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#debian IRC Logs for 2009-03-27

---Logopened Fri Mar 27 00:00:19 2009
00:02<Lance4>will it?
00:02<amphi>if it contains 'sid',the answer is most likely "yes, a lot" ;)
00:02<kapil>debian-reference is meant for you to learn to manage your _stable_ Debian system before trying things like upgrading to "testing" or "unstable". in particular, the reference explains things like lines in /etc/apt/sources.list and how to handle upgrades
00:02<goodger>Lance4: yes, probably
00:04<chealer>!tell Lance4 about volatile
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00:11<Lance4>I give up
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00:19<EricBSingelton>is there any lenny packed with lustre 1.6.7?
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00:21-!-toshiaki [~toshiaki@] has quit [Quit: Saliendo]
00:21<dondelelcaro>Irssi 0.8.12 (20071006) - shrink 2
00:22<dondelelcaro>]/win shrink 4
00:22<dondelelcaro>sorry; stupid keyboard is making it annoying to type
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00:23<ivan_>hay alguien
00:23<ivan_>o toy mas solo
00:23<ivan_>ok me mudo de irc
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00:24<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
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00:25<meshuggah>hola chealer
00:26<meshuggah>hola amigos
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00:26<chealer>saluti meshuggah
00:26<EricBSingelton>is there any lenny packaged with lustre 1.6.7?
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00:27<meshuggah>chealer how was your exam?
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00:29-!-mode/#debian [+l 373] by debhelper
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00:32<chealer>EricBSingelton: if you mean lustre 1.6.7 packages in lenny, no. if you mean lustre 1.6.7 packages for lenny, I don't know (the unstable packages would probably work)
00:33<chealer>meshuggah: I should have said it was a quiz. but I got a perfect score, modulo a badly formulated question.
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00:39<meshuggah>why do i get often a little window saying me 100% of /usr used, and when i check, i have like 500Meg free
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00:41<linux01>i have nvidia fx5600 card with dual head and i think i have it configured corrrect but my main screen shows everything fine and my 2nd screen wont go above 640x480 res and it gets recognized as CRT
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00:42<meshuggah>how cna i set up midi on debian lenny?
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00:44<aardvarX>linux01, have you looked into xrandr or urandr?
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00:46<linux01>aardvarX: not sure what that is...
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00:49<PiklesOnFire>linux01, xrandr can be used to set your screen resolution
00:49<PiklesOnFire>linux01, look into it on google, the linux man page is posted there
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00:51<aardvarX>if you use lxde setup, type in lxrandr
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00:52<compguy1011>how do i kill the xserver?
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00:54<chealer>compguy1011: the deadly way is Ctrl+Alt+Backspace
00:54<aardvarX>cntrl alt backspace - the 3 finger salute
00:54<compguy1011>but that restarts it
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00:55<aardvarX>but it kills it first :P
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00:55<compguy1011>k, how do i kill it then keep it killed?
00:56<goodger>good question. for some insane reason debian uses only four runlevels, so there's no multi-user-without-X mode
00:56<compguy1011>k, how do u install nvidia drivers then?
00:57<chealer>!tell compguy1011 about ngd
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00:57<compguy1011>it says it needs to be in multiuser mode but with xserver shutdown
00:57<chealer>compguy1011: why do you want to stop X?
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00:57<deas>hi to aLL,i am getting error for configuring printer via web, after clicking add printer it is saying 403 forbidden
00:57<compguy1011>cuz nvidia says i have to
00:57<goodger>compguy1011: if your instructions are from nvidia, they are incorrect
00:57<chealer>compguy1011: nvidia-installer?
00:57<goodger>do _not_ use nvidia's installer
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00:58<compguy1011>ya, u said get the latest ones from
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00:58<goodger>I'm certain nobody here said that
00:58<compguy1011>ok, well i did apt-get install nvidia-gtk
00:58<compguy1011>o well, someone did haha
00:59-!-mode/#debian [+l 379] by debhelper
00:59<compguy1011>and i went to my package manager and it has like 5-6 nvidia things already installed
00:59<goodger>compguy1011: follow the instructions from
00:59<goodger>I think you mean nvidia-glx, incidentally
00:59<compguy1011>yea haha
01:00<compguy1011>ok, gonna go have a smoke and ill give it a poke
01:00<goodger>it's probable if the drivers are already installed that you just need to change "nv" in your xorg.conf to "nvidia"
01:00<goodger>however, if the drivers are not installed, this will stop X from loading
01:00<compguy1011>ok, brb ty
01:03<goodger>*tut* smoking indeed
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01:05<aardvarX>smoking blunts while setting up debian equals problems.
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01:06<goodger>indeed, any form of substance abuse with any operating system equals problems
01:07<aardvarX>there is a good chance you might forget a step
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01:08<goodger>or die of lung cancer, indeed
01:08<compguy1011>haha back, ok gonna give it a shot
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01:14<compguy1011>goodger, ok, little lost, it says run m-a auto-install nvidia-kernel${VERSION}-source what goes in the version? i have the file: on kernel: 2.6.26-1-686
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01:14<goodger>compguy1011: delete the .run file, you won't need it
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01:15<compguy1011>so like? mv 123.x like that? sorry new to linux
01:15<goodger>it wants your kernel version
01:15<goodger>but really you should be able to install from the debian repositories
01:16<goodger>do you have nvidia-kernel-2.6-(anything) installed?
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01:16<compguy1011>k, i tried that but it gave me this: blake@debian:~$ m-a auto-install nvidia-kernel${2.6.26-1-686}-source
01:16<compguy1011>bash: nvidia-kernel${2.6.26-1-686}-source: bad substitution
01:16<compguy1011>um, u mean in package manager?
01:17<compguy1011>synaptic package manager i searched for nvidia and it has like 5 things installed already
01:17<goodger>list them
01:17<compguy1011>k, 1 sec
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01:20<compguy1011>goodger, nvclock, nvidia-glx, nvidia-glx-dev, nvidia-kernel-2.6.26-1-686, nvidia-kernel-common, and xserver-xorg-video-nv
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01:21<goodger>compguy1011: is there an nvidia-kernel-2.6-i386 or something like it?
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01:22<compguy1011>arnt i using 686 though?
01:23<twb>I installed console-setup and now on the console, my "Caps Lock" key is no longer Control.
01:23<twb>How do I make Caps Lock a control key on the linux console?
01:23<compguy1011>twb, good question haha, new to linux sorry
01:23<dpkg>well, capslock is "dumpkeys | sed 's/58 = Caps_Lock/58 = Control/' | loadkeys" turns capslock into control for all vc's. For console-setup, add 'ctrl:nocaps' to XKBOPTIONS within /etc/default/console-setup.
01:23<goodger>compguy1011: might be... is there a -2.6-686?
01:23<twb>gsimmons: thanks.
01:24<compguy1011>yes there is
01:24<twb>XKB on the console is... unsettling.
01:24<compguy1011>goodger, yes
01:24<goodger>compguy1011: install that one, it will automatically drag in new versions of nvidia-kernel to match your kernel
01:24<compguy1011>ok, was the other one the 26. something the wrong one? shall i del it?
01:25<compguy1011>blake@debian:~$ uname -r
01:25<goodger>no, that's the specific one; 2.6-686 is the generic one, and brings in the specific one for you
01:25<goodger>(see also: virtual package)
01:25<compguy1011>kinda lost on why that would work but ok 1 sec
01:26<goodger>then edit /etc/X11/xorg.conf and change "nv" to "nvidia" under "devices", and log out
01:26<compguy1011>k, 1 sec
01:26<twb>I enabled uvesafb mode=800x480-32 on my Eee PC 701, and with small fonts, it's REALLY fuzzy.
01:26<twb>How can it be fuzzy at a native resolution?
01:27<goodger>twb: inefficient antialiasing?
01:27<compguy1011>hey twb i know im new but a friend of mine had one of thoes netbooks like u have, he installed ubuntu remix and loves it, just a thought
01:27<twb>So the next question is: how do I disable antialiasing?
01:27<twb>I mean, Terminus is supposed to be a bitmap font FFS
01:28<twb>(Incidentally, I asked #debian-eeepc first, but they are asleep.)
01:28<goodger>twb: ah, if it's not the antialiasing I can't help. can you provide a screenshot? NB. I have no idea how you'd do that
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01:29<compguy1011>nothing has changed
01:29<goodger>compguy1011: note the lack of the word "nvidia" anywhere in that file
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01:30<blarson>!tell twb about screenshot
01:30<goodger>under device, add: [tab]Driver[tab][tab]"nvidia"
01:30<twb>blarson: uh that advice is unhelpful for fb consoles
01:31<goodger>where [tab] is obviously replaced by hitting the tab key, and the leading spaces are not included
01:32<compguy1011>hehe got it goodger
01:32<compguy1011>k, so just restart x now?
01:32<goodger>compguy1011: does it look like ?
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01:32<compguy1011>yes but didnt sudo haha, 1 sec
01:33<gsimmons>twb: Try fbgrab.
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01:34<goodger>I reckon the screenshot will not be fuzzy, in which case you need to check you're running at the actual resolution you wanted
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01:34<twb>nod, good idea
01:34<compguy1011>goodger, kudos it worked
01:35<goodger>compguy1011: to disable the irritating logo, see
01:36<compguy1011>haha, true, ok, 1 sec, and for the nvidia control panel? where would that reside
01:37<goodger>compguy1011: only accessible by hitting alt-f2 and typing nvidia-settings, afaik
01:37<twb>It doesn't appear to be antialiased in the screenshot
01:37<goodger>twb: looks wholly unfuzzy to me
01:37<twb>goodger: are there only two colours in the screenshot?
01:37<goodger>though it's small enough that my eyes try to make it look fuzzy
01:38<twb>goodger: blow it up to 4x size
01:38<compguy1011>no graphical settings window?
01:38<goodger>twb: at full magnification, it has two colours
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01:38<goodger>compguy1011: sorry, that should have been "gksu nvidia-settings"
01:39<twb>OK, so how do I isolate and bust up the fool app causing this problem?
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01:39<goodger>what resolution did you want?
01:39-!-domi [] has joined #debian
01:39<goodger>the screenshot is 640x480
01:40<goodger>(and really, really tiny --- I can't believe I used to use a computer whose entire GUI ran at that resolution)
01:42<simonrvn>i know... i ran at 832x624 for years too...
01:42<aardvarX>twb probably wants 800x480
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01:43<compguy1011>goodger, hm, nothing came of gksu nvidia-settings
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01:44<compguy1011>how about nvidia-settings in package manager? goodger
01:45<linux01>thanks to everyone that tried to help me with this dual head nvidia driver problems it finally works now
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01:46<compguy1011>ah ha! gott it
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01:52<twb>16:46 <aardvarX> twb probably wants 800x480
01:52<twb>aardvarX: nope, this is an eee pc
01:52<twb>"widescreen" bollocks
01:52<twb>16:43 <goodger> the screenshot is 640x480
01:52<twb>goodger: ah, thanks. It's *that* problem.
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01:53<aardvarX>twb i know, ive got an eeepc
01:53<linux01>if i'm dual booting between xp and debian lenny how can i access all the data on the xp partion/HDD??
01:53<twb>uvesafb is stupidly selecting a resolution that isn't native, because VESA doesn't have widescreen resolutions
01:54<twb>!tell linux01 -about ntfs-3g
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01:54<gsimmons>twb: Do you have v86d installed?
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01:54<twb>gsimmons: I do.
01:54<gsimmons>twb: Right, just checking.
01:54<twb>aardvarX: oh sorry, brain fart.
01:55<twb>aardvarX: you're right, 800x480 is what I want.
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01:58<aardvarX>twb, hmm i thought debian would autodetect that. i heard lxde works well on that setup. it even has the eeepc dashboard type setup if you want to use it.
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01:59<twb>aardvarX: lxde runs under Xorg.
01:59<twb>aardvarX: I cannot run Xorg because it is segfaulting.
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02:00<aardvarX>twb, hmm, i heard that debian works with eeepc. i havent tried it you though
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02:01<twb>aardvarX: Xorg only broke this morning
02:01<twb>aardvarX: normally it works fine
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02:02<goodger>you're on stable, though >.<
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02:02<aardvarX>so you installed lenny and everything worked?
02:02<linux01>goodger: how can i make sure my xorg.conf file gets loaded every time computer starts?
02:03<twb>aardvarX: no, I installed sid.
02:03<twb>aardvarX: I installed it before lenny existed
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02:04<aardvarX>i read that the lenny lxde install iso works with eeepc
02:04<twb>aardvarX: btw, personally I think lxde is a pointless wank. It's just openbox and a taskbar and file manager, not a "real" desktop environment.
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02:05<twb>I could combine ratpoison and thunar and fspanel and call it "twbde", but it would actually be anything.
02:06<goodger>first you use the word "wank" in a way that I've never heard of, and then you end your rant using TeX markup
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02:06<goodger>you're breaking my mind :P
02:06<twb>goodger: because </rant> is for filthy PHP weenies
02:06<aardvarX>yea, but it's mega light. And it has all the gui tools to play de - personally i love it.
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02:06<twb>aardvarX: it's "mega light" because it's not a DE.
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02:06<goodger>twb: surely that'd be <? end_rant(); ?>
02:06<twb>aardvarX: ratpoison is lighter than openbox, but we don't swan around going "ooh, look at our de"
02:06<twb>goodger: whatever
02:07<twb>I miss SGML's </>
02:07<goodger>SGML had that?
02:07<goodger>that's the one feature I've actually wanted to be added to xhtml
02:07<twb></> is shorthand for "close the matching tag"
02:07<goodger>yes, yes
02:08<twb>I guess the XML people felt that was "too easy".
02:08<goodger>well, it doesn't appear in HTML 1.0 either
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02:08<aardvarX>i think lxde is the super hot setup myself. it runs rings around gnome.
02:08<twb>HTML 1.0 won't document SGML semantics, because they're document in whatever the SGML spec is
02:08<twb>aardvarX: it doesn't *do anything*
02:09<twb>It's not fair to compare it to GNOME because GNOME is an actual DE
02:09<twb>You should be comparing it to stuff like icewm
02:09<twb>Or oroborous
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02:10<goodger>GNOME is a vast, obese, hulking monster that eats DIMMs with a spoon
02:10<aardvarX>ok, its better than icewm :P
02:11<twb>goodger: granted. But it's still not reasonable to compare lxde to it
02:11<goodger>however, it is more than a window manager
02:11<twb>goodger: OK, then something like icewm + icecc + some midnight commander clone
02:12<goodger>I also think it's better than KDE, and it seems a lot of people agree with me now that KDE 4 has been eventful
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02:15<Prathibha>Is there any link that provides details on how to boot the iso from harddisk instead of CD/DVD
02:15<aardvarX>lxde would be great on your eeepc, is all i'm trying to say.
02:16<jm_>in general ISO image will contain kernel+initrd, so it's the easiest to just boot using those
02:16<twb>aardvarX: I prefer a *lightweight* window manager without any pointless time-wasting manual window placement, decorations or panels, thanks.
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02:17<twb>i.e. xorg, ratpoison and xvt. The end.
02:17<pester>what's the alternate java jre besides sun's?
02:17<pester>open something
02:17<twb>pester: openjk
02:17<twb>pester: openjdk / icedtea
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02:18<pester>what repo is it in? non-free?
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02:20<pester>i'm not seeing it...
02:21<pester>i had it installed but i switched to sun's. not sun-java6-jre is crashing alot and i want to go back...
02:22<aardvarX>twb lxde is really perdy, n shiny - ratpoison is uugly, and too geeky.
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02:24<chealer>pester: main
02:25<pester>chealer: i'm not seeing it
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02:26<pester>chealer: <<< my sources.list
02:26<twb>goodger: I got it working
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02:27<twb>I had to install 915resolution (yuk) and use it to modify the VESA modes the BIOS claims to support, prior to modprobing uvesafb
02:27<twb>Now fbgrab | file confirms that an 800x480 image was taken
02:28<chealer>pester: you should
02:28<goodger>no more fuzzings?
02:28<goodger> /o\
02:29<pester>wierd. it's there now. thanks
02:29<twb>goodger: correct
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02:32<aardvarX>twb, sweet
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02:33<twb>Next question: I can type alt+n but not alt+shift+! in Emacs in Screen on the framebuffer console
02:33<twb>Is there a way around this?
02:34-!-mhash [~mhash@] has joined #debian
02:34<twb>Currently I'm just typing ESC shift+!, which is a PITA
02:34<twb>Particularly for things like M-1 M-(
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02:43<PiklesOnFire>evening all =]
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02:46<goodger>good morning, PiklesOnFire
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02:48<PiklesOnFire>sup goodger? lol, mighty slow in here at almost 3am
02:48<goodger>ten to seven here \o/
02:49<PiklesOnFire>rock on. haha
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02:51<PiklesOnFire>i'm in 9 deb channels and not a dang one has anything going on
02:52<twb>PiklesOnFire: you should start a brawl, then
02:52<PiklesOnFire>meh, brawls aren't my stile :p
02:52<PiklesOnFire>style* even
02:54-!-davius [~davius@] has joined #debian
02:54<dpkg>hello, davius
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02:56<PiklesOnFire>aye davius
02:57*goodger cannot believe anyone was so lonely as to engineer dpkg to say "hi" to them
02:58<PiklesOnFire>lmao... it was prolly designed for ppl who are lonely, not designed by someone who IS lonely... then again... if they had the spare time... they prolly aren't too popular w. the ladies :p
02:58<twb>PiklesOnFire: it's just a ping
02:59<twb>You use it for when you aren't sure if you lost connectivity
02:59<goodger>I don't believe popularity with the ladies [or men] is necessary, simply the ability to be liked enough to have someone aside from an automaton greet you
02:59<PiklesOnFire>ahahaha, that's true too goodger. and yes twb i'm aware that it's just a ping-back :p
03:00<PiklesOnFire>but it should say "you're still connected" not "hello" :p
03:00<twb>Note that a small but non-negligible portion of the population are neither ladies nor men.
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03:00<twb>Rick Moen wrote a paper on it in response to California's proposition whatever-it-was.
03:00<PiklesOnFire>::sigh:: this is true. my puppy is actually one of those non-boy non-girl types :[[[
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03:01<linux01>how do i change the channel my wifi card is on when its in monitor mode?
03:01<goodger>twb: "non-negligible" is subjective, and the notion of people being able to be neither male nor female is subjective also
03:01-!-mhash [~mhash@] has joined #debian
03:01<PiklesOnFire>linux01, use iwconfig
03:01<twb>goodger: well, medically speaking
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03:02<PiklesOnFire>linux01, with the channel option :]
03:02<twb>I'd dig up the URL but I can't be bothered.
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03:02<goodger>I contend that people with XY and XX chromosomes are male and female respectively until surgically altered to anatomically resemble the other...
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03:02<twb>goodger: those are only two possibilities
03:03<goodger>yes, hence why I mentioned those two chromosomal combinations explicitly
03:03<twb>Fair enough
03:03<linux01>how do i change what driver my wifi card is using?
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03:04<PiklesOnFire>twb, ooooor, in my dog's case... you can get a stone stuck in your penis... and then have the euretha re-routed where your balls WERE before the doctor cut them off and turned the hole into a vagaygay =[[[
03:04<PiklesOnFire>my poor puppy
03:04<PiklesOnFire>for those who sound things out and heard "gay"
03:04<PiklesOnFire>my gf is sitting w. me, i was trying to be... polite?
03:04<PiklesOnFire>linux01, what wifi card are you using?
03:05<goodger>"vagina" is perfectly polite, methinks...
03:05<linux01>netgear ma311
03:05<goodger>twb: there was a story in the news recently about a pregnant man... on inspection, it turned out to be a woman who'd had mastectomies and was taking testosterone (thereby placing her baby at some risk, I've no doubt), but was nonetheless milking the story for as much media attention as possible, for being the "first pregnant man"
03:05<linux01>it has the Hermesi chipset and using orinoco driver
03:06*goodger reckons he is heading for an OT hand-slap, but would be glad to continue the bioethics discussion on #debian-offtopic
03:06<linux01>i was under the impression that it had prism chipset
03:06<PiklesOnFire>linux01, you should just need to "modprobe -r [CurrentDriver]" and then run "modprobe [NewDriver]" assuming the new driver is compatible with the chipset.
03:07<PiklesOnFire>linux01, are you using airsnort?
03:08<linux01>trying to atleast
03:09<PiklesOnFire>::DOH!:: aircrack-ng, that's what i meant, sorry. it uses orinoco on mine as well, and i KNOW it's a prism card
03:10<linux01>sorry new to this not sure if they're the same program
03:11<PiklesOnFire>linux01, the drivers are different, but if you get ANY results to show it's working, don't worry if it seems out of place, at least, that's my recommendation
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03:13<linux01>i want to inject packets on the network and it doesnt allow it... not sure if different drivers will make a difference
03:13-!-shweppsi1 is now known as shweppsie
03:15<PiklesOnFire>linux01, sorry, do you know if your card supports packet injection? as i can't seem to locate any information on it...
03:15<linux01>no thats what im not sure of
03:16<linux01>also if i use the same card on windows...netstumbler shows a lot more networks around and thats not the case on lenny using airodump...
03:17<PiklesOnFire>i'm like 98% sure your card DOES NOT support PI, at least, from a simple google search, but again it's only 98%.
03:17<twb>PiklesOnFire: 98% sounds very precise.
03:18<twb>PiklesOnFire: wouldn't a qualitative term like "extremely" better express your level of certainty?
03:18<PiklesOnFire>twb, 98% is me giving 2% because i didn't see it on the first page of a google search for " (minus the quotes)
03:18<twb>Fair enough.
03:18<PiklesOnFire>"[his wifi card] linux packet injection"**
03:19<PiklesOnFire>twb, well, 2% margin for error is still enough that condoms that do a 99% job still have a warning on them :p
03:20<twb>My point was that you shouldn't use a quantitative value unless you actually measured.
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03:20<PiklesOnFire>"like 98%" isn't exactly quantitative
03:20*PiklesOnFire rolls eyes
03:20<twb>Sure it is.
03:20<twb>Valley girl quantities are still quantities
03:20<PiklesOnFire>valley girl?
03:21<PiklesOnFire>a) i'm a guy. b) i live NO WHERE near the valley and like, totally don't plan to :p
03:21<twb>PiklesOnFire: "it's, like, soooooo, like, vapid and, like, annoying"
03:21<PiklesOnFire>like o-m-geeeeee no waaaaaaaay
03:22<twb>facebook ajax facebook myspace myspace!
03:22<PiklesOnFire>lmao - ty twb, my gf just asked "what's ajax? like the dish washing detergent?"
03:22<twb>It's funny because the only time I hear about social networking sites is on the community radio stations
03:23<twb>"And you can hear our new song on our facebook page"
03:23<PiklesOnFire>yeah... sad, but true.
03:23<twb>I feel sorry for them like the white sailors probably felt sorry for the seemingly primitive islanders they passed back in 1750
03:23*goodger has facebook open permanently, for, ah, social reasons :P
03:23<twb>Having said that, I can't play a guitar...
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03:24<goodger>being 18 means that most of my friends are 18-25, and such people use facebook... besides, I'm afraid of telephones
03:24<twb>I simply don't have friends.
03:24<twb>Probem solved.
03:24<PiklesOnFire>twb, sounds like a true geek
03:24<goodger>and more problems created, indeed
03:25<twb>goodger: that is the way of the world, my friend.
03:25<erKURITA>PiklesOnFire I differ
03:25*PiklesOnFire wonders if anyone is offended by being called a geek on here?
03:25<twb>It's at this point I usually dig up a Blues Brothers quote or something
03:25<erKURITA>I love being called a geek, as long it doesn't have a pejorative connotation
03:25<twb>PiklesOnFire: it's nearly as much a compliment as "hacker"
03:26<erKURITA>geek as in "computer, I.T. lover"
03:26<goodger>we do not speak of IT here :P
03:26<PiklesOnFire>meh, hacker has lost it's glamor due to the media :[
03:26<twb>I sure don't like computers.
03:26<erKURITA>depends on what you mean "a hacker"
03:26<erKURITA>twb what are you doing on a Debian channel then ?
03:26<PiklesOnFire>erKURITA, i prefer geek to nerd any day
03:26<erKURITA>me too
03:26<twb>Computers are filthy devil machines which are a necessary evil because I'm too slow to perform beta reduction in my head.
03:27<twb>Hell, I can't even play chess without a chessboard
03:27*PiklesOnFire flames the gf because she's so n00b
03:27<twb>PiklesOnFire: that sounds unhygienic
03:27*goodger hates computers, but is sadly incapable of receiving communiques from his friends telepathically
03:27<PiklesOnFire>twb, you're confusing her with your beta reduction jibber jabber
03:28<twb>goodger: allow me to recommdend heliotropy or semaphore
03:28<goodger>twb: too bloody slow
03:28<goodger>I'd only end up building a small computer system to operate the semaphores anyway
03:28<twb>PiklesOnFire: you can tell her that real "computer geeks" are just mathematicians who got their hands dirty
03:28<PiklesOnFire>ew, i hate math
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03:29<PiklesOnFire>twb, seriously, i think i just gagged
03:29<twb>PiklesOnFire: then you're a "software engineer" instead
03:29<PiklesOnFire>twb, i prefer network and software security specialist ;p
03:29<twb>That's someone who doesn't know what they're doing, but can convince large corporations that they do
03:29<PiklesOnFire>that's bill gates
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03:30<twb>Ahh, security analysis. That's where you get to point out every time someone else screws up.
03:30-!-dr|z3d [~dr|] has joined #debian
03:30<twb>It's like being a football referee
03:30<twb>I love doing that
03:30<PiklesOnFire>plus, i get paid to fuck up, i mean, fix... other peoples problems
03:31<twb>The best part is that when you fix the problem, you introduce new problems.
03:31<twb>So you have a guaranteed revenue stream
03:31<PiklesOnFire>well, i'd never actually admit to that...
03:31<goodger>"the level of quality was quickly revealed to be high enough for usability but low enough to generate a steady stream of billable support hours" --- a recent WTF
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03:32<PiklesOnFire>LMAO sounds like aol...
03:32<goodger>AOL used to have free telephone support
03:32<twb>goodger: only if you had a telephone
03:32<PiklesOnFire>i used to work for em... back when they had that
03:33<goodger>one time, one of their people called me back very early in the morning with the solution to an extremely complex problem
03:33<goodger>I was extremely gratified
03:33<PiklesOnFire>plug it in?
03:33<twb>goodger: maybe it was MTU or window scaling
03:33<goodger>no, download a small tool to change windows' TCP MTU to 1420B
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03:33<goodger>no end of problems there
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03:34<goodger>changing the MTU to 1400 didn't work on linux, though, so I wasn't able to use that until I'd dumped them
03:34-!-domi [] has joined #debian
03:34<twb>We have an awesome problem with tcp_window_scaling because part of our network is thinwire, managed by a SunOS old-point-shit server
03:34<PiklesOnFire>i was sad when i found out i couldn't even use the free account they gave me because i use linux
03:34<PiklesOnFire>how lame
03:34<PiklesOnFire>ew, Sun
03:35<twb>PiklesOnFire: hey, Sun gave us NFS, NeWS and ZFS
03:35<twb>And NIS gets a four out of ten for effort
03:35<goodger>twb: and
03:35<twb>goodger: hahaha
03:35<twb>goodger: and java
03:35<PiklesOnFire>XFS ftw
03:35<goodger>they shall never, ever be forgiven for
03:35<goodger>nor java
03:35<PiklesOnFire>haha, i'm w. goodger on that one
03:36<goodger>ext3 ftw \o/
03:36<PiklesOnFire>java sucks as a language
03:36<vitamin4o1>ahha :)
03:36<PiklesOnFire>ext3, reiser, or xfs, i <3 em all
03:36<vitamin4o1>java is a good lang
03:36<twb>Java's one goal in life was to stop C++ coders using manual memory management. To that extent, it was a success.
03:36<PiklesOnFire>good lang? nooooo, c++ is a good lang :p
03:36<goodger>java may be a good language, but the mozilla applet continues to crash my firefox
03:37<PiklesOnFire>and old school coders LIKED manual memory management :p
03:37<goodger>"java is c++--" ~popular quote
03:37<vitamin4o1>yeah i love c++, but the ideology of java is also exellent
03:37<PiklesOnFire>meh, to each their own? power to the choices in linux?
03:37<twb>You wouldn't need automatic memory management if your variables were immutable
03:37*twb is an FP weenie
03:38*goodger is a pythonista...
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03:38<goodger>python somehow manages to combine automatic memory management with immutable variables
03:38<PiklesOnFire>i like python
03:38*Supaplex is snacking on sharp cheddar cheese mmmmm
03:39-!-mode/#debian [+l 385] by debhelper
03:39<goodger>it is, nonetheless, the best general-purpose programming language I have ever encountered
03:39<goodger>not least because it's the only one small enough to fit in my brain :)
03:39<Supaplex>!start a programming war
03:39<Supaplex>!start a programming language war
03:39<PiklesOnFire>ruby's coming along pretty well too
03:39<Supaplex>meh :P
03:40<vitamin4o1>is there anybody that like drinking beer
03:40<twb> runs Ubuntu now?!
03:40<PiklesOnFire>i'm drinking two right now!
03:40<manphiz>well, the 'with' statement in python mimic the RAII idiom in C++, which is nicer than GC
03:40<vitamin4o1>cheers, me too :)
03:40<PiklesOnFire>Supaplex, don't make fun of my meh
03:40<goodger>ruby's sole achievement has been to unleash rails upon the world, for which it shall also never be forgiven
03:41<PiklesOnFire>goodger, you have to give them credit, the fact that they have made RAD such a simple process... and that the code runs on windows, linux, and Macs is pretty impressive too
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03:42<PiklesOnFire>Ruby will hold a small place in my heart until linux starts using brainfuck as a programming language
03:42<goodger>meh, making a cross-platform compiler/interpreter isn't difficult, C's been doing it for four decades
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03:43<goodger>oh, crap, look at the time
03:43<PiklesOnFire>yeah, but making a language that speeds up RAD in the way that Ruby and Rails has done, is simply astounding
03:43<goodger>I have to go to college in twenty minutes :(
03:43<PiklesOnFire>goodger, you're in the UK correct?
03:44-!-debalance [] has joined #debian
03:45-!-davius [~davius@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
03:45<PiklesOnFire>across the pond was the only way for you to be 3 hours ahead of me :p
03:46-!-chitchat [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
03:47<goodger>make that at least 6, by my reckoning
03:47<goodger>it's 7:47 here
03:47<_>and i am gmt +3
03:47<PiklesOnFire>er... 4
03:47<PiklesOnFire>it's 3:47
03:48<PiklesOnFire>stupid timezones
03:48<goodger>_: that's the worst nick I've ever seen
03:48<goodger>PiklesOnFire: I must have got DST backwards
03:48-!-_ is now known as omg_onoez
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03:48<PiklesOnFire>omg_onoez, that's better
03:48*PiklesOnFire lolz
03:49<goodger>(it commences this sunday in europe, whereupon EST will be 5 hours behind
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03:51*goodger puts a stamp on his letter to the university's disability and dyslexia support service, wondering why he gets a free laptop for having a learning disability
03:51<twb>goodger: is it a good laptop?
03:52<PiklesOnFire>twb, who cares, it's a free laptop
03:52<twb>goodger: maybe they should've given you a free braille reader or something
03:52<twb>Those things are sweet
03:52<twb>The new rotating cylinder design is cool, too
03:52<goodger>I wouldn't have very much use for one, my eyesight is better than 20/20
03:53<twb>goodger: this is a university; it's not allowed to make sense
03:53<goodger>the laptops, however, are of decent spec for non-gaming
03:53<PiklesOnFire>do you feel in dyslexic too?
03:53<goodger>also, campus-wide wifi FTW
03:53<PiklesOnFire>goodger, mmm campus-wide wifi = yummy
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03:53<twb>PiklesOnFire: depends if it blocks port 22
03:54<twb>PiklesOnFire: and similar issues
03:54<PiklesOnFire>twb, nah, i can still use it for my needs
03:54<goodger>it doesn't block anything that the ethernet ports don't block...
03:55<twb>I hate universities
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03:55<twb>They need optimizing
03:55<PiklesOnFire>reformat them and put windows on em. when they blue screen, people will realize they can get the info they are paying thousands for, totally free, online
03:55<twb>They are like a PDP-11 that has been running airling booking code hand-written in machine code and maintained with undocumented binary patches for thirty years
03:55<goodger>I believe I will also be entitled to a "disability allowance" from the government, of some silly figure like £10k
03:55<twb>PiklesOnFire: they can't, that's the problem
03:56<PiklesOnFire>twb, crap
03:56<twb>PiklesOnFire: MIT's OCW is completely unintelligible unless you're an MIT student, for example
03:56<goodger>PiklesOnFire: you can't get a degree online, except from the open university, which is laughable
03:56<omg_onoez>u're lucky there, u have campus wi-fi,a lot of free hotspots... and we have to own our wireless provider to have some piece of free crappy wi-fi i-net access
03:56<twb>PiklesOnFire: probably the closest thing is wikibooks and wikipedia
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03:56<PiklesOnFire>goodger, you can't get the degree itself, but the books, the info, is totally there
03:56<PiklesOnFire>google - ftw, again
03:56<twb>PiklesOnFire: oh, are you talking about theft?
03:57<twb>PiklesOnFire: I thought you meant copyleft learning
03:57<PiklesOnFire>twb, uhm, i speak of no such thing...
03:57<goodger>PiklesOnFire: doesn't help one bit. you can have the knowledge, but the words "master's degree from cambridge" go quite far in terms of salaries
03:57<twb>goodger: well sure, if you care about salaries
03:57<goodger>twb: he was probably talking about copyright infringement, at worst, rather than theft
03:57<twb>goodger: hand waving
03:58<PiklesOnFire>goodger, well, yes... but that's what i'm saying. it's a waist to spend money on college when i can learn more from google than i can sitting in a class. some sort of GED should be given for college imo
03:58<twb>I don't consider that an acceptable substitute
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03:58<goodger>twb: I wouldn't be doing a degree if I didn't care about my salary... besides, I want to put Dr in front of my name, and it's quite low living costs during a recession
03:58<twb>Having said that, authors like Diestel get kudos for gratis, if not copyleft, publication online.
03:58<PiklesOnFire>twb, i do. i've learned more online than i have in a classroom
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03:59<twb>PiklesOnFire: were you by any chance in an IT-related course?
03:59<simonrvn>though the intarwebs doesn't improve your spelling ;).
03:59<twb>PiklesOnFire: because I don't think that's representative of the wider academented environment
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03:59<PiklesOnFire>simonrvn, the intrawebs does everything
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04:00<simonrvn>ok then, let's prove that "waist" is wrong there, you wanted "waste".
04:00<twb>For example, I bet it'd be hard to do the equivalent of three years of marine biology using copyright infringement, let alone copyleft and gratis textbooks.
04:00*PiklesOnFire has to go to bed, the gf is becoming parental in her ways of making me "sleep" and such
04:01<goodger>night PiklesOnFire
04:01<twb>PiklesOnFire: you mean like feeding you to make you sleepy?
04:01<PiklesOnFire>and simonrvn, i like waist better :p
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04:01<PiklesOnFire>twb, i mean like making me go to sleep... she won't go to bed til i do. haha
04:01<PiklesOnFire>peace all
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04:02<goodger>twb: I may have learned more during the time I've spent running my own business than I will during the 4+ years I spend at university, but the latter will be more important in terms of my ability to get an obscenely high-paying job in the event that the business fails
04:03<twb>I think I'd rather be dead than in a high-paying yet soullessly boring job
04:03<goodger>it doesn't have to be boring
04:04<twb>If it was fun, they wouldn't give you money to do it
04:04<goodger>not necessarily
04:04<goodger>plus, with that kind of job, a lot of time gets freed up to work on interesting things
04:04<simonrvn>twb: you'd be surprised
04:05<twb>simonrvn: ssh, don't spoil my juvenile fantasies about how the world works
04:05<goodger>if I make a million pounds a year, I can easily afford to employ someone at £50kpa to fix particular bugs in Debian :P
04:05*twb retreats to a fort of ayn rand books and ratm cds
04:05<simonrvn>eew ayn rand.
04:06*simonrvn is more the opposite libertarian (i.e. left)
04:06<twb>Hey, as a linguist I thoroughly enjoyed that book, whatever it was called.
04:06<goodger>the only exposure to Ayn Rand I have is "all that is ours was once flushed down your toilets. here's our library---" "nothing but crumpled porno and Ayn Rand!"
04:06<jm_>hmm is it normal to add given host to a LDAP directory if you have users (for that host) in LDAP? to clarify, I am totally clueless about the subject, just came accross some docs which say to do this
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04:07<simonrvn>jm_: some orgs do that, some don't. it's certainly easier in some ways to do that.
04:07<twb>jm_: ldap is not something for the clueless to try
04:08<jm_>simonrvn: do you know why it's done that way?
04:08<jm_>twb: indeed, that's why I am steering clear of it :)
04:08<twb>jm_: possibly you add host objects to keep samba happy?
04:08<twb>Unless I've misunderstood the question...
04:08<jm_>twb: could be, the docs don't say why that step is performed
04:09<simonrvn>coupla reasons i can think is because since the user is already there, why not add the host too? also, host-based auth / access to other hosts or services. another is to simplify management.
04:09<twb>I know that CIFS needs a sort of faux user account for each client machine
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04:09<twb>Maybe you're also using LDAP instead of DNS, for getent hosts :P
04:10<jm_>ok thanks for the input
04:10<twb>People used NIS that way once
04:10<simonrvn>hosts in ldap is like an extended /etc/hosts ;)
04:10<jm_>twb: naah, but perhaps the document assumes that - haven't gone through all of it yet
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04:10<goodger>this is the sort of horror /me is glad to have avoided, having not gone into the information technology industry
04:11<twb>Is there a framebuffer terminal that isn't shit?
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04:11<simonrvn>i used to do it here but i had a lot of hardware shuffling to do and did, and haven't updated.... (no biggie though, small network ;)
04:11<twb>I mean, I really only want "simple" stuff like underline support and bold-means-bright
04:11<jm_>twb: possibly the best option is to use GTK apps on FB
04:11<twb>libvte blows
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04:12<twb>Having said that, pango ain't so bad as all that...
04:12<frolic>Witch netbooks your guys thinks that is more debian friendly?
04:12<simonrvn>pango is the better part of that...
04:12<twb>frolic: there is good support for the Eee PC.
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04:12<twb>Is fbgtk in Debian? I can't see it...
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04:12<simonrvn>tried fbterm?
04:13<twb>simonrvn: yeah, that's plan B
04:13<twb>simonrvn: er, jfbterm is plan B
04:13<frolic>twb, Do you know anything about dell models?
04:13<simonrvn>j ?
04:13<twb>frolic: my boss runs Ubuntu on one, I believe
04:13<twb>simonrvn: it does CJK
04:13<jm_>twb: how about this -- libgtk-directfb-2.0-0 - The GTK+ graphical user interface library - DirectFB runtime
04:14<twb>jm_: yeah, sorry, I'm falling behind in the conversation
04:14<simonrvn>ah, extended support for asian charsets and such
04:14<twb>jm_: dunno how to use it, though
04:14<twb>simonrvn: the nice thing about jfbterm is it uses GNU Unifont
04:14<twb>simonrvn: the downside is that font is quite big, and I mainly want latin-1, greek, and box drawing characters
04:14<simonrvn>hm. i wonder if fbterm does too.
04:15<twb>simonrvn: if fbterm the same as bogl-bterm?
04:15<simonrvn>yeh, that bugged me about fbterm (tried it once)
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04:16<twb>simonrvn: apparently not
04:17<simonrvn>similar, but not quite
04:17<frolic>twb, I am comparing dell, hp and Asus, and I would do like to see comments about users that tried. Your boss complain about his dell?
04:18<twb>frolic: yes, but we always complain
04:18<twb>frolic: I can't remember what the complaints were
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04:18<twb>frolic: send me a reminder to and I'll forward it on to him
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04:19<frolic>twb, hehe. Ok, thank you. :)
04:20<twb>Another console question: what is the equivalent of "xset dpms force off", i.e. to turn off (not just blank) the screen?
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04:23<jm_>twb: hmm so far all docs I found say build apps against gtkfb, which can't be right, also found this --
04:23<weasel>dpkg --get-selections | awk '$2!="install" {print $1}'
04:23<weasel>echo "really purge these [y/N]?"; read ans; [ "$ans" = "y" ] && dpkg --purge `dpkg --get-selections | awk '$2!="install" {print $1}'`
04:23<dpkg>weasel: I'm not sure, is it larger than a breadbox?
04:23<weasel>wrong window.
04:24<twb>jm_: I nastily suspect LD_PRELOAD vodooo is called for
04:26<simonrvn>weasel: heheh, and hello
04:26<jm_>twb: hmm you think? it's worth trying I suppose
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04:30<deas>jm_ hi i configured printer for client using ipp but getting error as pdftops-options: -cfg /etc/cups/pdftops.conf
04:30<jm_>it would be nice that the package included a readme if it was just preloding the lib
04:30<deas>PID 11072 (/usr/lib/cups/filter/foomatic-rip) stopped with status 3!
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04:31<deas>Job stopped due to filter errors.
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04:33<jm_>deas: hmm I'm sorry but I don't know how to fix that - I suppose one can run the same commands manually to debug it further, but I never looked into it -- set debug loglevel in cupsd.conf
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04:35<lore17>can someone help me get my sound working in debian lenny please. Alsa seems to be working and isnt muted but no sound comes out of speakers
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04:36<sts>hello folks! i'm building a debian package. i've got a problem with dpkg-genchanges, which complains about missing files when i haven't done the build for the second architecture: "dpkg-genchanges: warning: duplicate files list entry for file package_1.2.3_i386.deb. dpkg-genchanges: failure: cannot fstat file ../package_1.2.3_amd64.deb: No such file or directory". i've got a debian/controls file with Archtectures: amd64 i386. i'm doing the build using dpkg-buildpackag
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04:36<jm_>lore17: do you have .asoundrc file with some crap in it? try renaming it, also verify that all mixers are unmuted ('amixer scontents' lists them)
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04:38<twb>fbterm doesn't implement underlining :-(
04:38<twb>Apparently it doesn't implement C-@ (Ctrl+Space) either...
04:39<lore17>jm_: i dont have a .asoundrc file, and all mixers are unmuted
04:39<jm_>hmm looks like very few people use FB these days, otherwise there would be far more info abotu GTK + FB
04:39<jm_>lore17: I've seen so many people claim that before, but they weren't - another option is wrong output/mode etc.
04:40<twb>jm_: yeah, that's been the case for a decade
04:40<lore17>what is output/mode?
04:40<twb>jm_: it's because they all want their stupid firefox
04:40<lore17>how do i configure that?
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04:40<jm_>some cards allow you to select analog/digital, toggle headphones etc - it's typically done via toggles in alsamixer
04:41<jm_>twb: well there's hardly anything else as suitable
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04:43<lore17>ah, alsamixer says analog devices under "chip:", i dont think the computer has a serarate headphone jack, it is a desktop and alsamixer wont let me change headphone volume from 0
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04:44<lore17>correction, it will, but it also has another headphone slider which is always at 0
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04:45<jm_>paste amixer scontents on pastebin
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04:45<lore17>how do i use pastebin? sorry if a stupid question
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04:45<blarson>!tell lore17 about pastebin
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04:46<twb>jm_: where "suitable" doesn't mean "I need it to do my job", but rather "I need it to waste time on flash / social networking / web forums"
04:46<jm_>twb: heh
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04:48<lore17>thanks blarson
04:49<lore17>jm_: here is output from amixer
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04:52<jm_>lore17: this definitely looks OK to me, what kind of card is this? how are you testing? where did you look for .asoundrc?
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04:56<lore17>jm_: I think this is my card, (i got that from lspci), i looked for .asoundrc in my home directory and in /root
04:56<lore17>jm_: im testing by playing music tracks through mpd and ncmpc, which will play the songs but there is no sound
04:58<jm_>lore17: tried speaker-test? beware, your volumes are very high and this produces some noise
04:59<lore17>jm_: ive tried running speaker-test, and no sound
05:00<jm_>lore17: hmm looks like an old chipset, I'm out of ideas sorry - probably best to try newer ALSA and ask on ALSA mailing list
05:00<lore17>jm_: ok, thanks a lot for giving it a go
05:01<lore17>jm_: if i try to compile the newest alsa, do i need to uninstall the old alsa first?
05:02<jm_>lore17: no, since it's part of the kernel - what's best is to get alsa-source from unstable, build it and then install the resulting package
05:02<jm_>lore17: is it the only card listed in /proc/asound/cards?
05:03<lore17>jm_: ah, yes
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05:07<lore17>the alsa-source file is a .deb package, do i just install with dpkg -i? or how do i build it first?
05:07<jm_>naah get a source package from alsa-source ;)
05:07<jm_>uhm for, not from
05:07<jm_>but you can try installing it first, maybe it'll work
05:08<jm_>otherwise just purge it
05:08<jm_>yeah doesn't have any specific dependencies, it shall work I suppose
05:08<jm_>after that just use m-a to build the modules
05:09<lore17>i have the source package
05:09<jm_>what's the filename?
05:10<jm_>that's not a source package, but go ahead and install it
05:10<lore17>ah ok
05:10<lore17>then m-a?
05:11<jm_>are there instructions in /usr/share/doc/alsa-source?
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05:12<lore17>there is a README.debian file
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05:12<jm_>it probably has docs about builtind it
05:13<jm_>blah typing
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05:13<jm_>m-a list will show which name to pass, after that it's just m-a a-i name
05:14<jm_>says alsa-source for me
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05:16<lore17>what is m-a list showing me? it lists a bunch of packages and says not found
05:17<jm_>the names of modules you can build, just do m-a a-i alsa-source
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05:19<lore17>ok its building now :)
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05:20<lore17>ok, is it installed now?
05:21<jm_>did you install the package it has built?
05:22<lore17>no, where would it put that package? it isnt in my current directory
05:22<Maulkin> /usr/src
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05:26<lore17>there is alsa-driver.tar.bz2, and the alsa source in /usr/src/modules
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05:26<lore17>is that the package? i need to extract it first?
05:27<jm_>it should build a deb file
05:28<jm_>lore17: ls -lrt /usr/src
05:29<lore17>jm_: here jed@yggdrasil:/usr/src$ ls -lrt
05:29<lore17>total 3040
05:29<lore17>drwxrwsr-x 3 root src 4096 2009-03-22 20:46 modules
05:29<lore17>-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 3086382 2009-03-22 20:47 alsa-driver.tar.bz2
05:29<lore17>drwxr-xr-x 18 root root 4096 2009-03-26 20:25 linux-headers-2.6.26-1-common
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05:29<petern>clever :D
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05:33<jm_>lore17: are you sure it built OK?
05:36<lore17>jm_: im doing it again to be sure, but it ran the m-a thing and said it was 'building alsa-source'
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05:37<jm_>lore17: no errors?
05:38<lore17>hmm, it may be taking longer this time though so maybe i didnt do it correctly last time
05:38<lore17>i dont think so, its still building
05:39<jm_>ok that sounds more like it
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05:42<lore17>jm_: great, it worked this time, i also think it installed it
05:43<lore17>should i reboot now to see if it worked?
05:43<jm_>no need to reboot, just rmmod the alsa modules loaded and try to load the new ones
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05:44<petern>wait, it plays but there's no sound? then you compiled kernel modules?
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05:45<jm_>verified mixer settings before
05:45<petern>not just... muted?
05:45<jm_>and made sure no .asoundrc was in the way
05:45<jm_> - mixer status
05:46<jm_>another thing to try would be headphone jack sense toggle
05:46<jm_>and line jack sense
05:47<lore17>which modules do i rmod and load?
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05:47<jm_>snd ones
05:47<jm_>and ac97
05:48<lore17>where do i grep for the snd ones? sorry
05:48<jm_>lsmod|grep snd
05:48<jm_>or /proc/modules
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05:53<lore17>ok, i rmmoded them
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05:55<lore17>do i modprobe the same ones i just rrmoded?
05:57<jm_>run depmod -a first
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05:57<davius>Is there a version of debian which can install on both amd64 and i386?
05:58<jm_>yes, i386 release can
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05:58<davius>i386 cannot install kernel with amd64 instructions ryt?
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05:59<jm_>it can, but userland is 32bit
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06:00<davius>well, i hear there's a single copy which can install userland in both 32 and 64 bit as appropriate.
06:00<davius>wanted to know which 1.
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06:00<lore17>jm_: eh, its still not working : \
06:00<simonrvn_>maybe you're thinking of the triple-boot cd that was made for etch?
06:01<simonrvn_>was x86, amd64, ppc
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06:01<jm_>yeah not sure what you're after - otherwise there are 32bit libs for amd64 release too
06:02<jm_>lore17: did you verify it loaded new version of the module?
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06:03<davius>i have a desktop which runs amd64 and a lappy which has p4. One copy which can install the appropriate instruction sets in both, instead of having 2 dvds.
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06:04<jurg>How can I tell apt-get NOT to install certain packages even if they're listed as deps?
06:04<lore17>jm_: maybe, i did "lsmod | grep snd" again and the modules are there now
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06:04<jm_>lore17: run "dmesg" and look for what it said, compare to previous text
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06:07<davius>does amd64 work in i386 32-bit processor?
06:08<davius>but the reverse is true right?
06:08<XaeroOne>I am running etch with debian etch, debian-multimedia and repositories in that order in sources.lst, when I install something with aptitude where is the package download from if it is present in all three?
06:09<jm_>lore17: hmm does it say anything useful at all? can't see it here
06:09<weasel>XaeroOne: ask apt-cache policy
06:09<jm_>XaeroOne: apt-cache policy will tell you
06:09<lore17>i dont think so
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06:09<jm_>I was hoping it would at least mention driver version
06:09<marctw>anyone graphed linux memory usage in Cacti before?i cnat understand the the standard templated "Linux memory usage"
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06:11<XaeroOne>the reason I am asking is because I am thinking of upgrading to lenny, so I can keep the other repos in sources.lst without any issues right?
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06:11<darek>I have a problem, with sound card on my pc
06:11<darek>how to install soud card on my pc?
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06:13<jm_>lore17: ahh modinfo will show which one is being loaded
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06:13<jm_>XaeroOne: yes
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06:14<lore17>jm_: modinfo which module?
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06:14<jm_>lore17: the one for your sound card, probably snd_intel_something
06:15<jm_>snd_intel8x0 for old chipsets, and hda for new ones
06:15<lore17>jm_: yes, i think it is the new version
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06:18<lore17>yea, it was snd_intel8x0
06:18<jm_>lore17: then it's probably best to ask people who are familiar with it
06:20<lore17>jm_: ok, thanks again for your help, and for bearing with me and my newbie questions
06:20<jm_>no worries
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06:21<darek>how to find sound pilot on my laptot please!!!
06:21<jm_>what is sound pilot?
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06:21<darek>symantec...i think
06:22*bela Hi I often have problem with the name of my machine with the mail , where can I change it,
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06:30<petemc>bela: try being more specific
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06:32*jm_ always waits for petemc to jump in when the question is about SMTP :)
06:34<bela> petemc I got belaptop unknown, this is the name stored in /etc/hosts
06:35<petemc>in /etc/hosts , ensure you have foo
06:36<petemc>then hostname -f will output , and (exim at least) will use this as the primary hostname
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06:37<bela>petemc exim is need if i want to get or sent message from my machine, if I use thru browser i can remove exim, are you
06:38<XaeroOne>i had installed etch on a 2GB drive, was supposed to be a lite/minimal install and now I am out of space :-)
06:38<XaeroOne>I wanted to move the /usr and /vat to another paritition
06:38<jurg>How can I blacklist a package completely?
06:38<petemc>bela: some things still need a local mta
06:38<jm_>jurg: try pinning
06:39<XaeroOne>right now dev/hda6 is mounted as root, now how do i put edit fstab to mount /var and /usr in /dev/hda7?
06:39<jurg>jm_: Tried it, the package still comes in as a dep.
06:39<bela> XaeroOne you mean /var, yes, but you must create partition and deal with /etc/fstab
06:40<XaeroOne>I have the paritition and copied /var and /usr to hda7
06:40<jm_>jurg: did you verify that apt-cache shows the right priority for it?
06:40<XaeroOne>but what should I add in fstab?
06:41<jm_>jurg: what did you set priority to?
06:41<jurg>jm_: -1
06:41<XaeroOne>right now /dev/hda6 is mounted to /
06:41<jm_>jurg: sounds about right
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06:42<bela>XaeroOne it seem difficult to do it directly while the system is running, cause, you have to umount / ; i suggest to use a live CD, mount had7 and hda6 , copy the directories to hda7, then
06:43<jurg>jm_: I set 'Pin' to be 'release a=testing" and apt-cache policy shows me Package pin is the same as Candidate.
06:43<XaeroOne>yup, yup, I'm not booted from that os right now, I have done the copying
06:43<bela>XaeroOne create in fstab /dev/had7 /usr ext3 and leave / as hda6
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06:44<XaeroOne>and another one for /var as well right?
06:44<jm_>jurg: heh just tried it and it also installed for me
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06:44<XaeroOne>I'm moving both /var and /usr to hda7
06:44<jurg>jm_: :\ So no easy way to completely blacklist a package? I thought that was one of the uses of pinning :\
06:45<jm_>jurg: me too, until now
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06:46<bela>XaeroOne you 'll get a problem, you need to have a partition for /usr and another for /var, otherwise the system attaces automatically /var to /
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06:49<XaeroOne>so if i understand correctly: you can have /usr /var /home etc all in / and mounted all at once but if you split them then you need to have seperate partitions for eah of the /var /usr /home dirs?
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06:51<bela> XaeroOne by default a directory is attached to / if it is not declared as partition.
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06:52<bela> XaeroOne you can split your hda7 in 2 partitions 7 and 8 and mount usr in 7 and var in 8
06:52<XaeroOne>i'm sorry I'm a new linux user, so you'll have a explain a wee bit more ... :-)
06:52<XaeroOne>I don't want to do that, it is one huge 10 gb partition and have all my data in there
06:52<bela>XaeroOne what are you running know
06:53<XaeroOne>so I can just create symlinks
06:53<XaeroOne>that should work right?
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06:53<fabiounibo>how are you?
06:53<bela>no symlinks run if you are in the same partition
06:53<lore17>coudnt you mount sda2 as another name, e.g. /media/partition2, then have both /var and /usr in it and then just point to them under /?
06:53<XaeroOne>I am running etch and want to uppgrade to lenny but running shot on space
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06:54<bela>I think, since you are new to linux, to install dirctly lenny it is fast, save before important files.
06:54<XaeroOne>good thing I asked before I screwed it up :-P
06:55<XaeroOne>I have a slow connection 256kb/s
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06:55<XaeroOne>it'll take a few hours
06:55<bela>you need the CD1
06:55<jm_>XaeroOne: try apt-get clean first
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06:56<XaeroOne>that will give me 400MB of space
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06:56<jm_>delete all the porn
06:56<bela>upgrading takes too long, cause in fact you reinstall everything, all packages has changed
06:56<XaeroOne>is 800MB space enough to upgrade etch to lenny
06:56<jm_>apt-get -s dist-upgrade will tell you how much space it needs
06:57<jm_>add some more]
06:57<XaeroOne>porn was deleted last time i was running short on space :-D
06:57<bela>Why you don't install lenny ? just get cd1, you do your partition as you want
06:58<XaeroOne>before i do apt-get -s dist-upgrade I would need to add lenny to sources.lst right?
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06:58<jm_>yes and do apt-get update
06:58<XaeroOne>I think, I'll have to do that now
06:59<XaeroOne>anyway thanks for the help, saved me a disater if I did it on my own
06:59<bela>XaeroOne you'll get space pb, lenny is bigger than etch
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06:59<XaeroOne>I mean it would have been a disaster if I did it on my own thinking ti would work
06:59<XaeroOne>damn I can't type today
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07:09<binarymutant>when I use svn+ssh for alioth it just hangs, what's up with that?
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07:21<Wesley_>When I boot up my debian system, the terminal gets all scrambled and unreadable
07:21<Wesley_>im not able to get the machine online, and i dont know whats wrong with it as im unable to read anything
07:22<jm_>try using different mode/disable fb altogether if it's enabled
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07:23<Wesley_>I have no idea what that means exactly jm_
07:23<Wesley_>but ill google
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07:24<jm_>Wesley_: vga=foo to specify different resolution, or vga=ask to get a list of some basic modes, disabling fb depends on which driver is in use
07:25<Wesley_>ah i can set that on the grub boot option
07:25<Wesley_>i hope
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07:26<jm_>or just edit the command line in grub, no need to alter your default config file that way
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07:27<Wesley_>think its my vga card or whatever
07:27<Wesley_>also bios has the same garblage
07:27<Wesley_>still readable tho
07:27<jm_>as in hardware problems? could be then
07:28<Wesley_>well that sux
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07:44<dr|z3d>!ops qimo spamming
07:44<dpkg>Hydroxide, bob2, caphuso, dondelelcaro, doogie, eeyore-, ElectricElf, ):, helix, ljlane, LoRez, RichiH, mentor, Netsnipe, TML, walters, xk, abrotman, gravity, azeem, Maulkin, stew, peterS, Alife, Myon, Ganneff, Maulkin, weasel, zobel: dr|z3d complains about: qimo spamming
07:44<qimo>qe haces?
07:44<administrador>donde estas qe no te veo?
07:44<dr|z3d>!ops administrador spamming also
07:45<dpkg>Hydroxide, bob2, caphuso, dondelelcaro, doogie, eeyore-, ElectricElf, ):, helix, ljlane, LoRez, RichiH, mentor, Netsnipe, TML, walters, xk, abrotman, gravity, azeem, Maulkin, stew, peterS, Alife, Myon, Ganneff, Maulkin, weasel, zobel: dr|z3d complains about: administrador spamming also
07:45<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
07:45<qimo>atras tuyo :)
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07:45<dpkg>Por favor use #debian-pt para ajuda em portugues ou #debian-br para ajuda em portugues do brasil. ( /join #debian-pt )
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08:38<frunsk>where would i go about getting recent stable version of evolution? (2.26
08:39<dr|z3d>aptitude install evolution ?
08:39<jm_>gnome 2.26 will be available in experimental in a while
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08:43<frunsk>jm_, a while means how long?
08:44<jm_>frunsk: when 2.24 enters testing
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09:16<Prathibha>How to install debian from the iso image stored in the windows partition
09:17<@Ganneff>burn it to a cd/dvd. boot from it.
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09:17<Prathibha>Ganneff, I don't have a CD/DVD. I want to install directly from hard disk
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09:22<jm_>Prathibha: I told you earlier - iso has kernel + initrd that you can use to boot with
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09:47<Zathraz>Hi. Since (I think) we upgraded an Etch servers FindUtils package from 4.1.20-6 to 4.2.28-1etch1 the daily run of updatedb/find causes a change of atime of files/dirs. Anyone any idea how I can avoid this?
09:48<jm_>Zathraz: do you know what atime indicates?
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09:48<jm_>so why do you think findutils can influence this?
09:48<Zathraz>access time. So it is true: the files were accessed
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09:49<jm_>(as in, why it wouldn't update it with older version, but it does update it with a newer version)
09:49<Zathraz>but the previous version seems not to alter the atime and therefor the verify job of backup sw did not report all kinds of files as being "new"
09:49<jm_>backup software relying on access time? now that sounds wrong
09:49<Zathraz>I agree
09:50<jm_>if anything it's the kernel/mount options that affect this
09:50<jm_>but I can't possibly see how it would only affect findutils
09:50<Zathraz>fortunately it's the verify job which shouts this bs instead of the actual job so all files are backuped
09:50<Zathraz>kernel was not updated
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10:17<bremner>is there a painless way to nicely printout a "web site" (interlinked set of html files). something like find dir -name '*.html' -exec renderhtml
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10:32<tetrimino>do somebody know how to install moodin engine for splashscreens?
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11:02<zedboy>what the heck is up with apache-common in lenny
11:03<stew>zedboy: can you ask a more specific question?
11:04<stew>zedboy: do you really mean apache-common or apache2.2-common?
11:04<zedboy>never mind
11:04*zedboy was trying to get libapache-mod-php5 working on an apache2 machine
11:05*zedboy couldn't figure out why php was already working
11:05*zedboy is having a stressful morning
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11:08<EmleyMoor>Is there a way to connect to a network for which I would use SecureClient on a Windows box, from lenny?
11:09<petemc>theres a linux secureclient is there not
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11:10<EmleyMoor>petemc: I think there was, for certain ancient RedHats... but nothing I can find now
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11:12<EmleyMoor>Anything that is about now I can't see haw to set up for this situation
11:13<EmleyMoor>how, even
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11:13<bremner>EmleyMoor: can you say more about what this SecureClient is? Is it a microsoft product?
11:14<petemc>checkpoint vpn
11:14<EmleyMoor>It's a Check Point product
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11:16<bremner> AFAIK, cisco is the only proprietary vpn supported in lenny. But that is just from "apt-cache search vpn". So I could be way off. I assume you checked to see if Check Point had a linux client
11:16<EmleyMoor>I did and that's how I found out about the ancient RedHat version
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11:19<zeroXten>hmm, where can I find docs on adding lenny packages under etch? Ie a mixed system?
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11:19<EmleyMoor>zeroXten: Do you have a reason to stay on etch?
11:20<EmleyMoor>Simple backporting is often the safest way of upgrading/adding packages to an earlier release
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11:21<Peke>alguno a tenido problemas con gconf estos ultimos dias
11:21<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
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11:23<zeroXten>hmm, dont' really want to upgrade everything, but need a newer version of php
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11:25<EmleyMoor>zeroXten: Have you looked if lenny's php packages can be built against their dependencies in etch?
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11:25<zeroXten>hmm, not yet
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11:28<EmleyMoor>zeroXten: I would find out exactly how much you would need to build - if it's not much, follow the instructions I am about to send, but replacing sid with lenny, for each package you need to build...
11:28<EmleyMoor>!tell zeroXten about ssb
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11:29<zeroXten>bah, needs libc6 > 2.7... i know thats not gonna work on etch
11:29<zeroXten>well, full upgrade it is
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11:33<NYankovskiy>Hi, could anybody help me with the problem? I'm trying to xinit on remote server, but it returns an error xinit: Connection reset by peer (errno 104): unable to connect to X server
11:34<NYankovskiy>если есть кто-то, кто может помочь на русском - будет даже лучше))
11:34<dpkg>Russian speakers, please use (Pogalujsta, zajdite na) (Pazhaluista, zahodite na) #debian-russian @
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11:37<NYankovskiy>so, can anybody help me?
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11:39<az>NYankovskiy: LANG=C
11:39<dpkg>polska -> (on Also, pl is a common extension for perl scripts and is sometimes used as an abbreviation for "packet loss".
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11:41<Saajan>Hi there. Can i install debian having only 1st dvd disk ?
11:41<Saajan>Whith kde and codecs ?
11:42<petemc>i would imagine so
11:42<petemc>well, not sure about codecs
11:42<petemc>most people use http mirrors
11:42<Saajan>So i can download them
11:42<bremner>Saajan: kde yes. Codecs are problematic.
11:42<az>Saajan: u need just net install + internet
11:43<az>u can download all packages via apt-get install packagename
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11:43<az>apt-cache search UCANSEARCH
11:43<az>apt-cache show LOOKPACKAGE
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11:43<az>best is debian netinstall because then u can install what u wanna
11:44<az>if wanna install gnome just apt-get install gnome
11:44<az>and w8 +- 30min
11:44<Saajan>Using mplayer :)
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11:44<NYankovskiy>pls, what can i do wrong? I cannot start x server on remote machine, i've spent two days trying to resolve the problem and really need your help
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11:45<extreme>hello i have setup gnome desktop on debian 5.0 and it has a problem with identify keystrokes
11:45<dpkg>dmm is probably Debian Multimedia, a repository of unofficial Debian packages, not in Debian for patent-related reasons, maintained by Christian Marillat. For information on how to use this repository, see or ask me about <dmm etch> <dmm lenny> <dmm squeeze>.
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11:46<extreme>when i type D onmy keyboard on my remote debian desktop its showing character F
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11:48<extreme>any help guys?
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11:50<nosklo>extreme: remove the D key with a knife and put it in the place of the F key :P
11:51<zeroXten>should I see "The following packages are BROKEN: ... libc6" when upgrading from etch to lenny?
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12:12<compguy1011>trying to mount a usb drive in debian5 which mounts fine in fedora10, error: Invalid mount option
12:13<data-K>write the command here ??
12:13<compguy1011>? i just plug it in and it says it cant mount it
12:14<compguy1011>it shows the drive, so i know it sees it
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12:15<data-K>it can be for multiple reasons, basically the first one (yes, stinks like ntfs)...right?
12:15<dpkg>ntfs is, like, Windows NT's filesystem. There are 3 main drivers in Debian, a Linux driver only able to read and FUSE drivers able to write too. For information about the former, ask me about <ntfsro>. For information about the read/write access, ask me about <ntfsrw>. See also and
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12:15<compguy1011>yes it is ntfs
12:16<compguy1011>k well the linux driver wont even let me read it
12:16<data-K>mount -t nfts vfat/dev/yourdevice /media/usb u tried??
12:16<Lethalman>compguy1011: mh no just bad rule to the bot sorry :)
12:16<Lethalman>I was trying to find some howto to mount ntfs
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12:17<compguy1011>i dont have a vfat folder
12:17<compguy1011>Lethalman, ah
12:17<dpkg>hmm... ntfs-3g is a user-space NTFS driver with write support and good performance. It is available in Lenny, or through for Etch (ask me about <> for instructions and see Usage examples: Ask me about <user accessible ntfs>.
12:18<data-K>you can try ntfs-3g
12:18<data-K>sorry oops
12:18<compguy1011>it says its available in lenny
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12:18<Lethalman>a list of dpkg factoids?
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12:18<compguy1011>where abouts? package manager? sorry im new to linux
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12:19<adb>compguy1011: apt-cache show ntfs-3g
12:20<compguy1011>adb, i was told use apt-cache search before... difference from show and search?
12:20<bremner>compguy1011: try both?
12:20<compguy1011>i will :) just wondering
12:21<adb>not yet tried ?
12:21<compguy1011>search pulled it up
12:21<data-K>is in default repos... if you never touched the sources.conf then an apt-get install ntfs-3g will do it
12:22<adb>data-K: let him time to understand some tings ...
12:22<compguy1011>data-K, ya i added contrib & nonfree but it still pulled it up
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12:22<adb>things *
12:23<data-K>sure ;)
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12:27<root_>hey, i cant seem to get my bcm43xx working ( i tried the b43 fw cutter)
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12:29<zumbi>Golden|Wolf: have you check wiki pages?
12:29<Golden|Wolf>i installed the fw cutter method, didnt workinng
12:29<dpkg>Support for your wireless LAN device is dependent on the chipset within. Don't know what you have? Ask me about <what's my wireless>. Atheros: <atheros>, <madwifi>; Atmel: <atmel>; Broadcom: <b43>; Intel: <ipw2100>, <ipw2200>, <ipw3945>, <iwlagn>; Intersil: <prism>; Ralink: <rt2x00>, <rt28xx>; Realtek: <rtl-wifi>; TI: <acx100>; ZyDAS: <zydas>. See also: <wlan howto>, <wpa>, <killswitch>, <wmaster0>.
12:29<dpkg>zumbi: are you smoking crack?
12:29<dpkg>[b43] the new driver for modern Broadcom 802.11g wireless chipsets, included in Linux since 2.6.24. Use <b43-fwcutter> to extract version 4 firmware for this driver. USB devices are not supported (for 4320, see <rndis_wlan>). 802.11b-only devices and BCM4306 rev 2 are instead supported by the <b43legacy> driver. BCM4321/4322 not supported, ask about <ndiswrapper> or <wl>. #bcm-users @
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12:30<Golden|Wolf>yes not working :p
12:32<adb>try #bcm-users @
12:32<zumbi>i personally do not have a b43, but i have somebodies acer laptop with that driver working but not very well, he uses wicd to configure wireless networking, using wireless-tools is a real pain, he said
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12:34<zedboy>hm, how does gnome decide what resolution options to offer me
12:34<compguy1011>can someone pastebin their sources.list?
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12:36<NYankovskiy>adb: so let's continue here
12:36<adb>NYankovskiy: try reinstalling gdm : apt-get install --reinstall gdm
12:36<NYankovskiy> here is xorg log
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12:38<ndshacker>my 160 gb external hdd wont mount
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12:38<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, format?
12:38<ndshacker>it doesnt even see it there
12:38<ndshacker>errr... fat32 i believe
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12:38<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, "lsmod | grep usb" pastebin me the results of that plz?
12:38-!-jelmer_ [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
12:39<PiklesOnFire>(i'm assuming this is a usb drive?)
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12:39<ndshacker>its never been on a windows pc, and I just upgraded to 8.10
12:39<ndshacker>it is a usb drive
12:39<adb>NYankovskiy: for me, log seems ok
12:39<NYankovskiy>adb: Same problem
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12:40<adb>paste xorg.conf too
12:40<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, this may seem like a really dumb question, but does your usb drive have it's own power source?
12:40<ndshacker>yes it does, and no that isnt dumb
12:41<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, is the power cord plugged in to the usb drive? and are you having the usb drive go through a hub or directly to the compy?
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12:41<ndshacker>thats my lsmod
12:41<ndshacker>and i tried in a hub and directly to my pc
12:42<ndshacker>and my power cord is plugged in, since the light is on :p
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12:42<ndshacker>i also have two usb flash drives plugged in :|
12:42<PiklesOnFire>well, it looks like you have the correct usb drivers, and everything about the drive connections seems ok... can you do a "ls /dev/" and pastebin that to me as well?
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12:43<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, as well as a pastebin of your /etc/fstab && /etc/mtab, provided you have both those files
12:43<InkBottle>What group have I to add myself to for scanimage -L to work (it works when I am root)? (I added myself to saned but the access is still denied when I'm normal user
12:43-!-jelmer_ [] has joined #debian
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12:44<ndshacker>thast the ls dev
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12:46<ndshacker>mtab and fstab in one place
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12:46<adb>NYankovskiy: mv /etc/X11/xorg.conf /etc/X11/xorg.conf.orig
12:46<PiklesOnFire>aganin, ndshacker ty
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12:47<ndshacker>no thank you
12:47<adb>NYankovskiy: done, and than "dpkg-reconfigure xserve-xorg"
12:47<adb>NYankovskiy: done, and than "dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg"
12:48<ndshacker>Piklesonfire, just so you know, it should be recognised as sdb1
12:48<PiklesOnFire>btw, i think i know what may be wrong, but before i dive into it, i'd like to just point something out to ya, the light on the usb drive doesn't always mean it's plugged in, my usb drive for instance only requires it's external power supply when it's routed through a usb hub, if it's directly to the computer, it will always draw power from the motherboard
12:48<NYankovskiy> │ Use kernel framebuffer device interface?
12:48<adb>NYankovskiy: no
12:49<ndshacker>ok then, but my iomega always needs the power source
12:49<NYankovskiy>Autodetect keyboard layout?
12:49<adb>NYankovskiy: no
12:49<ndshacker>so in this case it does signify it being plugged in
12:49<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, i have one last thing i'd like you to pastebin for me plz, if you could copy a "ls /dev/disk/by-uuid"
12:49<adb>NYankovskiy: ans so on ...
12:49<adb>NYankovskiy: and* so on ...
12:49<PiklesOnFire>ah, ok, good to know :]
12:49-!-ranix [] has joined #debian
12:49<ranix>I did an apt-get source links
12:49-!-fxiny [] has joined #debian
12:49<ranix>where did the source unpack?
12:49<ndshacker>so many list commands :D
12:50<ranix>I checked /usr/src and /usr/share/src
12:50<NYankovskiy>well, done
12:50<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, i'm going to help you add an fstab entry to keep this problem from coming back, hopefully :p
12:50<NYankovskiy>adb: done
12:50<ndshacker>its only two lines, sure i cant pst that here?
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12:50<adb>NYankovskiy:test the new X
12:50<ndshacker>04C4-FAE6 deb2ebb4-0570-4110-98c0-f987b6d93259
12:50<PiklesOnFire>go for it
12:50<ndshacker>da54392d-8ca2-4750-8899-62de6fc7f06e ECB3-5E99
12:50<Woet>how to resolve this?
12:50<data-K>root_ I have an old Acer laptop, gave me some probs but is working with bcm43xxx I think... sorry I don't have here to check...
12:51<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, i'm sorry i need ls -l /dev/disk/by-uuid
12:51<ranix>Can anybody tell me where my source goes when I "apt-get source foo" ?
12:51*PiklesOnFire smacks self "DOH!"
12:51<ndshacker>ok, but the drive isnt there :\
12:51<adb>ranix: /usr/src ?
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12:51<NYankovskiy>adb: (EE) Failed to initialize GLX extension (Compatible NVIDIA X driver not found)
12:52<ranix>adb: ah it puts it in the pwd
12:52<ranix>that's terrible
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12:52<adb>NYankovskiy: uname -r ?
12:52<ndshacker>gparted doesnt even see it
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12:52<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, have you tried cfdisk /dev/sdd?
12:53<InkBottle>and I don't have a scanner group, only a saned group
12:53<ndshacker>what will that do?
12:53<ndshacker>thats not the hdd
12:53<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, it appears it's /dev/sdd, but for some reason it's not reading the partition head, which is why you're not getting a /dev/sdd1 in /dev
12:53-!-parsix [] has joined #debian
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12:53<ndshacker>no thats really not it :( thats a flashdrive
12:53<NYankovskiy>adb: 2.6.26-1-amd64
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12:54<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, you're on ubuntu correct?
12:54<LiCeT>hi all
12:54<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, kk, gimmie a sec see what i can findz
12:54<PiklesOnFire>hola LiCeT
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12:54<adb>NYankovskiy: comment > Load "glx"
12:54<ndshacker>I figured since Ubuntu was debian based that you guys could help
12:54<LiCeT>hi Pikl :)
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12:55<adb>NYankovskiy: or paste the new xorg.conf
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12:55<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, tbh, i recently switched from arch to debian testing, just so i can have a rolling-release distro that has fglrx support. but i did ubuntu support on their channnel for some time, so i'm more than willing to try and help anyone :]]
12:55<ndshacker>ok :)
12:55<ndshacker>i tried arch, was to complex for a newbie
12:56<PiklesOnFire>i <3 arch, but they just decided to drop fglrx from the core, and make the users work on it
12:56<fxiny> *untu* is not supported here
12:56<amphi>hey fxiny
12:56<fxiny>amphi: hey :)
12:56<ndshacker>er... ok?
12:56<adb>fxiny: hey
12:56<PiklesOnFire>which, in a way is good, it may help get amd to start supporting linux, but that's pretty off topic lolz
12:57<ndshacker>lolz yep
12:57<fxiny>adb: hi :)
12:57<amphi>fxiny: I made a nice layout for gimp
12:57<fxiny>amphi: floating gimp ?
12:57<metalqga>sinking one
12:57<ndshacker>geez, i wish i hadnt upgraded to 8.10
12:57<amphi>fxiny: no
12:57<fxiny>metalqga: long time !
12:57<ndshacker>it was working fine before this ;(
12:57<metalqga>fxiny: hi
12:57<adb>NYankovskiy: ok, test is ok ?
12:58<InkBottle>I installed sane-util and I don't have a scanner group, any idea why?
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12:58<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, can you try to unplug the usb device, run "sudo /etc/init.d/hotplug restart" then plug the device back in?
12:58<amphi>fxiny: tabbed layout for image windows, and a small Full for the toolbox
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12:59<ndshacker>command not found
13:00<metalqga>amphi: nice one
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13:00<fxiny>amphi: no floating ? i have ediff floating and Xmessage , and Navigator going sytraight into W 2
13:00<amphi>metalqga: thanks; and yes, 'sinking one', exactly ;)
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13:01<metalqga>fxiny: tomorrow F1 aus!
13:01<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, hm, that might be the problem :p h.o. a sec :]]
13:01<sassi>yeh and kimi will win :P
13:01<adb>NYankovskiy: add in Section "Device" >> Driver "nvidia"<<<
13:01<amphi>fxiny: not floating - transients float, but the toolbox and image windows are sunk
13:01<ndshacker>but i restarted with it plugged in
13:01<ndshacker>shouldnt it recognise it on reboot?
13:01<PiklesOnFire>it should
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13:02<amphi>fxiny: 'where gimpLayout = (tabbedLayout ****||* Full)' - dragPane combinator
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13:03<fxiny>amphi: ahhhhh layout combinator ? nice ! have you done : xprop | grep WM_CLASS ?
13:03<fxiny>amphi: for the toolbox ?
13:04<amphi>fxiny: WM_WINDOW_ROLE to unfloat the toolbox and image windows
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13:04<amphi>fxiny: the default manage hook floats the transients
13:04<fxiny>amphi: that's how i'm sending iceweasel to W2 : , resource =? "Navigator" --> doF (W.shift "2")
13:04<adb>NYankovskiy: i presume you used m-a to install nvidia driver, viewing your old xorg.conf
13:04<fxiny>amphi: is still navigator , hhahaah
13:04-!-AliTarihi [~quassel@] has joined #debian
13:05<InkBottle>modprob -v scanner Module scanner not found
13:05<amphi>fxiny: '(className =? "Gimp" <&&> fmap ("toolbox" `isSuffixOf`) role) --> (ask >>= doF . W.sink)' to unfloat the toolbox
13:05<fxiny>amphi: anyway that layout looks interesting
13:05<fxiny>amphi: nice one !
13:06<amphi>fxiny: I tried the withIM based one, but there were anomalies
13:06-!-parsix [] has left #debian [Konversation terminated!]
13:06<amphi>fxiny: focusing the toolbox would change the focused image window
13:06<amphi>fxiny: with Full also, so it's not an artefact of [my] tabbed layout
13:06<NYankovskiy>adb: just made chages to xorg.conf , but it refuses to start :(((
13:07<amphi>PiklesOnFire: xmoand is in debian ;)
13:07<amphi>er, xmonad
13:07<ndshacker>pikls: any other ideas?
13:07<ndshacker>its basicly where i store everything
13:07<ndshacker>including a paer due in a few days
13:07<adb> amphi fxiny, etc try #xmonad . i added for you this channel
13:07<amphi>fxiny: BTW, apropos the unfloat, 'where role = stringProperty "WM_WINDOW_ROLE"'
13:07<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, i'm reading right now, which doesn't seem to be too helpful, bit it's the issue you seem to be having
13:08<amphi>adb: you are too kind ;)
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13:08<PiklesOnFire>amphi, it may be in debian, but this chat isn't for the support of specific software, that's what offtopic is fore ;p
13:08-!-geenna [~geenna@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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13:08<amphi>offtopic is for raving, not for support of any kind ;)
13:09<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, omg, read the comment before the last, that seems to have solved it, try that plz :]
13:09<fxiny>adb: as a debian user i'm talking with a debian user about setting xmonad right in lenny , so i stay here unless a known op tells me to move
13:09-!-jelmer_ [] has joined #debian
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13:09<PiklesOnFire>and amphi that's true too i guess :p
13:09<ndshacker>sudo invoke-rc.d dbus-1 restart
13:09<fxiny>adb: and i do not like joining offtopic
13:09<amphi>fxiny: I'm not using lenny, I must confess
13:09<fxiny>amphi: i know :)
13:10-!-aen [~aen@] has quit []
13:10<fxiny>amphi: but i am using it :)
13:10<amphi>fxiny: adb has made a pleasant, if spartan, #xmonad here
13:10<ndshacker>couldnt find the package
13:10-!-sagitarius [~sagitariu@] has joined #debian
13:10<fxiny>amphi: here in oftc ?
13:10<amphi>fxiny: yes
13:10<fxiny>ok . give me a minute
13:10<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, if you try to install hal and hal-device-manager, it doesn't work?
13:10<jonathan_>I am trying to update to 8.10 and my system is giving me an error about the pgp key and that it can not be found. Any assistance would be appreciated, public or private.
13:10<bremner>why not #xmonad on freenode? it is quite active
13:11<fxiny>adb: ok ok .
13:11-!-compguy1011 [] has joined #debian
13:11<ndshacker>E: Couldn't find package hal-device-manager
13:11<PiklesOnFire>jonathan_, try google plz? (not to be rude, but will turn up thousands of results for that issue)
13:11<fxiny>amphi: i need 5 minutes , cat duty ;)
13:12<fxiny>adb: ^^^
13:12<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, what ver did you say you were using?
13:12<goodger>!tell jonathan_ about ubuntu
13:12<ndshacker>updated from 8.04 last night
13:12<fxiny>bremner: because i prefere oftc :)
13:12<goodger>!tell ndshacker about ubuntu
13:12<jonathan_>piklesonfire, no problem, never offended
13:12<InkBottle>Still no-one having any idea about why I can't access my usb-scanner when I'm not root?
13:13<goodger>PiklesOnFire: the practise here is to ask ubuntu users to seek help in #ubuntu, due to ubuntu being a buggy piece of tripe
13:13<fxiny>goodger: nice one !
13:13-!-erwan [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:14<goodger>fxiny: thank you
13:14<ndshacker>ive noticed
13:14<ndshacker>is debian any better?
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13:14<fxiny>goodger: tripe is not good even for crouton :P
13:14-!-jelmer_ [] has joined #debian
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13:14<PiklesOnFire>goodger, i'm aware, but for a usb device issue, i figged i'd still try to help ;p
13:14<petern>oh, another attack of the ubuntu users?
13:14-!-scientes [] has joined #debian
13:14<goodger>ndshacker: sorry, but we really cannot help you with ubuntu --- we simply have no way to tell how it will behave
13:14-!-spechard [] has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 30 seconds.]
13:14<gravity>It's not even that ubuntu is bad or good
13:14<goodger>we appreciate that ubuntu dumps you into this channel by default in some clients
13:14<NYankovskiy>adb: xinit: Connection reset by peer (errno 104): unable to connect to X server same again (( and XKeepCrash
13:14<ndshacker>well, how hard is it to get on debian?
13:14<gravity>The actual policy is that Ubuntu users should get help in their appropriate channel so that Debian users can get help here without having it clogged by legions of Ubuntu users.
13:15<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, sadly, i'm out of ideas, and this is where the voice of the chat is correct, i can't assis=[
13:15<ndshacker>because i will happily switch since ubuntu hates me
13:15<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, debian is EASY to set up and install and use
13:15<gravity>We want to make sure that Debian users have a place to get help for their distro.
13:15<goodger>gravity: I like my phrasing better :D
13:15<amphi>ndshacker: lenny is very pleasant
13:15<InkBottle>is there a group for usb?
13:15<ndshacker>gravity, for the longest time i thought this was the ubuntuchannel :(
13:15<goodger>ndshacker: there are a number of ways to install debian; the recommended method is with a network install
13:15<PiklesOnFire>gravity, goodger, i like goodger phrasing better as well
13:15<gravity>goodger: But it's untrue and assholish
13:16<goodger>gravity: I am assholish in general. complaints to /dev/null
13:16<petern>i <3 the netinst cd
13:16<PiklesOnFire>goodger, haha, wb btw :]
13:16<goodger>thank you, PiklesOnFire
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13:16<ndshacker>heh peeople, dot most deb files work on debian lol?
13:16<adb>NYankovskiy: that's my xorg.conf >
13:16<PiklesOnFire>petern, i <3 usb image ;p
13:17<ndshacker>so iwont lose my fav programs?
13:17<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, debian and ubuntu are NOT binary compatible
13:17<goodger>ndshacker: debian invented the .deb format, so I dare say they will continue to work
13:17<goodger>of course, many .debs are built for ubuntu nowadays, so it is hit and miss.
13:17<PiklesOnFire>that is, they have slight changes to each other that will keep certain things from working 100% correct
13:17<goodger>though debian has larger repositories of debian-maintained software
13:17<ndshacker>so i should dual it first?
13:18<goodger>probably not worth the bother of dualling tbh
13:18<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, debian has far more apps than ubuntu, i'd say you'll prolly not need a dual boot, you can prolly find your app in the deb repo, if not in some 3rd party repo for sure
13:18<ndshacker>well people have told me that ubuntu is beating out their "grandpa"
13:18<ndshacker>so i wasnt sure abour program availabilty
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13:19<PiklesOnFire>ndshacker, ubuntu is like... well, windows for linux users, it still holds your hand, debian doesn't do so much hand holding and lets you fudge up on your own, rather than it fudging up for you ;p
13:19-!-kristianpaul [~kristianp@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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13:19<ndshacker>so debian lets you shoot your own foot, ubuntu does it for you
13:20<fxiny>adb: nice idea :)
13:20<PiklesOnFire>debian lets you shoot your own foot, ubuntu shoots you in the shoulder ;p
13:20<fxiny>bremner: we are already 5 ;)
13:20<adb>fxiny: it's a gift for you
13:20<fxiny>xmonad rocks :P
13:20<data-K>shoots you in the shoulder and in the the night
13:21<ndshacker>it seems like the bad stuff happens in the night
13:21<fxiny>adb: me ? i've been told about dwm here long ago
13:21<goodger>ndshacker: for instance, ubuntu's recently added xorg configurator is quite good at generating xorg.conf files that don't work as advertised and/or crash the Xorg system upon boot; debian forces you, more or less, to make your own xorg.conf changes, which may of course be complete rubbish, but will at least not be computer-generated rubbish
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13:22<PiklesOnFire>goodger, perfect example XD
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13:22<petern>X is too simple these days
13:22<petern>when i was a lad
13:22<ndshacker>goodger so basicly debian wont baby us
13:22<petern>fields greener
13:22<petern>etc etc
13:23<goodger>notably, ubuntu was responsible for spearheading the effort to make Xorg failsafe
13:23<petern>we had to make our own modelines for all resolutions...
13:23<goodger>they seem to produce good ideas and poor implementations for those ideas
13:23<ndshacker>so whats your take on mint?
13:24<goodger>ndshacker: no, it will not baby you; but there is plenty of documentation and of course lots of friendly people here
13:24<ndshacker>Ive noticed :)
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13:24<amphi>petern: heh
13:24<goodger>I've never used mint, but I can only assume an ubuntu derivative would be even worse than ubuntu itself...
13:24<ndshacker>it wouldnt even boot on my computer
13:24<goodger>there you go, then :P
13:24<ndshacker>gave me like 60 I/O errors
13:25<amphi>mint is a deformed grandchild of debian? ;)
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13:25<goodger>I _have_ used ubuntu, debian, fedora, gentoo, arch linux, centos, suse and mandrake, however, and so far ubuntu was the first one that was usable, and debian the only one that's bearable nowadays
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13:27<ndshacker>i have cds for those
13:27<ndshacker>but nevar been brave enough to do most of them
13:27<ndshacker>ok they are telling me to reboot with the drive unplugged
13:27<ndshacker>I have to restart on this thing almost as often as under windows >.<
13:28<amphi>restart? ye ghods!
13:28<petern>i was shocked when i installed debian on my laptop yesterday
13:28<petern>i had to reboot it after it had finished!
13:28<goodger>ndshacker: one day, sit down with a virtual machine and install gentoo. it will teach you a tremendous deal about linux, and because it's in a VM, it won't ruin your system with its gentoo-ness
13:29<ndshacker>why not reccomend LFS?
13:29<petern>gentoo is fun
13:29<petern>i also like watching paint dry
13:29<amphi>installing gentoo will teach you an enormous amount about... gentoo
13:29<ndshacker>And its supposedly fast
13:30<goodger>it isn't fast when your CPU is being eaten alive by the compiler
13:30<petern>gentoo's installation instructions are great
13:30<goodger>anyway, short of installing a new kernel version, you never have to reboot under debian, or indeed ubuntu (the GUI tools lie!)
13:30<petern>they use colour to differentiate things
13:30<petern>so, er, once you've printed them out to follow them... errr
13:30<ndshacker>gotta restart this hunk
13:30<petern>only when your nvidia driver goes tits up
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13:31<petern>my system did not resume from suspend with nv. it does with nvidia.
13:31<goodger>I don't believe my nvidia driver has ever elevated its breasts
13:31<goodger>I was not previously aware of it possessing such appendages, indeed
13:32<Geek`N`Proud`>goodger: technically you don't even have to reboot for kernel updates
13:32<Geek`N`Proud`>there's technologies which can apply patches for CVEs to the running kernel
13:32<koollman>ksplice ?
13:32<Geek`N`Proud`>and that is what most critical Debian kernel updates are
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13:32<Geek`N`Proud`>koollman: yush
13:33<koollman>I don't think I would use that in production yet
13:33<gravity>goodger: Not really, wrt X failsafe in Ubuntu. Most of us were thinking about that before Ubuntu even existed.
13:33<goodger>Geek`N`Proud`: I was not previously aware of this
13:33<gravity>No one could act on it really with XFree86 holding the reins though
13:33<goodger>gravity: I'm sure, but working code for it appeared a suspiciously short time after ubuntu published their manifesto/spec/rationale document
13:33<Geek`N`Proud`>goodger: it's not in mainstream use at the moment, since the tools they provide are made for developers, not users
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13:34<goodger>Geek`N`Proud`: very good. of course, kernel updates are once every two months even on testing...
13:34<gravity>goodger: Which working code would that be?
13:34<goodger>gravity: the code that's currently in use in all Xes?
13:34<gravity>goodger: Totally different in concept and execution than what Ubuntu did.
13:35<Geek`N`Proud`>goodger: indeed =] which I am greatful for because I run an x86_64 kernel on i386 userland and compile from source xD
13:35-!-En3rgY [] has joined #debian
13:35<goodger>really? and it was a total coincidence that they happened to coincide?
13:35-!-anotherone [] has joined #debian
13:35<gravity>goodger: Ubuntu's variant always falls back if the server fails to load a bad driver. The current X server doesn't do this. It just picks the right one from the beginning.
13:35<goodger>well, that at least explains why this version isn't a kludgy hack
13:35<gravity>With no fallback if it fails
13:35<goodger>right. brb
13:36*gravity wonders which one of us was actually working on this problem
13:36<gravity>Oh yeah. That's right. Me.
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13:37<gravity>goodger: Ubuntu did publish a spec on launchpad. And I read it carefully and compared it to what I'd been talking with the developers about for months.
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13:40<goodger>thank god for that
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13:42<Geek`N`Proud`>gravity: is that feature in the Debian Lenny copy? ^^
13:42<gravity>Geek`N`Proud`: Automagic loading? I believe so.
13:42-!-nou [] has joined #debian
13:43<goodger>gravity: as I understand it, either system may boot X to a functioning state in the total absence of an xorg.conf
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13:43<gravity>goodger: Yes. This is an upstream thing.
13:43<gravity>That's been around for a long time, and is independant of what Ubuntu proposed and what I worked on.
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13:44<Geek`N`Proud`>I wonder how long upstart will survive
13:44<goodger>so this has nothing to do with the ubuntu manifesto, and it merely appeared during the lenny release cycle completely coincidentally to ubuntu's implementation
13:44<fxiny>Cadmium02: hey
13:45<gravity>goodger: It's not really coincidental. It was a common idea that floated around the Xorg and linux circles for a while.
13:45<Geek`N`Proud`>goodger: 90% of what is claimed to be Ubuntu features are actually features that exist in vanilla upstream anyway
13:45<Geek`N`Proud`>Ubuntu just decides to enable them before they become default
13:45<goodger>Geek`N`Proud`: upstart is a very good idea indeed. when it has been properly tested and had the (grave, I'm sure) bugs worked out of it, mostly by non-ubuntu people, it could easily replace sysv
13:45<goodger>Geek`N`Proud`: I'm well aware of that, and I'm well aware of the result
13:45<goodger>gravity: very good
13:46<gravity>goodger: It just became time to do it then. I wasn't able to work on it during the etch cycle because I burned all my time just switching us from XFree86 to Xorg, and from monolithic Xorg to modular Xorg. Even taking the Ubuntu work, it was still a ton of labor and prevented the autoconfig stuff from happening at that time.
13:46<Geek`N`Proud`>hmm, brb
13:46<goodger>sarge had xfree86?
13:46<goodger>good grief.
13:47<goodger>then again, I seem to remember sarge being in testing for about two years
13:47<goodger>I switched from ubuntu when etch was testing.
13:47<gravity>It was way overdue. And Branden was very patient about not jumping the gun on the X stuff and disrupting the release.
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13:48<gravity>And he shipped a very very good XFree86 when sarge was done as a result.
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13:49<goodger>the only good thing I remember about ubuntu was the internationalisation
13:49-!-fen [] has quit []
13:49<goodger>launchpad was really, really good at it, and installing languages as packages rather than embedding them in everything else was a good idea
13:50<Geek`N`Proud`>goodger: back in the days of Breezy Badger, Ubuntu was Debian Unstable with a more defined default desktop config
13:50<goodger>unfortunately, I haven't contributed to internationalisation in debian due to the lack of such an interface --- .po files scare me
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13:50<Geek`N`Proud`>but now it's got other benefits hehe#
13:50<goodger>Geek`N`Proud`: yes, so I recall. I used ubuntu since its inception...
13:50<Geek`N`Proud`>Like the Ubuntu trend is making .debs of proprietary software easier to get hold of
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13:51<Geek`N`Proud`>goodger: I used it since 4.10 or something like that, and I had to learn it all pretty fast (I had a Speedtouch USB Modem and a buggy GeForce 2 MX 400 that would cause random lockups)
13:52<goodger>my first attempt at using linux came immediately after my purchase of an ethernet router.
13:52<goodger>however, I was still using AOL, so unfortunately I couldn't get it to work until I switched ISPs around 5.04 time
13:53<Geek`N`Proud`>mine was before I had the net :(
13:53<Geek`N`Proud`>I found Knoppix in a popular PC magazine at the time
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13:53<goodger>I remember installing mandrake 8 back in the days of dialup
13:53<goodger>kde 2, etc.
13:54<Geek`N`Proud`>I wasn't lucky enough to get dial-up, heck I had Windows 3.1 when most people had Windows 98 >.>
13:54<goodger>ah. I was born in 1990, so I never quite got to suffer through windows 3.11
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13:55<Geek`N`Proud`>I was born in 1990 too ;-p
13:55-!-ubuntu_ [~ubuntu@] has joined #debian
13:55<goodger>a kindred spirit \o/
13:55<Geek`N`Proud`>my 1st PC was an 8086 Olivetti box with DOS.. with an epic 640kb RAM and 20MB hard disk
13:55<adb> so !ot #debian-offtopic is for you
13:55<Geek`N`Proud`>oops my bad
13:56<Geek`N`Proud`>be right back, I really need to reboot quickly
13:56<gravity>adb: Thanks
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13:56<goodger>adb: do you have a function aside from issuing periodic OT handslaps?
13:56<adb>goodger: not really
13:56<goodger>then you are essentially worthless. ho hum~
13:57<adb>it's enough , i guess
13:57<petern>ah, but is adb translatable to arabic?
13:58<adb>no some mac patern
13:58<adb>or maybe yes
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14:00<Geek`N`Proud>yay! Fixed opera's damn stupid nicing of every plugin
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14:01<fxiny>makke: raiseMaybe checks if is already running , runInTerm runs mutt in a term , why urxvt -e iceweasel and not just ", spawn "iceweasel") ?
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14:02<fxiny>makke: tabcompletion :)
14:02<goodger>Geek`N`Proud: is opera open-source yet?
14:02<PiklesOnFire>goodger, no
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14:03<makke>no problem, now i am up again ;)
14:03<Geek`N`Proud>goodger: nah, it probably never will be
14:03<Geek`N`Proud>goodger: it nices all plugins that use it's wrapper to 20
14:04<Geek`N`Proud>well.. till you use this barely document environment variable that you can only find on the mailing list
14:04<goodger>how unpleasant.
14:05<PiklesOnFire>i <3 opera. always have and always will... but i need opensource on my system, so iceweasel it is for me
14:05*amphi mumbles 'midori'
14:06<PiklesOnFire>amphi, i liked midori, but it just didn't render pages correctly most of the time
14:06<amjad>I want to input abc1, abc2,abc3 ... abc112 in a file. How can I do that?
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14:06<amjad>each on its online
14:06<amphi>it does here, well as much as my css lets it, but I'm building webkit and midori from git
14:07-!-linux01 [] has joined #debian
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14:07<amjad>got it, thanks
14:07<adama>amjad: for i in `seq 1 112` ;do echo abc$i >> file; done
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14:10<dpkg>hello, davius
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14:18<Geek`N`Proud>is there an IRC channel for wodim/cdrecord?
14:20<Lemonzest>Geek`N`Proud: i think its called #cdrkit
14:20<davius>hi! need help with iwlwifi
14:20<Lemonzest>very low traffic tho
14:21<davius>i don't find the /etc/udev/rules.d/z25_persistent-net.rules
14:22<Geek`N`Proud>I need to defeat some copy protections to make a CD backup
14:22-!-zeroXten [~fscott@] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
14:22<adb>davius: cat /etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules
14:22<Geek`N`Proud>there are tools available on the Windows platform to analyze the original disc in more detail
14:23-!-sagitarius [~sagitariu@] has joined #debian
14:23<cahoot>Geek`N`Proud: dd doesn't do the trick?
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14:24<Geek`N`Proud>cahoot: unfortunately not, infact there's nothing to quickly bypass read errors from what I can tell
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14:29<cahoot>Geek`N`Proud: ddrescue?
14:29<PiklesOnFire>cahoot, +1
14:30<PiklesOnFire>ddrescue is a good suggestion ;p
14:31<Geek`N`Proud>hmm i'll have to give it a gop
14:31<Geek`N`Proud>I wonder if Alcohol 120%'s CD reading ability will work in Wine (ignoring the whole virtual drive stuff that is :D)
14:32<cahoot>why not use windows for windows work?
14:32<keyser>why use windows when you can leave through doors
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14:36<fxiny>make sure is not a tall window with a suspended blade on it :P
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14:39<davius>hi! I'm unable to find wlan0 in my connections after i install iwlwifi
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14:40<amphi>davius: is the module loaded?
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14:40<davius>i've run modprobe iwl3945. how do i check if it has loaded?
14:41<PiklesOnFire>davius, lsmod | grep iwl3945
14:41<PiklesOnFire>if you see it, it loaded :p
14:41<cahoot>run dmesg - check for complaints about firmware
14:42-!-mastroquet_ [] has joined #debian
14:42<davius>i see four lines...
14:42-!-junix [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
14:42<davius>1. iwl3945
14:42<davius>2. iwl3945, mac80211
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14:43<PiklesOnFire>davius, that means it's loaded. lol.
14:43<davius>what should i do next?
14:43<amjad>I have 112 lines of text, each line has a word abc. I want to replace it with abc1 for line1, abc 2 for line 2 ... abc112 for line 112. How do I do that?
14:43-!-noid [] has joined #debian
14:44<PiklesOnFire>davius, use a nice gui to config your wireless? wicd i hear is good, i still use networkmanager personally
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14:45<davius>how do i detect which is my wireless device? because when i typed in the name wlan0, it says device not found (network manager)
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14:45<davius>the gui shows only eth0 and lo
14:45<PiklesOnFire>iwconfig will show you the wireless
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14:46<PiklesOnFire>you may need to run "ifconfig wlan0 up"
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14:46<cahoot>amjad: sed 's/abc/abc /g' 'file' seems to do it
14:47<davius>okay, i did that, no change.
14:47<amjad>cahoot, how do I add numbers 1 - 112 to abc?
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14:47<davius>i don't find iwconfig in my aptitude repository.
14:47<PiklesOnFire>davius, output of iwconfig?
14:47<amjad>cahoot, will it not just replace all abc with abc .
14:47<davius>well, i see wlan0 there.
14:47<cahoot>amjad: I obviously misread your question
14:48<PiklesOnFire>davius, iwconfig is a part of the wireless-tools package
14:48<davius>oh! that i installed this eve.
14:48<amjad>cahoot, actually I want to add numbers to abc
14:48-!-krc [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:48<cahoot>amjad: thought you wanted to replace 'abc'' with 'abc *'
14:48<PiklesOnFire>davius, then you should have iwconfig already installed :]
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14:48<davius>now, i see the details of wlan0 in iwconfig. does that mean it's working?
14:49<PiklesOnFire>it means it should be. davius, have a look @ this link
14:49<PiklesOnFire>it should help you out a lil bit (i have the same wifi card btw)
14:49<davius>i've been reading that page for more than 4 hrs now, without luck.
14:49<PiklesOnFire>srslyz? dang
14:49<davius>btw. it says ipw3945 is depricated.
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14:50<davius>and i am supposed to use iwl3945, which i did.
14:50<amphi>davius: that is indeed better - you don't need the revulsive daemon with that driver
14:50-!-sylarrr [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:51<PiklesOnFire>davius, amphi is correct, the new driver is much better
14:51<davius>okay. that's what i've installed.
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14:51<PiklesOnFire>davius, it should be working fine then. hopefully any ways
14:52<PiklesOnFire>i'll brb, time to restart xserver XD
14:52<PiklesOnFire>stupid fglrx
14:52<adb>davius: cat /sys/bus/pci/drivers/iwl3945/0000\:05\:00.0/rf_kill
14:52<adb>said/does what ?
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14:53<davius>returns 0
14:53<adb>"2" here , and don't have iwl3945 working ... rf-kill must be 0
14:54<adb>so you ok
14:54<adb>iwlist wlan0 scan
14:54<adb>try this scan
14:54<davius>well, it detects my wireless network.
14:54<adb>or wifi-radar
14:54<davius>is there a command to join it?
14:54<adb>install it
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14:56<davius>what next?
14:56<adb>now have to associate to a AP somewhere
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14:56<adb>it's up to you now
14:56<davius>how do i do that?
14:56<adb>read some docs
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14:58<davius>does that mean my hardware is working fine and i only have to join the network?
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15:04<davius>wifi-radar says could not get ip address.
15:04<dpkg>hello, davius
15:04*cdlu waits for it
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15:08<jlj>is there a way to see the total size of all packages installed by atp?
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15:09<Cadmium02>Is it possible to "vacate" some space on hard drive and format it as fat32 to be able to install windows and dualboot?
15:09<Cadmium02>is this even safe? or shold I se another hard drive?
15:09-!-En3rgY [] has joined #debian
15:09<Pitxyoki>What windows do you want to install?
15:09<En3rgY>cheers all
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15:10<En3rgY>1 question.. i get an error during the ETQW client : error while loading shared libraries:
15:11<jlj>Cadmium02: You can use the parted partition manager
15:11<Cadmium02>jlj, is that the name of utility? "parted partition manager" ?
15:12-!-adb [] has joined #debian
15:12<jlj>Cadmium02: yea "parted", it's in the debian repository
15:13<Cadmium02>jlj, I'll look into it, thanks
15:14-!-yxoc [] has joined #debian
15:14<Cadmium02>I just need windows for 15 minutes only, to update iphone, then I'm done with it. I probably should not mess with partitions
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15:14<patrikf>jlj: that should do it: dpkg-query -W -f '${Installed-Size}\n' | awk '{sum+=$1}END{print sum/1024, "MiB";}'
15:16<jlj>patrikf: thanks :)
15:16<patrikf>Cadmium02: you probably want gparted, a GUI for parted (which is a command-line utility)
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15:16<Cadmium02>patrikf, yep, found that. But I'm thinking of installing win on external drive
15:16<Cadmium02>I only need it for 15 mins, so no point in messing with partitions
15:17-!-davius [~davius@] has joined #debian
15:17<patrikf>Cadmium02: maybe wine will do then... or qemu
15:17<Cadmium02>patrikf, probably not
15:18<davius>I am unable to connect to a wireless AP. wifi-radar says "wmaster0: unknown hardware address type 801" while trying to connect.
15:18<chealer>jlj: yes (Synaptic will show that)
15:19<adb>davius: wlan0 must be associated , ignore wmaster0
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15:20<davius>is there simple program to connect to an AP, like there is in windows where u hv 2 select a detected AP, enter the WEP Key and connect.
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15:22<patrikf>davius: NetworkManager
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15:23<porno_>checkehier garnix
15:23<porno_>m,,us auf eRadio
15:23<davius>is network manager editor same as network manager?
15:25<davius>is network manager editor same as network manager?
15:25<adb>!tell davius about search
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15:27<adb>porno_: stop it !
15:27<davius>well, in fact i've installed network manager, but where do i find it?
15:28<zedboy>I've got eth1 as and dhcpd working on that interface, and eth2 dynamic-ip'ing and plugged into the cable router. from the local machine i can reach the outside world, but it's not NAT'ing - other machines on the network can ping/telnet this one, but can't reach the outside world
15:29-!-mode/#debian [+l 408] by debhelper
15:29<cahoot>davius: running gnome?
15:29-!-porno_ [] has quit [Quit: Verlassend]
15:29<dondelelcaro>zedboy: install ipmasq or similar, and configure NAT if you want the other machines to be able to access the outside world.
15:30-!-dpascal [] has joined #debian
15:30<cahoot>davius: then I'd simply restart gnome
15:30<davius>i did. where do i find it?
15:30-!-dpascal [] has quit []
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15:30<patrikf>davius: notification area
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15:31<patrikf>i.e. "systray" in windows terms
15:31<cahoot>davius: no small icon in the taskbar looking like two computerscreens?
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15:31<patrikf>davius: did you install the network-manager-gnome package?
15:31<davius>oh yes.
15:31<davius>and i see it.
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15:33<giuliano>ciao a tutti
15:34<En3rgY>what`s the name of the 32-bit-compatibility-package?
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15:34<En3rgY>or the libs are installed by default in lenny?
15:35<En3rgY>amd 64
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15:35<goodger>En3rgY: ia64-libs, methinks
15:36<goodger>they are installed as dependencies of anything that needs them, except nvidia-glx, I think
15:36<zedboy>dondelelcaro: i installed ipmasq.
15:36<En3rgY>i installed nv-glx manually
15:36<En3rgY>found-it thanks
15:36<zedboy>dondelelcaro: and i'm going thru the troubleshooting in the IP-Masquerade-HOWTO
15:36<zedboy>still not finding the prob :(
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15:38<En3rgY>im running lenny on amd 64 proc. for installing an x86 script do i need to type the linux32 command first in the console?
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15:41<dondelelcaro>zedboy: if ipmasq is installed and running, the output of iptables -L; ip addr; cat /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward; will be useful.
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15:46<zedboy>dondelelcaro: ok one sec
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15:49<EmleyMoor>Will Firefox 3 for Windows work in the version of wine in lenny?
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15:50<zedboy>dondelelcaro: /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward is 1
15:51<patrikf>EmleyMoor: besides, why would you need firefox to run under wine?
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15:55<gass>so ... today a new kernel for lenny went out?
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15:56<gass>is ther a place where we can check the load of
15:56*zedboy sees the problem
15:56<dondelelcaro>there are multiple mirrors, so...
15:56<zedboy>ipmasq isn't masquerading anything
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15:57<zedboy>dondelelcaro: the IP MASQ section of ipmasq -v's ouput is empty ...
15:57<gass>dondelelcaro, true ... i know that ... must be my room mate, downloading some warez
15:57<zedboy>dondelelcaro: so i'm obviously not convincing it to masq packets, even tho i see it's logging the requests (in dmesg)
15:57<gass>i am downloading linux-source package and getting a new one from security. at low speed
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15:57<dondelelcaro>zedboy: iptables -t nat -L; will tell you what's going on there
15:58<zedboy>dondelelcaro: it's blank - all 3 sectiosn (PREROUTING, POSTROUTING, OUTPUT)
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15:59<zedboy>dondelelcaro: but i'm not sure what to do to juice ipmasq into behaving nicely :(
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16:00<En3rgY>is there a way to use emerald with compiz-fusion? beryl gives me headaches..
16:01<daryl>Can I upgrade 32bit lenny to 64bit lenny for my athlon 64bit
16:01<gass>daryl, no ... you have to reinstall
16:01<dondelelcaro>zedboy: it's likely that having an odd interface configuration is screwing with things
16:02<dondelelcaro>zedboy: check out what default-if; outputs, and make sure that /etc/ipmasq/rules/A01interfaces.def and /etc/ipmasq/rules/M70masq.def look rreasonable
16:02<daryl>well crap lol i just installed 32bit oh well
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16:03<dondelelcaro>zedboy: if you just want to make it work immediately, /msg dpkg masq
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16:04<zedboy>dondelelcaro: it's taking EXTERNAL_IN and EXTERNAL_OUT from default-if | sort -u
16:04<zedboy>i windows if it's getting them backwards.
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16:06<chealer>gass: on 2009-03-20...yes
16:06<gass>chealer, it seems
16:06<gass>chealer, thanks
16:07<simonrvn>En3rgY: try out fusion-icon to fast switch between decorators, WMs, etc.
16:07<chealer>is there a command-line utility to test hostname resolution, that is using /etc/hosts/, as, for example, ping uses?
16:07<En3rgY>it doesn`t give the emerald option
16:08<En3rgY>only if i install beryl
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16:08<simonrvn>you need to have it installed ;)
16:08<En3rgY>wich is strange
16:08<En3rgY>what? beryl?
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16:09<deniz>is there such a thing as software that can tell if ur lying by hearing ur voice?
16:09<simonrvn>emerald and the theme manager for it
16:09<En3rgY>ok... working on it
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16:18<kop>If I want to change block device read-ahead to I have to run blockdev after every boot or is there a sysctl or something that can be set in a file somewhere?
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16:21<linux01>how can i access data that is on my windows drive......?
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16:22<simonrvn>linux01: /msg dpkg ntfs-3g
16:22<simonrvn>type that here
16:22<En3rgY>ntfs-3g is used only on vista?
16:23<blarson>kop: You could put the command in /etc/rc.local
16:23<simonrvn>En3rgY: what are you talking about?
16:23<En3rgY>ntfs 3rd generation
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16:23<En3rgY>is the filesystem used by vista
16:23<En3rgY>i think
16:23<simonrvn>how is that relevant to the FUSE ntfs driver?
16:24<En3rgY>or is it on xp too?
16:24<En3rgY>is not
16:24<simonrvn>ntfs is present on xp also...
16:24<En3rgY>but is not 3g
16:24<linux01>i have xp on one drive and lenny on another and few other external HDD's that are also ntfs
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16:24<En3rgY>as 3rd generation
16:24<Torsten_W>En3rgY: wrong
16:24<En3rgY>did you tried to browse the partition?
16:24<Torsten_W>En3rgY: ntfs-3g is the driver for all ntfs
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16:25<linux01>yes but they dont show any content..
16:25*simonrvn wonders where En3rgY got his info...
16:25<simonrvn>linux01: did you type "/msg dpkg ntfs-3g" in your irc client yet?
16:25<linux01>yes i did
16:28<simonrvn>did you read it?
16:28<linux01>yea didnt konw it sent me a message
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16:33<dgodfather>Hi everyone i have some small beginner driver devel issue
16:33<dgodfather>can anyone here help me? or redirect me to a more relevant channel?
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16:34<dgodfather>the problem is that i add the linux/module.h to my file, but it's giving me many compilation errors as i paste...
16:34<adb> ? #C ?
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16:34<Cadmium02>there was no .ssh folder in my home, after trying to connect to a remote server there is .ssh2/ in home dir. How do I make sure I connect ia ssh1 and not ssh2? does server determine this or client?
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16:36<adb>dgodfather: try ##C on freenode
16:37<dgodfather>adb, thanks i will, but i am talking about c not c#
16:37<dgodfather>still the same?
16:38-!-ItsMeWill [~william@] has joined #debian
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16:39<ItsMeWill>Anyone one have time for a newbie question?
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16:40<ItsMeWill>Anyone one have time for a newbie question?
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16:41<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. when I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, or if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask (ask the whole channel!). We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer, ask a few hours later or ask
16:41<adb>dgodfather: 1. i said ##C not c# 2. on freenode not here -on oftc -
16:42<Kilerhageman>What's the command to install sudo?
16:42<dpkg>well, sudo is (Substitute User DO) better than su, according to talon. It is able to give limited super user privileges to specific users, or can allow you to do silly things like run X apps with root perms, or good in scripts with "username ALL = NOPASSWD: /some/program", or or you need to setup /etc/sudoers first before you can use it (ask about <visudo>)
16:42<goodger>Kilerhageman: aptitude install sudo (run as root)
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16:42<ItsMeWill>How do i lnow what verof Debian to use? [alpha][amd64][arm][armel][hppa][i386][ia64 etc......
16:42-!-stevecotton [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:42<Geek`N`Proud>ItsMeWill: what computer do you have?
16:42-!-stuckey [] has joined #debian
16:42<goodger>ItsMeWill: who made your system's CPU?
16:42<Geek`N`Proud>what system do you currently use?
16:42<Lethalman>ItsMeWill: uname -a
16:43<Lethalman>ah lol
16:43<dgodfather>well thanks guys
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16:43<goodger>Lethalman: the fact that he's asking means he probably doesn't have debian installed yet >.<
16:43<ItsMeWill>dell 2950 2- Intel Xeon E5320 Clovertown 1.86GHz 2 x 4MB L2 Cache LGA 771 80W Quad-Core Active
16:43<stuckey>Does anyone know how to get MOC to play the songs listed in a directory in the other they're cue-tagged (i.e., the songs have cutags by tracks, track1, track2, etc.)?
16:43<goodger>ItsMeWill: i386, probably
16:43<Geek`N`Proud>ItsMeWill: i386 would definitely work.. amd64 might work
16:43<stuckey>Currently mine just lists and plays them in a random order.
16:43<Lethalman>goodger: I read "How di i know what version of Debian I'm using?" :) screen was too distant
16:44<valdyn>ItsMeWill: how much ram?
16:44<Geek`N`Proud>ItsMeWill: amd64 works on Intel CPUs supporting EM64T (64-bit)
16:44<ItsMeWill>ok i have i386 but it does not use all 21Gb of emory only 3gb ???
16:44<valdyn>ItsMeWill: use amd64
16:44<linux01>got ntfs-3g to work thanks guys
16:44<Pitxyoki>"No manual entry for sqrt" <- What package do I have to install to have access to the C functions' manuals?
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16:44<Geek`N`Proud>ItsMeWill: in that case amd64.. or you can install an amd64 kernel on an i386 install (which has benefits!)
16:45<Kilerhageman>What's the link to the WGET location for sudo for debian lenny?
16:45<goodger>ItsMeWill: it will use 4GB; windows XP uses 3GB, or something...
16:45<valdyn>ItsMeWill: are you going to have single processes that are > 2GB?
16:45<goodger>Kilerhageman: use aptitude install sudo, as I said
16:45<Geek`N`Proud>goodger: it uses 3GB on average.. as video ram and other forms of memory are added in
16:45<valdyn>goodger: it will use whatever his pci devices leave free, thats always less than 4G, sometimes close to 3G
16:46<ItsMeWill>in TOP it only shows 3gb
16:46<valdyn>ItsMeWill: we know.
16:46<goodger>Geek`N`Proud: I've never had to use windows with large amounts of RAM, frankly. it's rather amusing that this arbitrary limit exists in windows XP
16:46<Mr-R>ItsMeWill: you could try the kernel package "linux-image-2.6.26-1-686-bigmem". but if you want to use much memory in one app (database/java/etc.) you should switch to amd64
16:46-!-zedboy [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
16:46<valdyn>ItsMeWill: you really want to use an amd64 kernel for performance reasons on that hardware.
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16:47<ItsMeWill>Yes it will be a MYSQL server....... Ok so tart all over and use AMD64 TY
16:47<valdyn>ItsMeWill: depending on what you want to run you *might* need 64-bit userspace
16:47<goodger>ItsMeWill: do as valdyn says; he's seldom wrong
16:47<valdyn>ItsMeWill: thats probably a good idea either way since debian doesnt support a mixed kernel/userspace environment iirc
16:48<valdyn>ItsMeWill: meaning it provides no amd64 kernel for your i386 install
16:48*Lethalman can't realize why people still prefers i386 over amd64...... maybe for java broser plugin?
16:48<valdyn>Lethalman: less ram usage
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16:50<Piet_>i've got some issue with xen + encrypted root on debian lenny. i have my dom0 on a dm-crypt + luks partition, and now, when i create a domu using xen-tools and start this domu, it asks me for a block device password, but there is none. i can press return 3 times and it will continue booting, but that's not exactly a perfect setup. is there something i can do to work around this?
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16:50<rjent>Greetings is there an equivalent for pathping on windows for debian?
16:50<valdyn>rjent: what does pathping do?
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16:50<Geek`N`Proud>goodger: they use a PAE kernel but prevent more than 4GB addressing due to "technical issues" yet allow it in 32-bit Server 2003 no matter what drivers are loaded with no problems
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16:51<goodger>Geek`N`Proud: ah... *sagenod*
16:51<Geek`N`Proud>so Server 2003 has a max of 64GB but XP ~4GB
16:51-!-kristianpaul [~kristianp@] has joined #debian
16:51<goodger>"out of memory: please insert more money."
16:51<valdyn>Geek`N`Proud: thats something else
16:51<cesurasean>Can someone advise the best way to upgrade to lenny.
16:51<valdyn>Geek`N`Proud: see linux kernel configuration
16:51<cesurasean>Does it need to be a fresh install?
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16:52<Geek`N`Proud>valdyn: GNU/Linux doesn't quite have that problem
16:52-!-gnewb [] has joined #debian
16:52<valdyn>Geek`N`Proud: you dont have to pay, but it has 4GB mode and 64GB mode
16:52<goodger>cesurasean: no. follow instructions I just had the bot send to you
16:53<Geek`N`Proud>valdyn: true, although who would want to use bounce buffers anyway... on Linux we just use a 64-bit kernel instead ;-p
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16:53<valdyn>Geek`N`Proud: yea, indeed
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16:55<deniz>can someone help me compile a program?
16:55<deniz>i need to extract the tar.gz file before compiling or i compile a tar.gz file?
16:55<goodger>deniz: you extract the tarball first
16:56<PiklesOnFire>deniz, you extract first
16:56<deniz>goodger, PiklesOnFire, i do ./configure then make then make install?
16:57<PiklesOnFire>deniz, yep
16:57<PiklesOnFire>make install should be run as root, btw
16:57<goodger>deniz: make install must be run as root.otherwise, spot on
16:57<petern>depends on what's in the tarball...
16:57<goodger>(regional variations apply)
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16:57<deniz>goodger, im already having problems with ./configure and i did su so it's all root
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16:58<Kilerhageman>How do I chmod a dir?
16:58<petern>you, er, use chmod
16:58<Kilerhageman>When I try to access it, it says permission denied
16:58-!-sagitarius [~sagitariu@] has quit [Quit: Saliendo]
16:58<Kilerhageman>with cd
16:58<Kilerhageman>So It should be: chmod DIRNAME rwx
16:58-!-Lemonzest [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
16:59<gnewb>su or needed I think
16:59<petern>man chmod
16:59<simonrvn>or just chmod --help
16:59<PiklesOnFire>man chmod ftw ;p
16:59<deniz>goodger, can i ask u how to compile in a 1 on 1 session?
17:00<goodger>deniz: what problem are you having with ./configure? it's probably telling you that you need to install some headers
17:00<deniz>goodger, k, thx :)
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17:00<Piet>steev: are you the steve by any chance?
17:00<Piet>and if so, may i ask you something regarding xen on lenny?
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17:00<petern>i find it helps to look at the contents of what's actually been extracted rather than blindly going in and running ./configure
17:01<Kilerhageman>Why I can't use cd? Why I get permission denied? :S
17:01<petern>because... you don't have permissions
17:01<Kilerhageman>I understand
17:01<Kilerhageman>But how do I give them to a dir?
17:02<PiklesOnFire>you add your user to the group that has read permissions, or you change the permissions of the folder w. chown to add your users group to the folder :p
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17:02<Kilerhageman>what command to add permisions ?
17:02<adb>!tell Kilerhageman about permissions
17:02<Kilerhageman>to the folder
17:02<PiklesOnFire>ty adb
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17:03<Kilerhageman>So: chmod FolderName rwx?
17:03<gnewb>Thank you
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17:04<PiklesOnFire>Kilerhageman, yes, but where rwx is usually represented in a numerical value ranging from 0-7 ;] read the man page
17:05<Kilerhageman>chmod Dir 777? :P
17:05<PiklesOnFire>oh god no
17:05<cesurasean>I'm getting this error when upgrading to lenny. W: There is no public key available for the following key IDs:
17:05<PiklesOnFire>cesurasean, what server is it complaining about?
17:06<PiklesOnFire>cesurasean, that should help :]]
17:07<adb>cesurasean: apt-cache search debian-keyring
17:07-!-midlis [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:08<stew>cesurasean: aptitude install debian-archive-keyring && aptitude update
17:08<stew>cesurasean: after those commands it should stop complaining
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17:09<Kilerhageman>How do I close that help file? ESC doesn't work :s
17:09<valdyn>Kilerhageman: Q works
17:10-!-laptop [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:10<Kilerhageman>And what's the main dir of a user? so where he would come after login?
17:10<valdyn>Kilerhageman: ~/
17:10<Kilerhageman>Hm: user/name/?
17:10<Kilerhageman>well, i need to set permission from the root account
17:10<valdyn>Kilerhageman: ~ or $HOME, everything else is not guaranteed
17:10<Kilerhageman>so I need to know the exact location
17:11<valdyn>Kilerhageman: you are trying something stupid if you are trying to change permissions
17:11<Kilerhageman>it's necesarry, otherwise i cant open my dirs :s
17:11<PiklesOnFire>Kilerhageman, a user's home dir is /home/username
17:12<Kilerhageman>Ok, thanks :)
17:12<valdyn>now hes off to break his permissions
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17:13*PiklesOnFire shrugs - you gave him the warnings
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17:14<Kilerhageman>For c compiler, i forget command... apt-get install-basics?
17:14<Kilerhageman>or what is it?
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17:15<avu>Kilerhageman, build-essential
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17:19<remus>ok you lot all hackers lol
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17:19<remus>no need to leave
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17:21<remus>god its like an under takers waiting room in here
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17:27<Kilerhageman>Command to open a text file and edit it?
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17:28<zem>i wonder when will someone write micro
17:29<sesamo>es en español
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17:29<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
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17:34<netzwurm>hm. how can i invoke hibernation from the commandline so that it doesn't ignore the settings from /etc/default/acpi-support don't get ignored?
17:34<netzwurm>i am using pm-hibernate right now, but that doesn't seem to cut it.
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17:41<adb>volontari: stop it
17:41<rjent>valdyn: well it shows a bit more than traceroute by showing number of packets droped at each hop. I found bing and it is an interesting tool but not exactly the same
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17:42<petern>hmm, i keep getting sound juicer popping up and saying it's unable to read the cd ...
17:42<petern>the obvious reason for that is that i didn't insert a cd...
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17:43<valdyn>rjent: mtr or mtr-tiny
17:44-!-jurica [] has joined #debian
17:44<rjent>valdyn: ok I will look at
17:44<petern>hmm, maybe it just means the drive is on its last legs :/
17:45<rjent>valdyn: oh that is nice
17:45<rjent>mtr that is
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17:55<clancy>why isn't iceweasel updated in lenny?
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17:56<deniz>does anyone know of a lie detector software that detects stress in a person's voice for lenny?
17:56-!-kalidar [] has joined #debian
17:56<zumbi>dpkg: lie
17:56<dpkg>zumbi, i am incapable of lying, or knoppix is better than debian
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17:57<cesurasean>Keep the following packages at their current version:
17:57<cesurasean>libcurl3 [7.15.5-1etch2 (now)]
17:57<cesurasean>for some reason this package isn't installing
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17:57<cesurasean>libcurl3-openssl-dev: Depends: libcurl3 (= 7.15.5-1etch2) but 7.18.2-8lenny2 is to be installed.
17:59-!-mode/#debian [+l 401] by debhelper
17:59<cesurasean>I just installed libcurl3 by hand, and it fixed that
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18:06<cesurasean>does anyone know why the newer kernels won't run on my box?
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18:06<cesurasean>it keeps going to busybox and complains about init
18:07<asimov>there's any italian?
18:07<dpkg>Ciao, vai su #debian-it per ricevere aiuto in italiano. Italian Speakers: Please use #debian-it, there you will get much more help.
18:07<asimov>thanks :)
18:07<zumbi>cesurasean: what kernels? what arch?
18:07<cesurasean>the newest kernel
18:08<cesurasean>what do you mean by arch?
18:08<zumbi>cesurasean: from where? vanilla kernel?
18:08<dpkg>[arch] a source control revision system that developers can use to develop projects in a distributed fashion. Arch (and its twin brother ArX) resides at, or, or #arch Under lenny, /bin/arch has disappeared, use "uname -m" instead.
18:08<zumbi>ummm, dpkg is wrong
18:08<zumbi>cesurasean: arch is i386, amd64, armel, mips, ..
18:09<cesurasean>the older etch kernel works fine, but the newer kernels I can't seem to get to work
18:09<zumbi>cesurasean: so, you downloaded source from and compile it? and now it fails to boot?
18:09-!-peretti [] has joined #debian
18:09<cesurasean>no, I never compiled anything
18:09<cesurasean>I upgraded from etch to lenny
18:10<zumbi>cesurasean: apt-get install linux-image?
18:10<dpkg>peretti: VATTENE VIA
18:10<cesurasean>yes, it's a VIA board, I believe
18:10<peretti>non sei piu mio amico
18:10-!-steffen_ [] has left #debian [Konversation terminated!]
18:10<dpkg>Ciao, vai su #debian-it per ricevere aiuto in italiano. Italian Speakers: Please use #debian-it, there you will get much more help.
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18:12<cesurasean>zumbi, do you have any advice for fixing the issue with the upgrade?
18:12<cesurasean>why isn't my kernel working, and why my hardware isn't supported
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18:12<zumbi>dpkg: arch is also hardware architectures. Debian has support for some of the most usual architectures, like i386, amd64, armel, mips, mipsel, sparc, powerpc, alpha, hppa, s390, ia64.
18:12<dpkg>that's too long, zumbi
18:14<zumbi>cesurasean: i do not know what issues are related to upgrading from etch to lenny, but I might help you to find out why it is not working, but I have not enough output from you. You probably lack an initrd or pass a wrong param to the kernel so it can not find the right rootfs
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18:15<zumbi>dpkg: arch is also hardware architecture, Debian has supports i386, amd64, armel, mips, mipsel, sparc, powerpc, alpha, hppa, s390 && ia64, IIRC.
18:15<dpkg>zumbi: that's too long
18:16<zumbi>dpkg: grgrgr
18:16<dpkg>i don't know, zumbi
18:16<zumbi>dpkg: arch is also i386, amd64, armel, mips, mipsel, sparc, powerpc, alpha, hppa, s390 && ia64, IIRC.
18:16<dpkg>okay, zumbi
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18:27<Woet>My server currently has 'kernel /vmlinuz root=/dev/sda1 - initrd /initrd.img' as /boot/grub/menu.lst
18:27<Woet>How do I change this to default?
18:27<Woet>(so I can install my own kernel)
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19:07<deniz>why do my windows look ugly??
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19:07<deniz>and how do i get back the default cursor from repositories?
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19:07<deniz>is it possible to undo the most recent apt-get autoremove?
19:08<stew>deniz: you could reconstruct it by looking at /var/log/dpkg.log
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19:11<adama>I'm having a problem migrating a fakeraid (Promise) set created in the BIOS, which worked in Windows and is therefore now full of data: - It is supposed to appear as one single drive, 4TB, but dmraid creates two 2tb drives, neither of which is usable. How might I combine them manually perhaps?
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19:11<deniz>stew, with what application do i open it with?
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19:12<adama>deniz: the log? less is best
19:12<stew>deniz: pager ; its just a text file. i'm saying if you look at that text file, you could figure out what was reomved
19:12<Pitxyoki>deniz, gedit
19:13<deniz>Pitxyoki, it removed that too no wonder it dint work, im installing it now
19:13<marius>why this nick name is protected
19:13<dondelelcaro>marius: because someone else registered it
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19:14<adama>any ideas for my raid set?
19:14<dondelelcaro>(of course, considering that they had it in 2003, and used it for all of 10 minutes, you could probably ask #oftc to release it)
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19:23<tbrock>guys does apache2 use apache2.conf or httpd.conf in debian
19:25<PiklesOnFire>tbrock, #debian-apache would be the correct place to ask, but it should be httpd.conf
19:25<tbrock>ok thanks! what is that other file then
19:26<PiklesOnFire>tbrock, i stand corrected actually.
19:26<PiklesOnFire>google - for the win ;p
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19:30*goodger goes to bed, finally; good night, sirs
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19:31<Ryan52>#debian-apache isn't a support channel...
19:31<Ryan52>tbrock: what's your questions?
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19:38<Ryan52>tbrock: hello?
19:40<deniz>how can i make my "glossy" applications theme come back? i removed it with apt-get accidentally ---> when i try to configure the looks i have "glossy" selected and the colours are somewhat similar but like the scroll bar or whatever it's called isn't blue and curvy, instead it's a grey square, anyone know what i can do?
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19:44<adama>deniz: I lost my themes on my laptop yesterday too.. I just got some new ones from I think
19:44<deniz>adama, getting the themes doesn't help (im using gnome-art to get the themes)
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19:47<adama>you need to install them through the appearance thinger
19:47<linux01>can someone help me figure out why i cannot access my partition that has XP on it...? i am able to access my external drives that has only data....
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19:49<adama>linux01: what happens when you try to mount it?
19:49<adb>!tell ntfs-3g about user accessible ntfs
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19:50<adama>!pal adb
19:50*dpkg points at adb and laughs
19:50<adama>!tell linux01 -about user accessible ntfs
19:50<linux01>it just says " cannot mount volume. invalid mount option when attempting to mount the volume.
19:50<adama>then dmesg|tail ?
19:51<linux01>dmsg|tail has errors about my eth0
19:52<adama>how are you trying to mount this xp partition?
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19:52<linux01>right click and "mount volume" like i did my 2 ext HDD
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19:53<adama>try mounting from the command line
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19:54<adama>mount -t mtfs-3g /dev/xxxx /windows/xp or somethigk
19:54-!-kedi [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
19:54<adama>also read what dpkg told you about user accessible ntfs
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19:58<adama>I'm going to ask my RAID question again...
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19:59<adama>I'm having a problem migrating a fakeraid (Promise) set created in the BIOS, which worked in Windows and is therefore now full of data: - It is supposed to appear as one single drive, 4TB, but dmraid creates two 2tb drives, neither of which is usable. How might I combine them manually perhaps?
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20:13<bobrox>someone can explain me why when i download xen-linux-system-2.6.26-1-xen-amd64 with apt-get source there is only the source of linux-2.6-2.6.26 without xen
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20:23<bernardo>how can i configure my xorg.conf to disable the tapping feature of the touchpad?
20:23<dondelelcaro>depends on the type of touchpad
20:24<bernardo>dondelelcaro: how do I know?
20:25<dondelelcaro>lsusb or lspci or examining the X log will tell you
20:26<bernardo>dondelelcaro: synaptics
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20:27<dondelelcaro>bernardo: man synaptics; and see all of teh configuration options avialable
20:28<bernardo>dondelelcaro: ok, thanks
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20:51<EmleyMoor>has iceape been removed from lenny?
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21:03<Schreck>I'd like to know if it's possible to block messages coming from one person on YM with iptables ?
21:04<EmleyMoor>Not likely
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21:07<Schreck>EmleyMoor ok hehe :/
21:07<Schreck>But... I think that iptables can block some paterns in the ip packets right ?
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21:13<mark1530>i need some help with configuring this box for parental control, please?
21:15<dondelelcaro>mark1530: parental control in what sense?
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21:15<mark1530>well, I mean for web browsing.
21:16<mark1530>I am on Knoppix 5.3.1, by the way
21:16<dondelelcaro>to do what with web browsing?
21:17<mark1530>I'd like to set something for content filtering to ensure nothing filsy get before my kid
21:18<dondelelcaro>well, there's pretty much nothing that does content filtering that is actually accurate
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21:18<mark1530>he is 13 but I don't want any of obscene nature to get into his browser as he is on the Net
21:18<dondelelcaro>your best bet is to actually parent, and be around when he's browsing
21:19<mark1530>I see
21:19<dondelelcaro>but in any event, we also can't support knoppix here. Try #knoppix on
21:19<mark1530>OK dokey, then
21:19<mark1530>thanks for your effort, anyway
21:19<mark1530>take care, then
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21:32<cwood>Anybody (else) have sudden network problems after today's sid dist-upgrade?
21:33<adb>cwood: which kernel ?
21:34<cwood>2.6.25, in the 2.6.26-2 package
21:34<cwood>I know it's not hardware, because the machine in question is fine in a live cd.
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21:42<adb>judd: versions kernels
21:42<judd>adb: kernels --
21:43<adb>judd: versions linux-image
21:43<judd>adb: linux-image --
21:43<adb>judd: versions linux-image sid
21:43<judd>adb: linux-image --
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21:43<cwood>I imagine that may be part of the problem.
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22:04<beck64>does anybody knows how can i install my gcc-4.3-doc ?
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22:04<beck64>when i do apt-get install , i receive a message that the package may be marked as obsoleted or something like thgat
22:05<cwood>beck64: what's the precise message?
22:07<beck64>ok give me a second
22:07<beck64>Package gcc-4.3-doc is not available, but is referred to by another package.
22:07<beck64>This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or
22:08<beck64>is only available from another source
22:08<beck64>E: Package gcc-4.3-doc has no installation candidate
22:08<beck64>and i did "apt-get install gcc-4.3-doc"
22:08<cwood>If you do 'apt-cache search gcc | grep doc', that will give you the list of available packages.
22:08<beck64>nothing appears
22:09<cwood>Is there a gcc in the repository you're using? Have you run apt-get update and had it succeed?
22:09<beck64>so , i think i just reply myself
22:09<adb>missing your sources.list
22:09<beck64>i need to use another source right ?
22:09<beck64>i installed gcc
22:09<cwood>If your apt-get update failed, there will be no packages to find gcc-4.3-doc.
22:09<beck64>with this repository
22:09<adb>no use the right
22:09<adb>gcc-4.3-doc - documentation for the GNU compilers (gcc, gobjc, g++)
22:10<adb>beck64: use lenny ?
22:10<beck64>im using debian 5.0
22:10<beck64>i just installed on monday
22:10<adb>beck64: paste your sources.list
22:11<adb>The following NEW packages will be installed:
22:11<adb> gcc-4.3-doc gcc-doc-base
22:11<cwood>AHa, looks like udev is looking like a culprit for my networking problem. I saw something on the laptop about eth0 renamed to eth2.
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22:13<adb>beck64: add non-free to sources.list . and apt-get update
22:14<beck64>ok let me tryu
22:16<adb>cwood: edit /etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules , to fix eth0 and more if needed
22:17<cwood>I have no 70-persistent-net.rules. I have 75-persistent-net-generator.rules. Is that significant?
22:17<beck64>adb: it looks like it worked... but i think i need to configure variables for getting the path to the man pages
22:18<beck64>because it downloaded all the man pages and installed it after the apt-get update but still getting 'no such manual'
22:18<adb> man gcc-4.3
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22:20<adb>iceweasel /usr/share/doc/gcc.html
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22:23<adb>well >>> iceweasel /usr/share/doc/gcc-4.3-doc/gcc.html
22:24<adb>or /../././//gccint.html
22:25<beck64>adb: yeap , but , isnt there any other way to use the 'man command' ?
22:25<adb>man gcc-4.3
22:25<cwood>man /path/to/manpage
22:25<cwood>You can specify the path to the filename, iirc
22:26<dkr>groff -Tascii -mandoc /path/to/manpage.1 |less :)
22:26<adb>gcc-4.3-doc <<< This file documents the use of the GNU compilers.
22:26<beck64>adb: yeah, sorry well maybe i did not explain myself
22:27<beck64>i would like the man pages of the functions
22:27<beck64>for example ptrace
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22:27<beck64>so , i thought gcc-4.3-doc had those information
22:27<beck64>but well , i think not , so , do you know the package that has the functions man pages ?
22:28<adb>i dunno
22:29<beck64>0]beck@dedekind ~]$ man gethostbyname
22:29<beck64>No manual entry for gethostbyname
22:29<cwood>You mean C language functions?
22:29<beck64>cwood: yes
22:30<adb>is this part of nis ? << gethostbyname
22:30<beck64>adb: well or ptrace or printf , etc..
22:30<beck64>man 3
22:31<adb>try ##C on freenode
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22:35<Hessophanes>beck64: Install manpages-dev.
22:38<Pitxyoki>I had just asked that here a while ago.
22:38<Pitxyoki>I eventually found it out.
22:39<Pitxyoki>beck64, manpages-dev gcc-doc and glibc-doc may have what you want.
22:39<Pitxyoki>...and I'm yet to discover why has the pthread_create manpage been removed from glibc-doc.
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22:40<cesurasean>lenny is so nice :)
22:40<cesurasean>I love the pidgin addin
22:40<beck64>Pitxyoki: Nice , it worked thanks
22:41<beck64>adb: thanks too :)
22:41<Silicium01>My machine creates .ssh2 directory in my home dir instead of .ssh. Why does this happend?
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22:46<cwood>adb: thank you for the pointers, it's back to healthy normal.
22:46<adb>welcome all
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23:07<Silicium01>When I try to ssh into other machine, I see my terminal display "Host key not found from database." is it bitching about my local or remote machine?
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23:14<Silicium01>Can someone help me with ssh? I have some basic questions
23:15<Silicium01>On machine1, when I type ssh it gives me the regular message "The authenticity of host can notbe established ... and so on
23:16<Silicium01>On machine two, if I type ssh it gives a different info:
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23:19-!-mode/#debian [+l 368] by debhelper
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23:27<kop>Silicium01 : You may have machine 2 setup so that host keys are required and you must manually put the key in (iirc) /etc/ssh/ssh_known_hosts or your personal file. It's the StrictHostKeyChecking directive.
23:27<Silicium01>kop, there's something else going on there
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23:28<Silicium01>I noticed on one machine I have /etc/ssh dir and other one /etc/ssh2
23:28<Silicium01>also in first one there is ~.ssh and other one ~.ssh2
23:28<kop>Silicium01 : You're using openssh?
23:28<Silicium01>kop, I cant figure out what caused this, or how to make both servers same (ise .ssh)
23:28<Silicium01>kop, yes
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23:29<Silicium01>one with .ssh and /etc ssh has dpkg show 1:5.1p1-5 version
23:29<Silicium01>no... 1:5.1p1-4
23:29<kop>Silicium01 : To make them the same you make the /etc/ssh/ssh_config and /etc/ssh/sshd_config files the same, modulo changes required for different ssh versions.
23:30<Silicium01>modulo cheages?
23:30<Silicium01>how come one version is using /etc/ssh and other one /etc/ssh2 ?
23:30<kop>Silicium01 : Taking into account what's supposed to be different if the version changes.
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23:31<kop>Silicium01 : You're using newer versions that what I've got, so I don't know.
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23:31<kop>Silicium01 : Have you tried diffing the configs?
23:31<Silicium01>you have 1:5.1p1-5 ?
23:32<kop>Silicium01 : 1:4.3p2-9etch3
23:32<Silicium01>kop, will try that, how do i diff them?
23:32<kop>Silicium01 : man diff: diff -u file1 file2
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23:32<Silicium01>kop I'll try that
23:33<Silicium01>kop, I guess it is changed in 1:5.1p1-5 vs 1:5.1p1-4
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23:35<Silicium01>is it possible to get onder versions of stuff in lenny?
23:36<Silicium01>for example, I want to get 1:5.1p1-4 instead of 1:5.1p1-5 using apt-get
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23:42<Silicium01>even documentation is not up to date for new version, still refering to .ssh and /etc/ssh when the file layout has changed
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23:46<twb>How can I tell which packages provide an alternative for pager?
23:47<kop>Silicium01 : Maybe the README.Debian has more info.
23:47<kop>twb: I swear I knew once.
23:48<Silicium01>kop, how can I downgrade the package?
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23:48<kop>Silicium01 : AFIK you can't.
23:48<twb>kop: to clarify: I mean alternatives I haven't already installed
23:48<kop>Silicium01 : You can build your own.
23:48<Silicium01>kop, crap, that sucks
23:48<Silicium01>I want 1:5.1p1-4 instead of 1:5.1p1-5 of openssh
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23:49<kop>twb: Maybe searching the package tags?
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23:49<twb>kop: you mean debtags? I tried that.
23:49<twb>kop: nor is Provides: available in this case
23:50<Silicium01>kop, 1:5.1p1-5 documentation and manpages are still refering to old stuff, isnt that the dmanest thing?
23:50<kop>twb: How about an apt-file search for /etc/alternatives/ content?
23:50<kop>Silicium01 : File a bug report.
23:50<twb>kop: those files are created by postinst
23:51<kop>twb: You're exhausting my brain. :-)
23:51<twb>kop: from /var/lib/dpkg/alternatives/, which doesn't have a single "pager" file or anything like that
23:51<twb>Oh sorry, that dir is also autocreated
23:52<kop>twb: Does the debian policy manual provide a clue?
23:53<twb>From cheap hacks it looks like the set is just more,less,most,w3m
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23:58<Silicium01>kop, filing, how do i enter pseudo headers?
---Logclosed Sat Mar 28 00:00:22 2009