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#debian IRC Logs for 2010-03-01

---Logopened Mon Mar 01 00:00:30 2010
---Daychanged Mon Mar 01 2010
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00:37<CrystalFire>I am having problems updating the repositories,, I posted a full explanation at
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00:38<CrystalFire>I havent been able to update the repositories for almost a week now
00:38<CrystalFire>is there a problem with
00:39<edhunter>CrystalFire: are you sure your dns works correctly? i can access those urls. all except one which has a 404 in the paste
00:40<CrystalFire>It should I am going straight to dsl modem and havent changed anything dns-wise
00:40<muzy>CrystalFire, why do you use IPv6?
00:41<CrystalFire>I dont on purpose,, im running inside a fresh install of lenny
00:41<CrystalFire>and i havent purposely changed anything in to force ipv6
00:42<muzy>because with IPv6 the Network is unreachable for me too
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00:42<CrystalFire>Do you think it would be bettter to use opends servers, or just to change somehow to use ipv4
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00:42<CrystalFire>i always worry about opendns being a security risk somehow
00:43<muzy>I would recommend you to try IPv4 firs
00:43<CrystalFire>should i assume its a debian thing first and change it there or go straight to dsl-modem?
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00:44<muzy>may you can paste your "ifconfig" output
00:44<CrystalFire>sure one sec
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00:44<CrystalFire>ok im new to debian been using ubuntu,, i havent figured out the sudo thing yet
00:45<CrystalFire>when i run ifconfig as user it cant find the command, but running sudo ifconfig asks for root password for user, and then wont work when i enter password
00:46<sney>it's not the root password, it's your password
00:46<CrystalFire>but shouldnt sudo ask for the root password?
00:47<Pryon>If you knew the root password...
00:47<sney>sudo is designed to allow certain accounts access to certain administrative tasks
00:48<CrystalFire>i just have to get used to the fact that most of what ubuntu does is strange
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00:48<CrystalFire>thats the reason im leaving it anyways soo its not that big of a deal
00:49<CrystalFire>what do i need to do to change things to ipv4?
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00:50<muzy>CrystalFire, that is a good question
00:50<CrystalFire>i thought so, lol
00:50<muzy>I have no clue
00:51<sney>there's an option you can pass to the kernel at boot but I forget what it is. ipv4 *is* enabled, but sometimes ipv6 conflicts with it
00:51<CrystalFire>should a vanilla install of lenny be using ipv6
00:51<sney>they're both enabled by default and 99% of the time that's not a problem
00:52<CrystalFire>i wonder why no one else seems to have problems updating the repositories,,
00:53<muzy>maybe they are all using v4
00:53<CrystalFire>seems unlikely that all of them would manually change things to force ip4
00:53<sney>CrystalFire: can you paste your /etc/apt/sources.list file?
00:53<CrystalFire>sure one sec
00:53<ansgar>CrystalFire: Usually applications will fall back to IPv4 if they cannot use IPv6.
00:54<ansgar>CrystalFire: That's why there is no problem for most users. Something seems to go wrong for you.
00:54<sney>maybe his ISP supports it in some broken fashion, so it appears to work but really doesn't
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00:56<sney>well you have some duplicate lines there and you should clean it up, but that's probably not causing the problem
00:56<ansgar>CrystalFire: What do "ip -6 route show", "ip -6 addr show" say?
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01:00<CrystalFire>anything look strange?
01:01<sney>I have 0 experience with inet6, unfortunately
01:02<CrystalFire>i found that the list of mirrors at lists which support for ipv6
01:02<CrystalFire>im going to try and change them to one that does and then see if that fixes
01:02<sney>hmm, could be
01:02<muzy>CrystalFire, try to browse to
01:02<muzy>if this works well your IPv6 works well
01:03<muzy>if this works maybe you should change your debian mirror
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01:04<CrystalFire>“” refused the connection
01:04<CrystalFire>should i even be using debian-volatile
01:05<sney>CrystalFire: if you do modinfo ipv6, do you get anything?
01:05<muzy>what does "ping6" output?
01:05<CrystalFire>“” refused the connection
01:05<CrystalFire>unknown host
01:05<muzy>okay then you do not have a real IPv6 adress
01:06<sney>CrystalFire: if you do modinfo ipv6, do you get anything?
01:06<CrystalFire>yep pasting in pastebin
01:06<CrystalFire>one sec
01:06<sney>I just need to know if it's one line or many
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01:07<CrystalFire>i installed this copy of lenny from the net-install disc
01:07<sney>ok, you can put ipv6 in /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist.conf and reboot, ipv6 will be disabled
01:07<CrystalFire>i wonder if that made a huge difference
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01:07<sney>most people install with netinst
01:08<CrystalFire>i wonder why i dont have an actual ipv6 address
01:08<sney>your isp/router doesn't support it
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01:08<sney>most don't
01:08<muzy>CrystalFire, maybe your ISP does not support it
01:08<sney>the real question is why apt is trying to use it anyway
01:09<CrystalFire>would disabling ipv6 pose any form of security risk
01:09<snogglethorpe>a lot of isps (or maybe the hardware for connecting?) seem to drop anything ipv6 related...
01:09<muzy>no CrystalFire
01:09<muzy>ipv6 is not essential
01:10<CrystalFire>would i still be able to stream to my xbox using multicast
01:10<CrystalFire>without ipv6
01:10<sney>nearly everything uses ipv4
01:10<sney>ipv6 is future tech basically
01:10<muzy>and ipv6 is a bit buggy actual
01:11<CrystalFire>would echo "blacklist ipv6" >> /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist.conf work to disable ipv6
01:11<sney>should, yes
01:11<muzy>and unless your ISP does not give you at least one public IPv6 adress it pointless to have it
01:12<muzy>*it is
01:12<CrystalFire>do i have to restart or can i do modprobe
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01:12<sney>restart is best, rmmod ipv6 might work or it might just break
01:13<CrystalFire>ok well back in a second thank you
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01:31<CrystalFire>ok everything seems to work now except for this error
01:31<CrystalFire>it cant download from this repository:
01:31<CrystalFire> Unable to fetch file, server said '/debian/dists/lenny/updates/main/source/Sources: No such file or directory '
01:32<muzy>this indicates that the repository is broken
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01:32<jm_>no it jjust means there are nno source packages there
01:33<CrystalFire>i tried that repo and one in a different state they both returend that... so can i safely ignore that error
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01:34<sney>try it with
01:35<CrystalFire>are the repositories always this broken?
01:36<jm_>no, updates just don't have source packages
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01:37<CrystalFire>ok so i disabled source-code updates in apt, and then realized that security updates for lenny were disabled and enable them
01:37<CrystalFire>now i get these errors
01:37<sney>it's gone back to ipv6, sigh
01:38<CrystalFire>i disabled it
01:39<sney>ok, don't panic
01:39<sney>make a file called 00local in /etc/modprobe.d/
01:39<CrystalFire>BUt this isnt in the hithchikers guide?
01:39<sney>(if it exists, just open it)
01:40<sney>add these lines:
01:40<sney>alias net-pf-10 off
01:40<sney>alias ipv6 off
01:40<sney>and restart again, that should do it for real
01:41*sney goes to bed
01:41*allu2 gets up from bed
01:44<CrystalFire>should i be root to change that file
01:44<allu2>i'd think
01:45<allu2>CrystalFire: if you try iam sure you'll see ;)
01:45<CrystalFire>i dont see why i should have to change all of this,, shouldnt it mostly work out of the box
01:46<CrystalFire>isnt the real problem that lenny is not falling back to ip4
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01:48<jm_>it's up to applications to behave like that, not distribution
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02:19<Leela>does anyone know why i can connect to this debian server but not the ubuntu server? I didn't change the settings
02:19<DeltaLima28>couldnt tell ya is the server down?
02:19<MeglaW_>nmap ipofubuntubox
02:20<jm_>Leela: why? because debian is superior of course
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02:21<Leela>hm ok. thanks. will try it later though
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02:22<goodger>*slow clap*
02:22<DeltaLima28>i am really new to this (Linux World) and IRC, is this channel for help or questions that i can pose?
02:22<valdyn>DeltaLima28: yes
02:22<jm_>DeltaLima28: if it's about Debian, read the topic
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02:23<DeltaLima28>cool, thanks for the reply
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02:27<Lauri>hi, i have problem with installiga debian etch, it says bad mirror, if i look that mirror with my borwser i saw there stuff for etch
02:27<jm_>why are you using etch installer?
02:27<Lauri>becouse php4 dont work under lenny
02:28<Lauri>or i am wrong?
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02:30<Lauri>i need start webservice what needs php php4, mysql4 and zend optimizer, under lenny all seems to work put all i can see is olny white page
02:30<jm_>how are you installing etch? are you aware there are no longer security updates for it?
02:31<Lauri>installing from netinstall cd iso and i dont need security, it's olny test server for 1 week and then webservice i going to live server
02:33<goodger> a server running php4?
02:33<goodger>on what OS?
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02:34<jm_>check your sources list and verify it it puts "stable" there - if so, replace with "etch"
02:35<hackel>How can I pin packages from a specific site in my apt_preferences? (this is described in the man page)
02:36<Lauri>how i can change apt source if install is half completed, install says to pick mirror
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02:37<Lauri>i dont know what os is there, i dont have at the moment access
02:37<jm_>you have access to other tty-s where you can edit stuff
02:38<Lauri>i need fast test server, becouse database is 3gb and my laptop what is server now, importiga 3gb database 1h
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03:08<Leela>hi again. i can't connect to the ubuntu server but as ubuntu is based on debian maybe someone here can help me?
03:09<dpkg>Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian, and it is unlikely to live up to Debian's standards (see <Debian policy>). Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu ( instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian>.
03:09<Ganneff>so no.
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03:13<jmm>hello .
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03:41<jar>df -h
03:42<jar>wrong window
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04:05<MeglaW_>man did deoendency based boot spit out errors
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04:06<MeglaW_>seems like every packet in my system does not like it
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04:21<tamrat>Anyone familiar with cdbs packaging around?
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04:25<babilen>tamrat: Just ask your question :)
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04:26<babilen>tamrat: But it sounds like you want to ask in #debian-mentors (/msg dpkg mentors)
04:27<tamrat>well, I created a seperate libxxx package, and my shlibs don't generate anymore
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04:46<loki87>hey !
04:47<loki87>i use fail2ban and want scan manual a logfile with these "fail2ban-regex full.log /etc/fail2ban/filter.d/sshd.conf", it find ~300 ips, but no action in iptables... how can i made this ?
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04:51<anus_k>ola ?
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04:56<Administrator>nick Lauri
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04:57<Lauri>can install mysql 4.* into lenny?
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05:02<seeS>you possibly could, but it would be a lot of work to sort out the dependencies
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05:03<Lauri>i dont even find apt source for that
05:04<seeS>it would have to be manual process
05:04<seeS>oh, maybe backports
05:04<seeS>which seems down anyhow
05:05<themill>it certainly won't be in backports
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05:06<seeS>hmm, i guess its sort of the opposite of backports
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05:07<themill>seeS: quite. And you be starting off with the old and very unmaintained package from sarge...
05:08<seeS>it is pretty ancient isn't it? i suppose its only a manual build
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05:09<Lauri>i found way that apt find mysql-server 4.1
05:09<themill>seeS: yeah, I suspect it's in that category of "I don't think I'd want it running on my machines even if I could compile it"
05:10<themill>Lauri: this is going to end badly...
05:10<seeS>it will. why do you want 4.1?
05:11<Lauri>webpage is working olny mysql 4.*
05:11<weasel>then fix the webpage or throw it out
05:11<seeS>thats a serious screwed up webpage
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05:12<weasel>seeS: was it the 'mysql' that gave it away? :)
05:12<themill>Lauri: the vast majority of things written with mysql 4 in mind work fine with mysql 5 too. I presume you have actually tried it out already
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05:12<seeS>weasel: i like the auto-corrupting tables as an added bonus
05:12<Lauri>i cant fix it, f* saurus CMS is zend gourd
05:13<jm_>maybe it's somethig idiotic like password style used in mysql ;)
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05:13<Lauri>sec, i will copy error
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05:17<seeS>your tables dont exist
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05:18<Lauri>hmm... that scipt how do to tables itself
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05:20<seeS>or its using reserved words
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05:22<Lauri>i think saurus cms install script syntax is full of errors:)
05:25<Lauri>in my laptop is running mysql 4.1, i make mysqldump and import in other machine, hope it work
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05:26<seeS>that may work
05:26<seeS>i suspect it might be the column names
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05:28<xover>guys does anyone know how to kick openoffice into gear so it actually works?
05:28<xover>It changing my formatting every time I open a .odt file.
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05:33<Lauri>it didn't work
05:35<seeS>same error?
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05:37<Lauri>no, zend optimizer error
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05:38<Lauri>i try one more time, diffrent why
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05:49<ddilinger>Greetings. Is there an easy way to alias a long domain name to something local? for example from my laptop to ssh to home i type 'ssh' and i want to be lazy and type 'ssh me@home'
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05:50<ddilinger>being much too hopefull i tried adding ' home' to /etc/hosts, but of course the hosts file wants ip addresses
05:50<ddilinger>i could setup a crontab that puts the ip there every hour or something, but was hoping for a real solution
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05:51<ddilinger>i'm afraid its the wrong time of day :(
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05:52<jmm>hi ddilinger .
05:52<jmm>do you want to do that only for the local computer ? or that short name will be used elsewhere ?
05:53<ddilinger>just on that one pc
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05:54<hollo>hi.. it might be a little out of topic, but i guess there is a couple of sysadm's in here.. and do anyone know of some nice server issue tracking system.. just a simple, log problem/give a message of how to solve/close
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05:55<ddilinger>dont know . . but i know theres hundreds of issue-tracking servers out there because each developer thinks the other ones are broken :)
05:55<jmm>ddilinger: you could use some dynamic dns service.
05:55<jmm>you know like dyndns or something.
05:56<ddilinger>jmm: i'm using the dynamic dns service, the problem is the domain name is too long, i dont like typing the whole thing out :)
05:56<jmm>what is your domain name ?
05:56<hollo>ddilinger, hehe.. exactly, and i wanted to go the other way, see if there is just something out there which can accoblish 90% of my jobs, and then i can mod the last 10% :)
05:56<jmm>you can use +search option in resolv.conf, if your dns server allow it.
05:57<jmm>like search . then your computer named will be accessible via fizz.
05:57<ddilinger>hmm, i wonder how prevalent that is. on the laptop i quite often have different providers(school wifi, bridged to phone, etc)
05:57<ddilinger>i might try the +search, gotta start reading man resolv.conf :)
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06:00<ddilinger>hmm, well the search prefix worked at home, but here its being forwarded to a dnsmasq server which is probably nice, will have to see how much the school and phone dns servers like it
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06:00<ddilinger>jmm : thanks for the pointer, looks like was right direction :)
06:01<gsimmons>ddilinger: If it's just for ssh, "Host home\nHostName" in ~/.ssh/config would do ; man ssh_config.
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06:01<jmm>ddilinger: yw.
06:01<ddilinger>gsimmons: ooh, i like that too. didnt know ssh had internal aliases
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06:03*ddilinger sees a whole mess of interesting things in man ssh_config
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06:09<ddilinger>seintence, para cervezas?
06:10<goodger>!tell david about es
06:11<ddilinger>!tell ddilinger about es
06:11<jmm>!tell me the truth
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06:14*ddilinger curses developing for php on a 300Mhz embedded device, but work with whats pre-installed . . . 50ms on my PC=1.6s on the device :P
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07:15<chaos-irssi>^-\[[^\]]*\]- <-- some1 plz tell me what you think this regular expression matches
07:16<dpkg>Damnit Jim! It's YOU. Y-O-U. Not *U*. U is a letter. YOU is a word. See ne1, or wud. Dutch for 'you' (formal singular). See
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07:20<Cfu|Work>hey guys
07:20<jhr>chaos-irssi: -[ anything in between the brackets including the brackets and a dash in front of them, maybe? ]
07:21<Cfu|Work>i'm trying to log a new mirror via the mirror submission page, but it's rejecting my proposed path to the debian archive falsely
07:21<jm_>[^\] means anything but \
07:21<Cfu|Work>does anyone know with whom i should get in touch?
07:21<frido>hello, has debian any package which contain dialog utility for disk configuring (HDD, MD, LVM ..) as is in debian installer ?
07:22<jhr>jm_: I disagree. the \ escapes the following ], so it's ^\], i.e everything but the closing bracket
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07:25<jm_>jhr: i was missing ] in my text
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07:26<chaos-irssi>my goal was to look for string beginning with "-[" followed by anything but "]" then "]-" :)
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07:28<jhr>chaos-irssi: and your regex doesn't work or what are you saying?
07:29<chaos-irssi>i use it as a pattern match but some -[...]- slip through the cracks
07:30<jhr>example line?
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07:31<chaos-irssi>can't ... it's not public :s
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07:55<leandrocalmeida>onde consigo uma versão 4 do debian?
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08:01<leandrocalmeida>where I get the version 4 of debian?
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08:05<vasan>i got grub 5 error... how to solve this?
08:05<rafa>Version 4 debian can get:
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08:05<leandrocalmeida>e em DVD ?
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08:06<jack>uyejjfjdjkfkkjn v pkokhkvbhnbfujiugn
08:06<jack>jakm mp ,
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---Logclosed Mon Mar 01 08:28:41 2010
---Logopened Mon Mar 01 08:28:50 2010
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08:46<amol112>hi all,while installing debian lenny ,it is not detecting already installed windows 7
08:47<amol112>can anyone help me to install debian over windows 7 in multiboot
08:47<jm_>maybe os-prober needs updating then
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08:48<amol112>jm_, any other way becoz it shows complete free disk
08:49<amol112>i dont want to format win7
08:49<jm_>amol112: wait, you're talking about partitions, not about boot loader?
08:49<amol112>jm_, yes partition
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08:49<jm_>amol112: does kernel detect its partition? check /proc/partitions
08:50<amol112>jm_, not detected
08:50<jm_>amol112: interesting, it detects it fine on my system at work, le me reboot the shit and test (with grml)
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08:55<jadernij>kto mozet pomo4j v ustanovke debiana?
08:57<jm_>amol112: yup, works fine, it created empty 1M partition at the beginning and then the real one
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09:07<davi>How to convert MPEG to wav?
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09:09<petemc>davi: try using a search engine
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09:10<davi>thanks petemc
09:11<jm_>mp3? lame can do that, or "write" plugins in some media players
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09:20<petemc>davi: players like vlc should have an option to output the sound stream to a file
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09:27<jmm>can somebody help me to add some packages to my custom installation CD ? I made an install then used apt-move to generate a tree with all packages, I also generated Packages.gz that I appened to the original one on the CD. but still it download packages from the network.can somebody help me please ?
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09:39<gerald>hi all.
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09:39<gerald>Who can help me to setup a dell server with broadcom card (chipset bmc5716) ?
09:40<gerald>I read that there is a pci id problem I try the patch but whitout success
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09:49<mixter_>hi! i'm using vsftpd as an ftp-server. are there any way to list active sessions and users?
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09:55*mixter_ found setproctitle_enable
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10:15<arf`>can't find any aspell related chan nor usefull help on the web, so does one know why, when in aspell check mode, my keyboard is ASCII only ?
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11:19<elijah>what does this error mean i looked everywhere and cant find it "Couldn't initialize SDL: No available video device"
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11:21<elijah>what does this error mean i looked everywhere and cant find it "Couldn't initialize SDL: No available video device"
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13:07<Japsu>o hai
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13:11<Muzer>My one-liner brain isn't working properly today: here's one I came up with to count the null bytes in a file: hexdump FILENAME | cut -d " " -f 2- | grep -v [0-9a-f][0-9a-f][0-9a-f][0-9a-f][0-9a-f][0-9a-f] | sed 's/\([0-9a-f][0-9a-f]\)\([0-9a-f][0-9a-f]\)/\1 \2/g' | sed 's/ /\n/g' | grep 00 | wc -l
13:11<Muzer>ugly :p
13:12<ikarus>Muzer: egads
13:12<Muzer>it works though :p
13:12<ikarus>you do know that hexdump skips sequences of 0s
13:12<Muzer>does it?
13:13<Muzer>nothing in the manpage (though I only skimmed it)
13:13<ikarus>it does
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13:14<Muzer>worked fine for me: muzer@muzer-desktop ~ $ hexdump null
13:14<Muzer>0000000 0000 0000 0000 0000 000a
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13:15<ikarus>but now take a sequence that would have multiple lines of 00's
13:15<ikarus>it skips them :)
13:16<Muzer>you're right :p
13:16<Muzer>any option to prevent that
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13:16<ikarus>never checked
13:16<ikarus>I just know the behavior
13:16<Muzer>or is there a better command to use?
13:17<ikarus>xxd I think
13:17<ikarus>atleast if you want correct hex output
13:17<ikarus>it's proably easier to call perl for this
13:17<Muzer>ah, thanks
13:17<ikarus>if oyu need counting
13:18<Muzer>yeah, but it's not for anything important, or part of a bigger script :p
13:19<Muzer>much shorter now :D
13:19<Muzer>xxd FILENAME | cut -d " " -f 2-9 | sed 's/\([0-9a-f][0-9a-f]\)\([0-9a-f][0-9a-f]\)/\1 \2/g' | sed 's/ /\n/g' | grep 00 | wc -l
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13:20<ikarus>Muzer: also sed can handle more then one command at once
13:20<ikarus>and grep can count
13:20<ikarus>(grep -c)
13:20<Muzer>thanks :)
13:20<Muzer>I knew about the sed thing
13:20<Muzer>but I know that sometimes it isn't a good idea - I've just realised in this case it will work
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13:35<mithdagor>how do i keep package A, even if the package B is trying to remove package A?
13:36<Muzer>why is it trying to remove it? Conflict?
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13:36<Muzer>or do you mean removal of package B is trying to remove package A?
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13:36<Muzer>if the latter, you can type: aptitude install package-A to mark it as manually installed
13:37<Muzer>(I believe)
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13:40<pipe>'lo. I recall that I've read about some software that simplifies installation of locally compiled programs, but I can't remember the name(s). It kept track of what files was installed when you did "make install", so you could unroll the changes later.
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13:42<Muzer>run that instead of make install
13:43<Muzer>that basically creates a Debian package of the installation
13:43<Muzer>also some packages do have a make uninstall (but not all)
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13:43<mithdagor>Muzer, not sure if it really conflicts. for example kbd is recommending console-tools but installing console-tools has removed kbd. now if i try to reinstall kbd is trying to remove console-tools. the idea is to keep console-tools and force install kbd.
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13:44<Muzer>sounds like a conflict to me
13:44<Muzer>you can use aptitude show (or apt-cache show, or even dpkg -s) and then the package name to look at all the details like conflicts
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13:59<mithdagor>Muzer, it doesn't seem to be a conflict. though i might be wrong. here is output of aptitude show kbd and aptitude show console-setup on my sid:
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14:04<cesurasean>[warn] Init: Name-based SSL virtual hosts only work for clients with TLS server name indication support (RFC 4366) - anyone have a clue what this means?
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14:06<pipe>Don't call me 'ho' :(
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14:20<slipshot>anyone know where a good howto for installing custom usplash themes in lenny is?
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15:03<silencio>Hi all, I have a question, if posible show the history comand with its date and time ?
15:04<petemc>silencio: you can change $HISTTIMEFORMAT to include time stamps
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15:05<silencio>ah ok, thank you
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15:56<cesurasean>anyone know why my tail of apache error logs are showing this? - Cannot adopt OID in UCD-SNMP-MIB: laIndex ::= { laEntry 1 }
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16:18<cesurasean>PHP Warning: PHP Startup: Unable to load dynamic library '/usr/lib/php5/20090626+lfs/' - /usr/lib/php5/20090626+lfs/ cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory in Unknown on line 0 - getting this error on squeeze. how do i resolve this?
16:19<oskie>try "ldd /usr/lib/php5/20090626+lfs/" and see what it says
16:20<cesurasean>does not exist
16:20<cesurasean>php5-imagick does not seem to install on squeeze either. says it is ref by a different package?
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16:21<cesurasean>how do i remove this module from running? does not seem to be part of squeeze currently...
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16:24<cesurasean>why can i not find in php.ini?
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16:24<oskie>what do you mean, "does not exist"? "ldd"?
16:25<oskie>ah I see
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16:26<chealer>cesurasean: you probably experience the equivalent of for imagick (there are no PHP modules without this problem that I know)
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16:26<oskie>22:20 < cesurasean> php5-imagick does not seem to install on squeeze either. says it is ref by a different package?
16:26<chealer>cesurasean: you could purge imagick
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16:29<sney>for imagick issues, it may be worth noting that imagemagick is being replaced by graphicsmagick, so there may be a php package for that as well
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16:29<cesurasean>where is php5-imagick being loaded from?
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16:30<cesurasean>how can i possibly purge php5-imagick, when it's not installed?
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16:30<cesurasean>sney, i just want to remove php5-imagick from loading with php startup. cant find it in php.ini though.
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16:35<cesurasean>nevermind, found it
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16:36<cesurasean>PHP Warning: PHP Startup: Unable to load dynamic library '/usr/lib/php5/20090626+lfs/' - /usr/lib/php5/20090626+lfs/ cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory in Unknown on line 0 - whats the package name for mhash? mhash?
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16:39<silencio>package php5-mhash
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16:39<cesurasean>it says php5-mhash is included in php5-common.
16:39<cesurasean>if this is the case, then why am i getting such errors?
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16:46<seanius>cesurasean: are you running testing or stable?
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16:47<cesurasean>testing. i ended up just removing the mhash.ini file...
16:47<cesurasean>seems it may be loaded a different way
16:47<chealer>cesurasean: do you have any *mhash* file? if not, anything about it in php.ini ?
16:48<cesurasean>i just had a mhash.ini file in conf.d
16:48<cesurasean>anyways, moving on...
16:48<cesurasean> - apache error log showing my snmp problems. is this a bug with squeeze?
16:48<cesurasean>seems to be related to php5-snmp, perhaps.
16:49<chealer>cesurasean: right. that was a leftover file from same bug again
16:49<cesurasean>chealer, do you know anything about this snmp issue?
16:51<chealer>cesurasean: no, just ask the channel
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17:31<rgouveia>hi all ... running lenny and sometimes after hibernating my desktop, it doesn't resume. I get a black screen with a blinking underscore on the top left of the screen and my keyboard leds are flashing. I presume the machine crashed. This happens 3 out 5 times. There isn't anything relevant in /var/log/pm-suspend.log. Any thoughts?
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17:33<chealer>rgouveia: which video driver do you use?
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17:36<ikarus>hmz, did anything change to ACPI recently
17:36<ikarus>my laptop isn't showing ACPI tablet conversion messages anymore
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17:40<rgouveia>chealer: ATI (fglrx)
17:40<ikarus>while /sys/devices/platform/thinkpad_acpi/hotkey_tablet_mode does contain the correct status
17:40<chealer>rgouveia: that may be a fglrx bug
17:41<thedave>can someone please point me to a decent doc with info on upgrading a single package (and dependencies) from lenny to squeeze? i'm not in a position to do a dist upgrade, but i need a more recent version of imapsync. is there a clean way to do this, or should i just build it by hand from latest sources?
17:41<rgouveia>chealer: so back to the ATI from xorg and test, you say?
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17:42<bremner>thedave: did you check
17:43<dpkg> is a semi-official repository of <backports> for the current stable distribution, prepared by Debian developers. Read . A sample line for your sources.list is: deb lenny-backports main contrib non-free. Once added, aptitude update && aptitude install debian-backports-keyring && aptitude update. <bpo mirrors> <bpo contents> <bpo list>
17:43<chealer>rgouveia: you can do that. but suspend in general is very buggy. if you don't intend to make much use of suspend, I would just not use it, particularly since even if you find a bug, it may be already fixed in squeeze.
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17:44<thedave>that's exactly what i'm looking for. thanks a ton, bremner
17:44<bremner>thedave: well, not everything is there, but it is a good place to start
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17:45<thedave>i knew something like this existed, but didn't know what it was, so it'll help tons. if it's not there, i'll probably just build the package by hand. however, it's always nice to have a dpkg method of doing stuff whenever possible
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17:46<bremner>!tell thedave about ssb
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17:47<bja>}7msg dpkg ssb
17:48*bja looks for the hot iron to straighten his fingers
17:48<ml|>thedave: never mix stable with other releases, only use bpo
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17:50<thedave>ml|: that's why i'm here looking for advice :)
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17:53<rgouveia>is there any way of browsing backports repo through synaptic?
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17:53<sobol>is there no option to add source?
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17:55<sobol>rgouveia, i think there is a option of repository
17:55<rgouveia>sobol: ah yes, I can filter by 'origin'. thanks
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19:03<vanagon>I installed squeeze with a sudo setup (no root account). But now thinks like the update manager request a root password even though none exists, and don't accept my user account password. What's the fix for this?
19:05<edhunter>vanagon: hm iirc sudo su will give you root and you can use passwd there
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19:06<vanagon>edhunter, hi, yes, I think that's correct. But I was hoping I could have a sudo-based system where it accepts my user password for things like the update manager. Is this not easy to set up in squeeze?
19:06<edhunter>vanagon: sorry no clue about that.. i prefer to have real root
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19:11<edhunter>vanagon: how is the update manager run? do you click on some shortcut?
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19:17<rgouveia>vanagon: maybe install gksudo or something like that?
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19:20<cesurasean>can someone tell me what is wrong with php5-snmp? -
19:20-!-gbp [] has joined #debian
19:20<cesurasean>is this a bug on squeeze?
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19:22<abrotman>cesurasean: which part of it?
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19:23<cesurasean>abrotman, all of that snmp garbage that it's having issues with. it seems to be related to php5-snmp.
19:23<cesurasean>look at my pastebin, you will see...
19:23<abrotman>i did
19:23<matu>what does that mean ? kernel:[51660.965543] Uhhuh. NMI received for unknown reason a0 on CPU 0.
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19:23<cesurasean>starts off with: Cannot find module (SNMPv2-TC): At line 10 in /usr/share/mibs/netsnmp/UCD-DLMOD-MIB
19:23<matu>Message from syslogd@debian at Mar 1 20:50:50 ...
19:23<matu> kernel:[51660.965550] You have some hardware problem, likely on the PCI bus.
19:23<matu>Message from syslogd@debian at Mar 1 20:50:50 ...
19:23<matu> kernel:[51660.965553] Dazed and confused, but trying to continue
19:23<matu>i dont think i have any hw problem because my computer is still running great
19:24<abrotman>cesurasean: i'd probably ask ##php on
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19:24<cesurasean>abrotman, thx
19:25<matu>is my computer almost dead ?
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19:28<matu>it seems to be nothing more than a bug
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19:30<abrotman>matu: i have a machine that does that .. it doesn't boot because the bios gets angry
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19:31<matu>mine boots well
19:31<abrotman>mine is a server
19:31<matu>mine is a laptop...
19:32<matu>are you using a graphical interface ?
19:32<matu>i use lxde
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19:34<abrotman>matu: it's a server .. it doesn't boot ..
19:35<matu>did the bios get angry because of these errors ?
19:35<matu>i am not sure to understand >_<
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19:36<dpkg>somebody said nmi was Non-Maskable Interrupts, a way to diagnose why a CPU soft-froze.
19:37<abrotman>matu: if your machine is functional, what's the concern ?
19:37<sney>I've seen NMI errors from a loose connection
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19:38<cesurasean>how do i run httpd -S on squeeze?
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19:38<sney>hell of a thing, intermittent NMI-based kernel panics in a big complex server, turned out to be just a loose connection between 2 component PCBs
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19:40<abrotman>sney: yeah ... if i remove the riser card, the NMI goes away ..
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19:41<bIGHh>Then, here is the official irc channel for debian distro ?
19:41<dpkg>If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on See <smart questions><errors>.
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19:41<matu>thx abrotman
19:42<abrotman>matu: does that help you at all ?
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19:42<matu>i dunno
19:43<abrotman>matu: you may want to check all your connections, and look for a bios update
19:43<matu>ah no it is too risky
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19:43<matu>to perform a bios update
19:44<abrotman>it is ?
19:44<Lillymon>I've got a bit of a problem with new Phonon packages in experimental. I can upgrade them to 4.6.0really4.3.80-1 (including the backends, which may help me with some problems), but libqt4-webkit (still at 4.6.0-1, the newest version in experimental) REQUIRES libphonon4 to be exactly 4.6.0-1, but the new Phonon backends require libphonon4 to be 4.6.0really4.3.80-1.
19:44<matu>my connection is working using an openbsd router
19:44<matu>but i have to say my ping is currently very high
19:44<abrotman>Lillymon: i'd probably ask #debian-kde .. but things like that happen .. maybe try again tomorrow
19:45<Lillymon>So aptitude can only install the new Phonon packages by removing libqt4-webkit, and almost every application that depends on Qt (read: Half of my apps) depend on it.
19:45<matu>because i am uploading some things
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19:46<bIGHh>nice Template from dpkgg, so my question is : Is this channel the official irc channel for debian linux distibutions ?
19:46<Lillymon>abrotman: Yeah, I will try again when some more packages get updated, but this does seem like a mistake really. I can't think of a single Phonon app that DOESN'T require Qt, so this is effectively an impossible combination. You simply cannot use the new Phonon packages.
19:47<abrotman>bIGHh: points here. that's as official as you're going to get .. take that for what it's worth
19:47<dpkg>Pour l'aide en francais, veuillez rejoindre le canal #debian-fr sur Francophone users: for help in french, please go to #debian-fr on
19:47<matu>oh abrotman you are a french guy too
19:47<Lillymon>I've actually got fairly severe problems with both Phonon backends available from the repositories, I'm eager to know if the latest versions have fixed any of them.
19:47<abrotman>matu: nope .. the other guy is though
19:48<matu>i mean i speak french too
19:48<matu>as my native language
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19:58<adb>matu, si jamais, /j
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20:04<bIGHh>abrotman: Thanks. (Though I saw another you in another #debian place - freenode - , eheh...). It's worth the ban I got in efnet then... , Many thanks Alexander :). You don't like french people ?
20:04<abrotman>yes, freenode
20:05<abrotman>bIGHh: no, but it might be easier for you to communicate in french .. not sure .. just making you aware
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20:06<bIGHh>Thanks for us, I noticed and joined there but keep here if you don't mind. :)
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20:18<Lillymon>I also noted earlier that one package update required restarting several other processes, but couldn't restart KDM. Can I restart KDM without interrupting anything else I'm doing?
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20:22<bIGHh>Lillymon: depending what "else" is. Generally restarting KDM kill all other above apps as Gnome or KDE or xterm...
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20:23<Lillymon>Yeah, I was hoping to keep them going. I can exit X though a bit later and doing, Irssi runs in Screen and Deluge runs as daemon, and they're the only things I want going constantly.
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20:25<bIGHh>Or any "X" dependant app...
20:25<Lillymon>As I said, I can exit X entirely, so I'd be quitting all X-dependent apps anyway.
20:26<Lillymon>I use Irssi and Deluge specifically so I can do this. I could use XChat or WeeChat instead of Irssi, and rTorrent instead of Deluge, but I have my preferences.
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20:28<Lillymon>I really should try to get mpd to work, being able to play music while X is down would be awesome. The Windows user in me still marvels that it's possible.
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20:29<Lillymon>So yeah, most pertinent question, how do I restart KDM at all? I've actually never done it before.
20:29<bja>Lillymon: moc
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20:31<bja>Lillymon: /etc/init.d/kdm restart
20:31<bIGHh>Lillymon: pick up in boot scripts (/etc/init.d/) the appropriate.
20:31<bIGHh>in other words...
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20:45<bIGHh>Lillymon: And No! , playing music without X ain't _awesome_ in linux word (even if you use pulseaudio!) or others ; because _audio_ ain't an X stuff. X stuff is to _display_ hard level with libs and kernel for Desktop managers like Kde that may use pulse, etc...
20:45-!-reseg [] has joined #debian
20:45<reseg>Hi, I need an OCR program (I want to run a pdf file to it -- in the pdf file are scanned pages of simple English text). What's a popular/good OCR software?
20:45-!-dvs [] has quit []
20:45<reseg>that is hopefully available in Synaptic. suggestions, please?
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20:46<Lillymon>bIGHh: That was pretty much my point, I fully understand how it works. But in Windows, if graphics go down, it all goes down. This system makes more sense, but after three years, I'm still amazed.
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20:47<Lillymon>Incidentally, mpd is baffling me. It's saying it can't listen on localhost because it's in use. Which it is, by Deluge. So what do I tell mpd to use?
20:50<Lillymon>I can fully understand the problem, I'm just at a loss as to what I should be doing about it.
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20:50<victorwpbastos>join #debian-br
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20:51<victorwpbastos>-j #debian-br
20:51<sney>victorwpbastos: try /join
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20:52<ml|>Lillymon: check to see if mpd is already running
20:53<bIGHh>Lillymon: Humm, me too after ~15 years : amazing no ? :)
20:53<Lillymon>That's weird, three instances. I tried to start it three times, but thought the 'Aborted' meant it'd quit
20:53*matu bye
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20:54<sundaymorning>man, configuring inn sure is hard
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21:00<Lillymon>OK, now I'm wondering what the hell MPD wants from me. I'm at "daemon: could not create pid file "/var/run/mpd/pid": Permission denied".
21:01<ml|>Lillymon: mpd runs as root, unless you change that
21:01<reseg>MPD is one complicated piece of bitch.
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21:01<reseg>It's not advisable running it as root, is it?
21:02<bremner>Lillymon: asuming you run as you, check your config file for a line starting pid_file
21:02<ml|>it's up to you, I don't
21:02<Lillymon>User was originally specified to run as "mpd", I commented out that line in my trial and error sessions.
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21:03<Lillymon>pid_file is set to "/var/run/mpd/pid", as in the error. I've no idea what I should be setting it to.
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21:04<sundaymorning>man, this is silly, inn should be easy to configure
21:04<Lillymon>I set it to be in /home, it doesn't write one, then complains it doesn't exist. It set it to be in /var, and it gives a permissions error instead.
21:05<abrotman>the mpd user probably owns /var/run/mpd/ .. but it's not running as the mpd user
21:05<ml|>Lillymon: it's run as root
21:05<Lillymon>I should run it as root?
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21:06<Lillymon>If I set the user back to mpd, then I get "daemon: cannot setgid for user "mpd": Operation not permitted".
21:06<abrotman>i didn't say that
21:06<ml|>you need to /etc/init.d/mpd stop and start it as user, but you meed to create several things for that to work
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21:08<Lillymon>abrotman: What did you say then?
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21:09*bIGHh reads mpd pages after Deluge one's. Hummm... Amazing, eheh. Looks like xmms2 neh?
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21:10<Lillymon>Never been much of an XMMS user. I hated Winamp, and I've been a fairly dedicated Amarok user. MPD looks like it could be a good backup, if it ever works. I'll probably be emboldened enough to try Mutt again if it ever doe.
21:11<Lillymon>I'm amazed it's so difficult. deluged is happily seeding away now, and the difficulty there is about at the level of "Push the button".
21:12<bIGHh>Lillymon: I hate Amarok (and xmms2 - where the hell is old xmms) and like audacious or vlc or xine.
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21:13<Lillymon>Xine somehow managed to mess up X the last time I tried it (maybe just the specific UI I was using), Audacious seems the best Winamp-alike for Linux but then I hate Winamp, and VLC glitches too much on fansubs for my tastes. Amarok and SMPlayer for me.
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21:14<sney>I think Banshee is pretty good
21:14<bIGHh>vlc has stream embeded stuff, though never tried it as for mpd I'm too new to it...
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21:15<Lillymon>But then Amarok uses Phonon, where the Xine backend cuts off tracks and the GStreamer backend refuses to play certain tracks, which is why I was here in the first place with the unresolvable dependencies.
21:16<Lillymon>GStreamer itself can play the same tracks (confirmed through Exaile), so it's a Phonon problem.
21:16<bIGHh>Ugh, Phonon <=> last Kde shit I guess.
21:16<Lillymon>I've reported the GStreamer bug, and the Amarok developers indicated the Xine problem is known to happen on some systems.
21:17<Lillymon>Phonon can actually use ALSA or OSS directly, or go through PulseAudio or JACK to get to Xine or GStreamer backends. I don't even know what to call it.
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21:18<Lillymon>But from my experience, Phonon is latency and added problems.
21:18<bIGHh>Shit dows alike
21:19<bIGHh>another level above above, GStreamer's nice and xine-lib 2.6 (damnit where are they gone ?)
21:20<Lillymon>So yeah, MPD. Still don't know what to do with it. I don't use root in the traditional sense that all Debian tutorials seem to assume, I've brought sudo with me from Ubuntu (I like running as root as little as possible).
21:21<chealer>bIGHh: please watch your language
21:21<bIGHh>chealer: I see... Sorry.
21:21<Lillymon>I could also say that Phonon is an effort to make things easier for developers by making things worse for users. Amarok 1.4 played everything perfectly by directly interfacing with the Xine backend. With Phonon in-between, it's a lot less code, but a lot more problems.
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21:22<ml|>Lillymon: do you want to use mpd?
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21:23<bIGHh>Lillymon: eh, very good. I agree.
21:23<Lillymon>ml|: Yes, I'm just filling time now, I'd like it to work but I'm not sure what to do. If I have to run it as root, then so be it. But I only ever do root stuff using sudo, so I've little experience doing it any other way.
21:23<ml|>Lillymon: you don't have too
21:24<Lillymon>I thought so, that's why I was reluctant to. I don't have to run Deluge as root, so it made sense I didn't have to do it with MPD.
21:24<dondelelcaro>Lillymon: by default, mpd runs as mpd, and the frontends run as the user
21:24<damentz>hey everyone, i think a new package in sid is causing the kernel package to fail for debian when building
21:24<dondelelcaro>Lillymon: if you're not using Debian's packaged mpd, all bets are off.
21:25<ml|>you can run mpd as your user tho, it's what I do
21:25<Lillymon>I'm using the testing version, installed straight from the repositories.
21:25*bremner has been perfectly happy running mpd as his regular user
21:25<damentz>on a kernel i'm making, i'm now getting this error -> dpkg-shlibdeps: error: no dependency information found for /lib/ (used by debian/linux-headers-2.6.33-0.dmz.2-liquorix-686/usr/src/linux-headers-2.6.33-0.dmz.2-liquorix-686/scripts/selinux/mdp/mdp).
21:25*bremner even thinks that should be default (mpd as user, no system service)
21:26<ml|>!beer bremner
21:26*dpkg pulls out a tasty Stone Arrogant Bastard for bremner
21:26<bIGHh>Though users come after developpers here... I mean what's easier for developpers is made stupidity for users (nothing to do at all even think!). Eh!
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21:27<dondelelcaro>bremner: it runs as a normal user by default
21:27<damentz>i think i narrowed it down to the libssl-dev package
21:27<Lillymon>OK, just to sanity check. What is the correct way to start MPD? I'm going to feel stupid if I got that wrong.
21:27<bremner>dondelelcaro: yeah, but it collides with the system service somehow iirc
21:27<dondelelcaro>Lillymon: by default, it starts with the init script.
21:28<bIGHh>as root then mpd user takes commands of it...
21:28<bremner>dondelelcaro: I think there is a port fight
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21:28<dondelelcaro>bremner: yes, athat's a noramal user
21:28<dondelelcaro>bremner: if you run it as a normal user, you use a different port and/or socket
21:29<dondelelcaro>err, a differen't login user
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21:29<Lillymon>As mpd it's "daemon: cannot setgid for user "mpd": Operation not permitted" as myself it's "daemon: cannot setgid for user "mpd": Operation not permitted". I'm going in circles now.
21:29<bIGHh>dondelelcaro: useless, mpd user is for that...
21:29<bremner>dondelelcaro: yes, I just don't see the point of making everybody configure their mpd, and their clients. But apparently some people like the system service
21:29<Lillymon>"daemon: could not create pid file "/var/run/mpd/pid": Permission denied"
21:30<ml|>I find it better to just set it up from ~
21:30<Lillymon>That's the error as myself.
21:30<dondelelcaro>Lillymon: uh, you start thempd ad root, but it runs as a normal user, mpd
21:30<bIGHh>got it !
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21:30<dondelelcaro>bremner: it does nice things, like not requiring a login to start it, etc.
21:31<bIGHh>I think.
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21:31<Lillymon>So run mpd using sudo? I need to do that?
21:31<dondelelcaro>Lillymon: it should have started it when you installed mpd
21:32<dondelelcaro>Lillymon: but yes, you'd start it with sudo
21:33<ml|>I don't remember, but I other issues running as a system deamon
21:33<dondelelcaro>like what?
21:33*dondelelcaro has it running on a lot of devices
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21:34<Lillymon>Well it's running now at least. Now I have to figure out how to make it play music.
21:34<ml|>was a while not sure, but I think it was creating the db and updating the db
21:34<ml|>Lillymon: you need a frontend, like mpc or a gui like ario
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21:35<dondelelcaro>Lillymon: use ncmpc or mpc play, assuming you've added bits to the db and updated it.
21:35-!-reseg [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
21:35<ml|>I like ncmpcpp
21:35<dondelelcaro>Lillymon: there's documentation which covers that
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21:37<dpkg>hello, d3co
21:39<d3co>hi friends well how can I avoid this message: "has been 36 times without being checked, checked forced" ?? thx =)
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21:41<dvs>d3co: man tune2fs
21:41<abrotman>d3co: you really probably don't want to
21:41<ml|>at boot fsck? I would not stop that
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21:43<d3co>hi abrotman, I dont want stop else what I should be before this
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21:43<abrotman>d3co: dvs told you where to read to stop or make it less frequent
21:43<dpkg>Hispanohablantes: Por favor /join #debian-es, alli obtendran mas ayuda. Spanish Speakers: Please /join #debian-es, there you will get much more help.
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21:43<dvs>d3co: you want to reduce the frequency and not kill it completely
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21:44<d3co>first, this is normal?
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21:44<ml|>it's for your disks sanity check ;)
21:45<abrotman>yes it is
21:45<ml|>ok :)
21:45<d3co>but lately is appear
21:45<abrotman>maybe you're rebooting more often
21:46<d3co>yes is my laptop =)
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21:47<d3co>but if it is normal and does not harm my hard disc, everything is good right?
21:47-!-ZimmE [] has joined #debian
21:47<dvs>d3co: it protects your OS
21:47<ml|>it's normal nothing to worry about unless fsck can't fix any issue your disk might have [if they come up at all]
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21:49<d3co>ok boys! you are the best!!
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22:03<dpkg>from memory, cya is Cover Your Ass, or l33tspeak for "see you"
22:03<Lillymon>Damn, I think I finally got my MPD problem nailed down. I'm editing .mpdconf (in /home, which MPD specifically says it looks for first) but my latest error only makes sense if it's running from /etc/mpd.conf. It's not using the config file I'm expecting it to.
22:04<dpkg>Cya, d3co
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22:06<ml|>Lillymon: why I run it as my user and use all ~/.mpd/...
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22:09<Lillymon>It still refuses to work. I try Sonata (my preferred frontend) and NOTHING is visible in the Library. Nothing is ever visible, MPD seemingly refuses to supply anything.
22:10<Lillymon>I have been at this for more than an hour, I am determined to force MPD to work if necessary.
22:10<Lillymon>God, I think it's creating a database this time around. Why the hell did it wait so long?
22:11<ml|>Lillymon: read on how mpd works
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22:12<Lillymon>I read the docs. What entered my mind was "Installation, [Big gap], configuration".
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22:15<Lillymon>Seems it finally coughed into life.
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22:16<Lillymon>Guess I'm done for now then, it only took an hour and a half .
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22:25<Lillymon>I still can't quite believe I just logged into a bare console, restarted KDM, then logged back in with my music player still going. MPD may replace Amarok through its sheer awesomeness.
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22:27<abrotman>pshaw ... flash does that all the time :)
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22:35<Lillymon>Ugh, MPD now worked. But I tell Sonata to save the current tracks as a playlist, it does nothing. I don't see anything appear in my playlists directory.
22:35<Lillymon>The path specified is absolute, there's no way for MPD to get confused.
22:38<ml|>set it in mpd.conf?
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22:38<Lillymon>I have, that's the only file I'm paying any attention to now.
22:39<ml|>and you have permission to that dir
22:40<Lillymon>It's in my /home directory, MPD is able to write its logfile to a similar directory (logfile goes in .mpd, playlists go in .mpd/playlists).
22:40-!-hybrid-k1rnel is now known as hybrid-kernel
22:42<ml|>using /home/... right?
22:42<Lillymon>Yep, "/home/[user]/.mpd/playlists".
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22:43<ml|>hmm, works here; but system still running mpd?
22:43<Lillymon>It's playing Lazy Generation by The F-Ups (actual band name) right now.
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22:47<Lillymon>ncmpc is more helpful, but baffling. It says "Permission denied". How the hell is that possible?
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22:49<bja>what is the courier package?
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22:54<Lillymon>I don't know what that is, and aptitude indicates nothing containing that name is installed.
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22:59<bja>Lillymon: thx
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23:13<JustRob>This is probably an unanswerable question but, for non-technical text entry...vim or emacs?
23:14<ml|>dpkg: start an editor war
23:14<dpkg>zile is known to repel members of your preferred sex
23:14<bja>Do you want an editor or a full
23:14<JustRob>Yeah, I'm trying to avoid the inevitable war
23:14<ml|>try both and see what you like, I prefer vim
23:15<JustRob>I'm looking for something for the console, that isn't as technically based as either vim or emacs, but has slightly more features and options than something like nano.
23:15<JustRob>I've used vim, haven't touched emacs yet.
23:15<JustRob>I default to nano because it's idiot proof for simple stuff
23:15<ml|>vimtutor helps
23:16<bja>JustRob: nano is also on the list
23:17<ml|>with more features, there will always be a learning curve
23:17<JustRob>Trying to find something to be my go-to app for plain text creation. Articles, novellas, short stories, stuff like that.
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23:18<JustRob>I've decided on an old comfortable laptop with nothing but a console-only lenny install. I'm trying to make it a distraction free writing machine...that happens to have nethack running on the second screen window...
23:18<bja>An editor is like a good pair of shoes, if they fit you'll never notice them again. There is no other way to see if they fit if you don't try them on. :D
23:18<ml|>can't go wrong with vim, imho
23:19<ml|>but like we've try and see
23:19<JustRob>my girlfriend even got me one of those Mug of Vi mugs from think geek years ago to feed my learning
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---Logclosed Tue Mar 02 00:00:38 2010