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#debian IRC Logs for 2009-05-29

---Logopened Fri May 29 00:00:03 2009
---Daychanged Fri May 29 2009
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00:00<ml|>check what you have in and /var/cache/apt/archives/partial/
00:00-!-raghorn [~wsr3193@] has quit []
00:01<ml|>yeah if the package depends on stuff you don't already install will fail
00:01<Co_X>ml : only binutils_2.18.1~cvs20080103-7i386.deb and linux-image-2.6.26-2-686_2.6.26-15lenny2_i3...
00:02<ml|>Co_X: try this install that package and look again
00:02<ml|>with aptitude
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00:05<Co_X>ml: i do with aptitude install python-mysqldb_1.2.2-7_i386.deb
00:06<Co_X>but it return "Couldn't find any package whose name or description match "python-mysqldb_1.2.2-7_i386.deb"
00:06<ml|>no i mean not using the deb and look again in /var/cache/....
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00:08<Hideo>Co_X: look into any of these: apt-mirror , apt-cacher-ng , apt-proxy
00:11<ml|>dpkg tell Co_X about apt-mirror
00:11<ml|>dpkg tell Co_X about apt-cacher-ng
00:11<ml|>dpkg tell Co_X about apt-proxy
00:11<ml|>!beer Hideo
00:11*dpkg pours a pint of Gulden Drak for Hideo
00:11<Hideo>!beer ml|
00:11*dpkg pours a quart of Guinness for ml|
00:12<Hideo>let's get drunk =P
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00:16<shamanix>!alcohol and linux
00:16<dpkg>they don't mix!
00:17<ed_debian>I heard a wild rumor the other day. Politically speaking. Is linux communist? None of use own the software yet we all use it?
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00:18<shamanix>i heard windows is capitalist ;-)
00:19<ed_debian>I heard windows doesn't really work
00:20<ed_debian>hey shamanix is your name really o_O ??
00:20<ed_debian>How do you pronounce that?
00:20<shamanix>I just like to keep it secret
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00:21<shamanix>actually my real name is Gábor, thats hungarian for Gabriel, but thats all you need to know
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00:22<ed_debian>(My real name is Ed)
00:22<ed_debian>It's english for Ed
00:24<ml|>ed_debian: hows that project coming along?
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00:24<ed_debian>I got my script to run! I realized that for on my system root doesn't have rights to run the notify-send program
00:24<shamanix>Linux was made by foreign terrorists to take money from true US companies like Microsoft - Some AOL'er NO COMMENT
00:24<ed_debian>also for some reason when I run udev rules on a specific device the previous rules are thrown out
00:25<ed_debian>Who the hell was that guy?
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00:25<ed_debian>I'm not working on it right now I should go to bed soon cause I have work tomorrow.
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00:25<ed_debian>Too bad I can't get paid to work with linux
00:25<ed_debian>Maybe one day....sigh
00:26<ml|>ed_debian: so it's fully working?
00:26<ed_debian>I have to add some mounting / unmounting logistics to the script
00:26<ed_debian>and I have to get root to be allowed to run "notify-send"
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00:27<ed_debian>then it will be working (maybe I'll find something else it needs to do by that point)
00:27<ml|>why can't root run that?
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00:27<ed_debian>i have no idea
00:27<ed_debian>if I su
00:27<ed_debian>and then run notify-send "things"
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00:27<ed_debian>notify-send "things"
00:27<ed_debian>libnotify-Message: Unable to get session bus: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken.
00:28<ed_debian>Real quick, before I go to bed how do you change what users can run what programs?
00:28<ed_debian>(if I run as "ed" it works fine)
00:29<ml|>well it's trying to run, maybe you need to configure something
00:29<shamanix>oops forget it
00:30<ed_debian>(it is owned by root btw and is set to executable for user group and others
00:30<ml|>ed_debian: like a siad before chmod a+x will allow everyone to run the script...
00:30<ed_debian>the script runs fine
00:30<ed_debian>udev calls the script as root
00:31<ed_debian>all of the commands besides notify-send are run
00:31<ml|>but if inside the script an app that needs root permissions the script will fail if run by normal user
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00:32<ed_debian>ml|, you're getting confused. rsync and notify-send are the only things in the script
00:32<ed_debian>I (a normal user) can run both of those and I can run the script
00:32<ml|>i'm talking in general
00:32<ed_debian>o yeah
00:32<ml|>there is something that you are missing somewhere
00:33<ed_debian>if I su
00:33<ed_debian>and then run notify-send...
00:33<ed_debian>I am sure that is the problem
00:33<ml|>yeah from above looks like it
00:33<ed_debian>notify-send is a small little program so that normal users can send gnome-notifications easily without root power
00:33<ed_debian>I don't think it is designed to be run by root
00:34<ml|>does it fail if you un it?
00:34<ed_debian>it works
00:34<ed_debian>What does that mean?
00:34<ml|>for my typo above
00:35<ed_debian>anyway I'm done working on it tonight
00:35<ed_debian>if you come up with anything post on my thread in
00:35<ml|>ok, ttyl
00:35<ed_debian>thanks for your help guys!
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00:35<ml|>np here
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00:36<ed_debian>good night shamanix !
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00:50<DjAlan>environment variables: are they only valid when I open a shell
00:50<DjAlan>or they're good for the whole X environment
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00:52<shamanix>I think so
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01:27<jpablo>Hi there ... if I Give permissions to a file is common that reboot the systema and the file dont have the permissions yet?
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02:14<bgupta>Hi... does debian have a standard daemon to manage dynamic allocation of swap files? I found swapd, which seems abandoned.. wondering if there is a PREFERRED UPDATE.
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02:16<bgupta>also found dynswapd, but aren't sure the uptake
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02:16<jm_>dphys-swapfile, swapspace
02:16<luigi>q pedo
02:17<luigi>al guna muchacha x ahi
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02:19<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
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02:26<Falsechicken>any idea how to change my logon screen resolution? All the help I found with google told me to change the values in xconf but my config file has no resolutions listed. just info like "Default monitor" and such
02:26<jm_>which one is used now and which one would you want to use?
02:27<Falsechicken>i dont know what is used. its pretty low. lower than 1024x768 I would like to use 1280x1024
02:27<jm_>your monitor can't print details about current mode?
02:28<Falsechicken>brb lol totally slipped
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02:29<Falsechicken>its 720x400........what?@
02:31<Falsechicken>I was happy with my res but i switched monitors and then it changed
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02:31<jm_>well then it's probably the best to put it in xorg.conf
02:32<Falsechicken>ok. I dont know where to put it. it doesnt list any resolutions
02:32<jm_>they go in section screen
02:32<xy>hallo kann mir wer helfen?
02:32<dpkg>deutschsprachige Hilfe bekommt ihr in (auf, oder - German speaking users please go to (on, or
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02:34<Supaplex>bah. the script is using the old backuppc, but even this causes friction :( /usr/sbin/dpkg-reconfigure: backuppc is broken or not fully installed
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02:36<xy>bin beginner sry komm nicht klar
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02:40<xy>hallo jemand da der mir hilft?
02:40<Falsechicken>my xorg.conf
02:41<Falsechicken>i dont know where to put my new res
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02:45<jm_>something like this:
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02:51<Nazcafan>gnote is in teeeeesting!
02:53<cmot>Hmm. freenodee/#kde is very silent... Perhaps here???
02:53<cmot>On a Debian squeeze/sid system with KDE 4.2: I've successfully compiled & installed webkitkdepart (success == no errors on cmake/make/make install) in /usr/local but now Konq won't find it. Copying the webkitkdepart.desktop file to my ~/.kde, Konq now offers it but can't load it with "shared library not found". where do I set the search path so that it finds the lib?
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02:55<jm_>cmot: how does it load it? dlopen?
02:56<cmot>jm_, I *guess* so
02:56<cmot>jm_, it puts a in /usr/local/lib/kde4, so KDE is somehow supposed to look for its kparts there.
02:57<jm_>cmot: man dlopen explain the various options - probably the easiest via or
02:57<cmot>jm_, thanks, but no.
02:57<cmot>jm_, it's a KDE specific dir.
02:57<cmot>(/usr/locl is in
02:57<jm_>/usr/local/lib/kde4 too?
02:57<jm_>well then
02:58<cmot>But neither is /usr/lib/kde4, where all the standard KDE plug-ins are.
02:58<jm_>it doesn't have to be if the binaries are compiled with the right options
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02:59<cmot>This is somehow just stupid.
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03:00<cmot>Also, the fact that the make install places webkitpart.desktop in /usr/local/share/kde4/services and KDE then doesn't find it hints that somehow mucking around with dlopen/ is not how this is supposed to go...
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03:04<cmot>jm_, Nah. putting /usr/local/lib/kde4 into (and running ldconfig) doesn't change a thing.
03:04<cmot>ldconfig -v doesn't show the plug-in either.
03:05<jm_>cmot: in that case it might be loading it with absolute path or somesuch
03:05<cmot>My guess is that kde has some internal list of paths where it looks for .desktop files, and then where it looks for plug-ins.
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03:06<cmot>I really hate to put non-packaged stuff into /usr, but I fear I'll end up doing this.
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03:08<tarzeau>bgupta: dphys-swapfile ?
03:09<jm_>ltrace would show if it's loading it with absolute path
03:09<tarzeau>just be aware that by default it creates swapfiles twice as big as your memroy, and if you have 128 gb memory machines, you don't want that
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03:18<shiznatix_>I am trying to unmount a USB HD but keep getting "device is busy" even though I have nothing open using it. How do I just kill whatever it is that is using it and unmount it already?
03:18<kenyon>shiznatix_: you can use lsof to see what process might be keeping it busy.
03:18<kenyon>!open files
03:18<dpkg>Care to know what program or process has a particular file or port open? lsof (list open files)! the package! the command! lsof is for YOU!!! lsof -i tcp:80; lsof /dev/dsp; lsof -i udp:53; etc... apt-get into today! Also, if you order right now, we'll throw in these hits for free: netstat -upant | grep whatever; fuser -v filename; fuser -v 80/tcp; etc. Ask me about <file-nr>.
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03:20<shiznatix_>it looks like runaway nano processes. How do I stop those when there is none open?
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03:20<dpkg>ps is probably a command that reports a snapshot of active processes (`man ps' for more info). Try: `ps auxw' which will report all processes with username in wide format. or ps is fixed in 2.0.3-3, no more segfaults.
03:21<kenyon>and then kill the process id
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03:23<shiznatix_>for some reason "kill 13259" kills nothing even though its clearly the PID of one of the runaway nanos
03:23<kenyon>try kill -1, then kill -2, then kill -9
03:24<shiznatix_>? those exact commands and not kill -13259
03:24<kenyon>those send different signals, with 9 being the most brutal
03:24<kenyon>no, like kill -1 13259
03:24<shiznatix_>aye, ok
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03:24<Supaplex>and if kill -9 doesn't kill it off, it might be in the "D" state.
03:25<shiznatix_>kill -9 worked
03:25<kenyon>now is device busy?
03:25<Supaplex>!start an editor war
03:25<dpkg>emacs is known to cause birth defects
03:25<shiznatix_>still got a few more to kill, re-getting the list
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03:26<debugdebug>hehe, i come here first time
03:27<debugdebug>i'm a chinese people, so my english is so poor
03:27-!-mode/#debian [+l 392] by debhelper
03:27<debugdebug>but it seems very intersting..~
03:27<dpkg>from memory, cn is China, or for help in chinese please join #debian-zh, Please use UTF-8, for IRC help see | Qt/KDE è¿æ¸¡æå¼å§ï¼è¯¦æ请é读
03:27<shiznatix_>kenyon, that did the trick, unmounted and everything
03:27<kenyon>shiznatix_: cool
03:27<debugdebug>i can type chinese..
03:28<debugdebug>but i believe your can't understand..
03:28<Supaplex>yes, but not in this channel.
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03:28<Supaplex>join #debian-zh to do that.
03:28<debugdebug>hehe, i come first i can't understand..
03:28<debugdebug>i just was interested it..
03:29<debugdebug>oh, i type so incorrectly..
03:29<debugdebug>you often come here?
03:29<cmot>jm_, Hmm. I think instead of ltrace I'll just resort to a bug report and try to figure this one out with the Debian/KDE devs. Anyway, thanks.
03:29<jm_>cmot: no worries
03:31<debugdebug>oh, here is a techical chatroom?
03:31<debugdebug>sorry to trouble you so much...
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03:32<debugdebug>oh, my god...i can't know how to quit it..
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03:32<Supaplex>pour water on it!
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03:38<spl>hi, i'm trying to build a deb with debhelper/dh_make and i'd like to include two init scripts. after reading the maintainer's guide / the man page i know how to include ONE script but how do i include multiple or custom files in general?
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03:42<pintook>does Gparted format flashdrive
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03:43<OdyX>cmot: try to ask in #debian-qt-kde maybe
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03:44<OdyX>simonrvn: also…
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03:46<cmot>OdyX, Hi! Oh, they're on IRC, too. Right.
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03:46<OdyX>cmot: and we .ch also ;)
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03:47<simonrvn>mm. that exists i guess. (didn't check)
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03:47<OdyX>simonrvn: it does... -kde is the user side and -qt-kde is the packagers'
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03:55<simonrvn>thanks for the info
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03:57<njg>I am struggling to find any documentation on the output of 'apt-cache depends xyz' . For example how to inteprete the <> and |. Has any one any pointers?
03:59<Supaplex>if you're doing something programmatic with it, I think there are perl modules for it
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04:02<shiznatix_>Ok I know this kind of this should be easy but I have no clue where to start. I have a fresh install of debian on a server with exim and php5 installed. I am trying to use the "mail()" function but alas, it sends no mail. I have sendmail installed and whatnot and the default settings should be good enough to send the emails (always has been for me) so where do I start to debug this?
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04:03<Supaplex>in #php naturally :)
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04:06<shiznatix_>The problem is its not just a php thing, perl isn't sending email either
04:06<Supaplex>dpkg-reconfigure exim and check preferences.
04:06<Supaplex>otherwise, we have a case of !don't work on our hands.
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04:12<shiznatix_>arg still seams to be having problems
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04:13<shiznatix_>I am trying sendmail from the command line like this: sendmail -t < file and the contents of "file" are:
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04:31<friger94>he jo was geht?
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05:01<cmot>When I put a small cup in the coffee maker I should specify that it should stop after making a small coffee.
05:03<weasel>"It Depends"
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05:52<Bleupomme>Hello how can I see all key combinations you can use on a terminal (for instance CTRL-A ...). I know there is a command but I cannot remember which one
05:52<jm_>you mean in shell?
05:53<weasel>man readline maybe?
05:54<jm_>also bind -p in bash, zsh has bindkey -a
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05:56<Bleupomme>jm_: that's it thank you
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06:03<matt7676>it's a bit offtopic question, but is here somebody, who has experience with RADIUS server?
06:03<matt7676>...on Debian
06:03<weasel>never had the need
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06:24<matt7676>weasel: ok. In our youth hostel we give out a WPA(TKIP)-PSK password for each guest, but this gives an automatic access to all LAN resources + they knowing WIFI password is not so good feature as well. I wonder is it possible to solve those issues using RADIUS.
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06:31<locklace>matt7676: "yes"
06:33<locklace>question is whether it's worth the effort. anyway, you'll probably get more responses on a networking channel, nothing debian-specific about the problem
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06:35<TM>excuse me
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06:36<TM>May I have a Piece of information? :)
06:36<TM>about hal...and how to configure it
06:36<TM>the thing is
06:36<TM>the thing is hal think my tv card is a keyboard
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06:37<TM>do you know how i could fix it?
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06:39<TM>may i paste..someone of my log?
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06:43<TM>perhaps i took the wrong moment of the day
06:43<TM>sorry 2 hv disturbed...
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06:44<RichiH>as #debian-ftp is +k, what is the correct place to report mirror troubles?
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06:47<RichiH>themill: seems there is a #debian-mirrors
06:47<RichiH>but thanks :)
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07:10<kashif>i am new cam any body help me
07:11<kashif>i m getting problem while try to install trac
07:11<jm_>trac package?
07:11<kashif>i m simply using " sudo apt-get install trac"
07:11<kashif>and getting error
07:12<kashif>Reading package lists... Done
07:12<kashif>Building dependency tree
07:12<kashif>Reading state information... Done
07:12<kashif>E: Couldn't find package trac
07:12-!-kashif was kicked from #debian by debhelper [use the paster bot or #flood]
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07:14<kashif>hi Jm_ help me
07:14<jm_>kashif: stop flooding
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07:15<kashif>what wrong with me
07:15<jm_>you can't paste stuff here
07:16<kashif>sorry but this was the error
07:16<kashif>then what i do?
07:16<jm_>paste it on a pastebin, the error was not visible
07:16<shiznatix_>I don't know if this is the right place but I have a server that has cpanel and WHM installed and uses them heavily. I just setup another website on this server but the only way I know how to create new email addresses on it is through cpanel. Basically when a new user signs up I want to create an email address for them in the style:, how can I do this via command line commands?
07:16<jm_>!tell kashif -about paste
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07:17<kenyon>kashif: maybe you need to do aptitude update
07:17<kashif>pastebin ?
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07:17<kenyon>!tell kashif about update
07:17<kashif>i did but didn't help
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07:18<kashif>aptitude update sucessfully ended
07:19<kashif>but apt-get install trac E: couldn't find package trac
07:19<petemc>pastebin your /etc/apt/sources.list
07:20<kashif>help jm_ kenyon
07:20<petemc>shiznatix_: that depends on how your mta is configured
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07:20<kashif>okay but how to pastebin my source.list
07:21<petemc>go to , copy and paste it, hit submit
07:21<shiznatix_>petemc, honestly I have no idea. What are the different scenarios and what steps do I have to take depending on which one?
07:22<kashif>thanks petemc i did it
07:22<petemc>you need to tell us the url
07:23<kenyon>there's also a debian package called pastebinit to help pastebin files
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07:23<jm_>pastebinit, but he wouldn't be able to install it with such sources.list
07:23<petemc>kenyon: thats all thats in sources.list ?
07:24<kenyon>that's a bad sources.list
07:24<kashif>all lines are commented except this line
07:24<kashif>what i need to do
07:24<kenyon>paste the entire file
07:25<kashif> this is trac error
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07:26<kashif>you got it
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07:27<kashif>then what i have to do
07:29<kashif>help me jm_ petemc kenyon
07:30<kenyon>kashif: use these lines:
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07:30<kenyon>kashif: and uncomment your security.debian lines
07:31<kashif>append these line on my source.list
07:31<kenyon>then sudo aptitude update && sudo aptitude install trac
07:31<kashif>okay let me try
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07:34<kashif>kenyon : leave ealier line as it is or make it comment
07:34<kenyon>kashif: leave as is
07:34<kenyon>it works?
07:35<kashif>its updateing
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07:36<kenyon>ok I'm going away.
07:37<kashif>thanks kenyan its worked trac 0.11.1-2.1 installed
07:37<kashif>cheers :)
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07:50<Falsechicken>anyone know where my xorg log is stored?
07:50<petemc> /var/log/ , same as all logs
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07:52<d3v1ous>if you not specified other
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07:54<Falsechicken>(**) RADEON(0): DPI set to (98, 112), Anyone know where the setting is to change that? I have a feeling that would fix my Large login screen fonts problem
07:54<OdyX>Falsechicken: kdm user, right ?
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07:55<jm_>Falsechicken: it's in xorg.conf - man xorg.conf
07:55<Falsechicken>gnome. and my config file says nothing about font dpi so I dont know what to add or change
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07:56<jm_>DisplaySize will affect it
07:56<jm_>xrandr also allows one to change it later
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08:01<Falsechicken>Im downloading xrandr. hoping that will help
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08:03<jm_>downloading xrandr?
08:06<Falsechicken>well i think its a front end
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08:07<Falsechicken>its done now. gnome-xrandr-applet
08:07<Falsechicken>i dont see it anywhere
08:07<jm_>yes that's a gui front-end to it
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08:10<Falsechicken>how do i launch the gui? its not in any of my menus
08:11<jm_>list files in package, look for anything in bin
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08:13<stuckey>I'm using the conkeror web-browser and it's continually crashing; I mean it just closes. I'll click on a weblink and it will close.
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08:16<Falsechicken>where are my gnome themes stored?
08:17<codeblue>hello everyone i am having a huge problem I cannot get the bridge module to work, I have recompiled my kernel to add the bridge module but on lsmod or modprobe --list it does not show the module
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08:18<codeblue>the reason im doing this is to run GameServer VM's but i cannot get it to forward ports correctly so i wish to TAP eth0
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08:18<codeblue>does anyone know where i can get the module and compile from source ?
08:20<codeblue>I get the folowing
08:20<codeblue>brctl addbr br0
08:20<codeblue>add bridge failed: Package not installed
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08:20<codeblue>anyone got any ideas???
08:20<codeblue>iv recompiled my kernel over 5 times I cannot get it to work
08:21<codeblue>uname -r
08:21<petemc>the debian kernel should have bridge support
08:21<codeblue>yeah i know it *should
08:21<codeblue>but as you can see its not working
08:21<petemc>you have indicated you're using your own compiled kernel
08:22<codeblue>my on OVH and they didnt support module loading so i had to recompile
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08:23<petemc>i use bridging with my xen boxes and it works find
08:23<petemc>i dont know what OVH is
08:23<codeblue>they are a server hosting comp in france
08:24<petemc>likely your issue is something particular to them, then
08:24<petemc>as it works fine on vanilla debian
08:24<Falsechicken>ok. Im getting a little frustrated. I cant find out how to change the login screen fonts. the theme says its supposed to be size 11. but there is no way that what i see is 11. and the thing that gets me is all I did was switch monitors. why would switching monitors effect my login font size?
08:25<codeblue>guess ill just recompile with a different kernel
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08:28<dr|z3d>Falsechicken: Try playing with your screen's DPI.
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08:29<dr|z3d>Falsechicken: Dot density is the reason different screens look different.
08:29<Falsechicken>i see. thanks. how do i change the dpi?
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08:32<jm_>Falsechicken: I already told you which setting in xorg.conf affects it
08:32<Falsechicken>the screen size?
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08:34<Falsechicken>i dont have a screen size sevtions
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08:35<jm_>perhaps you would want to read xorg.conf man page to find out where it really goes
08:35<kashif>any one me for configuring apache file
08:36<kashif>i am not able to browse trac on browser
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08:36<kashif>but i edited apache site-available file
08:36<jm_>try /usr/share/doc/trac/README.Debian.gz
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08:37<kashif>jm_ check this
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08:40<jm_>kashif: I never used trac, but that's where you shall find info
08:40<jm_>used as in installing it
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08:41<kashif>i used the same way
08:41<kashif>for help
08:41<kashif>let me try again on it :)
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08:42<devine>Hey, I have done a net-install and put KDE 4.2 on top - I have a few GTK based apps that look like ass. How do I change the look and feel of GTK based forms?
08:43<jm_>gtk-chtheme will allow you to set a default GTK theme
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08:43<devine>thanks jm_
08:43<jm_>no worries
08:44<devine>Somebody asked that in #fedora a month ago and I couldn't tell them.
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08:48<devine>so many dependencies for metacity-themes
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08:49<Falsechicken>Displaysize worked. thanks
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08:55<jrodger>I just allowed a"smart update" (Lenny) and now network manager doesn't display right, any ideas on the fix?
08:55<nathan7>Just wondering, what are the views of you guys on *buntu?
08:56<dr|z3d>They vary. Considerably.
08:56<dr|z3d>It's a good introduction to Linux, in my view.
08:56<dr|z3d>It's also doing great things raising Linux's profile, and also Debian's.
08:57<kooll>and a rather bad distribution, in mine. (while still being surprisingly good as an intro)
08:57<dr|z3d>It's more a newb os than an enthusiast/hacker os.
08:58<kooll>Also, I like/dislike the way it 'forced' other distributions to react
08:58<devine>Ubuntu is shoddy. It is fine if you stick to simple things in a gnome environment - but stray outside of that and the packages are horrible.
08:58<dr|z3d>That said, it's perfectly capable. It's not handicapped, as such.
08:58<kooll>many are now concentrating on 'simpler' interfaces
08:58<kooll>some are nice improvments, others are just awful way to behave by default :)
08:59<devine>as soon as something doesn't work they hack the crap out of it instead of coming up with a real solution
09:00<dr|z3d>I disagree, devine. Ubuntu's quite tidy whether you're running, gnome, kde, xfce.
09:00<kooll>I currently hate hal, pulseaudio, NetworkManager, and some of the rules of udev (ok, the last one was not brought by 'ubuntuization', I think)
09:00<devine>dr|z3d: I can't believe you just said Ubuntu has a good implementation of KDE.
09:00<devine>I have tried Xubuntu - no complaints but it has some cruft that made it heavier than it really had to be.
09:01<kooll>devine: is there such a thing ? a good implementation of kde ? ;)
09:01<devine>Debian does a good job. Fedora and SuSE too.
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09:01<kooll>I've seen Suse kde.
09:02<devine>It's different.
09:02<kooll>can't say I liked it. Made my machine slow.
09:02<devine>That's SuSE.
09:02<devine>I have to use SLED on my work laptop.
09:03<devine>SLES isn't bad on servers though (very good for Xen and ISCSI setups)
09:03<devine>I hate SLED... Even OpenSUSE would be a massive improvement.
09:04<kooll>I don't appreciate the kind of program made with no regard to performance. I mean, I understand very well that premature optimization is a bad thing. But sometimes the design is just not only 'suboptimal' but seem more like someone tried to made it slower
09:04<kooll>and, that kind of program seems to be now the basis of the 'user-friendly desktop distribution'
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09:07<locklace>ubuntu is all about throwing as much as possible into the pot to end up with the largest possible out-of-the-box desktop feature list. that is the overriding priority
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09:08<locklace>kooll: there's micro-optimization and then there's design quality and efficiency. the former is rarely a high priority, the latter is essential
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09:09<locklace>nathan7: and then there's stuff like this:
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09:10<kooll>locklace: things like 'hey, let us pool every two seconds to check if there's a cdrom' (that would be one of hal's behaviour), or 'ok, we have a dialog box, we freeze the app input/output waiting for an answer' (that's firefox) just make me want to find out who's responsible :)
09:10<locklace>!lart hal
09:10*dpkg decapitates hal conan the destroyer style
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09:12<locklace>in ubuntu good unix design and the lessons of history take a back seat to building a ui that windows users can feel comfortable with
09:13<locklace>i say "back seat" but actually those elements are more like in the boot or fell out on the highway altogether 100 miles back
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09:16<dr|z3d>It's not that bad, but sure, it's trying to be all things to most people. It's done good, though, in bringing Linux to the "masses". So you might see Ubuntu as the trojan that gets Linux more broad acceptance. :)
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09:17<devine>Yeah Ubuntu's achievements are very much appreciated but it is a shame that the bad things about Ubuntu are being considered "just how things are".
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09:17<azeem>please discuss ubuntu elsewhere
09:18<devine>Just like Windows users accept all the crap that Windows gives them. Right azeem .
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09:21<devine>Just one more thing - I would rather see Ubuntu presented to the masses rather than one of the obscure/innapropropriate distros that manufacturers like to put on netbooks. For sure.
09:21<devine>done :)
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09:25<sd_>Hello! I have a small problem: MTA postfix writing it's logs not only to /var/log/mail.* but to /var/log/syslog also, thus trashing system log, so it's difficult to watch system messages. How can I make it stop writing to syslog ?
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09:33<locklace>sd_: do you understand how syslog works
09:33<darsie>Hi! How can I remove the 'manually installed' flag for a packet?
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09:35<sd_>locklace: I hope yes :) now looking inside /etc/syslog.conf and trying to understand how to separate mailloging from all the others...
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09:39<sd_>locklace: I suspect these lines are responcible: *.*;auth,authpriv.none -/var/log/syslog ? and mail.* -/var/log/mail.log . The first one catches everything, the seond is directs mail logging to separate file. But normally with exim there is no mail looging in syslog. Why it's not the same with postfix?
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09:44<locklace>sd_: one trick you can use to test how your config is working is to use logger(1); using -p to specify facility/priority for a test message will let you see where those messages end up
09:45<gsimmons>sd_: Because Postfix logs to syslog and Debian's Exim does not.
09:45<sd_>hmm, not good . Ok, trying to play with syslog.conf ...
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09:47<locklace>sd_: so from that you can see that "logger -p test" logs the test line to /var/log/,mail.log,syslog, as you'd expect from the syslog.conf
09:47<sd_>thank you for example!...
09:48<locklace>it does seem kind of dumb to me that the default config sends things like to /var/log/syslog
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09:48<sd_>locklace: exactly
09:49<locklace>the utility of that file itself is questionable
09:52<sd_>well guys, seems I stopped it. :) the solution is in /etc/syslog change appropriate line to: *.*;auth,authpriv.none; !mail -/var/log/syslog . !mail -- is the solution
09:53<locklace>sd_: sure. lots of ways to do it
09:53<sd_>then kill -HUP NNNN for syslogd :)
09:54<locklace>but if you're going to bother reconfiguring syslog, you might want to revisit things like the whole purpose of having that file to begin with
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09:54<locklace>and whether you want various things duplicated in multiple files all over the place
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09:56<sd_>yes. but for now only postfix was annoying me. It logs tons of records rejecting spam connections, you can imagine...
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09:56<sd_>all the rest is acceptable by default
09:56<locklace>yeah, mail logs are some of the noisiest
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09:57<locklace>consider submitting a bug about that
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09:59<sd_>I've already submet a bug about kernel deb-package installation configuration script. Recenly upgraded kernel - seems it's not fixed yet since 2 months... They gave it "average" priority despite the fact that such a bug can make some systems unbootable.
10:00<locklace>the whole bug-handling thing in debian is frankly a mystery to me
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10:00<locklace>and the bts is far from optimal compared to other bug tracking systems i've used, afaict
10:01<sd_>I guess they wont spend too much efforts toward "old stable" Etch ... Me I don't waht to upgrade to deb5 for now...
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10:01<locklace>i see a lot of real bugs just sit there for months if not years with no updates, trying to determine their status has been impossible for me on many occasions
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10:03<sd_>and one more thing, as soon as I submet my e-mail there I started to receive "nigerian" spam messages. It looks the whole bugtracking system is pretty outdated.. :(
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10:04<locklace>sd_: but anyway that syslog behaviour is the same in lenny and squeeze, so if you report the bug it won't fail to get attention because it's etch at least (it'll probably fail to get attention for some other reason)
10:04<locklace>sd_: yeah, "outdated" is an understatement
10:04<petemc>compared to what?
10:05<locklace>petemc: um, almost every other bts i've used, and i've used a lot
10:05<petemc>for example?
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10:06<locklace>simple and widely applicable example, bugzilla, e.g.
10:06<sd_>as a minimum emails must be protected against address spam harvesters
10:06<petemc>the bts was revamped in the past year or two
10:06<sd_>it's standart for today
10:06<petemc>not really
10:06<petemc>you're going to get spam anyway, who gives a shit
10:06<locklace>the bugzilla is hardly the best i've seen but it's still a hell of a lot better
10:07<petemc>better how?
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10:12<locklace>the page layout is *much* clearer, the status fields are clearer and more complete, the attachment system and layout is decent (does debian bts even do attachment management? i see huge dumps of system info directly inline all the time)
10:13<petemc>bugzilla is generally hated
10:13<petemc>i think the debian bts is fine, personally
10:13<valdyn>bugzilla doesnt hide email addresses anyway
10:13<valdyn>and doesnt either
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10:13<locklace>bugzilla is hardly my favourite like i said, it needs a lot of improvement. but it's still better
10:14<locklace>but the bts itself is less of a problem than how it's used
10:16<petemc>complaining about it isnt very useful, anyone can send a patch
10:16<stuckey>How do I take a screenshot of a window? I know to use "import" but how do I get it to take a screenshot of another window?
10:17<dpkg>To take a screenshot of your current desktop, you can probably just hit the "PrintScreen" key on your keyboard (Gnome and KDE). Alternatives include ksnapshot, gnome-panel-screenshot, the Gimp's "Acquire->Screenshot", "import -window root screenshot.jpg" (imagemagick package), scrot (scrot package), xwd. For framebuffer consoles, use fbgrab.
10:17<dpkg>To take a screenshot of your current desktop, you can probably just hit the "PrintScreen" key on your keyboard (Gnome and KDE). Alternatives include ksnapshot, gnome-panel-screenshot, the Gimp's "Acquire->Screenshot", "import -window root screenshot.jpg" (imagemagick package), scrot (scrot package), xwd. For framebuffer consoles, use fbgrab.
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10:17<petemc>alt printscreen may take a screenshot of the active window
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10:18<stuckey>petemc: what does it save it as and where?
10:18<petemc>the buffer, you paste it
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10:19<stuckey>I think I just need to figure out how to tell import which window I want... with the -window option... but how do I figure out which window is which?
10:20<azeem>if you hit printscreen in gnome, it'll pop up a dialog with a thumbnail and the option to save it somewhere
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10:20<azeem>probably the same is true for alt+prscreen
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10:21<stuckey>azeem: I don't use gnome
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10:27<stuckey>import: unable to read X window image `': Resource temporarily unavailable.
10:27<stuckey>That's what I get when I give "import imagename.jpg"
10:27<stuckey>It gives me a little X thing and I get to select the window...
10:27<matt7676>I have an old Compaq desktop computer with built in speaker. It worked flawlessly until I made an upgrade to Lenny and changed my DE to Gnome(it was XFCE before). I mean I have no sound. However the setting should be fine(in alsamixer all channels are turned on). I made a screen-shot: At the background you can see "aplay -vv Pink_Noise.wav" playing fine. Any suggestions why I'm n
10:28<avtobiff>matt7676, don't cross post
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10:37<oliva>hi there ... anybody can explain me why if I try to run a watch session in background it got stopped ?
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10:41<chantanito>matt7676: are you there?
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10:43<matt7676>chantanito: yes, but I got it fixed by reseting alsamixer values. /etc/init.d/alsa-utils reset 0
10:44<chantanito>matt7676: good for you
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10:56*arw hello people
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11:00*chantanito says hi to arw
11:00<arw>arw: returns hello to chantanito
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11:13<RedKnight>I am having trouble getting diffutils. Doesn't show up in my synaptic. When I do apt-get I get "E: Couldn't find package diffutils"
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11:14<RedKnight>Can anyone help me figure what I am missing here?
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11:14<azeem>RedKnight: maybe you're looking for patchutils?
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11:14<RedKnight>It is listed as diffutils-2.8.1
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11:15<RedKnight>Is patchutils an alternative?
11:15<azeem>RedKnight: listed where?
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11:16<RedKnight>I am experimenting with Debian (lenny) and Linux from scratch (6.3) so it is on a LFS 6.3 listing.
11:16<RedKnight>I see it at but not in my synaptic
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11:17<RedKnight>>> Debian >> Packages >> lenny (stable) >> Source >> utils >> diffutils
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11:18<azeem>RedKnight: synaptic does binary packages, you're looking at source packages there
11:18<azeem>the binary package is called "diff"
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11:20<RedKnight>Ok, hmmm... Maybe that is not what I want... I see what you are saying. I just wanted to make sure the LFS package was availible for Debian
11:20<sean>does anyone know how to properly configure usb sound in lenny?
11:20<RedKnight>and I navigated there
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11:20<RedKnight>What I would like to do is get it to show up in synaptic and figure what I am doing that is not letting it show up there
11:21<RedKnight>or use a-t-get
11:21<RedKnight>that is use apt-get
11:21<sean>i need some h elp getting my usb headphones to work properly, any ideas?
11:21<RedKnight>but I am not sure what I am doing so it doesn't show up.
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11:22<sean>dr|z3d, hi, are you there?
11:23<RedKnight>Maybe just download, untar and install... I just wanted to learn what I am doing wrong...
11:23<RedKnight>wrong with synaptic...
11:23<RedKnight>And right my wrong... :-)
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11:24<sean>!tell sean usb sound
11:24<dr|z3d>sean: You rang?
11:24<sean>yah i did
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11:25<Yezu>i i need help configuring my usb headphones
11:25<Yezu>for some reason, it worked last night after boot up, now this morning they are not working
11:25<dr|z3d>Not my dept. Others might know better.
11:25<bja>Yezu: Did you step on them last night? :D
11:26<Yezu>bja, haha no
11:26<bja>Ok then wait, someone might help you
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11:29<Yezu>when i run alsaconf, it immediatley out puts the following: Unloading ALSA sound driver modules: snd-usb-audio snd-usb-lib snd-pcm snd-page-alloc snd-hwdep snd-rawmidi snd-timer snd-seq-device (failed: modules still loaded: snd-usb-audio snd-usb-lib snd-pcm snd-page-alloc snd-hwdep snd-rawmidi snd-timer snd-seq-device).
11:29<Yezu>why does my snd-usb-audio fail to unload?
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11:33<helpdesk>Hey guys. Just installed debian core, GDM and gnome-core. Real quick noobie question: how do i remove the my computer and trash icons from the desktop???
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11:33<cahoot>via gconf-editor IIRC
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11:33<helpdesk>do i need to install gconf-editor?
11:33<cahoot>it's there already
11:35<cahoot>via gconf-editor->apps->nautilus->desktop helpdesk
11:35<RedKnight>So azeem, you are saying that diff_2.8.1 is the same as diffutils-2.8.1 and this is why diffutils doesn't show up?
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11:36<azeem>RedKnight: roughly, yes
11:37<helpdesk>i think something is wrong with my gnome-core install......i can't seem to find the gconf-editor, nor the command to run it
11:37<RedKnight>Ok, thanks for you help! I will run with it.
11:37<cahoot>in a terminal: gconf-editor <enter> - no workie?
11:37<RedKnight>Have a great weekend azeem!
11:38<helpdesk>gconf-editor and sudo gconf-editor yields a "command not found"
11:38<azeem>helpdesk: it's not in gnome-core, it's in gnome-desktop-environment
11:38<cahoot>helpdesk: might actually need to be installed if you've only installed part of gnome
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11:39<helpdesk>so ill have to install gconf-editor
11:39<helpdesk>is that the package name?
11:39<cahoot>helpdesk: aptitude install gconf-editor then
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11:41<helpdesk>yeah i just installed it
11:41<helpdesk>thanks guys
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11:51<helpdesk>another question: in gnome-core i can't seem to find the option to select which programs run on startup, is there a way I can change this in terminal? i want iceweasel to load on startup
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12:00<azeem>helpdesk: you have to add it to the session I believe
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12:08<carvalho>alguem sabe me dizer como colocar pasta partilhada no virtual boxe
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12:10<dpkg>Este canal é apenas em inglês. Por favor, use #debian-br (/j #debian-br) para ajuda em portugues.
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12:17<bja>ml|: You killed judd again?
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12:41<simNIX>is it posible to give my nic 3 ip's and run 3 diferent nfs server on each ?
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12:56<felixd>youpi works :P
12:56<ml|>dpkg: lart bja
12:56*dpkg chops bja in half with a free Solaris 7 CD
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13:01<bja>ml|: I'll spare you because judd is allready back
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13:02<ml|>heh :P
13:02<azeem>felixd: what is youpi?
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13:03<felixd>I ment yupi :d
13:03<felixd>It worsk !: D hehe
13:04<felixd>19:01 -!- * felixd H 0 ~felixd@2001:41d0:1:643a::1 [Pawel Wojciechowski]
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13:04<felixd>ipv6 ;]
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13:09<monoglets>i have a problem with interfaces... when i set bridge and restart the network.. the computer cant connect to network .. someone help me??
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13:10<test2>ip route - routing tables are set properly ?
13:11<monoglets>i have a problem with interfaces... when i set bridge and restart the network.. the computer cant connect to network .. i do it in order to configure kvm ....someone help me??
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13:14<bja>dpkg: tell monoglets about br
13:15<monoglets><bja> why???
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13:19<yitaty>oi htgbfggvdsdfbh
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13:19<azeem>is there a way to search evolution's email folders for Msg-Ids?
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13:20<socialevil>is it possible to ask something about mic in ubuntu..
13:20<azeem>socialevil: please ask in #ubuntu
13:21<socialevil>i did :) but nobodys there right now thats why im asking here if im not allowed ok :) ill go
13:21<azeem>sorry, no ubuntu questions here, try again later in #ubuntu
13:21<socialevil>ok thanks
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13:22<MrTettin>you know why you get so many ubuntu questions here? because ubuntu is superior to debian
13:23<azeem>MrTettin: please keep it on topic
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13:23<bja>azeem: Last time I used evolution it wasn't posible, If my memory serves me right i used some fgrep on the file itself. Can't remember any more :(
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13:29<beer> I have a problem. I have just install Debian squeeze with kde 4. The problem is when I am visiting a pages via konq the text on those pages looks ugly. When I use Iceweal the text looks lormal
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13:30<beer>is there a way to control/tweak the way konq renderes text?
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13:32<mimmo>beer: guess u can look in settings - look and feel
13:32-!-Bunnyh [] has joined #debian
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13:32<mimmo>and set the font you want
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13:32<mimmo>but iceweasel ftw :P
13:35-!-Armageddon [~Armageddo@] has joined #debian
13:35<ml|>look for a setting that let's webpages use thier own fonts, that is iceweasel's default
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13:37<Armageddon>Guys is there any fast way to get Debian CD/DVDs ?
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13:38<mikegrb>faster than what?
13:38<Armageddon>15K donwload speed
13:38<Armageddon>it will take me 15 hours to download the first cd
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13:39<Armageddon>i sometimes hate living in this country
13:40<Armageddon>there are no stores to Buy the CD/DVDs
13:40<Armageddon>and the internet sucks
13:40<ml|>Armageddon: so you are on dialup
13:40<beer>mimmo: there are 2 problem with Icewasel: it is gtk-pased and therfore takes longer to load. And it is not nicly integrted into kde
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13:41<Armageddon>ml|: somehow ! if you wanna call it dialup
13:42<Armageddon>Ever heard of Lebanon ?
13:42<Armageddon>i bet it is never on any linux distro list :)
13:43-!-maxence [] has joined #debian
13:43<maxence>coucou !
13:43<maxence>ya personne youhou
13:44<Armageddon>je pense que cette channel est en anglais
13:44<maxence>ah oups
13:44<bja>dpkg: tell maxence about fr
13:45<bja>maxence: ce bien
13:45<Armageddon>bja: what do you want me to translate ?
13:45-!-maxence [] has quit []
13:46<Armageddon>he/she left :/
13:46<ml|>Armageddon: can't you order a cd from nearest country that sells them
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13:47<Armageddon>ml|: nearest country is france :(
13:47<Armageddon>or germany
13:47<bja>Armageddon: nothing, its been quite sometime that I haven't written anything in french
13:47<ml|>is that bad?
13:47<bja>Armageddon: Are you from switzerland?
13:47<ml|>better than nothing
13:47<Armageddon>bja: same here :P
13:47<bja>did i spell that ok?
13:48<Armageddon>bja: no lebanon, i speak 3 languages fluently
13:48<Armageddon>bja: its better spending 13hours to download 1 CD instead of waiting a month for 3 of them
13:48<bja>Don't tell me I'll guess
13:48<Armageddon>ml|: its better spending 13hours to download 1 CD instead of waiting a month for 3 of them (sorry)
13:49<ml|>oh yeah that would be better
13:49<Armageddon>ml|: :) i know, how many CDs will i have to download to install Debian ?
13:50<fxiny>just one if yo go with potato :P
13:50<bja>Armageddon: You speak English, french and lebanees. ?
13:50<bja>Armageddon: habibe = loved one right?
13:51<Armageddon>bja: lebanese is close to arabic so i can speak lebanese (spoken) and arabic (spoken and written)
13:51<Armageddon>bja: yes
13:51<Armageddon>ml|: thanks
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13:54<Armagedd1n>damn connection
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13:54<Armagedd1n>anyone said anything while i was gone ?
13:55<Armagedd1n>lemme get back to you
13:55<bja>Armagedd1n: Just ot
13:56<Armagedd1n>ot ?
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13:57<bja>Armagedd1n: off topic
13:58<Armagedd1n>O_o i didnt understand !
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14:03<fxiny>enouf: ping
14:03<Armagedd1n>isnt there a cd for Gnome ?
14:04<fxiny>iirc cd No 1
14:04<ml|>yeah should be on cd 1
14:04<Armagedd1n>oh cool
14:04<Armagedd1n>thanks :)
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14:10<sylar>what do i do if i want to install a package to a different folder?
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14:11<fxiny>no folders allowed in unix :P
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14:11<fxiny>dir dir dir
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14:12<ml|>fxiny: dir?
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14:12<fxiny>directory ?
14:12<fxiny>sylar: what you want to do ?
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14:14<GnomeAfterAll>nice, many peoples in here (=
14:15<GnomeAfterAll>although almost everyone seems to be AFK
14:15<alex_>como instalar webcam?
14:16<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
14:16<fxiny>no keyboards at all : we have psyco-dalek powers :P
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14:16<GnomeAfterAll>i don't know why, but i like this place (=
14:16<dpkg>Este canal é apenas em inglês. Por favor, use #debian-br (/j #debian-br) para ajuda em portugues.
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14:17<fxiny>you already like it ? yes ? time to remind you of xmonad then ;)
14:17<fxiny>ml|: ;)
14:17*bja names ml| the fastes language recognition bot on #debian
14:17<bja>je je
14:17<ml|>fxiny: xmonand
14:18<ml|>bja: :P
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14:20<s4br3>I use various packages in R regularly. However, not all are included in the standard repositories for me (unstable + experimental)). What is the easiest way to have access to R packages and survive upgrades?
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14:31<simonrvn>s4br3: i imagine there will be a team to handle that stuff, if there isn't one already, and i'd expect said team to come up with some packages to round it out.
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14:32<dpkg>Este canal é apenas em inglês. Por favor, use #debian-br (/j #debian-br) para ajuda em portugues.
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14:40<s4br3>simonrvn, Thanks for the info. There is one, but I think the packages are maintained well enough at R. But, Im not sure.
14:40<s4br3>simonrvn, Thanks for the info. There is one, but I think the packages are NOT maintained well enough at R. But, Im not sure.
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14:45<dondelelcaro>s4br3: there are a few utilities to package R packages into debian packages, and there are a few unofficial repositories floating around
14:46<dondelelcaro>s4br3: see the pkg-bioc repositories on alioth, FE.
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14:53<s4br3>dondelelcaro, Thanks. Have you tried them?
14:54<Txt_file>how can I manage more than one wlan-card with wicd or some other tool?
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14:58<dondelelcaro>s4br3: I use a few of them, yes.
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14:58<s4br3>dondelelcaro, ok. So it is actively supported. I am installing them now.
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15:20<s4br3>dondelelcaro, Hmmm... The hard coded paths don't fit for me...
15:20<s4br3>dondelelcaro, I get "../tools-ng/autogenerate-variable.out" when I should have had ../tools/autogenerate-variable.out
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15:28<locklace>!beer themill
15:28*dpkg pours a quart of Jever for themill
15:29<s4br3>dondelelcaro, Ooh. I just needed to change that in the script
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15:53<jetdog>hello all :)
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15:54<jetdog>I seem to be experiencing something strange with my acpi fan control -- and I know it is not the bios, because it had no issues previously with any of ubuntu's pre-packaged kernels
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15:55<Malchance>I've got a problem with Gnome
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15:55<Malchance>could anybody help me ?
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15:56<Malchance>the previews don't work
15:56<jetdog>is there a better acpi fan control for P-II systems... lm-sensors or something alike?
15:56<Malchance>and also I can't change my wallpaper because my jpg are not detected as images
15:58<jetdog>Malchance :
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15:59<Malchance>jetdog, thank you
15:59<jetdog>i think debian sleeping :P
16:00<s4br3>It is Friday...
16:00-!-esaym [] has joined #debian
16:00<Malchance>s4br3, and debian sleeps on fridays ?
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16:02<dondelelcaro>Malchance: does feh or similar display them?
16:03<Malchance>ahem ... what is feh ?
16:03<Malchance>it seems not to be installed if it's a command
16:04<dondelelcaro>Malchance: it's a command in a package called feh.
16:04<dpkg>*** NEWS FLASH! *** Your box does not come with every app, tool and utility known to debiankind installed already. If you find that the program you've been told to use isn't there, install it. Also ask me about <search>. If someone suggests an application to you, it's highly likely that it's available via apt-get or aptitude.
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16:07<Malchance>dondelelcaro, yes, feh displays them
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16:07<Malchance>even eog do
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16:08<jetdog_>hmm, yeah what fan/acpi control software are most peeps using in debian?
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16:31<s4br3>dondelelcaro, It is still building... :)
16:31<Malchance>dondelelcaro, thank you, I've solved out the problem
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16:35<walldo>hello everyone
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16:36<MyWifeIs19>under lenny, what's the relationship between libc6 and libc6-amd64?
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16:39<MyWifeIs19>I am asking b/c libc6 has amd64 architechture version too
16:40<MyWifeIs19>and libc6-amd64 is listed under i386 architechture only
16:40-!-Wes [] has joined #debian
16:40<azeem>libc6-amd64 is used for 64bit applications
16:41<Wes>I am porting to squeeze/sid on x86_64 -- something in unistd.h appears to be poisoning _GNU_SOURCE. Anybody know why?
16:41<azeem>Wes: what are you porting?
16:42<Wes>azeem: gpsee (you've never heard of it)
16:42<Wes>even #define _GNU_SOURCE; #include <unistd.h>; #include <string.h> leaves me with no memrchr
16:43<Wes>very strange. Worked around that by tweaking include order, but now I don't have a prototype for getpgid(), which is defined in unistd.h itself
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16:44<azeem>Wes: whatever it is, it's a bug in your program; sorry, but this channel is not about programmin advice
16:44<Wes>azeem: pretty sure it's a header bug, but c'est la vie. I'll just make a note in the docs re. building on debian.
16:45<MyWifeIs19>So, it seems libc6-amd64 is used under i386 arch to enable 64 bit app, while under amd64 arch libc6 just takes care of 64bit-ness, correct???
16:45-!-geir [] has joined #debian
16:45<azeem>Wes: why do you think it's Debian specific?
16:45<azeem>MyWifeIs19: yes
16:45-!-SiCuTDeUx [~sicutdeux@] has joined #debian
16:45<Wes>azeem: It may not be, but it doesn't occur on other OSes, nor my FC10 box
16:46<azeem>other OSes?
16:46<Wes>azeem: other == various versions of Solaris, an old FreeBSD box and a leopard box
16:46<azeem>what does that have to do
16:46<azeem>obviously you need to check against vanilla glibc
16:46<Wes>azeem: my only other linux box is a fedora core 10 box.
16:46<Wes>azeem: is there an easy way to do that/
16:47<azeem>no, your best bet is to find the FC release with the same version
16:47<Wes>azeem: good thinking
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16:48<Wes>azeem: Do you know offhand how to figure out which version of glibc is installed on squeeze/sid?
16:48<bzed>dpkg -s libc6 |grep Version
16:48<azeem>dpkg -l libc6
16:48<dpkg>No packages found matching libc6
16:48<dpkg>Badgers ate my libc6 |grep Version!
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16:49<Wes>bzed / azeem: thanks! (2.9-13, FWIW)
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16:50<geir>Hi everyone :) I'm running a etch server here, and have a problem with mount options in fstab. I used the command mount --rbind /mnt/data /home/geir/data then looked at /etc/mtab and copied the relevant line to /etc/fstab. Now, fstab lists the option as bind not rbind and on reboot I don't get the mounted stuff under /mnt/data when I do a ls on /home/geir/data. What should I do?
16:51<bzed>Wes: not sure where you problem is, but with the define/include you've posted above I get extern void *memchr (__const void *__s, int __c, size_t __n)
16:51<Wes>bzed: memrchr, not memchr
16:51<bzed>extern void *memrchr (__const void *__s, int __c, size_t __n)
16:51<bzed>also where it should be
16:52<Wes>bzed: you ran that through the preprocessor?
16:52<Wes>bzed: *strange*. what version deb/libc?
16:53<bzed>eglibc 2.9-13
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16:54<Wes>bzed: Interesting. There must be another header interacting, as that works for me too. I'm going to reduce test cases further.
16:54<azeem>Wes: as I said, programmer error
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16:55<Wes>azeem: jumping to conclusions is not helpful, unless you have a proof that I'm not aware of
16:55<azeem>Wes: glibc developers > 99,9% other developers
16:56<azeem>plus glibc has a quite extensive test suite
16:57<Wes>azeem: *sigh*
16:57<azeem>Wes: sorry
16:57<Wes>azeem: I'm so very sorry I asked for help
16:57<azeem>Wes: as I said, this channel is not about programming advice
16:57<azeem>try in #c or so
16:57<Wes>azeem: Then you could have just said "go away! we don't want to help you!"
16:57<azeem>I said that above
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16:58<wooj>the love and helpfulness overwhelms me.
16:58-!-Affiliated [] has joined #debian
16:59<azeem>wooj: this is simply about what is appropriate here and what is not
16:59<azeem>we don't have the resources to answer all questions, so we restrict ourselves to Debian support
16:59*wooj nods
17:00<geir>Was the question about fstab and mount options appropriate for this channel?
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17:00<azeem>geir: yes
17:01*bja thinks that beeing nice and reading all that people post avoids pointless circular discussions
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17:02<interbird>On this channel, people always want to help, but sometimes a question is 'out-of-league' for a simple answer.
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17:09<geir>so, getting fstab to do a rbind mount instead of a bind mount? Possible? (on etch)
17:11<bja>geir: I remember doing that on etch, I just can't remember if i did it on fstab or on cli
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17:11<geir>bja: in cli its straightforward. Just do mount --rbind olddir newdir
17:12<locklace>Wes: we keep azeem around for his unfailingly sunny disposition and warm, welcoming manner.
17:12<kop>geir : There's always rc.local, and put a comment in fstab.
17:12<bja>!beer locklace
17:12*dpkg pulls out a tasty Dogfishhead 90min IPA for locklace
17:12<ml|>locklace: heh
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17:13<geir>kop: yeah, thats what it seems I must do. I just thought I'd ask if there was a way to do it with fstab :)
17:13<bja>geir: Yes you are right, i couldn't do it on fstab, so i made a script and placed it on rc2.s
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17:14<Wes>locklace: Ah ha. Of course, he's right. All problems with programs are programmer error by definition. I was trying to find out if this new environment need an extra "something" to make it work, though. I suppose I should have read the source code to everything on the box, then I'd know and wouldn't need to ask. ;)
17:15<Wes>That said, when /etc/debian_version says "4.0", how does that compare to "squeeze/sid"?
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17:15<bja>4 was etch
17:15<geir>bja/kop: thanks for the answers. I'll make a script then :)
17:15<geir>Wes: 4 is etch, 5 is lenny
17:16<Wes>Thanks. Now, etch, lenny, then the one I'm on? Is that right? And debian doesn't change package versions across names except for security fixes?
17:16<ml|>Wes: lsb_release -d
17:16<bja>Wes: Check that you aren't in between releases
17:17<Wes>"Debian GNU/Linux unstable (sid)"
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17:17<Wes>So my cohort with a working, but patched, etch box is quite likely to have different versions of packages.
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17:18<interbird>lenny is a release, squeeze (testing) is not yet; packages names and dependencies can change in squeeze, that's the whole point of a testing branch
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17:20<bja>Wes: We all have a tendency to let machines work indefenetly, until something breaks, if you have on you sources.list a reference to stable, in due time releases get mixed
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17:22<trash80>I was trying to get kde4 from experimental, but it seems there is no meta-kde4 in any of the repos
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17:22<azeem>trash80: kde4 is in testing/unstable
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17:22<azeem>trash80: I don't know, you can check or so
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17:22<azeem>judd: versions kdebase
17:22<judd>azeem: kdebase -- etch-security: 4:3.5.5a.dfsg.1-6etch1 etch: 4:3.5.5a.dfsg.1-6etch2 etch-backports: 4:3.5.7-4~bpo40+1 sid: 4:3.5.9.dfsg.1-5 lenny: 4:3.5.9.dfsg.1-6 sid: 4:3.5.9.dfsg.1-6 experimental: 4:4.2.0-1 sid: 4:4.2.2-1 squeeze: 4:4.2.2-1
17:22<trash80>that is what I did
17:23<chealer>trash80: ask #debian-kde
17:23<azeem>trash80: so 4.2.2
17:23<trash80>in there, there is supposed to be meta-kde4
17:23<azeem>experimental won't get newer versions until 4.3 betas or so I guess
17:23<Wes>bja: package management never ceases to be a problem, does it? Still, I've found 'apt' to be about the cleanest I've seen anywhere, yet. But putting small labels on big things is always a tricky problem.
17:23<trash80>or any mirror
17:24<trash80>but every mirror does not have it
17:24<trash80>I'm saying, you can't get kde from experimental right now at all
17:24<azeem>trash80: yes, because it's in testing/unstable
17:24<azeem>at this point kde in experimental is no longer supported
17:25<trash80>ah, thx, the links on the debian package site should reflect that, it confused me
17:25<azeem>which package site?
17:26<trash80>if you follow the package link to the mirrors
17:26<azeem>those are automatically generated
17:26<trash80>ok, thank you very much, just confuse :)
17:26<trash80>I'll get it from testing/sid
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17:27<Wes>Ah! Found the problem by reducing my test case further. (Thanks Bzed)
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17:28<Wes>Does anybody know a better channel for asking about how system headers are expected to cascade on Linux platforms?
17:28<Wes>It turns out that it's <memory.h> that's poisoning _GNU_SOURCE (not sure exactly how yet)
17:28<Wes>No, I take that back in its entirety
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17:29<bzed>Wes: #c
17:29<esk>I just did a dist-upgrade in unstable and can no longer find my mouse
17:29*Wes hasn't had supper yet and made a typo in a test case reduction.
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17:29<dpkg>from memory, unstable is the status of a Debian release when packages can be added to the system at any time that might disrupt the integrity of the whole system! Ask me about <break>. Not supported here, in general. It's also newspeak for not stable. If you have to ask whether you should use it or how, you shouldn't. apt-get install apt-listbugs apt-listchanges (!) See <testing>, <sid>, <sid faq><apt-listbugs><apt-listchanges><bts>.
17:29<rodolfo>excuse me anybody can tell me where I can find Pidgin's developers?
17:29<azeem>rodolfo: not in here, sorry
17:29<bja>rodolfo: Have you tried their website?
17:30<rodolfo>azeem, I know I just forgot their channel
17:30<interbird>When I shutdown Debian, messages appear on tty7 instead of tt0, any hints anyone ?
17:30<azeem>rodolfo: try google
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17:37<Wes>interbird: you're not running a non-standard getty on tty0 or anything?
17:38<interbird>this is a lenny installation upgraded to squeeze; don't remember when it started
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17:40<bzed>rodolfo: look on their homepage, its mentioned somewhere there
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17:41<rodolfo>bzed, azeem, bja, thank you I have found the correct channel. I appreciate your help. bye =]
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17:42<dpkg>Another happy customer leaves the building
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17:42<dpkg>How high?
17:42<bzed>!jump to the sky
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17:47<deniz>is there an instant messaging client that allows for playing games on the MSN protocol such as uno?
17:50<adama_>I think, no.
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18:04<enouf>fxiny - yo just got in from work ...
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18:08<ml|>enouf: he left a while ago
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18:11<deniz>what's the latest version of windows live messenger that works in the wine of lenny?
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18:16<locklace>deniz: did you just come out of a course on how to craft questions to #debian precisely designed to ensure the least possible probability of being answered?
18:16<locklace>just curious
18:17-!-mode/#debian [+l 411] by debhelper
18:17<deniz>locklace, well i wanted to play uno with someone without having to install windows virtually, so does empathy does this maybe? or some other im client?
18:17<deniz>i have squeeze on another computer
18:17<deniz>if there is an im client on linux that could do this
18:18<interbird>did you just come out of a course... lol
18:18<interbird>!beer locklace
18:18*dpkg pulls out an excellent Delirium Tremens for locklace
18:18<watwww>is there a mainstream fs any more space-efficient than ext3fs?
18:19<watwww>for storing static files
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18:19<watwww>i guess another question might be, does fs type even matter for storing static files?
18:19<interbird>static files ?
18:20<interbird>romfs ?
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18:23<bzed>watwww: on which medium do you want to store the files?
18:23-!-ElegantAngel [] has quit []
18:23<MyWifeIs19>probably ssd
18:24<watwww>bzed, an extra sata disk i had laying around
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18:24<watwww>looks like it doesn't really matter
18:25<interbird>static files, files that do not change, are maybe best space efficiently stored on an compressing filesystem; depending if the files are compressable, unlike jpg's for instance
18:25<watwww>interbird, thats exactly my point
18:26<watwww>i have too much crap in /home/$USER than i want
18:27<watwww>so i'm looking for a more efficient way to service these types of files (mostly jpegs, mpegs, tarballs, or anything i download from the web that doesn't depend on my current fs)
18:27<bzed>watwww: just use ext3
18:27<watwww>ok, so it doesn't really matter
18:27<interbird>static files in $USER ? static means to me the do not change. hardly like file in $USER that do change
18:27<bja>watwww: Have you tried encrypting them encryption and compression are close relatives
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18:28<watwww>bja, thats why i was considering formating this extra disk as reiserfs
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18:28<interbird>reiser is in jail, so will your files be if you don't watch out
18:29*watwww ponders a complicated future
18:30<bja>watwww: I wouldn't recommend reiserfs, although its not yet a dead proyect, its not all that stable
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18:30<watwww>i'm probably over-thinking this too much
18:32<interbird>watwww: what do you want to accomplish ?
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18:33<watwww>more disk space for my root fs
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18:33<watwww> /home is getting bloated
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18:34<locklace>watwww: man rm
18:34<ml|>locklace: lol
18:34<interbird>delete some stuff you don't need or attach an extra drive and put /home on that
18:35<watwww>i mean where the hell do you guys store files in the tree that don't have any dependencies?
18:35<watwww>do you just simply mount a new disk, call it crap, and leave it in root?
18:35<watwww>imagine you're running a file-server
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18:36<interbird>man mount
18:36<ml|>place it where you want to
18:36<bja>watwww: No I usually call them differently and put them somewhere in between root and my $HOME :)
18:36-!-PeterFA [] has joined #debian
18:37<bja>BTW are western digital portable hd supported on linux?
18:37<interbird>ln -sf
18:38<ml|>it should
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18:38<bja>the usual sd? device
18:38<interbird>i have yet to come across an external usb drive not recognized by linux
18:39<ml|>bja: usb?
18:39<interbird>booting from it is a different story; depends on your bios and more....
18:39<watwww>mine works fine, and it was on discount
18:39<watwww>and it's a seagate :3
18:39<bja>ml|: I am going to buy it today or tomorrow
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18:40<mimmozzo>i want a cheap netbook
18:40<mimmozzo>100 euros
18:40<ml|>bja: should work, and use usbmount if ya like
18:40<mimmozzo>anyone? ;D
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18:40<interbird>seagate drives could have a power-safe issue; google for it
18:41<bja>interbird: What do you mean by power-safe
18:42<ml|>bja: you are getting WD so no worries
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18:42<onur>Hi. Can i use more than one command for the control a bug in Debian bug system?
18:42<onur>*at the same time
18:42<interbird>bja: from memory; some seagate drives have a power-safe mode (spin-down) that does not work correctly; i read about that some months ago
18:42<weasel>onur: yes.
18:42<onur>ok thanks
18:42<bja>interbird: thx i'll stick to wd
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18:44<ranix>interbird: I like your name
18:44<interbird>bja: -- duno about now
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18:44<interbird>ramix: me too :-)
18:44<ranix>I have a bird and I love him
18:45<ranix>I am picturing the interbirds, flying around the internets
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18:46<locklace>implementing rfc 1149, of course
18:46<interbird>what's the name of your bird? not tweetie u guess :-)
18:46<ranix>picking clamavs out of the torrents and dropping them on the hard disks
18:46<ranix>to get at the juicy freshmeat inside
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18:49<watwww>anyone here use debian as a virtual private server?
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18:50<ranix>watwww: see !anyone and !ask
18:50<watwww>i assume xen is the emulator of choice, but was wondering how difficult they are to setup
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18:50<watwww>who here is running xen on debian?
18:50<dpkg>Please do not ask if anyone uses 'some_program'. Instead, ask your real question. (If the real question _was_ "does anyone use 'some_program'?" ask me about <popcon> instead.) See <ask> <sicco> <ask-to-ask> <polls> <search>, or <htasq>
18:50<interbird>watwww: tried virtualbox ?
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18:51<watwww>of course, but i just got this contract with a marketing firm who wants to host 3 different sites in house
18:52<watwww>two running on apache (not really a problem) but one is running Sun's ONE web-server on solaris
18:53<interbird>Sun ONE is a webapp server right? is't that what is now GlassFish ?
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18:55<ariel>algun gfato por ak?
18:55<ariel>la concha de sus madres
18:55<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
18:55<interbird>hola ariel: this is an English channel
18:55<watwww>interbird, yes and no, i think
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18:56<ranix>watwww: xen is the best-performing VM
18:56<ranix>watwww: virtualbox is used by many
18:56<ranix>watwww: vmware is used by some
18:56<interbird>watwww: GlassFish is available for Linux and you can connect it to Apache
18:56<ranix>watwww: qemu is excellent, but maybe not for server use
18:57<watwww>ranix, could i easily restore an image to a different machine?
18:57<ranix>that's about all your options for VM hypervisors
18:57<ranix>watwww: I am not google
18:57<ml|>how about kvm
18:57<ranix>ml|: ah there is that
18:57<ariel>hola alguno q habla español?
18:58<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
18:58<interbird>ariel: we speak English here, please:
18:58<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
19:00<interbird>watwww: vmdk is a portable image format supported by several vm's
19:03<bja>ariel /j #debian-es
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19:05<watwww>interbird, i start this contract on monday, but from what i got so far the production sever is being staged by a web-host as a virtual private server. my job is to create a stage for the web-host staging the production server
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19:05<watwww>it all makes perfect sense =/
19:06<interbird>watwww: never start a contract you cannot deliver
19:06<watwww>interbird, i'm broke and need anything
19:06<ariel>you Transg de hit de Ubuntu On De Japon?
19:06<ranix>world needs more unemployed incompetent it guys imo
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19:09<interbird>watwww: apache for webserver, tomcat for webapplication server, tomcat can be replaced by GlassFish (Sun) or Geronimo (IBM); a connection between the webappserver and apache is possible like mapping a webapp to a url in a vhost of apache
19:09<watwww>i don't have control over how the site is already implemented
19:09<interbird>what do you want then ?
19:09<watwww>i have to implement (or simulate) a working version of what they already have
19:10<watwww>i know that from working with VirtualBox in the past that vdi's are not cross-platform compatible on other machines
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19:11<watwww>from where they were installed from
19:11<interbird>watwww: the latest virtualbox (2.2.2 by heart) supports vmdk's; a portable image format
19:12<bja>watwww: I've seen kvm perform flawlessly on intel hw as long as there is no X involved
19:13<bja>watwww: I don't have any benchmarks, but I'm sure someone has allready made them
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19:15<sylar>what do i do if i want to install a package to a different folder?
19:17<bja>sylar: Just guessing you download it, you expand the .deb file and you put it wherever you want. Just guessing
19:17<interbird>packages are bound to the directory the are compiled for; you cannot change it unless you compile the package yourself from source and change the destination
19:17<bja>interbird: Where can I read more on thath
19:18<interbird>the place where packages are installed is ok, there is no need to change it
19:19<interbird>bja: o what? vmdk's? read the virtualbox manual, it's an indexed pdf, you might find it interesting
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19:20<bja>interbird: More on compiling and binding programss to dirs. And that stuff.
19:20<bja>interbird: Virtualbox manual was downloaded on monday je je pretty interensting
19:21<interbird>not ?
19:21<watwww>interbird, thanks
19:22<watwww>vmdk seems to do the trick (in theory)
19:22<bja>interbird: Guess i need again that 9-iron for my fingers
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19:22<Txt_file>is there a way to setup a linux-PC as wlan accsess point?
19:23<interbird>bja: guess so....
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19:24<ml|>!lart bja
19:24*dpkg pours hot grits down the front of bja's pants
19:24<watwww>interbird, i think it's donkey balls vmware doesn't support debian as a host
19:25<bja>dpkg: dye
19:25<dpkg>bja: I give up, what is it?
19:25<bja>dpkg: die pls
19:25*dpkg takes two shots to the head, murders bja then crumples to the ground, lifeless...
19:25<watwww>dpkg is so sadistic
19:25<dpkg>watwww: I don't know, could you explain it?
19:26<interbird>watwww: who needs vmware? why would you use it? virtualbox is a free solution, supporting vmware's vmdk format; you could have your stuff ready before monday....
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19:26<watwww>it's not due on monday, i have a month to work on this
19:27<watwww>but you're right
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19:27<bja>locklace: thx
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19:47<Txt_file>is there a way to setup a linux-PC as wlan accsess point?
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20:03<user01>what is the best way to learn programming so i can write packages for debian one day? should i start with ruby with rails?
20:03<user01>ruby on rails
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20:04<user01>or learn python or perl
20:04<locklace>start with the shell.
20:04<user01>or c
20:04<user01>locklace, ok and after the shell?
20:06<locklace>depends what kind of thing you want to do. but you have to know unix well, and sh is an important piece and a good introduction.
20:06<MyWifeIs19>just say no to csh scripting
20:06<user01>locklace, from your page: "Why bother to learn shell programming, when you could be out there rollerblading or trying to get a date?"
20:07<ml|>Because, in a word, it's useful.
20:07-!-Lin [] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
20:07<user01>ml|, thats two words, three if you count the contraction
20:08<ml|>user01: what i was trying to get across is that to keep reading
20:08<MyWifeIs19>user01, learn python after bash scripting
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20:09<ml|>i wouldn't learn bash scripting, just sh
20:10<user01>ok, i just learned a a lot about LaTeX and presented it to my LUG and they seemed to be thinking "why on earth did you waste your time with that?"
20:11<user01>so ill try out the bash scripting . .. i just didnt know what shell to start with
20:11<user01>when i installed openbsd they seemed very into tcsh
20:12<locklace>sh, not bash
20:12<ml|>bash tcsh are shells
20:13<locklace>and if you want to write software applications, there are many more important things to learn before worrying about what language to use
20:13-!-dr|z3d [~dr|] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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20:13<locklace>like, you know, how to design software
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20:15<user01>so sh scripting and not bash scripting
20:15<user01>do sh then bash then . . .
20:15<MyWifeIs19>look up "csh programming considered harmful"
20:16<MyWifeIs19>also "top 10 resons not to use C shell"
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20:17<user01>i was playing around with the website try ruby and was enjoying it
20:21<locklace>do you know how to design layered, orthogonal and composable abstractions? do you know how to separate interface from implementation? do you know how to analyze the asymptotic efficiency of an algorithm or prove it will halt with the correct result?
20:22<user01>is there a universal command line command to see what shell is running?
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20:23<sney>some shells handle variables differently, but ls -l /bin/sh will show you what the default shell is
20:24<locklace>echo $SHELL, and i'll take that as "no"
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20:26<user01>locklace, i thought learning a programming language first would be better than learning how to analyse the asymptotic efficiency of an algorithm i didnt know how to program yet
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20:27<locklace>not really
20:27<user01>locklace, thanks for the $SHELL
20:28<user01>hmmm so echo $SHELL says bash, ls -l /bin/sh says dash
20:29<locklace>i mean, sure, spend a couple of days learning the syntax of some language so you can experiment and write working test programs, but that's trivial compared to learning things like algorithm analysis, good engineering practice and os architecture
20:29<locklace>(unless you pick c++, and then it's the seventh circle of hell)
20:30<user01>well i took a semester of c/c++ once
20:30<user01>i didnt learn much
20:30<user01>but i got a good grade
20:31<user01>that was in high school
20:32<locklace>here's a good free book if you're ready to do the real thing:
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20:33<bja>!beer locklace
20:33*dpkg pours a litre of Piraat for locklace
20:33<ml|>maybe this one...
20:33<user01>locklace, that book seems to think i should learn lisp
20:33<locklace>you should
20:34<ranix>lol lisp
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20:34<ranix>jump into C headfirst
20:34<ranix>futz with php
20:34<ranix>perl, awk, whatever
20:34<ranix>whatever you happen to get into
20:34<chris__>would this be a good place to ask some basic questions about Debian / Linux?...I'm just starting out with it
20:34<bja>chris__: Just shoot
20:34<ranix>chris__: any debian question is on-topic here
20:34<ml|>chris__: yes
20:34<chris__>cool, thanks...
20:34<locklace>user01: but the book is not about any language, it's about exactly what the title says it is
20:35-!-bgupta is now known as bgupta|away
20:35<user01>locklace, i know the first page says everything is going to be given in lisp
20:36<chris__>first question for the moment...I've found how to install and uninstall software through the System\Administration\Add and Remove Programs...but how do I install software that is not listed there, or how do I get other software listed...I can elaborate with a specific example here in a sec...
20:36<ml|>dpkg: tell chris__ about ask
20:36<ml|>dpkg: tell chris__ about grounding
20:37<chris__>at the following web page, , is one example of software that I could download...but I'm not quite sure how
20:37<chris__>...or I have downloaded the .deb file but can't seem to do anything with it...sounds like you guys are about to explain something to me though :)
20:38<ml|>chris__: read what it is tell you on top
20:38<chris__>I went to that sources.list and attempted to do that but didn't have any luck...I might not be doing it exactly correct
20:39<user01>hey these books were made with tex2page, maybe learning latex was useful afterall :)
20:39<ml|>dpkg tell chris__ about sources.list
20:40<chris__>after I add my chosen ftp/http directory to that sources.list, is it supposed to update my "Add and Remove Software" program to include this new database?
20:40<chris__>"Add/Remove Applications" be specific
20:40-!-Gun_Smoke [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:41*MyWifeIs19 is learing intercal
20:41<ml|>chris__: read messages from dpkg
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20:43<sylar>how can I hibernate?
20:43<chris__>ah, thanks, didn't see that i was getting direct messages....
20:43<MyWifeIs19>sylar, take some unisom
20:43<ml|>dpkg tell chris__ about dpkgbot
20:44<shamanix>chris__: install gdebi from your package manager (you call it add remove), or in terminal dpkg -i downloadedfilenamehere.deb
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20:44<sylar>MyWifeIs19, I am tired
20:44<ml|>shamanix: yes, but that app he wants is the repos
20:45<sylar>MyWifeIs19, must hibernate
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20:46<MyWifeIs19>sylar, if you have any *codine, it will work too
20:47<sylar>MyWifeIs19, my computer has a *codine tolerance so it will not work on him
20:47<MyWifeIs19>sylar, you can also watch re-run of golden girls
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20:50<locklace>sylar: man s2disk
20:50-!-Gun_Smoke [] has joined #debian
20:52<ml|>dpkg: s2disk
20:52<dpkg>somebody said s2disk was something what does not work.
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20:52<sylar>dpkg: hibernate
20:52<dpkg>no idea, sylar
20:53-!-bgupta|away is now known as bgupta
20:53<dpkg>Suspend can mean either suspend to disk (a.k.a. hibernate) or suspend to ram. The in-kernel suspend now works pretty well in etch (and even better in lenny) . There are also kernel patches that provide more features such as <tuxonice>. Installing the uswsusp and hibernate packages along with a front-end like gnome-power-manager or kpowersave should be enough. Also ask me about <suspend troubleshooting>. <swapwake>
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20:56<sylar>I am toast
20:56<sylar>tried hibernate and now my comp still run and not responsive
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20:57<locklace>welcome to linux suspend
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20:59<MyWifeIs19>fwiw, vista messed up suspend on many laptops, I heard
20:59<adama_>simple question: how do I see what is the return value from a command: /etc/init.d/dovecot start is supposed to return 1 or 2 on error - I want to print this out
21:00<locklace>adama_: echo $?
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21:01<adama_>thanks! it is returning 0 but does not appear to be running after
21:01-!-arthurfurlan [~arthurfur@] has joined #debian
21:03<adama_>and I cannot find any logs
21:03-!-githogori [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
21:03<adama_>ah here is some log in syslog
21:03<k1lumin4t1>is there any tool to recover cut/deleted data from a USB drive?
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21:07<locklace>k1lumin4t1: if you feel like entering forensic disk analysis land
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21:38<bja>Anyone a free statistics book on the web, I'm too lazy to dig mine out of the n boxes stored?
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21:44*bja picks his flashlight, the old keys and drags his body towards the warehouse
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21:53<bremner>I'm trying add a subkey to an openpgp smartcard. I get the following error messages: I can successfully create a key from scratch, so it is counterintuitive that it should be a communications problem
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22:13<pooples>Is there a debian download that comes without a gui?
22:14<pooples>cuz im gonna install fluxbox.. so id rather start from scratch
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22:15<sney>use the netinst and don't select any tasks, like laptop desktop server etc
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22:15<sney>just leave it all blank and it'll install the base system and leave you to your devices
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22:16<wooj>yep, what sney said. I only have lxde on my debian, works perfectly.
22:17<pooples>so when im installing debian, i choose netinst?
22:17<shamanix>you have to have the netinst iso
22:17<sney>you download the netinst (net installer) iso
22:17<sney>and then you use that to install
22:17<pooples>oh alright
22:18<sney>it's pretty tiny, it just has the installer base and pulls almost everything over the net, hence the name
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22:18<jrabbit>sney: no.
22:18<ml|>yeah 150mb or so
22:18<jrabbit>if you provide a network conenction the normal installer will bring in the latest packages
22:19<pooples>so i just choose one of the image files from the "Small CD's" category on the download page?
22:19<jrabbit>I don't know why you want to
22:19<sney>yea, but the normal installer also uses the CD as a default apt source for a lot of stuff, and we don't really need to confuse this guy
22:19<sney>yes pooples.
22:19<jrabbit>if you don't learn now you jsut end up fucking up your debian install sney
22:20<jrabbit>And then they think "debian did it"
22:20<jrabbit>when in reality they didn't jsut fucking learn how to do any thing
22:20<ml|>yes pooples, but not that business card
22:20<pooples>whoa.. watch your language there skipper
22:21<sney>man all you gotta do is install the base system with no tasks and then apt-get install fluxbox
22:21<sney>and the system will do the rest
22:21<sney>it is not that big of a deal jrabbit.
22:21<ml|>aptitude ;)
22:21<pooples>gotta go and curse
22:22<sney>I apt, I'm old school, it doesn't matter, it all works out! hooray! ubuntu for old people! go USA!
22:22<shamanix>is there a netinst for testing(squeeze)?, cause I sure can't find one
22:22<ml|>sney: lol
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22:22<sney>they used to do daily netinst builds for testing
22:22<shamanix>sney: what happened to that?
22:23<sney>for all I know it still exists, it was just a little annoying to find the page
22:23<sney>I just don't know since my current hardware uses a custom image
22:24<jrabbit>sney: old-school is dpkg k thx
22:24<sney>I think it was under debian-installer
22:24<sney>I'm certified in dpkg but it's not as relevant in a comparison with aptitude. you could say dselect
22:25<sney>but dselect was really annoying
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22:25<sney>so I wouldn't keep using it no matter how old school it was
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22:26<shamanix>holy @$%^ THERE IS a testing netinst, just googled it
22:26*shamanix is going to have a lot of fun today
22:26<jrabbit>there is no reason for nightlies...
22:26<jrabbit>you ..
22:27<jrabbit>fuck it if i expalin it it won't sink in
22:27<ml|>shamanix: link plz, i can never find it
22:27<ml|>shamanix: thank you
22:28<shamanix>just googled debian testing netinst, first page to come up
22:28-!-SiCuTDeUx_ [~sicutdeux@] has joined #debian
22:30<sney>my first linux experience was on debian potato, setting up my system with dselect
22:30<sney>looking back it's a wonder I didn't run screaming
22:31<shamanix>my first was Caldera, no comment, and I ran screaming :-) that was ~10+ years ago
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22:31<Nemoder>heh me too, and I still use dselect!
22:32<wooj>my first was yggdrasil... it was evil.
22:33<sney>I've heard of that one
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22:33<ml|>shamanix: i have searched for that before but doesn't come up for me, but thanks
22:33<wooj>it was a long time ago, on a 386. X took 20 mins to start up in my 4mb ram.
22:33<Nemoder>actually my first was redhat5.2, dselect on potato was a blessing compared to those :P
22:33<wooj>I feel old
22:33<wooj>I'm gonna go shoot myself and go to the glue factory now.
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22:35<doubledutch>Hello all - new install of XFCE and Debian Lenny on a Laptop, connected a camera via USB 1.1; just now how can I access it? Old system was "automagic"
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22:36<Nemoder>doubledutch: I use gtkam
22:37-!-kingsley [~kingsley@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:37<wooj>doubledutch, you can use mplayer, cheese, gtkam, lots of apps.
22:38<doubledutch>Thank you.
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22:40<tonytraductor>I just mount the camera, or the sd card, and access the files through the file system
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22:49<ml|>you can also use usbmount
22:54<ml|>doubledutch: but from my days of using xfce, it should show up in thunar
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22:59<wakariera>my vlc wunt show any video
23:00<aa>Hello, I have an annoying CUPS question that I need help with
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23:02<aa>anyone know how to edit/change the popup username and passwd in the http://localhost:631/admin/
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23:10<pablo>hello i need help
23:12<ed_debian>What's up pablo?
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23:14<pablo>i need know, how to jump a proxi
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23:15<ed_debian>I don't think you can :(
23:16<pablo>but if I connect at once to another proxy?
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23:18<pablo>ok, thank you
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23:19<pablo>good bay
23:19<ed_debian>sorry :(
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23:36<user01>is there a way to select a wireless network at bootup?
23:36<user01>i am usually in one of three places
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23:37<user01>like to prompt at boot which location
23:39<xemacs4321>maybe in networkmanager, but that is gnome/xfce
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23:48<user01>xemacs4321, i think im doing something wrong with network manager it lets me enter name but not bssids
23:49<user01>xemacs4321, if i change it in network it is ok
23:50<user01>it always prompts me for the distro name though
23:50<xemacs4321>i dont have laptop so i dont know , sorry
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23:53<phorce1>is there a metapackage for installing -dev requirements for compiling X/GTK/QT programs?
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23:57<xemacs4321>phorce1, apt-get build-dep package-name
23:58<xemacs4321>phorce1, or look it up on
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---Logclosed Sat May 30 00:00:07 2009