue has passed, since it works under root (just not sudo)
21:46<drakemobius>i will troubleshoot some other time when i have less pressing issues...thanks for your help
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21:47<abrotman>that's not a debian kernel
21:47<abrotman>unless it's maybe a kernel
21:48<Txt-file>the nvidia is a very little problem cause I use only the bash at the pc ... at my main pc I have a ATI RadeonHD 2600 Pro (RV630) and I have the feeling that the gpu does nothing. I can't play xmoto (cause low fps) and when I want to watch a video totem needs 30% of my cpu (AMD Athlon 64 X2 5000+)
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21:50<Txt-file>whois Marina
21:51<Txt-file>damn shit ... ever I do any damn shit
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21:53<Txt-file>abrotman, interbird: now I want to setup my gpu correctly that my cpu don't need to do the graphic processing or are 30% cpu-usage while playing a video normal
21:54<Marina>tá falando cmgoo?
21:54<interbird>which one? the nVidia (which you use for console) or the ATI ?
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21:54<Txt-file>interbird: nope .. my ati
21:54<Marina>kisses' :)
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21:55<abrotman>Txt-file: /msg dpkg fglrx one-liner
21:56<interbird>Txt-file: And are you graphical on the ati-box or just in cli like your nvidia ?
21:56<Marina>não estou entendendo!
21:56<Marina>estou saindo tá ?!
21:56<Marina>Beijão ;*
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21:57<Txt-file>interbird: my amd/ati-pc has Debian sid and is installed for daily use
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21:59<Marina>ain não dá mais to saindo beijos té uma próxima
21:59<interbird>Txt-file: i now, but you stated two big problems with graphic-cards, one of them is an nvidia in cli-mode and the other is an ati, correct ?
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22:00<Txt-file>interbird: yeah, right
22:00<interbird>Txt-file: and your amd/ati-pc has Debian on it for daily use ?
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22:01<Txt-file>abrotman: didn't work ... failed to build fglrx-source
22:01<Txt-file>interbird: right
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22:02<Phoul>hey, is there a way to disable the starting of things like evolution-exchange, gnome power manager.
22:02<interbird>Txt-file: Well, if that's your daily system, what is wrong with is then ?
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22:04<Txt-file>interbird: I don't think that everything works correct when a video in totem has lags if I underclock my cpu to 1GHz ... and nothing else is open that has a bigger cpu-usage then 10 %
22:04<Hideo>Phoul: I removed those when I first installed my system, so I'm not sure, but my guess is they start from /etc/rc*
22:04<Hideo>Phoul: use "man update-rc.d"
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22:07<Phoul>They dont start as services
22:07<Phoul>they start when gnome starts
22:07<Txt-file>by the way .. knows anyone how to change the language of the complete system? I don't want german error-messages
22:07<interbird>Txt-file: Maybe you have not chosen the corect videocard to use with Debian -- or you have not chosen the right os for your videocard...
22:08<Hideo>Phoul: ok, in that case I don't know then since I don't use gnome, sry :P
22:09<Txt-file>interbird: damn ... but I don't want to change the cards cause my 2nd (the vidia) is better for gaming
22:09<Hideo>Txt-file: "dpkg-reconfigure locales" ?
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22:09<Txt-file>hideo: thx you
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22:10<interbird>Txt-file: Change te OS ? :-)
22:10<qq>Txt-file: compare lvc /totem
22:11<qq> *vlc /totem
22:11<Hideo>mplayer! =P
22:11<Txt-file>interbird: any recommended
22:12<Txt-file>qq: sure but I don't like vlc very much
22:12<Hideo>Txt-file: I recommend this distro called Debian ;)
22:12<Txt-file>hideo: me too
22:12<qq> "compare" !== use
22:13<interbird>To expect gaming to the fullest on linux (for now) is like to expect ms to go open-source (which will never happen)
22:14<Hideo>tremulous is a pretty decent and addicting game in linux
22:14<Txt-file>interbird .. cause this the pc has a debian minimal and a damn shit (called windoze visda)
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22:16<Txt-file>the problem with gaming is that the most gaming-devs prefer DX instead of OpenGL (, OAL etc)
22:16<qq>Txt-file: i use/prefer vlc for his less resources demanding than totem
22:17<interbird>Yeah; the hardware has been reclaimed... Thanks to Debian and it's derivatives. Software makes the Machine !
22:17<Hideo>qq: don't be sexist, how do you know vlc is not a she? =D
22:18<qq>i just made a presumption ...
22:18<qq>CPU[Pentium III (Katmai) clocked at 448.057 Mhz]
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22:19<newsense>man i hate old computers
22:19<qq>not me...
22:20<Hideo>they are still useful working in a cluster
22:20<newsense>never had such a hard time installing debian in about 8 yrs till today
22:20<Hideo>however the electricity bill will be high
22:20<newsense>still aint installe
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22:20<Txt-file>qq: I like old pcs too cause it is not bad when they break
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22:20<newsense>got one keyboard/mouse/monitor no kvm switch
22:21<qq>Txt-file: never break here
22:21<qq>the newer often ...
22:21<newsense>where do i go to start troubleshooting the problem
22:21<newsense>seems to happen during installing base
22:21<newsense>seems some packages are breaking due to depend issues
22:22<newsense>which is funny since im using the etch netinst.iso and all base depends should be on there
22:22<newsense>hardware issue im thinking
22:22<newsense>maybe disk failure ?
22:22<newsense>either cdrom or hdd
22:22<qq>or memory ?
22:23<Hideo>have you checked to see the install disk wasn't corrupted?
22:23<Txt-file>qq: I have seen some old pcs they have not worked
22:23<newsense>yeah install disk checked out ok
22:23<newsense>took forever
22:23<newsense>ive seen it too unfortunately
22:24<newsense>tried using generic ide driver and disabling fb and selecting low mem sys
22:24<newsense>still nothing
22:24<newsense>made it even worst actually
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22:25<newsense>maybe ill post an ad on under computers saying give me your old box
22:25<interbird>try disabeling dma and acpi and apm; look at kernelsource/Documentation
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22:26<newsense>interbird i will right now brb thanks
22:26<averna>Hi, I'm trying to figure out how to load photos from my new digital camera. I'm running Debian Gnome and a dialogue box comes up to say it detects the camera and should It add photos to my album. Then nothing. Don't think I have an album.
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22:26<newsense>6.4g enough to run slimline system with xfce ?
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22:27<Hideo>newsense: oh yes
22:27<averna>Do I need to add an album, or is it hidden somewhere?
22:27<interbird>averna: Is GPhoto activated or FSpot? -- can yo tell ?
22:27<newsense>cool let me get it up and running, finally getting my brother to try linux and hes not impressed so far lol
22:27<averna>hmm no, I don't know about those.
22:28<averna>Do I need to get them from the synaptic pkg mgr?
22:28<interbird>averna: no
22:28<averna>They should be on Debian already?
22:28<interbird>averna: when you plug in your camera, does it ask for a "roll-name" ?
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22:29<averna>It just says "Would you like to add these pictures to your album?
22:29<interbird>averna: so, what proggie detected your camera?
22:29<averna>then I can ignore or import.
22:30<averna>the box is titled Camera Import
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22:30<interbird>averna: cancel the dialog and try the FSpot-program
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22:31<averna>F-spot. OK. Is it something I need to download?
22:31<interbird>averna: FSpot is what you would want to categorize foto's...
22:31<averna>ok, great. Thanks
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22:32<interbird>averna: open synaptic package manager, search for "spot" and install f-spot
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22:33<newsense>think ill try etchnhalf if disabling dma etc. doesnt work
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22:35<interbird>newsense: you can always track howfar the booting succeeds; so where does it stop ?
22:35<newsense>bout 45% into base install
22:35<newsense>tty4 says depend problems
22:36<newsense>shoulda wrote down exact conflict
22:36<interbird>newsense: what install cd areyou using ?
22:36<newsense>i will if i get it again
22:36<newsense>etch netinst.iso
22:36<newsense>whatever latest is
22:37<qq>is stop or is long ?
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22:37<qq> it*
22:37<interbird>newsense: is this iso up-to-date? (not old?)
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22:37<newsense>definately upto date
22:37<newsense>forgot exact ver
22:37<newsense>4.03 maybe
22:37<newsense>dont remember off hand
22:38<newsense>it is the latest version though
22:38<qq>how much ram ?
22:38<newsense>wouldnt waste your time if i wasnt sure
22:38<newsense>i dont know exactly
22:38<newsense>bios is uninformative
22:38<interbird>newsense: netinst is only valid for the time it was created; maybe download a "fresh" netinst.iso and try again
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22:38<newsense>and i dont know how to check during install from another tty
22:39<Hideo>he said he has the latest one
22:39<newsense>interbird: this is an old computer i doubt support was recently added for it
22:39<qq>newsense: it stop or is long ?
22:39<newsense>dont follow you sorry
22:39<interbird>newsense: what is old, nwesense ?
22:40<newsense>this motherboard ram hdd everything
22:40<qq>a mean
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22:40<newsense>installer aborted
22:41<newsense>said check tty4 and i checked it and it complained about dependency issues
22:41<qq>not normal
22:41<newsense>im thinking i/o error on cdrom or hdd
22:41<qq>me too
22:41<Hideo>newsense: we would need to see that, if you can post that on a paste site, it'd be helpful
22:41<interbird>newsense: did you try to boot knoppix on that machine? it knoppix boots then there is a good chance debian can be installed too; maybe with some boot-tweaking...
22:41<newsense>im gonna do that
22:42<newsense>gonna have to shut down this one
22:42<Hideo>oh, it's the same machine?
22:42<newsense>from installer can i mount a usb drive ?
22:42<newsense>no different machine
22:42<Hideo>should be able to mount a usb drive
22:42<newsense>ok cool brb
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22:42<newsense>thanls btw
22:43<newsense>never thought id be that guy with the install issue
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22:47<divya>hi...good morning.....can anyone guid eme on html and cgi-scripts
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22:48<erKURITA>divya this is not a web development channel
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22:52<timmy_bo1>I'm not on Debian, but I'm curious. Is there a /var/db/pkg/ for installed packages?
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22:53<Hideo>timmy_bo1: there's a /var/lib/dpkg/
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22:54<timmy_bo1>Thank you.
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22:55<Hideo>timmy_bo1: what is /var/db/pkg/ , what distro has it and what usually go in there?
22:55<averna>Thanks for helping with the photos, F-spot works great.
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22:58<interbird>averna: just create a tag and drop it on one or more photo's; i wish my file-system could be categorized like that... (yes i like eas and acl's too)
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23:00<timmy_bo1>Hideo: FreeBSD and Gentoo have /var/db/pkg/
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23:20*pull my finger
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23:30<venger>hey guys, can anyone explain why, when i have "%sudo ALL=NOPASSWD: ALL" set in /etc/sudoers and a user is in the sudo group, but still has to give a password when using sudo?
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23:47<clmaxwell>hello! i have a problem with an nForce onboard NIC -- using forcedeth driver, i see it start as eth0, i configure it normally, but no packets are ever sent
23:48<clmaxwell>dmesg output: forcedeth: reverse engineered nforce ethernet driver. version 0.61 forcedeth 0000:00:0a.0 ifname eth0, PHY OUI ox1374 @ 1, addr [mac]
23:48-!-Holborn [] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal]
23:49<clmaxwell>contents of /etc/network/interfaces: iface eth0 inet static address netmask gateway auto eth0
23:49-!-AbsintheSyringe [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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23:51<clmaxwell>aaaanyone? internet is vital these days, you know :P
23:52<newsense>but look how much of the world is without it
23:52<newsense>cell phones are only access to some
23:52<clmaxwell>it sucks to be them, I guess
23:52<newsense>yeah lmao
23:53<newsense>im a fatcat sittin on my nice connect
23:53*newsense awaits a dos attack
23:54<clmaxwell>mii-tool fails with SIOCGMIIPHY on 'eth0' failed: Op not supported
23:54<clmaxwell>strace of the same reveals ENODEV (no such device)
23:54<clmaxwell>so I guess forcedeth says theres an eth0 but...there isn't?
23:54<clmaxwell>i don't follow.
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---Logclosed Fri Aug 08 00:00:45 2008