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#debian IRC Logs for 2009-10-01

---Logopened Thu Oct 01 00:00:18 2009
---Daychanged Thu Oct 01 2009
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00:09<Prathibha>While clicking the tab in iceweasel browser, the screen became black and it showed the following lines: Check syslog for diagonstics. [Fail]. Then automatically a window with blue background appeared showing "Failed to start Xserver(your graphical interface). It is likely that it is not set up correcty.....".
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00:10<Prathibha>Then I went into text mode and restarted gdm. but I was not able to get the GUI. How to solve the problem>?
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00:10<Prathibha>It happens often in my system. I am using debian lenny.
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00:37<sney`>man, whenever I go a long time without updating I learn to regret it
00:37<sney`>aptitude is throwing a fit because there are too many wonky dependencies
00:38<sney`>and now we're keeping back approximately 30 xorg-related packages
00:38<sney`>fun stuff.
00:41<sney`>I suppose I'll just keep updating periodically until the deps work themselves out, unless anyone knows of a way to clear this up in one go (debian squeeze, amd64)
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00:49<blueldr137>I'm trying to install xen. How do I do this? It said try "make dist"...
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00:59<dpkg>xen is probably an open source virtual machine monitor, intended to run up to 100 full featured OSs on a single computer. OSs must be explicitly modified ("ported") to run on Xen, although compatibility is maintained for user applications. Xen achieves high performance virtualization without special hardware support. For detailed help, see . #debian-xen on See also <virtualization>.
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01:01<blueldr137>thanks xeon-enoug
01:04<Jerryclunsford>I need to ask a stupid question. What is the proper syntax for chown when changing a folder owner from root?
01:05<Jerryclunsford>Or could someone tell what channel deals with this?
01:07<jm_>Jerryclunsford: folder? my version of chown can't handle folders
01:07<Jerryclunsford>htat could be the problem then
01:08<Jerryclunsford>jm i talked to last night about problems installing lenny on a HP DL360?
01:08<jm_>but it can handle directories!
01:08<jm_>Jerryclunsford: yes
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01:09<Jerryclunsford>I had the wrong distribution needed amd 64 instead of i386
01:09<Jerryclunsford>went right through
01:09<jm_>i386 also works on all the same hardware
01:09<jm_>or should anyway
01:10<Jerryclunsford>should thats my luck any way what would the syntax be for directories
01:10<jm_>depends what exactly do you want to do
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01:12<Jerryclunsford>change the permissions on the www directory so that I can put web pages in it
01:12<jm_>which www directory? note that it's not a good idea to change ownership of /var/www - it's like that for a reason
01:13<Jerryclunsford>well I guess I'll just set up new a directory and point apache at it
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01:14<jm_>what is your goal with this?
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01:15<Jerryclunsford>Just setting up a website then I'll start to learning about the virtual servers
01:16<jm_>right, just create new dirs for that or use userdir module and put stuff in ~/public_html
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01:17<Jerryclunsford>I don't have a static IP so I'm just working with it learn how it's set up for when (and if) I do.
01:18<realone>In my opinion, gay sex is a lot hotter than straight sex. You are now imagining yourself being fucked as a trap while sitting in someone's lap, facing them. You give out little moans and whimpers as you desperately force yourself to ride him, pulling yourself up and down his cock as fast as you can manage. Your feminine features are flushed red with embarrassment because your stiff, hefty prick is bouncing off his stomach with every thru
01:18<realone>st, but he is holding your hands back, preventing you from hiding it or jacking yourself off. Just as he begin to climax, you slam your hips down as deeply as you can, squeezing like a vice around him and moaning wildly. As he continues to fill you with his cum, you begin spraying his stomach and chest with your own virile but useless seed, your hips desperately bucking with every spurt. After his orgasms subside, he releases your arms a
01:18<realone>nd grab your hips, grinding his still-hard but sated dick deeply into you, and he tells you that he won't pull it out until you clean up the mess you made. You begin straining forward, using you tongue to lap up the warm cum you plastered across his stomach. By the time you are done, you are both already hard again. sorry if this is long, it took me a long time to write o.o
01:18<Jerryclunsford>boot time
01:18<realone>hope u enjoy
01:19<Jerryclunsford>can someone please boot this off
01:19<realone>debian is like gay sex though
01:19<realone>it is so fun to do
01:19<realone>and yet everyone enjoys it
01:22<Jerryclunsford>jm thanks for the help I'm getting out of here This is not the place for that.
01:22<jm_>Jerryclunsford: just ignore morons, they go away as soon as they see no one cares about their shit
01:22<Jerryclunsford>well I need to get some sleep tonight didn't get any sleep last night. Take it easy.
01:23<jm_>good night
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01:23<jm_>ohh and when you create dirs: chown username dir
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01:57<ottoshmidt>can u tell me whether the boot up messages are being logged somewhere in logs?
01:59<jm_>ottoshmidt: not by default
01:59<Vasistha>ottoshmidt: maybe /var/log/syslog -- I'm pretty sure they are somewhere
01:59<Vasistha>or perhaps not :P
01:59<ottoshmidt>shall see
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02:11<SSmith>ottoshmidt: take a look at /var/log/dmesg
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02:12<jm_>ottoshmidt: enable bootlogd
02:12<ottoshmidt>syslog appears to be kernel log or not?
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02:12<ottoshmidt>jm_, command?
02:12<jm_>ottoshmidt: editor /etc/default/bootlogd
02:13<ottoshmidt>will check
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02:15<sano>have a question about linux0.01.
02:15<sano>May I ask you some questions here?
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02:17<ottoshmidt>jm_, going to reboot and check if worked, would it be in /var/log/bootlogd or smth?
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02:18<jm_>ottoshmidt: /var/log/boot
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03:13<cmot>Yodel! (Hmm #openssh@freenode is quite quiet..., perhaps here:)
03:13<cmot> Is the "VPN with openssh and tun devices" thingy supported by any Windows ssh client?
03:13<cmot>(The remote side would be Debian, so it's not as OT as it seems ;-)
03:14<buffoon_work>cmot, i'd try putty... that seems to support a lot of things...
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03:16<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
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03:20<cmot>buffoon_work, putty doesn't seem to support it, just port forwardings
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03:48<sylock_>it seems that the "mail" command (from mailutils) changed sinced Lenny. With Etch, I used to set in my scripts the "-c" option to set some mail addresses in carbon copy. With Lenny, I don't see any option anymore to set some mail in carbon copy
03:48<sylock_>is there a way, a new/other command to do it?
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03:50<jm_>sylock: you can use mutt instead
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03:52<locklace>sylock_: works fine with mail set to bsd-mailx. you can install the latter if you don't have it
03:52<locklace>thought that was the default "mail", actually
03:54<xeon-enouf>update-alternatives --config mailx
03:54<xeon-enouf>There is only one alternative in link group mailx: /usr/bin/bsd-mailx
03:55<xeon-enouf>oh wait, he's on lenny, i'm not
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03:58<sylock_>thx locklace. bsd-mailx have the traditional mail command I used to know
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04:13<inzo>how do i find where an erroneous env variable is coming from? I checked ~/.profile and ~/.bashrc. what next?
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04:14<Yoda-BZH`Wk>~/.bash_profile /etc/bash.bashrc /etc/profile
04:16<inzo>any other ideas? this just started randomly
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04:20<inzo>is there a way of modifying the environment of every shell created afterwards without modifying one of these files?
04:21<dr|z3d>bashrc is the way to go.
04:21<inzo>so if i see a variable in env that's not in bashrc, where did it come from?
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04:24<jm_>inzo: there's also /etc/environment*
04:24<jm_>and /etc/security/pam_env.conf
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04:26<cubiq>is it possibile to execute a script as soon as a specific external USB HD is connected? (not so debian related but...)
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04:27<jm_>cubiq: sure
04:27<cubiq>jm_: can you point me to the right direction?
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04:28<dr|zed>inzo: Did you get my link?
04:28<cubiq>no need to be detailed just some hints :)
04:29<dr|zed>Might shed some light on the issue..
04:29<inzo>oooh, thanks
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04:32<jm_>cubiq: you can use udev - see writing udev rules document
04:33<cubiq>jm_: thanks
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04:34<blueldr137>hi cubiq
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04:41<cubiq>what the hell??! "-bash: ls: command not found"
04:41<petemc>is your $PATH messed up?
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04:42<cubiq>petemc: /usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/games
04:42<cubiq>oh blueldr137, hi there
04:43<petemc>is that the same environment as where you got that error message?
04:43<cubiq>petemc: yes
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04:44<petemc>as in, you typed ls and it returned that?
04:44<cubiq>petemc: yep
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04:52<jm_>cubiq: echo /bin/ls*
04:53<cubiq>jm_: I'm afraid it's a hw failure...
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04:54<jm_>cubiq: might be yes
04:55<cubiq>jm_: the pc doesn't reboot... holy s*#t
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05:01<cubiq>sometimes I hate technology... gotta get my hoe back
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05:22<frood>I've installed bitlbee using "apt-get install bitlbee" using the standard lenny respository but it doesn't appear to work. I can see it lstening with netstat on but i cannot telnet to it locally. Any ideas?
05:25<jm_>you *can* telnet to it
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05:26<frood>jsut times out
05:27<jm_>try using it via your IRC client
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05:28<frood>same problem. It's weird
05:29<jm_>does it accept the connection if you strace it?
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05:33<frood>i'm not sure what i'm looking at. just sort of hangs here
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05:34<jm_>sorry you should strace bitlbee
05:35<jm_>are you sure you have no firewall rules configured?
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05:39<Benalex>Hello all, I installed Lenny 5.0.3, and it didn't give me correct screen resolution, so I add few lines (taken from Ubuntu 8.04.3 installation) and added them to Lenny's xorg.conf, now I have the desired resolutions and refresh rates, but the display kinda slow, even when I move the mouse or change active windows it eats the cpu for a second or two
05:39<Benalex>any ideas/
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05:40<frood>hmm bitlbee doesn't seem to like running via strace. just quits out. There's no firewall, no
05:44<frood>... actually maybe there is. *rolls eyes* always something stupid isn't it. Thanks for your help!
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05:47<frood>I had an accept all from localhost iptables rule, but it was below the one to block external access to ircd
05:49<jm_>frood: for strace simply have it attach to a running process
05:50<frood>ah ok. honest, i'd not heard of it until you mentioned it
05:51<jm_>it sometimes helps with things like this - if you don't see it accept()-ing the socket, it means the traffic is not reaching it
05:51<jm_>(or it's some silly bug in the tool)
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05:51<jm_>normally one would see select returning > 0
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05:52<frood>yeah looks like a very useful tool
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05:56<SammyTheSnake>I'm just safe-upgrading my testing box and I get a lot of errors saying I can't switch to dependency-based init scripts because various packages are removed but not purged. How do I purge a package without installing / uninstalling it? apt-get --purge remove [package] rightly points out that I don't have the package installed...
05:57<frood>SammyTheSnake: how many packages are we talking? could you install them again first?
05:57<dondelelcaro>SammyTheSnake: dpkg --purge packagename
05:57<dondelelcaro>SammyTheSnake: or aptitude purge packagename;
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05:59<SammyTheSnake>dondelelcaro: ah, that does it :#S
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06:03<SammyTheSnake>hmm, I'm still getting the following error: insserv: warning: script 'S25libdevmapper1.02' missing LSB tags and overrides, insserv: warning: script 'libdevmapper1.02' missing LSB tags and overrides
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06:04<William>yeah, i have a name now
06:04<SammyTheSnake>I think the next step is the BTS to see if those packages have been reported as not migrating neatly...
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06:05<icebrain>hi. what's the best way to provide more screens to GoPlay? I'm willing to try some games and take a screen of them, but where should I send them?
06:05<dr|z3d>icebrain: What's the Debian relevance?
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06:07<icebrain>dr|z3d: hmm, isn't GoPlay a Debian specific package?
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06:09<dr|z3d>It's certainly offered in Debian, sure.
06:09<dr|z3d>So you're asking how to do screenshots?
06:09<inkbottle>Hi, when I upgrade, I most the time have xserver-xorg-video-all installed though there is an alternative, installing only one package of the list
06:11<inkbottle>how to prement this behavior and make xserver-xorg-video-nv be the only package being upgraded of the whole list?
06:11<icebrain>dr|z3d: I know how to take the screenshots, but how can I contribute them in the games-thumbnails package?
06:11<inkbottle>do you think this page could be a solution for that:
06:11<dr|z3d>inkbottle: Remove the generic xorg install metapackage.
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06:12<dr|z3d>icebrain: I don't know offhand how you'd contribute.. see if you can find the homepage with instructions.
06:12<inkbottle>dr|z3d, Yes I remember i did that once
06:12<Benalex>Is there a documentation that describes how to reconfigure xorg.conf manually in Lenny?
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06:13<dr|z3d>Benalex: man xorg.conf
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06:14<dr|z3d>inkbottle: xserver-xorg-video-all is the metapackage you probably want to remove..
06:15<dr|z3d>apt-cache search xorg |grep meta
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06:19<inkbottle>dr|z3d, I think i see where is the work around, i try it and say after if it works
06:22<dr|z3d>inkbottle: Once you've removed the metapackage, you'll want to remove the redundant drivers.. xserver-xorg-video-<notyourdesireddriver> should all be removed.
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06:24<inkbottle>dr|z3d, there is a virtual package xserver-xorg-video-5, which is installed without having to select it as soon as there is a driver installed; and which fits the dependencies. nevertheless, at upgrading, the whole lot of xserver-xorg-video-all is installed again
06:25<inkbottle>s/installed/considered installed/
06:31<jm_>inkbottle: trid disabling installation of recommended packages?
06:31<inkbottle>jm_, yes but then you have to install recommended package by hand
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06:32<jm_>inkbottle: yes, that's the point of it ;)
06:33<jm_>inkbottle: also, aptitude why/why-not tells you why something is installed
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06:34<frood>jm_: how do i get to see that? i can't see in in the menus
06:34<inkbottle>however I think I have to modify my installing strategy and use more tunable tools than apt-get or aptitude. Like making my own mix of all apt-tools that are available
06:35<inkbottle>there is a tool called nix, I don't know if it is in deb repos
06:35<inkbottle>see nixos
06:35<jm_>frood: sorry, see what?
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06:36<inkbottle>why -> command line
06:36<inkbottle>frood, call aptitude with command line
06:36<jm_>ahh you mean why?
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06:37<Prathibha>Window manager warning: Invalid WM_TRANSIENT_FOR window 0x72 specified for 0x120864f ().The system crashes with the following message in xsession-errors file.
06:37<jm_>aptitude why libcaca0 bash ...
06:37<inkbottle>I quit, bye
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06:38<jm_>ahh no, just a single pkg name, the rest is a pattern
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06:39<Prathibha>Window manager warning: Invalid WM_TRANSIENT_FOR window 0x72 specified for 0x120864f ().The system crashes with the following message in xsession-errors file.
06:39<frood>jm_: it just lists the dependances of that package?
06:39<jm_>frood: it tells you why something is installed
06:40<jm_>if it's due to depends, then yes, might be due to recommends etc.
06:40<frood>jm_: ahh i see. handy
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07:10<dpkg><linuxrules> i dont have problems with languaje
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07:12<sebastian__>can someone tell me how to lunch open from excel file from nautilus ? I can do it from thunar... I have wind installed and when I click xls files in thunar they launch excel, but in nautilus not :-(
07:15<buffoon_work>sebastian, right click on a xls file and then specify the application...
07:15<buffoon_work>even though I don't know what you're doing with "Excel"... wine?
07:15<sebastian__>buffoon_work, it's not working in debian lenny, I tried
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07:16<sebastian__>buffoon_work, believe me I hate excel, but I need it to run some vba program i have
07:16<sebastian__>should be a command like wine /home/sebastian/.wine/drive_c/Program\ Files/Microsoft\ Office/OFFICE11/EXCEL.EXE %f for file ?
07:16<sebastian__>i just don't know how to pass this parameter through nautilus ...
07:16<buffoon_work>i think so yes...
07:17<sebastian__>it's also failing
07:17<jm_>if it fails simply write a shell script and clal that
07:17<buffoon_work>oh, i'm here on thunar too... =)
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07:18<sebastian__>jm_ i like the idea of a shell script, any idea how I pass a mouse click with file name to shell script ?
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07:19<jm_>sebastian__: what do you mean?
07:19<buffoon_work>sebastian, it should be $1 (which is the 1st parameter)
07:20<jm_>sebastian__: ahh use "$@"
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07:50<bremner>if a remote (CentOS) host does not support rxvt-unicode when sshing from various debian boxes, do I have any option other than asking them to add a termcap entry?
07:51<jm_>why not simply change it to something more standard, say xterm?
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07:53<jm_>you can also idd it in your home dir
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07:54<bremner>and then set TERMCAP or so?
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07:55<jm_>I think you don't need to, it will look in ~/.terminfo by default
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08:14<aden>my name is aden
08:14<aden>vc tc de onde
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08:15<nikobit>Hi all!
08:15<bremner>jm_: hmm, man ncurses suggests setting TERMINFO, which works
08:16<aden>a e da slandi
08:16<aden>and you eua
08:16<jm_>bremner: it looks in ~/.terminfo by default on Debian, no need to set it, doesn't it do the same on centos?
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08:17<aden>you speak brasil
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08:17<dpkg>Este canal é apenas em inglês. Por favor, use #debian-br (/j #debian-br) para ajuda em portugues.
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08:18<aden>i alide and peak
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08:19<adb>adema, /msg dpkg ot
08:19<adb>aden, /msg dpkg ot
08:19<adb>sorry adema
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08:20<aden>not and adema is aden
08:21<aden>speak biurifour
08:21<noflash>aden, this isn't a chat channel. Do you have a debian question?
08:21<aden>you is brasil
08:21<aden>is you
08:21<noflash>aden, go to #debian-br
08:21<K0JIbKA>help on network manager required. is it siutable at the moment?
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08:22<chaos>what the hell ... why do ppl pm me?
08:22<jm_>K0JIbKA: it's always suitable, try /msg dpkg ask
08:23<aden>is you
08:23<adb>aden, stop it !
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08:23<aden>and you
08:23<aden>i n speak + inglech
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08:24<aden>hablas espanhol
08:25<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
08:26<dpkg>Por favor use #debian-pt para ajuda em portugues ou #debian-br para ajuda em portugues do brasil. ( /join #debian-pt )
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08:28<aden>speak guel biurifour
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08:35<lucasn>hi, can someone tell my why the network cards in my lenny machine start with eth1?
08:35<jm_>lucasn: probably
08:35<lucasn>i am used for them to start counting from 0
08:36<dpkg>As of version 0.090, udev has the ability to statically rename Ethernet cards based on MAC address. The addresses are configured in /etc/udev/rules.d/z25_persistent-net.rules . If you want the mappings to change, edit that file. See also <forcedeth mac>. As of version 0.124-1, the file is called /etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules .
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08:37<jm_>whoever named this doesn't want to make a fuss about anything
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08:38<K0JIbKA>Debian 5_0. kernel 2.6.26-1-686. I've tried to build home network with desktop, laptop and wireless router. Following help from "Debian Reference" pages I've edited file /etc/hosts, then /etc/network/interfaces in order to include home network addresses that were given by DHCP of router. Nothing worked out. Then I've commented everything I've changed to bring settings back. But since that time nm-applet in the tray doesn't allow me to connect to
08:38<K0JIbKA>the Internet at Auto Mode. It remains with "Manual Network configuration". How to work it out? I need network manager to do all connections auto-mode. And possibly set my home network with two hosts. Both running same Debian as above through router.
08:39<ans-tor->about gpl javascript, if my web or my javascript use the gpl javascript, then my script will also be gpl
08:39<ans-tor->what if the gpl js is placed on another website, like google ajax api?
08:40<ans-tor->if my script and the gpl js is on different host?
08:40<K0JIbKA>thanks in advance
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08:42<jm_>K0JIbKA: if you want router to give out IP-s then you need to configure router, just add your local interfaces as dhcp in Debian
08:42<themill>K0JIbKA: if you want to use network-manager for this, then comment out everything in /etc/network/interfaces except for the entries for "lo".
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08:45<adb>found a typo in > "wireless conncetion managers"
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08:45<eljefe__>I failed the authentication at http://localhost:631 for CUPS administration; how do I force it to re-prompt me to log in?
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08:47<dr|z3d>eljefe__: Clear your authetnticated session cache, if revisiting the url doesn't work.
08:47<themill>adb: fixed. (unless I found a different one)
08:47<eljefe__>wow there isn't a button or something to log in. dr|z3d ? :( ok
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08:48<adb>thx themill ;) yes was in networkmanager ..
08:49<dr|z3d>eljefe__: If it's using htaccess files for control, you won't get a button, no.
08:50<K0JIbKA>jm_: What does it mean?
08:50<K0JIbKA>themill: Is it safe I mean is it possible to reverse all that stuff back without breaking the Internet connection? I'm so new to Debian :(
08:51<jm_>K0JIbKA: you only want one device give out IP-s, or have it all static
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08:52<K0JIbKA>plenty machines in here. supposed to be DHCP
08:53<K0JIbKA>router gives IPs to all
08:55<K0JIbKA>whenever i turn on router it shows connection statistics but no host names for clients. Router is DLink DIR-300. work under some linux version which I don't know
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08:55<jm_>that probably requires configuring the router
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08:58<K0JIbKA>I'm able to ping laptop and desktop - each other. thanks anyway
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08:59<Guest366>hallo wie gets?
08:59<dpkg>deutschsprachige Hilfe bekommt ihr in (auf, oder - German speaking users please go to (on, or
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09:11<lucasn>how can I can i call grub2 in another hd's mbr (from grub2)? does set "root=(hd1); chainloader +1" do the trick? is root without a partition valid?
09:12<jm_>lucasn: you can also say chainloader (hd1)+1
09:12<lucasn>without setting root first?
09:12<frood>lucasn: can you not just choose which hdd to boot from the bios?
09:12<lucasn>nope, graphics card is fried
09:12<jm_>yeah, that always worked in grub 1, probably works in grub2 too
09:12<lucasn>and i dont have another pc with the same bios
09:12<lucasn>so i cant do it blindfolded
09:12<jm_>serial console ;)
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09:12-!-ew is "ew" on #debian #
09:13<lucasn>hm, didnt find any documents on the debug connector
09:13<lucasn>and it doesnt officially have serial ports
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09:13<frood>debian doesn't really care too much which computer you boot it on. youll only run into problems with X really
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09:13<frood>can swap hard disks to whatever you want. as long as its the right type of processor
09:14<lucasn>X is not installed, that's really not very useful without graphics :)
09:14<lucasn>it didnt break recently, I set it up like that
09:14<lucasn>the reason i want to chainload grub is that i want to boot from usb
09:14<lucasn>in order to send the hdd to sleep
09:15<lucasn>but i cant set the pc to boot directly off usb because it is hard without seeing it
09:16<lucasn>or does someone here have an ideo how i could change the boot order in my bios without graphics card?
09:16<lucasn>is there some kind of bios emulator where i can load my bios and see what it would look like?
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09:17<jm_>ahh also recalled grub1 had rootnoverify
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09:31<ans-tor->there is a real chance <-- does this mean 100% of propability?
09:31<ans-tor->"If you do anything other than a purely default installation, there is a real " "chance that some dialogs will be displayed in English instead."
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09:32<dr|z3d>Real chance = likely, but not 100% definite.
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09:33<ew>@lucas, I think you need some jedi practice
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09:34<lucasn>yeah, that would also help
09:34<ew>like when luke used the helmet backwards
09:34<ew>in A New Hope
09:34<lucasn>or maybe if I licked the graphics card, maybe I could taste image
09:35<ew>just make sure you are wearing rubber boots
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09:38<frood>~i don't understand why you don't just put the hard disk in another computer if you want to get at the data on it
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09:39<lucasn>i dont want to access the data
09:40<lucasn>[15:14] lucasn: the reason i want to chainload grub is that i want to boot from usb
09:40<lucasn>[15:14] lucasn: in order to send the hdd to sleep
09:40<lucasn>[15:15] lucasn: but i cant set the pc to boot directly off usb because it is hard without seeing it
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09:42<frood>hmm tricky
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09:43<frood>and i take it the BIOS is set to boot from hdd first? no CDROM first or anything?
09:43<lucasn>maybe it is cdrom first, I don't remember
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09:44<frood>you could try that then. if you have a knoppix cd kicking around
09:45-!-hugoxrosa [~hugoxrosa@] has joined #debian
09:45<lucasn>how would that help me? I already installed debian on it
09:46<lucasn>i can ssh into it
09:46<lucasn>the only thing i want is for grub on the hdd to load grub from usb
09:46<lucasn>so i don't always have to update grub on the hdd when I install a new kernel on the usb system
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09:47<frood> ?
09:47<lucasn>looks great
09:48<lucasn>i guess i used the wrong keywords
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09:54<ans-tor->"The proxy information should be given in the standard form of \"http://"
09:55<ans-tor-> http://[[user][:pass]@]host[:port]/ -should be-> http://[user[:pass]@]host[:port]/
09:55<nano->Are there any way of getting libstdc++5 in my sid installation?
09:55<mary_>hello to everyone!
09:55<mary_>I was wondering if anyone could help me fix my wireless card on Acer Aspire One netbook
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09:57<frood>mary_: this article walks you through it
09:58<timbt>can anyone remember what's the difference between Lenny 5.0.2a and 5.0.2, I can't find any changelogs
09:58<gsimmons>dpkg: tell timbt -about 5.0.2a
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09:59<rjent>Greetings, what kernel boot param to disable only power savings features. I have tried acpi=off but that did not do it.
09:59<frood>rjent: try noacpi
10:00<rjent>frood: thanks for the reply. I tried that and it made the mouse on several units run very slow.
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10:01<rjent>frood: so I am thinking the noacpi might have something to do with usb devices, but I am not sure
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10:02<frood>rjent: is the apmd daemon running? you could try stopping that
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10:03<rjent>frood: Ok I will look at that.
10:04<xeon-enouf>frood: rjent acpi=off, not noacpi
10:04<xeon-enouf>unless you mean noapic
10:05<xeon-enouf>or, unless more recent kernels readded that noacpi option, or something
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10:05<xeon-enouf>rjent: ahh - i see you tried acpi=off - oh well
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10:10<frood>xeon-enouf: is noacpi the same as acpi=off? i know "acpi=" can take a bunch of options, but i thought maybe noacpi did something else again
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10:12<xeon-enouf>frood: i don't think noacpi works at all
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10:12<xeon-enouf>frood: older kernels it was an option, IIRC, like 2.4 series maybe
10:13<rjent>frood and xeon-enouf: I just looked on those systems and apmd is not running best I can tell
10:13<xeon-enouf>apm != acpi
10:13<xeon-enouf>you don't want apm .. how old is this? oh a Acerone?
10:13<xeon-enouf>no, nt you
10:13<rjent>Equipment is newer workstations
10:14*xeon-enouf missed your original questions/issues/descriptions
10:14-!-flami [] has joined #debian
10:14<xeon-enouf>ok, got it with /lastlog
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10:15<xeon-enouf>rjent: "disable only power savings features" <--what exactly do you mean? Also, check into your BIOS and see under Power Management
10:15<flami>Hi, where can I find information about taking something out of the boot process with the new dependency based boot? ( update-rc.d -f mysql remove doesnt work it seems )
10:16<xeon-enouf>acpi=off will force it to not use any ACPI
10:16<xeon-enouf>rjent: but note - that MIGHT also disable the other cores (no SMP) and imply noapic (see IO-APIC and LAPIC kernel things)
10:17<xeon-enouf>flami: i use rcconf
10:17<xeon-enouf>flami: /msg dpkg rcconf - but what you did with update-rc.d should've worked
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10:26<tadej>how can I run wireshark with other accounts and still be able to specify which interface has to be monitored? I can run wireshark as a non-root but it doesn't list anything in the interface list so I cannot set it up
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10:26<tadej>wireshark (as root) seems a bit buggy
10:26<xeon-enouf>wireshark needs root, IINM
10:26<tadej>okay, cool
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10:27<tadej>but I guess that the whole app is kind of buggy
10:27<flami>xeon-enouf: thanks
10:28<flami>its jsut that it says "update-rc.d: using dependency based boot sequencing", it made me suspect that it didnt do anything ;)
10:28<mary_>does anyone have the time to fix my Atheros wireless card on my Acer Aspire One? I use Sidux.
10:28<xeon-enouf>tadej: google using tcpdump read logs wireshark (or similar)
10:28<bja>mary_: /j #sidux
10:29<xeon-enouf>mary_: also try #sidux on
10:29<mary_>bja you recomend to ask this at #sidux channel?
10:29<xeon-enouf>yes, this is #debian ;-)
10:29<mary_>ok thanks
10:30<tadej>xeon-enouf, I'll try tcpdump, weird thing I didn't thought of it myself
10:30<ans-tor->what is it doing, when it says "resolving dependencies" ?
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10:37<xeon-enouf>ans-tor-: reading the pkgs.list or somefile-name within .. oh don't make me find it
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10:46<ans-tor->xeon-enouf: what is "resolving dependencies of the required packages"?
10:46<ans-tor->reading pkgs.list the required packages?
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10:47<inglor>How can I found which rules of udev my kernel use when connecting a device (firewire ext HD)
10:48<magyar>hi, how do i reconfigure xorg on squeeze?
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10:50*arw hello folks
10:50<rjent>frood and xeon-enouf: Thanks for the dialog. I will look at the references.
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10:55<Raevsky>ïðèâåò âñåì
10:55<Raevsky>ãîâðèò ïî ðóññêè êòîíòü?
10:55<dpkg>Russian speakers, please use (Pogalujsta, zajdite na) (Pazhaluista, zahodite na) #debian-russian @
10:56<Raevsky>i have a problem with install of my debian
10:56<frood>what's up?
10:56<Raevsky>when i have started at 1 time, i sow tty1, and how a can switch to gnome?
10:57<Raevsky>alt+f? doesnt work.......
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10:58<Raevsky>anybody help me?
10:59<weasel>have you installed gnome?
11:00<Raevsky>i think yes....i used net_inst.iso....and it consist of gnome
11:01<flami>Raevsky: try apt-cache policy gnome . itll tell you if you have it installed
11:01<Raevsky>i installed with this iso several times, and gnome is by defoult is installed
11:02<Raevsky>aaa....apr-cache ok
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11:02<Raevsky>iam gonna reboot and chek this one
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11:03<flami>Raevsky: if you are sure that you have a xserver and gdm + gnome , I guess its time to check /var/log/Xorg.0.log .
11:04<Raevsky>what is gdm?
11:04<flami>that thing you see when you log into gnome
11:04<Raevsky>with apt-cache i can chek this?
11:05<flami>well itll tell you if its installed
11:05<flami>but that doesnt mean it has to work ;)
11:05<kop_>Are there any handy-dandy icon packages for network diagramming, a-lah visio?
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11:06<inzo>kop_: dia
11:07<kop_>inzo: That's a program. I'm looking for icons.
11:07<petemc>wouldnt it stand to reason that dia would have icons?
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11:08<kop_>petemc: It doesn't.
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11:09<kop_>petemc: Mostly icons are just bling, but sometimes bling is nice.
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11:09<kop_>petemc: Dia is still getting it's core functionality right, seems tome.
11:10<bja>kop_: there is package which is based in nmap that generates a nice network map, i just can't remember the name
11:10<kop_>So anyhow. I'm using dia, but looking for more bling.
11:10-!-cahoot [] has joined #debian
11:10<kop_>bja: I recall seeing that on the nmap home page. It might be nmap itself. Anyhow, I need to draw my own diagrams.
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11:13<inzo> ?
11:14<kop_>inzo: That looks promising. Thanks.
11:15<kop_>To what package does one submit an enhancement request to package something not packaged?
11:18<bja>i guess a wish list on the initial package, that if i understood you correctly
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11:20<kop_>bja: That'd be ok for something like dia images, but not for some entirely unpackaged program.
11:21<dpkg>Request For Package is the way to ask for a piece of software to be included in Debian. See, the section on that page "Adding new entries with "reportbug"" is a good place to start. Technically, RFP is a wishlist bug filed against "wnpp" with a title beginning "RFP: ", ask me about <wnpp>.
11:21<kop_>I see nagios-images has some useful stuff.
11:21<kop_>themill: Thanks.
11:21<bja>the cavalry to the rescue
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11:22<themill>kop_: which images are you specifically interested in?
11:23<jpinx-eeepc>does anyone know how to copy a live image (debian) into a partition on a stick and then make it bootable while offline?
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11:24<dpkg>UNetbootin allows you to create bootable USB drives for a variety of Linux distributions from Windows or Linux, without requiring you to burn a CD. You can either let it download one of the many distributions supported out-of-the-box for you, or supply your own Linux <iso> file if you've already downloaded one or your preferred distribution isn't on the list.
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11:26<themill>kop_: xfig-libs might also be of interest to you, btw
11:26<kop_>themill: Switches, openbsd, firewall, wanlink, MS workstation, servers, server rack, cisco router. Stuff like that.
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11:27<themill>yeah, xfig-libs is worth looking at then
11:27<kop_>themill: I'll install it and see. Thanks.
11:28<themill>kop_: xfig is rather umm... quaint... but it's an excellent drawing program.
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11:32<kop_>themill: Nice images.
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11:55<themill>!coffee bzed
11:55*dpkg decants a fine brew of fair trade Jamaican Blue Mountain for bzed, courtesy of themill
11:55<themill>bzed: problem solved...
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11:56<norbert_>hi, a friend of mine installed Skype 2.1 on Debian and that program now crashes Debian every few minutes, so he can't use it
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11:56<bzed>themill: thanks :D
11:57<norbert_>I know this is not a Debian issue, mostly because Skype is closed source, but I want to redownload an older version of Skype (2.0 instead of 2.1) but it's no longer available on; does anyone know a place where I can get a deb package with 2.0?
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12:28<sidney>hi all, looking for help with grub2 boot problems - is this the right place?
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12:29<sidney>anybody here?
12:29<bja>sidney: if you are using debian it is the right place
12:30<sidney>yes i am
12:30<sidney>since updating my debian/unstable system i've been unable to boot
12:30<sidney>first time in years i haven't been able to solve the problem myself
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12:31<sidney>i have a root partition on raid (mirrored) /dev/md0, grub2 comes up, kernel starts loading, then hangs
12:31<valdyn>sidney: what did you install grub2 to?
12:31<valdyn>sidney: uh, so grub2 is fine
12:31<valdyn>sidney: where exactly does it hang?
12:31<sidney>yeah i can get a prompt hang on, will reboot
12:32<sidney>(i mean: a grub2 prompt)
12:32<sidney>ok: precise description follows:
12:32<sidney>- pc booting
12:33<sidney>I get GNU GRUB version 1.97~beta3 screen
12:33<sidney>2 options:
12:33<sidney>(1) Deian GNU/Linux, Linux 2.6.30-1-amd64
12:33<sidney>(2) same, except (recovery mode)
12:33<valdyn>sidney: you just told us that the kernel loads, so grub is fine so far
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12:33<valdyn>sidney: so you dont yet need to tell us anything about grub2
12:33<sidney>ok i hit enter on the first option
12:34<sidney>fair enough, sorry :)
12:34<sidney>First option says "Loading, pleas wait..."
12:34<sidney>For a loooong time.
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12:34<sidney>Second option is more verbose.
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12:35<sidney>Both have me drop in busybox after a timeout
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12:35<valdyn>sidney: the error and the error message are before busybox
12:35<sidney>(I'm still staring at the "Loading, please wait...")
12:36<valdyn>sidney: you have all kernel messages suppressed with the "quiet" in your kernel parameters, ( viewable from grub2 also )
12:37<valdyn>sidney: the recovery mode appearantly does not have that set
12:37<sidney>I just dropped to busybox, I see no errors
12:37<sidney>so "quitet" mode suppresses them
12:37<valdyn>sidney: yes
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12:37<sidney>small i boot in "recovery mode"?
12:37<valdyn>sidney: just use the recovery mode then
12:38<sidney>thanks for your patience so far
12:38<sidney>rebooting with hopefully mor einfo
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12:38<sidney>ok I get kernel bootup messages.
12:39<sidney>It hangs after 6.5 seconds, message:
12:39<sidney>Begin: Mounting root file system ... begin: Running /scripts/local-top ... done.
12:39<sidney>(and the next line)
12:39<sidney>Begin: Waiting for root file system ...
12:39<sidney>(and it just hangs right there)
12:40<valdyn>sidney: you have an older kernel listed in grub2 ?
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12:40<sidney>unfortunately not :/
12:41<sidney>I just had the grub2 update scripts modify my legacy grub install
12:41<sidney>apparently something went awry
12:41<sidney>I just have the 2.6.30 listed
12:41<valdyn>sidney: ok, i you should see the error now...
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12:41<valdyn>sidney: or it scrolled by?
12:42<sidney>No the timeout happended here it is verbatim:
12:42<sidney>"Gave up waiting for root device. Common problems:
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12:43<sidney>- Boot args (cat /proc/cmdline)
12:43<sidney>- Check rootdelay= (did the system wait longenough?)
12:43<sidney>- Check root= (did the system wait for the right device?)
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12:43<valdyn>sidney: ok, i dont need to see more, reboot, select one of both entry, hit the E key
12:43<sidney>will do
12:44<sidney>I'm now looking at the GRUB command listing for the "recovery mode" entry
12:45<valdyn>sidney: is there one line starting with "initrd
12:45<sidney>last one
12:45<lucasn>is there a module that makes my keyboard leds appear in /sys/classes/leds ?
12:45<sidney>@valdyn: initrd /boot/initrd.img-2.6.30-1-amd64
12:45<valdyn>sidney: ok, the initrd either does not exist or is not found
12:46<valdyn>sidney: what does the linux line say after root=
12:46<sidney>it has root=UUID=<<big uuid string>> ro single
12:47<valdyn>sidney: ok, thats not helpful unfortunately
12:47<valdyn>sidney: your actual root device is md0 ?
12:47<valdyn>sidney: tell me the insmod lines
12:47<sidney>ok here we go
12:47<sidney>insmod raid
12:47<sidney>insmod mdraid
12:47<sidney>insmod ext2
12:47<sidney>set root=(md0)
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12:48<sidney>search --no-floppy --fs-uuid --set <<big uuid string>>
12:48<sidney>linux /boot/vmlinuz-2.6.30-1-amd64 root=<<big uuid string>> ro single
12:48<sidney>initrd /boot/initrd.img-2.6.30-1-amd64
12:49<valdyn>sidney: to bad i dont know the precise symptoms of the initrd not being found, but thats probably your issue
12:49<sidney>that's it. <<big--uuid string>> is the same on both places
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12:49<valdyn>sidney: so you could garble the name of the initrd and see if you get the precisely same symptoms
12:49<sidney>hang on, i will look if it exists on (md0)
12:50<sidney>your idea is good will try
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12:50<sidney>FYI: ls (md0)/boot shows the initrd.img-2.6.30-1-amd64 file to be present, from the GRUB command line
12:51<sidney>will garble initrd line and reboot
12:51<sidney>note: this changes symptoms
12:51<sidney>GRUB refuses to boot with garbled line
12:52<valdyn>sidney: ok
12:52<sidney>"error: file not found"
12:52<valdyn>sidney: set root=/dev/md0
12:53<sidney>ok, changing that particular line, and rebooting...
12:53<sidney>i mean _boot_ing, not rebooting :)
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12:53<sidney>no dice
12:54<sidney>"Begin: Waiting for root file system..."
12:54<sidney>and hangs
12:54<valdyn>sidney: ok, replace /dev/md0 with any raid member
12:54<sidney>ok will do
12:55<valdyn>sidney: this will unsync your raid, but its not going to break anything serious
12:55<sidney>FYI I have /dev/sda /dev/sdb; /dev/sda1and /dev/sb1 are swap; /dev/sda2 and /dev/sdb2 are root partition
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12:56<sidney>I'd happily rebuild the raid sync if this fixes it :)
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12:56<sidney>I replaced:
12:56<valdyn>sidney: no, dont replace the root=(md0)
12:57<inglor>Anyone knows where should I look if only /dev/sdc1 device is not Auto mounted when plugged? It doesn't matter if I plug a usb or an ext HD. Just that device. It says I don't have the privileges to mount it.
12:57<valdyn>sidney: only the /dev/md0 in the kernel parameters
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12:57<sidney>ah ok
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12:57<valdyn>inglor: in which debian release, in which desktop environment ?
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12:58<inglor>debian sid and gnome. I checked the udev rules bit nothing for that particular device.
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12:59<valdyn>inglor: run polkit-gnome-authorization
12:59<Rae>hi every body
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13:00<Rae>i have a little problem....when i have install debian, at first startup i sow only tty1 terminal with standart login
13:01<valdyn>Rae: thats ok
13:01<Rae>but how can a cahnge this to gnome?
13:01<Rae>i want work in gnome
13:01<valdyn>Rae: aptitude install xorg gdm gnome
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13:01<Rae>xm...but i thotht that gnome already is installed!
13:01<sidney>@valdyn: progress at last -- kernel and system have booted perfectly.
13:02<Rae>i install net_inst.iso
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13:02<valdyn>Rae: i dont really care if that is already installed, leave that command as i gave you
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13:03<Rae>can i use command apt-get install xorg gdm gnome?
13:03<valdyn>Rae: yes
13:03<inglor>valdyn: Nothing special, this tool handle ALL removable devices. I have the problem only with /dev/sdc1
13:03<Rae> can i understand that gnome is already installed?
13:03<valdyn>Rae: does that command do anything?
13:04<inglor>Rae: Try startx as normal user
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13:05<valdyn>sidney: except that / is not on a raid now
13:05<sidney>well oddly it seems to be
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13:05<valdyn>sidney: even if your df claims that it is, its not
13:05<sidney>ok, you're right then
13:05<valdyn>sidney: the df output of / is a hack
13:06<sidney>strangely, my mdadm seems to have disappeared
13:06<valdyn>sidney: so thats one of your problems then
13:06<sidney>probably during some apt update, i didn't notice
13:06<valdyn>sidney: you should fix your system from a livecd
13:06<abeastinme>find@ Fundamentals of Operating Systems a.m. lister
13:07<valdyn>sidney: i.e. shut down and use a livecd
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13:07<sidney>@valdyn: wouldn't it be simpler to re-install mdadm and resync the raid?
13:07<valdyn>sidney: you can try that
13:07<inglor>I just donl't get it. Only /dev/sdc1 device have this problem. If I disconnect my HD and plug a usb i still got the same issue. It's like as if I don't have read access on the device (which I have)
13:08<valdyn>sidney: i dont know how your unsynced raid will boot
13:08<valdyn>inglor: youre not supposed to have read access on the device
13:09<valdyn>inglor: but maybe you really mean filesystem
13:09<sidney>valdyn: i see your point
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13:11<valdyn>inglor: is sdc1 listed in /etc/fstab ?
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13:12<inglor>valdyn: what I mean is that if I plug a device (isb or Firewire) and my kernel link it to the device /dev/sdc1 I got this message from gnome saying I am not privileged to mount the volume 'xxx'. If my kernel link it in another device it's no problem.
13:12<inglor>maybe i use wrong word as "link"
13:12<valdyn>inglor: yea, so is it listed in /etc/fstab?
13:13<inglor>strangely it is.. and i think I should have known it.
13:13<inglor>i didn't notice.
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13:14<inglor>yep working just fine. ntfs configuration tool must have written the info in there.
13:14<inglor>(it was ntfs-3g when I was trying to plug a friend's device) cheers for making me see it :)
13:16<dr|z3d>ntfs-3g is the filesystem stuff, ntfs-config is the easy config ui.
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13:26<sidney>@valdyn: do you know of a live CD that has mdadm in order to rebuild my raid?
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13:31<bja>dpkg: tell sidney about @
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13:43<Fujitina>hi all
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13:44<Fujitina>there is some italian who can help me?
13:45<dpkg>Ciao, vai su #debian-it per ricevere aiuto in italiano. Italian Speakers: Please use #debian-it, there you will get much more help.
13:45<Fujitina>thank you
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13:45<dpkg>Ciao, vai su #debian-it per ricevere aiuto in italiano. Italian Speakers: Please use #debian-it, there you will get much more help.
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13:46<weasel>bja: your point?
13:46<pototoy>hi, just curious what packages are "standard"? I debootsrapped my first install, and it looks pretty... bare.
13:46<weasel>a debootstrap usually puts tons of stuff there that isn't needed.
13:47<pototoy>but it left me with a tiny install that doesn't have vim or acpid... just listing what I should install next.
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13:47<weasel>you could always install tasksel next
13:47<pototoy>not to mention the lack of important config files.
13:48<pototoy>ooh.. thanks. but what exactly does that install?
13:48<weasel>tasksel installs tasksel.
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13:48<bja>weasel: blame it on lag
13:49<pototoy>but I already have tasksel after a debootstrap
13:49<weasel>and important is relative. it's debootstrap. it's there to give you the stuff that's necessary to get yourself started.
13:49<weasel>if you want a complete system use d-i
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13:50<weasel>and it's not missing a lot. network stuff mostly (interfaces, hosts, hostname, resolv.conf).
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13:51<pototoy>hmm... well, ok. thanks :)
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13:53<ferar>Hi, anybody knows how to install debian through serial terminal ?
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13:54<ferar>or better via SD card
13:54<pototoy>what about unetbootin?
13:54<bja>ferar: whatever media you use most be bootable by your computer
13:54<dr|z3d>ferar: Sure. unetbootin or somesuch.. plenty of ways to create a bootable usb/sd device.
13:55<dr|z3d>Some live CD's have a usb boot device creation tool.
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13:55<pototoy>btw, what's the package name for powedevil or kde's equiv of gnome-power-manager?
13:55<ferar>if possible a link pls?
13:56<adama>ferar: unetbootin
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13:57<pototoy>it's called unetbootin in testing/unstable
13:57<ferar>thanks, I'll check that out
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13:59<pototoy>guys? what about kde's equiv of gnome-power-manager? can't find powerdevil in the repos
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13:59<themill>pototoy: for lenny, kpowersave
13:59<pototoy>thanks! i've been looking for that
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14:01<sidney>hi all, anyone here can help me? I'm trying to figure out how to resync a RAID-1 root partition that's gone bad (preferably, live)
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14:02<interbird>bios-raid or hard-raid (true raid controller) ?
14:02<sidney>interbird: sw raid
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14:02<lucasn>I am trying to write a led kernel module that is supposed to control the keyboard leds, but it seems that I can not ioctl other devices from a kernel module. is that correct or am I including the wrong headers?
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14:03<interbird>sidney: all is gone (no raid-device) or mirror is present ?
14:04<sidney>interbird: mdadm --misc -D /dev/md0 says that one member is "removed", one is active sync
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14:05<sidney>interbird: the removed device was kicked during boot
14:06<sidney>interbird: message was "md: kicking non-fresh sda2 from array!"
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14:08<interbird>sidney: best is to check the bios for the sw-raid properties; (some shitty bioses can 'jump-to-non-raid'); also, boot with a live-cd like knoppix to see what it sees to exclude any system-mis-configuration;
14:09<sidney>interbird: no bios is involved, this is purely software raid mnanaged by linux. I don't see your point
14:11<interbird>sidney: ok, sw-raid is also the term for some on-board sw-raid controllers managed by bios; how many disks are involved? what is the hd-controller?
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14:15<interbird>sidney: raid-1 is an *exact* mirror, so you could sync sda to sdb with dd, but the *main question* is why they got out-of-sync and if sda has the *most-recent-data*. It's very hard to tell over IRC.
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14:17<sidney>interbird: they got out of sync because mdadm was missing so booting became impossible.
14:17<interbird>sidney: how big is the size of the disk and are you able to dump it to an image on some external (usb) disk ?
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14:17<sidney>interbird: not really, it's 1,5 TB
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14:18<valdyn>sidney: you can assemble the mirror with one disk and --assume-clean
14:18<valdyn>sidney: ( thats sda2 if i remember correctly )
14:18<sidney>interbird: I'm looking for a way to do a live recovery, I see no reason why that couldn't be done
14:18<valdyn>sidney: ...assemble the *raid*
14:19<interbird>sidney: can you access one of the drives ? (sda?)
14:19<valdyn>sidney: you cannot do this live, use a live cd
14:19<interbird>yes, use a live cd
14:19<sidney>ok will use a live cd
14:19<valdyn>sidney: or at least i dont know how to convice your raid to be clean while its live
14:20<sidney>but then I could get stuck with my original problem.
14:20<valdyn>sidney: mind, i mean the single disk to be clean, *dont* declare the complete raid clean
14:20<valdyn>sidney: no
14:20<sidney>it now appears the raid consists of /dev/sdb2 (/dev/sda2 is kicked at boot time)
14:20<valdyn>sidney: your mdadm is installed on sda2
14:21<sidney>valdyn: i am confused now
14:21<sidney>(not your fault)
14:21<valdyn>sidney: if you declare assemble the raid *just* with sda2 and declare it clean
14:21<valdyn>sidney: then a copy of its data will be on sdb2 after the sync
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14:22<sidney>valdyn: the question is whether mdadm is now in /dev/sda2 or on /dev/sdb2
14:22<valdyn>sidney: mdadm kicks sda2, because we modified it, but since you know better you can override that
14:22<valdyn>sidney: both
14:22<sidney>valdyn: slow, please
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14:22<valdyn>sidney: you have 2 ways here
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14:22<sidney>valdyn: why do you think mdadm is on my /dev/sda2?
14:23<valdyn>sidney: because you used that in root= earlier
14:23<sidney>valdyn: i rebooted, md0 is active, consists of /dev/sdb2 (which I think is strange), and I have mdadm
14:23<valdyn>sidney: ok, i get whats confusing you
14:24<valdyn>sidney: your initial ram disk is loaded from sda2
14:24<valdyn>sidney: *after* that point your raid is mounted with just sdb2
14:24<interbird>let him dump an fdisk -lu to be sure ?
14:25<sidney>valdyn: but how come i have mdadm now?
14:25<sidney>valdyn: I installed it back when I booted with root=/dev/sda2
14:26<sidney>now I'm booted with root=md0
14:26<sidney>md0 is active, but just sdb2
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14:26<sidney>still got mdadm
14:26<sidney>Note that I don;t exactly understand the initrd wizardry, that may be what bugs me
14:27<interbird>but you are accessing the wrong device (on-raid)
14:27<valdyn>sidney: ok
14:27<valdyn>sidney: i have no idea
14:27<valdyn>sidney: so: use a live cd, assemble and sync the raid
14:27<valdyn>sidney: now after that use chroot to enter your system
14:27<valdyn>sidney: and if you need install mdadm from there
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14:28<sidney>will knoppix do? does it have mdadm for the initial sync? I tried kubuntu 9.04 earlier, but it didn't have it
14:28<valdyn>sidney: do you understand what chroot is?
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14:28<valdyn>sidney: knoppix has it, i cant tell if it supports your hardware obviously
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14:28<sidney>valdyn: yes, but it would be a first for me to a chroot manually
14:29<sidney>but i guess i will be ok.
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14:29<valdyn>sidney: just bind mount /dev /proc /sys into the chroot
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14:30<sidney>i will do this
14:30<sidney>still, i have to say:
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14:30<sidney>i think its strange i cannot re-add /dev/sda2 live
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14:30<interbird>use a live cd and check without modifying
14:30<valdyn>sidney: whats the error you get?
14:31<interbird>(or being live)
14:31<valdyn>sidney: oh, never mind, the single mirror is syncing
14:32<sidney>valdyn, i don't understand the "the single mirror is syncing" remark
14:32<valdyn>sidney: i wonder if you cant just "mdadm /dev/md0 --assume-clean live
14:33<valdyn>sidney: i mean it thinks that its not clean, so it would need a clean mirror to sync from/to
14:33<valdyn>sidney: but sda2 also got kicked because its not clean
14:33<interbird>sda2 is a partition and not a drive
14:34<sidney>interbird: my md0 is made of sda2 and sdb2
14:34<valdyn>interbird: hows that relevant?
14:35<sidney>valdyn: suppose i were brave, what command would you have me try to do a live resync?
14:35<interbird>the relevance is that it's not a complete dasd and raid1 is a mirroring-system; hence the notice "single mirror is syncing'
14:36<valdyn>sidney: whats the error you get when trying to add sda2 ?
14:36<sidney>when I do "mdadm /dev/md0 --ad /dev/sda2"
14:36<sidney>i get: "mdadm: Cannot open /dev/sda2: Device or resource busy"
14:37<chiku>does dpkg-source -x package.dsc just do zcat package.diff.gz | patch -p1 ?
14:37<interbird>you should do this stuff from a live cd
14:37<valdyn>sidney: you can boot debian to the busybox prompt too and assemble the raid there
14:37<valdyn>sidney: not sure thats easier than a livecd
14:38<sidney>valdyn: how can I force that?
14:38<valdyn>sidney: set an invalid root=/dev/blah
14:38<sidney>interbird: why shouldn't I be able to do it live? that's sort-of the point of RAID1.
14:39<valdyn>sidney: whats really your / ?
14:39<valdyn>sidney: is it not sda2 now?
14:39<sidney>valdyn: df says /dev/md0 but I hear that cannot be trusted :-(
14:39<interbird>sidney: because your drives/partitions are mounted and booting a live-cd puts you in a helicopter able to check and sync ?
14:40<valdyn>sidney: it *is* what your linux kernel parameter was, but it shows whats in /etc/fstab
14:40<sidney>kernel parameter was the UUID as given in the GRUB config, I suppose
14:40<interbird>mount -l ?
14:40<sidney>(did I mention I hate this UUID stuff?)
14:41<interbird>UUID is cool, just hard to type :-)
14:41<sidney>hold on, checking dmesg
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14:42<sidney>ok dmesg says root=/dev/sda2
14:43<sidney>damn i remember: booting from md0 doesn't work :-/
14:43<sidney>that explains
14:43<sidney>I'm really booted from /dev/sda2
14:43<sidney>the /dev/sda2 has the mdadm
14:44<sidney>and the md0 consists of /dev/sdb2 only
14:44<interbird>md0 is your raid-device; sda2 is the one-half of it; sdb2 needs to be synced so md0 can be accessable again
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14:44<interbird>(i guess)
14:44<sidney>it is terribly shitty that mount and df show /dev/md0 as root device when in fact it isn't
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14:45<sidney>didn't know that.
14:46<sidney>would a dd if=/dev/sda2 of=/dev/sdb2 do the trick?
14:46<sidney>(from a live CD)?
14:46<interbird>untill you are in a helicopter and not shitting with sw-raid i cannot help
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14:47<interbird>s/shitting with sw-raid/shitting with sw-raid live/
14:47<sidney>ok, suppose i boot from a live cd, would the dd suffice to fix this?
14:48<sidney>are there no ID's or anything in the first partition sectors?
14:48<interbird>possibly, like i said earlier, but you have to do some sanity-checks
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14:48<interbird>and also think about what caused the probbie
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14:49<sidney>interbird: the root-cause-of-failure was that mdadm got lost by an apt-get update, on next reboot, the raid couldn't be engaged
14:49<interbird>go live-cd, mount -ro partitions, compare and dd sda2 to sdb2 to get the master onto the slave; *but check check check*
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14:50<sidney>sounds ok, but what is there to check?
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14:50<interbird>sidney: what are you running ? (lenny, testing, sid ?)
14:51<bdheeman>wow, now we can build debian packages on a free and open suse build service also
14:51<bdheeman>please check
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14:52<interbird>sidney: so, you find it a wise idea to upgrade raod-software on sid without checking? don't you know what sid stands for ?
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14:53<sidney>what can I say? I like living on the edge. Has worked for me over the last 8 years or so, with intermittent glitches.
14:54<sidney>unstable's pretty unstable these days.
14:54<sidney>I meant to say: unstable's pretty stable these days.
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14:56<interbird>sidney: once you solve your probbie, will you let the debian developers know :-)
14:56<ferar>Hi, I have an ARM based system i have install the kernel (and custom drivers for touchpad, eth0, wifi, and keyboard) is it possible to install debian from uboot menu ot better from minicom (serial port connection)?
14:57<sidney>what could i tell them? I learnt a few things today: grub2 documentation sucks, by some accident mdadm got uninstalled which causes a lot of headaches, and mount/dd sometimes will lie about the root file system.
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14:57<sidney>none of which is a concern for any debian developer i should imagine
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15:00<interbird>dunno, the debian developers made stable, testing and unstable. reporting problems in unstable is the way to get stuff to stable.
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15:04<jrosset>LOAD cwirc
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15:06<sidney>guys, thanks for the help so far, i need to do some stuff of the computer. valdyn / interbird, thanks for your help.
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15:07<interbird>np, please read what sid is and what it's not.
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15:22<edbian>Does anybody know how to set up sudo in NIS ?
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15:23<tekila>I am not completely newbie to linux I run my own sever which is nothing but I want to run stable servers which is something but you guys of debian I have one question is debian in progress or freezed why is it that kde is only version 3.5 in lenny squeeze
15:24<jpinx-eeepc>'cos KDE sux ? ;)
15:24<jupe>is it possible to merge the Etch DVDs into one giant ISO and use it to install from hd-media?
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15:26<interbird>KDE on a server ?
15:26<jbutera>where is firefox? :(
15:26<dpkg>Iceweasel is a DFSG-free fork of Firefox, which replaces it in Debian as of Etch. It is not GNU's Firefox fork (now known as <IceCat>). Ask me about <why iceweasel> and <iceweasel user-agent>. Use gnome-default-applications-properties to change settings such as the mail reader. No longer supported in Etch, see and ask me about <d-s-a>.
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15:27<themill>tekila: lenny is frozen. squeeze has kde4 but you wouldn't be putting either kde or squeeze on a server anyway
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15:27<jbutera>nifty, thanks interbird
15:27<cheal>tekila: lenny is not squeeze
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15:29<jbutera>debian sure is a lot prettier by default than ubuntu :) orange hurts my brain
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15:30<interbird>that's just a "theme"; don't you know you can make Debian as "pretty" as you want ?
15:30<beer>jbutera: debian is much bether than ubuntu becouse debian do no force Gnome on you
15:31<jbutera>interbird, i know, but its nice to have to change that immediately upon installing
15:32<dr|z3d>beer: Well, there's Ubuntu (Gnome), Kubuntu (Debian), Lubuntu (LXDE), Fubuntu (Flux).. not exactly forcing Gnome on the user, is it?
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15:33<interbird>jbutera: Judging a book by it's cover is not the right way; maybe you like Debian more (in time) because it let's you *truly* free of stuff; but then you have to know how to change a "theme" or install you wifi; But we'll be here :-)
15:33<beer>: have you ever tried kubuntu?
15:33-!-midlis [] has joined #debian
15:33<interbird>Also tried OS/2
15:33<jbutera>howd that work out for ya?
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15:33<jupe>can anyone point me to a site that shows how to combine the Etch DVDs into one large ISO?
15:34<dr|z3d>beer: For the record, I'm not a huge KDE fan. Style over substance to me. Looks nice, though. ;)
15:34<interbird>jupe: Create your own deb-mirror: start with and read past the 1st page
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15:35<jupe>interbird: thanks, but i need an ISO for the installer
15:36<petemc>jupe: i think there are blu ray images already, if thats what you're after
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15:36<interbird>jupe: You think All Of Debian fit's on 1 iso ?
15:36<jupe>petemc: cool, have link?
15:36<beer>I have tried a lot of kubuntu and everytime something is broken/bad. Like hardware that workd in the prio releas has stop working ets, slow compared to debian, to early adoption of things that even the devs say it is not ready ets. I do not know if it is a buntu think og a kubuntu problem
15:37<jupe>interbird: sure, 1 giant ISO on a USB drive = portable installation medium
15:37<petemc>jupe: no, but id imagine they're easily found, they arent hidden
15:37<cheal>jbutera, dr|z3d, beer: please stick to topic
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15:38<PXL> :p
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15:38<interbird>jupe: with a select box to install just cmdline and/or gui or blast 20G from the stick to the install-disk? Just read, you might get ideas... :-)
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15:40<jupe>interbird: i've been up and down; didn't find what i need
15:40<petemc>jupe: you can download blu ray images with jigdo
15:40<jupe>petemc: apparently only for lenny; my project requires etch :(
15:41<jupe>thx for link, tho
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16:00<interbird>Well, I agree needs a true facelift; It's not of this time anymore and the page is badly designed for "how people browse these days". There should be less topics on the left and inline links linking to pages completely replacing the master-page could be confusing to newcomers. Also the "GNU-style" might be clear to us "old-meat-dudes" but less attracting to new visitors; But this is all just my opinion...
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16:02<privatix>i've a small question, i'm using > torify bash to use tor for every application, is this safe enough or would someone suggest iptables?
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16:03<interbird>when can one ever be safe enough ?
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16:04<privatix>interbird, i thought cause suidroot
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16:05<interbird>privatix: sure, but do you realy think someone is going to tell you your method is "safe-enough" ?
16:06<blueldr137>I'm trying to install compiz... how do I edit the xorg.conf file?
16:06<privatix>interbird, i thought that there is something wrong with my plan
16:07<interbird>sudo nano /etc/X11/xorg.conf
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16:07<blueldr137>thanks interbird
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16:09<interbird>privatix: sure there is... (is all software bug-free?) ; What i mean to say is: don't ask if your plan is good;nobody will confirm; ask i anyone might see flaws; some might respond. Catch my "negative logic" on it ?
16:10<privatix>interbird, ok, you're right
16:10<interbird>not really, just...
16:11<interbird>(not wrong :-)
16:11<privatix>thx to our goverment ... now i have to solve problems...
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16:12<interbird>life's a bitch...
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16:18<interbird>blueldr137: Running compiz has not much to do with xorg.conf. If you are running Gnome then Compiz will store it's settings in gconf. If running Gnome with Compiz you might want to use fusion-icon; a gnome-applet where you can set compiz-settings and change window-managers...
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16:21<_sd>Hello! I need to accept netflows from remote router which is placed somewhere in the I-net. It's known, netflow employs UDP. My netflow collector server is placed inside my local network which is firewalled from outside world. How can I accomplish this task. Just dumb port forwarding is not acceptable for udp/netflow as it's just open port, no authorisation, so anybody can connect to it to pump some shit to collector....
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16:22<bja>_sd: dump port forwarding plus a little iptables rule
16:23<_sd>bja: you meant to set up iptables to accept connections only say from ?
16:24<SQlvpapir_>anyone had crazy playback issues in unstable recently? like it would play too fast/skip etc. both for audio and video - in every player I tried
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16:24<_sd>bja: well, the idea is simple and clear, thanks
16:26<interbird>_sd: udp cannot be routed over internet unless you use a tunnel or some other point-2-point connection encapsulating udp in a routable protocol.
16:27<jupe>udp is routable because it sits on top of ip
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16:28<jupe>it's no less routable than tcp
16:28<_sd>interbird: thank you.
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16:29<interbird>jupe: udp is connectionless, blocked by routers and can only "ride" on the back of some other routable protocol
16:29<_sd>jupe: hmm. I need to go for some readings. Some links to usefull documentation would be appreciated...
16:30<jupe>interbird: udp works at the transport layer; it sits on ip (the routing layer), therefore is routable (same as tcp)
16:30<_sd>Guys, well the remote side is just dumb router which supports cisco's netflow 5 protocol...
16:30<interbird>_sd: for starters:
16:30<bja>_sd: yes simple as that, thats how you filter sometines dns lookups
16:30<jupe>_sd: bja's advice was good: iptables filter to port forward UDP packets coming only from your server
16:31<interbird>jupe: udp does not sit on tcpip and is connectionless; routers will not let it through, try it yourself
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16:31<_sd>well, btw DNS port 53 using both TCP and UDP. At our's firewall it's configured to forward both protos inside LAN to the server...
16:32<jupe>interbird: udp sits ontop of ip; tcp also sits on top of ip; routers don't care either way (of course you can firewall anything you want)
16:32<tadej>okay I have had it. help me compile this thing ... I have to manually edit the makefile so what do I have to specify as a SRCDIR string?
16:32<tadej>I have headers and source install
16:33<tadej>also the build package
16:34<dpkg>The enter key is not a substitute for punctuation. Hitting enter unnecessarily makes it difficult to follow what you are saying. Consider using ',', '. ', ';', '...', '---', or ':' instead. If you hit enter too often, you will be autokicked by debhelper for flooding the channel.
16:35<interbird>jupe: between you and me are public routers that will not forward udp as it is *connectionless* and blocked as a protocol on i-net routers; Otherwise we would have no problem setting-up a remote X-session using XDMCP
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16:35<interbird>Any other way is by tunnel
16:35<jupe>interbird: i assure you that udp's "connectionless" methods have nothing to do with its routability
16:35<jupe>routers will forward UDP just as easily as they forward TCP
16:36<jupe>no difference
16:36<jupe>think of it as tcp-lite
16:37<jupe>interbird: maybe you're thinking of ARP or some other non-routable protocol?
16:37<interbird>"Routability" in this context is not a "property" of the protocol; it's a property of the "medium".
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16:37<jonatthelinuxexperiment>Guys, hate to break in on something that I don't know a whole lot about, but DNS is a UDP protocol - If UDP couldn't be routed, then how would DNS function?
16:37<jupe>interbird: if you fire up tcpdump and look at a UDP datagram (any one will do), you will see that it sits on an IP packet -- that means it has a src and dst IP address, and port numbers
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16:38<bja>interbird: "Common network applications that use UDP include: the Domain Name System (DNS), streaming media applications such as IPTV, Voice over IP (VoIP), Trivial File Transfer Protocol (TFTP) and many online games."
16:38<jonatthelinuxexperiment>I dont mean to call anybody a liar here, but i have to say that I agree with jupe, unless I'm misunderstanding the issue
16:38<jupe>DNS can use both tcp and udp, but udp is the preferred method ... and absolutely it's routed across networks
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16:38<jonatthelinuxexperiment>Figured that I hadn't forgotten my networking course that fast...
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16:39<knoppix__>jemand da?
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16:39<dpkg>deutschsprachige Hilfe bekommt ihr in (auf, oder - German speaking users please go to (on, or
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16:40<locklace>wait, what
16:40<locklace>!smack interbird
16:40*dpkg smacks interbird upside the head.
16:40<rjent>how do I enable serial console output?
16:40<dpkg>deutschsprachige Hilfe bekommt ihr in (auf, oder - German speaking users please go to (on, or
16:40<interbird>bja: True, where UDP is *encapsulated* in another non-connectionless protocol; I agree with that in the context you say.
16:40<xeon-enouf>rjent: serialconsole howto for starters
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16:41<locklace>interbird: what the hell are you talking about
16:41<bja>locklace: can you elaborate on that
16:42<interbird>locklace: you first smack and then ask?
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16:42<jupe>interbird: if you have netcat installed, run this: nc -u 54321
16:42-!-dinomite [] has joined #debian
16:42<jupe>then type something and hit enter
16:42<jupe>i will tell you what you typed
16:42<jupe>because UDP is routed :)
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16:43<interbird>UDP is *not* routed; it is *on-top-of*...
16:43<xeon-enouf>here we go
16:43<jupe>so is tcp, no difference
16:43<jupe>IP is the routable protocol
16:43<xeon-enouf>interbird: are you thinking of NetBIOS, hehe
16:43<jonatthelinuxexperiment>this is an absurd argument...
16:44<bja>interbird: you can make a higher level protocol work with UDP, it cannot encapsulate it
16:44*themill makes interbird do UDP-over-carrier pigeon.
16:44-!-yo [] has quit []
16:44<bja>!lart interbird
16:44*dpkg --purges interbird
16:44<jupe>interbird: run the nc command, i'll bet you an internet dollar that i see it at my server :)
16:44-!-crib [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:44<interbird>so is IPX and so-not is NETBIOS; learn your protocol-stuff and see that UDP is like NETBIOS in that context
16:44-!-uva [] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
16:44<xeon-enouf>in soviet russia carrier pigeon UDP's YOU!
16:45<themill>interbird: ffs... is this actually helping anyone?
16:45<jupe>lol no, udp is not anything like netbios
16:45<SQlvpapir_>this is getting stupid
16:45-!-SQlvpapir_ [~teis@] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
16:45<locklace>udp is like netbios? is this a full moon?
16:45*themill points towards #debian-offtopic
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16:46<xeon-enouf>sometimes stupid shit is .. fun .. just look at JackAss (the movie) :-p
16:46<rjent>xeon-enouf: Thanks.
16:47<jonatthelinuxexperiment>I'd pay good money to receive a debian iso delivered by udp-over-carrier-pigeon
16:48<themill>jonatthelinuxexperiment: ask jpinx-eeepc, he gets all his network data via carrier pigeon
16:48<K0JIbKA>to what place?
16:48-!-chomwitt [] has joined #debian
16:48<jonatthelinuxexperiment>any place will do. I'd travel for such an honour
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16:49<interbird>me uploading debian 7 to jonatthelinuxexperiment using udp; oops...
16:50<jonatthelinuxexperiment>interbird: I didn't get it, it wouldn't route...
16:51<interbird>shit, why is that ?
16:51<xeon-enouf>i'd like to see some pterodachtyls(sp?) drop me of some Knights of Ni and a shrubbery .. and possiblu a hedgerow
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16:52<interbird>what is a hedgerow? (and now don't throw that against me because i say upd needs a carrier protocol)
16:53<jonatthelinuxexperiment>i think it has something to do with the english...
16:53<interbird>possibly, all wars start by misunderstanding... :-(
16:53<themill>obscure Monty Python references....
16:53<jonatthelinuxexperiment>i'm Canadian, so I wouldn't know
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16:54<interbird>i'm duch so i know more; who knows most ?
16:55<bzed>at least the dutch, they know how to spell their country
16:55<interbird>i'm off-shore, that's why there is no 't'
16:56-!-blackxored [~adrian@] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
16:56<interbird>also, the language is 'dutch' and the country is called holland; by who cares about that ? :-)
16:58<interbird>anyway... let's get ot again otherwise...
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17:01<interbird>i lost that debian-# where one can go in times of need; anyone can tell me ?
17:02<themill>!topicsmite interbird
17:02<dpkg>And the wrath of /TOPIC descended with terrible fury upon interbird. And all the people marveled, saying, Behold, we too should read the /TOPIC, lest we be stricken. And all the people read the /TOPIC, and went away edified.
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17:03<interbird>i knew you would answer and put me out of my misery themill, thx
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17:06<jonatthelinuxexperiment>Anyhow guys, before I head off to work, just a little bit of shameless self-promotion that actually is on topic. We've been blogging about using Linux over at for just over a month now, and could use some people who actually know what they're talking about to check us out. Drop by sometime for a good read, or just to laugh at the noobs.
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17:18<blueldr137>I'm trying to install compiz... I'm editing the xorg.conf file.. and It say's I need to add 'Option "AIGLX" "on"' under 'Server Layout', but I can't find 'Server Layout'???
17:18<blueldr137>in the xorg.conf file..
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17:18<interbird>Does your compiz run or not ?
17:19<blueldr137>I haven't tried it yet
17:20<blueldr137>I added everything else
17:20<blueldr137>to the xorg.conf file
17:20<interbird>Are you in a GUI (like Gnome or KDE), what GUI do you want compiz to work in ?
17:21<blueldr137>im using Gnome
17:21<interbird>Are you in Gnome now ?
17:21-!-mcmat [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
17:21<interbird>Open a terminal
17:21-!-drakeman [] has quit [Quit: Saliendo]
17:22<blueldr137>im in a terminal now editing the xorg.conf file
17:22<blueldr137>should I open a new terminal?
17:23<interbird>yes, or leave the editor editing xorg.conf with no changes saved
17:23<blueldr137>ok, I'm ready. Thanks for helping me
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17:24<interbird>what does whoami say when you type that command in the terminal? (it shows the user you are currently loged-in under)
17:25<interbird>what does uname -a say ?
17:25<interbird>(you can paste the line here) (it will let us know your kernel-version)
17:25<blueldr137>Linux grahamcomp 2.6.26-2-amd64 #1 SMP Wed Aug 19 22:33:18 UTC 2009 x86_64 GNU/Linux
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17:27-!-mode/#debian [+l 393] by debhelper
17:27<interbird>ok, does ps -ef | grep metacity show a line with a process-number? Otherwise, does ps -ef|grep compiz show any? (this show what window-manager you are running)
17:28<blueldr137>graham 3412 3334 0 15:29 ? 00:00:12 /usr/bin/metacity --sm-client-id=default0
17:28<blueldr137>graham 4904 4858 0 17:28 pts/0 00:00:00 grep metacity
17:29<blueldr137>and 'ps -ef|grep compiz' shows: graham 4911 4858 0 17:29 pts/0 00:00:00 grep compiz
17:30<interbird>ok, you are running metacity and not compiz; so we will try to get compiz running but this may not work leaving you with no window-manager at all; just follow my lead please...
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17:30<blueldr137>lol ok
17:30<interbird>are you still in the terminal ?
17:30<interbird>try this:
17:32<interbird>compiz --replace & this could get nasty if compiz will not start, leaving you with windown with no borders, but then we know compiz does not work; just try to keep te terminal open; try the command please...
17:33<blueldr137>ok I still have borders
17:33<blueldr137>It says this though:
17:33<blueldr137>/usr/bin/compiz.real (core) - Fatal: No GLXFBConfig for default depth, this isn't going to work.
17:33<blueldr137>/usr/bin/compiz.real (core) - Error: Failed to manage screen: 0
17:33<blueldr137>/usr/bin/compiz.real (core) - Fatal: No manageable screens found on display :0.0
17:34<interbird>ahhh, ok
17:35<interbird>can you pastebin your /etc/X11/ and the output of lspci ?
17:35<dpkg>Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use: or for pics. Use for large files (think tar.gz) up to 100MB. Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>.
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17:37<blueldr137>do you mean /etc/X11/xorg.conf?
17:37<interbird>(sorry about mixed name)
17:37<blueldr137>:) thats ok
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17:40<interbird>blueldr137: so, i expect a link to a pastebin where i can see the contents of your xorg.conf and the output of lspci, ok ?
17:41<blueldr137>ok. I working on it. lol
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17:41<blueldr137>thanks for helping me again
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17:42<interbird>will send the bill later...
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17:42<blueldr137>lol :(
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17:45<blueldr137>there is the link
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17:47<blueldr137>I already installed the compiz packages. Just so you know. :P
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17:48<interbird>blueldr137: ok, i said eralier that xorg.con does not matter, but i could be wrong since you are using a :VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc RV530 [Radeon X1600]
17:49<blueldr137>do I have to manually edit the xorg.conf file then?
17:49<interbird>blueldr137: I must admit i am unfamiliar with this card but i know there might be open-source and closed-source drivers that can work with it
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17:50<blueldr137>I think ATI has linux drivers should I install those?
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17:51<interbird>did you already or not ?
17:51<blueldr137>no I haven't yet
17:51<blueldr137>I just recently installed debian... I wasn't sure if debian would install my graphics drivers automatically
17:51<interbird>let me look for a moment; be right back...
17:52<blueldr137>im downloading the ATI drivers now
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17:54<interbird>you could install those but they are closed-sourse; i know there are open-source drivers for the ati-x...800; closed source drivers are a pain most of the time; let me see if there are any open-source drivers for your type of card...
17:55<blueldr137>ok thanks
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17:56<blueldr137>hi santoshpbk
17:57<dpkg>[radeon] A brand of graphic processing units by ATI ( For chipsets prior to R600 (ie. models up to and including the X1950), use the "radeon" xorg driver and optionally install 'libgl1-mesa-dri' for 3D acceleration. Alternatively, the non-free <fglrx> driver can be used (recent chipsets, usually better 3D performance/features). See also <radeonhd>. #radeon on freenode.
17:58<blueldr137>thanks adb
17:58-!-SQlvpapir_ is now known as SQlvpapir
17:58<jbutera>how can i get my i950 graphics to work not-crappily?
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17:58<atta>hi there. :P could someone help me on that one? well, i have a module to install, and i have just the sources for it. i have done the install once, with make, and then cp (to copy it do /lib/modules), but now i want to install it making a .deb. someone could help me?
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18:00<adb> /msg dpkg m-a
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18:01<interbird>blueldr137: The advice adb gave looks good.
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18:02<blueldr137>ok. I will look into installing that 'radeon' xorg driver, and later I will try to get compiz to work. lol
18:02<blueldr137>I have to go now though... :(
18:03<interbird>succ7 !
18:03<blueldr137>Thanks for helping me interbird. :)
18:03<blueldr137>I'll be back on in a couple of hours.. lol :)
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18:07<interbird>"One day, hardware will also be open and maintained like some software is now; untill that day we will 'blob-along', I guess"
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18:15<interbird>Hai, Omni
18:16<Omni>I'm planning on installing debian to a CompactFlash which is connected to a compactflash -> ide converter
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18:16<Omni>I have the idea that it is unwise to make a /swap
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18:16<Omni>since that will cause many write cycles to occur
18:17<Omni>will debian work well enough on such a setup?
18:17<interbird>Dunno, depends on storage/ram size
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18:17<Omni>I haven't bought any ram yet
18:17<Omni>how much would you reccommend
18:17<Omni>it's going to be a tiny server
18:18<adb>1 GB
18:18<interbird>Server on CompactFlash ?
18:18<Omni>it's going to sit under my bed
18:18<Omni>and will be 100% quiet
18:19<interbird>It will be, after a while... :-)
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18:19<Omni>what do you mean: after a while?
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18:22<Omni>well and another question: the cpu is a 550mhz VIA C3
18:22<Omni>will it be enough?
18:22<interbird>well, will it ?
18:22<interbird>you tell us
18:23<Omni>I don't know, it meets the minimum
18:23<interbird>a debian server needs 500mb harddisk and 64mb ram; but you bought no ram, so it will be silent i guess...
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18:24<interbird>you can tune with busybox and ramdisks...
18:25<interbird>so, all-in-all, sounds good !
18:25<interbird>please let us know you findings please !
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18:26<adb>interbird, your proposed config is for a print server i guess ..
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18:27<valdyn>that would be a damn fragile print server
18:27<interbird>adb: nope, i could squeeze samba inthere too, but no ldap or databases...
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18:28<Omni>it's more a sort of experiment
18:29<adb>Omni, add a maximum ram that that hardware may support
18:29-!-anton [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:29<adb> (now a days ram is silent too)
18:29<Omni>Hehe I think the max ram size is going to have to do more with my wallet than with the hardware grin
18:30*Omni grins
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18:30<Omni>and what I've got lying around...
18:30<interbird>bigger the wallet the more silent you mean :-)
18:30<Omni>hehe no let me explain:
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18:31<Omni>I bought this:
18:31<interbird>seriously: you could squeeze a lot in a tiny system with debian; no doubt about that
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18:31<valdyn>Omni: you should use swap
18:31<Omni>why's that?
18:32<interbird>404 - not found
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18:32<valdyn>Omni: there will be plenty of stuff in memory that will hardly ever be used
18:32-!-hever [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:32<valdyn>Omni: you can set swappiness very low to reduce swaps
18:32-!-dvs [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
18:33<interbird>not found
18:33<Omni>valdyn aha I didn't know I could influence that
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18:33<Omni>interbird weird it's the direct link. maybe this one?
18:33-!-chitchat [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:34<interbird>Breaks after PC_(
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18:35<Omni>valdyn any suggestions on what I might google to find info on that?
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18:36<adb>interbird, ends in // Mini_PC
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18:37-!-mode/#debian [+l 383] by debhelper
18:37*themill wonders if it's interbird's irc client, interbird's browser or interbird that's broken
18:37<interbird>adb: on my xchat too; cannot follow link as given and unwilling to "repair"; blame it on the boogie
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18:39<interbird>that works; still not know if it's my irc client or themills correct (for me) link
18:40<VelvetElvis>Howdy. I just did an aptitude upgrade and it gave me this:
18:40<VelvetElvis>Setting up sysv-rc (2.87dsf-6) ...
18:40<themill>interbird: sounds like xchat has a dodgy regexp for identifying URLs
18:40<VelvetElvis>info: Checking if it is safe to convert to dependency based boot.
18:40<VelvetElvis>error: Unable to migrate to dependency based boot sequencing.
18:40<VelvetElvis>error: Problems detected: package timidity left obsolete init.d script behind, package vsftpd removed but not purged
18:40<themill>!stop pasting VelvetElvis
18:40<dpkg>VelvetElvis: We don't defecate on your keyboard. Please don't paste in our channel. /msg dpkg paste
18:41<VelvetElvis>sorry, I thought 4 lines would be OK
18:41<interbird>Omni: Looks nice, but there are more of this devices; i assume you already got this one...
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18:42<VelvetElvis>anyway I purged timidy and vsftpd and did dpkg-reconfigure sysv-rc and got the same error messages
18:42<Omni>well thanks for the help, I'll see if I can get the hardware this weekend and then set it up next week
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18:43<VelvetElvis>how can I tell if I'm even in a stable state to reboot?
18:44<interbird>themill: possibly bad regex evaluation; first time i encountered this; thx for correct link
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18:45<adb>VelvetElvis, running lenny ?
18:46<interbird>define "stable state" please
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18:46<VelvetElvis>squeeze, I upgrade every few days
18:47<adb>on a server ?
18:47<VelvetElvis>it just upgraded to the dependancy based boot stuff when it threw those errors.
18:47<interbird>squeeze is "what is going to be stable later", so, you cannot expect it to be stable now...
18:48<VelvetElvis>desktop. I had vsftpd installed just for testing
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18:48<VelvetElvis>yeah, I know. I ran sid for years.
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18:49<VelvetElvis>I'm just asking if anyone knows if this error means my system has been left in an unbootable state
18:50<interbird>it just surpirises me how many people think that debian is squeeze and that that is stable in the way they want...
18:50<themill>VelvetElvis: are those initscripts still there?
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18:51<VelvetElvis>in /etc/init.d?
18:51<Eric_xtc>any BSD users?
18:51<VelvetElvis>yeah, just kill 'em?
18:52<themill>VelvetElvis: or move them out of the way just in case... also look in /etc/rc?.d/
18:52<interbird>BSD 8.0 RC1 but still evaluating...
18:52<Eric_xtc>interbird: your using BSD?
18:52<themill>Eric_xtc: wrong channel....
18:52<Eric_xtc>interbird: read my message
18:53<VelvetElvis>ok, I'll try that and reconfigure
18:53<VelvetElvis>thanks, I probobly should have figured that out on my own
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18:54<interbird>Eric_xtc: sorry, which one? About any BSD-users? I'm not on BSD right now.
18:55<adb>interbird, ot!
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18:56<VelvetElvis>cool, it reconfigured fine this time. thanks again
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19:06*interbird is getting quite irritated by this "ot-markings" -- better would be to directly shut-up some trolls on this channel right-away when they arrive
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19:14<adb>!comfort interbird
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19:14<dpkg>There, there, interbird. It's OK. I'm here for you.
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19:15<chetic>Just installed Debian and I'm having trouble with the wifi. It's getting a really bad signal and I'm only getting about 1mbit or so (on a 54mbit card)
19:15<chetic>In Windows however I get a great signal
19:16<chetic>Anybody have an idea?
19:16<chetic>Why my wifi connection is terrible in debian
19:17-!-mode/#debian [+l 375] by debhelper
19:17<bja>The quality of the driver varies according to the card you have, the more openess of the manufacturer toward independent developers (open source comunity) the better the driver is.
19:17<abrotman>chetic: which wifi card?
19:17*dpkg leans back and lights up a cigar
19:18<interbird>no, dpkg... Lite up a sigar for me, u asshole :-)
19:18<Eric_xtc>cuz you don't know how to prosses it
19:18<Eric_xtc>process it
19:19<chetic>abrotman, it's a canyon, with rt2510
19:20<chetic>canyon cn-wf511
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19:23<dpkg>The Ralink RT2500 PCI chipset (RT2500/RT2560) is supported by the next-generation driver (rt2500pci), included in mainline kernels since 2.6.24. Does not require firmware from userspace. For driver installation on Etch systems, see
19:23<chealer>chetic: rt2510? what's the chipset?
19:23<chetic>sorry I guess it's rt2500
19:23<chetic>the chipset I mean
19:24<abrotman>i'd guess it's the same as above .. you probably need the firmware
19:24<abrotman>interbird: please go play somewhere else
19:25<chetic>what? change firmware? but the card works great in windows
19:25<chetic>has to be a driver issue, right?
19:25<interbird>abrotman: sorry, you reply to... ?
19:25<abrotman>oh .. does not require .. ignore me
19:25<themill>interbird: go to bed...
19:26<abrotman>chetic: this is lenny or squeeze? uname -a ?
19:26<bja>chetic: afaik firmware is loaded into all wifi cards the moment they are needed
19:26<abrotman>don't know if i'd say "all"
19:26<chetic>abrotman, uh, Linux debian 2.6.26-2-686 #1 SMP Wed Aug 19 06:06:52 UTC 2009 i686 GNU/Linux
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19:27<bja>ok, i over generalized, all the cards i've ever used
19:28<chetic>abrotman, I guess it's lenny? 5.x
19:28<chealer>chetic: so you're using the rt2500pci driver or what?
19:29<chetic>I have no idea how to check
19:29<interbird>themill,abrotman: love you too
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19:31<abrotman>chetic: lsmod | grep 2500
19:31<chetic>oh yes, says rt2500pci plenty of times there
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19:32<chetic>I guess I'll try to try the other two drivers
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19:48<linuxguy>Hi Ive just ibnstalled lenny and updated everything Im using a 5512mb ati 9500 card.....i have the res i want but Im getting jumpy screensavers any helpies to correct this would be great thanks
19:50<interbird>5512mb or 512mb? both are plausible
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19:50<dr|z3d>Neither are. 512MB is.
19:50<linuxguy>interbird: sorry 512mb
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19:52<linuxguy>also whats that irc chat programm looks like quasell or soething pls
19:54<dr|z3d>linuxguy: Have you installed ATI's prorietary drivers?
19:54-!-dvs [] has joined #debian
19:54<dr|z3d>If not, you likely have 3d disabled in hardware, which would cause the general rubbishness you're describing.
19:54<leper>who can help me to config the aircrack, i have a broadcom 06:00.0 Network controller [0280]: Broadcom Corporation BCM4312 802.11b/g [14e4:4315] (rev 01)
19:55<dr|z3d>Or rather, not enabled in the generic drivers.
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19:58<linuxguy>dr|z3d: yes from their site.........Ive been googling how to correct this problem but cant find out much to help me with debian lenny
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19:58<dpkg>To use an ATI graphics card with Debian, ask me about <fglrx>, <radeon> and <radeonhd>. See also <radeon vs radeonhd>. Installing proprietary drivers from (i.e. with the ATI Driver Installer) is not supported in #debian, please go to #ati (
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19:59<adb>leper, /msg dpkg aircrack
19:59<chealer>leper: just ask your question
20:00<linuxguy>hhmm ok so im being told no support for the ati driver? far as i know im using the fglix driver
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20:02<interbird>fglrx is the closed one; radeon is the open one; so, yes, a little incentive is to use the open (radeon) one...
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20:06<leper>chealer i can make the aircrack recognize my wireless
20:06<leper>it don't go to monitor mode
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20:12<caca>phpmyadmin...can anybody help-me?
20:13<dpkg>Este canal é apenas em inglês. Por favor, use #debian-br (/j #debian-br) para ajuda em portugues.
20:14<caca>phpmyadmin...can anybody help-me?
20:14<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
20:14<linuxguy>interbird: ok so how do i use the radeon one pls thanks
20:15<caca>i use ubuntu and instaled apache, myslq and phpmyadmin...
20:15<dpkg>Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian, and it is unlikely to live up to Debian's standards (see <Debian policy>). Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu ( instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian>.
20:15<caca>but i cant log in phpmyadmin
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20:17<abrotman>caca: go ask #ubuntu on
20:17<interbird>linuxguy: problem is, that if you already installed the fglrx-driver it's hard to go back to the radeon-driver. The fglrx driver installs lot's of stuff that clashes with the X/radeon situation. So, sorry, the short answer is: cannot help you over IRC.
20:17<abrotman>it depends how he installed the fglrx driver
20:18<interbird>like with chmodding +x the bin and running it as root ? is there any other way ?
20:19<interbird>like how abrotman?
20:19<abrotman>shouldn't you be in bed?
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20:20<themill>dpkg: tell interbird about fglrx one-liner
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20:22<tech13>in Lenny, how do I get mplayer to block power management from turning off the monitor?
20:22<Wall975>please need help
20:22<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
20:22<iccy>does the checkbox in the options screen not work?
20:23<tech13>using xfce, and running mplayer from a terminal. Where is the checkbox?
20:23<linuxguy>interbird: i was hoping i could upgrade to kde 4.3.1 is this not possible now.....or will that solve the graphics problem?
20:23<Wall975>im a novice in linux
20:23<abrotman>linuxguy: has nothing to do with it
20:24<leper>welcome Wall975
20:24<linuxguy>abrotman: so how can i solve the graphics prob pls?
20:24<interbird>themill: Yes, I know this line and it does not work (all-the-time). And I tell you that from experience. Truth is I forgot to use it the last times I encountered this problem, so I will try it again. Thanks for remembering this one; it's not a 'solid-solution' though.
20:24<themill>interbird: wfm
20:25<abrotman>linuxguy: what is the problem you're having? what is your video card?
20:25<Wall975>trying to create a script that will ask someone to enter his name.but that person exist in a file that i have already created
20:25<themill>interbird: and if you do install the driver that way, removing it to then use radeon is trivial.
20:25<Wall975>the script should just terminate.but if not ,it should save that person name in the file
20:26<linuxguy>abrotman: its an ati 9500 card.......i get the res i need but very jumpy screensavers and no 3 d accelaration
20:27<abrotman>linuxguy: does the binary fglrx have an uninstall option ?
20:27<linuxguy>abrotman: let me see
20:28<icebrain>Wall975: I can't help you, but try #bash and ask them :)
20:28<tech13>Wall975, what language are you trying to use?
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20:29<linuxguy>abrotman: it looks like in super user mode i can click on boxes and disable it
20:29<interbird>themill: removing fglrx is not trival; atleast not on an XR800; fglrx point a lot of stuff elsewhere (libs) and is **very persistant** in configuration.
20:29<themill>interbird: use the debian packages.
20:30<abrotman>linuxguy: uninstall it .. not disable it
20:31<interbird>themill: yeah, like i have to tried every angle.
20:32*abrotman wonders why themill is trying to have an actual conversation with someone that clearly can't speak english
20:34*interbird wonders why abrotman is so hostile
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20:43<linuxguy>abrotman: ok how do i uninstall it pls.....i cant see an uninstaller
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20:43<abrotman>linuxguy: i don't use fglrx .. i was asking you if it has an uninstall optoin
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20:43<interbird>the .bin has options; one of them is --uninstall (or so)
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20:44<linuxguy>abrotman: yes i know i cant see an there an add /remove software in debian?
20:44<vinicius>how can i send an email with an earlier date?
20:44<abrotman>linuxguy: not for software that you don't 'add' using that interface
20:45<Wall975>im using bash
20:45<interbird>linuxguy: tried the .bin with the --uninstall option ???
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20:48<linuxguy>ok ive just done a look at the ati screen its an old card....going back 4-5 yrs and only 128mb on board......I have later nvidia card would this work better...still again 128mb fx5200
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20:51<interbird>fine, what driver is loaded ?
20:51<bja>vinicius: you can set up you smtp to an earlier date, but the recieving edge will also time stamp you email making whatever changes you make useless
20:53<vinicius>bja, i remember receiving spam mail on later dates
20:53<vinicius>later i mean... tomorrow or something (dont know it in english) =)
20:54<bja>but your mail client timestamps the email recieved, so any other date is considered a mistake
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20:54<linuxguy>interbird: if i installed the nvidia card would i need to re-install debian?..or can i get the card to work from the prompt?
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20:54<abrotman>linuxguy: do you even know which driver X is trying to use ?
20:55<vinicius>bja, i thought that
20:55<vinicius>bja, ok... thanks...
20:57<adb>Error : scsi 2:0:0:0: Device offlined - not ready after error recovery , on a usb hard , ~5 sec after plugging in , any ideas ?
20:57<interbird>linuxguy: can you put the output of lsmod and cat /etc/X11/xorg.conf on a pastebin ?
20:57<dpkg>Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use: or for pics. Use for large files (think tar.gz) up to 100MB. Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>.
20:58<bja>adb: your usb stick is hosed
20:58<linuxguy>abrotman: yes its the fglrx one ive looked at the xorg frile using kate........but if the nvidia card will work better I can swap the card
20:59<abrotman>the config or log ?
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21:00<linuxguy>abrotman: the xorg.conf file
21:01<adb>bja, it's a hard disk .. and it is ok on a IDE
21:01<abrotman>linuxguy: so change it to 'radeon' instead of 'fglrx'
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21:03<interbird>aint gonna work...
21:03-!-jegc [~jegc@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
21:03<interbird>is not going to work
21:03<abrotman>interbird: so fix it then ...
21:04<linuxguy>oh ok.........just done i log out/in and see what happens?
21:04<abrotman>linuxguy: yes
21:05<interbird>no X, i guess
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21:14<linuxguy>abrotman: ok here goes
21:14<linuxguy>abrotman: and thanks for your helps
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21:15<interbird>doesn't seem to work yet
21:15<bja>adb: check that the housing is working properly, only time i had that error was with a hosed stick
21:15<abrotman>interbird: if you're not going to try to help, just be quiet
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21:16<bja>Did some told him how to set up irssi or ircci in case he had no X?
21:16<abrotman>one would think he'd just change the file back
21:16<interbird>abrotman: don't silence me, you just fucked up and you know it
21:17<abrotman>interbird: seriously, go away. you're not helpful to anyone in the slightest bit.
21:17<abrotman>thought so ..
21:19<interbird>let's analyse abrotman: what you say and i suggest; what you accomplished is rebooting him on a tekst-screen and he was too tired to ask for you again; he is not helped. point.
21:19<abrotman>interbird: please just go away
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21:22<adb>bja, very possible , thx
21:22<vr>I've got a freshly installed system and didn't use tasksel to add all the default stuff... I've installed opebox and xserver-xorg and can 'startx' to get into X... I've also installed the tint2 package but I don't know how to make the tint2 panel come up (launching tint2 from xterm does nothing) advice?
21:22<interbird>abrotman: can we move on please ?
21:22<bja>adb: np
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21:26<abrotman>vr: ~/.xsession .. like "#!/bin/sh\ntint2 &" .. the \n is a newline/enter
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21:28<linuxguy>abrotman: working fine now with the radeon driver but i cheated :)
21:29<vr>abrotman: creating that file causes X not to start?
21:29<linuxguy>yes had the smxi script installed got rid of the ati driver and installed the debian one and it worked 1st time
21:29<vr>I thought it was my syntax so I deleted .xsession and then 'touch .xsession' and it does same
21:30<abrotman>vr: you may have to put your window manager in there too .. depends on the WM IIRC
21:30<abrotman>linuxguy: but it's all good now ?
21:31<bja>vr: you have to source /etc/X11/Xsession on your .xsession
21:32<vr>bja: source?
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21:33<bja>this line should do it ". /etc/X11/Xsession" the little dot at the beginning tells the script to also run the file, that is called sourcing
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21:39<vr>hrm... well with all 3 of those lines in .xsession X just hangs at a blank screen
21:41<interbird>did you check the log at /var/log/Xorg.0.log to see where it stiffles ?
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21:44<linuxguy>abrotman: yes all good now screensavers working....compiz thing i dont like is the screen like 1280x1024 or something like that cos the screen looks a bit widescreen now
21:45<abrotman>linuxguy: xrandr might help
21:46<linuxguy>abrotman: yes ive heard of that but not sure how to ussse it
21:47<abrotman>it has a beautiful man page ...
21:48<interbird>duplicate the line in xorg.conf and change the line to the values seen in xrandr, then read the manual
21:48<abrotman>uh no
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21:50<linuxguy>abrotman: you see my main probs are that im new to debian.......if i saw what to do like adding modelines etc for the ati card i can just edit the xorg.conf file and get on with it
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21:51<abrotman>you shouldn't have to anymore
21:51<vr>ok, looking at the log there is no error. It was fully starting but with zero config.
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21:52<vr>I created ~/.config/openbox/ and put tint2 & in there. Launched X and get a blank screen with a naked bottom screen panel that has a clock on it. I think I'm on my way.
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21:53<linuxguy>abrotman: ok next question for helps is can i upgrdae lenny to kde 4.3.1?
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21:54<abrotman>you should have been on lenny already ?
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21:55<linuxguy>abrotman: yes i am on lenny now but its using the kde 3.5.10 kernel ive been told i can upgrade adding some deb files to the sources.lst ?
21:55<abrotman>!tell linuxguy about kde4
21:55<interbird>no, kde 4.3.1 does not run on lenny
21:56<interbird>(not without...)
21:57<abrotman>linuxguy: and i think that still only gets you kde4.2
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22:01<interbird>isn't whatever kde version would run on debian a bit ot? as kde is just a gui? isn't there a # for that? i mean...
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22:01-!-mode/#debian [+o abrotman] by ChanServ
22:02-!-mode/#debian [+b *!*] by abrotman
22:02-!-mode/#debian [-o abrotman] by abrotman
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22:03<linuxguy>abrotman: it says on some other sites ive looked at that its possible to upgrade using a deb from kubuntu !
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22:04<bombadil_>hi, a moment ago my OS X Leopard machine's shares were visible under "network" but now they won't appear anymore
22:04<abrotman>linuxguy: i personally wouldn't try it, but it's not my machine.
22:04<bombadil_>any idea as to why?
22:05<abrotman>linuxguy: that said, i can't stop you from doing it
22:05<bombadil_>i am able to mount my debian home folder on OS X no problem
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22:07<linuxguy>abrotman: yes i know..........but im thinking of doing this now.....i have more upto date pc here faster better card (a 1gb nvidia) with spare hd thinking of putting debian on that now and using this box to play around with some distros
22:08<abrotman>linuxguy: did you try asking #debian-kde
22:09<linuxguy>abrotman: thanks
22:10<abrotman>linuxguy: they did have kde4.2 packages .. squeeze has a mix of 4.2 and 4.3 you could try/test
22:10<abrotman>linuxguy: ultimately, if you want bleeding edge software, Debian may not be for you
22:10-!-mode/#debian [+o abrotman] by ChanServ
22:10<linuxguy>abrotman: yes i noticed that to
22:10-!-mode/#debian [-b *!*] by abrotman
22:11-!-mode/#debian [-o abrotman] by abrotman
22:11<vr>Bleeding happens after cutting so maybe "bleeding edge" actually is the correct reference for debian? :-)
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22:17<linuxguy>abrotman: i picked debian out of all the distros bcause it is strong well recommended and has a base that hundreds of other distros so yes its bleeding edge alright.......i can tell you i installed fedora 10 and 11 a while ago and worked well until the updates...none worked i was left with just a cursor saying that the updates werent tested enough for release which is very poor
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22:18<abrotman>okay then
22:19<linuxguy>abrotman: ive been here for about an hr or so and ive recieved help got things i wanted working without much hassle which for a newbie to debian says a like works!
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22:19<abrotman>like works ?
22:21<interbird>nice, debian is the mother of ubuntu, fedora is the child of redhat (a company) and suse is the child of jurix. Maybe you also would like some *BSD; dunno, check it out...
22:22<fancy>that is right
22:23<linuxguy>abrotman: yes works the info needed worked there was no phaffing around googe looking for stuff
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22:26<linuxguy>abrotman: i think ive found a backport thats updating to kde 4.3.1......from cough cough kubuntu\debian repo
22:26<abrotman>linuxguy: no such thing .. good luck
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22:29<linuxguy>abrotman: look theres a deb file there
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22:30<abrotman>doesn't make it fit for Debian
22:30<abrotman>linuxguy: those packages are not meant for Debian
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22:32<linuxguy>abrotman: yes i know......if they dont work at least ive tried........i am seriously thinking of putting debian onto the other pc using the better nvidia card and faster pc
22:33<abrotman>you're probably going to hose the installation
22:33<vr>I tried the latest and greatest KDE on an nVidia 8800GT / Q6600 and it severely slowed down my system. You may not be happy.
22:34<linuxguy>abrotman: hossse the installation?
22:34-!-traaf [] has joined #debian
22:34<vr>It was also unstable and froze periodically.
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22:36<interbird>debian is what you want it to be, (k)ubuntu is what it says it is for you; subtle difference but measurable...
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22:38<abrotman>linuxguy: hose/break/munge/kill/unusable
22:38<bombadil_>does anyone know how to share a folder in os x, and have it appear in the "network" folder in debian gnome?
22:40<interbird>how do you share on osx ? did you give the shared folder a name ?
22:40<bombadil_>yes the folder has a name...
22:40<bombadil_>what are you asking exactly?
22:41<abrotman>bombadil_: did you try to list shares with smbclient ?
22:41<bombadil_>no i haven't, i am using AFP with netatalk
22:41*abrotman runs away
22:42<bombadil_>is netatalk a bad idea?
22:42<interbird>gnome cifs:vfs does not use smbclient (fyi)
22:42<bombadil_>so far, i can access my debian on OS X, but not vice versa
22:42<simonrvn>bombadil_: it should work from linux to os x, but not the other way
22:42<linuxguy>abrotman: you mean debian wont work properly on anewer better faster pc?
22:42<abrotman>bombadil_: if you're trying to share access, you probably want to use CIFS/samba/smbfs .. whatever .. but netatalk is something apple created AFAIK .. it's not widely used
22:42<simonrvn>bombadil_: there used to be a kernel module that did that for linux too, but it's very old
22:43<abrotman>linuxguy: i didn't say that
22:43<bombadil_>for a little while the OS X shares were visible, i could browse the dirs and open files no problem. now they are gone ....
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22:43<bombadil_>they disappeared when i turned off file sharing in OS X and then turned it on again
22:44<linuxguy>abrotman: wel its working on an old pc now.....i quite like it that why im thinking of putting it on a faster pc
22:44<bombadil_>i've tried restarting both computers but the shares haven't come back
22:44<linuxguy>brb need to reboot
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22:44<bombadil_>i've tried restarting netatalk
22:44<blueldr137>where can I get open source drivers for my Radeon X1600 card?
22:44<bombadil_>i have my debian home dir mounted in OS X, it works perfectly
22:45<bombadil_>i just want to figure out how to reactivate the OS X shares
22:45<abrotman>blueldr137: radeon or radeonhd .. if they don't work you're up the creek
22:45<bombadil_>file sharing is set to "on" in preferences
22:46<interbird>smbclient -U% -Llocalhost should show the cifs-net assuming you are using cifs on the OSX-box; if using AppleTalk to share then install the conforming packages on the TUX-box; Using CIFS both machines can share folders.
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22:46<blueldr137>abrotman: thanks. where can I download that driver?
22:47<abrotman>aptitude install xorg ?
22:47<bombadil_>interbird: i am using AFP on OSX and Debian
22:47<blueldr137>hi interbird
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22:47<blueldr137>abrotman: "aptitude install xorg" in my terminal?
22:47<blueldr137>lol ok
22:50<interbird>bombadil_: AFP is proprieraty to Apple; it can be done but not as good as with CIFS
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22:51<blueldr137>that command is wanting to remove 2 packages "libmikmod2{u}" and "libsmpeg0{u}"?
22:51<bombadil_>interbird: currently i can access my debian machine on OS X no problem. initially i could see my OS X shares on debian as well (in the network folder in gnome) but they mysteriously disappeared. any ideas?
22:51<blueldr137>is there a way I can download a .deb file?
22:51<interbird>bombadil_: You can install Samba/CIFS on OSX and share that network with Linux/Samba/CIFS or Windows
22:52<bombadil_>interbird: ok i will try CIFS if i cannot get this working again, but i want to try to fix this first as it was working flawlessly a few minutes ago
22:54<interbird>bombadil_: Don't know what you installed on Linux, Linux has a lot of support for foreign network-protocols like Novell Netware (old-style ipx) and possibly also AppleTalk. Best is to figure-out what you are using now. CIFS is my reccommendation as that is what SAMBA3/4 use; any other protoco
22:55<interbird>l might not be supported for any time more
22:55<bombadil_>interbird: i installed "netatalk" on os x
22:55<bombadil_>interbird: basically afp for linux
22:56<interbird>bombadil_: Not te "good" way to go
22:56<interbird>bombadil_: Better is to get your OSX-box to talk cifs
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22:56<bombadil_>interbird: there is an option to share files using "SMB" in OS X, is that samba?
22:56<blueldr137>is installing radeonHD a bad idea because its experimental or is it stable enough to use?
22:57<bombadil_>interbird: would it be best then to share that way, and install samba on my debian machine?
22:58<interbird>and make the workgroups the same name and also the ip-subnet on the same segment
22:58<interbird>There is samba for OSX, google, find it and use it
22:59<bombadil_>i believe it is built into OS X Leopard
23:00<interbird>no it's not; not in the way like samba-for-osx
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23:00<jrabbit>Apple has implemented SMB well.
23:00<jrabbit>It's on par with the linux samba in my experince.
23:00<bombadil_>according to something i am reading, SMB = CIFS
23:00<interbird>not realy, but be my guest...
23:01<interbird>smb != cifs !!!
23:01<bombadil_>thanks for helping me interbird
23:01<bombadil_>what bothers me is that it was working initially then stopped :( using this AFP nonesense
23:02<bombadil_>i need to go for now, thanks again everyone
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23:03<interbird>the best way to share osx with linux or windows is to use cifs; all other (smb) protocols are "kinda-outdated".
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23:04<interbird>also make sure the "WORKGROUP" is of the same name if you don't use a login-server.
23:06<interbird>(and replicate users on each workstation if you only use workgroup-stuff; there is no "central-validator" in that case;
23:07<blueldr137>I'm editing a file using nano... how do I save the changes "ctrl+s"???
23:07<jrabbit>interbird: nfs.
23:07<blueldr137>thanks interbird
23:08<adb>ctrl-X is exit
23:08<blueldr137>oh ok lol thanks
23:09<interbird>jrabbit: actually there is no need for nfs anymore, not with the current status of smb/cifs; if you still want to use nfs you have to choose between the "kernel-version" and the "userland-version".
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23:14<interbird>The right tool for command-line modifications is: mc (Midnight Commander); In newer versions some *brain-dead* person decided to substitute the mc-editor for nano; may this guy burn under all bugs ever found in software !!
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23:19<blueldr137>could someone help me with compiz? lol I have both the "xserver-xorg-video-radeon" and "xserver-xorg-video-radeonhd" packages installed... and I edited the "/etc/X11/xorg.conf" file... but now I don't have borders around my windows and compiz isn't working... lol :(
23:20<dpkg>If you want to laugh, use heh or hah or bwahahaha. lol doesn't sound like laughter at all and makes you look like an AOL user.
23:20<interbird>compiz --replace does not work i assume ?
23:21<blueldr137>compiz -replace or compiz --replace
23:21-!-HeidiS [] has joined #debian
23:21<drakeman>interbird, are you trying to load compiz?
23:21-!-jtaji [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:22<interbird>drakeman: no, not me; i just unloaded it...
23:22<drakeman>interbird, sorry, i though... ok!
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23:22<blueldr137>lol thanks interbird now I have borders again :)
23:23<drakeman>!win blueldr137
23:23<dpkg>Congratulations, blueldr137! You have won the time-life collection of vintage AOL CDs, a set of 120!
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23:25<blueldr137>what am I doing wrong with compiz.... I have my xorg driver packages installed for my card... I edited the xorg.conf file... I add a startup command "compiz -replace" (which was of course why i didn't have borders) :P
23:25<blueldr137>could I have left something out of the xorg.conf file?
23:25<drakeman>blueldr137, you want to load compiz and it didnt load?
23:26-!-HeidiS [] has quit []
23:26<blueldr137>please :)
23:26<drakeman>blueldr137, mmm, but the problems is loading it at start? or loading it from console?
23:26<blueldr137>well I think I don't have everything in the xorg.conf file
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23:27<drakeman>blueldr137, but you dont need a lot of lines to load compiz
23:27<interbird>what does killall -u $USER do ?
23:28<blueldr137>the directions said add 'Option "AIGLX" "on"' under the 'Server Layout' section, but I didn't have a server layout section so I didn't add that part... Is that it?
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23:28<drakeman>blueldr137, thats why im asking you! what is the problem exactly
23:28<blueldr137>loading it from the console
23:28<drakeman>blueldr137, i dont have that line in my xorg. and my compiz works fine!
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23:30<drakeman>blueldr137, can you pastebin your xorg.conf
23:30<blueldr137>Interbird: thanks lol that command logged me out... :P
23:30<blueldr137>drakeman: yes give me a sec
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23:32<blueldr137>drakeman: here is the pastebin url
23:33<blueldr137>I kinda of had a feeling that command would log me out lol :P
23:33<interbird>blueldr137: Yeah, i know; i was just wondering who would do that; -- no harm, now you know that $USER is you :-)
23:34<blueldr137>serves me right for alt+F4 ing people :P
23:34<interbird>life is a bitch but oooh so beautiful :-)
23:36<drakeman>blueldr137, what is your video card?
23:36<drakeman>nvidia? ati?
23:36<interbird>pitty they disabled ctrl-alt-backspace in ubuntu because they were afraid someone might press those 3 keys by accident....
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23:41<blueldr137>im back
23:41<blueldr137>drakeman: ati x1600
23:41*interbird cga
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23:42<blueldr137>and I have the "xserver-xorg-video-radeon" and the "xserver-xorg-video-radeonhd" packages installed
23:42<interbird>bios int10h is all i need
23:42-!-jmarsden [] has joined #debian
23:43<blueldr137>interbird: what's that?
23:43<blueldr137>interbird: a bios update?
23:43<interbird>not really
23:43-!-Kalessin [] has joined #debian
23:44<interbird>sometimes a lot of cpu-power or memory is just a 'stand-in-the-way'
23:45<blueldr137>interbird: what do you mean by that? it decreases performance?
23:45<interbird>sometimes things like 'old games' are best played on 'old hardware'; i'm just melancholic here :-)
23:45<blueldr137>interbird: yes that is true
23:45<interbird>yes, something like that...
23:46<blueldr137>interbird: you could always just virtualize some older OS
23:49<interbird>I know, but nothing beats the *real thing*; no virtualbox, no vmware, no xen; Just the little Z80 on the wirewrap-board; call me corney, but thats the way it is; you know? You don't, but you will sometime... :-)
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23:49<blueldr137>lol yeah
23:49<drakeman>blueldr137, i have a question, if you run ccsm you have the option window decoration checked?
23:49-!-tuxwarrior [~tuxwarrio@] has quit [Quit: leaving]
23:49<drakeman>blueldr137, just tu make sure
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23:50<blueldr137>drakeman: i'm looking for the option
23:51<drakeman>blueldr137, is in the effects part
23:51<blueldr137>drakeman: yes it is checked
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23:51<blueldr137>drakeman: thanks for helping me
23:52<tdn>Anyone out there who still uses dialup? dhcp and pppd both want to re-write resolv.conf when you're using dialup, and this becomes aproblem when you want to preserve some nameservers in the list.
23:52<tdn>The most annoying thing is, dhclient completely _ignores_ the settings in dhclient.conf
23:52<interbird>drakeman: wm-option is sometimes fucked; it does not show the actual state; just click on the wm you want to use; this is a (longstanding) bug
23:53<drakeman>blueldr137, np, have u checked the logs for errors? when you try to load compiz --replace, you get any error in the console when loading? or checked the /var/log/ folder for errors logs?
23:53<blueldr137>no I haven't let me look
23:53<drakeman>interbird, wm?
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23:56<blueldr137>drakeman: I ran "compiz --replace" and these are the errors it shows.
23:57-!-mode/#debian [+l 357] by debhelper
23:57<drakeman>interbird, i have the same problem with compiz before, but i havent checked that option :D
23:58<interbird>drakeman: sorry, i lost your context; either metacity is running or compiz if you use gnome; using gnome? or kde?
23:59<blueldr137>i'm using gnome
23:59<drakeman>blueldr137, what did you get if you type this ---> glxinfo | grep render
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23:59<drakeman>interbird, im using gnome right now
---Logclosed Fri Oct 02 00:00:26 2009