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#debian IRC Logs for 2009-09-24

---Logopened Thu Sep 24 00:00:11 2009
---Daychanged Thu Sep 24 2009
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02:04<twb>I have a new HP SmartArray hardware raid card. Anybody know offhand the least-worst way to tell it "just give me the goddamn disks so I can use Linux md raid"?
02:04<twb>AFAICT that is to configure three one-disk RAID0 arrays
02:05<jm_>what does it show if it's totally unconfigured?
02:06<twb>You mean if you remove all the arrays?
02:06<twb>Just checking now.
02:06<sney>iirc the smart array boards don't have a programmable interface that you can just get into, you need to use the annoying hp smartstart disc. which is linux based. you could dissect it and figure out what it's doing, I suppose.
02:07<jm_>i remember having the same problem with SCSI RAID controller in some of our old dell servers
02:07<jm_>(to get it to present individual disks)
02:07<sney>those big hardware raid boards don't want to let you do it in software
02:07<sney>they're designed to do the raid themselves
02:07<sney>and they're fairly good at it, I think in many/most cases it's best to just do it their way
02:08<sney>all the hotplug and array building etc stuff is implemented in hardware. md is cool but a chip that does it for you is cooler
02:09<twb>sney: well, see, the other problem is that $purchasing_guy didn't ask for the RAID5 line item
02:09<twb>So the firmware won't let you pick anything other than RAID0 and (I think) RAID1.
02:09<sney>oh, that stinks
02:09<twb>Pretty stupid because he did the same thing last time :-/
02:09<sney>isn't the firmware on those guys socketed
02:10<twb>Fucked if I know; I normally deal with whitebox crap
02:10<sney>there are so many smart array boards I can't remember if it's all or just some
02:10<sney>5300 I think is socketed.
02:10<sney>or is it 6400? eh i don't remember but if you look it should be obvious
02:10<twb>OK, if you remove all the arrays, the RAID BIOS halts the boot and forces you to make some
02:11<jm_>hehe exactly the same shit as our dells then
02:11<twb>Apparently the RAID card is a P410 (SAS), not that I expect that to help anyone
02:12<sney>I guess your only choice is to make 1-disk arrays if it'll let you. and if it doesn't, take the card downstairs and feed it to $purchasing_guy and get a replacement dummy disk controller and/or actual raid5 board
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02:40<pde>anyone know why control-alt-backspace might have stopped working?
02:40<pde>I've added Option "XkbOptions" "terminate:ctrl_alt_bksp" to the InputDevice stanza of xorg.conf
02:40<pde>it doesn't seem to help
02:42<jm_>is that the latest solution to this idiocy?
02:43<Gold24>how about dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg?
02:43<jm_>previously it was enabled by setting dontzap to false
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02:46<jm_>pde: are you using input hotplug?
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02:47<twb>Apparently I cannot allocate more than two arrays, so with one-disk RAID0 drives, I can't make all three drives visible to mdadm.
02:48<twb>Furthermore, they show up as cciss/c0dN instead of sd[abc], which makes me super distrustful
02:48<jm_>yeah that's common for cciss
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02:48<twb>Not seeing "sda" to me screams out "I am a fakeraid!"
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02:52*twb gripes
02:55<twb>Stupid "enterprise" junk.
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03:51<leikh>In aliases I have list: :include: /path/to/list. When sending to list, is seen by recipient as the to: address. Can I tell exim to rewrite to each specific listmembers address?
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03:53<twb>You could use an inline list and hope clients preserve it. That's probably a bad idea. The address would look something like "Eric Conspiracy":,,;
03:55<leikh>yup, bad idea :)
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04:13<locklace>in squeeze, "grub" is now a dummy package and i need to get rid of it. but "aptitude remove grub" wants to remove grub-common and grub-legacy too for no reason that i can see. what gives?
04:14<anton>have you installed grub2 first?
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04:14<locklace>no, and i'm not going to.
04:15<anton>then you have to tell aptitude to flag grub-common and grub-legacy as manually installed - otherwise it think they should be removed when you remove grub
04:15<anton>(or just leave grub installed)
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04:15<locklace>oh, it's an unmarkauto thing. thanks
04:15<locklace>!beer anton
04:15*dpkg pours a pint of Franziskaner Hefeweizen for anton
04:16<anton>:D <gulp>
04:17<locklace>btw, what is the actual upgrade process for grub2 now? will just installing grub-pc do everything automatically?
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04:18<anton>locklace, I did it at home recently, and I think it first chainloads grub-legacy. You have to run an explicit command to move to grub2
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04:19<jm_>it asks you about chainloading, or at least it used to
04:19<locklace>ok. is the upgrade process documented anywhere?
04:19<vortek>I currently trying to get my 1370 wireless mini pci card in this laptop, i heard the latest kernel supports it, my question is it easier to use ndiswrappers or compile it in the kernel?
04:20<jm_>locklace: try this
04:20<gsimmons>vortek: Is this still your outdated sid system with a 2.6.22 kernel?
04:21<jm_> says to just install the grub package ins queeze
04:21<vortek>im thinking of just installing the kernel from my xp partition
04:22<vortek>whatyou thik would be easier?
04:22<gsimmons>vortek: You can alternatively use the bcm43xx driver in that kernel, once firmware is supplied, for support of your BCM4318 device.
04:22<locklace>jm_: ah, it's that second link that has the actual upgrade
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04:22<vortek>ah hso my current kernel supports it ?
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04:24<vortek>just recompile with it selected ?
04:24<vortek>gsimmons: sorry i been out the loop for a few years :
04:25<gsimmons>vortek: It's already there as a module. See the example procedure at to assist with your situation.
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04:29<vortek>uhm #
04:29<vortek> * Due to Debian bug #513087, ensure that you install the b43-fwcutter package
04:29<vortek> (and fetch/extract firmware, when prompted) prior to restarting with the
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04:30<vortek>what ab out the bottum of to howto ? syays i have to use another kernel?
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04:33<gsimmons>vortek: If you upgrade your system to Lenny as per the release notes, a new kernel (2.6.26) will be installed. This provides the b43 driver, which also supports your BCM4318-based device. Specific firmware for that driver is required.
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04:34<vortek>ahh bbut wireless as per howto is established before upgrade right ?
04:34<jm_>that's the idea
04:35<vortek>thanxs man!
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04:36<vortek>how can i find my windows partition? so far i cant find it by mounting
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04:37<jm_>vortek: cat /proc/partitions ; fdisk -l
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04:38<vortek>one last question : #
04:38<vortek>Extract firmware from Broadcom driver, output in /lib/firmware:
04:38<vortek> # bcm43xx-fwcutter -w /lib/firmware /path/to/driver/wl_apsta-
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04:39<vortek>what about that part? how do i know the location?
04:39<vortek>and could you paste that parition info agian ?
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04:41<vortek>i mean what did you type on how i can find my win partition?
04:42<vortek>i lost it before i could log it
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04:42<gsimmons>vortek: < jm_> vortek: cat /proc/partitions ; fdisk -l
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04:44<vortek>one last question
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04:44<vortek># bcm43xx-fwcutter -w /lib/firmware /path/to/driver/wl_apsta- <=== how do i know the location?
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04:45<vortek>the path to driver part im asking about
04:46<jm_>vortek: wherever you downloaded it
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04:46<vortek> is the guide im using ; pardon my if i sound ignorant\
04:47<jm_>yes, it says acquire the driver - so download it, save it somewhere, use this path
04:48<vortek>ahh i see doh!
04:48*vortek smacks himself
04:48<vortek>these valuims are making me stupid hehe
04:49<vortek>ever since ive been put in nursing home i lost track of computers for five years man the withdraws were crazy heeh
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04:50<vortek>but im faithfull to debian i wont touch another distro
04:50<shambo>hi everyone :)
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04:51<vortek>will the new window managers run on a 1000 mhz ?
04:52<shambo>Can anyone tell me how to customize Debian DVD with my choice of packages
04:52<jm_>new versions of icewm, awesome, larswm et all most definitely will :)
04:52<shambo>I am new to linux :(
04:53<jm_>shambo: nope, not anyone can
04:53<shambo>why ?
04:53<vortek>what about them new ones that are totaly new i forget the names though
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04:53<jm_>say my mom has no idea what debian is so she can't tell you
04:54<shambo>can it be done ?
04:54<jm_>see above
04:55<shambo>ok , Thanks a lot
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04:56<shambo>I need a custom disc to install Debian on 10 computers in my college with some particular packages
04:57<stuckey>If I kill a bash session will that also kill the program running on it?
04:57<ce_gokil>kdfjovjojfvjkvkvmbol fuckkk youuu
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04:58<vortek>beryl and compiz will they run on a 1000 mhz?
04:58<shambo>jm_ : how long are you using Debian
04:59<jm_>vortek: in theory they would if your gfx card is OK
04:59<jm_>shambo: I don't remember, started with 1.3.1
04:59*Gold24 was just about to say it depends more on the gfx card
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04:59<shambo>Ok, Please pardon my poor English .
04:59<stuckey>I have an instance of mocp launched in a shell that won't terminate. It doesn't show up in ps.... How do I kill it?
04:59<jm_>probably 1997
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05:00<spion>is Jérémy Lal anywhere in irc?
05:00<spion>"Jeremy Lal" even
05:00<shambo>Thats a lot of years ...... 12 yrs :O
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05:01<shambo>I was 7 yrs old :)
05:01<vortek>is there anything nicer then beryl ?
05:02<jm_>vortek: beryl has been merged with compiz
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05:03<shambo>jm_ : where are you from ?
05:04<jm_>shambo: slovenia
05:04<shambo>jm_ : India
05:04<jm_>shambo: I checked :)
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05:11<spion>Jeremy Lal sometimes hanging around here?
05:12<vortek>so what do i look up in google compiz or beryl?
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05:13<jm_>compiz, but why google? debian has it
05:13<petemc>spion: if you know someones nick the bot has a seen function
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05:13<spion>petemc: my problem is, I don't know his nick :P
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05:14<dr|z3d>spion: If you don't, how are we meant to? ;)
05:14<dr|z3d>"Anyone seen Dorothy Parker?"
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05:14<petemc>i shouldnt be helping you stalk someone, but you can use /who and then /lastlog in the status window
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05:15<spion>dr|z3d: maybe anybody know his nick and his realname?
05:16<spion>dr|z3d: my client displays also the realname when someone joins the channel
05:16<azeem>not everybody uses realnames in here
05:16<azeem>or rather, the majority probably doesn't
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05:16<spion>azeem: anyways ... it was just a try
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05:16<azeem>and I never head about him
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05:57<Frozen_>good morning
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06:02<Blood>hi all
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06:03<Blood>i got a new laptop. And it has vista installed. and ill probly need vista (its for my engineering school. bought by it) and i wanted to install debian (coz vista is slow as hell)
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06:03<Blood>how can i proceed to install debian, without fucking up vista ? i had tried on my computer, and debian (or grub i dunno) corrupted the hall.dll file or something like that.
06:04<jm_>create another partition for Debian and install it there
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06:05<Blood>Jm_ thats what i did the last time on my computer. And i still fucked up some file. Are you sure it will keep vista working ? Ill have to try XFCE this time :p
06:06<reinie>hall.dll could have been fucked up by sunspots as well
06:06<Blood>Jeez, when i think about it, im really some geek. First thing i do when i get a computer is install linux
06:06<dr|z3d>Blood: Try supergrub. Might help.
06:06<Blood>sunspots => ? im not english :)
06:06<Blood>Supergrub O.O Never heard of it. Ill have a go at it :).
06:06<dr|z3d>Blood: There's also help online for recovering Vista after installing Linux.
06:06<jm_>Blood: yes, the installer won't touch other partitions, unless there's a severe bug, no-one has reported anything similar here
06:07<jm_>Blood: also be careful as to where you install GRUB
06:07<Blood>jm_ that might of been my error. where should grub be installed ? On the /boot partition ?
06:07<cmot>Yodel! Anybody remembers sarge? We'll have to modify an appliance (upgrading to lenny is not currently possible) and integrate VPN. Which of *SWAN or whatever was present in sarge for IPSec? Did PPTP work (server and/or client) with encryption in sarge?
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06:08<cmot>Blood, I've found a /boot partition unnecessary with modern systems; but grub in the Linux partition is probably a good idea, and let the mbr be windws' own problem.
06:08<dr|z3d>Blood: Maybe might shed some light?
06:08<jm_>Blood: well you only have two options - MBR or your debian partition; in the latter case you will need to configure a way to be able to boot that, you can use windows boot loader for this if you want, but it's much easier to put GRUB on MBR and start Windows from it
06:09<Blood>mbr = multi boot something ?
06:09<dpkg>[mbr] Master Boot Record, the first bit of code loaded from the hard drive when a PC boots. To install a clean MBR (e.g. to get rid of LILO if it is in the MBR) from DOS one can run "fdisk /mbr"; from linux "install-mbr /dev/hda", or ask me about <fixmbr>, or see See for guidelines on copying the MBR.
06:09<Blood>so the MBR can be grub or lilo for example ?
06:09<jm_>yes, or windows
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06:11<Blood>dr|z3d: thanks for the link, it answered some of my question. Yeah, but what i wanted to do (well, ive done it in the past) is replace the windows MBR by grub.
06:12<jm_>that should work just fine - it shall detect windows is installed and will add an entry for it in the boot menu
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06:19<cmot>IPSec: What is the status: kernel-native ipsec, do the *SWAN need kernel patches, which toolset should I use?
06:20<cmot>I'm completely confused because there are too many options...
06:20<cmot>(And, as I've said: if anybody can tell me what was relevant back when sarge was current this would be the bonus question.)
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06:36<lancelot_of>hallo everybody
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06:37<lancelot_of>i'm trying to make an apple alluminium usb keyboard working on my debian system..many Fn keys do not work, as such as keyboard usb ports that could be very useful working on a laptop..any suggestion/experience?
06:38<dr|z3d>lancelot_of: Make sure your keyboard layout's set to "Macintosh".
06:38<lancelot_of>dr|z3d, howto?
06:39<valdyn>lancelot_of: is acpi-support installed?
06:39<lancelot_of>valdyn, of course
06:40<lancelot_of>valdyn, i'm under i've eee-acpi-support which conflicts with acpi-support
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06:41<dr|z3d>lancelot_of: Check the obvious things.. keyboard layout, locale etc.. dig around your settings menu.
06:43<lancelot_of>dr|z3d, is this method excluing my laptop keyboard from working?
06:43<dr|z3d>lancelot_of: If you've got a Mac keyboard attached and it's not configured as such, then yes.
06:44<lancelot_of>dr|z3d, i should desire to configure such as making both working
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06:50<flexy>How can I have each new login via ssh to be ioniced to idle level instantly?
06:51<jm_>flexy: shell startup scripts?
06:51<awoodland>there's gotta be a pam module for that surely
06:51<jm_>for ionice? i doubt
06:51<lancelot_of>dr|z3d, i tried dpkg-reconfigure console-data, choosing mac architecture from the full list, but a get a dpkg warnig: dpkg: warning: obsolete option '--print-installation-architecture', please use '--print-architecture' instead.
06:51<lancelot_of> and nothing change on my keyboard
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06:52<flexy>jm_: how do I differentiate ssh from local login?
06:52<jm_>flexy: echo $TTY
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06:53<flexy>jm_: empty when ssh, includes something when local?
06:53<awoodland>it'll be pts something for ssh
06:53<jm_>flexy: is it? darn I thought bash sets it, but apparently not - use tty output
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06:54<jm_>flexy: ahh even better, LocalCommand in ssh config might work for you
06:54<flexy>jm_, awoodland: echo $any of those gives empty...
06:54<flexy>jm_: ok
06:54<jm_>flexy: tty is a command
06:55<flexy>jm_: ok, so it seems :)
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06:58<makkan>I use this line in inittab to log in automatically to my system: 1:2345:respawn:/bin/login -f YOUR_USER_NAME tty1 </dev/tty1 >/dev/tty1 2>&1 this works fine, but now I wanted to use ttysnoop so I have to call login from snooptab instead but for some reason that wont work. Can anyone tell me why?
06:59<makkan>flexy: I wrote a script that finds out wether your're on a tty or pts if you're interested. I had a similar issue the day before yesterday.
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07:01<flexy>makkan: can you paste it to me?
07:01<makkan>flexy: <--- should be the first post there...
07:02<flexy>makkan: ok, thanks
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07:03<jm_>makkan: what's the error you get?
07:04<makkan>jm_: Good question, it just dosen't log in. Where should I check for errors?
07:04<flexy>jm_: did you mean in ssh_config or sshd_config? I found enabling option for it in ssh_config, but does that work? I mean that I have not access to all machines accessing the server I need to have idle io class set on its users...
07:04<makkan>jm_: automatically that is, normal login still works
07:04<jm_>flexy: ssh_config
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07:05<jm_>makkan: did you check logs?
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07:06<valdyn>one isnt logged in remotely when the tty is a pts
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07:07<makkan>jm_: no unfortunately I was way to tired to think of that yesterday, I'll do that today. Thanks for the tip... and making me fel stupid ;)
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07:08<makkan>valdyn: well I know you can be on a pts locally aswell but I didn't know you could be on a tty remotely?
07:08<lancelot_of>if i run dmesg after usb device plugged in apple keybord usb ports, i can see the in kernel messages the usb device recognizing...but i can't mount it 'cause i can't find the device in /dev nor in nautilus automount
07:09<lancelot_of>any hint?
07:13<jm_>lancelot_of: did you check what kernel says when you plug it in?
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07:15<lancelot_of>jm_, yes,
07:16<lancelot_of>jm, but the apple keyboard desn't work if i've run dpkg-reconfigure console-data...
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07:17<jm_>lancelot_of: rejected 1 configuration due to insufficient available bus power, USB disconnect, address 8
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07:18<lancelot_of>jm, so there's no way to make ub key working on these ports, right?
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07:20<jm_>lancelot_of: maybe you just need to adjust something, there are some settings in /sys, tryt googling for this error
07:20<lancelot_of>jm_, i've tried to plug in those ports the mouse and it works!
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07:21<jm_>lancelot_of: yeah different devices have different requirements
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07:22<lancelot_of>jm, i could use this port for mouse and laptop port for usb keys...however, Fn key problem persists...and no useful information for debian on the web...
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07:23<jm_>lancelot_of: do they work on console?
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07:25<lancelot_of>jm_, no
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07:32<jm_>lancelot_of: sorry can't help with this, not familiar with hardware
07:34<valdyn>lancelot_of: you need to read a little more carefully: rejected 1 configuration due to insufficient available bus power
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07:37<valdyn>lancelot_of: so appearantly your device claims to and/or does need more electricity than that usb port provides
07:38<xeon-enouf>lancelot_of: fwiw, at some point, console-data is replaced with console-setup
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07:38<dr|z3d>lancelot_of: That means, in essence, you need to find yourself a powered usb hub, probably.
07:39<valdyn>lancelot_of: fn-fx key aren't like keyboard keys, you need acpid to monitor what they emit
07:39<xeon-enouf>kvm! :-p
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07:40<valdyn>lancelot_of: i guess they emit something that isnt covered by your acpi scripts, they they do work
07:40<Kipples>hi all maybe some one can help me :)
07:40<xeon-enouf>valdyn: are those the (power related) entries i see in /proc/bus/input/devices ?
07:40<valdyn>xeon-enouf: no idea
07:41*xeon-enouf recalls seeing apple things here, for many others, possibly even myself at times
07:41<xeon-enouf>er s/here/there
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07:44<lancelot_of>valdyn, any aoggestion to fix?
07:44<valdyn>lancelot_of: fix what?
07:44<lancelot_of>i configured pommed and launched /etc/init.d restart but Fn keys still don't work
07:44<valdyn>lancelot_of: quit your system acpid and start one in verbose / debugging mode in a terminal
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07:45<lancelot_of>acpi_listen do not recognize any Fn Key pressing event
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07:46<valdyn>lancelot_of: and you dont get events at /dev/input/* either?
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07:48<lancelot_of>valdyn, in /dev/input/ there are several enumerated events, but none associated with Fn-Key pressing
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07:50<urbinek>what WIFI card can you recommend for wifi sharing (change debian into AP) with g or n standard ?
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08:18<dpkg>X.Org X11, the reference implementation of the X Window System, forked from XFree86 4.4RC2. The current release is X11R7.4. To install, ask me about <install x>. Ask me about <drxx> to reconfigure. #xorg on
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08:37<mjt>hmm. Where to configure keyboard language and stuff (xkb) on sid?
08:37<mjt>before it was in "keyboard" section in xorg.conf, now that section is skipped due to evdev and hotplug.
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08:38<urbinek>it won't work if you put it in xorg.conf ?
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08:38<mjt>for that i have to turn off all the hotplug stuff
08:38<jm_>mjt: if you disable input hotplug it's still there, otherwise it's done via HAL, also try dpkg-reconfigure console-setup
08:39<mjt>aha. console-setup it is
08:39<mjt>a package i skipped when trying to update X bits to -sid
08:39<mjt>(had to rebuild some X package - maybe xorg-common - to remove certain deps)
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08:41<mjt>blah. it asks me which keyboard i have, but the list does not even have this vendor.
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08:43<carnil>Hi, I'm trying to deboostrap a minimal unstable chroot under lenny with debootstrap --arch=amd64 --variant=buildd --verbose --include=fakeroot,build-essential --components=main --resolve-deps sid reference
08:43<carnil>(rund by sbuild-createchroot)
08:43<carnil>but it fails
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08:43<carnil>does someone experienced the same?
08:44<carnil>any Idea how I can solve that?
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08:44<mjt>aargh... console-setup switched keyboard to russian layout and the layout switch key combination does not work... So I can't type on console anymore....
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08:46<adb>carnil, try whitout fakeroot
08:46<mjt>i wonder how to re-do it, at least temporarily...
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08:53<carnil>adb: it fails even without including build-essential and fakreroot (so leaving --include=)
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08:57<adb>that must works ;) > debootstrap --arch=amd64 sid reference
08:57<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
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09:01<dpkg>polska -> (on Also, pl is a common extension for perl scripts and is sometimes used as an abbreviation for "packet loss".
09:01<urbinek>hehe xD
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09:03<adb>carnil, nope ;( it stop on "W: Failure trying to run: chroot /home/ee/reference mount -t proc proc /proc"
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09:06<adb>but "chroot reference mount -t proc proc proc" works ..
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09:23<carnil>adb: Ok, thanks for testing, no Idea at the moment where to locate the problem exactly
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09:26<adb>i tho in debootstrap ..
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09:33<Cope>I'm trying to find a tftpboot.img for debian sparc
09:33<Cope>has a boot.img
09:33<Cope>is this correct? I am sure it used to be called tftpboot.img
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09:39<adb>carnil, cat reference/debootstrap/debootstrap.log ;)
09:42<noflash>!tell Cope -about sparc
09:42<Cope>noflash: silence in debian-sparc
09:43<noflash>that's all I had :)
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09:43<Cope>noflash: thanks!
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09:46<adb> !tell Cope -about netboot
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10:07<carnil>ah thanks adb
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10:07<lancelot_of>which package to use webcam under on debian?
10:07<dr|z3d>lancelot_of: Try Cheese.
10:08<adb>carnil, and i just get you the solution
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10:08<carnil>adb: yes I see it's apt and the keyring package
10:09<adb>hmm , not here
10:09<carnil>or the gnupg package, I have to look into it a bit closer before answering ;-)
10:10<carnil>(next time)
10:10<lancelot_of>thannk you
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10:11<adb>carnil, can you paste your debootstrap.log , please ?
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10:12<Tuplad>when I boot up I get an error message that /dev/sda8 isn't recognized as an ext2 partition and has to be dischecked manually. but I don't even have sda8, could it be a wrongly tagged ntfs partition ?
10:12<carnil>adb: sure ...
10:12<adb>Tuplad, fdisk -l
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10:15<Tuplad>adb: but I've had a problem though. I took 30gb from a ntfs partition with gparted, but windows couldn't recognize the partition anymore and neither could debian. so I guess it's that one. but can I get some more information about it somehow ?
10:16<petemc>you should always be aware that messing with partitions brings with it the risk of losing data
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10:16<mjt>where does gnome stores user preferences such as keyboard layout, hotkeys etc?
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10:17<Tuplad>petemc: indeed. I tried using testdisk but it messed up my 70gb linux partition which is now marked as unallocated.
10:17<Tuplad>petemc: and it damaged my other ntfs partition
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10:20<Tuplad>petemc: so I'm pretty skeptic about testdisk now :p
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10:23<am>hi to all,i have created debian lenny dvd from local repository .but at last step i.e grub installation step it is asking for media change
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10:39<am>hi to all ,can anyone tell me how to install grub dvd installation is not doing grub installation it is asking for media change
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10:40*mjt installs syslinux
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10:41<locklace>!reinstall grub
10:41<dpkg>See Boot a cd like knoppixgrml, mount your disk read/write, (mount boot partition into your / partition if applicable,) mount -o bind /dev/ /your/root/dev; chroot /your/root; mount -t proc none /proc; grub-install /dev/foo (you may need to edit /etc/mtab and/or /boot/grub/ Also ask me about <fixmbr> <rescue mode>
10:42<am>locklace, but can you tell me why installation is getting stop at this place?
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10:43<locklace>nope. what version of debian?
10:43<am>if i install inbuild dvdrom it goes fine but this error is for external dvdrom
10:43<am>locklace, lenny
10:44<locklace>well, you can either wait for someone who happens to know, or just install it yourself using the above procedure
10:45<am>locklace, main grub is not installed and i am not having livecd so how to install from same step using Ctrl-Alt-f3 terminal
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10:48<am>is there any way to do chroot and install grub using grub install dvd
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10:49<am>sorry lenny install dvd
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10:52<Emery>i'm sure you can go in with any live cd and install grub
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10:54<am>Emery, but grub package itselfs notinstalled
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10:55<am>so no grub or stage1 is installed
10:55<Emery>then create a suitable environment and install ?
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10:55<am>Emery, can ou please tell how?
10:55<Emery>explin the whole problem
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10:56<am>if i install with external dvd drive at last it is not installing grub asking for media change but same can be installed with internal dvd rom
10:57<am>media change means it is expecting another install dvd to continue
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10:58<am>so i want to install grub
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10:58<am>and use system
10:59<Emery>why are you using the dvd to install Debian ?
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11:07<am>i am getting error after cleaning up load-install-cd :failed to mount cdrom load:install-cd:umount cdrom cannot umount /target/cdrom:invalid arguement
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11:07<Emery>why are you using the dvd to install Debian ?
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11:08<am>Emery, i have downloaded repo and created DVD
11:09<Emery>can you not install Debian with another cd ... then move over your repo ?
11:11<am>Emery, first it shown 97%completed installation at step of cleaning up so only grub has to install
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11:12<am>is anyproblem while creating DVD
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11:12<Emery>you might have not burned it properly.
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11:14<am>Emery, but same works at inbuilb dvdrom
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11:21<ret>wrong window D:
11:21<achadwick>Hi. Is Gürkan Sengün around? I'm afraid I don't know his nick.
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11:28<drakeman>hey, guys, you can offer little support about iptables, i know this is a channel support for Debian, but maybe if someone of you with little experience in iptables.
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11:32<damocles>Sorry to be of bother. My regular debian jedi is home sick w/ the flu. Could someone help me translate some instructions? I'm following directions on creating conf files for Apache and the instruction is to "Link location /path/to/existing/file to "this" file (a file I just created). Should I interpret that as creating a symbolic link or is there a better interpretation? Much obliged.
11:32<xeon-enouf>achadwick: why? i think i know who that is
11:33<xeon-enouf>damocles: symlink ; man ln
11:33<xeon-enouf>see -s
11:33<xeon-enouf>drakeman: fwiw, there'
11:33<damocles>thanks xeon-enouf. that's what I thought, but I wanted to check. :-)
11:34<xeon-enouf>s #iptables and ##networking on
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11:35<drakeman>xeon-enouf, fwiw?
11:35<dpkg>extra, extra, read all about it, fwiw is for {what,whatever} it's worth
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11:36<achadwick>Just wanting to chase up a couple of patches in the bts for a package he maintains ( )
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11:37<xeon-enouf>achadwick: he's not on this network - or not in this channel, but over on in #debian (see tarzeau)
11:37<xeon-enouf>achadwick: ahh , seems to be in #debian-kbsd
11:38<drakeman>ok, the little question is, if i make this rule ---> /sbin/iptables -A INPUT -p tcp --syn -j REJECT --reject-with icmp-port-unreachable
11:38<drakeman> to reject income tcp connections, this blocks any connections even ssh, so, if i want to enable the ssh for one ip, can i do someting like ! -s theipiwanttoenableaccess?
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11:39<rudi_s>drakeman: Better -j ACCEPT it in an own rule before that reject. But also check the topic in #iptables on Freenode.
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11:40<drakeman>rudi_s, so you say make the rule to accept that ip first and then the one that blocks the income tcp traffic.., yes i am on freenode #iptables but anyone write anything htere
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11:41<rudi_s>drakeman: Yes, that's what I meant.
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11:43<drakeman>rudi_s, ok, im going to try that :D thanks.
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11:45<chenming>could someone tell me the default runlevel of lenny
11:45<adb>carnil, found a workaround .. edit /etc/apt/sources.list comment "deb http://debootstrap.invalid/ sid main".. add a valid mirror , "chroot reference mount -t proc proc proc" , chroot reference, aptitude update , aptitude install debian-archive-keyring , and from here do all it's needed ;)
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11:47<adb>well reference/etc/apt/sources.list ..
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11:51<lancelot_of>does anyone help me understanding the kernel messages posted here: I got them through dmesg, of course
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11:54<cahoot>I'd google
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11:57<the-dude>lancelot_of: I think I saw it years ago
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11:59<lancelot_of>the-dude, ...and?
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12:03<dutchfish>i someone aware thet make-kpkg clean does not handle autgenerated .h files on clean up? like drivers/gpu/drm/radeon/r100_reg_safe.h or is this a kernel issue?
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12:10<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: IIRC, you can simply rm the /debian dir? rather than make-kpkg clean
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12:11<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, sure i could do git clean -nf, but i wonder if that was not a job of make-kpkg clean
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12:11<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: seen /usr/share/kernel-package/docs/README
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12:13<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, nope nothing in it about autogenerated .h files
12:15<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, autogenerated ny the kernel that is on compile time
12:15<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: autogenerated by who? what? when? why?
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12:16<dutchfish>i never have seen this before
12:17<king>join #debian-es
12:17<dutchfish>from 2.6.18 and up, up until now
12:17<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: hrm, seems to me you'd want the headers used available with the source, once you compile a kernel
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12:18<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: i never really noticed, nor looked - is this debian source? or vanilla
12:18<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, nope, they are autogenerated on each compile and need to be
12:18<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, vanilla
12:18<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: not to me, they shouldn't
12:18<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, but i might be early on discovery
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12:20<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, if you only compile once its a non-issue, but you get trapped on the second compile when you want make-kpkg clean
12:20<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, anyway thanks for your support, i fugure it out
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12:22<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, a git clean -nf , is sifficient for now
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12:22<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, after make-kpkg clean that is
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12:23<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: just rm -rd the entire build/ dir, and extract .tar.gz again ;-)
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12:24<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, haha, i dont use tar.gz anymore, but yes
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12:24<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: i don't think anything other than the what's in the debian/ dir falls under the purpose of make-kpkg, maybe you want 'make clean'
12:25<xeon-enouf>i recall, there was a 'make distclean' somewhere, at some point'
12:25<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, oh, i thought after make-kpkg andalotoffoo, amke-kpkg clean would do
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12:26<dutchfish>but thanks, Sir
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12:28<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: no prob; i see /usr/share/kernel-package/ruleset/targets/{,} and /usr/share/kernel-package/ruleset/ have some 'distclean' related entries
12:28<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, yup
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12:30<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: haha @
12:30<xeon-enouf># work around idiocy in recent kernel versions
12:30<xeon-enouf># However, this makes it harder to use git versions of the kernel
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12:31<dutchfish>any link?
12:32<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: direcly from ;-)
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12:32<dutchfish>ah ok
12:32<dutchfish>back to the drawing board then
12:32<dutchfish>thanks for the find
12:33<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: you might want to ask the maintainer through an email perhaps, or something ;-)
12:33<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, nah, i am only a lesser god, prolly alot will stumble over it
12:34<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, at least its not a make-kpkg issue
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12:54<xeon-enouf>dutchfish: if you start with a clean source tree and just do your ./configure ; make ; make ... ; etc do those files you mention get generated? If so, then it's kernel-related, not make-kpkg, AFAICT, also, then try 'make clean' check this out;*/Makefile#L1183
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12:55<dutchfish>xeon-enouf they do
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12:57<dutchfish>make M=dir clean will do nicly, isnt make-kpkg clean to run that?
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13:01<dutchfish>xeon-enouf, actually its more simple, the author of the module should in HIS sub-make also get up of those by cleaning the on CLEAN
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13:01<dutchfish>get rid by cleaning those on CLEAN
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13:03<dutchfish>so yes, then its a kernel bug
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13:38<mib_1xocev>how do i fix an apt-get upgrade that will not continue due to clamav message? sources.list has deb lenny/volatile main
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14:08<null>witam wszystkich
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14:09<null>jestem tu nowy, mam pewien problem dokladnie to z konfiguracja wifi pod debianem
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14:10<null>czytalem juz rozne posty polskie i zagraniczne ale nie udalo mi sie do konca skonfigurowac tego, tzn sterowniki udalo mi sie zaladowac przed m-a ndiswrapper'a, kara wifi wykrywa mi sic ale nie umie sie z nia polaczyc
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14:11<null>polecenie iwlist wlan0 scanning wyswietla ze jest wykryta siec(router) ale nic z tego, moze mi ktos pomoc czy raczej nie bardzo?
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14:12<dpkg>polska -> (on Also, pl is a common extension for perl scripts and is sometimes used as an abbreviation for "packet loss".
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14:24<patrikf>is there a tool for working with apache(-style) access.log files?
14:24<patrikf>like, all accesses after time X
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14:38<kop>patrikf: You could search the packges with aptitude search '~Gapache' or some such. (The search given is too broad.)
14:38<Graveworm>Hi! After a long period I've just updated via aptitude. Now, if I boot my machine the first few seconds everything looks as good as before the update. But then linux tells me that it is "Setting up console font and keymap". After that the font size is huge an ugly. Which package causes this? Is it 'console-setup'? How can I revoke the font to that before the update?
14:38<patrikf>kop: I've resigned already, found asql, and decided that egrep suits my current needs best. ;-)
14:38<Graveworm>I've no framebuffer compiled into my kernel.
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14:39<Graveworm>So changing the font in /etc/console-tools/config does nothing.
14:40<patrikf>Graveworm: /etc/default/console-setup
14:41<Graveworm>patrikf: Ah, perfect. Thx :).
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14:47<tuxcrafter>debian uk mirrors are running on ultra low speed this evening :D somebody that knows what is going on?
14:49<tadej>use torrent?
14:49<tadej>flies 100mbps constant at my end
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14:52<fgh>patrikf: whe ive changed font in /etc/default/console-setup how do i activate it? or need i reboot?
14:53<patrikf>fgh: console-setup ships an init script. *hint hint*
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15:19<sd_>Hello! I need a solution or advice. I want to be able to address my dinamic clients (remote users) by domain name. Say our domain is, so for the clients it would be, . I know it is possible to marry DHCP with DNS for dinamic DNS updates. But the best solution seems to be PPPoE, especially for traff.accounting, etc... Is it possible to make PPPoE updating DNS records db?
15:20<dr|z3d>sd_: hosts file is one way.
15:20<sd_>dr|z3d: for dynamic IP adressing?...
15:21<dr|z3d>sd_: Ah, in which case, maybe dyndns or a similar service.
15:21<sd_>and when you have 100+ remote clients....
15:22<jimcooncat>... you call it a botnet!
15:22<sd_>no, we are not supposed to use 3rd party services
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15:22<dr|z3d>Nevermind. No idea, then. Others may know more about your pppoe suggestion.
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15:22<sd_>:) no botnets
15:22<kop>sd_ : Have the remote users open a openvpn vpn tunnel, possibly without encryption. Configure openvpn to force VPN ip numbers on the clients with a ccd directory. Then put the resultant vpn (rfc1918) addresses into your dns, on split horizon for local consumption if you prefer.
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15:23<jimcooncat>sd_: maybe you could have a script trigger when they log in?
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15:23<sd_>I was thinking that PPPoE employs DHCP for IP distribution, but it appears that PPPoE does this job itself...
15:23<kop>sd_: If you want accounting run a separate accounting program (pmacct) or some such on the vpn tunnels.
15:24<sd_>kop: it should be something simple to configure and install. Our situation is similat to an Internet provider..
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15:25<sd_>I mean to install at clients side...
15:25<dr|z3d>simple vpn? hamachi.
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15:26<dr|z3d>And ghamachi for a ui.
15:26<kop>sd_: Open vpn has a windows gui installer. It's open source, so you can tweak it to make your own installer that's braindead. Of course the whole thing is lots of work for you.
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15:26<sd_>Clients hardware supports either DHCP or PPPoE, or static configuration..
15:26<dr|z3d>That said, you might prefer openvpn, indeed. Though it's not quite so easily configured.
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15:27<sd_>kop: I know OpenVPN well, I had experience with it. No it's not appropriate for this task...
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15:29<sd_>with OpenVPN you need to generate and distribute the keys, it would become management nightmare with 100+ clients...
15:31<petemc>why? you'll generally be distributing a client anyway
15:32<sd_>Ok, guys, let me try to narrow the problem.. Is it possible to marry PPPoE with DHCP, so the PPPoE server would employ DHCP for IP distribution?
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15:39<kop>sd_: You write a custom installer so that the installer is created with a key in it.
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15:43<sd_>kop: I understand, thanks. But first I'll try to consider all the possibilities with PPPoE, because there would be a lot of advantages this way...
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16:01<kop>I've upgraded from etch to lenny on a box that had /etc/ssh/sshd_config MaxAuthRetries lowered. Probably to 2 but I forget. Now I can no longer login, I get "Too many authentication failures" messages. I'll be able to frob the knobs when I get physical access and can login, but does anybody have a clue as to what's changed? I _think_ it was the lenny upgrade. I thought I tested it afterwords, but maybe the box had not yet been restarted or something.
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16:06<sd_>kop: maybe there some kind of protection against brute force was added... I would disable this feature. As for the protection I use fail2ban for ssh, smtp. pop3. http, ftp - very effective. there is a lot of rat actvivty coming from botnets...
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16:07<Darkedge>I got a question....
16:09<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
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16:09<Darkedge>Alrighty. Well.
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16:10<Darkedge>Can I make it so I can have meh username like....
16:10<Darkedge>James rather then james?
16:10<locklace>bad idea
16:11<Darkedge>I know,
16:11<Darkedge>It's a bad idea,
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16:11<Darkedge>But locklace If I wanta do it. Can you help me?
16:11*themill takes away Darkedge's enter key. Again.
16:11<locklace>!smack Darkedge
16:11*dpkg smacks Darkedge upside the head.
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16:12<dkr>perl -pi -e 's/james/James/' /etc/{passwd,shadow,group}
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16:14<Darkedge>Oh yeah, another thing, I wanta learn to write in perl
16:14<Darkedge>Where do I start?
16:14<themill>Darkedge: changing your username is never a good idea though. There are too many places to change it. dkr's suggestion misses $HOME and all your gnome/kde/xfce/whatever config files.
16:14<dkr>Darkedge: | | | | | | |
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16:15<Darkedge>and python! :P
16:15<sd_>Darkedge: do you know how to use google?
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16:16<Darkedge>I think, :P
16:16<locklace>i beg to differ
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16:17<sd_>Darkedge: so stop flooding here until your IP is not banned...
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16:27<bliss>som fan
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16:43<ert34>How can I use gnome's network manager on xfce.
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16:44<hackndoes>hello all
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16:44<hackndoes>i have a problem that won't go away. i am trying to connect to my own wireless network without success
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16:45-!-zem_ is now known as zem
16:45<zem>hackndoes: can you see your network on scan?
16:45<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
16:45<hackndoes>iwl 3945 is my driver
16:45<sd_>ert34: just install it along with all the required libs and run.... ..You don't have to install Gnome desktop itself.
16:45<hackndoes>when i scan it doesn't show up, but in my network manager icon in gnome it is shown
16:46<hackndoes>also, when i removed the wep authentication i am using it succeeded
16:46<ert34>I just did it, sd_ . But I don't now how to call it.
16:46<zem>i'd avoid wep
16:46<hackndoes>so what should i use?
16:46<hackndoes>and how to make it work?
16:46<zem>wpa, or even better wpa2
16:47<hackndoes>and in such case how do i configure that to work?
16:47<ert34>Wicd has a bug that doesn't manages hidden essids correctly.
16:47<ert34>So it's why I am trying network-manager.
16:47<sd_>ert34: dpkg -L packagaName - to see the name of binary. then make a shortcut to it or add it to your menu.
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16:48<hackndoes>zem, can you help me configure that?
16:49<zem>hackndoes: nope, not realy, but try some reading like
16:49-!-kfe [] has joined #debian
16:50<hackndoes>well i have done ton of reading to make simple wep to work and it doesn't what makes you think i can make a more complex encrytion work?
16:52*bja refrains from giving the correct answer to the above question
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16:53<ert34>/usr/sbin/NetworkManager does nothing
16:53<ert34>Is this the right binary?
16:54<philipp>i need to know how i can turn of (in the console) that he start a secound x server on tty10
16:54<zem>hackndoes: have you tried iwconfig <iface> ap <ap mac>?
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16:55<philipp>does someone know it?
16:55<bja>ert34: if you installed NetworkManager you should have /etc/init.d/network-manager
16:55<philipp>in which file is written that the xserver get started?
16:56<themill>ert34: nm-applet is the user tool
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16:56<ert34>nm-applet shows, thanks
16:56<hackndoes_>zem, yes i have
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16:57<hackndoes_>it doesn't want to forcibly associate
16:58<zem>hmmm... no idea... sorry
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17:02<lucasss>i know this may sound stupid, but im an ubuntu user, i want to user debian but i dont know which version should i choose... stable or testing, im just a desktop user... could some one tell me the diferences or guide me somehow?
17:02<lucasss>and am i goin to be able to install debian just downloading the first cd?
17:03<ert34>Unlike wicd, network-manager doesn't finds any wireless networks, or seems to has wireless enabled.
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17:03<bja>philipp: afaik the x server gets started with the gdm (or whatever you have installed)
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17:04<bja>ert34: does iwconfig detects any wireless extensions?
17:04-!-jiikoo--- [] has quit []
17:04<wnd>lucasss, many prefer running testing as desktop. if you're willing to install debian online, a minimal cd image (such as business card cd image) will do just fine.
17:05<ert34>Yes. It recognizes my essid;
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17:06<lucasss>wnd: thanks for respoding, mmm... i have a really slow internet connection... i dont think i want to try installing debian from internet.... if i download cd1 and then complete the instalation with packages i want from the net is that allright?
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17:06<kop>lucasss: I prefer stable, because I want my desktop to just work. There's always bugs, everywhere, but the point of stable is that they don't change. (And there are not that many.)
17:07<kop>lucasss: The most efficient install is to download the netinstall image. The rest of the install is from the net, but it will only download what you need. If you download the first cd there will likely be stuff you don't need on the cd.
17:07<lucasss>ok, well thank you very much guys
17:08<kop>lucasss: With stable there's also if you must have something newer. The problem with stable is that you keep it for about 3 years (based on historical trends) before you get new software, so you have to be able to live with that.
17:08<bja>ert34: there is more information in "man iwconfig", also if there is a problem it should verbously cry for help giving you a hint on why it is not working
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17:09<wnd>I agree with kop, slow internet connection is a good reason to use the netinstall image
17:09<lucasss>kop: i think ill go for testing...
17:09<ert34>I will tr it out. Thanks, bja.
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17:09<kop>lucasss: How slow is your connection? Really slow connections are hard to use with debian because you do want to install security patches. (OTOH, that's true of any linux.)
17:09<wnd>personally I use stable to my server and other devices I cannot afford to stop functioning
17:09<lucasss>kop: 100 kbps
17:09<kop>lucasss: Also testing is continually updated, so will require bandwidth.
17:09<wnd>to have stop functioning
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17:10<lucasss>kop: im asuming it will be like ubuntu updates... thats allright
17:10<kop>lucasss: That's sounds manageable. See also the apt-cacher package if you're planning on running more than one box.
17:10<philipp>how can i start a xserver?
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17:11<philipp>how can i start a xserver on command line?
17:11<wnd>it's also possible to install stable and then switch to testing if you think applications are too old
17:11<carnil>adb: sorry for the late answer, could not test your workaround, but just tried it again and now it works
17:11<philipp>how can i start a xserver on command line?
17:11<kop>philipp: If you install xdm or gdm or kdm it will just start at boot. From the command line try startx.
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17:12<adb>carnil, nice , but not here ..
17:12<lucasss>kop: all i need is install internet software and music office.... wifi drivers-- i read something about non free repos to install iwi3945 modules-- build an iso and back it up to an usb stick just in case i need it...
17:12-!-kfe__ [] has joined #debian
17:12<dr|z3d>philipp: 'startxfce4' for Xfce, if you're using that.
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17:13<philipp>and how do i stop it?
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17:14<dr|z3d>ctrl+shift+backspace should work.
17:14<kop>philipp: You can either switch to another virtual terminal with ctrl-alt-fN where N is 1 to 5 or use ctrl-alt-backspace (IIRC)
17:14<dr|z3d>Or use the ui logout option.
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17:14<kop>dr|z3d: Is ctrl-shift-backspace a new(ish) thing?
17:14<dr|z3d>ctrl+alt+bkspc sorry.
17:14<philipp>no wanna stop all on command line
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17:15<kop>philipp: go back to the command line in a virtual terminal and kill the x server.
17:15<dr|z3d>You can kill the DE's session manager.
17:15<ert34>Problem fixed, I just deleted my interfacews and worked.
17:15<kop>kop: I can't recall if startx continues to run or daemonizes, if the former then ctrl-c will kill it.
17:15<jthomas_sb_>Has anyone used Gtk-recordmydesktop? Its a frontend to recordmydesktop and it lets you pick a window to record, which is great. But every video I produce is plays back at high-speed, so my 3min videos are done in about 6 seconds.
17:15<philipp>kop gui dosent work
17:16<philipp>i am on tty1
17:16<bja>philipp: ps -AF|grep /usr/sbin/X :1 and kill the litlle btd
17:16<ert34>I am now connected with wireless.
17:16<dr|z3d>kop: ctrl+alt+bkpsc? Think it's more "legacy" than new. Being phased out in some distros, apparently.
17:16<bja>!win ert34
17:16<dpkg>Congratulations, ert34! You have won a one way ticket to Beirut!
17:16<kop>dr|z3d: I'd had that feeling and was wondering what replace it.
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17:16<bja>dr|z3d: actually X droped it recently but there is a way to set it back up
17:16<ert34>Wicd doesn't works. Just a bugged piece of software, needs backports or sid and even with those things doesn't works.
17:17<kop>I find ctrl-alt-backspace handy.
17:17<jthomas_sb_>wicd works amazingly well for me
17:17<carnil>adb: still the same problem for you?
17:17<locklace>bja: itym "pkill X". hth
17:17<adb>carnil, you'r sure you'r redone a sid debootstrap ?
17:17<ert34>Not for me, and my hidden essid.
17:17<adb>carnil, yes ..
17:18<dr|z3d>bja: Ah, gotcha.
17:18<bja>locklace: thx
17:18<ert34>Wicd shows the signal strength correctly, but network manager not.
17:18<ert34>Ah, shows correctlky now.
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17:19<ert34>I had a suggestion for who use xfce now, never use wicd.
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17:20<bja>locklace: but that would kill all X and when you have two different servers running you need to differentiate them
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17:20<locklace>bja: pkill -f
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17:22<mjt>hm. After trying to install radeon drivers from sid (which required quite a few X bits and other stuff), I noticed that my hotplug devices aren't handled automatically anymore. Like, inserting an USB stick does not open nautilus window in gnome anymore. Any hints to debug?
17:22<bja>locklace: thx
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17:23<mjt>(kernel detects the stick just fine as before, but it goes no further)
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17:23<locklace>mjt: welcome to hal
17:23<mjt>hal worked before. I had to update it when updating X.
17:24<mjt>now it also installed policykit which may be related too
17:24<locklace>hal never works. it just occasionally forgets to fail
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17:24<mjt>oh, so it is (or was) quite forgetful here.
17:25<themill>locklace: must have Alzheimer's on my machines.
17:25<locklace>mjt: did you check the links in the topic of #debian-x
17:25<mjt>i didn't know such channel exists :)
17:25<valdyn>mjt: you need to run polkit-gnome-authorization to give yourself permissions to access devices
17:26<mjt>(I already added myself to a bunch of groups before)
17:26<valdyn>mjt: groups are no longer used for this
17:26<mjt>damn ;)
17:26<valdyn>mjt: first of all things you should probably reboot
17:26<carnil>adb: yes, see
17:26<mjt>reboot??? ;)
17:27<valdyn>mjt: i dont know which serivices you have to manually restart and/or if you have to log out of gnome / X
17:27-!-mode/#debian [+l 396] by debhelper
17:27<mjt>i fail to see why I should reboot a freshly booted PC :)
17:27<ert34>the xfce bug that doesn't shows the icons did not fix with the tango theme
17:27<valdyn>mjt: ok, i just meant to reboot after the package upgrade
17:27<adb>carnil, ok ..
17:27<carnil>adb: which variant are you using?
17:27<bja>valdyn: where is the info on the new "group" system?
17:28<valdyn>bja: no idea
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17:28<bja>Stupid question: How did you manage to learn about it?
17:29<valdyn>bja: i dont know, i know that i didnt lose much time finding it
17:29<themill>bja: the idea is that you don't need to create dozens of groups and add all the users to them -- it can just be managed by configuring a policy daemon.
17:29<adb>carnil, just rerun debootstrap --verbose sid, seen some weird things here ..
17:29<valdyn>bja: dbus is the interface to access various resources, the new dbus configuration uses polkit, not groups
17:30<bja>valdyn: thx, i'll dive into it later
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17:30<adb>carnil, bah , here wont works
17:31<bja>themill: thx but a simple script used to do the same thing with the group system
17:31<carnil>adb: that's strange, will try tomorrow without the buildd variant, but have to go now
17:31<valdyn>and.. i really like this system. Its much better to handle than full acl on the filesystem
17:31<valdyn>while groups dont allow the same fine grained control
17:32<adb>carnil, ok
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17:35<mjt>lovely. I wonder how to run this polkit-gnome-authorization thing :)
17:35<bja>valdyn: you need to have X installed to use it? I have a sid vm and there is no trace of it
17:35<mjt>installed policykit-gnome, which contains that proggy. But It does not do any good as user (just ignores buttons), and it refuses to start as root.
17:35<bja>forget it mjt just answered it for me
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17:36<mjt>and it's not in gnome's "System" menu either.
17:37<mjt>(not in any gnome menu really)
17:37<locklace>kind of makes you miss a simple "vi /etc/group"
17:37<mjt>** (polkit-gnome-authorization:26983): WARNING **: Caught error: Method "ObtainAuthorization" with signature "suu" on interface "org.freedesktop.PolicyKit.AuthenticationAgent" doesn't exist
17:38<locklace>!lose mjt
17:38<dpkg>mjt: You Lose.
17:38<xeon-enouf>mjt: any good trying gksu/gksudo .. or maybe gconftool-2 or gconf-editor? or dpkg -L <pkgname> for some info? ;-)
17:38<xeon-enouf>heh .. oh well
17:38<xeon-enouf>mjt: wait, is HAL installed? :-P
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17:38<locklace>i'll get my coat
17:39<mjt>hal is in dependencies of many things
17:39<mjt>including the x server
17:39<mjt>so yes it's installed and running
17:39<foxes>learning, from new to handle, is understanding really important? or we just need practices?
17:39<xeon-enouf>mjt: yeah, but i know some staunch xorg devotees who are beating HAL back with a stick - thought you might be one of those ;-)
17:40<mjt>geez, that error from polkit-gnome-auth is printed when pressing *any* "Ok-like" button in there.
17:40<mjt>so it does not do anything at all
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17:40<xeon-enouf>mjt: there is some polkit-gnome-doc pkg in sid atleast
17:41<mjt>well, i guess i can edit that /etc/PolicyKit.conf directly
17:41<valdyn>mjt: why cant you run it as root?
17:42<mjt>** (polkit-gnome-authorization:5783): WARNING **: Couldn't connect to session bus: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken.
17:42<mjt>** (polkit-gnome-authorization:5783): DEBUG: Already running
17:42<mjt>that's what happens when running it as root
17:43<valdyn>mjt: so you didnt reboot after dbus got upgraded?
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17:43<valdyn>mjt: or you didnt fully upgrade
17:43<mjt>dbus hasn't been upgraded, as far as i know
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17:43<valdyn>mjt: show us the output of "apt-cache policy dbus"
17:43<mjt>1.2.1-5+lenny1 (security)
17:43<valdyn>mjt: so duh
17:44<valdyn>mjt: you upgraded various things but not dbus?
17:44<xeon-enouf>policykit-gnome-doc - PolicyKit-gnome API documentation *and* policykit-doc - documentation for PolicyKit
17:44<mjt>eeek. dbus pulls glibc.
17:44<valdyn>mjt: you now have a mixed lenny squeeze system, i wouldnt expect that to work
17:44<mjt>which means i can't do it.
17:44<mjt>what a mess... :(((
17:44<mjt>i just wanted my video card to work
17:45<valdyn>mjt: its not exactly a secret that mixing debian releases is unsupported
17:45-!-Lin [] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
17:45<mjt>i understand it's "unsupported", aka, may break etc.
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17:46<mjt>but ok. why or when this hotplug thing stopped working?
17:46<mjt>is it hal or polkit or sometihng else?
17:46<mjt>i mean, i can revert some of them back to lenny's
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17:47<mjt>just need to know which ones.
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17:48<valdyn>mjt: i dont know which packages exactly you upgraded
17:48<valdyn>mjt: gnome and hal and dbus all work together
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17:48<mjt>gnome is from lenny, dbus too.
17:48<mjt>hal and x are from sid
17:48<valdyn>mjt: so theres the problem
17:48<themill>where could that possibly go wrong?
17:48<xeon-enouf>no ssb? no backports?
17:48<mjt>and also polkit which didn't exist before
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17:48<mjt>what's ssb?
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17:49<xeon-enouf>themill: heh
17:49-!-dr|zed is now known as dr|z3d
17:49<dpkg>First: See if the package has already been backported. Ask me about <backports>. If it hasn't, 1) Add ONLY a "deb-src ..." line for sid to your sources.list. 2) apt-get update 3) apt-get install build-essential; apt-get build-dep packagename;apt-get -b source packagename; 4) install the resultant debs. If you are just wanting to change the compilation options, ask me about <package recompile>, or see <uupdate> if sid is too old
17:49<mjt>well, i did that with a few X bits
17:49<xeon-enouf>mjt: you know all this already (or so i thought ;-p)
17:49<mjt>i didn't know this abbreviation (ssb)
17:49<xeon-enouf>i see
17:50<mjt>noone sane will backport x server. i guess :)
17:50<mjt>and nouveau requires latest
17:50<themill>weren't you after radeon drivers?
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17:51<mjt>it's more complicated really. I had some issues with radeon, tried to verify if they're fixed in latest - they didn't. So i tried nvidia, which requires latest x. THat didn't work completely either.
17:52*xeon-enouf looked at nouveau ~1 month ago - seemed broken, so stopped that path
17:52<xeon-enouf>(and i'm on sid - wholly ;-))
17:52<mjt>ya, it locked up here left and right
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17:52<xeon-enouf>i couldn't even get the pkgs .. either for building, nor installing
17:52<mjt>i have to compile many things for 200+ servers which are running lenny. So updating glibc is no go.
17:53<xeon-enouf>maybe it was longer than a month ago
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17:53<xeon-enouf>200+ servers don't need gnome, nor polkit, nor latest video drivers ... or do they ? :-P
17:54<mjt>but really, who is responsible for this hotplug permission stuff? hal? Where's its logs??
17:54<themill>mjt: you'd be building things in a clean chroot or vm anyway, wouldn't you?
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17:54<mjt>themill: i prefer real system, together with a gui editor/debugger
17:54<xeon-enouf>mjt: udev handles hotplug - but as mentioned the trifecta go hand in hand for DEs
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17:54<xeon-enouf>udev+dbus+hal ... XML - here we come!
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17:55<themill>mjt: final compilation before deployment would still be better done in a cleaner environment
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17:55<mjt>aha.. I finally got it. I updated hal because x stopped recognizing my input devices (that famous input hotplug). input now works , but that broke hotplug of other stuff.
17:56<mjt>so it's hal, which apparently now uses polkit instead of groups
17:56<xeon-enouf>do /msg dpkg hal see last URL
17:56<mjt>so i have to revert hal and fix x input bits
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17:57<xeon-enouf>input is only one section of hotplug - udev recognizes devices, gives them a /dev/ entry and loads needed modules
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17:58<mjt>i mean hotplug of input in x
17:58<mjt>evdev &Co
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17:58<xeon-enouf>well, Lenny Xorg still uses and whereas newer versions use
17:59<xeon-enouf>again, IIUC
17:59<mjt>yay! reverting hal back to lenny's and voila, usb sticks and photo camera works again.
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17:59<xeon-enouf>mixing gets one into all sorts of weirdo situations
17:59<themill>locklace: mixing releases is what broke things here, not hal. If message passing were being done by function calls, it would SIGSEGV or SIGBUS all around. Because it's XML it's mostly still functional except for some fancy stuff.
18:00<mjt>hmm. i wonder if it's possible to build hal w/o polkit
18:00<xeon-enouf>mjt: it's possible to build Xorg without HAL
18:00<xeon-enouf>mjt: but that's the way it's moving .. so
18:01<xeon-enouf>then just use usbmount or something
18:01<mjt>for now it's the polkit whicih fails here. I've working pre-polkit hal.
18:01<xeon-enouf>DEs on Servers? ufff
18:01<xeon-enouf>mjt: wait till you meet consolekit! :-P
18:01<mjt>not on servers, not even libx11 on servers
18:02<mjt>i managed to have no libldap on any of my machines
18:03*themill wonders if he's in #gentoo given the current obsession with microoptimisation
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18:03<xeon-enouf>!recompile me
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18:05<mjt>"--enable-acl-management ACL management" -- hal configure option. Lovely explanation.
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18:05<staspika>Hi. Any ideas how to find out the name of the file wget just download? I write a script which gets URLs as parameters and passes them to wget. After that, the file has to be processed, but how to find out what filename it has?
18:05<xeon-enouf>mjt: we're accepting patches ... including documentation ;-)
18:05<mjt>xeon-enouf: should i run away from consolekit even before i met it? :)
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18:06<themill>staspika: best to actually specify the filename to be used with -O in that case
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18:06<xeon-enouf>mjt: just check ps/pstree output often if you upgrade ;-)
18:06<xeon-enouf>mjt: grep for console-kit-* :-)
18:07<mjt>i understand how to check if it's here. I asked another question :)
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18:07<staspika>themill: I would prefer to preserve the name, in case if I will later have to process the same file again.
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18:07<xeon-enouf>mjt: i find it even more confusing how the Process names have hyphens (vs pkgnames) and then the binaries are even truncated versions (i.e; ck* and polkit*)
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18:08<xeon-enouf>staspika: i usually use the -P option, then you can use various tools to find name - but yeah -O is best
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18:09<xeon-enouf>staspika: such as find and -mtime, etc ... maybe even use incron/incrontab - search for inotify
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18:10<xeon-enouf>staspika: you could alter your script to pass you the filename .. either to console/xterm, or logfile
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18:11<xeon-enouf>staspika: just pass the output of wget to file as well .. use 'tee' even if you like
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18:14<staspika>The use of wget's output can be tricky, as soon as I don't know which language the user uses. Will try -P and see what possibilities it brings.
18:14<mjt>peace. rebuilt hal from sid w/o polkit and consolekit. Now both x and "other" hotplug works again.
18:14<staspika>xeon-enouf: The use of wget's output can be tricky, as soon as I don't know which language the user uses. Will try -P and see what possibilities it brings.
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18:14<staspika>xeon-enouf: thanks.
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18:22<xeon-enouf>staspika: i usually "cd /to/dir/i-save-filename/" then just use "wget -P. <URL>"
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18:23<staspika>xeon-enouf, themill: also, in case if a file with the same name exists, wget will save the file it downloads with a different name. Just want to mention.
18:23<xeon-enouf>yes, most unix utils will - append a version/string or some alphanumeric
18:23<themill>staspika: I'd use mktemp so that was never the case (or just process the output directly in a pipe with -O -)
18:24<staspika>Seems to be a dirty workaround...
18:24<xeon-enouf>see - that "-O -" stuff confuses me, but that's only cause i'm an idiot
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18:24<themill>no, I'd say those were the two correct ways of doing it in a script.
18:25<themill>trying to find out the last written file to a directory is a dirty and fragile hack. And will also prevent you from ever running a second copy of the script to speed up whatever it is you are doing.
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18:30<mjt>xeon-enouf, themill, valdyn: thanks alot for all your help. It now almost works! :)
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18:31<valdyn>mjt: i think maybe you only needed to backport the gfx driver?
18:31<mjt>it required recent X *API*
18:31<valdyn>mjt: I see
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18:35<mjt>oh no. It still does not work. Even root xterm stopped working. Restarting all this mess....
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18:38<mjt>..restart fixed that last one (gksu), but not hotplug.
18:39<mjt>valdyn: re reboot: it appears that restarting dbus is enough. It triggers restart of everything else (hal, system-tools-backends, various other services like hcid).
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18:42<normal>cpuburn doesn't have a graphic interface?
18:43<normal>and how do you monitor it?
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19:10<madian>I have a problem with lenny
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19:11<madian>if I am using a torrent client (rtorrent) the internet is stop working
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19:12<cwood>Question. Anybody else had Evolution start crashing today after hitting the "reply all" button?
19:13<madian>I can ping but I can't resolve any address
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19:13<cwood>madian: try limiting your up/down torrenting bandwidth perhaps? I found that if my torrent client was saturating my bandwidth then I couldn't do much else.
19:14<madian>will try but it worked before with fedora
19:14<cwood>If you can't resolve any address, that also suggests that your /etc/resolv.conf could be misconfigured.
19:14<madian>I had to close the rtorrent to connect here
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19:15<madian>the nameserver is the router
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19:15<madian>I also tried some open dns server but the same problem
19:16<cwood>madian: so can you use the host command to look up dns addresses directly from the router? If you install bind or something and use "nameserver" as the only line in /etc/resolv.conf, does that work better? Time to isolate where the issue is.
19:16<madian>the weired thing is that rtorrent is working great
19:16*bja ponders the bandwith limits of certain conections
19:17<cwood>This sounds like that old joke.
19:17<cwood>"#debian, it hurts when I use rtorrent."
19:17<cwood>"So don't use rtorrent."
19:18<madian>if it's the problem then ok
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19:18<madian>but I as I said it worked with fedora
19:18<cwood>I completely fail to see how rtorrent prevents your dns lookups.
19:18<cwood>But if the feature you really need is in Fedora, heck, go for it.
19:19<madian>just installed debian yesterday
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19:20<cwood>Well, a good time for diagnosis then.
19:21<cwood>Time to isolate the issue. Does it happen when you use host lookups against a local bind server? does it happen when you look things up against your isp's dns server? etc.
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19:22<madian>I don't know how to setup bind
19:22-!-phrosty [~phrosty@2001:470:d:30b::100] has joined #debian
19:22<cwood>apt-get install bind9
19:22<cwood>It sets up with a basic caching configuration, iirc.
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19:23<cirdan>cwood: is it really necessary to set up bind9?
19:24<cwood>Couldn't say. When I'm troubleshooting dns I prefer to have a local server to test with.
19:25<cwood>You can always uninstall it right after the testing, after all.
19:25<cirdan>good point
19:26<madian>bind is working
19:26<madian>will try to run rtorrent
19:27<cwood>Remember to update /etc/resolv.conf
19:27<cwood>And ensure it works before you run rtorrent.
19:27<cirdan>madian: could you please run this one liner and tell if it outputs somethin useful -->dig @`grep nameserver /etc/resolv.conf|awk '{ print$2 }'`
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19:29<madian>; <<>> DiG 9.5.1-P3 <<>> @
19:29<madian>; (1 server found)
19:29<madian>;; global options: printcmd
19:29<madian>;; connection timed out; no servers could be reached
19:29<madian>;; connection timed out; no servers could be reached
19:29-!-madian was kicked from #debian by debhelper [use the paster bot or #flood]
19:30<cirdan>cwood: you are definetly right it would be better for him to set up a local dns, all yours
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19:36<cwood>madian: Was that dig done with rtorrent on or off?
19:37<cwood>So when you try the same dig with rtorrent off do you get useful output? (Don't paste into channel this time.)
19:38<cwood>Okay. So the issue is not anything on your local machine, it's that when you put lots of torrent traffic through your router, it stops answering dns queries.
19:39<cwood>At least, that's how it looks to me.
19:39<madian>if that's the case it should work with other dns
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19:40<cwood>What order are the nameserver lines in /etc/resolv.conf?
19:40<madian>local then router ( thats now)
19:40<bja>madian: you filled your pipe too mucho, try limiting rtorrent traffic and it should start working again
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19:41<cwood>Okay, so remove everything but the localhost. And learn how to limit the bandwidth that rtorrent uses.
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19:42<bja>madian: do a backup copy first so when you are finished you have something to fall back to
19:43<cwood>Right. Always, always back up. ^_^
19:43<madian>will the bandwidth be affected with total speed or total connected peers
19:43-!-stevecotton [] has joined #debian
19:43<cwood>Total speed.
19:43<cwood>For my torrent I cap my upload at about 90% of my total upload bandwidth.
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19:43<cwood>Download doesn't seem to affect me so much.
19:45<madian>I have limited the speed for rtorrent
19:46<madian>dig is working now
19:46<cwood>Hey hey, fancy that.
19:46<madian>dig is working now
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19:47<madian>will remove the limit for testing
19:48<cirdan>madian: did you removed the lines cwood ask you to?
19:48-!-icebrain [] has joined #debian
19:49<Angel>join -debian español
19:49<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
19:49<madian>I have tried to add dns server into the router (removed the ISP's)
19:49<cirdan>.. /j #debian-es
19:50<cwood>madian: seems like limiting your rtorrent bandwidth solved your issue, so you don't really need a local copy of bind if you don't want one.
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19:55<madian>yes, it's the bandwidth
19:55<madian>I have tested again with limit on bandwidth and without
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19:57<madian>thanks cwood,cirdan
19:58<bja>madian: i suggested bandwith on the first place :(
19:58<madian>ok thank you bja
19:58<bja>!beer madian
19:58*dpkg pulls out a tasty Gulden Drak for madian
19:59<bja>just kidding, i didn't do anything
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20:05<cwood>bug 548225
20:05<cwood>hee hee
20:06<madian>solved :)
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20:06<dpkg>Another happy customer leaves the building.
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20:18<valdyn>maybe someone is going to make a proper neat tc GUI
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20:23<adb>tc ?
20:23<bja>traffic control
20:25<adb>there is ..calls ceni
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20:35<felix>hi, i have a little pain with compiz. All works ok with gnome, the cube etc, but when i'm turning the cube with a window grabbed with the mouse, screen freezes for a while just when the cube ends the turn.
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21:03<heartbeats>hi where i can get wxglade tutorials in pdf
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21:03<bja>Does anyone know of a gui like xli (sets an image on root window of X)?
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21:09<adb>a background for X ?
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21:09<bja>adb: yes
21:10<adb>System> Preference> Appearance> background
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21:10<adb>and ADD ..
21:10<bja>on ion3?
21:11<adb>said ion3 . not see that ;)
21:11<bja>that is the tiny little problem i need a tool that is DE agnostic
21:11<bja>tile DE
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21:12<bja>adb: thx anyway
21:12<adb>i said use feh ..
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21:12<bja>looking into it right now
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21:15<Fulanito>I was playing with ifconfig to change my MAC address
21:15<Fulanito>...Usually I can do it with wired addresses
21:16<Fulanito>But I tried with a wireless (Atheros), and failed... I just didn't get anything
21:16<Fulanito>...does anybody know how? (I'm not trying to attack/steal/fraud...)
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21:17<Fulanito>seems it's too late in most of the world :(
21:17<Fulanito>thanks anyway, gotta go
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21:21<bja>adb: looked into it, sounds great but i was looking for something more graphical, somthing a secretary could use
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21:23<adb>heh , feh image.png , right click add as background is hard ?!?
21:24<bja>adb: my secretary comes from windows world, typing a command is not her style, but i'll see what can i arrange for her
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21:29<bja>adb: got it, simple bash script that looks for her photographs on a single directory thx
21:29<bja>she can pick whatever she wants now
21:29<adb>yw bja
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21:47<blendmaster1024>how do i restart udev?
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21:47<adb>/etc/init.d/udev restart ?
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21:48<blendmaster1024>hmm... that *might* do it... semms like it would miss something though, i dont know why maybe i'm insane. i'll try that and hope nothing breaks
21:53<blendmaster1024>it worked
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21:54<Cluster>ae fmz
21:57<adb>blendmaster1024, stop asking on both #d ..
21:58<blendmaster1024>oh oops :) i'll just use freenode
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22:01<Cluster>have somebody here?
22:01<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
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22:14<dpkg>Xfce is a pretty nifty Desktop Environment. Lightweight, fast, compact. To install, ask me about <install xfce>. Backported 4.6.1 packages are available, ask me about <bpo>. Squeeze users: Missing icons in your menu? See bug #526171 in the <BTS>. #xfce on
22:14<ert34>This bug. I can't fix it, even changing my theme.
22:14<ert34>To the recommended by the guy in the BTS.
22:15<ert34>Ah, and I am in lenny, not in squeeze.
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22:49<rev>anyone no how to turn on a computer?
22:49<ert34>Can I kill myself? I just waste 4 hours of my life trying configuring and blaming wicd, but I just put the wrong passphrase.
22:50<rev>sounds like your a real smarty
22:50<ert34>weak troll
22:51<rev>can you help my i have pushed every button on this keyboard and i cant turn my computer off
22:51<ert34>put your keyboard on your mommy's ass. maybe would work.
22:51<rev>wow your real angry
22:51<Ganneff>rev: sudo poweroff.
22:52<Ganneff>ert34: be friendly or stop talking
22:52<ert34>Sorry, Ganneff .
22:52<ert34>and rev
22:52<rev>thanks i was joking i no how to turn it off
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---Logclosed Fri Sep 25 00:00:02 2009