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#debian IRC Logs for 2009-01-12

---Logopened Mon Jan 12 00:00:02 2009
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02:00<Supaplex>ouuu lenny has newer nvidia-kernel-source than my ages old backport. 173.14 > 169.09
02:00*Supaplex rolls a fresh backport
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02:09<mike>ughh guys im such a newb -.-
02:10<mike>i finally solved my problem with my video hahah
02:10<mike>turns out vlc and mplayer werent pointed to the correct drivers -.-
02:10<mike>ughh lol
02:10<mike>i feel like
02:10*phorce1 rolls a fresh ... wait, is this a public channel?
02:10<mike>haha keep rolling =D
02:11<mike>so whats new in the land of the debian ?
02:11<goodger>mike: would you explain, please? I have been unable to make vlc do anything for some time
02:11<phorce1>mike: installing mplayer also breaks some of the vlc codecs
02:11<mike>well nah i got it working now
02:11<phorce1>'sup Supaplex
02:11<mike>turns out i wasnt pointing the player at the right drivers
02:12<mike>goodger, what problems are you having with vlc?
02:12<mike>i can walk you trhough my solution and see if does you any good
02:12<goodger>mike: it outputs sound but no video
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02:12<goodger>please do
02:12<mike>goodger, haha same problem i had its using the wrong video driver
02:12<mike>open vlc
02:12<goodger>I have 20 minutes before I have to go to college
02:13<phorce1>vlc will play pretty much anything but .avi files for me. mplayer plays the .avi files. I pretty much just use mplayer for everything now so I don't have to remember keyboard shortcuts for 2 media players
02:13<mike>go into your prefrences
02:13<jm_>mplayer selects the right output device by default
02:13<mike>mine didnt
02:13<mike>i had to point it =D
02:13<mike>but anyway
02:13<mike>goodger prefrences
02:14<mike>click on the advanced option box
02:14<jm_>so what did you have to point it to?
02:14<mike>ok go to video
02:14<mike>and choose the correct video output module
02:14<mike>aka driver =D
02:14<goodger>tried that, none of them work
02:15<mike>even set it as the same in mplayer?
02:15<goodger>mplayer doesn't work either
02:15<jm_>must be some crap card if it can't do Xv
02:15<mike>i pointed mine to the x11
02:15<mike>closed and restarted it
02:15<mike>then it worked
02:15<mike>remember to hit save
02:15<goodger>ah, close and restart?
02:16<goodger>I've just been hitting the back button to reload the file
02:16<mike>well i go off of it liek mplayer
02:16<goodger>closing and restarting doesn't work either
02:16<mike>lol you have to restart the player
02:16<jm_>what's the default for vo in Debian?
02:16<mike>im not sure
02:16<mike>i just selcted the x11 driver
02:17<mike>find out what your using for video out
02:17<mike>and then switch it to that
02:17<goodger>none of them work, I just said
02:17<mike>well have you tried closing and restrting on all of them ?
02:17<mike>ok then
02:17<mike>beats me
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02:17<jm_>goodger: what does mplayer say if you use mplayer -vo x11?
02:17<jm_>goodger: assuming you're testing it in X
02:18<goodger>it says "mplayer: command not found"
02:18<mike>mine is set to gl2 ( x11 with opengl)
02:18<Ouroboros>is there a decent tool that can create complete images for all the standard types of optical discs (data/audio/video CD, data/video DVD...)? i used to think 'dd' did this...apparently not
02:19<goodger>jm_: having installed it, it works
02:19<jm_>goodger: does it work with "-vo xv"?
02:19<jm_>ok so it should work by default
02:20<goodger>VLC's problem seems to be related to reading the video from the file --- under "video -> video track" it has "disabled", which is selected, and "track 1"
02:20<phorce1>Ouroboros: why would dd if=/dev/dvd of=file.iso not work?
02:20<goodger>selecting "track 1" does nothing
02:20<jm_>Ouroboros: cdrdao, cdparanoia, dd
02:21<goodger>and the next time I open the player it's back on "disabled" again
02:21<jm_>goodger: maybe it can't find video codecs
02:21<Ouroboros>phorce1: perhaps it does for DVDs, i am not sure.... it certainly does not work for multi-session CDs
02:21<phorce1>goodger: try playing a .mpg file rather than a .avi file with vlc
02:21<goodger>I will have a look and see if I have any
02:21<mike>goodger, try getting the gstreamer plugins
02:21<goodger>mike: I have all the gstreamer plugins
02:21<goodger>it worked fine until a few months ago
02:21<mike>goodger, hmm
02:22<mike>goodger, i read somewhere about a problem simmilar to yours
02:22<mike>goodger, are you on lenny?
02:22<phorce1>Ouroboros: ahhh, multi-session I hadn't messed with. With the current price of media I just create single session discs regardless of the amount of data I'm putting on them
02:22<goodger>mike: correct
02:22<mike>goodger, i read somewhere that lenny can mess with the libs needed for the codec lemme see if i can link you to how to fix it
02:23<Ouroboros>phorce1: this is true, i am not sure why some of my discs are multi-session... also, arent standard audio CDs multi-session (multi-track?)
02:23<goodger>opening a .mp4 or .divx has the same problem
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02:24<mike>tgoodger, not sure if this is the same problem as yours but hopefully ive been useful here =D
02:24<goodger>mike: thank you very much
02:24<phorce1>Ouroboros: multi-track != multi-session. I think only "special feature" audio CD's are multi-session (those with mixed data/audio tracks)
02:24*goodger dutifully purges dmm
02:24<mike>goodger, you helped me with my audion so no problem and my monitor res haha
02:25<Ouroboros>phorce1: makes sense, obviously i need to research this a little more
02:25<mike>took me days to find out what my problem was -.-
02:25<mike>here i was being a newb and not watching my video output -.-
02:26<phorce1>Ouroboros: have you tried one of the "X" burning frontends like GnomeBaker?
02:26<Ouroboros>not yet, i only tried dd so far (in cygwin at that, argh)
02:26<mike>mow this is going to sound bad but i cant get java installed and i need help with it
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02:27<goodger>mike: the power of christ compels you!
02:27<goodger>the power of christ compels you!
02:27<mike>goodger, did it work ?
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02:28<goodger>mike: still downgrading. synaptic's dependency resolution would be amusing if it wasn't me
02:28<Supaplex>what's the libwfb business in lenny? Is there someway to modify nvidia-kernel-source so it's not needed? (etch backport)
02:28<phorce1>goodger: note that bit on the link mike sent about not being able to transcode with mplayer/mencoder if you "fix" vlc by reverting the libraries
02:29<goodger>phorce1: I'm reverting the libraries
02:29<mike>goodger, phorcel, so wait i may have actually have been helpfull
02:29<goodger>mike: perhaps. give it a minute
02:29<mike>holy fu**ing sh**
02:30<phorce1>goodger: that bit is the reason I just use mplayer for everything. I have some bash scripts I wrote to create .avi files out of directories full of .jpg files using mencoder.
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02:30<mike>i MAY not have been totally useless
02:30<Supaplex>just mostly ;)
02:30<Supaplex>heh heh. jk
02:31<goodger>...nope. you're useless now
02:31<mike>well at least i tried =D
02:31<phorce1>The new Windows version of vlc is pretty nice. Installed it for a customer today who's running an older machine with XP and media-player was completely munching her CPU
02:32<goodger>aha! forgot to rm -rf ~/.vlc
02:32<mike>is it just me or does windows just much your cpu on its own
02:32<goodger>it works!
02:32<goodger>mike: only vista.
02:32<mike>i mean i havent had that problem once on debian
02:32<mike>haha i fixed it
02:32<phorce1>mike: (I told her that the SP3 was going to kill her)
02:32<mike>see now ive officially done my good deed in #debian
02:32<goodger>windows suffers from many, many architectural problems that impede its performance when the CPU is stressed
02:33<mike>phorcel, ive troubleshooted windows for a while
02:33<mike>and do alot of work for friends
02:33<Ouroboros>phorce1: i had some problems with some of the last versions in relation to multiple screens and stream creation, hopefully they fixed these
02:33<mike>it isnt worth the cd or dvd it comes on -.-
02:33<goodger>mike: it's cheaper than a games console
02:34<mike>goodger, depends on which console and shich version of windows =P
02:34<mike>im fine with my supertux on gnome =D
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02:34<phorce1>Ouroboros: I don't currently have a windows machine set up that I can test it on for an extended amount of time so I don't have a clue ;-)
02:34<Ouroboros>you need windows 7... its just hitler :)
02:34<goodger>Ouroboros: best XKCD ever
02:34<Ouroboros>phorce1: eh, i will try it later
02:35<mike>i have a full windows pro and vista ultimate no activation dvd
02:35<goodger>mike: if winXP.price < xbox.price: mike.poke()
02:35*goodger pokes mike hard
02:35<mike>ouch wtf
02:35<mike>damn '
02:35<mike>that hurt
02:35<mike>dude chill
02:35<goodger>now I'm going to college
02:35<Ouroboros>mike: i get them from school free.... running vista now, its not so bad once you make it look like xp :)
02:36<goodger>good morning
02:36<mike>yeah the aero does eat alot of cpu
02:36<mike>but i ran it for a while
02:36<mike>its not that bad
02:36<mike>i still prefer debian
02:36*phorce1 plays solitaire and my Simpson's/James Brown/Barry White customized version of NeverPutt
02:36<Ouroboros>i prefer debian for work
02:36<mike>dude im telling you supertux so owns mario....
02:36<Ouroboros>or anything that required not losing my files :)
02:36*Supaplex reads the lenny release notes (draft)
02:37<goodger>Supaplex: link link link link link link link link
02:37<mike>i thought lenny was realesed allready?
02:38<goodger>mike: nope
02:38<Ouroboros>there is not even a release date yet :/
02:38<goodger>there won't be a release date announced until the day after the release, if it's anything like etch was
02:38<mike>im so new to debian its not funny
02:38<goodger>(I wasn't around for sarge)
02:38*phorce1 gives up on designing a new form for a hazardous materials transport company. This is *SO* not worth a $35 design fee.
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02:39<mike>"we transport your shit! literally!"
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02:39<Supaplex>goodger: topic: etch->lenny
02:39<goodger>mike: sewage isn't hazardous. think "freon" or "nucular waste"
02:39<goodger>Supaplex: cheers
02:39<Ouroboros>goodger: interestingly, the sarge security repositories have already been disabled for months... so doesnt that mean lenny was release ;-
02:40<mike>hmm they keep it in trucks that say hazardous
02:40<phorce1>I'm just not good enough with Oo Writer --- (propane transport actually)
02:40<goodger>Ouroboros: isn't it just on a timer?
02:40<Ouroboros>goodger: i thought it was supposed to go away when a new one comes out... maybe i was wrong
02:40<mike>are there still people running sarge?
02:41<Ouroboros>mike: i had 1 package from it
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02:41<mike>hmm maybe ill muck around and get my wireless card working
02:41<phorce1>Ouroboros: no, they just (sort of) froze lenny as the next release candidate. Doesn't seem like a REAL hard freeze like they did for etch, but, frozen.
02:41<mike>i though people were running lenny allready ?
02:42<mike>im confused
02:42<goodger>mike: etch is only 18 months old... many server admins update their servers in multi-year cycles because it's difficult work
02:42<Aaron_I>is there an official/unofficial Debian forums?
02:42<phorce1>mike: many are
02:42<goodger>mike: many people are. ask people here about using testing as a rolling release... I'm going to college
02:42<goodger>good morning
02:42<Ouroboros>mike: there is oldstable/stable/testing/unstable ... some people run each of these, even some older releases
02:42<phorce1>goodger: you've been leaving for 20 minutes ;-)
02:42<goodger>phorce1: quiet, you
02:43<mike>ok so when they release will it still be an unstable release or stable?
02:43<Ouroboros>it will go testing->stable
02:43<mike>ahhh i see
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02:43<mike>when it hits that ill update
02:43<Supaplex>a new testing will replace it, unstable stays as-is
02:43<Ouroboros>everything just shifts by one, and something becomes the new unstable
02:43<mike>i dont wanna be old
02:43<Supaplex>well, sid's always in flux. :)
02:43<phorce1>mike: lenny is "testing", it will go to "stable" ----- sid will always be "unstable"
02:44<mike>why do they consider it "unstable"?
02:44<Supaplex>it's not proven
02:44<Ouroboros>what is the reason for so many security releases for etch lately? or this a normal amount
02:44<phorce1>mike: run it for a while and you'll find out
02:44<mike>if it survives me for a week its proven =D
02:44<mike>nah i dont wanna kill my computer haha
02:44<Supaplex>mike: that's pretty much amounts to testing :)
02:45<mike>eh i like etch so far
02:45<mike>but if lenny goes stable ill be in here asking how to upgrade haha
02:45<Ouroboros>mike: apt-get dist-upgrade?
02:45<mike>well im sorry i said i was new haha
02:45<phorce1>testing is actually quite stable normally. Only when something in "unstable" causes something like massive library upgrades does "testing" get a bit twitchy.
02:45<Ouroboros>it might work, i dont know
02:46<chealer>Aaron_I: yeah, there's that one. there is no official forum.
02:46<mike>i mean ive run various different types of linux over the paste few years
02:46<mike>i liek knoppix and ubuntu
02:46<Aaron_I>thank ya
02:46<mike>but when i hit debian i found home
02:46<phorce1>new additions to testing have to run without major bug reports for 10 days minimum in "unstable" before they are considered for a move into "testing"
02:46<mike>so much so i got rid of windows completely
02:46<blarson>For upgrade instructions between releases, read the installation notes.
02:46<Ouroboros>mike: i am curious, you are going from ubuntu to debian?
02:47<mike>last i ran was ubuntu yes
02:47<Ouroboros>usually it is the opposite
02:47<mike>i like debian better
02:47<mike>people told me to cut my teeth on ubuntu
02:47<mike>but i just jumped right into etch
02:48<mike>and so far ive been able to work everything out with a little reading
02:48<Ouroboros>etch should pretty much just work perfectly
02:48<mike>ehh things like soundcard not working
02:48-!-S_WO is now known as swo
02:48<mike>no wireless
02:48<mike>no flash
02:48<goodger>ubuntu is the same, but with more bugs and a few badly-executed hacks masquerading as usability improvements
02:48<mike>no java
02:48<Ouroboros>mike: err ok, i mostly run servers, some of those desktop features can be tricky
02:48<goodger>(I really am going now. see you all later)
02:49<mike>see yah goodger
02:49<mike>eh wireless was easy on ubuntu
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02:49<mike>i dont liek using ndiswrapper
02:49<Ouroboros>mike: flash should be easy
02:49<mike>there restricted hardware wizard made things a breeze
02:49<mike>i got flash
02:49<mike>and sound
02:49<mike>just no java or wireless yet
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02:49<Ouroboros>java should be easy too
02:49<Ouroboros>wireless i dont know about
02:49<jm_>debian has java
02:50<mike>it doesnt seem to work for me
02:50<jm_>!doesn't work
02:50<dpkg>Look buddy, "doesn't work" is a vague statement. Does it sit on the couch all day long? Does it procrastinate doing the dishes? Does it beg on the street for change? Please be specific! Define 'it' and what it isn't doing. Give us more details so we can help you without needing to ask basic questions like "what's the error message".
02:50<mike>i have it installed btu whenever i try to install liek limewire or visit a site that uses the jre
02:50<mike>it says its not installed -.-
02:51<mike>care to walk me through this ?
02:51<Ouroboros>mike: probably just need a path setting?
02:51<jm_>did you install sun-java<foo>-plugin
02:51<mike>in the package manager>
02:51<mike>lemme see
02:51<jm_>dpkg -l|grep sun-java
02:51<dpkg>parse error: dunno what the heck you're talking about, jm_
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02:51<mike>i have no plugin listed....
02:52<mike>just the java package
02:52<mike>and yes that installed
02:52<jm_>but you have jre/jdk listed?
02:52<mike>but still no jre
02:52<mike>umm im not sure
02:52<jm_>paste the output of the above ocmmand on a pastebin site
02:52<Ouroboros>mike: did you try this: dpkg -l|grep sun-java
02:52<mike>obvioully not if limewire wont install
02:53<mike>no output
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02:53<jm_>ok, apt-get install sun-java6-plugin
02:53<jm_>or aptitude or whatever you're using to install packages
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02:54<Ouroboros>mike: apt-cache search sun-java6
02:54<mike>says it couldnt find the pluggin..
02:55<jm_>then you don't have non-free repository in sources.list
02:55<mike>lol what was the name of the backports one?
02:55<jm_>are you using etch?
02:55<jm_>ok in that case it would be sun-java5-plugin
02:55<mike>and the location of the soruces.list
02:55<jm_>so install that instead
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02:56<mike>still nothing
02:56<mike>E: Couldn't find package sun-java5-plugin
02:56<Ouroboros>jm_: wait, is there sun-java in etch?
02:57<mike>haha i thought it was a non-free plugin
02:57<mike>liek flash
02:57<jm_>then check /etc/apt/sources.list - does it mention non-free?
02:57<jm_>Ouroboros: yes
02:57<Ouroboros>oh yeah
02:57<mike>no it doesnt cause i havent added it yet =D
02:58<jm_>so add it, also add contrib
02:58<Ouroboros>sorry, i havent installed java in a while :)
02:58<mike>could you give me what to post haha i dont quite remember
02:58<mike>did it once before but on my dads comp
02:58<jm_>add " contrib non-free" after main, without quotes
02:59<jm_>poor dad
02:59<Ouroboros>mike: this site might be useful to you:
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02:59<mike>haha no his works fine
02:59<mike>im not bad at this
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02:59<mike>just need some direction
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03:00<mike>deb etch/updates main contrib non-free ?
03:00<Ouroboros>no to the other line
03:00<jm_>no, you need to update the regular entry
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03:00<Ouroboros>probably both actually, no?:
03:00<mike>the other one is the same with the acception of src added to the front
03:01<jm_>you only have that?
03:01<jm_>you need an entry for regular Debian mirror
03:01<mike>ill brb bathroom
03:01<Ouroboros>deb <your mirror here> etch main contrib non-free
03:03<mike>lol i dont know my mirror Xd
03:03<jm_>where are you from?
03:03<Ouroboros>this should have been set up during the install, not sure why you dont have it
03:03<jm_>Ouroboros: no networking probably
03:03<mike>philadelphia pa
03:03<Ouroboros>ah yes
03:04<mike>nah did it with networking
03:04<mike>i remember selecting a mirror then
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03:04<jm_>try deb etch main contrib non-free
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03:04<mike>should i add one with out the non free aswell ?
03:04<Ouroboros>i use
03:05<jm_>then you need to use update with apt and then install java
03:05<mike>ok lets try this guyd
03:05<jm_>no, it's all on one line, it has main, contrib and non-free as you can see
03:05<Ouroboros>mike: that line adds all three sections
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03:05<jm_>you can update security entry later
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03:05<mike>ok updated
03:06<mike>so run the java5-plugin command?
03:06<mike>5 lol 6 doesnt work =P
03:07<mike>ok so its downloading it
03:07<Ouroboros>ah yeah, 6 is not in etch
03:07<mike>thanks much gentlemen
03:07<mike>ohh fancy eula prompt
03:07<jm_>wireless should be easy now that it's working
03:08<gsimmons>mike: Regarding wireless, what device do you have? (eg. brand/model, revision if known)
03:08<mike>its a broadcom chipset
03:08<jm_>now that's useful :P
03:08<mike>im gonna try to use the bcmxxcutter
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03:08<mike>it registers as a dell mini
03:08<jm_>lspci shall tell you
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03:09<mike>kk gimme a min
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03:09<mike>05:00.0 Network controller: Broadcom Corporation Dell Wireless 1390 WLAN Mini-PCI Card (rev 01)
03:09<mike>^that one =D
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03:09<gsimmons>mike: Probably a BCM4311. Run "update-pciids", then lspci again to confirm.
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03:10<mike>05:00.0 Network controller: Broadcom Corporation BCM4311 802.11b/g WLAN (rev 01)
03:10<mike>wow nice call
03:11<mike>like i said ive had it working on ubuntu but only because of the restricted hardware wizard
03:11<mike>and bcmxxcutter
03:11<gsimmons>mike: Yep. This isn't suported by the bcm43xx driver in Etch's 2.6.18 kernel. You'll need to use the b43 driver, which is available in "Etch-and-a-half" kernels (2.6.24) or etch-backports (2.62.26). Refer to the wiki.
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03:13<Ouroboros>jm_: cdrdao and cdparanoia seem to be only for audio... anything that will work for multi-session data discs?
03:13<jm_>Ouroboros: they can do data tracks too
03:13<mike>ok so im going to add this non-free and download the firmware and use the bcm43xxcutter to do the work
03:13<mike>thats easy enough =D
03:13<mike>i hate ndiswrapper..
03:14<jm_>you already have non-free
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03:15<gsimmons>mike: You also need to use b43-fwcutter, not bcm43xx-fwcutter.
03:16<mike>hmm im just going by what it says here
03:16<mike>and thnk you much for the help
03:16<mike>saving me much of a head ache later lol
03:16<Ouroboros>jm_: lets say i use cdrdao on a single-session data CD, is the data.bin that it produces a standard ISO image that i can mount with something?
03:18<mike>ok so far ive followed it
03:18<jm_>Ouroboros: no, you need cdemu to mount it
03:18<mike>and i ran iwconfig
03:18<mike>and it says no wireless extensions?
03:18<jm_>Ouroboros: actually it might be ISO9660 image, depending on mode used
03:19<gsimmons>mike: Did you install a new kernel image? Again, the bcm43xx driver will not support your device.
03:19<Ouroboros>jm_: if it is not ISO then it is a cue/bin type thing? i guess either will work
03:20<mike>followed the page to the t =/
03:20<jm_>Ouroboros: cue/bin can be used for mode1 images too, and that will be mountable without cdemu, for mode2 you can use cdemu
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03:20<gsimmons>mike: You are following the "b43 and b43legacy section", right?
03:21<gsimmons>mike: Did you install a new kernel image? Have you restarted your system to boot into kernel 2.6.24?
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03:22<mike>ok let me reboot ill brb
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03:24<Ouroboros>jm_: any reason to use cdparanoia instead of cdrdao besides possibly better audio error checking?
03:25<Ouroboros>(i never realized there were problems reading audio tracks as data)
03:25<jm_>Ouroboros: I've always used cdparanoia for audio CD-s, and cdrdao for everything else
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03:26<mike>kk rebooted
03:26<Ouroboros>is audio data not ECC-protected or something? why is it difficult to get an error-free copy?
03:26<Ouroboros>ECC/CRC whatever
03:26<jm_>Ouroboros: it is, but it has far less redundancy bits
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03:27<jm_>2048 (mode1) vs 2352 (mode2) bits
03:27<Ouroboros>from these man pages it seems like in some cases it cant even detect that there was an error
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03:28<jm_>yeah, I was amazed when I realiased how this was designed ;)
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03:33<Ouroboros>jm_: only cdrdao con copy data sessions, no? so for a mixed CD i would ideally want to rip the audio part with cdparanoia and the rest with cdrdao
03:33<jm_>Ouroboros: but cdrdao can do audio too
03:34<sarathms>how can i format a pendrive in debain?
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03:35<Ouroboros>hmm, this is quite the mess, i guess i will deal with my data discs first, hopefully by the time i am done i will have enough experience to attempt audio
03:35<knoppix_>op knoppix_
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03:35<Guest71>!op Guest71
03:36<Guest71>#join ubuntu
03:37<Guest71>#join dd
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03:37<Ouroboros>jm_: do any of these considerations apply to VCD/SVCD/video DVD, or are those more like data CDs
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03:40<jm_>Ouroboros: vcd/svcd are typically mode2, so it would be similar to audio - video dvd-s are iso9660 or udf or mixed iso9660/udf
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03:44<Ouroboros>jm_: so something like cdrdao --read-raw should work for VCD/SVCD, and dd should work for DVDs
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03:46<Ouroboros>well thanks for the help, this was very informative
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03:46<jm_>Ouroboros: yup, vobcopy is great for video DVD-s to remove copy protection while copying
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03:47<Ouroboros>i dont think i need that since all of these were burned by me
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03:47<Ouroboros>if you havent figured out, i am trying to liquidate all of my remaining discs
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03:49<Ouroboros>considering all this crap probably fits on 1-2 500 GB drives, no sense in keeping spindles around
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03:50<jm_>that's a good option if you don't have too many discs
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03:52<Ouroboros>of course optical discs are scaling in size also (see BluRay) so thit is not entirely practical... luckily most of my stuff is still CD-sized
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03:52<jm_>yeah but bluray media is horribly expensive
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03:52<jm_>medium even
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03:52<Ouroboros>i mean, if you wanted to store HD movies, you would need some massive drives
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03:53<jm_>but I just calculated and disks are only 1.7 times more expensive here
03:54<Ouroboros>yeah its pretty rediculous
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03:55<Ouroboros>on other hand, audio and video have intrinsic maximum quality (based on human perception), so there won't necessarily be indefinite scaling
03:56<Ouroboros>e.g., for a single track you dont need more than x bits and y Hz
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03:57<Ouroboros>of course, at some point there will be 3D video and we will be royally screwed
03:57<Ouroboros>or just various multi-channel / larger screen technologies
03:57<jm_>like 3d porn with nvidia glasses ;)
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03:59<Ouroboros>i like this thing:
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04:02<Ouroboros>jm_: what is the technology in those glasses?
04:02<Ouroboros>ah shutters
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04:07<jm_>good night
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04:24<anton>Do I need to call my /etc/init.d/... script in a postinst to restart the service in my package? or will dpkg handle that automatically for me?
04:24<jm_>anton: no, you need to do it
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04:26<anton>is there a preferred way to call it? or just the usual /etc/init.d/service restart?
04:27<jm_>you should use invoke-rc.d
04:27<anton>thanks jm_
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04:29<jm_>anton: check the examples and do it that way
04:30<anton>jm_ examples? (am looking at the manpage)
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04:31<jm_>anton: ohh I meant postinst examples
04:31<anton>oh right - nm guide?
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04:33<jm_>or just look at some existing script,will be faster
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04:36<anton>thanks - thought the must be a page in policy - have a script, but probably not the best one..
04:40<anton>hmm - looks like dh_installinit is already doing it for me...
04:40<jm_>ahh indeed, nice stuff
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04:44<everettz>Looking for a howto on setting the standard installer to NetConsole mode so that I can perform an install via ssh.
04:45<jm_>you mean to have it start ssh daemon?
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04:45<jm_>I thought I have you a link explaining how to do it last week
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05:03*Supaplex rolls back to nvidia 169 series
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05:05<OdyX>dpkg hit me
05:05*dpkg kicks odyx.
05:05<OdyX>thanks dpkg.
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05:09<freeman2411>Can someone help to write a shell script?
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05:12<freeman2411>I need a shell script which self destructs the linux system in case of an emergenca
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05:13<freeman2411>could someone help me please
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05:14<petemc>freeman2411: computers generally dont offer a self destruct facility
05:14<freeman2411>:-( I know that is the problem
05:15<petemc>its not a problem for most people
05:15<Gekz>freeman2411: you could just type rm -rf / in case of emergency
05:15<Gekz>freeman2411: and if you need it all permanently and securely removed, shred /dev/sda
05:16<Supaplex>or store it encrypted in the first place.
05:17<Gekz>that too
05:17<freeman2411>yeah gode idea but I would need also a trigger for it to use it via e-mail
05:17<Gekz>freeman2411: are you involved in illegal activities by any chance
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05:17<Supaplex>my suggestion would simply require shutdown. you'd have to renter the pass phrase on boot up
05:17<Supaplex>he's parnoid, but they're still out to get him
05:18*Supaplex has sudden unexplained shooting pains from two toes
05:18<Gekz>the NSA
05:18<jm_>via email? procmail-lib offers recipes to deal with that
05:18<freeman2411>procmail-lib really that would work
05:19<Supaplex>and there's an i2c library for thermite detination
05:19<Supaplex>HAH! not.
05:19<freeman2411>I want to use it for experimental things
05:19<freeman2411>for test computer
05:19<themill>Dell offer a "formatting your data remotely" service. See and replies in the next issue.
05:19<freeman2411>only an idea
05:19<themill>in particular
05:20<sander_m>Hi. I want to do SSL client certificate validation on Apache. Where can I find all the certificates for CACert, VeriSign, Thawte, etcetera so Apache can verify the client certificates? Google is no help here. All it show me is tutorials that have people create theit own CA server certificates.
05:20<teo>xdcc send #41
05:20<themill>teo: don't do that
05:21<Supaplex>!tell sander_m -about search
05:21<Supaplex>(and no, it's not just a google search factoid)
05:22<themill>sander_m: "locate cacert" or "apt-file search cacert" should give you some ideas.
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05:24<OdyX>dpkg thank me
05:24<dpkg>OdyX: no worries
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05:29<sander_m>themill: I found them, thanks.
05:31<sander_m>Now I have another problem. I am using mod_gnutls instead of mod_ssl (so I can have multiple virtual hosts). I set "GnuTLSClientCAFile /etc/ssl/certs/ca-certificates.crt" but I get the error "GnuTLS: Failed to load Client CA File '/etc/ssl/certs/ca-certificates.crt': (-51) The given memory buffer is too short to hold parameters."
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05:51<Web-sidux436>hello, i have installed postfix and courier. Now postfix uses mbox and courier uses maildir. What should i use? IF i use mbox - does courier support mbox, if yes, how can change it?
05:52<weasel>I'd recommend dovecot
05:53<weasel>dovecot can use both mbox and maildir. so can postfix btw.
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05:55<Web-sidux436>ok good than i will use dovecot. Next question: can i specify a path to maildir?
05:55<weasel>read the fine documentation :)
05:56<petern>yes you can
05:56<Web-sidux436>i have read the one from courier and it looks confusing and strange
05:56<Web-sidux436>or what is better maildir, or mbox?
05:57<Web-sidux436>and why?
05:57<Web-sidux436>k from seeing as human maildir looks nicer...
05:58<weasel>maildir doesn't require rewriting all mails just because you delete one.
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06:02<stuckey>Does anyone know that command to make the x server refresh? You know, like if you run a programand it corrupts the display so that you've black squares everywhere?
06:03<jm_>try xrefresh
06:03<stuckey>Thanks jm_
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06:05<peej>I've got etch, etchnhalf and bpo kernel. Trying to get an rtl8180 pcmcia card running on it. Recommendations? I had it running on sarge from a source compilation.
06:05<peej>supposedly rtl8180 runs on bpo, (mainline kernel) but no idea how to continue.
06:06<gsimmons>peej: See
06:07<peej>gsimmons: yup, now, the problem is the machine I'm installing on to has no connection other than usb. Suggestions ?
06:07<peej>it's booting cleanly, just no blinkenlights on pccard at any stage.
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06:09<gsimmons>peej: I'm sorry, you have a bpo kernel already installed, or you require one to be?
06:09<peej>"Once your sources are configured:" -- a more appropriate question maybe: how do I get that onto the usb-only box?
06:09<peej>gsimmons, : I transferrd the bpo kernel onto the box already with a dpkg -i
06:10<peej>now I'm wondering about what to do now.
06:10<peej>to get the rtl8180 on pccard running.
06:11<peej>I was hoping a mere modprobe rtl8180 would do it or something. No such luck
06:12<gsimmons>peej: What does "uname -r" return?
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06:13<gsimmons>peej: Do you have the 'pcmciautils' package installed?
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06:14<peej>nope. Install?
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06:15<gsimmons>peej: It would be preferable.
06:15*peej usb juggles...
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06:17<peej>btw, if I install hotplug, will my old sarge kernel work with the etch packages (I did a dist upgrade)?
06:17<peej>(hotplug overwrites udev stuff)
06:19<jm_>doesn't it conflict udev? therefore not recommended
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06:20<peej>conflicts, yes.
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06:21<peej>gsimmons: ok, pcmciautils 014-3 is up. Now what?
06:22<peej>ooh. wireless-tools package too I guess.
06:22*peej juggles some more
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06:24<peej>wireless-tools is up too.
06:25<peej><windows mode>rebooting</windows mode>
06:27<peej>nope, no blinkenlights
06:27<gsimmons>peej: Hmm. Is your device listed in lspci?
06:27<peej>oh, hang on, I didn't have the card in properly.
06:28<peej>reboots again...
06:29<peej>ah. proble of 000:01:00.0 failed with error -16
06:30<peej>(cannot obtain pci resources)
06:30<peej>ounable to reserve i/o region #1:100@1000 for device 000:0100.0 whatever that means.
06:31<peej>and the system hung when setting system clock.
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06:32<peej>well, not quite hung. I can type crap in and it displays. Doesn't act on it though.
06:32<peej>oh... loading device-mapper support message...
06:33<peej>ground to a halt again.
06:33<peej>how irritating.
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06:39<peej>some kind of kernel problem. Should I have installed the bport kernel with just a dpkg -i ? And no other packages?
06:40<jm_>people had reported weird problems with recent kernels where the thing would stall unless they were typing on the keyboard or somesuch
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06:41<peej>heh, well, this bpo kernel stalls even though I type stuff..
06:41<peej>probably something to do with the weirdo box I'm using.
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06:42<jm_>maybe try the regular known to help boot options
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06:42<jm_>(to disable acpi, apic, lapic, mmiconf)
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06:42<peej>jm_ : like? (just a list of words to look up)
06:42<peej>oh, how strange. it's booting now.
06:42<peej>(after a hard reboot)
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06:43<peej>but still no blinkenlights on the pccard
06:44<tuxcrafter>hi all does debian have something like ibsh iron bar shell somehwer
06:44<tuxcrafter>i cant find it
06:44<tuxcrafter>i want to create a user for only ssh tunneling
06:44<peej>lspci: cardbus bridge, : ricoh rl5c475 (rev 80)
06:44<tuxcrafter>so i thought i make a new user and make it shell ibsh
06:44<tuxcrafter>but i cant find ibsh on my system
06:45<peej>whoops. I'm back in 2.6.18 kernel at the moment.
06:46<peej>argh. Off to lunch. Thanks for inputs guys. Feel free to add more, I'll scroll back and look.
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06:51<themill>tuxcrafter: perhaps the rssh package does what you want?
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06:53<tuxcrafter>themill: checking it out
06:53<tuxcrafter>it seems usign shell /bin/false also allows for ssh tunneling
06:53<tuxcrafter>and then my server whent down ...
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06:55*tuxcrafter instable sshfs when having heavy bandwidth ...
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06:55<jm_>there's also scponly
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07:02<Web-sidux436>what is nicer? put maildir into the users home dir, or put it somewhere in /var ?
07:02<tuxcrafter>themill: jm_ thanks for the hints
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07:10<peej>Web-sidux436 : home I'd say. easier to migrate.
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07:14<sander_m>Does anyone know anything about Apache+mod_gnutls? I cannot get client certificate validation to work. It's driving me nuts!
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07:17<parasense>hello, im getting the following two lines in my xorg.0.log
07:17<parasense>(==) Using config file: "/etc/X11/xorg.conf.failsafe"
07:17<parasense>(==) No Layout section. Using the first Screen section.
07:18<parasense>how can i make it read the file and not ignore i?
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07:20<jm_>what do you mean? according to the above it is reading a file
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07:21<parasense>it looks like it falls back on some sort of default settings
07:21<jm_>that's how it's handled nowadays - autodetection
07:22<parasense>running with framebuffer so the display is not having the drivers it should need ( this is what i understand)
07:22<parasense>well, in this situation it cant detect my second display
07:22<jm_>you can create config file by hand and it will use it
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07:23<parasense>this is a config file from my ubuntu 8.04, shouldnt it work on 8.10 too?
07:23<jm_>you should ask in ubuntu related IRC channels, this is for Debian
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07:23<stuckey>Does anyone know when Lenny is set to go stable?
07:24<szymon_g>i've got a (possibly silly) question: how to create initrd file in debian lenny (after 'traditional' kernel compilation)?
07:24<parasense>doesnt debian use xorg too?
07:24<szymon_g>parasense: it use xorg
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07:24<jm_>szymon_g: you can use mkinitramfs or mkinitrd or yaird, but custom compiled kernels often don't need initrd usually
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07:28<noneo>Hi all. How to avoid post installation scripts?
07:28<jm_>you can't
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07:29<noneo>jm_: Thx :-)
07:29<jm_>noneo: why would you want it?
07:29<noneo>jm_: My friend, Gentoo fan asked about it.
07:30<noneo>He wanted to install on Debian ldap package without modifying pam files.
07:31<jm_>those should be marked as such and dpkg would ask you if you want to modify them
07:31<jm_>that is, as configuration files
07:32<noneo>"-pvalue/--priority=value" ?
07:32<jm_>that's for debconf only
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07:33<szymon_g>hm... dpkg gives no possibility to avoid postinstall scripts?
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07:34<jm_>not directly no
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07:40<imagandi>hello tehere can some one help with the permissions of one fat32 partition
07:40<imagandi>when i makee sudo chmod 777 /mnt/sda5
07:40<imagandi>nothing happend
07:40<jm_>fat32 doesn't have permissions
07:40<imagandi>... thats strange
07:40<jm_>!tell imagandi -about vfatrw
07:40<imagandi>why then i can't create folders in it via this user
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07:42<imagandi>/dev/sda5 /mnt/sda5 vfat defaults,uid=777,umask=000 0 0
07:42<imagandi>jm_, how about that ?
07:42<imagandi>it will make the parttition acseesible for all users ok ?
07:43<jm_>imagandi: it will make it writable by everyone, are you sure you want to do that?
07:43<imagandi>or can you just tell me where i can find my uid ?
07:43<imagandi>jm_ this partitiion is one my private eee pc i think there will be no problem
07:43<jm_>uhm `id' command tells you your id (please don't ask yes/no questions)
07:43<imagandi>or i am wrong ?
07:43<jm_>imagandi: ok then
07:44<imagandi> :) can i as one more what is umask
07:44<imagandi>i know that 000 means all users
07:44<dpkg>The umask or user mask is the set of permissions which are *not* set on files and directories that are created with a default set of permissions. For example, a umask of 0022; would mean that files would be created with 644 permissions by default, directories with 755. help umask; or man 2 umask and info coreutils 'File Permissions'; for further details. (You may have to install manpages-dev if you don't have the umask manpa
07:45<imagandi>jm_, :) thx i think i will can maintain it now
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07:48<jm_>imagandi: no problem
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07:49<averule>hi to debain installer how to add by default local reposity path in mirrorlist of netinstallation
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07:50<imagandi>sources.list maybe
07:51<averule>imagandi, no in source of d-i->choose-mirror packages it is taking ISO codes from iso-3166-udeb
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07:52<jm_>averule: preseeding
07:52<averule>but i am not getting from which it is fetching mirror path for that iso code of country?
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07:53<averule>jm_:preseeding will give force fully install from local repo
07:53<imagandi>averule, just trying
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07:53<imagandi>jm_, am i stupid or what i add this
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07:53<imagandi>/dev/sda5 /mnt/sda5 vfat defaults,uid=1000,umask=000 0 0
07:53<averule>jm_i like to give both local repo as well debian repo mirror path
07:53<imagandi>and i still can make folders in it
07:53<imagandi>and i still cant make folders in it
07:54<metjuf>hi does anybody can help me ? i need to install nvidia driver for graphic akceleration
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07:54<deavid>echo "something" /dev/lp0 (and printer isn't conected) echo will wait until I connect the printer. ¿There is a way to timeout that after a few seconds?
07:54<deavid>echo "something" > /dev/lp0
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07:55<jm_>averule: you mean it doesn't allow you to set two or more?
07:55<metjuf>i downloaded but instalator need some kernel-source files ...
07:56<jm_>metjuf: don't do that, read about it in the wiki
07:56<dpkg>To use an NVIDIA graphics card with Debian, see If you've done it before, asking me about <nvidia pre-built> or <nvidia m-a> might work (if you're using a GeForce 2 or older, ask me about <nvidia_legacy>). drivers (ie. <nvidia-installer>) are _not_ supported in #debian, please go to #nvidia (
07:56<averule>jm_ normally it comes nearer country repository list or can do with manually
07:56<averule>net installation
07:57<jm_>averule: yes, it lets you choose mirror manually
07:57<averule>jm_ : whatever i am giving manually that i like to keep in list by default it self
07:57<averule>so what i have to customize
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07:58<jm_>averule: I don't understand what you want to do
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08:00<averule>jm_ : editing choose-mirror udeb such that it as well contain my local repository name..
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08:07<jm_>averule: I suppose you'll have to rebuild choose-mirror package
08:08<averule>jm_yes you are correct but like searching of iso code of country it uses iso-code but i am not abl to find out what is package for country mirror path
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08:08<dpkg>i heard debian mirrors is or | ask me about <apt-spy> or <netselect-apt> | to make a mirror, see or
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08:10<jm_>averule: is this part of d-i source code?
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08:11<averule>jm_: choose-mirror is part of d-i...
08:12<jm_>averule: hmm it requires svn to get sources, don't have that here
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08:14<insomniac077>Pulse Check....
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08:23<insomniac077>Is this where the party is? ......?
08:26<metalqga>you aren't invited!
08:27<insomniac077>that's just wrong.... :'( lol
08:27<metalqga>oh ok, apt-get install ice-cold six pack @ insomniac077
08:30<averule>jm_ i have created amd64 .iso but in qemu it gives error as kernel requires x86-64 arch. i am having amd64 itself
08:30<averule>but after writing in cd it works
08:31<jm_>averule: check what `dpkg --print-architecture' says
08:31<averule>is it possible to test in qemu itself by solving this error
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08:31<averule>jm_ amd64
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08:35<insomniac077>we havning fun yet?
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08:35<jm_>averule: hmm I only ever used it with 32bit, but it does say it supports x86_64
08:37<averule>jm_ it says that only detected an i686 CPU
08:37<averule>even my system is amd64
08:38<jm_>averule: are you sure the kernel on CD is 64bit?
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08:38<jm_>averule: btw I found you can add up to 9 local mirrors with pre-seeding
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08:39<dpkg>somebody said rc was Release-critical, or Release Candidate
08:40<averule>jm_, yes i am having amd64 kernel..
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08:43<averule>jm_ is it possible to force to user to enter password more than 6 char at installation time as well
08:43<enouf>jm_: not sure if you know, or if relevant, but averule is rerolling his own ISO, it's not a pure Debian one
08:44<jm_>enouf: yeah but he's using d-i
08:44<enouf>AFAIK, (from yesterday's convo)
08:44<enouf>jm_: right - i guess i meant installer, not ISO
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08:44<metalqga>averule I hate this restriction min 6 char password
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08:45<averule>metalqga, but it is good habbit
08:45<metalqga>(most cats are called with 4charred names :P )
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08:45<jm_>averule: I doubt
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08:46<averule>metalqga, to have more powerful, password length should be big is good
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08:48<metalqga>also use cyrillic in it
08:48<averule>jm_,enouf .i am using d-i,lenny repository. i am creating iso because of intrest without changing any .deb
08:48<averule>just making changes in d-i
08:49<averule>so that i can learn how it works
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08:52<Halitech>hello, wondering if anyone knows of a good tutorial for using a debian system as a PXE server to install windows on a laptop that can boot from floppy but the cdrom is dead and the usb cdrom is not bootable in the bios
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08:53<Halitech>the usb cdrom is working in windows but not working when trying to boot from floppy even following info on for usb boot
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08:53<averule>metalqga, cyrillic in d-i ,how to use it?
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08:54<metalqga>dunno just thought two alphabets are more difficult to brute force
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08:54<Alcap>hey there
08:54<Alcap>does anyone know if it's possible to open an app for another user?
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08:55<jm_>Alcap: no, not anyone does
08:55<Alcap>crap :(
08:56<metalqga>login in shell (you will have to know the pass) then execute the app
08:56<jm_>but some people might know, and maybe they will answer if you don't ask yes/no questions
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08:56<Alcap>jm_ do you know how to do this?
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08:57<enouf>Halitech: try SBM on floppy and load a CD from there if needed - - docs also in debian-installer ISO
08:57<jm_>Alcap: yes
08:57<jm_>enouf: dos SBM support USB CD-ROM drives?
08:57<Alcap>then explain xD
08:58<enouf>jm_: not sure offhand
08:58<jm_>Alcap: explain what you are trying to do
08:59<Alcap>I want to open an app
08:59<Alcap>with my uid
08:59<Alcap>and then send it to another user so that he/she can work on it
08:59<enouf>Halitech: hrm .. you might want to try some memdisk usage (see and/or the various grub ones, grub4dos, supergrub disk, etc
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09:00<enouf>or, roll an ISO with using floppy emulation mode even
09:00<jm_>Alcap: X app?
09:01<Alcap>otherwise screen would be an epic win
09:01<Halitech>enouf, ok, will take a look and see what I can find out on those links
09:04<jm_>in that case you'd need to use something like xmove, vnc, freenx and then there's another thing to detach x11 apps
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09:05<Alcap>jm_, I have a freenx server
09:05<Alcap>the problem is that
09:06<Alcap>to do what I want to do with the computer
09:06<Alcap>I must use the shadow option
09:06<Alcap>and it's unbelievably slow
09:06<Alcap>I don't understand why
09:06<Alcap>if I use the KDE session it looks like I'm sitting at the computer
09:07<Alcap>but the KDE session creates a new session
09:07<Alcap>if I want to use an app that I have running on my computer when I log in
09:07<Alcap>the app is no longer there
09:07<Alcap>although it shows on ps ax
09:07<jm_>it's probably because it's sending stuff to wrong server
09:07<Alcap>if I could just send it to another user (I could create one just to ssh) it would be awesome
09:08<Alcap>how is that jm_?
09:08<Alcap>explain in a little more detail please
09:09<jm_>Alcap: well that's my guess, would need to investigate to confirm - did you check where it's connected to?
09:09<Alcap>the app?
09:09<Alcap>it's connected to display 0
09:09<Alcap>as I and the ssh user are
09:12<jm_>are you sure? does netstat confirm it?
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09:13<Alcap>let me check...
09:13<Alcap>how do I do that?
09:14<Alcap>what flags do I need to parse to netstat I mean ;)
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09:17<jm_>well use this instead: lsof -p PID
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09:20<Alcap>jm_, do you want me to get the output into pastebin?
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09:21<jm_>Alcap: sorry, I'll have to go soon, check if it's connected to the same socket as other working apps
09:23<Alcap>it's not...
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09:27<jm_>that would explain it not being shown
09:27<Alcap>how do I forward it to the same socket then?
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09:40<newsense>!seen fxiny
09:40<dpkg>fxiny <> was last seen on IRC in channel #debian, 18h 58m 3s ago, saying: 'use netcat'.
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09:44<averule>jm_: in qemu i am able to see first background image of debian with install option after that i am getting error od processor architecture.
09:45<Alcap>[14:27] <-- jm_ has left this server (Quit: Disconnecting).
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09:45<averule>jm_but same image if writes in cd it start directly with text mode
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09:46<averule>jm_:without showing any select option for expert/gui/text installation mode directly going in text install mode
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10:15<stuckey>Does anyone know when lenny will go stable?
10:16<metalqga>this is the question
10:16<dpkg>well, wir is When It's Ready. See also RSN and SIYH
10:17<metalqga>as far as I'm concerned, it's stable
10:17<stuckey>Where is information like this posted? Is there a mailing list for this or something?
10:17<metalqga>see the topic
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10:26<stuckey>Thanks stew
10:26<marty>ops, misstake :D
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10:29<stephen>Hello everyone..
10:29<stephen>Stupid question. I have a dell 2950 with 2 x quad xeons..
10:30<weasel>that's not a question :)
10:30<stephen>I want a debian 64bit os on it.. but there is only a choice of two.. ia64 and amd64..
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10:30<stuckey>I have a dual-core intel chip; should I be running the 32bit or 64bit version of debian?
10:30<stephen>WIll the ia64 work on such a processor?
10:30<weasel>no, ia64 will not work on it.
10:30<weasel>ia64 is something else
10:30<stephen>which debian arch do I use for 64 bit?
10:30<weasel>whether you want amd64 or i386 is harder to tell
10:30<Gekz>stuckey: either.
10:31<Gekz>stuckey: it's your decision
10:31<stuckey>Gekz: what's the difference? Is there a benefit to either?
10:31<weasel>how much ram do you have?
10:31<stephen>24 gb?
10:31<weasel>use amd64.
10:31<stuckey>I have 4GB Ram
10:31<Gekz>stuckey: 64bit allows more than 4GB ram
10:31<Gekz>use 64bit then
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10:31<stuckey>Gekz: aren't there less programs available for 64bit though?
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10:31<Gekz>haha <3 the bot
10:32<Gekz>stuckey: not afaik
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10:32<Gekz>everything runs on 64bit now I'm sure
10:32<weasel>at least as long as it isn't a desktop 64bit should be fine
10:32<stuckey>This is a desktop
10:32<stuckey>It's just my personal computer
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10:32<stuckey>What's the problem with running a desktop with 64bit?
10:32<weasel>with 64bit you might run into issues with flash, OOo, videos etc
10:33<stuckey>weasel: I don't use non-free
10:33<weasel>or maybe that's all fine now, who knows
10:33<stuckey>Most of that stuff is in non-free, isn't it?
10:33<Gekz>weasel: it's fine now
10:33<Gekz>stuckey: yes
10:33<Gekz>except OpenOffice
10:33<Gekz>which runs on 64bit afaik
10:34*OdyX runs amd64: OOo no problem, flash (gnash is OK for most), videos, OK for most too
10:34<petemc>gnash is ok for most?
10:34<stuckey>I hate flash
10:34<stuckey>it's just stupid
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10:34<petern>flash works fine for me on 64bit
10:34<stuckey>Is 64bit faster?
10:34<stephen>which one of these [alpha][amd64][arm][hppa][i386][ia64][mips][mipsel][powerpc][sparc][s390][source][multi-arch] would you use for a dell 2950 with 2 x quad core xeons.. 64bit os
10:35<stuckey>What's the deal with 64vs32 bit? I mean is it just that it would support more memory?
10:35<weasel>can address more memory, amd64 has more general purpose registers than i386, but it also needs more memory because pointers are wider
10:35<petern>obviously it's not a 64 bit OS if you're stuck at choosing which to install...
10:36<petern>@ stephen :)
10:36<erKURITA>petern <= win
10:36<stephen>Im looking at the debian download page
10:36<OdyX>stephen: amd64 I think
10:36<stephen>But the processor is Intel Xeon
10:37<weasel>stuckey: your options are i386 or amd64.
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10:37<erKURITA>Unless you've got an Itanium, and afaik, the only architecture that would work on a 64-bits CPU are either i386 or amd64
10:37<erKURITA>and the former is 32-bit
10:37<OdyX>stephen: amd64 is for AMD64 and EM64T from Intel
10:38<OdyX>IA64 is something else (not Xeon)
10:38<stephen>OdyX thanks
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10:39<Web-sidux436>after windows xp stocks for some seconds i see this error in the samba log:
10:39<Web-sidux436>Error writing 5 bytes to client. -1. (The socket is not connected)
10:40<erKURITA>eh ?
10:40<erKURITA>how does Win XP stocks?
10:40<stuckey>weasel: where can I learn more about how the 32bit and 64bit processors/processor systems work?
10:40-!-d7rt [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:41<erKURITA>stuckey how about the specification ?
10:41<erKURITA>it'll be all greek to you, but that's a starting point
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10:42<stuckey>erKURITA: Sure... I feel like I need to learn a bit more about how all of this stuff is working; I like to understand how the things I"m using work
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10:46<stuckey>Does anyone here use skype? If so, do you just install the skype package on your system? I was thinking that since it isn't a part of the distribution shouldn't you like, install it in a virtual machine or something?
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10:46<stuckey>Perhaps someone could share with me the proper way of doing this
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10:47<sep>stuckey, if the skupe packages was made for debian, i usualy just install it. if it is source code, i usualy either make a package. or install it in /usr/local
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10:49<stuckey>sep: but that's definitely not secure. Shouldn't something be done to make sure it isn't compromising system security?
10:49<stuckey>That's why I suggested that perhaps it should be installed in a virutal environment or chroot ...
10:50<weasel>doesn't skype distribute their backdo^Wsoftware in an apt-gettable way?
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10:51<sep>stuckey, if you are conserned with security you DO NOT INSTALL it :)
10:51<stuckey>sep: but I need to use it.
10:51<stuckey>So what does one do?
10:51<sep>stuckey, you can run things in jail. or in vm
10:51<stuckey>I was thinking of using vm... what's jail though?
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10:52<sep>stuckey, running it chrooted, (jail is a bsd term that is similar)
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10:52<sep>stuckey, you would first look for FOSS alternatives tho
10:53<sep>i am not aware of any tho...
10:53<stuckey>What does FOSS mean?
10:54<petern>free open source software
10:54<petern>and skype is evil
10:54<OdyX>I prefer FLOSS: Free Libre Open Source Software
10:54<taziden>petern: free as in freedom?
10:55<petern>taziden, dunno, "open source" sort of implies that bit...
10:55<erKURITA>taziden and possibly free as in beer
10:55<petern>i say that sitting here with my cisco ip phone running sccp... hehe
10:55<petern>although it hooks into asterisk
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10:58<hever>Hej I get " triggers ci file contains unknown directive syntax" if I try to remove xfce4-mcs-manager How can I enforce the removement? --force-all doesn't help. I can't reinstall the package, too. So how could I remove it from my "package catalogue" the hard way ?
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11:01<erKURITA>hever I wouldn't do that
11:01<erKURITA>I'd submit a bug to the package maintainer
11:02-!-mode/#debian [-b *!*@] by debhelper
11:02<hever>and using my system without a gui ?
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11:02<erKURITA>for the mean time.... uhm
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11:06<taziden>try lxde ... :D
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11:10<hever>erKURITA, you wouldn't do that but do you know how to do it ?
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11:11<erKURITA>first than anything, apply the First Law of Troubleshooting
11:11<erKURITA>"Someone has already had your problem"
11:11<erKURITA>Therefore, I'd google for possible solutions.
11:12<hever>This problem is related to a storage problem not to the package itself I think.
11:12<hever>there are no, just source code.
11:12<erKURITA>If there are no matches, read the documentation of apt-get and/or dpkg to see how to remove a package forcefully
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11:12<erKURITA>hever you should search for the package control files
11:12<hever>erKURITA, that was the first I did ;)
11:12<erKURITA>and if all else fails
11:12<erKURITA>use fire
11:12<hever>(read mans)
11:13<erKURITA>and try to see where the trigger file is bugging, fix it on my own and distribute the patch
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11:34<hever>erKURITA, thanks for your tips. What is fire ?
11:34<erKURITA>It's a joke
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11:35<erKURITA>If you ever played Legend of Zelda, you wouldn't have asked that question
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11:36<hever>I did ;) Is there no way to just remove it and all of it files ?
11:37<erKURITA>Did you try getting the .deb itself and force-installing with dpkg ?
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11:37<erKURITA>reinstalling, I mean
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11:39<edvin>hi. not an specific debian question, but here goes. I've got a portable mp3-player(iriver t60) which has a damaged disk. i've run fsck.vfat and all, but it wont help. now I'm thinking about if scandisk(xp/vista) would do a better job?
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11:41<erKURITA>edvin can you mount it?
11:41<erKURITA>does it click when it spins on ?
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11:41<erKURITA>not when it reads the data, but when it first starts to spin
11:41<edvin>its a flash card, I believe. hard to tell.
11:41<erKURITA>you said a disk
11:41<edvin>sorry mate
11:42<erKURITA>then if it mounts, you could just format it anew, unless you've got important data
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11:42<edvin>done that, but that wont fix the bad blocks problem
11:42<erKURITA>there's a command that checks (as in scraps them off the FAT)
11:43<edvin>what else?
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11:43<hever>erKURITA, I tried downloading them with apt, and after it fails from and tried to install them with dpkg.
11:44<hever>As I said the problem came up after a file system error...
11:44<erKURITA>hever uh? it failed to download directly from the website?
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11:46<hever>no. I could download it but the installation failed
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11:47<erKURITA>edvin there's a way to use dd along with badblocks
11:47<edvin>anyone... would xp's/vista's scandisk do a better work than fsck.vfat, spotting bad blocks etc?
11:47<katsushiro>tar zxf /usr/lib64/iceweasel/plugins/
11:47<katsushiro>no work
11:47<edvin>erkurita: alright, ill google.
11:47<erKURITA>or just badblocks
11:48<katsushiro>google no work
11:48<erKURITA>(even though this is for an LVM setup)
11:48<erKURITA>By using badblocks you will verify that your physical disk is fine and at the ame time, fill with some random data.
11:48<erKURITA># badblocks -c 10240 -s -w -t random -v /dev/lvmvolume/encryptedhome
11:48<edvin>ah, found it myself. I didn't understand you were refering to a program! :P
11:48<erKURITA>of course
11:49<dpkg>well, badblocks is badblocks(8): search device for bad blocks
11:49<edvin>awesome... hope it helps.
11:49<erKURITA>katsushiro how about you extract first then move?
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11:49<erKURITA>and read the README inside
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11:50<katsushiro>plugin 64bits flash
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11:53<hever>erKURITA, triggers ci file contains unknown directive syntax where can I find this file ?
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11:54<erKURITA>the control.tar.gz should have it
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11:54<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
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11:54<hever>and where is it stored ?
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11:54<erKURITA>hever inside the .deb
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12:02<newsense>!ping fxiny
12:02*dpkg tolls a 5-meter-bell over fxiny's head
12:02<Supaplex>thread apply all bt full is getting long. how do I set gdb to not pause for scrolling? (I'm capturing a session log anyway)
12:03<Supaplex>in gdb :)
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12:05<dpkg>Ukraine - ua ukr 804 User Agent. It refers to web clients, and what they send to the web server as "who they are". It can be easily faked.
12:05<erKURITA>lol ?
12:05<jthomas>I am looking to install Lenny onto an Lenovo x200 tablet; this will be a laptop/desktop, not a server at all (AFAIK). Currently it has Vista-x64 and 4GB of RAM. Should I use 32bit or 64bit Debian, any suggestions?
12:06<newsense>64bit uses more ram but you got 4 gigs
12:06<erKURITA>I'd go for 64-bits to be able to use the 4 GB
12:06<jthomas>since there are 64bit versions of Java and the adobe Flashplayer, 64 should be ok to go right?
12:06<jthomas>any known issues with 64bit?
12:06<jthomas>major ones
12:07<hever>erKURITA, I removed the package myself from /var/lib/dpkg/info and I could reinstall it now...
12:07<Supaplex>set pagenation off, maybe...
12:08<hever>sometimes you must be hard to your system
12:08<erKURITA>Supaplex say what?
12:08<erKURITA>You're thinking Windows, aren't you ?
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12:08<snogglethorpe>jthomas: 64-bit _debian_ works fine
12:09<jthomas>Per this HowTo it tells me to install the 2.6.27 kernel, is this a good idea or should I wait until its in Debian proper?
12:09<chealer>jthomas: you must be thinking about Sun's Java plugin, which is not available for amd64
12:09<cahoot>need .27 for the hw?
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12:10<jthomas>thats what that HowTo seems to tell me, for the wifi
12:10<jthomas>Sun's java isn't available for 64?
12:10-!-morph__ [] has joined #debian
12:10<chealer>jthomas: Sun' Java plugin
12:10<stew>jthomas: the web browser plugin is not, the rest is
12:10<jthomas>not sure, cahoot... the HowTo says to d/l this and unpack it etc iwlwifi-5000-ucode-5.4.A.11.tar.gz
12:10<hever>erKURITA, thanks bye. I hope it works ;)
12:11<alephnull>6u13 does have a usable 64 bit plugin.
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12:11<erKURITA>you're welcome
12:11<erKURITA>good luck
12:11<hever>erKURITA, Now I like to play zelda ;)
12:11<Supaplex>erKURITA: no
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12:12<jthomas>alephnull (nice name btw) what is 6u13 ?
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12:13<alephnull>jthomas: Sun Java 6 update 13.
12:13<jthomas>aaah. nice. is that in Sid or Experimental?
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12:14<stew>jthomas: no
12:14<alephnull>No idea. I don't think it is packaged, it is like a beta.
12:14<jthomas>would installing the 32bit work out?
12:14<stew>there is also openjdk and the icedtea plugin
12:15<alephnull>jthomas: Then you need a 32 bit browser too.
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12:16<jthomas>ok well, we'll see how it all goes down...
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12:16<themill>icedtea-gcjwebplugin sounds like an easier approach
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12:17<jthomas>thanks peops, I'm sure I'll be back with some more questions... i'll try that for sure (icedtea)
12:17<fxiny>newsense: pong
12:17<newsense>hey wassup
12:17<newsense>just had a ? for ya
12:18<fxiny>i'm on OT
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12:18<newsense>i reinstalled and used encrypted lvm is it normal to get messages at boot like unable to find volume group twice than get dropped to the password prompt
12:18<fxiny>just join
12:19<fxiny>twice ? is pam-mount installed ?
12:19<newsense>sorry im talking in there and youre talking here haha
12:19<newsense>let me check i dont think so actually
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12:20<newsense>nope it isnt
12:20<fxiny>so you can't log in ?
12:20*goodger returns
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12:20<newsense>no i can but im just wondering if this is going to be a problem later
12:20<goodger>another perfectly worthless day's non-work concludes
12:20<newsense>i had to add usb to my initramfs so i could use my usb keyboard
12:21<fxiny>is it a fresh install ?
12:21<newsense>but i can decrypt the partitions
12:21<newsense>yes very fresh :)
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12:21<newsense>and when i reboot or halt i get cant deavtivate the volume group
12:21<newsense>its a common issue i see from google but havent seen an answer
12:22<fxiny>all partitions encrypted ? how many ?
12:22<newsense>all but boot
12:23<fxiny>so you made 5 keys ?
12:23<newsense>no just one
12:23<newsense>i set it up through the debian installer
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12:23<newsense>made one lvm group with the encrypted partitions
12:24<newsense>got / /home /tmp /usr /var encrypted
12:24<newsense>i just choose the guided lvm encrypted whole drive option or whatever its called
12:25<fxiny>no swap ? lvm differs form mine i think, mine is not lvm . i have three partitions encrypted : / /home and swap but i made threre keys
12:25<fxiny>one pass at boot
12:25<newsense>luckily i had like 10 usb to ps2 adapters lying around i was under the impression the initramfs had usb drivers
12:25<newsense>oh wait sorry forgot swap
12:26<newsense>also encrypted
12:26<fxiny>newsense: i think you kave to edit /etc/crypttab
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12:27<newsense>fxiny, ok ill look into it, looks very basic right now
12:27<fxiny>newsense: my keys are in /etc/cryptkeys , did you mkdir it ?
12:28<newsense>hda2_crypt /dev/hda2 none luks
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12:28<newsense>fxiny, i didnt do anything it was setup by the installer i did input a passphrase during install
12:28<newsense>no i got no cryptkeys in /etc
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12:34<Tuplad>hey. I've got a problem that sometimes comes back... usually, after an amarok update or any sound related problems, I can't play sound in my browser, but I can in music players.
12:35<Tuplad>what's going on ?
12:35<rimabul>hello , je to ohromný
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12:44<Tuplad>hey. I've got a problem that sometimes comes back... usually, after an amarok update or any sound related problems, I can't play sound in my browser, but I can in music players. what's going on ?
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12:50<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
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12:51<phil_>hey guys
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13:29<rjent>Greetings is it possible to get X access to a chroot envirnoment.
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13:31<weasel>you just need the x magic cookies in your chroot
13:31<weasel>they'll probably in in either .Xauthority in your homedir or somewhere in /tmp
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13:40<themill>weasel, rjent: you also need to bind mount /tmp/.X11-unix.
13:40<themill>rjent: consider using schroot for the purpose.
13:42<dpkg>i guess schroot is an easy way of setting up a chroot of testing or unstable within your installation of stable. See and
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13:45<rjent>themill: thanks and I will try. also thanks weasel
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13:48<sdljfhs0h0>hey. i'm not sure how to import a key for this.
13:48<sdljfhs0h0>W: GPG error: etch-backports Release: The following signatures couldn't be verified
13:48<adama>sdljfhs0h0: /topic
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13:50<sdljfhs0h0>yeah. i already have debian-backports-keyring installed
13:51<adama>sdljfhs0h0: if it is for another repo, here is the command
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13:51<adama>gpg --keyserver --recv-keys <key signature> ; apt-key add /root/.gnupg/pubring.gpg
13:51<adama>nm then
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14:03<skimp>Anyone here tether off an iphone3g on debian?
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14:07<pizzie>Hello. is there a way to redirect iptables' logging from syslog to extra files?
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14:09<pizzie>or would that be a job of external tools that mangle syslog?
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14:09<pizzie>syslog-ng or the alternative?
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14:09<weasel>pizzie: use ULOG instead of LOG
14:09<weasel>and install ulogd
14:09*pizzie looks
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14:10<pizzie>wow, that even has a mysql backend
14:10<pizzie>thanks for the tip weasel
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14:13<Coagulate>Umm, im pretty new to linux and I have some question about a problem Im having with trying to switch out of gnome to a terminal
14:14<frank>with syslog-ng this can be done with a filter like 'filter f_iptables { match("IN=.*OUT="); };'
14:14<Supaplex>Coagulate: for terminals/x11 on tty1-tty12, press ctrl+alt+n where n = ttyN to switch
14:15<Coagulate>when i try to switch from x to a tty1 i just get a black screen with no prompt
14:16<pizzie>Harald Welte is a debian person, too?
14:16<Gathond>Coagulate: mine does the same with the nvidia driver
14:16<Coagulate>also when i try to switch user within x i get a black screen
14:16<Gathond>Coagulate: then it proceeds straight into crashing if you try to switch back to X
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14:17<Coagulate>aye i have a 8800 gts
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14:17<pizzie>frank: yes but thats kind of a hack and no real solution, because it adds extra processing
14:17<OdyX>pizzie: Nope... OpenMoko + GSM + kernel drivers + independent hacker
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14:17<pizzie>well :o)
14:17<Gathond>Coagulate: I don'øt think their driver support switching away from the X session it runs
14:18<Gathond>Coagulate: I'm guessing switching users actually does that, switch to another X session running on another virtual TTY
14:18<Coagulate>doh they fail
14:18<Gathond>Coagulate: they open nv one does iirc
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14:18<Gathond>Coagulate: however that is strictly 2d only
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14:19<Coagulate>I guess i have to wait for nvidia to come out with a new driver before i can switch terminals then
14:19<pizzie>could somebody elaborate in plain english what the netlink multicast group of ulogd is about?
14:20<Gathond>Coagulate: I haven't been able to for 2years, so I would not hold my breath
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14:20<enouf>Coagulate: can you switch back and forth from any TTY and X?
14:20<enouf>Coagulate: cat /proc/cmdline says?
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14:20<Coagulate>no i cant it just gives me a black screen when i switch
14:20<Coagulate>im not in linux atm
14:21<stevecotton>the nvidia driver is flaky when switching between TTY and X; normally works for me, then occasionally breaks hard
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14:21<stevecotton>and the black screen is one of the failure modes that I've seen
14:21<enouf>Coagulate: and ensure nvidiafb, nor rivafb is loaded - blacklist those as a matter of fact - try adding a vga=791 option to your kernel line, so vesafb will load and reserve that mem address spacwe
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14:22<Coagulate>ok ill try that out
14:22<stevecotton>but it officially doesn't support running two X sessions at once
14:22<enouf>all you guys with the same issues, should be comapring kernel versions atleast
14:23<Coagulate>im using whatever the latest stable is off the site is
14:23<Gathond>I'm using whatever sid uses (and have used)
14:24<Gathond>I've usually resigned myself to just use the nv one
14:24<pizzie>or is 32 the default setting for '--ulog-nlgroup' and i just go with that?
14:24<Gathond>it works(tm) (the parts that actually work)
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14:24<Coagulate>i guess ill go see if adding vga=791 to my kernal line works
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14:24<stevecotton>for me it's long-running breakage through several kernel versions and nvidia driver versions (although I'm using custom kernels and the non-Debianized driver)
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14:24*stevecotton isn't expecting help with that, just saying it's a well-known issue
14:25<pizzie>yes the nvidia framebuffer driver is broken
14:25<pizzie>i needed to disable it
14:26*Gathond is with stevecotton
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14:29<pizzie>or maybe the '--ulog-nlgroup' does not matter and you only need to use the same value in the config and the iptables rule?
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14:35<dgodfather>hello there everyone
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14:40<pizzie>ah, seems to work
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14:41<pizzie>really cool this ulogd
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14:45<ex-bart>Why is e2fsprogs_1.41.3-1.diff.gz empty?
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14:46<OdyX>could be because there is no difference between upstream and Debian ?
14:46-!-nils [] has quit []
14:46<ex-bart>I checked and, they both contain the empty file, gzip compressed, for e2fsprogs_1.41.3-1.diff.gz.
14:46-!-rimabul [] has joined #debian
14:46<OdyX>(which is generally not the case)
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14:47<OdyX>empty here too
14:47<ex-bart>why isn't e2fsprogs a native package then?
14:47<stew>well ted ts'o, the author of e2fsprogs is also the debian maitnainer
14:47<OdyX>native ?
14:47-!-smalahove [] has joined #debian
14:47<ex-bart>without a diff.gz
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14:48<OdyX>well... diff.gz are probably mandatory, even if empty
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14:48<OdyX>just not to confuse source fetchers
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14:49<stew>OdyX: no, diff.gz is not manditory in that you can create a debian native package instead
14:49<OdyX>OK. point taken.
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14:49<stew>perhaps he's not making a debian native package becuase he is anticipating future changes?
14:50<ex-bart>well, if he is upstream, he will be the one making future changes
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14:51<stew>ex-bart: yes, but he is probably anticipating having to make changes to the debian package without releasing a new version upstream
14:51<bit>join #brasil
14:51-!-kitsune is now known as alba
14:52<stew>which looks like what has happened with past releases, the -1 is an empty .diff.gz and then there are subsequent sourceless uploads
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14:52<OdyX>you can upload just a diff.gz ?
14:52<alba>this may sound stupid but which one of the adresses listed here is the computer mac adress? need to filter it in the router... but in the router i appear with a different one
14:52<alba>could someone please advise?
14:52<ex-bart>it's just that dpkg-source warned about it
14:52*OdyX scratches head and wonders.
14:53<stew>OdyX: yes, (with a .dsc and .changes), which is typically what is done with anything but a -1 revision
14:53<stew>(well you also have to upload .debs)
14:53<adama>alba: it's the HWaddr
14:53<ex-bart>alba: 00:16:d4:b2:27:83
14:53*OdyX understands the power of Debian a little more
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14:54<alba>hmm the router states it's this one... 00-18-DE-D1-16-D2 and i dont understand why
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14:54<stew>OdyX: here is a previous -1 upload ; it has a .orig.tar.gz and and empty .diff.gz ; is the subsequent -2 upload which doens't have .orig.tar.gz
14:54<adama>alba is there any hardware between the eth0 and the router?
14:54<OdyX>wouah. Fantastic !
14:54<adama>or just a cable
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14:54<ex-bart>ok, so I'll just assume it was intentional an not file a bug
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14:55<alba>hmm nothing at all i am connected wirelessly to my router adama and i want to filter the connection since the network has no encryption (cannot connect and i dunno why)
14:55<alba>so i thought ifconfig should do the trick... but when i check the macs are all different
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15:05<simonrvn>xavier_: /server yourserver then /join #channel
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15:10<skimp>is there a hotkey in gnome to get to terminal?
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15:14<adama>skimp you can make one
15:14<adama>I use F
15:15<Supaplex>even with debug symbols, why is there no symbol table information for gdb?
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15:15<adama>System - Preferences - Keyboard Shortcuts
15:15<adama>Open Terminal Window
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15:17<hal>hellomfrom Tex
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15:17<hal>whats up?
15:17<hal>is it dead in here?
15:17<adama>debian is up
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15:18<dpkg>qotd19 is probably <Overfiend> "PHP 5! Now with Zend-enhanced multicrashing! Reserve your copy today!"
15:18<simonrvn>the sky is up
15:20<hal>whats happing then?
15:21-!-hal [] has quit []
15:22<OdyX>then you quit ?
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15:25<Lounge>i'm looking for the file that stores the nautilus navigation history and one know where it is?
15:26<shze>my screen is black (locked+screen off) and keyb is dead after coming back to my laptop after a while (~1h), but I can ssh into it; how can I find what's my problem? (debian testing+x7.4/server1.5+kde4.1.3)
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15:46<Supaplex>great. package wasn't even created with -ggdb grr
15:46<sdljfhs0h0>so how often should i turn my computer off?
15:46<sdljfhs0h0>do i really need to
15:46-!-cahoot [~radix@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:47<simonrvn>when the full moon is at its closest in a long time.
15:47-!-xplibpublic [] has joined #debian
15:48<xplibpublic>hi all
15:48<Nemoder>sdljfhs0h0: I'd say at least once every 6months if for nothing else than just to clean the dust out :)
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15:49<xplibpublic>Id like to setup a server on an old imac g4. Am I going to go about setting up a static IP for it the standard way if I'm getting the net via a router configured to use DHCP?
15:49-!-lancelot_of [~TheKnight@] has quit [Read error: No route to host]
15:49<simonrvn>use either or
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15:50<xplibpublic>Im trying to set it up as a seedbox
15:50<xplibpublic>Id like to be able to access it remotely
15:50<xplibpublic>would that change the configuration any
15:51<sdljfhs0h0>i mean, will leaving it on for a month at a time do any damage to the hardware? or is it just a matter of a set lifespan for the cpu and wearing it out more quickly?
15:51<simonrvn>it'll wear out more quickly if you overclock it
15:52<sdljfhs0h0>without overclocking
15:52<sdljfhs0h0>i dont plan to
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15:52<simonrvn>dunno, i've had stuff run for years, and only took it down 'cause i replaced it with a faster box.
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15:59<sdljfhs0h0>yeah. it should last till then...
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16:00<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. when I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, or if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask (ask the whole channel!). We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer, ask later or ask
16:01<Garp>Question: If I set LANG=fr but that in some software the string is not translated to french, I get the english version. What can be done to try first another language? Like german? Thanks.
16:02<sdljfhs0h0>maybe that software does not have a french language version
16:02-!-lancelot_of [~TheKnight@] has quit [Quit: Sto andando via]
16:02<sdljfhs0h0>i don't think setting an environmental variable can change the language software was written for
16:02<sdljfhs0h0>if that was your question
16:02<Garp>sdljfhs0h0: me neither.
16:02<Garp>that's not the question.
16:03<Nemoder>you can change the system language with dpkg-reconfigure locales
16:03<sdljfhs0h0>if it's popular software you might check for a french language pack
16:03<sdljfhs0h0>maybe enough ppl asked for it
16:03<Garp>OK, I try to ask my questioin more clearily ;)
16:03<Nemoder>you might have better luck in a language specific channel
16:03<dpkg>Pour l'aide en francais, veuillez rejoindre le canal #debian-fr sur French users: for help in french, please go to #debian-fr on
16:03<stew>Garp: i don't think what you want to do is possible without source code changes
16:04<sdljfhs0h0><Garp> that's not the question.
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16:04<Garp>stew: but doesnt the standard 'locale' define this properly?
16:04<stew>he wants it so that when his default locale isn't found, he can specify a secondary locale to try instead of getting the default
16:04<Garp>stew: I saw some construct like: LANG=fr:de
16:04-!-Condottiero [] has joined #debian
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16:04<stew>oh, that would be news to me
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16:07<Garp>stew: export LANGUAGE=zz:de:fr:es <- in
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16:07<stew>Garp: ahh, sorry, i hadn't seen that before
16:07<Garp>stew: I would like some precision about such syntax...
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16:07<Garp>I tried, but it seems not yet to work as expected (I'm not so suche about LANG, LANGUAGE and such)
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16:08<sander_m>Hi all. I havce a problem with my HP all-in-one. Printing works but scanning does not. It's recoignised, but I always get "device busy". Any ideas?
16:09<Txt-file>sander_am: please more details about your model ... there is more than one HP all-in-one
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16:10<sander_m>HP LaserHet M1120n
16:10<sander_m>It's a network printer
16:10<sander_m> on my network
16:11<Garp>stew: OK? seems a bit clearer now: LANG can only get one language/convention. Only language can be hacked the way I mentionned.
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16:12<Garp>stew: As LANG defines more the standards (date representation and such) it seems clear now. LANGAUE explicitely target the UI aspect.
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16:17<Garp>sander_m: sorry, I have no idea
16:18<sander_m>Garp :-(
16:18<Garp>LaserHet <- Laser*J*et ?
16:18<sander_m>Garp: Yes. That's what I corrected above as well.
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16:19<sander_m>`scanimage -L` says: hpaio:/net/HP_LaserJet_M1120n_MFP?ip=
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16:21<Garp> <- " so we'll be looking at adding scanning support in a future release." (2008-11-20)
16:21-!-CNerone [] has joined #debian
16:21<CNerone>hi all
16:22<Garp>sander_m: "Scanning with HPLIP 2.8.10 should work over USB however." (same source)
16:23-!-stollenreiter [] has joined #debian
16:23<CNerone>I run "shutdown -h", I got "system going to runlevel 1" and system went to runlevel-1 (maintenanc mode)
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16:24<sander_m>Garp: Great find. Thanks
16:25<Garp>sander_m : just googling. I have no other info, sorry (I dont have anything near such a printer)
16:25<stollenreiter>hello from germany
16:25<sander_m>Garp: You know what the really nasty part is? HP didn't supply me with an USB cable :-(
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16:26<sander_m>Garp: I bet that they'll charge a fortune for it
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16:26<Garp>sander_m: if, at least, there's an USB port somewhere, you'll find a cable ;)
16:27<lancelot_of>guys i can't see any osd on my display...the events corresponding to the keys interested work but no osd appears even if osd is enabled on my system
16:27<lancelot_of>any hint?
16:27<sander_m>Garp: Good point. I checked to be sure, but yes, there is an USB port on the device :-)
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16:35<Garp>have to go. Bebye
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16:36<Guest163>per favore dove posso trovare skipe per ubuntu
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16:38<vjt>Guest163: this is an *english* channel about *debian* and *free software* :D
16:39-!-mode/#debian [+l 379] by debhelper
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16:40<dredtrake>hi all
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16:42<Txt-file>can someone give me a link to a LDAP-server install howto?
16:42<oscar>how do you install adobe
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16:42<Txt-file>oscar: which software from adobe
16:42<dredtrake>whitch adobe software do you want to install?
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16:43<skimp><- also trying to install flash
16:43<dpkg>somebody said flash was frequently used to deliver interactivity, audio and video through a web browser. Ask me about <gnash> or <swfdec> for free implementations or <adobe flash> for a non-free implementation. Also see
16:43<dredtrake>flash player? or the software to make fla
16:44<skimp>flash player
16:44<oscar>yea player
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16:44<skimp>im totally new to linux .. i know how to get in root in terminal, need to be told the rest hehe
16:45<Txt-file>!tell skimp about flash
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16:46<oscar>it says to put ./flashplayer-installer in terminal
16:46<oscar>but when i do
16:46<oscar>terminal says that directory is not found
16:46<skimp>how do I save in nano
16:47<stew>oscar: we'd recommend using the flashplayer-nonfree packages from debian instead
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16:47<Txt-file>skimp: STRG + O
16:47<oscar>how would i do that
16:47<stew>oscar: what version of debian are you running?
16:47<alba>isnt that ctrl+x and overwrite skimp ?
16:47<stew>oscar: please go to #ubuntu or #xubunto on for help with xubuntu
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16:48<skimp>ok ctrl x saved
16:48<dpkg>Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian, and it is unlikely to live up to Debian's standards (see <Debian policy>). Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu ( instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian>.
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16:50<skimp>Im actually in debian. Can someone help me install flashplayer. Im using iceweasel. And im brand spanking new to linux.
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16:50<stew>skimp: what version of debian are you running?
16:51<skimp>I know how to get into root, thats about it.
16:51<stew>skimp: you want a free flash pluign? or you want the non-free one from adobe?
16:51-!-CNerone [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
16:53<skimp>Doesnt matter, whatevers easier.
16:53<stew>skimp: aptitude install gnash
16:54<Txt-file>stew: swfdec vs. gnash??
16:54<stew>Txt-file: i don't know
16:54<skimp>i tried swf and i didnt like it because you had to enable it everytime flash loads
16:55<skimp>like for instance flash banners dont show automatically, you have to enable
16:55<Txt-file>that's what I like at swfdec
16:57<skimp>stew, gnash didnt work
16:57<skimp>flash things arent loading
16:59<skimp>the swf worked, except you have to hit play on everything, which is annoying with banners
16:59<Supaplex>I rebuilt etch mysql-server-5.0 with DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nostrip,noopt and while the binary is not stripped, there are no debug symbols being loaded by gdb. I see a /usr/share/doc/mysql-server-5.0/mysqld.sym.gz file. Any suggestions on how to ensure gdb has access to the symbols?
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17:07*Supaplex 's reverse engineering build tools etc to unravel this mystery
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17:15<LL00>why there is a fix for ntp and bind9, shouldn't fix for openssl solve the vulnerabilty?
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17:56<adama>I'm having trouble getting the sound working on this fresh Lenny install.
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17:57<adama>lspci says it has a [SiS] AC'97
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17:58<adama>lsmod has snd_ac97_codec, ac97_bus, snd_pcm, snd
17:59-!-mode/#debian [+l 366] by debhelper
17:59<adama>but trying to play audio with totem e.g. the visualization comes up but no sounds play and the volume thing is greyed out
18:00<adama>double-clicking the volume applet yields the error: "No volume control GStreamer plugins and/or devices found."
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18:00<adama>what am I missing??
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18:00<themill>!alsa checklist
18:00<dpkg>1) run alsaconf as root 2) add yourself to the 'audio' group (log out and log in again) 3) use alsamixer and unmute channels and raise levels (also try muting some channels) 4) arts or esound stopped? 5) OSS modules unloaded? 6) speakers on? 7) modprobe snd-pcm-oss 8) does "aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav" work for root? Test your sound with aplay and a wav so codec issues don't confuse the situation. <list alsa users>
18:00<adama>will try those
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18:12<adama>OK I think it was the group thing... now aplay /usr/share/sounds/alsa/Noise.wav works as user. BUT still get the same error trying to adjust volume with the taskbar applet
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18:26<Txt-file>szymon_g: hy ... some problem/question??
18:26<szymon_g>no, not yet ;p
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18:31<adama>so now playing sounds with aplay, totem etc works fine, and alsamixer can control the volume, but I get "No volume control GStreamer plugins and/or devices found." when trying to adjust the volume with the gnome applet button
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18:31<Txt-file>adama: I get the same error. you are not alone.
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18:33<themill>adama: did you install totem-gstreamer or totem-xine?
18:34<adama>came down when I installed gnome
18:34<themill>can totem control the volume?
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18:37<szymon_g>hm... if i wanna to compile kernel *without* initrd file, which parts have to be compiled as a 'built-in' instead of modules? i know, its filesystems (ext3 in my case), but what else?
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18:43<themill>adama: you have logged out and then back in again since adding yourself to the audio group, haven't you?
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18:44<adama>themill yes I did, that enabled me to play the sound with aplay
18:44<adama>and have sound in totem
18:45<themill>adama: can you pastebin ls -l /dev/dsp /dev/mixer /dev/snd/*
18:45<themill>(although I suspect gstreamer borkage not permissions)
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18:50<themill>Looks fine. Does "alsamixer" allow you to change volumes?
18:50<adama>themill: yes alsamixer -c0 brings up the sliders, they work fine.
18:51<themill>do you have more than one sound card?
18:51<Txt-file>adama: is gnome-media installed?
18:51<adama>it's onboard, none in pci
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18:52<adama>Txt-file yes it is
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18:52<themill>adama: is this a fresh user in the fresh install? or have you brought in settings files from a previous installation?
18:53<adama>it's a fresh install, I installed with and Etch netinst CD, then updgaded to lenny in sources.list, upgraded the kernel, then installed gnome and other stuff. Also the user is NOT the one created during the install
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18:54<themill>Are there any outstanding upgrades (i.e. you dist-upgraded not just upgraded)? Does it work OK for the user that *was* created at install time?
18:54<adama>let me check
18:55<themill>adama: btw that's not the recommended way of upgrading from etch to lenny but that shouldn't be the cause of your problems. For future reference, /msg dpkg etch->lenny
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18:57<adama>themill, there are a few things it wants to install.... Check out the discrepancies in /etc/group though.
18:58<adama>I will try as the user 1000
18:59<themill>those updates look irrelevant to this problem. Doesn't look like a permissions problem either. I'm mystified.
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19:01<adama>OK it works fine for the other user. I think it might have to do with the groups that gerry is not in
19:01<adama>(the other user = adama, 1000)
19:02<adama>gerry = 1001
19:02<themill>adama: shouldn't be an issue, but who knows what gstreamer is trying to do here.
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19:03<themill>adama: you logged out and back in after adding to the audio group, but I wonder if there was some gnome or gstreamer related daemon still running that didn't pick up the group change. From what I've seen, gnome is particularly bad at leaving daemons behind when you log out.
19:03<sem>hi all
19:03<adama>so, why, when I created the user gerry, wasn't he put into all those groups? dialout, cdrom, floppy, audio, video, plugdev
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19:04<adama>themill I will try rebooting? Should I add gerry to all those groups?
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19:05<themill>adama: no harm comes from adding the user to those groups. You can add them to /etc/adduser.conf if you want them to be included for new users in the future. Rebooting might help... prodding gstreamer configs might help too.
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19:07<udo>hätte eine frage. Kann mir da jemand helfen?
19:07<dpkg>deutschsprachige Hilfe bekommt ihr in (auf, oder - German speaking users please go to (on, or DE == Desktop Environment
19:08<udo>Oh, danke!
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19:10<adama>waiting for this dist-upgrade to finish
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19:11<abrotman>what did adama break?
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19:13<adama>brb, let's see if I've fixed it
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19:17<adama>It works! :))
19:17<adama>not sure what the solution was but oh well
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19:24<themill>adama: excellent. Probably a matter of killing some gnomish cruft daemon that was still running even though you had logged out and then back in.
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19:29<adama>themill: yep, thanks for the help
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19:29<adama>I wonder if that other guy who had the same problem was following along..
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19:45<MFF-EL-BORI>hola krak
19:45<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
19:45<krak>one questin
19:46<krak>how to enable color support in sirc irc client?
19:46<krak>i tried /load but no change
19:46<MFF-EL-BORI>i dont know i am new in this types of chat
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19:54<pascal>s there someone ?
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20:00<abrotman>impatient .. jeez
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20:03<MFF-EL-BORI>Hi pascal
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20:06<aldrenean>anyone feel like helping me get sound back on Mint?
20:07<gsimmons>!linux mint
20:07<dpkg>linux mint is probably a distribution based on Ubuntu. It is not Debian and we're unable to assist. Go /join #linuxmint @ See <Based on Debian>., or
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20:14<chris_>i was on here las night asking about my problems with getting x to work for me
20:15<chris_>i'm now on the actual computer with the problem.
20:15<chris_>i tried a dpgk-reconfigure xserver-xorg, but that didn't work.
20:15<amphi>what video card?
20:17<chris_>meoblast001:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation Unknown device 27ae (rev 03)
20:17<chris_>meoblast001:02.1 Display controller: Intel Corporation Mobile 945GM/GMS/940GML Express Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 03)
20:17<chris_>meoblast ?
20:17<meoblast001>what about my vga compatible controller?
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20:18<chris_>did you see that ?
20:18<meoblast001>my graphics card is quite slow actually
20:18<amphi>chris_: do update-pciids and try again
20:18<meoblast001>amphi: what's he talking about
20:18<chris_>when you say try again you mean try the dpkg reconf again
20:18<amphi>I hoped he was talking about his video card
20:19<chris_>meoblast001: are you talking about me ?
20:19<meoblast001>i wasnt even talking in here
20:19<chris_>why when i pasted my message did it go to you ?
20:19<chris_>or haev o
20:19<chris_>or have your name on it
20:20<themill>i945 should be supported by xserver-xorg-video-intel
20:20<chris_>i must have done something wrong. i was trying to copy /paste using screen
20:20<meoblast001>i have a 915gm dont know why you'd be asking me
20:20<chris_>from oen window to anotehr
20:20-!-hollywoodb [] has joined #debian
20:20<chris_>i was trying to ask the channel
20:20<meoblast001>oh ic
20:20<meoblast001>it's ok
20:20<abrotman>chris_: aptitude install linux-image-2.6-686-etchnhalf xserver-xorg-video-intel
20:21<themill>(unless it's another one of these intel model number bogosities that they keep pulling with their video cards)
20:21<chris_>abrotman : i need a new kernel image ?
20:21<chris_>well i updated the pci id's . first i'll try the reconfigure
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20:22<abrotman>chris_: and update-pciids
20:22<chris_>i did that alread
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20:23<chris_>whats with "etchnhalf" ?
20:23<dpkg>"etch + 1/2" -- an update to Debian's stable release "etch" designed to provide support for newer hardware. It includes a 2.6.24 kernel along with an updated installer. Release notes: Installation instructions: See also or <etchnhalf facts>
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20:23<chris_>i see
20:23<chris_>so if the reconfigure doesn't work i'll try that
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20:24<chris_>hope this works
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20:44<twb>I wish mount -t tmpfs supported -o owner=proxy. Against which package should I report this wishlist bug?
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20:46<abrotman>the mount package?
20:46<twb>OK, I was guessing that was wrong
20:46<twb>That I should complain to a kernel package
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20:46<abrotman>why a kernel issue?
20:47<twb>Well because not supporting that option is due to the tmpfs filesystem not supporting it, Iguess
20:47<twb>The error comes from dmesg, not mount
20:48<abrotman>ah .. you could ask #debian-kernel
20:48*abrotman wonders where chris went
20:48<enouf>twb: in my 2.6.26-1-686, i get;
20:49<abrotman>i think he means the option part ?
20:52<twb>Yes, I mean the option part
20:52<twb>[10093.888673] tmpfs: Bad mount option owner
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20:56<chris_>the etchnhalf seems to have problems when i select it at boot from grub menu
20:56<chris_>do i have to do something to configure it ?
20:56<dpkg>"etch + 1/2" -- an update to Debian's stable release "etch" designed to provide support for newer hardware. It includes a 2.6.24 kernel along with an updated installer. Release notes: Installation instructions: See also or <etchnhalf facts>
20:56<abrotman>chris_: no you shouldn't have to
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20:57<chris_>one of the errors that came up makes it looks like i have no /dev/sda devices
20:57<chris_>hence no hd
20:58<chris_>maybe i need to install from a etchnhalf media ?
21:00<abrotman>you could try that .. or use lenny
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21:01<nsfmc>sorry if this is meta, but is there a recommended irc server to install from apt for etch?
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21:02<abrotman>irc server? install?
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21:03<nsfmc>yeah, i mean, i'm trying to set one up for some friends and me but i have no idea if anyone has a preferred ircd
21:03<nsfmc>that is, a private irc server on my own machine
21:03<simonrvn>oooh, that makes sense now
21:04<nsfmc>abrotman, simonrvn, yeah, sorry, it might have been a bit abstract
21:04<abrotman>you want to know if there is a preferred ircd in etch to install for your use
21:04<chris_>okay, i'll go try to setup my boot USB stick with either etch n half or with lenny
21:04<abrotman>and i think there are only a couple
21:04<nsfmc>the reason i ask is that i have this mental association with irc server and being rooted
21:05-!-twb [] has left #debian [rcirc on GNU Emacs]
21:05<abrotman>you could chroot it
21:05<nsfmc>so i wanted something a little less, umm.. rogue?
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21:05<nsfmc>well, yeah, i guess i was wondering if anyone had recs
21:05<simonrvn>i think that's the preferred way nowadays, if not run from vserver, or sen, or something
21:06<nsfmc>like otfc-hybrid?
21:07<simonrvn>i haven't run one in years
21:07<nsfmc>yeah, it seems a bit silly, no?
21:07<simonrvn>well, 3, but whatever :P
21:07<abrotman>xmpp server!
21:07<nsfmc>yeah, i tried jabber
21:07<nsfmc>but jabber support across mac clients is a bit spotty
21:07<nsfmc>some folks are kinda, umm... special
21:07<abrotman>there are uhm .. quite a few
21:08<abrotman>my friend really likes uh .. starts with an A and quacks
21:08<nsfmc>it does an ok job, yes
21:08<simonrvn>heh, i d/led that the other day, so my partner could have a pidgin-like app
21:08<nsfmc>yeah, it's a nice app actually
21:08<abrotman>as long as it has xmpp conference support .. should be just like IRC :)
21:09<nsfmc>the problem i was having was when folks from gmail would try to connect to my xmpp/ejabberd server, they were getting weird error messages
21:10<nsfmc>but not from other jabber servers, only gmail/gtalk jabber folks
21:10<nsfmc>so it seemed a bit annoying
21:10<nsfmc>i don't know, maybe i'm asking for too much
21:10*abrotman says that as disappears again
21:10<simonrvn>well they probably do something extra to it
21:11<nsfmc>yeah, it's a weird when support for things like xmpp is like 70%
21:11<nsfmc>it seems like the right answer, though
21:11<nsfmc>well, thanks for talking that out
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21:12<simonrvn>i didn't do anything! :P
21:12*simonrvn grins
21:14<kop>Something strange has hapoened to ,uh, kde, or maybe X. I clicked on an iceweasel close tab and nothing happened. So I figured iceweasl hac locked up and swtiched to a vt and killed it. But back in X I can't get betwen my workspaces, or start iceweasel from the icon in the taskbar. But I can start a terminal window. So I do that and kill and start kicker. Now scrolling my mouse wheel sends me from one virtual screen (not worksapce, I can slide windows fro
21:14<kop>What's wrong and what do I do to fix it short of restarting my X session?
21:15<simonrvn>i'd just ctrl-alt-backspace the fucker
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21:15<kop>Is there some other kde-ingie I should try restarting?
21:15<kop>simonrvn : That's cheating. ;-)
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21:16<simonrvn>if you don't have something to save, then no ;p
21:16<kop>simonrvn : Probably sanest though.
21:16<simonrvn>just make sure to not save the session first
21:17<kop>simonrvn : Prolly 15 or 20 termina windows, doing various things, some of which I've just not gotten back to in weeks.
21:17<kop>simonrvn :What saves the session?
21:17<simonrvn>hehe, time to kill it ;p
21:17<simonrvn>kde has a save session thingy, restarts stuff at start
21:17<kop>I think I'll noodle around and shut apps down, just so I know what i'm missing.
21:17<simonrvn>noodle doodle
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21:29<diego>is there any tool to binary compare files , I need to review a patched file
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21:30<skimp>Anyone wanna help me get my wireless working! Im on a eeepc 1000, its enabled in bios, and ive tried wifi-radar and wicd... Its not picking any up
21:30<diego>whats your wifi chipset?
21:31<skimp>Ralink RT2860 chipset
21:31<skimp>oh and heads up.. im a noob, first day on linux as well
21:31<skimp>running debian though
21:31<abrotman>diego: compare them how? they're binary
21:31<dpalacio>diego: apt-cache search binary diff
21:31<dpkg>Vendor drivers for the Ralink 802.11n chipsets (RT2860/RT2890 and RT2870) are available from 'rt2860-source' is available for Debian <EeePC> and sid, use "aptitude install module-assistant && m-a prepare && m-a a-i rt2860" to build and install.
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21:32<diego>skimp: using debian etch?
21:32<skimp>hm not sure what etch is
21:32<abrotman>only in sid ? ick
21:32<skimp>using gnome..
21:33<craigevil-eee>hes on lenny and has the rt2860 modules already
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21:33<skimp>craig: thanks
21:33<diego>sudo aptitude install rt2860-modules-{kernel number}
21:33<newsense>craigevil-eee, psychic ?
21:33<diego>you can aptitude search rt2860
21:33<abrotman>diego: that's not likely to work.. at all
21:34<craigevil-eee>no been in #debianeeepc:)
21:34<newsense>ahhh :)
21:34<skimp>aptitude search rt2769 shows nothing
21:34<diego>if you dont find it, add to the repos
21:35<abrotman>skimp: ask the #debian-eeepc channel
21:35<abrotman>wait .. did he say it was an eeepc, or am i losing my mind ?
21:35<newsense>never knew they had a channel wow, eeepc's are pretty popular these days
21:35*abrotman looks around for his mind ...
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21:35<craigevil-eee>haha yes
21:36<diego>skimp: they have an installer
21:36<diego>hope it helps :)
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21:37<diego>no prob, at least you don't have an HP... thats a headache :-)
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21:39<kop>simonrvn : That was... Odd.
21:40<simonrvn>what happened?
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22:40<mike>had the oddest ecperience earlier
22:40<mike>seems that some how my flash wasnt working in any of my browsers
22:40<mike>i had to reinstall to get it back
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22:48<abrotman>maybe i insulted it?
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22:58<mike>wtf was up with that ?
22:58*simonrvn shrugs
22:59<snogglethorpe>debian would be the most annoying boyfriend ever probably
23:00<mike>if etch was a chick id go out with it
23:00<snogglethorpe>sid seems more exciting
23:00<mike>but i think id dump it cause its considering a sex change to lenny -.-
23:00<rickbot>my girlfriend is named 'sid'
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23:01<mike>haha hey guys meet "sid" my girfriend
23:01-!-craig [] has joined #debian
23:01<rickbot>and she rocks!!
23:01<simonrvn>sidney, can be a woman's name
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23:02<snogglethorpe>also a cat's name
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23:04<mike>come on now etch sounds exotic lol
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23:06<snogglethorpe>argh, this stupid libdrm bug...
23:06-!-rickbot [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
23:07<snogglethorpe>tho X seems unexpectedly usable with NoAccel turned on, even on this anemic CPU...
23:09-!-mode/#debian [+l 345] by debhelper
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23:24<ed00m>some from chile or latinoamericam???
23:24<ed00m>debian users spanish??
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23:27<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
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23:56<donny>how can i make scons print out the commands it's executing? the closest option i found in the man page doesn't suffice (debug=presub)
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---Logclosed Tue Jan 13 00:00:04 2009